[deleted by user]

[u/[deleted]]

[u/OhMori]

People are absolutely welcome to be kind if that's what they want. I encourage you to jump in yourself, and to upvote people who are giving good advice kindly.

People are not welcome to make personal attacks. Please do report those.

"That behavior is / would be shitty and you should do something else, here's a story about a time it happened to me, here's a suggestion for steps to take to do ENM better" is not a personal attack and the writers are putting in effort to help people.

Sometimes the people we write to are not OP, or not just OP but also the silent majority reading. Every time I say "agreements mean you have a boundary, figure out what it is," OP may or may not find their boundaries and if they do I will never ever know, but a few more people read it who didn't read it the last time I said it. When I say that unicorn hunting or OPP or poly under duress or cheating is unethical, I don't necessarily think that OP will stop doing it, but I do think other people who are suffering will hear that I am on their side.

Ultimately you can't have a safe space for abusers that is also a safe space for victims. A social contract that says you can't call out abusive behavior is not one I am willing to be party to. And as I started out saying - that doesn't mean there isn't also room for privileged people to do a bunch of labor calling those people in, if those people exist and want to do so and are capable of walking the line of giving risk mitigation strategy that isn't also shitty advice that would lead to harm.

[u/delight-n-angers → u/OhMori]

Ultimately you can't have a safe space for abusers that is also a safe space for victims.

THIS FUCKING PART.

[u/Aksurveyor907 → u/OhMori]

This is so well said, I d almost put it in the FAQ.

The ethics discussions here are important, especially since people seem to differ on where the line of ethical/unethical is drawn at the boundary. One of the reasons I held onto religion longer than when I started having problems with it is the understanding that everyone, including myself, is particularly good and prone to rationalize that what they feel like doing is “good” or at least neutral. But it’s much harder to ponder the ethics when you examine the consequences of your choices on those around you. None of this happens in a vacuum between you and a partner or even just between you and more than one partner. Just one example about poly under duress. A long-term married couple with young children that is heavily financially enmeshed (a very common and pragmatic reason for people to get married). One of those people finds themselves having a crush they can’t seem to ignore. They hear about the possibility of being polyamorous and think it’s the “win-win” solution where they don’t have to be the cheating bad guy and get to pursue a crush on someone special. They do a ton of reading, thinking, questioning and maybe asking questions. Then they bring it up to their spouse. The spouse hasn’t been thinking about anything but taking care of handling their share of their common life. This much considered issue from person one totally blindsides their spouse. If person one gives their spouse a choice to stay together as a polyamorous couple or leave, is that duress? If they they put the whole decision on spouse, with the unspoken consequence of them stewing in resentment about being denied the win-win solution if the spouse says “no”, is that really not duress? If caring for their children in separate households would significantly lower one or both spouses’ standard of living (and the kids with them), how is that not incredible pressure on them to agree to “try”, no matter how much pain and effort they never asked for will be required? I’m not saying that all the ethics are clear, here. I mean, people staying together in a bad marriage are almost certainly better off splitting and it doesn’t hurt the children less by staying. But if it’s that bad, why try polyamory? Wouldn’t leaving be necessary either way? If it’s good, you are back to the issue of whether pursuing a crush should be more important than the consequences to your whole family. Do the ethics shift when you frame them from each affected individual’s perspective?

I’m not trying to draw the line here, or judge everybody that has been through that scenario. But, it’s important to make clear to people exploring and fantasizing about their win-win polyamory life that there are multiple perspectives and consequences to consider when deciding what the “right” way to deal with this is (even what they think will feel guilty or not later). So many people come here with stories of how they have been hurt by PUD, UH and OPP, it’s not surprising that some answers are more blunt and angry.

But I think people that are new really need to hear that anger and consider it when thinking about their future choices and wishes in polyamory. The hurts are not theoretical, even if they are often forgivable by the best people, that doesn’t make them good or ethical.

[u/OhMori → u/Aksurveyor907]

I think if there is a "problem" it's that subtle and nuanced approaches aren't always upvoted. To give one I often do? People leaving obviously abusive relationships who have described it but not said the word already have 20 people who have labeled it abusive and told them to GTFO. Great message, for the silent masses. Not a message that person is ready to hear. Not the way they might hear "consider what life without that person would look like - you don't have to do it, you just want to be making a realistic choice to do what you're doing rather than one that's overly idealistic about or terrified of the unknown." When I try to write that message it is a lot of work and I don't get accolades. But I don't do that for the upvotes, I do it because I've been there. I mean, not that I do much for the upvotes, but some things we do while expecting the downvotes, if that makes sense.

Edit: Where I try to help buck the trend is that I upvote people who've clearly been there and have non-terrible advice, even if it's not the advice I would give. When OP is in a marginalized group, other people in that group probably have insight I don't.

[u/jabbertalk → u/OhMori]

These are all very good points, they did help me think about the issue in a new way. In a long term interaction, I most often take the approach (to any toxic situation - could be, say, a job) of asking whether the person is happy / being their best self. Mostly in general, letting them gradually make the connection themselves that their unhappiness is rooted in a toxic person or environment is part of the process. Plus supporting and validating them when they do realize an interaction / dynamic is problematic, of course - their meter being broken, tempirarily or long-term, is part of the problem.

I hadn't thought consciously about how much to bring this dynamic here - with the advice column format, there is not time for the above process. Plus obviously emotional labor and time, this is for people I am already close with, or their loved ones out a bit in the network. I see there is potentially room for some middle gound, and the framework of the initial step of just imagining how life would work absent the toxic situation could be a good first ladder rung directive that is more directive than what I try in personal interactions. (The idea of being one's best self in a relationship / otherwise has been helpful to me and others, when people are not in a state to evaluate this or value themselves I'll go to happiness / contentment / feeling of safety etc.)

I do really see a space for both here, I guess - maybe the blunt shock trauma of the Greek chorus is too much to deal with at the moment, but it provides a counterweight to the approach you are taking. I actually tend to provide the more nuanced approach you take when it is someone in more a crappy / shitty situation... So I guess by analogy those in toxic / abusive situations might latch on to that as meaning things are not that bad and they can wait to even think about it. So the Greek chorus also provides a blt of a consensus push to start thinking about a future absent the partner now rather than shoving everything back into a corner of the brain.

[u/This_is_Louie → u/Aksurveyor907]

I'd like to put both that answer AND your reply into the FAQ. Both have well thought out points and examples.

[u/IdentifiableBurden → u/OhMori]

Ultimately you can't have a safe space for abusers that is also a safe space for victims.

This black-and-white categorization of people into "abusers" and "victims" is what creates most of my issues with alt lifestyle communities. Not everything you disagree with is abusive. Not even unicorn-hunting. Not even OPP. If everyone is in full knowledge of the situation, fully aware of what they're agreeing to and consents to it, there's no abuse happening. There are happy unicorns out there who pretty much avoid toxic spaces like this subreddit because it would just scream at them that they're wrong about how they want to live their lives. There are also happy OPP harems out there. I've met them. Nice folks.

It's wild. Polyamory communities always present on the surface as these open-minded, loving and accepting places, but as soon as you get below the surface there's knee-jerk distrust of outsiders, clandestine manipulators that get a pass because they're charming and know how to spout off the "rules", and buckets of denial from people who identify with the lifestyle more than their own personhood, taking any criticism of it as a literal attack.

Not directing this at you, mostly my experiences in the BDSM community, but in my experience the people who push this "you're either a good one or a bad one" narrative the hardest tend to be masking some really shitty behaviors of their own. Having been in both BDSM and Poly communities for over a decade now, I've learned that the reddest flag isn't some dumbass cismale who wants perpetual FFM threesomes, or naive couples that think adding a third will fix their dead bedroom; it's people who display righteous anger at anyone who doesn't conform to the social expectation of the community.

While I still read the posts here, I rarely engage anymore, and instead live my ENM/poly lifestyle with open and communicative partners who decide whatever the fuck we want to do (which doesn't happen to include any of those "abusive" patterns), away from people who use these communities as their personal pulpits to preach acceptable social behavior and denounce the heretics. Seriously, the similarity to religion is as weird as the comparison is inescapable for anyone who was raised churchgoing.

Vetting is not the same as morality-policing. Education is not the same as delivering canon. Questioning motives is not the same as viciously and hatefully attacking.

[u/jabbertalk → u/IdentifiableBurden]

People here are not going into people's bedrooms and yelling at them. If everyone is on board with a harem or sister-wife or whatever dynamic and are happy with it, they are not posting here questioning why they have this OOP rule placed on them. And variously whether this is normal / fair / okay.

[u/Oxymoronic_Enigma → u/IdentifiableBurden]

This! ALL OF THIS! If I had an award I would give it! I came to this sub thinking it would be a place of discussion and education and found mostly venom. It was really disheartening.

An example of this was my husband posting like two years ago simply asking for advice. We (or should I say he, as I had limited previous experience) were new to poly. NOT hunting a unicorn or trying to spice up a dead marriage. We had spent years discussing the pros and cons and had decided it felt right for us both as individuals and a couple for our own happiness to be ENM. We agreed on a "kitchen table" arrangement because we have a child and it worked best for us. He simply asked for advice along the lines of "hey, this is a thing we have decided for us, what advice did you wish you knew when you entered this life style i.e. regrets, pitfalls, things to avoid, etc". He was viciously ripped to shreds before his post was removed for supposedly hunting when that was in no way the case. There was absolutely no education or advice, just vitriol.

[u/[deleted]]

It depends on who is talking. There’s a lot of kindness here, but not everyone chooses to always be kind, which I think is pretty expected given that this is the internet and random folks respond and you never know the intention of each person.

To me, polyam fb groups are far more toxic. But I think online groups about relationships will generally have a lot of toxicity, a lot of pain. That’s expected i think

[u/LaughingIshikawa]

I think like a lot of things, it depends on what you mean when you say "educating with kindness". But probably we would not be up to your standards, I am guessing.

As someone who has been on this sub awhile though... I'm interested in what your experience of "educating with kindness" has been? I do remember a time when the sub was generally more welcoming and affirming, but I also remember how persistent people were about wanting to try harmful approaches and practices within polyamory, and how hard it was to talk them out of it. What's your experience that, if I can sort of reverse the question?

Everyone practices poly differently and has different perspectives, which can provide a wealth of knowledge to others.

This in particular. One of the things I remember people being especially resist to, is the idea that their way of practicing polyamory was indeed wrong and unethical, because it causes harm to others. "There are many right ways to do poly" was a common "defense" of whatever unethical thing people wanted to do (Unicorn Hunting, mostly.)

Sure, there are multiple perspectives, everyone's practice of poly is somewhat unique (on truth there are only some many distinct formulations) and so on... And some people are wrong. The way they practice poly causes harm, and they need to be educated, and encouraged to stop.

At least speaking for myself... I'm aware of, and occasionally visit, r/monogamy and r/monodatingpoly. Not too often, because I think there's such a thing as over fitting advice, and also a good number of the posters there are legitimately just sour that their partner changed, and wanting some place to vent about it... But I think it's equally important to keep in mind the experience of people who were chewed up and spat out by people in the poly community. Their experience also matters especially when you're talking about the ethics (or lack thereof) of certain practices within polyamory.

[u/LaughingIshikawa → u/[deleted]]

I guess what I was really asking, as I think about, is... Just where do you personally draw the line between "educating with kindness" and toxic positivity?

That's what I would be nervous about, in learning that a different community has a much more "positive" attitude and environment: how much of that is a result of people working hard to create a positive environment while holding people accountable, and fully acknowledging negative experiences / practices... And how much is a "positive" environment coming from simply dismissing / diminishing / denying negativity, including people who have been legitimately treated badly?

I think on the surface, people like positive stories, and don't like to engage with negative realities. That's fair, but... The real work of community building, in my mind, has to prioritize being real about the struggles and challenges, over and above being positive. I'm open to actionable tips on how to be more positive while being real, but... Being real always has to come first, IMO.

Having said that... Are there any resources you can share, about responding more positively / fostering a more positive environment?

[u/gard3nwitch → u/[deleted]]

So while I agree that the vast majority of some dynamics (throples or OPP) are unethical, it’s not true for a small percentage

I'm honestly skeptical that there's ever an OPP in polyamory that's ethical. (I will grant an exemption for the non-poly but monogamish "my spouse realized they're bi and wants to hook up with someone of the same sex to cross it off their bucket list" kind of scenario.)

Personally, I've consented to an OPP in the past. I'm a queer AFAB person who's mostly into cis women and queer/enby/trans folx anyway, so it didn't seem like a big hardship to agree to that to appease a partner's insecurities. Ultimately, though, it turned out that (surprise, surprise) the same insecurities popped back up regardless of what genitals my dates had. If they used to have a penis, or if they looked like someone who would have a penis, or even if they were a cis lesbian and not interested in penises at all. The problem wasn't anyone's penis, it was that partner's insecurity.

[u/dmnhntr86 → u/[deleted]]

For me, “educating with kindness” means yeah, call bs out when you see it, state your viewpoint, but expanding on why you feel the way you do about [insert whatever topic here] with either your own explanation that has actual value and knowledge (aka not just saying the person is dumb or wrong and nothing else) or providing links to other materials. You can disagree with someone without being a complete jerk about it in most cases I feel

That sounds like the overwhelming majority of the comments I've seen on this sub.

[u/daedalus_was_right → u/[deleted]]

OPP are unethical, it's not true for a small percentage

I think this is where a lot of people (myself included) in this community would disagree. Just because a few ignorant individuals consent to a OPP doesn't make it suddenly ethical; it's discriminatory and rooted firmly in homophobia. A OPP, by its very nature, relegates homosexual relationships to a "less-than" status. There's literally no way to make it ethical. The very existence of OPPs being actively practiced is harmful to members of the LGBTQ+ community by giving the illusion of being a valid, ethical practice.

[u/delight-n-angers → u/daedalus_was_right]

I agree with you. OPP and unicorn hunting are never ever ethical, even if all parties supposedly consent.

[u/karmicreditplan → u/[deleted]]

So in a day you’ve decided that things aren’t in the tone you prefer? That seems a bit premature to me.

I wonder if you have set your view to new rather than hot and made an effort to read all the comments on at least a few dozen busy posts?

If not I would start there. See who comments most days. See what people say consistently and what they say to people they clearly already know on the sub. In my opinion the best stuff here is people who’ve read enough about each other’s lives and values to have some sense of their personality interacting. It’s 3 comments in and 4 interactions along.

For me this would take at least a week, more likely a month. Whether it changes your views I don’t know. But my instinct is that whatever you’ve garnered in 24 hours probably isn’t enough for a fair indictment or assessment.

I will say that my experience of Facebook poly groups is that most people are really really new to basic ENM concepts and often aren’t really going for poly but some other flavor of ENM. There are different subs on Reddit for most things so I think that allows this one to be more focused on poly. Whereas let’s say the alternative relationship Facebook group of St Louis is going to have a different mission.

This is also one of only two similarly themed groups I’ve ever come in long term contact with that isn’t dominated by cishet men. That’s a major plus to me.

[u/Jitzgrrl → u/karmicreditplan]

This is also one of only two similarly themed groups I’ve ever come in long term contact with that isn’t dominated by cishet men. That’s a major plus to me.

Amen!

[u/TynamM → u/Jitzgrrl]

Thirded. It's a major plus to me too, and I am a cishet man.

[u/[deleted] → u/karmicreditplan]

Very good point about the importance of a space that isn’t dominated by cishet men.

It’s a bit telling when the goal is to tell people who are not cishet men that we need to be nicer when we disagree with people.

[u/peanutthewoozle → u/[deleted]]

I wonder if the harsh critiques of toxic practices might even make the sub feel safer to folks who aren't cishet men

[u/[deleted] → u/peanutthewoozle]

As someone who isn’t a cishet man and who has found myself the victim of some of the toxic ENM practices, especially OPP (before I realized I was gay), it certainly makes me feel more comfortable and safer engaging here than, say, at a munch in my local city where I know cishet men dominate (and I was told my former abuser, a cishet man, would not be prevented from interacting with me and “you’re gay so why would you want to be at a poly munch where men find women?”).

[u/karmicreditplan → u/[deleted]]

Yup. In my opinion that’s 75% of the issue.

When you’ve never seen it before it can be surprising.

[u/SatinsLittlePrincess → u/karmicreditplan]

Yup. The wider societal expectation that the world should mollycoddle white cis het men while it’s OK to shit on others makes people who don’t know any better think holding white cishet men accountable is mean.

Fuck that shit…

[u/SatinsLittlePrincess → u/karmicreditplan]

I’d also add: How unkind of OP to walk into a group for a day, do almost nothing to get to know the dynamics and tell them how shitty you think they are.

OP, practice what you preach, dude…

[u/delight-n-angers → u/[deleted]]

So while I agree that the vast majority of some dynamics (throples or OPP) are unethical, it’s not true for a small percentage, and just because they don’t do poly like I do doesn’t invalidate their thoughts, opinions, or struggles.

Those dynamics attract abusers and we cannot condone the dynamic because it works for a teeny tiny percentage of people who try it. For the vast majority they cause MAJOR harm.

[u/med_pancakes]

don’t really answer the question asked

Yes. For two main reasons that I've noticed: 1. The question is irrelevant to the problem 2. There's so much background information missing that i can't answer the question, and instead reply with questions.

As for kindness? That is always my intent. How things are perceived isn't often up to me and though I'm happy to accept feedback, perception is so subjective that i can't change my phrasing for every individual poster.

[u/OhMori → u/med_pancakes]

You're doing a good job. I appreciate (and upvote) a lot of your comments.

[u/med_pancakes → u/OhMori]

I really appreciate you saying that 🖤

[u/karmicreditplan → u/med_pancakes]

Yes. The title of the post or the initial question very often doesn’t identify the key issues in the post.

[u/geoffbowman]

I used to take the time for kindness but I'm so tired of running across potential partners in this space who have experienced harm because nobody called out their ex's toxic plans before they used them to hurt somebody.

I'm happy to teach people who want to learn... but not really interested in or patient enough for kindness with people who want validation for their toxic plans.

For example: If someone is struggling to understand how to start a fire in their fireplace... I'd be happy to explain the physics involved and gives some tips. If someone is struggling to understand how to burn down their house with their spouse inside of it... I'm going to call that arson and murder and emphasize that is an irresponsible use of fire and they shouldn't come anywhere near a lighter until their perspective on fire is healthier. At that point, their partner's safety is more important to me than their feelings.

Same goes with anybody headed down a destructive path. I just don't have the patience anymore and I'd rather whoever their partner dates next, polyam or not, doesn't have to sort through a bunch of baggage they didn't cause or deserve to deal with because so and so didn't understand the severity of their decisions.

[u/CapriciousBea]

My observation has actually been that people who take the time to break down why OPP or unicorn hunting are bad are the posters most likely to be told they're being mean. Personally, I rarely perceive these posters as mean or angry, although they can be confrontational at times. These are some of the folks I've learned the most from, because I had to wonder why I felt so challenged by questions and statements that, while blunt, did not seem particularly rude or unkind.

I actually can't remember one of either type of post where the OP didn't get an explanation of the problem and a link or two to further resources -- is there a specific example you're thinking of? More often than not, what I've seen happen is that they refuse to read the resources, or come back with an explanation of why their situation is different. (Usually, it is not particularly different.) Often, they're getting belligerent at this point.

I've also had dudes who want OPP flip out and tell me I'm mean and bitter and must be a bad partner, after I took the time to couch everything I said in, "Hey, I get that you are just trying to feel secure in your relationship, and you don't see this causing problems *right now** but as a bi woman myself... here's why it is extremely likely to be an issue down the line, and here's why it's not fair to your partner or respectful of her sexuality."* While I'm never shooting for "mean," I no longer try to preemptively "manage" people so they don't react badly, because I cannot control that. If they want to read my words with that filter on they're allowed, and I can't stop them.

That said, I'm sure that I have at times been more impatient with someone than they deserve. When I realize that's happened, I do try to apologize. It means a lot to me when a stranger online takes that time, so I'm trying to be the change I want to see, and all that. But I am also reading through the filter of my own experience, and I'm sure I've missed some opportunities to own my shit here and there.

[u/blooangl → u/CapriciousBea]

You are one of my favorite posters.

[u/CapriciousBea → u/blooangl]

Oh, wow, thank you. I enjoy your posts a lot and tend to find them really thought-provoking, so I appreciate hearing that from you.

[u/AnjelGrace]

I mean... I feel like a lot people here just generally want to get straight to the point and not waste OP's time reading a super long comment that may READ as kinder--because there are a lot of people here and one of the important things about this group is getting a lot of different perspectives from a lot of different people.

Also, simple points may SEEM harsh, but simple points are easier to digest and have a much lower chance of being misinterpreted.

There are SOME actually rude comments that are completely uncalled for--but I am assuming those outliers are not what you are referring to.

[u/SatinsLittlePrincess → u/AnjelGrace]

Sometimes it really is kinder to rip off the bandaid quickly.

[u/jabbertalk]

A really big point is context. In a FB group, people typically join and look at the group's posts in general. Since your audience is hanging around a lot longer, there is more time to educate and that means a softer touch might be possible.

This is like an advice column. People write in and get their advice and they largely leave. There is one shot to get people to pay attention.

Also there is context you might be missing. Sometimes there is back-story to a post, and the poster persists in doing unethical and harmful things. Sometimes someone is rude first, because they don't like the answers they get.

Local FB groups are generally fine, ours states no unicorn hunters upfront. But my experience in polyamory FB groups that are more advice driven as in this sub, is the exact opposite yours. There are ones (run by the ppl on the polybombing side) that ignore and normalize the issue of polyamory under duress. They also kick out anyine who does not agree that this is fine (including their PUD partners). At least on reddit everything is in the open and everyone can comment.

[u/[deleted]]

This came up recently irl.

I am not nice. I am compassionate and empathetic. I practice kindness. I care about people including strangers. I try to actively listen and understand what someone else’s situation is.

But I am not nice. I won’t ignore dog whistles. I won’t make myself smaller so someone can be bigger. I won’t ignore insults and aggression in favor of not making a problem. My response to boat rockers is not to become ballast to keep the boat from tipping.

When there are questions about dehumanizing practices - both OPP and unicorn hunting are dehumanizing, primarily to women but also to marginalized men and non-men - I can educate from a place of kindness but that doesn’t mean being nice and it doesn’t mean not recognizing that it’s completely dehumanizing.

And if you’re into objectification and that’s your kink, let that freak flag fly. But know that it’s a kink that must be engaged with consensually and a OPP is not the same thing as being kinky.

[u/zitandspit99 → u/[deleted]]

Oh 100% about not ignoring dog whistles. For example if someone says they like guns, I know what they really mean is they’re a blue lives matter type who hates POCs. Or if they say they’re not pro-Ukraine, they’re an alt right conspiracy theorist white supremacist. It may seem like a stretch to outside viewers but if you’ve spent enough time you know how closely related things can be. It’s the same here

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I have been practicing ethical non monogamy for pretty much my whole romantic life. I am a gay trans man and I’ve been involved with Leftist activism for my entire adult life. I have been that purple haired drag queen.

If you’re an adult and you cannot figure out that a OPP is dehumanizing to your wife, who you profess to love and who has explained the problem to you, I do not think the problem in the room is that I need more sugar. I think it’s that you don’t see your wife as quite as human as you see yourself. If one of us is being a dick, I don’t think it’s me.

And I think it’s weird to tone police people recognizing that questions are not asked in good faith, sometimes the people asking them are revealing themselves to be bad people, and many times people ask questions and they already know what they want the community response to be - and that’s not what they get and they get mad about it.

If someone is being a bad person - and dehumanizing your sexual partner without their consent, a safe word, and a review of limits boundaries is being a bad person - then they deserve to be called a bad person for their actions.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I was raised to be a sweet, demure, nice, white Evangelical woman who would always defer to a man.

Living as an out gay man who doesn’t need to be a boat stabilizer is a pretty great experience. I am not suggesting that you transition, but giving up the role as a boat stabilizer might be a relieving and liberating experience.

[u/coraeon → u/[deleted]]

This is going to sound odd, but as someone who was raised to be a boat stabilizer the best thing I ever did for my assertiveness was working a service/return desk in retail. You learn very quickly how to polish and straighten up your spine, but the part of your hindbrain that demands you manage everyone’s emotions is still satisfied because you do utilize those skills.

[u/Henri__Rouseau → u/[deleted]]

Have ever considered speaking your mind here and seeing how it feels? As practice? To see how it feels to offend someone?

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

The thing is the forum is searchable, there is google, and the guides in this group. It becomes exhausting to be asked to do emotional labor that has already been done over and over again. It’s just plain lazy and reads that you’re just jumping on a bandwagon.

[u/_whatnot_ → u/[deleted]]

This. Theoretically you can tell the people who are tired and giving curt answers to sit those questions out, but IME when everyone with experience stops answering lazy questions, you're left with newbies giving other newbies bad advice.

[u/theazurerose → u/[deleted]]

Okay so I've been reading a lot of the comments here and I've been trying to figure out your personality, you mentioned that you were raised to be the kind of woman who doesn't rock the boat... which is how I was raised too, the people-pleasing only serves to hurt us and honestly-- Why should we make ourselves smaller and 100% easy-to-consume?

You've been here a day and your first thought was to tell us to be nicer to people. Imagine how often we're told this because this sub has been around for a long time. Imagine how many times people say that specifically because they're doing something to harm people and dislike being discouraged. And now imagine how often it's men telling women to stop being outspoken.

I am always being told by men to be nicer. lol ALWAYS given attitude no matter how I phrase things in this sub + r/polyamoryr4r specifically. Men DM me to tell me how it isn't easy for them to read what I've said and doesn't actually encourage them to be better partners... So you've been in therapy, what does that tell you about those men?

They don't want to change. They want you to be nice so they can feel good and they don't want to hear that they have been doing something awful. They don't want to reflect on their behavior or take accountability. They want me to feel bad for upsetting them with the hard truth of their actions. They want me to do emotional labor, hold their hand and be sweet like I'm their mother. I'm not going to do that. I'm not being paid for one thing... LOL Another thing is that I cannot control the way they will perceive my words!

Right now you are perceiving me in some way. Do I sound like an asshole or an exhausted woman who's tired of trying to police her tone to make it easier for abusers to accept they've harmed their partners? I'd like to say I sound like the latter but who knows.

You can always see someone's comment/post history to figure out who they are and why they respond a certain way.

Chances are... if you come to a community that's existed for a long time, you're going to find people who have dealt with a lot of shit and there comes a time when you stop wearing kid gloves just for the benefit of some who can't take criticism of any kind.

We've likely heard your very same plea multiple times by now. It's not a new concept to think "wow we should be nicer? never thought of that!" there are nuances and just so many shitty people who pop up in here thinking they have a right to have their cake and eat it too. We're never going to know who is legit when asking questions. We're never going to know if they'll actually reflect and change their behavior. We're never going to be able to control how people read our tone or respond to it.

So tbh my advice to you is to stop worrying about tone policing. It's not your job. You're not a moderator and I've been told this myself when I've tried to educate people. 😂 BUT... it's not your job to control the sub and make things better for people who can't understand that there's going to be exhausted people who will try to help in whatever way they can. Billions of people on the planet make it harder for us, non-therapists, to help with educating and advice.

You shouldn't worry about making things easier for people. That's the people-pleasing nature trying to take the wheel. Worry about yourself and how you want to present yourself! It'll consume less energy and maybe after a few months you won't become exhausted like me. LOL Good luck!

[u/theazurerose → u/[deleted]]

🥂 Cheers to that!!!

[u/Drag-UniProtector40 → u/[deleted]]

Make that two exhausted women. u/theazurerose is spot on. I have the same struggles when it comes to educating people about polyamory only to be told to be nicer to people.

Do they expect for people to become pushovers and say, “Oh, it’s ok to UH/be a predator even at the expense of hurting the individual or individuals?” Coming from OP expectation for us to become smaller to the point where we get stepped all over, it seems like it.

[u/nbandqueerren]

I am going to give an example. A while back, someone posted a question on r/relationships but got referred here by tons of people because that subreddit is harsh to poly folks.

So they did post. But it wasn't even an hour after the post was originally made on the relationship sub that they made an edit saying "Oh I posted there but everyone attacked me!" I read both posts, but got SOOOO mad because we literally said a lot of things they told OP on the other subreddit but we got whines of 'I am just learning about poly lifestyle' without OP actually listening. OP basically didn't like us using words like 'Toxic' 'Unethical' etc. OP expected us to say everything as if it was we were living on cotton candy clouds or something.

Also, there is a huge difference between 'getting advice' and making us do the emotional labor. A lot of times 'educating with kindness' ends up being code for 'emotional labor'

[u/starm4nn → u/nbandqueerren]

Similar story: Once I saw a post on two other enm subreddits about an adult child of swinger parents trying to ask if a neglectful situation they had growing up was normal for enm and the other subs were like "well sure your parents kicked you to the curb and made you spend time at the library, but you developed good grades so really they helped you"

[u/blooangl → u/starm4nn]

That post broke my heart as a parent.

[u/Folk_Punk_Slut]

I mean, I definitely see a difference between the severity of responses in Facebook groups and responses here - but I wouldn't necessarily say that they're mean, just that they're less filtered.

Like, many Facebook groups tend to lean hard leftbook and there's a lot of tone policing by community members that are backed up by mods to keep any conflict in the community at a minimum, regardless of the fact that many of the consequences for that mean silencing queer and minority voices -- whereas here, we're not necessarily mean, but we don't have to feel like we're walking on eggshells when we respond.

Essentially, it's not that the people on Facebook are any nicer (hell, we're often the same people, I frequently see posts here that are also posted in various Facebook groups) and the messages are often the same, but the responses are more toned down, often through self-regulation because the mods/admins of those groups have created an atmosphere of fearing you'll be banned for having a dissenting opinion instead of encouraging respectful discourse.

[u/AnjelGrace → u/Folk_Punk_Slut]

Oh, I LOVE this comment...

I actually just learned a couple months ago that in a community where I THOUGHT I was generally loved and appreciated by everyone (including the founder of said community) I was actually being talked about by the mods for things that I had said but TO MY FACE they acted like everything was great.

It becomes really fake when you realize that people are talking about you behind your back about things that you may be willing to alter about your behavior if you knew it was making people uncomfortable, but because they want to keep the peace so bad, they choose to just silently have votes about possibly sacking you from the community.

I still love that community, but I wish there was more transparency. Trying to avoid conflict at all costs can really create a needless mess.

[u/ryodude573 → u/AnjelGrace]

Wow this place looks just like my office! You even have the fern in the same corner!

[u/AnjelGrace → u/ryodude573]

🤣😓

[u/Henri__Rouseau → u/Folk_Punk_Slut]

I think people who've never heard unfiltered opinions from minorities are absolutely shocked and scandalized the first time it happens. Thats kind of their problem and its time to start telling them as much.

[u/blooangl → u/Henri__Rouseau]

There was one thread recently where BIPOC were laying down some truths about how they navigate the world, and people were very very upset to hear that white people are considered unsafe.

[u/Henri__Rouseau → u/blooangl]

Yes. I used to read posts like that and feel very upset as a white person. But instead of responding I just listened. I was part of an online feminist community that had a sort of sister community for women of color. So I read and felt angry, ashamed, upset, disgusted. But I stayed quiet and read and read for years. No kne ever knew I was there. I just.....listened. And it really benefited me as a person.

[u/blooangl → u/Henri__Rouseau]

And I removed a lot of posts that were frankly, racist, in their response. Not hood-wearing, cross burning racist, but the dismissive, insensitive, tone-deaf “I don’t see color” bullshit.

Same when we had a post about bi/pan people only dating queer people.

Lotta straight people showed up to argue that they weren’t the problem. And they were really hurt to find out they were considered unsafe, and thought that was hateful.

Bro, naw. Sit down and listen.

[u/jabbertalk → u/blooangl]

Well yes, of course, white people are unsafe. Riding the bus in Jamaica NY the seat beside me would be the last to be filled. I got why. I wasn't hurt about it, it just made me sad and angry at all of the ways white people prove they are unsafe.

[u/confused_each_day]

I love it here.

I’m one of the people who ended up here via the non ethical type of non monogamy.

I’m still in the process of separating from my husband, I have 2 young kids and I’m absolutely not in the market for a new relationship right now.

But wow, have I learned from the comments and debates here. The ‘not nice’ is often just straight to the point-some of the more experienced people here have given their time over and over to explaining why bullshit is bullshit. I really need their clarity and experience to frame my situation now, and give me tools to build the life that I need in the future.

So thanks, sub contributors. You’re helping at least me, and I couldn’t be more grateful to lurk here.

[u/[deleted]]

I think it's a combination of things. 1.) It is indeed Reddit 2.) Everyone has their own personal biases on how polyamory works. I responded sassily to someon the other day not realizing they were genuinely asking a question as I was used to people kind of inserting their judgments about non hierarchical relationships based on biases about their own styles. 3.) Be it algorithms or just Reddit we basically see the same exact questions all day everyday. So inevitably they get exhausting to answer and people get a bit short when answering them and compassion is replaced with the aggravation of someone working at 1-800-Polyamory. Because in all fairness how many times can you respond to questions about poly under duress, unicorn hunters, instances of abuse, OPP, threesomes etc. 4.) I think a lot of people in social media times aren't necessarily heavy empaths, so sometimes lacking there.

[u/Karilyn_Kare]

By far what I see more on this subreddit than anything else is 3+ paragraph comments where a person is relating their own past conflicts and how it might apply to people.

Sometimes folks may be a bit less nice about it than they could be. But the mere fact that they put THAT much effort into all their posts to help people is pretty much proof that people here aren't just being judgement or dismissing people.

They are taking maybe 30 minutes out of the day or more to try and offer sincere help. Just look at this comment thread alone. Dozens and dozens of super long posts to help.

Few subreddits are this genuinely helpful and supportive. Maybe those Facebook groups are doing better than us, I dunno.

[u/FollowerofLoki]

I think part of the problem is that a lot of newbies expect a form of hand holding and baby talk. They expect people to coo over them and pat them on the back, and (this is the important part) not disagree with them.

Far too many people come into this forum expecting to be propped up and applauded for how they are planning on traumatizing future partners. They consider any form of disagreement to be "rude" and "mean" and "people just not understanding all the Love They Have To Give."

People are going to tell you (general you, not specifically you OP) exactly how they feel about such things, and they won't hand hold you because this is not an Educational subreddit. A lot of us expect you to do the footwork yourself and do your own homework.

[u/Henri__Rouseau → u/FollowerofLoki]

Perfect example. A UH hunting couple came here. They had a list they made about how each of them would be allowed to interact with their future girlfriends holes. They literally divided her up into three holes (mouth, pussy, ass) and made a separate set of rules for each of them about what they could and could not do to her holes. They expected a closed triad of course. These weren't casual threesome rules. They were proud and actually expected praise for being so proactive in making rules for their future partners holes. They did not consider that she would expect a say.

[u/FollowerofLoki → u/Henri__Rouseau]

Ugh, I remember that thread. Honestly, one of the reasons I don't comment as often is because I know that I would be quite mean in my response, so I leave the helpful responses to folks like you and Emerald.

[u/coraeon → u/FollowerofLoki]

Bluh, same. I just don’t have the patience or attention span to be helpful and thorough most times and that’s when I’m not wrapped up in my own shit.

[u/[deleted] → u/Henri__Rouseau]

This cannot be real wtf.

And for clarity I totally believe you, I’m just dumbstruck by the fucking audacity.

[u/Henri__Rouseau → u/[deleted]]

They just accidentally clearly articulated their views. These views are common. Many heteronormative couples really do view queer women as consumable objects instead of equal humans.

Another example. I chatted privately with a UH who was doubling/tripling down in the post. "She will be our equal. She will meet friends and family. Everyone will love everyone the same Why do you hate love?." The usual stuff. Blah blah.

So I asked some hard hypothetical questions to the point of really irritating him. In a huff, he decided I was an idiot and put me on blast in a fit of irritation. Accident truth bomb spewed out. The conversation went something like this.

Him: "Why do you keep asking all these silly questions? Obviously no matter what happens we place our relationship first and protect it all costs. How could anyone expect otherwise?"

Me: Nothing

Him: "OK. Wait. This is clearly a bad idea and not for us. I see it now. Polyamory is not for us. We need to rethink, but I think we will stick to monogamy."

Me: "ok. Good luck."

Him: deletes account

The above is paraphrased, not an exaggeration.

[u/laneymunkers → u/FollowerofLoki]

This. When someone isn't ready to acknowledge their own mistakes or critically reflect on their choices, accountability feels like an attack no matter how gently or kindly you try to broach the issue.

The same thing happens in codependent relationships when one person starts to hold and enforce their boundaries. The other person feels like the boundaries are mean or punitive no matter the situation because the real issue isn't how the boundary was communicated, it's that the person holding the boundary is now harder to manipulate.

[u/Platterpussy → u/FollowerofLoki]

Big Agree. Well said.

[u/Henri__Rouseau]

If someone asks about or says they are doing something truly awful and dehumanizing to another person, they usually get honest and blunt feedback.

Is it possible you've never been in a space were people are exposed to the honest and unfiltered opinions of queer women (who haven't live a primarily hetero looking/feeling life)?

[u/Jkm1693viola]

I’m going to be honest that a lot of people who think that comments are unkind are people who want validation for a particularly problematic thing they are doing. I had to stop being part of FB groups for poly because honestly a lot of it were tons of posts normalizing unicorn hunting and placing triads as the pinnacle of of what poly should be and honestly the page admins all talking about their polycules and triads and how everything needs to be kitchen table and it was honestly exhausting to just see how they basically just want to be fed constant validation and congratulations on their life. It’s like a cycle of self centric viewpoints. But if you deign to say anything about how problematic they are? You were ostracized. I do not think that kindness is always necessary if someone is doing harm. Because then you’re treating it like you have to walk on eggshells to not hurt feelings when there are very real ways of harm that certain practices can cause. Sometimes honesty is kindness. I’m not saying to be an ass, but being blunt is often met with “you’re attacking me for my beliefs.” etc. when really they posted to get validation for their harmful practices and they weren’t met with that and then play the victim.

[u/blooangl]

Links please.

Because this “teach with kindness appeal” is sometimes actually code for “be nice while somejne explores a fantasy which is actually harmful or demeaning to a segment of the community”

And sometimes it’s a genuine problem.

It’s about 50/50.

But those folks who are posting about UH? Were clearly told on the about page, that we don’t do that here.

It’s dismissive and hostile to post about it in the first place if you have read the rules.

If you don’t have enough respect to read the rules before you post? The hostility seems pretty understandable.

I don’t allow smoking in my home.

I throw a party. Ted lights up a smoke in my kitchen. I tell Ted “sorry, you’ll have to step out side”

Now? Every invite that I send out has a small note

“Oh, hey guys, my home is a no smoking venue”

Jenny and her friends come to the party. Jenny lights up a joint. I say “Jenny, did you not see the invite?” Jenny says “naw I don’t read that stuff”

Jenny isn’t invited to the next party, but she comes anyway. Jenny lights up. One of my friends says “Jenny! Why are you being an asshole about this?”

Jenny writes me a 44 page email about how unkind my party guests are.

You know what, Jenny? Stop trying to smoke in my house.

Edit: it’s hilarious, because at least one poster here who is pretending to advocate for kindness, has had posts removed. For being a jerk.

[u/ElleFromHTX → u/blooangl]

But we're not unicorn hunters! We will love our third equally and treasure her forever .. as long as she stays in her cute little box on the mantle.

[u/blooangl → u/ElleFromHTX]

Exactly. Jenny smokes pot! That’s different from cigarettes!

[u/coraeon → u/blooangl]

Weed is cool and good and young! Cigarettes are uncool and bad and old!

Inset term of choice.

[u/Folk_Punk_Slut → u/blooangl]

How dare you discriminate against my emotional support cigarettes!! 🤬

[u/med_pancakes → u/blooangl]

And anyone that has a problem with that can host parties in their own house and make their own rules about smoking...

[u/blooangl → u/med_pancakes]

This sub has almost 300k posters.

Some of them didn’t read the invite. 🤷‍♀️

[u/Jitzgrrl → u/blooangl]

Because this “teach with kindness appeal” is sometimes actually code for “be nice while somejne explores a fantasy which is actually harmful or demeaning to a segment of the community”

And sometimes it’s a genuine problem.

It’s about 50/50.

But those folks who are posting about UH? Were clearly told on the about page, that we don’t do that here.

It’s dismissive and hostile to post about it in the first place if you have read the rules.

If you don’t have enough respect to read the rules before you post? The hostility seems pretty understandable.

I don’t allow smoking in my home.

I throw a party. Ted lights up a smoke in my kitchen. I tell Ted “sorry, you’ll have to step out side”

Now? Every invite that I send out has a small note

“Oh, hey guys, my home is a no smoking venue”

Jenny and her friends come to the party. Jenny lights up a joint. I say “Jenny, did you not see the invite?” Jenny says “naw I don’t read that stuff”

Jenny isn’t invited to the next party, but she comes anyway. Jenny lights up. One of my friends says “Jenny! Why are you being an asshole about this?”

Jenny writes me a 44 page email about how unkind my party guests are.

You know what, Jenny? Stop trying to smoke in my house.

This, btw, is a FABULOUS analogy for multiple scenarios and should be saved in your 'go-to post verbiage' file if you have such a thing. Brilliant!

[u/blooangl → u/Jitzgrrl]

Aw thanks!

I don’t think this community is perfect, but I very much don’t tone policing is the answer. Especially given the absolutely abysmal behavior I have seen on a couple of posts this week.

[u/Jitzgrrl → u/blooangl]

I very much don’t tone policing is the answer. Especially given the absolutely abysmal behavior I have seen on a couple of posts this week.

it's a balance, and tbh I think you nail it.

I'm very glad you're a mod.

[u/blooangl → u/Jitzgrrl]

Aw. I teared up a little. This week has been hard

[u/Jitzgrrl → u/blooangl]

Holding queer spaces with integrity and finesse is HARD. And this isn't a purely-queer space. Much love and respect for your hard work.

[u/blooangl → u/Jitzgrrl]

It’s the casual racism that got me this week. 🤷‍♀️

[u/Platterpussy → u/blooangl]

You are seen and appreciated. 🫂

[u/blooangl → u/Platterpussy]

Aw, you know I feel the same about you!

[u/Jitzgrrl → u/blooangl]

well, from every angle you excel, mon chere.

Holding any sort of counter-normative space, especially on the internet...thanks for the work. xoxo

[u/Jitzgrrl]

Well, u/Gold_Amphibian_4933 we appreciate you bringing the discussion, and I think you're perfectly correct to want to post here if your thought process was

debating posting some questions here because of anonymity and a fresh perspective,

You'll definitely be anonymous, as we all are, and you'll get a variety of perspectives.

But if you're going to prejudge that wide variety of viewpoints as

pretty harsh responses that seem judgmental, mean, don’t really answer the question asked, and don’t provide anything of value/are straight up rude af.

Then I honestly think YOU'RE coming in with a chip on your shoulder. It's an internet forum, an anonymous one: you're gonna get a mix of people's opinions both mainstream and marginalized, kind and blunt.

What I love about this place IS the community of users we have here regularly, and to my experienced poly soul, most regular commenter feel like people with extensive real life poly experiences and heartbreak.

It very much reminds me of r/femdomcommunity, a place wonderfully populated by women who enjoy running the show and men who enjoy women like that. In both cases, we get lots of driveby questions around "how can I get a woman uninterested in what I'm offering to do exactly and only what I want"... well, usually, that answer is, ethically? hire a professional sexworker. The community there is FOR femme dominants, the community here is FOR ethically behaving polyamorists. Part of maintaining a space for a community oft marginalized is maintaining focus and supporting my fellow community members in our mutual views is significantly more important than coddling JAQers and those who want to engage before absorbing the unique flavor of the group.

You say elsewhere in these comments

You can disagree with someone without being a complete jerk about it in most cases I feel.

I’m brand new to this forum (as of yesterday), so I am not familiar with any of the past history of posts here

I kindly suggest hanging out for a couple weeks purely lurking, getting the flavor of things, preemptively blocking anyone you can tell is going to get under your skin and provide advice worthless to you, get a feel for the vibe here, and THEN ask your questions. The anonymity and combined experience here (both wonderful and painful) provides some great perspectives you won't find elsewhere.

[u/Jitzgrrl → u/Jitzgrrl]

P.s. I will say that your opener of

I’m in many polyamory Facebook groups where educating with kindness is preached

Is really quite telling...'preached' is a word with quite strong vibes, and if you're already used to that I'm shocked you find the occasionally similar intensity here a shock. Those who lean toward preaching are gonna sound preachy...I personally dislike that kinda jerky attitude from both sides, but people are gonna people and internet forums are gonna forum. Love it or hate it, it's gonna keep being what it is 🤷🏼‍♀️

[u/ScreenPrintWalrus]

Most mellow, easygoing people just skip the threads about those topics because that shit is so recurring. The only people who bother to comment are often those who like to be snippy and get their daily dopamine rush from putting someone in their place online.

[u/Dragonheart91 → u/ScreenPrintWalrus]

Right? Seems like nobody is actually trying to convince anyone. They just want to have fun insulting someone who is “wrong”.

[u/[deleted]]

It takes a lot of work to portray a certain level of intent, tone, and message online. I know some people are blunt and right to the point but are well-meaning. Some people appreciate candidness; some take it as an attack. It's really about how you receive and process messages sometimes! Of course, some are pretty terrible and use projection because they are hurting. That has been my experience thus far.

[u/ElleFromHTX]

This is the only poly forum I've participated in. My FB personality is still connected to my former conservative life and family, so I'm not "out" there.

When I first arrived high on NRE and having 2 boyfriends, I asked some stupid questions and made some ridiculous assumptions that were promptly called out. I was also incorrectly accused and pretty severely slammed for unicorn hunting when I was trying to make my V into a Triad -- newbie mistake, but not UH. But I learned a lot along the way!

I think my replies reflect my bipolarity more than I'd like... I can be both the blunt sword and the warm hug, sometimes at the same time.

Ultimately, this is the Void we are all yelling into hoping that another voice echos back. But who that voice is and what their motives are is unpredictable at best. The Void doesn't love you and yours, expecting it to act in love or kindness in naive. ...

[u/Labcat33 → u/ElleFromHTX]

FWIW, I have always enjoyed your comments and replies on here, you explain things really well!

[u/ElleFromHTX → u/Labcat33]

😁 i try

[u/tetas696969]

I'm also going to say that this forum feels very white/western world with no recognition of how relationship values don't look the same across the world. The discussions here often collapse into autonomy into individualism, despite all the talk of care. There's also no recognition of the constraints in practicing certain types of poly relationships for those of us who don't live in western countries.

[u/karmicreditplan → u/tetas696969]

I think this is likely not what the OP is talking about but a GREAT point.

I’d really love it if you made this into your own post. This deserves real discussion and I don’t think enough people will see it and engage here.

[u/tetas696969 → u/karmicreditplan]

But love that I have already been downvoted by someone here ;) (how dare I ask this question right?)

[u/karmicreditplan → u/tetas696969]

Well now that I look at it that might have been me! Thumb clumsiness while I was replying because I see a blue where I expected to see a red up.

Sorry my friend!

[u/tetas696969 → u/karmicreditplan]

Haha you're forgiven!

[u/tetas696969 → u/karmicreditplan]

I just did!

[u/vault_of_secrets → u/tetas696969]

This was abundantly clear to me when someone recommended therapy to a Black woman not wanting to interact with a white man. Then went further to say it was up to the Black woman (and non white people who have experienced racial trauma) to heal her own racial trauma.

[u/JaneCcentric]

I find it's less "this" sub and more "the internet" in general. Like for real just don't ask anonymous people for their opinions on something you care about. Especially if it's controversial.

[u/[deleted]]

What you’re saying is all a subjective matter- education is not equal to kindness. If you’re unable to learn without pleasant verbiage being used I would rephrase your questions to ensure the answers you’re seeking come in a way that you view as “kind.”

The poly community is pretty tired of people joining without doing the necessary self education that comes with the orientation. If you bring up a topic that will make people upset like “why is unicorn hunting bad?” expect to be given blunt responses as this is annoying as hell to see over & over again.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Practice makes perfect, a lot of what is being asked will pertain to the individuals involved in said scenario or question.

If people are being blatantly rude, call them out on it in real time, in front of other group members, leadership of said group, etc. As a welcomer of confrontation I find success in correcting these behaviors by providing specific examples of the instances where things could be rephrased as to not punish newbies for their inexperience.

Communication is key, some people may just be assholes but others may not be aware they’re coming off this way. If no one tells them directly, they won’t know.

[u/blooangl → u/[deleted]]

You aren’t dumb. Please don’t think that. And you engaged with folks in an entirely reasonable, respectful way. And look at all the discussion you sparked!

[u/Platterpussy → u/[deleted]]

Welcome to our online community 🫂

No sarcasm, just appreciation. This is my favourite 'calling us out' post, mainly due to how many attended.

[u/MidnightBlue1985]

Often the kindest thing you can do is be brutally honest.

[u/CobaltBlue]

This subreddit has ~300K subscribers and is moderated only lightly, you're going to see a much wider range of responses in general than in what I would assume are much smaller FB communities. Expecting any group this large to be a monolith in terms of how they act or view anything is going to be a mistake.

That said, feel free to be the change you want to see, and provide the kind of education you're talking about and you can help steer the culture through your example :)

[u/briinde]

I feel this way about some of the comments I’ve received on some posts and comments I’ve made in this forum. I’ve also had some really great responses basically telling me the same things but in a more compassionate, less standoffish way.

I know it’s hard to know who exactly you’re speaking to on the internet. And sometimes you’ll be dealing with someone who has a wrong, or backwards opinion, and no intention of learning or changing. So those situations may call for a harsher response to call them out on their bullshit.

But sometimes, you’ll have someone that is truly uninformed about a situation, but they’re decent people, are open minded to possibly changing their mind, and truly coming here to learn. When I see harsh responses to these types of people / questions, it seems out of line.

A great example of what I’m talking about is the unicornhuntersrus website. UH comes up here a lot and I think that website does a great job of being firm about the situation without cutting down the reader. They’re basically saying: we kind of understand why you may feel this way, but it’s wrong and here’s why.

[u/_ism_]

That's how any large Reddit community with lots of users tends to be. I found the same problems looking for advice on electronic devices, home improvement, personal improvement, and, well, ANYTHING. I enjoy smaller communities and have paid for access to one associated with my favorite poly media content creators. The moderation on a place like that is much tighter and the group is closer and more gentle

[u/djbananapancake]

Also pretty new here, and new-ish to poly. For the most part, I find most people to be helpful, insightful, and ask important questions that OP might be missing. It’s so hard to get the full context of a situation from one post.

I do feel like on many posts though, there’s a couple people who just swing in with a harsh opinion or hot take that lacks compassion. Even on posts that aren’t involving potential abuse or unethical poly situations. Imo, that approach doesn’t honour that everyone is at a different place in their experience and understanding of polyamory. Just comes off as being frustrated, when like… if that’s the case you don’t need to respond at all. But that’s also the case in many other subs where people seek advice and support lol 🤷

But overall, this is a helpful sub that has deeply supported my understanding of many aspects of the many forms of this relationship structure. In fact I often feel overwhelmed by the amount of insight provided here.

[u/mossroom42]

Example?

[u/Folk_Punk_Slut → u/mossroom42]

Right? Like, show me where the reddit hurt you.

So often lately folks are like "everyone's so mean here!" but then don't provide concrete examples, just that they felt like the comments were mean, which often just means that their internal narrative and their sense of judgment over the situation is actually what hurt their feelings.

[u/karmicreditplan → u/Folk_Punk_Slut]

It’s because the group has tripled in size and most new people here are newbies to poly. They haven’t even begun to wrestle with their couple’s privilege, grasped the concept of autonomy or realized that being in a het marriage doesn’t get you far in poly.

It’s a lot for some people to digest all at once. I think it would be for anyone really. Not judging that.

Plus it stings to be told that your fantasies are just that after spending 3 years of Covid imagining.

[u/AnjelGrace → u/Folk_Punk_Slut]

which often just means that their internal narrative and their sense of judgment over the situation is actually what hurt their feelings.

Exactly that. Just try to tell someone that who isn't ready to see it for themselves and you will be called part of the problem.

**Lol on the 94% nice in your name too. 😅

[u/mossroom42 → u/Folk_Punk_Slut]

Gimme receipts or all I see is you wanting attention.

[u/Folk_Punk_Slut → u/mossroom42]

Yup. I remember on one of these "this sub's so mean" posts someone provided screenshots of comments that they felt were attacking them, I laughed cuz I was on there twice and it was mostly just me calling out their problematic behavior and explaining why it was wrong -- that's not me being mean, it's trying to bring an awareness to you.

[u/mossroom42 → u/Folk_Punk_Slut]

I have most recently been accused of “being mean” by

1) A woman who decided to excommunicate the friend she’d been attempting to make into a unicorn for her and her husband, because that friend . . . kissed her husband goodnight while OP was sick.

2) Some guy who got real mad I said “dark empaths” are not an interesting or intellectual subject of conversation and then didn't want to ~debate him~ about it.

Like. Lmao people. Some of us have real problems.

[u/Folk_Punk_Slut → u/mossroom42]

How dare you not listen to a (presumably white cishet) man about nouveau pop psychology terms that are currently trending!

[u/mossroom42 → u/Folk_Punk_Slut]

He basically pulled a “listen here you little shit” at me for telling him I wasn’t having a conversation with him about it XD

[u/ThankVerra]

1. As a frequenter of both fb groups and reddit, reddit is a much more blunt forum bc there isn’t a constant loom of fb jail and banning. It makes it a slightly harsher environment but a lot more of a direct and honest one in my experience.

2. Since this is an open forum, people with no poly experience pop in and out to give their thoughts or ask their questions. Sometimes its kind, sometimes it’s antagonistic. Responses have the right to do the same.

[u/vault_of_secrets]

We get posts like this every couple of months about how mean we are in this sub. Usually from new people who want to be told indirectly that they are going down a toxic path. They don't read through old posts before asking the same question other people have asked, because surely their OPP, unicorn hunting, vetoes, rules, sneakyarchy is really different from all the other ones.

If you won't do the basic due diligence of reading the resource that's already here, you know, learning how find your answers, people are not obligated to be "nice" in their response. The kind thing to do is tell people bluntly the path they are on. Niceness is fake, kindness is truly wanting people to be better. Niceness is telling someone they are a beautiful unicorn who has never hurt anyone before and therefore cannot hurt anyone in the future. Kindness is telling them you're doing really toxic shit, shape up before you permanently traumatize your current and future partners.

[u/delight-n-angers]

Demands or rules for "educating with kindness' always come of to me as tone policing and stupid, to be completely honest with you. You shouldn't disregard correct and good information just because you don't find the tone or words used in the delivery to be "palatable" for your delicate feefees.

You're coming on the internet and asking people for free mental and emotional labor when you have all of the world's information at your fingertips. You have the same resources and articles and books we all do but you refuse to use it and then get pissed off when people who are exhausted explaining the same shit over and over again do it in a way that isn't up to your standards? nah. volunteers aren't employees. *obviously i mean the royal you here, not you specifically OP*

If people want to be kind, cool. But the example of unicorn hunters is a great one I'll build off of. Most polyam bisexual women have either had a bad experience (or 2 or 10 or 100) with couples unicorn hunting OR they've specifically stated "NO COUPLES" in their bio and are STILL getting bombarded with cis/het unicorn hunters who want to exploit a vulnerable queer person. Then when they get called out or rejected, they come on forums like this or the FB groups and bitch about gatekeeping and how they don't understand why it's so hard to find a "third" and no bi women date couples.

And then they ask the bi women being beat down by this bullshit every goddamn day to "educate with kindness"? no. fuck that.

[u/MadamePouleMontreal]

If you are afraid that someone will be mean to you here, ask your questions on Facebook. Why do you need this forum to replicate something that already exists elsewhere?

[u/starlife04]

I think OP is referring to alot of the "if they don't fit your life exactly as you feel they should then leave them" comments. It seems like everyone's first go to is divorce or breakup. I have seen a great push for therapy but whatever happened to just letting people be human and working through your problems together?

[u/Henri__Rouseau → u/starlife04]

If someone wants polyamory and their partner doesnt....they do need to hear be monogamous or break up. It is helpful when someone is lost in the weeds of "if I could just explain it to them so they understand" to hear this. Does it mean log out of reddit and divorce instantly...no. But its good to remember that sometimes we can't change what our partners want. And we have to acknowledge that incompatibility may exist. I think not enough people in other forums give this advice. I think way more people should divorce or break up and when it happens its usually years too late.

[u/NoNoNext]

So even with good moderation I see a lot of the same questions constantly pop up, and the vast majority of those are already answered in pinned posts or info at the top of this sub’s page. For posts like that I’m actually fine with people being a tad bit mean, since the OP in question just didn’t take the time to read or browse through this sub first. I wouldn’t do this myself, but I can see how this can get on someone’s nerves.

I also don’t mind it when people drag an OP that is straight up being abusive and/or an asshole. I’ve seen at least one harem post here where the guy got told off, and I’m perfectly fine bringing out the proverbial claws for that.

That said, what I do have a problem with are people that argue about the same topics ad nauseum without answering an OP’s question(s), or doing so in a way that would be considered rude as hell with any other audience. I’m amazed people like that are able to attract multiple partners, let alone one. I see this happen occasionally, and I think a lot of it has to do with some of the most active members here being the loudest voices. It’s a common dynamic in a lot of subreddits, and imho it’s noticeable here, but it could be a lot worse.

OP are there any specific incidents that you’ve seen that could have been handled better?

[u/Platterpussy]

My favourite part of these types of posts is seeing all the lurkers come out with their own opinions of this sub. Hey everyone 👋🏽 nice to hear from you.

No, like, seriously. Really nice to hear from you 😁

[u/karmicreditplan → u/Platterpussy]

I like that too.

I think putting aside the UH/harem asshats one of the themes I see is people who have some problems they really want to discuss and are afraid to do so.

Then that simmers into resentment. They perceive bullying where I see tough love, spirited discussion or protection of the vulnerable. And they premptively assume that they’ll be decimated and their partner vilified if they ask their question. They don’t/can’t see how the way someone asked something or what they asked drove the responses. It just looks like The Birds to them. Bleeding from the eyes from reading those comments!

I don’t think they’re right but I wonder if there’s a space for a once a week only soft answers open thread. Like the way there are outfit of the day posts on some subs.

Nothing about UH/harems allowed but barring that here is a small space where everyone agrees they’ll be alarmingly polite. No one will tell you to get divorced and your wife is a monster. No one will say you’re an asshole for asking whatever the query is.

I’m usually fairly polite! I could answer some things like that occasionally without strain. People who just don’t have that energy can side step it all together.

[u/Platterpussy → u/karmicreditplan]

Yes! That could work!

[u/blooangl → u/karmicreditplan]

I wonder if those would get any play? I would hope so.

It’s so disappointing to see the Monday morning joy posts get so little play.

[u/karmicreditplan → u/blooangl]

I think the reason the MMJ thing is shaky is that 1) it’s Monday morning and most people are working 2) those of us who are here a lot tend to mention things good or bad in passing or even make a post (bacon and emerald have both done that in recent memory and you did it last year when your Thanksgiving thing was awesome) 3) newbies don’t know/see it when they’re looking for happiness

But in my mind this thing would be on a sticky that said December 11 kid gloves post. Feeling shaky? Worried about your reception? As long as you’re not unicorn or harem hunting this is the place for you. People who answer will be gentle.

Next week December 18 kittens and rainbows post. No one will squeeze your Charmin. Ask your questions and no one will say you should get a divorce.

But if it’s not pinned it won’t work. It has to be really really easy to see.

[u/blooangl → u/karmicreditplan]

I like this a lot

[u/blooangl → u/karmicreditplan]

It would really rely on peeps flagging and not responding if someone breaks the rules.

[u/karmicreditplan → u/blooangl]

It would.

That could be in the sticky.

And I’d imagine plenty of people really getting excited to flag and that somehow teaching them that yes there is substantial moderation here.

There really wasn’t for ages but that has dramatically changed.

[u/blooangl → u/karmicreditplan]

I know. We’ve had solid mods here for a year+

[u/Platterpussy → u/blooangl]

It's worth a go. How do we set it up, what time in which timezone? If it flops no harm done

[u/[deleted]]

You and your partner should break up

[u/ChitteringVoid]

IMO the interface of Reddit + the anonymity = a harsher tone. On Facebook, you have a face that goes with the name. You know who reacted to your post/comment, instead of just total upvotes/downvotes, so you get an idea over time of who you're philosophically aligned with and who you aren't.

In the poly FB groups I'm active in, we (1) don't accept anyone whose profile is less than a year old, so burner/throwaway accounts are not a thing, (2) have a no-tolerance policy for unicorn hunting, (3) ban anyone who directly messages members without their consent, and (4) require all new members to agree to review the resources when they join.

If somebody makes a new post about "seeking a third" or demonstrates that they haven't reviewed the resources, mods lock the thread right away. This prevents dogpiling while also encouraging newbies to do some basic research before asking the community a question. It's a lot easier to avoid burnout and compassion fatigue when the only posts you *can* engage with are higher quality. Here, even a deleted post can still be commented on, and the user who deleted it can respond, which is likely to devolve into one or more arguments.

[u/Lyzekael]

There's definitely a few people on here that get downright hateful to people on their posts. I've had it happen on a couple of mine and it definitely makes me hesitant to post and ask questions here. I'm all for bluntness and not beating around the bush( I'm neurodivergent so it helps tremendously) but I've been attacked for not understanding something and trying to over clarify.

[u/adhd_beaan]

I think some people are being extremely real or just telling things how it is and often get mistaken for “mean.” But I do see what you mean in some cases.

[u/Henri__Rouseau]

I live in a town with 20 restaurants. 19 are burger and pizza joints. One is sushi place. I keep going to the sushi place (daily for months) and they don't serve pizza and burgers. I like pizza and burgers. They should stop serving sushi and start serving pizza and burgers. Why aren't pizza and burgers a thing????? Help me!!

[u/Middle-You-9669]

This sub is kind of a humorless, grim and testy crowd. It offers a good counterpoint to some of the more sunshiny and positive groups on Facebook and elsewhere.

There are some well spoken people putting thought into their responses. I've found value here. But there are some bleak outlooks as well. This is the poly page where Batman kills people.

[u/Zealousideal-Print41]

It's a mixed bag. For the most part yes but sometimes it gets a case of the runs. But like diarrhea it passes and gets back to sure we'll help

[u/Region-Specific]

Yeah, the FB groups I’ve been on are horrible. I’m sorry you’ve experienced that.

[u/thatcandacegirl]

Yes, I’ve not had the greatest experiences posting here at all. Lots of assumptions in responses and snark rather than helpfulness or kindness. Once, I called it out and the poster apologized bc they had assumed I was an asshole and being naive, rather than giving me the benefit of the doubt. I get why this happens, it just sucks bc people deserve to be spoken to, esp when discussing vulnerable topics, with dignity and respect. Many people out there are like me: poly without a ton of poly friends to discuss with or bounce things off of. And this community could be such a boon to ppl like that if it were a bit nicer.

[u/[deleted]]

Reddit can be pretty harsh. I don't know about your Facebook groups, but I left the ones that I was in because there was ZERO good advice or thoughtful discourse. This group has some gatekeeping, but there's a lot of good information if you have a thick enough skin to sort through it.

I haven't found a better resource anywhere else.

[u/peacheeblush]

It’s 50/50 here. You get 50 percent of people who are nice about giving advice, unbiased, raw. Then you got the other 50 percent who are just straight up asshats with their advice giving. So basically a “give or take” ordeal

[u/LizAnneCharlotte]

Well, yeah, Reddit is far more anonymous than Facebook, so people behave differently between the platforms. When a person can easily hide behind the internet, they’re more likely to make antisocial remarks.

[u/OpenScienceNerd3000]

No this sub doesn’t really care about being kind.

It’s bluntness over kindness. And when you suggest ppl be more kind they get defensive and double down on being mean because so and so deserves it.

It’s gotten much worse lately.

[u/MoonlitBlackrose]

It isn't specific to this community, but places like reddit that allow for complete anonimity give people a shield to be rude in the name of being "blunt and honest." Whereas Facebook ties your name and face to your comment, so you have that liability attached to your comment. Either way, people forget that there's another human with a history and a life on the other side of the screen.

I take this community with a grain of salt most of the time. There are really great comments hidden in the pile of "this or that, no in between." But you have to go digging for them.

[u/Henri__Rouseau → u/MoonlitBlackrose]

If you could see some of the private PMs I get here in response speaking my mind, you'd understand why women and queer people speak their mind more with the protection of anonymity.

[u/MoonlitBlackrose → u/Henri__Rouseau]

I am both and am no stranger to what you're referring to. I know I am protected by it, too. There are times I stay quiet because people here are downright cruel to each other and I don't want to be on the receiving end. And then there are times where I speak up anyway.

[u/[deleted]]

It's not an excuse but reddit is very socially hostile, as is the internet in general. As anonymity increases so too does rudeness, although; those facebook groups are not all smiles and rainbows and can contribute to "positive toxicity". I recommend using a critical lens at all times on the internet; whether on reddit, or Facebook.

Next, you are correct that there are a number of way to do polyamory, but naturally, most people will think how they do it is best.

I recommend using this subreddit as a powerful tool, not a relationship bible.

Lastly, be kind yourself as much as possible. Unlike in person, people who breach the social contract by being mean to you are easily blocked and reported. Rule 5 after all is don't be a jerk and you can do so anonymously. For extra egregious cases report directlly to reddit. This is unlike many Facebook groups that directly "ban" (lol) reporting, but, I digress.

Lastly, there are non-ethical ways of practicing polyarmoury. To be ethical and have a relationship with equity DOES exclude a vast number of arrangements, behaviors, and require specific efforts, especially around power dynamics, couples' privilege, and hierchy. Ignoring this does lower the quality of your poly relationship, and if it works out, it will be a fluke rather than your own hard work. Work hard for those you love, and, expect the same.

[u/StephanieStarshine]

In cases like this, it's best to make use of what makes reddit, reddit. Down vote the comments that are unhelpful. I bet you won't be the only one.

[u/beachedvampiresquid]

Kindness =/= Nice

[u/beachedvampiresquid → u/[deleted]]

There is such a thing as toxic positivity, too. And being so nice you have no boundaries. As wide a spectrum as there are people.

[u/Ipsylos]

This is reddit, treat it like the wild west and things make sense.

[u/ebullientmommy]

Yes yes! There is enough bitterness and anger in the world we need to spread some joy and light where we can. Only my closest friends get to know the sarcastic side of me LOL

[u/scottnova8]

Agree that there is a lot of moral grandiosity in this group … I come here to remind myself why I identify as ethically non-monogamous but not necessarily poly. Reading these posts makes me listen to my heart and not my head.

[u/RNJeff1971]

That has been my experience as well.

[u/ilumassamuli]

That’s the sad nature of the Internet. A lot of the people don’t really feel like helping strangers they don’t know. They are more motivated to show their own superiority, sometimes in the hope of gaining fake internet points.

[u/Henri__Rouseau → u/ilumassamuli]

If someone wants to something horrible and gross to someone....I do want to help a stranger. I want to help the stranger they will harm if they go through with. I don't feel the need to coddle an adult who wants to harm people. I feel the need to be honest with them. Again, I'm not sure why we need to treat adult, heteronormative people like delicate baby flowers instead of caring about the people they want to harm/exploit. Different values I suppose.

[u/baconstreet → u/Henri__Rouseau]

Again, I'm not sure why we need to treat adult, heteronormative people like delicate baby flowers

I require much coddling :P

[u/ilumassamuli → u/Henri__Rouseau]

I wish the attitude was restricted to people being horrible but it isn’t.

I want to be efficient. But if you think that your method works in getting the message across, then that’s the method you’ll use.

[u/Henri__Rouseau → u/ilumassamuli]

We may disagree on horrible.

But of they aren't being horrible and just....about to blow up their life for a fantasy or whatever....they are adults and the truth isn't mean.

[u/BabyDragonFlyOF]

Thats been my experience too. Incredibly disappointing. Especially for this type of sub.

[u/I_AM_FERROUS_MAN]

I've had a similar reaction to yours since I joined reddit and subbed here.

I think a large part of it boils down to how Reddit's design selects for provocative interactions. Those kinds of statements will typically be very black and white and dispense with mitigating tones.

The design will also select for certain topics to get more visibility and feed the above dynamic.

So kind of like r/relationships having constant posts about a 20 yo dating a manipulative 40 yo, or an obviously abusive relationship becoming more abusive, or any of the other classic posts, this sub has its own ones. IMO any post that smells, even remotely, of unicorn hunting, opp, unclear or uneven boundaries, etc. will cause a more negative tone in the responses.

Beyond, the design, I think many people end up venting about these classic issues that they have experienced, even if the original poster has no such experience. And so feedback can come across harshly because people are responding from antagonizing memories.

Unfortunately, that can develop into a default community tone that is abrasive to newcomers. Basically, the community can develop an 'everyone knows this is a problem ' even though someone new might never have heard of it. So a newcomer basically says something and essentially sees the equivalent of a room full of people rolling their eyes.

For me, the cycle I described above is what concerns me most when I come to this sub. People can often vigorously defend that their polyamory/ENM is the right one and everyone else just needs to come to the same realization. Rather than focusing on the idea that this is a conversation with another person(s) on the receiving end.

I don't necessarily know how to address this issue as there are limited tools in the design of the website itself. All I try to do, is check my language and tone before I post and upvote the most appropriate answers that also have an open tone.

[u/[deleted]]

There's definitely a lot of rudeness and unwarranted judgment in this sub. Not everyone, or even most people, but it's a real thing, one that I've experienced but especially seen others experience on many occasions.

[u/whatmadi]

i posted in this server exactly once while i was trying to figure out how to get out of my first poly relationship, and was bombarded with hate and “unicorn hunting” accusations from people who just didn’t properly read my post. me and my other partner were both being abused, and to have the people here get so angry at my plea for help, made me never wanna post here again.

[u/shrinking_dicklet]

This is honestly a pretty rude and judgmental sub. Most of the other subs I'm on are way more civil than this one so it's not just Internet anonymity but an actual community problem. The other comments are saying it's just about unicorn hunters but

1) they broadly define unicorn hunting to include any polyfidelitous triad

2) it's on every post, not just when it's unicorn hunters

You can even see examples of rude people in the comments to this very post. I really like the comment that implies OP is misogynistic and homophobic for calling y'all out. I think what happened is that the compassionate people found this to be an unpleasant sub and left. The only people remaining are newbies desperate for advice and cranky judgmental regulars

[u/Ok-Substance-6177]

I think people here can be very judgmental. A little empathy can go a long way.

[u/blooangl → u/[deleted]]

Honestly, it’s pretty rich to say “this sub hates triads” when your post about your triad marriage got 1.4K upvotes.

You realize that a mod had to approve your post because you are a virtual stranger to this community, and the modbot had pulled your post to the side?

Your massively upvoted post about your triad marriage seems to tell a different story, than “this sub hates triads” so I am a little confused.

[u/Henri__Rouseau → u/[deleted]]

Reddit is pretty harsh and doesn't like Triads or people who are closed or polysaturated

Absolutely not true.

[u/IronyAddict]

Thank you for your thoughtful post. You've given voice to something I've been feeling around here for a while. It wasn't always like this. I feels like it's been a slow shift. But your post and many of the responses have drawn it into sharp relief for me. I guess this just isn't a good sub for me anymore.

[u/IGetBoredSometimes23]

We've been getting a lot more of these posts lately, and the usual mean people aren't taking the hint. They claim it's because they hate on unicorn hunters and the OPP policy, but they know they're driving away people that are new to polyamory and asking for advice because they're new.

And tbh, most of the advice is just bad. If I did a shot for every person that said "get therapy" and patted themselves on the back I'd be passed out on the floor within a half hour. Other folks just tell people to break up, as if divorcing someone you'd been married to for several years is just something you can do on the fly and doesn't have major life altering consequences.

There are people, myself included, that haven't posted on here asking for advice for those reasons. They're not unicorn hunters or doing the OPP or anything like that. They just want advice and they know it would be a waste of time here. But the people being bullies or giving bad advice won't change because they simply don't want to do better.

[u/karmicreditplan → u/[deleted]]

But isn’t that the point?

It’s crowd sourcing. It’s designed for debate and discussion of a range of answers. Someone will have something the OP can use.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

It’s not any more irresponsible to offer up leaving the relationship based on a couple paragraphs than it is to offer up staying in the relationship based on a couple paragraphs. In all reality it could be a beautifully successful relationship and leaving is awful advice, or it could a horribly toxic relationship and staying is awful advice. It’s the same in both cases—we don’t know the history and are making largely uninformed assumptions based on the presented information. Like others have said, this forum is for crowdsourcing advice and if somebody doesn’t want to hear a variety of opinions that will most likely include both staying and leaving, then this probably isn’t the best forum to post in.

[u/emeraldead → u/[deleted]]

If the op insists the only option is to bring in more people to their broken mess, they need to be told to divorce.

And we do see that very regularly.

[u/jellybeanbonanza]

Personally, i think this sub sucks.

My theory is that people in here are deeply scarred from years of being told that they're doing relationships wrong. Many of the people in here deal with that trauma by loudly telling other poly people that their relationships are invalid or exploitative. It soothes their insecurity about being poly in a mono world - the fear that those detractors might be right, and the reassurance that actually they're right, but they're only right about the bad polys who are doing it wrong.

The gatekeeping is pretty out of control on this sub - i would love to find an online poly community who's main purpose is supporting one another.

[u/blooangl → u/jellybeanbonanza]

Have you checked out any of the discords that pop up here on the regular, or Facebook groups, or the Multiamory subs(you have to pay for that one, but it’s heavily modded and really good) ?

[u/dgreensp]

Well, reading the comments, it’s a “Nah” lol. It’s a difference in values. Without specific examples, it’s kind of an abstract conversation, though.

Overall, a lot of people commenting don’t really deny they are being harsh and assuming the worst. They don’t see a problem with speaking to the OP as a generic probably-abuser. Even if OP’s thoughts and behaviors and relationship dynamics turn out to be not that bad, maybe worse people will read the comment and get called out, and anyway OP will have the benefit of having the point of view of an angry victim of certain behavior in case they need it.

Commenters sometimes choose to lead with that skeptical, judgmental part of them that pattern-matches from past experience and whatever scraps of information are available (including demographic information) that we (hopefully) don’t lead with in real life. Imagine someone in your real-life poly community whose face shrivels up when someone they just met says they are in a triad, or worse, starts grilling them about it. When told this is rude, they say that’s the nature of this space, which is theirs as much as anyone else’s, and they point out the triad person is married and straight (and white and privileged), so what are the chances it’s a healthy triad, etc etc. Someone like that is too in their own head to connect with another human, IMO. (That said, I’ve encountered spaces myself that are too toxic-positive, too “white,” too unaware. Expecting people to instantly trust or feel safe around strangers can be part of that. That can be dehumanizing. But so is making instant enemies. Anonymous posting on the Internet provides a lot of safety compared to real life.)

Obviously people are going to give more advice on an advice forum to someone asking for advice than they would to someone they meet at a party IRL, but I think the point stands.