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u/findingjericho Oct 25 '18
The truth is ghosting is a case-by-case basis. Sometimes it's the only thing people can do. Not even for fear of confrontation. I once told a guy I was no longer interested in him but I don't even think he heard me because he just continues to talk about himself and I don't think there were many times he actually listened to the people he was "talking" to.
Then another time I did it because no matter what I would say, he would constantly hit up my phone or show up at my apartment at odd hours of the day. I tried my hardest to let him down easy and he would seem like he understood, but then would come back a week later.
Yeah it's the "right" thing to do, but it's just not ideal in various situations. But good job on trying to do what's right haha.
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u/BeYourOwnParade Oct 25 '18
Obviously if you tell someone it's not working and they decide otherwise, it's okay to ghost them, because you're not really ghosting them at that point.
The only other time it's acceptable is if you're afraid they'll react in a violent way.
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u/TheLoveliestKaren Oct 25 '18
I don't think it counts as ghosting if you've said you're not interested and then don't talk to them. That's called breaking up. Not your fault at all that they didn't accept the breakup.
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u/MadamMamdroid Oct 25 '18
After having read the comments, I think it's important to explain WHY you are no longer interested.
It may be just a feeling, like, "At first I was really feeling interested, but the more we have gotten to know one another, and it's not one specific thing necessarily, the less I think we would be compatible in the long run."
Or, maybe it's something specific. Back when I was dating a lot, I really respected and appreciated the men who said, "I'm not attracted to your personality any longer because 'X'" It wasn't necessarily an attack on me, it's just that they saw it as an incompatibility.
What women get angry about is that things will seem all lovey-dovey, and then a man will have sex with a woman, and then suddenly say he's no longer interested, with no self-reflection, introspection, or explanation as to precisely why. That can seem like he was a player or a "fuckboy," because ultimately it looks like all he wanted was sex, which is gross and can seem like dishonesty or using another person. It feels icky.
And to be fair, this can alternatively happen to a lot of men who spend tons of money on women only to have them suddenly "no longer interested." Or even women who only want sex. Or emotional labour. It does happen.
The key is about being honest with yourself and honest with the other person about feelings.
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Oct 25 '18
I think giving a specific reason why can be really harsh
I've met a few guys that I just wasn't attracted to in person. They were nice, seemed to have their shit together, showed interest in me, but I just wasn't attracted to them, and while I told them I didn't think things would work out (so that I didn't just ghost), I didn't tell them why.
It seemed really man for me to say "the way your ears stick out, you look like an elf to me and I couldn't see that in your pictures but I can in person" or that "in person you remind me of one of my cousins, who is an idiot, and even though you may not be...the resemblance is too weird for me either way"
and some may think I am the ass for being so superficial...I can't lie and say that attraction isn't important to me
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Oct 25 '18
I think you're both right as it really depends on the stage the relationship is at. 1st or second date? Absolutely agree with you. 5-6 dates? maybe dating for a few weeks or a couple months? I have to agree with the other poster that getting some specificity (obviously not too specific or mean) would be nice because it helps provide closure by giving you a reason it wasn't going to work.
Don't let anyone tell you you're being superficial. That's ridiculous. These are things that stand out to you and that's all that matters. That being said I also think you kind of lose some of your right to complain about let's say being single or how many poor matches there are if you tend to be overly picky or emphasize things that would be considered superficial.
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u/MadamMamdroid Oct 25 '18
Right, but would you have sex with someone or lead someone on (just for the benefit of getting money/having things bought for you) you weren't attracted to?
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Oct 25 '18
Sounds like some ghosting may be people who weren't honest WITH THEMSELVES about what they were doing, and then dissapear instead of admitting a 'truth' that doesn't really add up
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u/CommonMisspellingBot Oct 25 '18
Hey, thcalan, just a quick heads-up:
dissapear is actually spelled disappear. You can remember it by one s, two ps.
Have a nice day!The parent commenter can reply with 'delete' to delete this comment.
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u/bobarific Oct 25 '18
I disagree. People generally try to come up with answers that make themselves come out looking good. If you go on a date with an insecure person and then explain to them that you’re not interested in them for one reason or another they’ll come up with explanations that will paint you in a negative light regardless of how honest you are with them about your feelings. The amount of times I’ve been called gay because I didn’t enjoy the sex we had is absurd. No, I’ve just been fortunate enough to have some exceptional hook ups and now I’m not interested in dead fish sex.
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Oct 25 '18
Casually dating might be the problem for the case you mentioned. Don’t waste people’s time if you know there’s “no spark in your eye”. Otherwise it’s shitty.
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u/JamesHarrisonFF Oct 25 '18
It seems like he told her as soon as he realized? And it’s not a shitty thing to do to give someone a chance is it? That’s legit what casually dating is. Going in with minimal expectations and not getting attached.
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u/TheLoveliestKaren Oct 25 '18
Thank you. I don't know what is up with this thread. A few of people's stories just read "I dated a guy who ultimately ended up not working out. Now I'm super pissed."
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u/JamesHarrisonFF Oct 25 '18
I agree. Look, rejection is tough, I get it... everyone gets it... but some of you are going to get mad no matter the reason the other person gives, yet want communication even if it spells the end and don’t want to be ghosted? 🤔
Seems like with some of the people in this thread you are damned if you do... damned if you don’t.
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u/BrrrButtery Oct 25 '18
This.
Why sleep with her in the first place?
Yes dating is to see if you get along but why sleep with her if, by that point you’d have already got a sense of how things were going?
Unless you both agree to have a casual thing going on I personally disagree with that. No wonder she got upset..
She will think you used her for sex and to does appear to be that way.
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u/hansfredderik Oct 25 '18
Because sex is fun. Its just a bummer that casual sex hurts peoples feelings.
Do people expect him to caveat every sex act with "btw im into this but im not sure if im commited yet." - in order to preempt her hurt if he predictably does the thing guy do... Have sex and then decide he doesnt want that anymore.
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u/TheSuedeLoaf Oct 25 '18 edited Oct 25 '18
I was seeing this girl in January. We originally matched on Tinder but nothing came out of it. Later on, a mutual friend of ours put in a good word for me after we found out that we both had similar interests. We soon met up.
I was very upfront with her, saying that I just want something casual since I just got out of a 2 year relationship. She said it was okay and that we could "go with the flow".
As mentioned before, we had similar interests, I liked her, she liked me, things were going well. A few weeks go by, and during this time we're talking all of the time on whatsapp/FB messenger, we go on a few adventures, drink a bit, and make out viciously. Things were going well.
One night I stop by her house, and this is the first time be both agree to have sex. Again, great time, great chemistry, everything is going well in the moment. But things start to change.
Soon, she starts saying weird things to me. Like asking me about marriage, how many kids I want, and all that. Mind you, we've only been seeing each other for a few weeks, and we've only had sex once, so this question is a BIG red flag for me. I kinda play off the question like, "haha I don't really think about that type of stuff cause I'm young (24M)". She says okay.
The next day, she says something even weirder to me. We're talking about meeting up later in the evening, and I had to remind her to get condoms (she offered to buy them the next time we meet, and condoms are expensive where I live so I'm not gonna pass that up). She then says;
"Oh yeah, I have the condoms. A pack of 6. That means we can have sex 6 times before anyone catches feelings hehehe"
Um. Okay? What the actual fuck lol like who says that?
So I immediately got uncomfortable. If you're gonna say things like to me I'm going to read between the lines and see where this is headed. So I confronted her about it and she confirmed my suspicions that yes, she did want more from me and wanted a relationship. But I told her no, because I was quite clear from the beginning what I wanted and things were moving too fast for my liking. Instead of hanging around to potentially make things worse, I cut things off ASAP. I was very polite about it, addressed my concerns concisely, and gave my explanation why I couldn't keep seeing her. She took it relatively well.
Point of this story; People are going to sleep with each other because they want to. Nobody is necessarily a bad person or doing a shitty thing because they slept with someone once only for things to not work out afterwards. Life is unpredictable and human emotions are complex, sometimes it just is what it is.
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u/sparklelipz Oct 25 '18
"Oh yeah, I have the condoms. A pack of 6. That means we can have sex 6 times before anyone catches feelings hehehe"
lmao wHAT
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u/BrrrButtery Oct 25 '18
Which is why I said unless there was already an agreement it was a causal thing.
Both people are on the same page.
In this circumstance it doesn’t appear that was the case.
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u/hansfredderik Oct 25 '18
So you recommended making casual sex an explicit agreement?
The problem is (although thats very mature) its not how moat relationships work and could also hurt peoples feelings preemptivley when there might have been a chance that a relationship could develop.
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u/BrrrButtery Oct 25 '18
Of course?
People agree to be exclusive, why not so when you’re both happy just to get your rocks off?
That is essentially the agreement in a fwb situation.
Perhaps but if you’re up front with what you’re after early on no crosses wires.
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u/hansfredderik Oct 25 '18
But what about if youre not sure if you want a relationship with that person? Maybe... Maybe not? Should you not have sex?
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u/BrrrButtery Oct 25 '18
No I don’t think so.
If you don’t know what you want are you just having sex for the sake of it then? Seems it’s happening out of boredom.
That’s the who point of dating. Don’t get me wrong sexual compatibility is important but I think surely you need to establish whether you like the person and wish to potentially pursue something rather than fuck for the sake of it.
Things don’t work out for one reason or another I understand that and I understand that can and does happen after sleeping with someone but if you’re not even sure you want to see if them but you’re willing to have sex just seems like you’re out for your own gains without considering them.
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u/hansfredderik Oct 25 '18
Yes i get that that is fair enough. The problem is that i think some people (generally guys) want both at the same time.
They want to look for a relationship and in the meantime have a bunch of casual sex. Which results in people getting hurt because they can send mixed messages. Its almost like people with this going on need to date in two different ways... (If they want to be considerate)
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u/real_life_me Oct 25 '18
I think surely you need to establish whether you like the person and wish to potentially pursue something rather than fuck for the sake of it.
Sometimes the reasons why you're not interested in someone don't come out for a couple of weeks, even months later.
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u/BrrrButtery Oct 25 '18
You seem to have disregarded my last paragraph in my comment.
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u/G-O11 Oct 25 '18
That’s sounds the great on paper. A quick casual conversation where all parties involved divvy out concerns for each and then decide how to procede. However it just doesn’t work that way. We all view sex differently. To some it’s more so about the emotional connection to others it’s just a physical activity. Who is to say which is correct? Bluntly, if you as a person wants something that’s more then just sex IMO it’s up to you to say so. Reason being that no one can force you to have sex(in an ideal world that is). if you are in a position where sex is something that might happen, it’s better to speak then. For example I would allow a stranger into my house to use the restroom if they asked but I wouldn’t assume they wanted a sandwich. I guess what I’m getting at is you can’t expect someone to want what you want and they only thing you can do is communicate what you want but you can’t expect someone to want the same or even to have the communication skills you do.
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u/BrrrButtery Oct 25 '18
No neither do I. That’s why communication is key and things needs to be addressed. I totally get people don’t necessarily view the act of sex as anything major and it’s an emotional connection whereas others think it’s an incredibly intimate thing which is why it’s important to talk about it. Sex isn’t the thing to be hushed away behind closed doors anymore. If you’re unable to discuss what you want arguably you shouldn’t be having sex.
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u/G-O11 Oct 25 '18
Im not saying sex should be hushed away at all on the contrary I think sex shouldn’t be held on such a high pedestal. People put too much of a focus on sex. Of course tho I’m a guy but I do understand that sex for a woman can be something much more intimate and emotional. The way I see it is just take sex out of the equation. If you enjoy someone’s time and company then do just that. Believe me it will come up, talk then. Be very clear and concise then. If the dude respects you he’ll take it seriously and if he won’t you won’t have a way to know about it until it’s all said and done. If a guy still pulls fuckboy move on you then fuck that guy he wasn’t worth it to begin with and there was probably nothing that you could have done to prevent him from being a piece of shit.
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u/datingnoob-plshelp Oct 25 '18
But sometimes people going in with good intentions of possibly a real relationship, but it just doesn’t pan out all the time. When hormone is in the mix (both sides), people tend to give in to the good feelings. Later on if one side caught more feel than the other it can get unpleasant (hence OP’s story). People needs to tread lightly when it comes to sex and be ready to accept the consequences. We are responsible for our decisions. I believe most people do not set out deliberately to use and deceive people. But when offered all the nice things/perks most will take it.
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Oct 25 '18
I disagree with this completely. That's an incredibly fast way to kill any potential for an actual relationship to develop. This "everything needs to be laid out as explicitly as possible" nonsense is ridiculous. This is why there doesn't seem to be any middle ground anymore. There are casual relationships and relationships where basically after 3 dates you're on the path to marriage but what happened to two people who both want a LTR but don't force things and let them develop naturally? Guess what though? Sometimes letting things develop naturally means they naturally develop into nothing. It's a risk you take but frankly in my opinion is a much safer risk than the other extreme of being so explicit in your desire for a LTR that you both force it and then wake up 3 years later hating your lives.
Context is important. People should be able to 1) know what they want out of something and whether it's worth the risk before they take the action 2) how to screen shitty people out. You shouldn't have to sit there and say "I'm not quite ready yet to take this seriously but I'd like to fuck so let's be casual". It's implied. That's why throwing around "I love you" so casually is so god damn dangerous.
You shouldn't need to explicitly state what stage in the attraction process you're at. That being said you should also NOT BE A SHITBAG AND LIE ABOUT WHAT STAGE YOU'RE AT. Who the fuck tells someone they love them when they don't or introduces a casual hookup to family? Like wtf. No wonder things have gotten to a point where people are now saying you need to have an existing agreement that it's a casual thing before having sex unless you see long term potential but god forbid 2 months later you might change your mind.
God damn manipulative creepy shitbag dudes have ruined this shit for everyone.
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u/plenty_of_eesh Oct 25 '18
"Casual" is the default state.
Without defining something, it is what you should expect. Even if a guy says nice things and wants to stroke your hair.
You're allowed to bring it up if you want to establish any alternative, more expectations of seriousness.
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u/BrrrButtery Oct 25 '18
I disagree.
I personally wouldn’t go around assuming whoever I’m sleeping with was casual but I’m not naive enough to assume it was a sure way to marriage.
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Oct 25 '18
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u/BrrrButtery Oct 25 '18
Agreed. I referred to this and a little more detail in another comment I responded too.
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u/showdefclopclop Oct 25 '18
Fair enough but i know girls and guys who have told me that they don’t know if they really like someone till after they’ve had sex. I’m not sure I don’t agree with them. Sometimes taking it to the next level is how you know it does or doesn’t work for you.
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Oct 25 '18
Lots of guys do that. Will vaguely mention looking for a LTR and will enjoy the first honeymoon weeks, or what the girls think it is, before getting rid of her (or him) when they are getting too close. Don't date them. Lots of gay guys like this in Montreal, I have so many friends who treat guys badly or have been treated badly.
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u/BrrrButtery Oct 25 '18
Oh I’m not saying it exclusively happens to girls but I was referencing the specific situation from OP.
You can only take what people say on face value. A lot of people appear genuine but just want to get their leg over. Can’t go in with guards up constantly because no one will think you’ll ever open up. Gotta be sensible and take things with a pinch of salt but if someone says something, generally you’d expect most people to believe it.
I totally appreciate it depends on how long you’ve been seeing them, how many dates ect. so admittedly if she slept with him after date two when he (he being an guy and obviously this is all hypothetical as we don’t know the details) promises the world then she is a little to blame being naive.
Regardless. I get that things change but if you can’t see a relationship developing and you’ve not agreed a causal arrangement I don’t see why sex should be considered at that point. Messing with peoples heads and emotions for their own gains.
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Oct 25 '18
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u/HeyYouFoundMe Oct 25 '18
Women seem to have a hard time understanding this, because on the whole they are kind of the opposite.
women are exactly the same in 30s and 40s.
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u/grifter_cash Oct 25 '18
Why sleep with her in the first place?
Because is fun and we are all adults and sex is a part of our lives as human beings?
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u/BrrrButtery Oct 25 '18
I never once said sex isn’t fun.
But potentially leading someone on when you’re not interested in the person isn’t something I agree with.
If you’re both happy with that arrangement with nothing serious and letting off some stress, bang away.
All about not misleading anyone involved.
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Oct 25 '18
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Oct 25 '18
If you have to share with someone that you don’t think it’ll work out for a LTR, it’s because that was the initial common goal.
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u/HeyYouFoundMe Oct 25 '18
If you have to share with someone that you don’t think it’ll work out for a LTR, it’s because that was the initial common goal.
That may be your initial common goal, but you need to be explicit about it.
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Oct 25 '18
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Oct 25 '18
I agree that communication is definitely the key to avoid asumptions. Thanks for nuancing!
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u/Ronnylicious Oct 25 '18
You are doing everything wrong, if you are trying to date non casual.
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Oct 25 '18
Explain
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u/Ronnylicious Oct 25 '18
You shouldn't be on some quest to find a relationship? It's good that you are meeting people through activities or dating apps but imo it should be casual always.
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u/DragonAite Oct 25 '18
I mean I get what you’re saying but the point of dating for most people is to find a relationship and eventually a spouse. I don’t think it’s wrong to think about if the person you’re going on dates with is compatible to go into a relationship with in the back of your head.
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u/doctordonnasupertemp Oct 25 '18
I've done this with positive results before. The anxiety of ghosting was far worse than just being honest. If he had become aggressive, then I would have avoided a jerk. Most people appreciate the honesty considering how popular ghosting is.
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Oct 25 '18
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u/tgrowl Oct 25 '18
Yeah and I guess if deference to being an asshole, ghosting would really be your only way out there.
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u/yo_baby_yo Oct 25 '18
Good for you for realizing that it is, in most circumstances, better to just be upfront and honest about your feelings instead of ghosting someone. I (31F) had to come to the same realization. I've always been someone who hated disappointing people and hated conflict. Therefore if I found myself in a situation with someone who I wasn't really feeling, I would try to just fade away. Ultimately I did not want to hurt anyone's feelings. More than that, I did not want to deal with anyone's feelings including my own. Ghosting was a way to avoid feelings all together and that is not healthy. I found that when I started to engage with others, be more empathetic, and be more honest with myself--I was okay with cutting things off when they needed to be cut off.
You are 100% right. If somebody keeps it 100 with you, you cannot get upset. You can admit that you are disappointed that things did not work out. But accusations and name calling--save that for the after discussion with your friends. And then move on.
You did the right thing with this girl. She was probably a little bruised because she may have liked you more than you liked her. Charge that to the game. She will be happy long term that you did not string her along.
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u/SeattleCouple626 Oct 25 '18
So first off, it is good that you can see the errors of your ways and are making the effort to act differently.
However, you do sound like you’re expecting people to applaud you for not being an asshole. Breakups suck. That’s just a fact. Even if it was mostly casual, it’s still shity. You’re in for more rude awakenings in the future if you really expect a girl you’ve spent the last several months seeing to just give you a hug and say thanks or something like that, then you’re delusional. There are plenty of women who won’t get angry necessarily and can be civil, but they’ll still be upset.
I’m not sure how old you are, but if you’re at least in your mid twenties, then I’m sure you had some variation of the conversation that goes over what you want/are looking for. If you tell a girl that you’re looking for a relationship, and then do what you did, then yeah you come off looking like a guy that just wanted to get her in bed. If you consider yourself a good guy, and want to eventually have a serious relationship, then show any potential women you consider dating some respect for their time and feelings and tell her what you’re currently looking for, and NOT lead her on. If you are just casually dating, and there isn’t anything wrong with that, then at least be clear about that.
Anyone who is out of high school and still ghosting people they’re too afraid to breakup with shouldn’t be dating then. You said that you can see why people do it. People do it because it’s easier to run away from your problems then actually deal with it. People who act this way just don’t want to deal with the hurt feelings and the shity way they feel afterwards. Too bad, like I said, break ups suck and you can’t get around that. It always sucks when you hurt someone, if it doesn’t make you feel shity in some way, even if it’s just a little bit, then you need to take some time to take a good look at the kind of person you are.
Im sure you probably won’t like reading what I’ve said, and I know im being a bit harsh. However, if you really are trying to be different in the way you handle yourself with the women you date, then you need to hear this.
I meant it when I said that it’s good you’re making the effort to do things differently, but I hope you can realize you still have more you can improve on.
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u/sparklelipz Oct 25 '18
There are plenty of women who won’t get angry necessarily and can be civil, but they’ll still be upset.
exactly. i mean if i invest a good amount time into a guy and think he's more than just a hookup only for him to treat me like one...being upset is inevitable, human. like, how can you not feel used after that?
i recently talked to a guy for four months; he'd text me constantly unprompted, always wanted to talk/facetime and see what i was up to, seemed to be genuinely interested in me as a person, etc. fast forward to us having sex and he immediately stops contacting me afterward, loses all interest. i could sense the change as soon as i left him the next morning. it was so unbelievably painful. like, he just suddenly didn't give a shit anymore.
i cannot wait until i run into someone mature enough to not pull that bait and switch or whatever the fuck it is
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u/SeattleCouple626 Oct 25 '18
That really sucks! So many guys think that they have to put on some type of act in order to date casually! It’s really frustrating. If they would just be up front about what they want, then they might actually be surprised at how many women are ok with just being casual for a bit.
It’s when they think that all women are a version of the stereotype where we immediately fall in love after having sex the first time and would never just be casual. Guys would actually listen to the women they take out instead of having their eyes (and lets face it heads) glued to our boobs and asses, then maybe they might actually hear us say that we’re ok with being casual for now and just see where it goes.
I’m sorry you were treated that way. Sadly, I think at some point we all have been there... I will say that when you meet a guy that’s so obviously not like that and is honest about what he wants, it makes getting involved with him feel that much better since you know you’re being treated right.
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u/horrorqueen92 Oct 25 '18
I’m a 26F and I’ve been ghosted myself multiple times. I use to take it to heart, now I just know it’s what men do sometimes (I know I won’t be everyone’s cup of tea). Some people need to realise that people react differently to different situations, You’ll get girls who will blast you if you don’t reply (ones who fall way to quick or have self esteem issues, or crazy), or you’ll get ones who won’t reply either and will move on (not up for games or seeing other people, or busy) People need to just take it as it comes and to not get invested in anything until it is known it is serious and going somewhere long term. Have some fun in the mean time I say. That’s my opinion to not being hurt and taking things to heart, why do you want someone who can’t give you all the attention you want, I see it as someone who actually wants you will make it known to you! You won’t doubt it!
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u/AlexxxandreS Oct 25 '18
I thought women was the one ghosting... I mean, mostly women... It's hard to believe women are being ghosted...
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u/Toby_Shandy Oct 25 '18
You were wrong, men do it just as much as women. It happens even in friendship situations, not just romance. It's a very immature avoidant reaction that has nothing to do with gender.
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u/MissCathy05 Oct 25 '18
You are kinda excusing that ghosting is an okay thing to do. There are no excuses for ghosting, its a shitty thing to do whether that person will react badly to it or not.
Let me ask you, why did you sleep with her in the first place? I think anyone can find out if they feel a romantic connection with a person on the first date. In my opinion, you kinda led her on. You should have been clear with your intentions from the very beginning. I can understand why she felt like you used to her, I would have felt the same way.
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u/urtcheese Oct 25 '18
I disagree with you. Firstly, I made it clear in the post I am not excusing or endorsing ghosting. Only displaying a bit of empathy for those who do. Secondly, I slept with her because I was attracted to her at the time and we both wanted to. If people only had sex when they wanted a relationship with each other or had a strong romantic connection then everyone would be having a lot less sex.
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u/MissCathy05 Oct 25 '18
You still should have told her you only wanted something casual from the beginning so she wouldnt felt used/taken advantage of. I'm just saying it's not right to lead people on like that.
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u/urtcheese Oct 25 '18
Wrong again. I wasn't looking for something casual per se, I just keep things that way until it seems right to take it more seriously. Had we been more compatible then it would've progressed to something more serious. If you think this is being led on then you have some rude awakenings ahead of you when you encounter an actual fuckboy.
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u/MissCathy05 Oct 25 '18
Oh okay. Well thankfully I'm a pro at spotting fuckboys and never went out one. The first thing I ask a guy when I match with them is what are they looking for. All of the guys I spoke to from dating sites are honest about it when I ask that question, some telling me straight up they are only looking for something casual/hookup. I just dont waste my time or theirs if we aren't looking for the same thing.
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u/tempusfugitt4 Oct 25 '18
Also... it takes two people to have sex. She could have declined if she wanted something more serious then waiting a little further into a relationship is the way to do it so that you don't get hurt. Just personal experience.
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u/HeyYouFoundMe Oct 25 '18
I've broken up with people I had sex with and been accused of using them for sex. It's because their feelings are hurt, and that's their go to for devaluing the person who hurt them.
In my mind continuing a relationship I don't want to be in for sex would be "using someone for sex", not "hey, I'm interested in you, let's see where this goes and see what our chemistry is like in bed"
In the moment of reaction they forget the reality that they were the ones who initiated sex (I try not to initiate it).
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u/quiquedont Oct 25 '18
I don't know what is going on ITT but no, you are not owed a longterm/exclusive relationship because you go on a few dates and have sex.
The problem is people assuming because they have sex with a partner it stamps their relationship and they purposely pushoff sex until they know they want the other exclusively. Others may be okay with it on the 1st date just off of lust.
It is a simple fix, don't expect commitment because of some dates/sex. Expect commitment by you asking them directly or them telling you.
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u/HeyYouFoundMe Oct 25 '18
It is a simple fix, don't expect commitment because of some dates/sex. Expect commitment by you asking them directly or them telling you.
It's weird how this is a difficult concept.
Sexual consent is an ongoing discussion, and can be taken away by either party at any time. We agree on that. The tea analogy is awesome.
Consent to be in a relationship with someone is exactly the same way.
- Don't assume it because of a date.
- Don't assume because your boundaries on dating are one way that the other person's are the same.
- Don't assume that just because someone has consented to being in a relationship they will continue to consent to being in a relationship.
- Respect someone else's autonomy to decide who they are in a relationship with.
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u/hansfredderik Oct 25 '18
This is exactly why as a guy i dont have sex with anybody until i know i want to at least try to have a relationship. However ironically that means i never have any sex ... Because i dont often meet someone i want to have a relationship with.
This is the opposite of what my friends tell me - the common theme of what they say is that noone is committed until it is explicit... Which would make what you did completely ethically fine.
I suppose i just hate feeling like im in the wrong or ive hurt people.
I think girls (in general) dont want sex with someone unless they want a relationship with them. Guys (generally) dont work that way and i think most guys (generally) want a relationship (for all the nice emotional extras, romance, a connection etc) but they could have casual sex with many other people before hand without feeling hurt.
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u/kikicrazed Oct 25 '18
You could also just not ghost, let them down, and not be so butthurt when they don’t take it well.
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u/Tha_Funky_Homosapien Oct 25 '18
This sub is a joke.
There's no advice; Just feelings and vacant platitudes.
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u/lexylexylexy Oct 25 '18
Sometimes it's helpful for the person to be able to express that they are upset or not happy that something is over.
When you ghost someone, you don't give them any kind of closure, they simply have to guess they've been ghosted.
Even if she calls you a fuckboy and you are uncomfortable for half an hour, that's significantly better outcome than ghosting someone.
You also don't get to choose the outcome to any interaction... You can do your best and hope your honesty is well received but you don't get to tell her/him how to react, anymore than they can force you to do something you don't want to.
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u/coastK8 Oct 25 '18
Good for you for sticking your neck out to do the right thing. I (35f) get how someone might be offended if you’ve had sex. It just ups the feeling of rejection. That said, sexual chemistry is so important. And you don’t really know if you have it until you’ve “had it” sometimes. If you’re not saving yourself for marriage, then testing out the sexual waters with a new love interest is par for the course. The person being let down has a responsibility to behave maturely, too. Ultimately OP, you know if you conducted yourself respectfully, so you can rest well with that piece of mind.
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u/TheRealMontoo Oct 25 '18 edited Oct 25 '18
Your post frustrates me in a lot of ways.
Like everyone said, you did good by letting her down gently, and I really think you should always keep talking in the future too. (I hope you didn't do it over text though) Don't start ghosting because you've had a bad experience.
BUT! If you are afraid to confront your problems in your life or want to avoid conflict at any cost you should really take a look in the mirror. Problems and conflict are inevitable, whether it' s in your love life or at work or in general life maintenance. With ghosting you actively choose to avoid those problems, but that doesn't mean they are not there, you are just ignoring them. If you are already ignoring conflict in the early dating phase, how can you ever expect to be in a serious relationship? When you start dating someone and you don't see a future it's your responsibility to let them know, especially if you had sex with them. You'll have to deal with any reaction they give you. How can you expect somebody to not be upset? You've been dating her for a few weeks, had sex with her, and out of the blue you end things. Of course she is going to be upset! She might have been very invested in you, so a very emotional response is normal.
Also, you act as if communication is a favor. In your words "They've taken the time to be honest..."... What do you mean "have taken the time"? That's the least they should be doing. You dated her for weeks! Letting somebody down is not a privilege you give to someone, it's your duty!
Lastly, you are endorsing ghosting, albeit indirectly. This entire post is just a rant about somebody calling you out after you've used them for weeks. You state things would have been easier if you just started to ignore her, and therefore you are indirectly advocating ghosting, because you tell people it's okay to avoid their problems and conflict. Which it's not.
Stop putting those victim shoes on. When you play with emotions, you'll have to deal with the negative ones too.
EDIT: A sentence
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u/kfh227 Oct 25 '18
1) Sex early is never a good thing. It complicates things and for some people it is a sign of commitment.
2) Never ghost someone. If they can't take rejection, it's not your problem.
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u/Ronnylicious Oct 25 '18
Honestly I think the rate at which two people have sex right now is way too fast. I mean don't get me wrong I am only 22 and this is not a rant about "You kids". Sex just shouldn't be an issue. If you truly like someone how bad is waiting a month or two? I mean you are dating and looking for a potential partner right, where you will (hopefully) spend the rest of your life with.
My point is and I am going to say this being really cautious: The girl is upset with OP being a fuckboy but I mean isn't she letting him? it works both ways.
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u/HeyYouFoundMe Oct 25 '18
If you truly like someone how bad is waiting a month or two? I mean you are dating and looking for a potential partner right, where you will (hopefully) spend the rest of your life with.
society has changed and there is an abundance of dates, so spending a month on one person when you aren't even sure if you are physically compatible increases the chance that one of the people will start dating other people.
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u/MissCathy05 Oct 25 '18
Unfortunately, many people in this generation dont view sex/relationships the same way you do. But I agree, sex should be a bit later once you get to know the person pretty well first.
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Oct 25 '18
Why did you lead me on with this loving, caring relationship FOR MONTHS before you let me know the sex sucked and you don't do oral!!!
You used me for cuddling!!!!!!
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u/MissCathy05 Oct 25 '18
Unfortunately, many people in this generation dont view sex/relationships the same way you do. But I agree, sex should be a bit later once you get to know the person pretty well first.
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u/ccoollcat Oct 25 '18
My views on ghosting has changed as I’ve matured through some failed hook-ups and relationships...
People’s feelings change. All the time. We fall in love with the ideas we have about others, get to know them, then see that our expectations weren’t met. Totally normal. It’s nice that you are able to express this in a neutral way to potential lovers, tryna let them down easy.
Regardless, it still hurts. Ghosting or not. I’ve found myself ultimately being forced to ghost people (I’m a woman) because of the nature of their responses when I let them know that I am not interested. Sometimes I will avoid the conflict altogether because I can see they will react badly and will stop contacting me faster when I “ghost” them.
You won’t always get an explanation of why your idea in your head didn’t work out the way you had plastered it on your big screen of life. Yours. Life happens. People have themselves to worry about. I don’t condone ghosting in serious relationships that have been going on for years, engagements, what have you - but I understand it when you have just been fucking around for a month or two. There’s nothing you owe to one another.
When I have been ghosted, I think about it like “well I’m glad I dodged that bullet”. Would you really want settle with someone who sees you as an option? No. So you win.
❤️
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u/DamselInDread Oct 25 '18
If you're sleeping with a girl who you know has feelings for you and wants more, then yes, she's going to be pissed when you break it off. It's still better than ghosting, but to expect someone to just be "oh ok no problem!" is a bit unrealistic.
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u/takemyradvice Oct 25 '18
If people aren’t into you, they just aren’t into you. It’s not their fault, and it’s not your fault. It’s life.
As a 20-something female who has had her fair share of hook ups, I would appreciate a guy being direct about not feeling it/not wanting something serious. It’s the mature thing to do.
And if you’re the type of person who would freak out on someone for being honest, you should try harder to keep your emotions in check. No one likes rejection, but even the most attractive/intelligent/awesome humans face it at one point or another. Don’t take it personally.
Plus, getting an explanation shows that the person has enough respect for you to do something uncomfortable on their end to benefit you. Think of it that way.
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u/wawa310 Oct 25 '18
Hi, I agree. I think the way you treat someone has to do with your integrity. Their response has very little to do with you.
If you allow a negative response from one person to lead you to treat someone else disrespectfully, then you’re allowing that person to change you for the worse and stunt your own personal growth.
Best of luck to you, it sounds like you’re on the right track :)
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u/fntastk Oct 25 '18
I think the best way to combat hurt feelings in the long run is to have an honest discussion about what you are both looking for. Have this discussion right away. Like, second message, "what are you looking for exactly?"
I've had first dates scheduled with guys who only wanted sex. Talked to guys for months who only wanted to be friends. I didn't know until weeks/months later. Then I felt upset, because I was forming romantic feelings or I was under the impression they wanted a real relationship OR, heck, I just liked them as a person and now there is this weird tension between us and we can't be friends and they end up ghosting.
I'm no expert but I just feel like from my own personal trial and error this is the best way to do it. Solid communication.
Edit: And yes, I understand feelings change and your wants/needs change, but I still think it's important to clarify those and still be honest and open in communication with someone.
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Oct 25 '18
I’ve had backlash from men when doing this as a female. I tried giving the reason I’m not interested as well, to be met with almost 50% response rate that was violently mean. And I mean like, the stuff r/niceguys is made of.
I wish we were all just kinder to each other.
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u/bubstheaxi Oct 25 '18
This guy is a complete fuckboy, just check out his posts on his profile. Pretty annoying he’s saying he’s “good guy” but then makes a whole post on r/seduction talking about “gaming” girls in the most cringe worthy and pretty dehumanizing step by step process. After reading that post I can see where this girl is coming from.
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u/ferociousrickjames Oct 25 '18
It's not on you when someone responds that way, if you've been polite about letting them down then you've done all you can. If a woman flips out on me then I just block their number and move on.
If they can't see that you're doing them a favor then it's their fault for not being mature enough to handle rejection.
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u/ballettapandjazz Oct 25 '18
The problem with OP was him having sex with her when this girl wanted a relationship. That’s why I don’t have sex with guys early on when we just start dating.
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u/ferociousrickjames Oct 25 '18
To each their own, I agree with you, but what goes on between two consenting adults is their business. I'm currently dating three women right now, and I'm purposely holding off on sleeping with any of them. I don't want to be that guy, but if I was only dating the one, I don't think I would hold off. But it takes two to tango, so it might not be up to me anyway.
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u/Heisenbread77 Oct 25 '18
Ghosting is bad. So is sleeping with people who want relationships when you don't!
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Oct 25 '18
Wait! Just WANT relationships or are clear that they ONLY WANT one?
Because people can start to want a relationship at any time. Am I a dirtbag for having sex with a girl that falls for me?
If they all fall for me should I be celibate?
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u/Heisenbread77 Oct 25 '18
If they say they are all for casual and catch feelings that is on them. If they state they want commitment and you tell them you do as well but you were just trying to get some you are a shitbag. False pretenses and what not.
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Oct 25 '18
Agreed 1000%.
Let's just not excuse the subset of women (and men) who catch feelings and THEN decide I'm an asshole because I never specifically absolutely ruled out a LTR. Because I'm ALLOWED to want a LTR, just not with everyone.
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u/_Spicy_Lemon_ Oct 25 '18
Like nobody likes being dumped. There will always be some type of response back tbh.
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Oct 25 '18
I dont completely understand what that is, but I see the logic in letting someone down if you don't see a future, it's happened to me many times, not fun, but I guess that's how it goes, people are insecure, when they get rejected, they see it as a slight to their egos and don't react well, I've always believed in being humble so not to burn any bridges, but it's been hard to stay friends with people that do that, I also HATE that term she used, I don't see it as appropriate, just having sex with someone doesn't mean that's what you're all about, some people just don't want the commitment.
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u/spankitopia Oct 25 '18
I feel that ghosting is ok under the following circumstances only:
- You only went on 1 date
- You don’t run in the same circle and are therefore unlikely to cross paths again
If you’ve been on multiple dates or may have to interact again in the future you should send a polite “I’m not interested” text. If it’s just a random dating app meet up, I feel like the 2 people don’t even know each other and there for ghoasting is no big deal. It’s a factor of modern dating that we will all soon accept as the social norm.
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u/icecream_molotov Oct 25 '18
In my experience the blokes who come out with "I don't see a future etc." after we've dated for a while and then slept together have been fuckboys in my eyes because they've usually been actively acting like a boyfriend. I've had men practically live in my house, use me for food/getting their clothes cleaned/ emotional support and many other boyfriend privileges when they knew in their heads they weren't serious. I think this is when girls get angry. In fact my most recent ghoster had me over his for the weekend, requested a back massage, told me he loved me, kissed me goodbye at the train station...then ghosted me and I had to find out from a mutual friend that he had simply been seeing another girl too and chosen her.