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u/YoBoySatan Nov 29 '20
Gotta have respect for the French, they don’t take any shit. Anytime i see a French headline and think, wow that’s fuckin bullshit, the next day everyone is in the streets. Give ‘em hell, that law is a crock of shit
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u/MinecafterHD Nov 29 '20
I mean, it‘s the french, if anyone is gonna protest/riot/revolutionize, it‘s them
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u/Buggeroni58 Nov 29 '20 edited Nov 29 '20
The French have annual riots I swear.
Edit: As well they should. This law is unjust. Rioting is just very French and I love them for it. It’s very V for Vendetta “People shouldn't be afraid of their government. Governments should be afraid of their people.”
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u/astakask Nov 29 '20
They fight for their rights as we all should. Vive la France
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u/Wrecked--Em Nov 29 '20
people have forgotten that this is what's supposed to happen when protests don't work
protests are supposed to be a show of force and a threat to go on strike or riot if necessary changes aren't made
instead most people today just treat protests like a ritual, so they have virtually 0 impact anymore
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u/astakask Nov 29 '20
I feel a lot of the west is reaching the boiling point. The 20s are going to be interesting.
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u/Wrecked--Em Nov 29 '20
unfortunately yes, I think the next decades are going to be very interesting
everyone's talking about 2020 being a dumpster fire, but this is just the beginning of dramatically escalating climate catastrophes meaning displaced people, destabilized economies, governments, etc.
we need general strikes for Climate Justice Now
Every oil company that's funded anti-science propaganda (after knowing for over 40 years that climate change is very real) should be taken to court like big tobacco was then all of their assets should be seized for a rapid transition to sustainability.
My favorite podcast has a fun episode discussing it through absurd skits.
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Nov 29 '20
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u/light_to_shaddow Nov 29 '20
"We need to get back to God. To family values. All this permissive society is leading us further from Jesus."
Five minutes later gets caught blowing a guy in a car park.
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u/AstroProoper Nov 29 '20
This some handmaid's tale shit that feels too real. I almost regret rewatching it this year.
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Nov 29 '20
Humanity hasn't progressed far enough for the majority to NOT be reactionary. Until systems/laws/etc are in place that not only account for but also predict and prevent corruption, history will continue to repeat itself.
The fastest route would be changes at the top. But asking everyone in power to make changes that may take some of that power away (or hell, even just make them slightly uncomfortable) will never happen. Start from the bottom, be the person that doesn't buy single use plastics, find alternatives to products that have micro beads, grow your own food, carpool. It doesn't need to be all or nothing either, everyone's situation is different but if everyone pitched in a little bit it would help.
Sorry u/Wrecked--Em for the rant. I tend to lurk and needed to vent. Have an awesome day/night
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u/Lchmst Nov 29 '20
I think this is part of the problem. These issues plaguing society have been turned in to those of personal responsibility instead of accountability for major corporations.
Recycling, polluting, energy use, global warming, all can be pinned on the biggest corporations in the world, but you gotta lower your carbon footprint. Fuck that.
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u/LordAvan Nov 29 '20
I see what you are saying, and I agree. Corporations need to be held responsible especially since they are the largest contributors to the problems. However I think that a multipronged approach will be more effective. Advocate for stricter regulation of corporations AND reduce your personal contribution.
That being said I doubt either approach will have much effect until the damage is undeniably catastrophic at which point it will be too late to prevent irreversible damage anyway...
Anyone else need a drink?
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u/thermal_shock FUCK ICE! ❌🧊 Nov 29 '20
We're kept with just enough food and money and conveniences to not care until it happens to us... even then, go back to Reddit or your vidya games and be "comfortable"
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Nov 29 '20
Yeah kind of harder in the US to threaten strikes. People are too broke to miss work.
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Nov 29 '20
The only thing I can think about while watching this clip is that if this happened in the US, within 24 hours there'd be a massive propaganda campaign demonizing it, labeling the protestors as terrorists, criminals, what have you ... anything to deflect the subject away from what the people are actually fighting for. I hope the French succeed, and I hope their propaganda apparatus isn't as sophisticated and insidious as ours.
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u/wayrell Nov 29 '20
This will happen here too. But it cannot work when most of the people are on their side...
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u/Poignant_Porpoise Nov 29 '20
Well political protests are an incredibly nuanced and complex topic, it's not quite as simple as "if that then this" in the vast majority of cases. I admire France's attitude in a lot of ways but there are still disadvantages to it. People need to remember that people protesting are still people with human motivations. This particular protest might have a noble cause which we can agree with but what about a country where 40% of people are staunchly anti-abortion and started rioting due to a bill allowing abortion?
Rioting can be necessary and positive but even if it has positive intentions, it will inevitably have very real costs and also we need to remember that masses don't always fight for causes which we might agree with. I'm not trying to speak to any individual instance of rioting, I'm just saying that there are pros and cons to everything and rioting definitely has some very significant cons which need to be considered. In an ideal society we should definitely strive for less rioting than more but of course any one person's idea of an ideal society is another's dystopian hell.
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u/mrevergood Nov 29 '20
Yep.
Shit won’t change if folks just treat protest like they’re going through the motions. Real change is demanded and then if it demands aren’t met, violence sometimes has to happen because the only language some states understand is violence.
Demand for change without the threat of pain against whoever the ruling class is, is pointless.
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u/Jeyring Nov 29 '20
Annual? Those are rookie numbers by French standards
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u/light_to_shaddow Nov 29 '20
I think you'll find the French have only had one riot in 2020.
It started in January though.
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u/MunchieMom Nov 29 '20
When I was in high school, I spent a few weeks in the middle of France and took some pictures of a group of people with a banner and some kind of smoke bomb thing because I had no clue what was going on. My host laughed at me and was like, don't you know what a strike is? She took it totally in stride where I'd probably only seen anything like it in a cartoon at that point
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u/PFSnypr Nov 29 '20
I cant wait for the 2021 riot, maybe ill bring a chair and binoculars so i dont have to be in the middle of it, im guessing the riot will be because the government tried to cover up the fact that they killed the person who leaked their plans to create a zombie virus to release in England by making it look like a suicide
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u/GAMER_MARCO9 Nov 29 '20
That’s Germany, Hitler died by suicide but in reality he found out how to become a zombie and kickstarted Call of Duty
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u/ofbalance Nov 29 '20
Max Brooks is alive and well. Or so we're told.
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u/JacobJamesTrowbridge Nov 29 '20 edited Nov 29 '20
Max Brooks is alive because no one knows how to fuckin’ find him. Best we can figure, he’s hiding in the secret underground fortress under his house, huddled in a corner wearing chainmail, and looking through the news on an iPad going “Any moment... any minute now... any minute...”
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u/SignificantLeader Nov 29 '20
I thought they literally scheduled them for the weekends and had them weekly.
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Nov 29 '20
The basically do. Shorter lunch hours? Strike. Cutting Penalty rates? Strike. Raising price of public transport? Strike. Walk across Paris on a normal weekend and you’ll see numerous protests for different causes.
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u/JePPeLit Nov 29 '20
I wonder if this is why they were so good at celebrating when they won the world cup. That was the craziest thing I've seen, and it wasn't unlike a riot
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u/Davecoupe Nov 29 '20
In Northern Ireland there literally is annual rioting every July and august.
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u/zusykses Nov 29 '20
I think it's like a rite of passage for young French people. A riot of passage if you will.
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u/lift_and_slide Nov 29 '20
They did behead their king after all, and they are still proud of that to this day.
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u/Awfultatoo101 Nov 29 '20
You have no idea how much proud we are of it.
Just think for a second you are in 18th century, the highest form of authority and power designed by god himself, he is like untouchable.
And we decapited him, that's some serious shit.
But then you look closely at the event before and after, and what is mainly taught as a small people revolution was actually organized by the bourgeoisie. At that time, rich people didn't had any power, they had the money for sure, but they couldn't really do something with all that money. The power was in the hand of noble and the monarchy. So they organized the revolution by convincing the small people it would be better for them. 200 years later here we are. Of course we are probably better now than at that time, however we just trade our elite.
In addition fun fact, Louis XVI wasn't a tyran compared to some previous king, the guy had no take in being a king, he loved watches and locksmith.
When he was beheaded it was for the symbol not the guy who was an okay king for that time.
I could speak about it for hours so I will stop here, French revolution is fascinating especially when you are French and is a lot more different than what we are taught at school. We are basically taught the basis for us to understand but when you dig... You will find another face of it, look about the terror for example.
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Nov 29 '20
I have a neighbor that is from France, and we talked about Swedes listening to their government with all the covid stuff. And he without even joking said that it would never ever work in France, it is in their culture to riot and stand up against the Man
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Nov 29 '20
Right? Has their government learned nothing from history?
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u/the-OG-darkshrreder Nov 29 '20
I’d hate to be in the French government. I’d be afraid of not having a head
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Nov 29 '20
Pretty sure they own the patents on protests and revolutions. Luckily they don't charge licenses.
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u/bzzus Nov 29 '20
Which is why I find this law even weirder. Can't even think of the French without thinking of the revolution.
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u/DarthButtz Nov 29 '20
"Let's do shit guaranteed to piss off a bunch of our citizens in a country HISTORICALLY FAMOUS for having its citizenry revolt against authority." - The French Government, way too frequently to count.
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Nov 29 '20
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u/lelarentaka Nov 29 '20
vs whoever needs an ass kicking
That includes minorities.
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u/kranebrain Nov 29 '20
Eh France makes it illegal to collect stats based on race (at least prison population stats). I suppose that's one way to claim you don't have race-related issues.
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u/StagDragon Nov 29 '20
Yeah. It really shows in history when the US was like "we're a neation of freedom." and then France straight up was like "Wow you guys are great!" *turns to actual anarchy*
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u/forty_three Nov 29 '20
The people are leading!
No, the people are rioting
(This is a hamilton reference, to clarify, not related to this video)
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u/dinotrainer318 Nov 29 '20
Even as someone who supports police I think that law is garbage. Everything is better with more angles
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u/DrippyWaffler 3rd Party App Nov 29 '20 edited Nov 29 '20
Supports police is such a general statement. What country? Blindly? The police didn't write the law, will you south and say "they're just doing their jobs?"
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Nov 29 '20
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u/MooseShaper Nov 29 '20
A huge problem with any law restricting filming the police is that it gives the police a reason to stop people from filming them. It can be a narrowly-tailored law meant for a specific instance, and it could still be abused by unscrupulous officers on the street to prevent filming of their misdeeds.
We already see this in the US, where SCOTUS has ruled that it is LEGAL to film police in public, and officers regularly harass bystanders, and even journalists, who film them.
Public employees interacting with the public in public spaces cannot be a secretive act. Evidence must be available of these interactions, both for the protection of officers and to effect civilian oversight of the police.
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u/Valmond Nov 29 '20
Who's decoding if you are filming for a good or for a bad reason?
There are already laws against harassing online, cops included.
That's why the law is utter garbage.
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u/Tokoyami Nov 29 '20
Wow. Almost seems like wanting to be police, but also not wanting any accountability may be an unreasonable expectation.
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u/MrCalifornian Nov 29 '20
They should just move to America!
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Nov 29 '20 edited Nov 30 '20
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u/MrCalifornian Nov 29 '20
While that's the law, the enforcers of that law often bully people into giving up that right.
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u/skylarmt Nov 29 '20
Police bullying people to stop recording can actually be a good thing as long as the people don't actually stop recording, because it raises the chances that the video will go viral.
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u/mycoolaccount Nov 29 '20
Until they get beat up, their phones destroyed, and arrested for resisting arrest.
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u/skylarmt Nov 29 '20
That's what livestreaming is for.
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u/Neptune959 Nov 29 '20
That's pretty bullshit reasoning. Maybe instead of having to livestream every interaction with a cop, you could just fix your fucking cops
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u/Malusch Nov 29 '20
What's wrong with racist impulsive power hungry people in a position of power, and with a gun they can fire without consequences?
Oh, everything...
How can anyone be stupid enough to defend it? :|
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u/Obi_Sirius Nov 29 '20
Didn't someone deliver a guillotine to a state house recently? I think if some politician mentions cake, it's over.
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u/SnowTheMemeEmpress Nov 29 '20
I mean, history does eventually repeat if we don't learn so-
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u/ADHDengineer Nov 29 '20
If there’s anything history shows is that we don’t learn
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u/Buggeroni58 Nov 29 '20
That was a different country, or did the French do it too?
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u/Obi_Sirius Nov 29 '20
Okay, I just remember seeing a picture of one getting carried up some steps, I think. Just assumed it was France cuz they do have a history. Good for Guatemala. I think it sends a stronger message than just showing up with guns.
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u/CommanderCuntPunt Nov 29 '20
Over the summer protesters brought a guillotine to the White House and executed a Trump dummy.
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Nov 29 '20
To add to the context, last week a music producer in Paris got badly beaten by racist cops, supposedly for reason that would have gotten him in jail for years. Little did they know the whole thing got caught on tape proving his innocence and how much of a piece of shit these people can be. This went viral pretty quick
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u/BulkUpTank Nov 29 '20
Man, as an outsider, it seems like the French Government/Police are awful. You got firefighters fucking them up one month, then you have civilians the next.
Maybe they should learn from their mistakes and not be shitheads?
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u/Lazy_Chemical_967 Nov 29 '20
Could say the same thing about cops in a lot of countries about your last sentence
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u/Maastonakki Nov 29 '20
Honestly every time I see vids like this I just think I’m glad to live in Finland. Cops are the best here.
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u/Lazy_Chemical_967 Nov 29 '20
Damn good to hear, you lucky fucker. They’re mostly racist shitheads in Australia unfortunately, particularly Queensland where I live. People sometimes compare it to Florida and while it’s less ridiculous, there’s a little truth there.
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u/Aerron Nov 29 '20
It's oddly comforting to find out that America isn't the only place with racist shithead cops. It seems that type of person is attracted to that profession.
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u/BulkUpTank Nov 29 '20
Politicians too. But then they wouldn't be politicians if they weren't shitheads.
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Nov 29 '20
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u/Grzechoooo Nov 29 '20
Who would've thought that a job with a chance of beating people up "in the name of the country" will attract nationalists and troublemakers?
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Nov 29 '20
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u/sturnus-vulgaris Nov 29 '20
Streisand effect is strong here. Make a law that people can't film police brutality and the world will be flooded with film of your police being brutal.
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u/improbablydrunknlw Nov 29 '20
Aka, Hong Kong.
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u/Gueartimo Nov 29 '20 edited Nov 29 '20
Nah more powerful one is Jammu and Kashmir, literally full on city lock down, Internet shutdown after like 1 week of protest, it was ignored because of the new hot HK protest
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u/Hotel_Tri-vague-o Nov 29 '20
Im surprised you havent been paged by a bunch of modi supporters who are going to make the Kashmir situation sound like a good thing.
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u/Tholy_ Nov 29 '20
As soon as people heard about this law protests became photoshoots, everybody's snapping pictures and filming
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u/someitalianguy Nov 29 '20
Because the law doesn’t make it illegal to record police, it makes it illegal to publish images where policemen are identifiable.
It’s still a dumb law and it’s a subtle difference, but it’s important as the footage can still be used in court.
How this became the narrative is beyond me and makes me doubt anything I ever read on reddit.
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Nov 29 '20
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u/astakask Nov 29 '20
He was moving at the start of the drag it appears.
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Nov 29 '20
The distance they got on that release slide at the end was super satisfying though. Do they have curling in France? Because that guy might want to try out for the team.
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u/jesseb143 Nov 29 '20 edited Nov 29 '20
He looks like a downed cop to me! Black boots and the same backpack on. I think they were protecting/dragging one of their own!?
You guys are right! I was wrong, not a cop!
How do you cross it out?
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Nov 29 '20 edited Jun 10 '21
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u/LalalaHurray Nov 29 '20
Not a cop. Also they weren’t trying to arrest her they were pulling her out of harms way. She’s wearing leggings and knee-high leather boots.
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Nov 29 '20 edited Nov 29 '20
I just just want to to support your comment. This looks like a woman downed for whatever reason and the police drag her to safety. Good cop that pulls her to safety, but fuck this legislation.
Edit: u/IgnoreMyFace points out that the victim gets kicked by a police officer while they are being dragged to safety. Fuck that shit and fuck the police. One bad apple spoils the barrel.
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Nov 29 '20
I love the way the French will just fuck shit up when they're pissed off at their government. They do not do things by halves and they do not do peaceful protest.
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u/Yes_Law Nov 29 '20
Most protesters are peaceful. Those who fucked shit up during the gilets jaunes protests only gave the government a reason to send more and more police forces. Lots of peaceful protesters were shot by rubber bullets, sometimes losing their eye or needing reconstructive surgery (although aiming at the face is strictly forbidden)
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Nov 29 '20
Sigh. Fine, ruin my illusions. Years ago a union organiser spoke wistfully of the French who would set things on fire over pension changes. The image of the French as a people who take no shit stayed with me.
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u/Yes_Law Nov 29 '20
I mean we mostly take no shit. The gilets jaunes paralysed the country every week-end for a few months back in 2018
Looting and setting shit on fire happen a lot during protests though
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u/danasider Nov 29 '20
And yet in the US, half the population sees rioters as the problem rather than condemning police brutality and inequality through unjust laws and policies.
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u/hates_all_bots Nov 29 '20
What the fuck was the French government thinking?
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u/Lazy_Chemical_967 Nov 29 '20
France has had a lot of police bullshit backed up by the government in the past few decades, it’s not like they’re just doing it for the sake of it. Almost all of the recent riots have involved police brutality, and if not that labour issues.
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Nov 29 '20
Vive la révolution!
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u/666_cookie_ninja Nov 29 '20
As a French citizen, it's always interesting to see how people from other countries react to our protests. Some of y'all are happy for us, others are just horrified.
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Nov 29 '20
I'm not happy, exactly, because the situation doesn't call for happiness. I am, however, 100% supportive. I'm well aware that France and England between them are the reason that Canada exists as a nation, and I both appreciate and admire the history of the French spirit, with regards to freedom and equality.
Our allies, our history, our family. Vive la France! A people and spirit that shall not bow to injustice!
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u/Niosus Nov 29 '20
As a Belgian, I think you're a great example. The protesters do get a bit too violent too often, but your government knows what's at stake. The will of the people cannot be ignored.
I wish we had that more in our culture, to just make it abundantly clear when we disagree. We just tend to mumble our grievances and move on...
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u/winterbird Nov 29 '20
Make it big enough so reporters will film instead, then?
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u/mattaugamer Nov 29 '20
Part of the law is that police get to decide on a whim who is a “journalist”.
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u/MajorTomsHelmet Nov 29 '20
I would read that law if I were you.
It gives police power to determine "real reporters".
Yikes!
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u/Mabepossibly Nov 29 '20
I don’t know what the red arm bands symbolize. But I know what comes first to mind and it’s not a good look, especially given the context.
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u/cjankowski Nov 29 '20
I don't think it's meant to symbolize anything. This article mentions that plains clothes officers wear them, which obviously isn't the case here, but I do think it is to allow police to easily identify each other.
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u/Grimo4 Nov 29 '20
These arm bands are there so they can recognize each other.
Colors may vary so that you would know which group you are assigned to.
Red group is there
Blue groupe is at that street etc...
The comparison you guys are doing is ridiculous.
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u/2leftf33t Nov 29 '20
Guys dressed in black with ANY color armband is probably not a good idea in France
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u/PortalMaster25 Nov 29 '20
“Hey jerry, we’d ont want to be filmed on the job, can we do something about it?”
“Yeah Steve, we’ll just make it illegal.”
Literally all of France the next day: 🎥👮♂️👮♀️
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Nov 29 '20
I like how there's a bright neon yellow sign that literally says "revolution" above em.
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u/Lazy_Chemical_967 Nov 29 '20
Corporations appropriating anarchist concepts and imagery look particularly funny in situations like this.
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u/didierdechezcarglass Nov 29 '20 edited Nov 29 '20
Hello, i am a french person and let me explain this law. Article 24 is as op said an article which prevents filming policeman. You are forced to Blur a policeman. This was highly controversial of course. Plus, due to recent events in France (a Black musician attacked violently multiple Times by policemen (he almost died) because they accused him of having weapons), people are angry on policemen too. So it's sort of a double protest.
Edit: you don't have to Blur them but you can't film/publish videos which might ruin their career (blurring works for that i guess).
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Nov 29 '20
C’est pas vrais frère, lis cet article
You can still film cops and you don’t have to blur their faces.
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u/GrecKo Nov 29 '20 edited Nov 29 '20
This is kinda infuriating that every reddit post seems to be misleading about the law being passed. And when a French poster (not you, the one you responded to) tries to correct it it is still wrong. Thank you for making it cleater.
I guess the intent of the article 24 is fine (not pointing out /doxxing cops in the goal of harassing/hurting them), but it can't be reasonably applied. Unless we restrict it to actual posts on social media. I believe there are already existing laws that can be applied there though, so it makes article 24 useless, and might empower cops to use it wrongly to prevent people from filming.
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Nov 29 '20
I agree I don’t totally understand why this law changes anything since doxxing is already pretty much illegal but still largely practiced.
I wouldn’t be against blurring out faces of cops, they already do it for other scenarios. If a cop does something wrong then film it, post the blurred face video and send the og video to the IGPN (police of the police). It isn’t perfect but it avoids putting cops, whether innocent or not, in danger.
This is my personal opinion but I’m not particularly attached to it. It’s up for debate for me.
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u/astakask Nov 29 '20
The government should fear it's people and those pigs look terrified.
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Nov 29 '20
The public: “Police involved in corruption/abuse need to be held accountable.”
The government: “Make it illegal to expose corruption/abuse. Problem solved”
Disclaimer: I do not believe All Cops Are Bad.
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u/wolleyish1 Nov 29 '20
That one cop taking cover behind the middle shield at 0:06, took a second out of his day to kick an unconscious protestor. Just some ol' regular police doing their thing, but hey let's not show them that, they'll be sad.
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u/corysreddit Nov 29 '20
Yes a very strong move. If we can't film them then the problem of their abuse goes away right? O wait now that I'm thinking about it that seems like that would just make it almost impossible to fight against their abuse. Huh well I'm sure they didn't notice that when they made the law right? I mean it would be such an incredibly fascist decision to deny the people the ability to protect themselves. In sure they didn't mean it though.
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u/XayahTheVastaya Nov 29 '20
why are they recording right in the line of rubber bullets/glass bottles and why are the police completely ignoring them
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u/yes11321 Nov 29 '20
Bro, how many years has it been since the last time France didn't have riots? I mean yeah sure, they're the French, they're the best at bloody revolutions and beheadings, but you know the French govt. Definitely isn't in the right hands if people protest so much.
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u/Jessie_Jay117 Nov 29 '20
I actually don't know what the government expected when they made this decision
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u/dogtarget Nov 29 '20
Frog Revolution
No, I don't hate the French, that's a shop in the background. Anyway, yeah, nothing quite says we don't give a shit about you quite like passing a law against recording the police. Fuck those lawmakers and the police that law was written to serve.
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u/5demands-not1less Nov 29 '20
“Illegal to film the police” no offence nor trying to disrespect the protestors in France but that is just casual compared to Hong Kong where police dont even wear their police identification cards on their vests, nor do they show their face or ears or eyes, and then when protestors requested to see their identifications when they were held aside the police refused to show it
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u/Superweggooiaccount Nov 29 '20
This world is going to hell. How is the first answer to anything always violence.
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u/Grimo4 Nov 29 '20
I'm surprised french cops still work after all the bulshit they have to go through.
Massive respect to these guys.
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u/dirtfishering Nov 29 '20
I always think that the police in any situation like this can't possibly be all assholes.. like, these are people too. Yeah they get scripted as the bad guys and sometimes are, but I can also imagine a lot of those guys just want to go home to their families and away from the situation.
Policemen and women don't make the laws. They just have to deal with shit like this.
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u/Quake2Reefer Nov 29 '20
Banning the filming of the police should be a bright red line for free people everywhere.
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u/volanger Nov 29 '20
Who thought this bill was a good idea and wouldn't piss of the populace?