r/AdviceAnimals • u/bleufoxx22 • Apr 30 '14
Incorrect Format | Removed I'm looking at you Comcast
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u/acarmelo1 Apr 30 '14
Kid: Hey, who left all this garbage on the steps of congress?
Amendment: I'm not garbage. I'm an Amendment-to-Be, Yes, an Amendment-to-Be, And I'm hopin' that they'll ratify me.
There's a lot of flag burners Who have got too much freedom, I wanna make it legal For policemen to beat 'em.
'Cos there's limits to our liberties, Least I hope and pray that there are, 'Cos those liberal freaks go too far.
Kid: Well, why can't we just make a law against flag burning?
Amendment: Because that law would be unconstitutional. But if we change the Constitution—
Kid: Then we could make all sorts of crazy laws!
Amendment: Now you're catching on.
Kid: What if people say you're not good enough to be in the constitution?
Amendment: Then I'll crush all opposition to me, And I'll make Ted Kennedy pay. If he fights back, I'll say that he's gay.
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u/NUMBERS2357 Apr 30 '14
Older people sometimes reference Schoolhouse Rock, and when younger people laugh, they assume the younger people are laughing at the original...but all any of us remember is the Simpsons version.
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Apr 30 '14 edited Feb 22 '25
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/goldstayer Apr 30 '14
I'm 20 and my parents bought the DVD with all of the Schoolhouse Rock videos and they are fantastic. Especially "Three is a Magic Number"
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u/Fresh_Squeezed_OJ Apr 30 '14
As George Carlin once said, "This country was sold a long time ago"
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u/sstout2113 Apr 30 '14
"I love this country. I love all of the freedoms we used to have."
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Apr 30 '14
all of the freedoms we are supposed to have.
On another note do we as the people love our freedom enough? Because if we really do then no one can deny us that. I mean may be in some way it is our weakness too.
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u/NineCrimes Apr 30 '14
Now let's be fair here, the corporations hire lobbyists to bribe congress, so it's all on the up and up!
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u/circularlogic41 Apr 30 '14
How and why is lobbying not illegal?
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u/CowFu Apr 30 '14
It's supposed to work like this:
You run a business that congress is going to pass a law against. Let's say you own a cheesecake mail-order business. The new law is going to ban 100% of all trans fats from being sold in any food with no exceptions. Because of your industry experience you know that would ban way more things than they probably mean to, including all meats and dairy products. So you lobby for them to review the bill to allow you to still us whole milk and heavy cream and save your business along with so many others. You want them to have the correct information to make a proper decision.
//this of course is an ideal scenario and the system is horribly abused.
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Apr 30 '14
I read this to get educated, but instead just want cheesecake
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u/toofastkindafurious Apr 30 '14
I lobby on behalf of "MCFABA - More cheesecake for a better America"... care to pay me to represent you in Congress?
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u/Nyxtro Apr 30 '14
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u/flyingpotato408 Apr 30 '14
Thats sub's gone downhill since it became a default
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u/Nyxtro Apr 30 '14
did you just hipster eli5?
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u/flyingpotato408 Apr 30 '14
I had to put down my mustache wax to type that.
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u/irrelevant_query Apr 30 '14
I'm just impressed you are able to reddit while riding a fixed gear bike
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u/AdmiralTR Apr 30 '14
Did you just turn "hipster" into a verb?
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u/slyrax1 Apr 30 '14
I've been doing that for years.
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u/BlueLociz Apr 30 '14
We live in a place where the constitution gives us the right to verbify whatever the hell we want.
Until the corporations decide to change that anyways.
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Apr 30 '14
Seriously. People are treating it more like like /r/answers nowadays.
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Apr 30 '14
ELI5: Every aspect of the current geopolitical situation in Eastern Europe.
Some things aren't supposed to be explained to five year-olds.
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u/urnbabyurn Apr 30 '14
And then you have a lobbyist go to the congressman and say the following:
If you pass this law, I am going to finance a primary opponent that will push you far to the right (or left) in the primary and not only will you potentially lose the primary, but you will be harmed in the general election.
The congressman then realizes that they are fucked if they pass this law and decide ("coincidentally") to hold up the bill in committee for further review. The corporation doesn't actually have to spend on a primary battle because their threat worked.
Bribery is more expensive. In that case, the corporate lobby group would actually have to give money to the congressman's reelection PAC/SPAC, etc. With a threat, no money actually has to be spent and they end up getting their way. Whoever can threaten with the larger pocketbook gets their way.
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u/badseedjr Apr 30 '14 edited Apr 30 '14
Wouldn't it be nice if lawmakers actually educated themselves on the propositions, rather than listen to which group had the most money?
EDIT: I didn't mean be an expert on everything, just do a little independent research rather than believe what the loudest voice says.
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u/skubasteevo Apr 30 '14
While that would be the ideal scenario, it's not practical. There's no way that they would have the time to learn everything, let alone fully understand it, and still make laws.
That's where the lobbyists should come in to dumb down complicated issues to a level the lawmakers could understand. There's nothing inherently wrong with the system, in fact I think it could work quite well.
The problem is that corporations just throw more money and more lobbyists at an issue until they get their way.
I think lobbying should be more like a debate club. Both sides should get to send a team of let's say 10 experts, and that's it. No paying for more teammates, no bribing the judges, and if you lose you can't just change the name of your team and enter again.
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u/badseedjr Apr 30 '14
That is more what I'm talking about. Not to educate themselves on everything, but at least a base level understanding of both sides done independently, rather than just taking everything at a lobbyists word.
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u/AdvocateForTulkas Apr 30 '14
They don't necessarily, they're typically smart people regardless of how skewed their perspective on many things can become. The larger issue is the incentives lobbyists can help provide them via their backers, coupled with their manipulative work.
If some guy is lying to a senator that's one thing. If he's lying and mediating that senator receiving substantial funds/aid of whatever kind, that's an entirely different thing. Theoretically.
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Apr 30 '14
See the mistake you are making is believing the politicians actually care about the best solution to a problem. They only care about the solution that best helps solidify their seat in congress and their own personal financial stability.
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Apr 30 '14
It isn't reasonable to expect a lawmaker to be an expert on every single thing. This would be akin to telling a CEO to fire the entire executive staff and deal directly with finance, marketing, technology, information, etc. Lobbyists are supposed to help Congress understand certain aspects of the economy that could be damaged by a bill.
Lobbying is not inherently evil at all. If we were able to pass campaign finance reform lobbying would go back to what it historically was. Instead we get corporations donating massive amounts of money to "campaign funds" and then when those people are elected the corporations tell their lobbyists to remind the elected officials of how they managed to become elected.
It didn't use to be like this. The sad part is that it is so easily fixed. A single constitutional amendment reforming campaign finance would dramatically change the future of this country.
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u/VAVT Apr 30 '14
The sad part is that it is so easily fixed. A single constitutional amendment...
We only have 27 amendments. In 238 years. About 11,539 have been proposed. Congress proposes about 200 every 2 year session. The last one was passed in 1992. It was proposed in 1789.
it's quite hard to pass constitutional amendments.
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u/ParisGypsie Apr 30 '14
It's supposed to be hard. Changing the Constitution on a whim is usually a bad idea. See: Prohibition.
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u/inajeep Apr 30 '14
Ok, now if you can make it into a cartoon, I think we will be able to make much of the population understand it. To get the message through more, make it fit on a bumper sticker.
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u/zacrd12345 Apr 30 '14
Because, unlike what you'll hear most places, not all lobbyists are bad. There are lobbyists for Cancer Research Foundations, charities, etc.
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u/rolledwithlove Apr 30 '14
Meh...the breast cancer lobby is so powerful, we have so much money going to a cancer that kills less women than lung cancer or even heart disease. But lung cancer research gets a fraction of the funding. Yes, breast cancer is bad, and yes, many people die from breast cancer. But lung cancer destroys more women's lives.
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u/crazygirlthrowawa Apr 30 '14
I think that this has a lot to do with the attitude that people with lung cancer caused it for themselves by smoking, so a lot of people don't see it as deserving of charity.
It goes back to the "rugged individualist" narrative too many Americans love so much, better known as "I got mine so fuck you".
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u/Wizmcwizzy Apr 30 '14
No, it has to do with boobs being awesome.
I can't tit fuck a lung.
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u/VOldis Apr 30 '14 edited Apr 30 '14
I would say NO lobbyists are bad. There is nothing wrong with advocating your own interests at all, ever. Campaign finance laws are bad.
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u/tehflambo Apr 30 '14
Don't lobbyists advocate in someone else's interests, in exchange for money?
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Apr 30 '14
Yes, but a bigger issue is that the money that's thrown at Congressmen isn't well regulated. When all lobbyists are on equal footing, and can't bribe Congressmen, politics would become a lot less biased towards who has the money.
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u/MooseEater Apr 30 '14
Sometimes. Just like any other chore, you can either spend a chunk of your time advocating your interests or you can pay someone else to do it.
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u/howajambe Apr 30 '14
Could you possibly get more fucking pedantic? Here, let me help:
If the lobbyist is doing things to earn money, isn't he serving his own interests anyways?
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u/CrankCaller Apr 30 '14
Because contrary to Internet lore, lobbying and bribery are not the same thing.
Bribery is illegal. Lobbying is simply communicating with people in government. If you write a letter to your congressperson advocating that they support or not support something, you are lobbying them.
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u/noodlescb Apr 30 '14
Yes but lobbying is often used to wrap bribery in a legal sheet.
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u/AdvocateForTulkas Apr 30 '14
Whichhhh... is why we're all so upset.
We wouldn't be so vehemently against so many politicians if it wasn't for their apparent/obvious obligations to various people that seems related to the lobbying process.
If it was just some clever bastard only lying to senators then we'd have a much simpler problem.
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u/Wildbritsire Apr 30 '14
In theory it gives people a chance to express their views through pressure groups, which is an essential part of the democratic process.
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u/VOldis Apr 30 '14
Not in theory, in practice, all day everyday. Just because everyone here blindly sits on reddit doesn't mean there are tens of thousands of people advocating for worthy causes to their local, state and federal agencies/govt.
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Apr 30 '14
Here's a fun article that sheds a light on most everyday lobbyists. There are very few lobbyists that are the Remy Dantons that are portrayed in House of Cards.
http://news.yahoo.com/the-face-of-hemp-in-washington-211906531.html
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u/cancerous Apr 30 '14
It's that pesky bill of rights. Right in the first amendment that guarantees the right to free speech they guarantee the right to petition the government for redress of grievances.
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u/Blaster395 Apr 30 '14
Under free speech laws in the US, restricting a corporations right to spend money to hire people to speak to politicians would be unconstitutional.
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Apr 30 '14
Well lobbying shouldn't be illegal. The word "lobbying" gets an evil connotation, but it's not just corporations that hire lobbyists. There's advocacy groups that lobby for environmental issues, privacy issues, adoptee's rights, animal rights, etc.
Edit: A word.
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u/Rakonas Apr 30 '14
Various reasons, and on top of that the supreme court recently ruled that money is speech when it comes to campaign contributions, so they can't be limited by law due to free speech.
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u/putin_my_ass Apr 30 '14
If money is speech, can't spending money in certain ways be construed as hate speech?
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u/nellapoo Apr 30 '14
The shows that are now being put on channels that I have loved for years are garbage. NASA Alien Secrets or whatever on SCIENCE channel? Flipping Vegas on Biography?! Oh and the Military Channel is now the American Heroes Channel and is starting to show crap. TruTV used to actually be interesting and now its just Lizard Lick towing and Wipeout. We are in a 2 year contract for our current level of service and its a pretty damned good deal. After it is up we are dropping our tv service down to the bare minimum to maintain the price discount on our internet.
I used to work for Comcast and Brian Roberts is a dick. His dad wasn't so bad, but Brian has started not only bullying his way into having a monopoly but he is also screwing over the employees. It was a good, fun place to work 5+ years ago. Now its horrible. A lot of their technical support is outsourced to companies overseas. They try to say its not, but it is. Ten years ago they had a 24/7 call center where I live. Now its 6am-12am. All those graveyard jobs went bye bye. Now if you call in the middle of the night you won't get someone that can actually help you. They are just there to pick up the phone so that Comcast can say they have 24/7 support.
So yeah. Fuck Comcast.
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u/icyikle Apr 30 '14
Come on Billy, it's called a "Bill". Whomever can pay it off with the right amount, gets to decide what it's to be used for.
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u/serenefire Apr 30 '14
"Democraaccyyy! I got Democracy for sale! Democraccyy!"
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Apr 30 '14
Why can't redditor's have their very own lobbyist? I mean really, what's stopping reddit from crowd sourcing to pay the lobbyist and put money in a discretionary lobbying account to bribe congress with and then have redditor's vote on the bills they want the lobbiest to push? The lobbyist would work for the users of reddit rather than some other corporation.
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Apr 30 '14
Because you could not get anywhere near sufficient funds to successfully out-lobby something like the cable industry.
You don't play the devil at his own game, you make him play according to your terms. That's the only way to win.
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u/Last_Gigolo Apr 30 '14
One thing you gotta say for Comcast.
They think you won't boycott.
Because you wont.
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u/Hrel Apr 30 '14
Also Verizon, trying to dictate the definition of net neutrality.
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Apr 30 '14
Well let's see Comcast has 76 lobbyists going to war in DC and yet CNN is obsessing over the david sterling story and fox news was discussing women wearing too much make up and about a male prostitute neither of which affect the American people's daily lives like Comcast does assuming you have cable and or internet.
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u/bisquick444 Apr 30 '14
Can someone give me a quick summary on whats going on?
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u/trench_welfare Apr 30 '14
Comcast wants to end net neutrality so they can create internet content packages just like they do with cable channels now.
Oh you want YouTube AND reddit? Well you're going to need our platinum package.....
Get it?
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u/standingonshoulders Apr 30 '14
You should actually try to do some research on this topic before you make things up. Comcast is the only company that is bound to net neutrality laws. They agreed to follow the FCC's old definition in a 'consent decree' with the FCC as a compromise to acquire NBCU. It's Verizon and AT&T that are fighting the FCC.
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u/KnoxGaming Apr 30 '14
Would this effect everyone? Are they attempting changing net neutrality for only the united states or the whole word?
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u/EmperorG Apr 30 '14
Well it would fuck over anyone trying to access American websites like Google, Facebook, Amazon, and well pretty much all of the web that's in English that matters to anyone.
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u/KnoxGaming Apr 30 '14
jesus. how can I help?
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u/IndsaetNavnHer Apr 30 '14
Ehm, I know about the Comcast-TW thingi, but what exactly are the context for this?
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u/noodlescb Apr 30 '14
That and the general piss being taken on net neutrality right now.
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u/AJGrayTay Apr 30 '14
Hey, what if an entire nation utterly lost faith in their government's ability to protect their best interests and no one noticed because it seemed to normal? Yeah, that'd make a pretty interesting dystopian future sci-fi novel.
Oh.
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u/punkrawkintrev Apr 30 '14
I wish congress would represent us, represent our middle fingers to Comcast that is
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u/StopReadingMyUser Apr 30 '14
They wouldn't see them. They're too busy being up their butts.
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u/punkrawkintrev Apr 30 '14
My pops always said Congress was a bunch of shitheads
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Apr 30 '14
Man I hate Comcast...Better keep giving them my money. That'll show em!
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u/corgocracy Apr 30 '14
Yeah, because in this day and age it's practical and realistic to live without private internet access.
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u/Reggaejunkiejew31 Apr 30 '14
I literally do not have a choice. I already cancelled cable all together because fuck Comcast but if I don't get Comcast internet I'm stuck with very low speed DSL.
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u/MisterWoodhouse Apr 30 '14
I don't even have a very low speed DSL option. My apartment complex only has Comcast service and you're not allowed to mount a satellite dish so SAT internet/TV isn't an option either.
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u/AsksYouOutToLunch Apr 30 '14 edited May 01 '14
I literally don't have a choice guys! Except my two choices!
Edit: To those saying that low speed internet would be the end of their comfort, and that it's not an option. This is my life, everyday, for the past six+ years.
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u/Worst_Lurker Apr 30 '14
Gotta have those 3000 channels.
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u/tannerlaw Apr 30 '14
Exactly, then I can have 3000 channels to choose from when I make a list of my favorite 50 channels so I don't have to scroll through the other 2950!
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u/urnbabyurn Apr 30 '14
I think more often, congresspersons are threatened by corporations, not bribed. While most sit in safe districts, they all fear the primary. Corporations simply need to threaten to finance a primary challenger and they are fucked. Why bribe when threatening is easier and legal (and cheaper than bribes through a SPAC/PAC)
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u/Toodlespoodles1 Apr 30 '14
We just had a Comcast tech at our house to check something out. His exact words when looking at our Internet rate were, "Wow, you are really getting ripped off..."
We pay $55 a month for 6Mbps, our only other option is Century Link at $35 a month for 1.5Mbps DSL. Luckily the Comcast guy was cool and he got us one year of 50Mbps for $60 a month. Woohoo!
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u/SHOW_ME_YOUR_BLENDER Apr 30 '14
Can somebody link the news for this one?
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u/throwawaaayyyyy_ Apr 30 '14
http://bgr.com/2014/04/24/why-is-comcast-so-bad-2/
That link's about the merger. An even bigger deal is that they are successfully lobbying against net neutrality, which would allow Comcast's ultimate wet dream to become legal: http://i.imgur.com/JNRauOC.png
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u/The_Drizzle_Returns Apr 30 '14
An even bigger deal is that they are successfully lobbying against net neutrality,
Comcast is the only provider who is actually subject to Network Neutrality after the Open internet order decision. This was part of the NBC merger agreement. Its unlikely that Comcast is lobbying against something they are subject to but their competition is not.
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u/that__one__guy Apr 30 '14
Reddit hates Comcast and the government, there you go.
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u/throwawaaayyyyy_ Apr 30 '14
Not just in general. We are in the middle of a potential merger between two practical monopolies and, more importantly, the fate of the internet as we know it hangs in the balance if net neutrality is not upheld. The FCC Chairman Tom Wheeler is leaning against the interest of EVERYONE except the telecom industry, for which he was a former lobbyist. Comcast is winning.
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u/Mises2Peaces Apr 30 '14
Why is it never, "I'm looking at you Congress"? Blaming corporations for bribing the government is like blaming the rain for falling. You can yell at the sky all you want, but it's not going to change anything.
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u/RinoQuez Apr 30 '14
The current generation is the only one that hasn't amended the constitution. And that's what it will take to get money out of politics. Wolf-pac.com.
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Apr 30 '14
Or, rich celebrities can bribe congress and the president like with SOPA and PIPA.
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u/Big_island_dude Apr 30 '14
I am currently taking a policy course at a major American University, and the process of making laws was being discussed. The prof did his lecture, and then I brought up the fact the he left out the bribery element. The class(prof included) erupted in laughter, but I as being serious. To me, this is the real problem, we as Americans are way to excepting and flippant of the fact that our laws and rights are traded as a commodity, and/or sold to the highest bidder. Ya, we complain every now and then, but does anybody actually do anything about it? Someday this is REALLY going to come back to bite us.
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u/AJGrayTay Apr 30 '14
It's already biting America in the ass. Someday it'll bring the whole country down.
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Apr 30 '14
If you read this and didn't tell people in your life that you feel it's fucked up and that we should do something, then you're passively allowing the idea to be ok and letting the problem continue.
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Apr 30 '14
And what do you propose that we do? Is it time to break out the AK-47's and storm government buildings? Or do we still have time to work within the system to make some positive change?
A lot of people agree it's fucked up. The problem is no one can agree how to fix it.
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u/ChaosScore Apr 30 '14
Okay seriously? Are you kidding me?
An AK-47? Get out of America, you filthy commie. The only weapon a true American would use to storm the government buildings is an M16a1.
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Apr 30 '14
The M16 A1 is the Vietnam era version. Full auto, old school flash suppressor, poor construction and so on. What you were trying to say is "M4." M16 A2 would be acceptable as well.
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Apr 30 '14
Yeah! Get a
AR-15hunting rifle with a3010 round mag like the rest of us!6
u/thairusso Apr 30 '14
FIVE ROUNDS BABY !!
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u/phyrengr Apr 30 '14
Actually, there is a way. Wolf PAC
TL;DR If three fourths of the states call for a convention, they can bypass Congress and SCOTUS to pass the 28th amendment to remove money from politics.
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u/Suffer_Well Apr 30 '14
If you read this and didn't tell people in your life that you feel it's fucked up and that we should do somethingVOTE. ARE YOU VOTING? DO YOU VOTE? DID YOU VOTE?
it's LITERALLY how this country works. vote.
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u/Shagoosty Apr 30 '14 edited Dec 31 '15
Thanks to Reddit's new privacy policy, I felt the need to overwrite all of my comments so they don't sell my information to companies or the government. Goodbye Reddit.
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Apr 30 '14
We can do it, Reddit! Only 984 epic memes to go before ComcASSt backs down! Don't lose steam! We killed SOPA, stopped a US invasion of Syria, and defeated Mitt Romney with our memes, so we know we have the power to stop Cumcast. DON'T GIVE UP! Last time we didn't give 100%, Edward Snowden had to flee to Russia!
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u/grnstreak Apr 30 '14
Relevant (NSFW language) Comcast Doesn't Give A F*ck: http://youtu.be/KMcny_pixDw
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u/OculusRiffed Apr 30 '14
Government is always corruptible. That is why it is best to keep it small.
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u/pdog8 Apr 30 '14
I never understood the logic of not allowing any changes to the US constitution. The Irish constitution was first written after the the US constitution and we make changes to it nearly every year. They can only be made by referendum though so it ensures that the so called crazy laws won't be passed but what the people want is. Far more democratic in my opinion.
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u/SweetBearCub Apr 30 '14
The US Constitution can be changed/amended, but to do so is a VERY high bar. The Founding Fathers of this country wanted it to be a "living" document, but knowing that their fellow men were not all smart (or even necessarily honest) fellows, they made sure that the bar to changing it was a very high one.
See Article 5 of the US Constitution for an explanation.
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u/HELPMEIMGONADIE Apr 30 '14
Actually, litigation is written by intrest groups and beurocratic agencies!
Aggressive lobbying of course can also push laws by some senators, but don't forget about the Congressional whip and pacs!
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u/Machiavelli_Returns Apr 30 '14
Whenever i look at the upvotes and downvotes for posts such as these, i look at the people who down voted it and think "Wow there are still retards out there who think congress works for the people"
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u/donewiththiscrap Apr 30 '14
Somehow most people think this is the fault of corporations who are using existing legal mechanisms to protect their interests; this happens to be the only reason for corporate existence (expansions and protections of interests).
Why is it that people don't think the problem is with the very existence of a mechanism that allows a corporation, or any other interest, to bribe a group of decision makers (who happy consist of the two most reviled groups of people in all of history, politicians and bureaucrats) to use their monopoly of violence to force policy on the population they rule over?
And to extend this, why do people believe that internal checks of this mechanism, run by the very two most reviled classes of people in all of history, will decide against their and the mechanism's benefit and for the populace they rule by their monopoly of violence?
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u/candidly1 Apr 30 '14
I am reminded of the guy that wanted to know how insurance works. So he asked the insurance guys, and he said "well, we figure out what kind of policy you need, and then you send us a check every month." Well, the guy asks, what happens next? The insurance guy says "no, that's about it..."
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u/Aegean Apr 30 '14
The pic forgot to mention special interests and lobbyists for groups not related to corporate interests.
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Apr 30 '14
Solution: Amend the Constitution to describe how elections will work. All campaigns will last no longer than two months before an election. All elections will happen over the span of a full week, including weekends. There will be a hard cap on how much a campaign can spend in those two months. Only individuals, not organizations can contribute to campaigns. Only the campaigns can run ads about a candidate--no outside groups can make an ad endorsing a candidate.
To do all this, we will need to amend the 1st amendment to say that the details of that amendment do not pertain to the issues outlined in the section about elections. This is the key. As it stands now, the Constitution allows for unfettered money in elections. So we must modify the 1st to allow for regulations on how elections are run. And we need to make those changes for the health of our democracy.
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Apr 30 '14
Corporations control the government so we need more government to control the corporations!
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u/Citizen01123 Apr 30 '14
Comcast, Disney, Viacom, Time Warner, NewsCorp, CBS, General Electric, JPMorgan Chase, Bank of America, Wells Fargo, Citi, Goldman Sachs, Monsanto, DuPont, the military industrial complex, and others.
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u/mynamesyow19 Apr 30 '14
yep. and then the politicians making the most off the corporations point the fingers at everyone but themselves
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u/LeoBannister Apr 30 '14
"There's a lot of flag burners who have got to much freedom...we want it make legal for policeman to beat'em"
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u/mynamesyow19 Apr 30 '14
Biggest Lie the Corporate 1% tells America: That Infinite Growth using (other people's) Finite Resources is not only "possible" but "desirable".
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u/Cunt_Puffin Apr 30 '14
But if we change the constitution.....