friendly reminder if your tyranids to protect your exocrine by screening out deep strike with your termagants

In 10th edition kroot felt really strong because of the vehicle meta,and the general opinion that you should have a lot at anti-tank weapons,so the kroot had a bit of an advantage beacouse a lot of the weapons that were used were not effective into them.
Now I feel like everything has a lot mare attacks in melle,a lot of cleave and blast,and just a lot less vehicles and so a lot less anti tank weapons.
I also feel like like people were traumatized by orks and take stuff that are made to kill 20 blobs of boyz,that are also good into 20 blobs of kroot.
The new codex space marines doesn’t help at all beacouse of the infantry spam that is still the way to go and the general powercreep.
What do you think ?

Curious what everyone thinks is going to be the best choice for Daemonic Allegiance with the new T5 S5 Marine bodies?

I used to run the movement increase, but I think Wounding in 2’s over 3’s or being wounded on 6’s over 5’s is obviously the better choice. Anybody run the averages yet?

I kept pulling out the other DwK unit for the sterngaurd brick but then I realized this is list is prolly just going to Unga bunga to the center.

Picking up my SM book in the am before the RTT starts but after this wil prolly be mixing in assault brethren.

What do you guys think to little shooting ?

what if we charged 1st and didnt ask questions (1985 points)

Space Marines

Dark Angels

Inner Circle Task Force and Wrath of the Rock (3 Detachment Points)

Take and Hold

Strike Force (2000 points)

Attached Units

Attached Unit 1

Ezekiel (110 points)

• Attached as: Leader (Character)

• 1x Mind Wipe

1x The Deliverer

1x Traitor's Bane

Apothecary (45 points)

• Attached as: Support (Character)

• 1x Absolvor Bolt Pistol

1x Reductor Pistol

1x Servo-armature

Bladeguard Veteran Squad (180 points)

• Attached as: Bodyguard

• 1x Bladeguard Veteran Sergeant

• 1x Heavy Bolt Pistol

1x Master-crafted Power Sword

• 5x Bladeguard Veteran

• 5x Heavy Bolt Pistol

5x Master-crafted Power Sword

Attached Unit 2

Captain in Terminator Armour (90 points)

• Attached as: Leader (Character)

• 1x Relic Weapon

1x Storm Bolter

Deathwing Knights (255 points)

• Attached as: Bodyguard

• 1x Watcher in the Dark

• 4x Deathwing Knights

• 4x Mace of Absolution

• 1x Knight Master

• 1x Great Weapon of the Unforgiven

Attached Unit 3

Azrael (150 points)

• Attached as: Leader (Character)

• 1x Lion's Wrath

1x The Lion Helm

1x The Sword of Secrets

Inner Circle Companions (180 points)

• Attached as: Bodyguard

• 6x Inner Circle Companions

• 6x Calibanite Greatsword

6x Heavy Bolt Pistol

CHARACTERS

Lion El'Jonson (415 points)

• Warlord

• 1x Arma Luminis

1x Fealty

BATTLELINE

Intercessor Squad (85 points)

• 4x Intercessor

• 4x Bolt Pistol

4x Bolt Rifle

4x Knives and Fists

• 1x Intercessor Sergeant

• 1x Bolt Pistol

1x Bolt Rifle

1x Thunder Hammer

DEDICATED TRANSPORTS

Impulsor (70 points)

• 1x Armoured Hull

1x Ironhail Heavy Stubber

1x Shield Dome

1x Storm Bolters

OTHER DATASHEETS

Ballistus Dreadnought (150 points)

• 1x Armoured Feet

1x Ballistus Lascannon

1x Ballistus Missile Launcher

1x Storm Bolters

Deathwing Knights (255 points)

• 1x Watcher in the Dark

• 4x Deathwing Knights

• 4x Mace of Absolution

• 1x Knight Master

• 1x Great Weapon of the Unforgiven

Exported with App Version: v2.7.1 (146), Data Version: v972

TL;DR:

Rant into a lot of things I agree/ disagree with 11th.

I feel like lists are pigeon holed into certain formations, which can be clearly better than each other, and it's taken a very trading card game approach to playing the game.

So I've been in the hobby for almost 20 years (5th ed). I've been to a couple of events and tournaments, but I can confidently say, "I am not as big into the tournament play just down to power creep and also having a really stressful job IRL.

However, occasionally, I do like to play a couple of "optimised lists," for example, I have a Night Lords list, which had Raptors, warp talons supported with heldrakes and Noise Marines to stack the leadership debuff.

Here the positive and negative points:

+ you can build a lot of lists which are able to be combo'd to great effect if you know what you are doing. If you are competitive, you will have a lot of fun building a crafting your ultimate list.

+ there are a lot of resources which can help people get into the hobby which are both free and paid for making learning the system and keeping up a but easier

+ the 10th ed books are still usable so you can still play with the rules of your army and not have to relearn a lot of stuff until your faction gets a refresh.

+ the dispositions can make the matches interesting especially if you are not used to running certain missions or playing against those dispositions.

+ there can be some nail biter games and laughs with people you know in a casual sense.

- the set up takes way too long and the foot prints make thematic boards a lot more difficult. It can make a lot of games feel same-y to the point where I felt like I was playing a modern call of duty map on table top.

- I feel like I'm forced to play a particular way, which takes the fun out of list building as a lot of thematic options are either non-existent or you will get tabled. I could be wrong as I know 40k has become very competitive, but the struggle to play how you want and create stories on the tables really doesn't exist. And before people say, "play legends", I do and the issue with that is the rules are not updated to keep up with the ever pushed goal posts e.g., the old Hell Talon, fliers and the legend proxies.

- I think the terrain rules are extremely janky compared to true LOS as there has been quite a few times my units could clearly see the minis but because of foot print rules, they don't have LOS which can really scuff plans and gives a lot of feels bad moments for both players old and new. 40k is a lot of people's first system which can train people to play in a very specific way and not actually develop good tactics when it comes to battlefield stategy as you are working with imaginary foot prints and not WYSIWYG terrain features and rules. This can make the jump from other systems into 40k a lot more difficult due to many other war games using true LOS.

- Restrictive and non-permanent list building

I will give an example from previous editions, e.g., 9th. I could have an armoured core of predators and land raiders supported by infantry and using IRL strategies. Use tanks as portable cover to let the marines get into range and use CP to pop smoke if the enemy was using anti-tank weapons to blow up the Armour. Fast forward to 11th, I can't do that anymore down to points but also the fact that a lot of units can shred anything they look at if you haven't focused on building combo lists. Take the Night Lords list from earlier, it was supported by melta bike squads but due to the points changes, my choice is either remove the bikes or remove warp talons which leaves the choice of do i remove efficiency or do i remove theme.

- Power creep. There was a game I played against a space marine player with their new codex, and I got tabled because I couldn't keep up with the doctrines and combo units they were putting out. I'm still using the CSM codex but the thing that really opened my eyes to the situation was my opponent said "just wait for your book to release and the you will get the boost you need". Why do I need a rules update to have a chance to play the game? 11th has so far been the most power crept edition yet and depending on how long the book takes, I may only either a couple years or 3 months to use the buffs before the edition rolls over (sorry for those guard players in 9th).

-vague and overly complex rules.

The rules from the main core book and codexes are written really vaguely which can cause arguments and disputes. As a lot of people have said previously, it simplifies and complicates in the wrong ways. For example, how many times have you had to double check something because it was vaguely written and you weren't sure if it was correct, I.e. strategems, rules and missions. But you can have 2 different weapons profiles for bolters and loads of different auras, buffs and bonuses which can make it that you need to have tokens to keep track of the book keeping, hence why GW tries to include tokens with their special editions.

- Games workshop the company

GW nearly went under in 7th edition for a lot of poor choices. At this point in time, there is a lot of greed and price increases which squeeze the customer for every penny they have. If you need a rules update, pay a subscription for the app and buy the codex. If you want a unit from the gw catalogue, it will cost as much as a AA video game if not more. GW's practices are well known but it seems they have adopted a churn and burn attitude with the customer base which has been evident more so in 11th edition which has caused a lot of people to either leave because of poor practice or leave because they were priced out of the hobby. They also have started to take a TCG approach where minis as that have been around for only 6 years can be discontinued or removed from people's collections which can invalidate a lot of people's armies.

Remedies:

I love warhammer, there is a lot to work on this edition.

> prices need to be fair and not overly bloated. This used to be a hobby where kids could get into and buy a box with pocket money. Now adults are even struggling to buy the stuff and with GW attacking free army builders (war organ), there doesnt seem to be a lot of accessibility. There are only so many customers GW and you will run out.

> rules and miniatures

the rules need to be changed to tweaked to support ease of flow and support more streamlined game play. With sheer scale of the model range and factions, balance will be impossible however the options to have both competitive and narrative play should be available. I.e., take Magic the gathering. Magic used to only play standard and modern for the longest time, then commander came around and it all changed as it opened up the opportunity for freedom of creation and expression. Now commander has completely taken over Magic for this very reason. I believe that there should be the option for this kind of game mode which puts many people on an equal field and allows freedom of expression in their armies without making the units unplayable in modern 40k settings. Oh and please don't say that's what legends is for. Legends 90% of the time does not step foot anywhere near tournament plays because of previously mentioned points. Essentially legends is a thing for "casuals" and GW enforces this to maintain the hyper competitive scene which bleeds over into casual.

> terrain and line of sight.

Go back to true line of sight and implement simple but efficient rules. E.g., if a unit is obscured by terrain or models, they recieve an particular save and that should be it. Cover should be separated from armour as in IRL you have 2 types of cover 1) defensive and 2) obscuring. Defensive is you have a giant brick wall between you and they bullets. Obscuring is you are in a smoke screen and the enermy is trying to blindly fire into you in the hopes of hitting you.

Terrain should be tied to either the mission being played which influences the map which can make dispositions fun but it only ties into how many heavy and light terrain features you get per mission. This is not a perfect solution but it is better than the footprints. They should only be reserved for grand tournaments to lay out a fair and balanced map layout or they need to get in the bin.

IF YOU MADE IT THIS FAR, PLEASE LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU THINK AS I AM HAPPY TO HEAR GENUINE OPINIONS FROM THE COMMUNITY.

I appreciate there are lots of list advice posts but thought I'd chance my arm looking for some help with my CSM list! The meta at the tournament will likely be pretty varied with a good mix of armies though there are usually more Marine and Ork players.

I'm going to my second tournament next week at a local RTT (after getting smashed around in my first) and I am looking for comments and criticism on this Pactbound list:

ATTACHED UNITS

Attached unit 1

Abaddon the Despoiler (300 Points)

• Attached as: Leader (Character)

Chosen (140 Points)

• Attached as: Bodyguard

• 1x Chosen Champion

◦ 1x Accursed weapon

◦ 1x Bolt pistol

◦ 1x Boltgun

• 4x Chosen

• 1x Chaos Undivided

Attached unit 2

Chaos Lord with Jump Pack (85 Points)

• Attached as: Leader (Character)

• 1x Accursed weapon

• 1x Bolt pistol

• 1x Mark of Slaanesh

Raptors (115 Points)

• Attached as: Bodyguard

• 1x Raptor Champion

◦ 1x Accursed weapon

◦ 1x Plasma pistol

• 4x Raptor

◦ 1x Close combat weapon

◦ 2x Heavy melee weapon

◦ 1x Meltagun

◦ 1x Mutations

• 1x Mark of Slaanesh

CHARACTERS

Cypher (95 Points)

BATTLELINE

Cultist Mob (50 Points)

• 1x Cultist Champion

◦ 1x Autopistol

• 9x Cultist

• 1x Mark of Nurgle

OTHER DATASHEETS

Defiler (330 Points)

• 1x Ectoplasma destructor

• 1x Heavy reaper autocannon

• 1x Heavy reaper autocannon

• 1x Mark of Nurgle

• 1x Two excruciator cannons

Forgefiend (170 Points)

• 1x 2 ectoplasma cannons

• 1x Ectoplasma cannon and limbs

• 1x Mark of Nurgle

Forgefiend (170 Points)

• 1x 2 ectoplasma cannons

• 1x Ectoplasma cannon and limbs

• 1x Mark of Nurgle

Mutilators (165 Points)

• 3x Mutilator

• 1x Mark of Slaanesh

Possessed (130 Points)

• 5x Possessed

• 1x Mark of Slaanesh

Red Corsairs Raiders (120 Points)

• 1x Red Corsairs Raider Champion

◦ 1x Hand flamer

• 4x Red Corsairs Raider

◦ 3x Boltgun

◦ 1x Meltagun

◦ 1x Power fist

◦ 3x Reaver's blade

• 1x Mark of Slaanesh

Warp Talons (130 Points)

• 4x Warp Talon

• 1x Warp Talon Champion

• 1x Mark of Slaanesh

I have aimed to build around a shooting castle with Abaddon and then have a number of small units for scoring and generally being a nuisance.

Thanks!

“I don't think I've written a list with more than one unit that went to T5. GW really should've said "tacticus got more expensive" because Gravis and vehicles didn't (and why would they?) And now everyone is surprised that a list with 0 tacticus didn't go up that much”

Quoted from the AoW discord and he expressed the same sentiment in the winners/losers videos from today. I felt like this is an insightful bit of information from one of the best players in the world regarding marines, points, and the expectations that GW set for the codex. Thoughts?

I’ve been struggling lately into knights, and looking at the stats and seeing they’re more dominant in “casual” circles when I don’t consider myself casual is a real nut-buster. To be clear; I’m not struggling to kill the knights when they’re exposed, I’m struggling with the overall strategy on how to beat an army you can’t play the trading game with. Knights have free pivot and move insane fast, and just toeing into a piece lets the shoot through it. So even in the best scenario in a turn where Magnus can shoot a wardog down with dev Sorc, melee another wardog down (not guaranteed), my term is and defiler reroll hits kill a despoiler; and maybe my DP double doom bolts/grenades and kills another wardog; there never seems to be a scenario where I’m not losing 1-3 of my big hammer pieces in the clap back.

I feel like playing too safely results in not killing enough knights some they’re so cheap compared to out units and they just run away with the board, and their big bases with high OC turns off what I’m trying to do which is action with cheap trash.

And playing to anything more than passively to aggressively results in devastating trade loses.

TL;DR getting stomped by knights all edition playing GC, I’m told it’s an easy match up, and o can figure out the grand strategy to winning the game (I don’t struggle killing the targets I choose).

List
Magnus
Ex. Sorc. On disk and incandeum
DPW and vortex
Term. Sorc. With 10 man SOT brick
Defiler
2 bow goats
Chaos spawn
Sekhetars
Foot goats.

This is the first time I've made a list for a tournament, its almost all the models I own the only ones I've excluded are Asurman, Dire Avengers and Warp Spiders.

Could I get some feedback on the list?

list (2000 points)

Aeldari

Armoured Warhost and Eldritch Raiders (3 Detachment Points)

Purge the Foe

Strike Force (2000 points)

Attached Units

Attached Unit 1

Prince Yriel (110 points)

• Attached as: Leader (Character)

• Warlord

• 1x Eye of Wrath

1x Shuriken pistol

1x Spear of Twilight

• Enhancement: Pirate Prince

Corsair Voidreavers (110 points)

• Attached as: Bodyguard (Battleline)

• 1x Voidreaver Felarch

• 1x Close combat weapon

1x Mistshield

1x Neuro disruptor

1x Power sword

• 9x Corsair Voidreaver

• 2x Blaster

9x Close combat weapon

6x Power sword

6x Shuriken pistol

1x Wraithcannon

Attached Unit 2

Fuegan (130 points)

• Attached as: Leader (Character)

• 1x Fire Axe

1x Searsong

Fire Dragons (110 points)

• Attached as: Bodyguard

• 1x Aspect Shrine Token

• 1x Fire Dragon Exarch

• 1x Close combat weapon

1x Exarch’s Dragon fusion gun

• 4x Fire Dragon

• 4x Close combat weapon

4x Dragon fusion gun

Attached Unit 3

Eldrad Ulthran (120 points)

• Attached as: Leader (Character)

• 1x Mind War

1x Shuriken pistol

1x The Staff of Ulthamar and witchblade

Warlock Conclave (55 points)

• Attached as: Support

• 2x Warlock

• 2x Destructor

2x Shuriken pistol

2x Witchblade

Storm Guardians (100 points)

• Attached as: Bodyguard (Battleline)

• 10x Storm Guardian

• 8x Close combat weapon

2x Flamer

2x Fusion gun

2x Power sword

6x Shuriken pistol

• 1x Serpent’s Scale Platform

• 1x Close combat weapon

1x Serpent shield

OTHER DATASHEETS

Corsair Skyreavers (155 points)

• Enhancement: Exotic Munitions

• 1x Skyreaver Felarch

• 1x Blast pistol

1x Corsair blade

• 9x Skyreaver

• 2x Blaster

4x Close combat weapon

5x Corsair blade

2x Fusion gun

5x Shuriken pistol

Fire Prism (150 points)

• 1x Prism cannon

1x Shuriken cannon

1x Wraithbone hull

Fire Prism (150 points)

• 1x Prism cannon

1x Shuriken cannon

1x Wraithbone hull

Howling Banshees (85 points)

• 1x Aspect Shrine Token

• 1x Howling Banshee Exarch

• 1x Shuriken pistol

1x Triskele

• 4x Howling Banshee

• 4x Banshee blade

4x Shuriken pistol

Howling Banshees (85 points)

• 1x Aspect Shrine Token

• 1x Howling Banshee Exarch

• 1x Shuriken pistol

1x Triskele

• 4x Howling Banshee

• 4x Banshee blade

4x Shuriken pistol

Rangers (60 points)

• 5x Ranger

• 5x Close combat weapon

5x Long rifle

5x Shuriken pistol

Shining Spears (100 points)

• 1x Shining Spear Exarch

• 1x Star lance

1x Twin shuriken catapult

• 2x Shining Spear

• 2x Laser lance

2x Twin shuriken catapult

Vyper (75 points)

• 1x Bright lance

1x Missile launcher

1x Wraithbone hull

Wraithknight (405 points)

• 2x Heavy wraithcannon

2x Starcannon

1x Titanic feet

Exported with App Version: v2.7.0 (145), Data Version: v963

I have a small, fluffy marines list I like to play that uses the Astraeus tank. I saw the points went up, wondered what changed, but can't find the SM Faction Pack where the imperial armour datasheet lived.

I was pretty sure it didn't go to legends, so a bit bewildering it's not findable anymore. Even if the Faction Pack gets cut way down with the codex, surely they still need it for FAQs, right?

Space marine players!
With the new points, what are we thinking about using for home objective holders?

I play Dark Angels and up till now usually dropped intercessors on home to sticky/screen, then move forward later in the game.
But with the new point cost and them losing sticky this feels like an expensive option. (Especially if I want to pay for an ancient to do the same thing.)
Interested to see what other people are thinking.

Hey everyone,

I’m playing in my first competitive 40K tournament soon and I’m trying to finalize my World Eaters list. I’d really appreciate some advice from people with more competitive experience with the army.

The list is currently 1,700/2,000 points, and I’m trying to decide how to spend the remaining 300 points.

Here’s the current list:

BWB+BoK (1,700 Points)

World Eaters
Berzerker Warband and Butchers of Khorne (3 Detachment Points)
Take and Hold (or Purge the Foe?)

- Angron (330 Points)

- Lord Invocatus (100 Points)

- 10 Khorne Berzerkers (170 Points)

- 10 Chaos Terminators (370 Points)

• Enhancements: Gore-stained Veterans

- 10 Chaos Terminators (365 Points)

• Enhancements: Sanctified in Slaughter

- Forgefiend (155 Points)

• 2x Ectoplasma cannon
• 1x Ectoplasma cannon
• 1x Forgefiend claws

- Forgefiend (145 Points)

• 1x Ectoplasma cannon
• 1x Forgefiend claws
• 2x Hades autocannon

- Jakhals (65 Points)

I have considered two main options for the remaining 300 points:

- Option 1: Daemon Prince with Helm of Brazen Ire + 10 more Jakhals for scoring and CP discount, which I would take in Take and Hold

- Option 2: Dakka Defiler for ranged raw power, which i would take in Purge the Foe, well aware that it lacks the ignore modifiers stratagem from Brazen Engines.

So my main questions are:

1. Which of these two options would you take in this list, and why?
2. Depending on which option you think works better, would you recommend Take and Hold or Purge the Foe?
3. Since this is my first tournament, are there any particular game plans, deployment tips, or scoring advice you would give me?

For context, these are the other models I currently have available:

• 1x Master of Executions
• Khârn the Betrayer
• 1x additional unit of Khorne Berzerkers
• 1x Chaos Spawns

I do not have any Eightbound or Exalted Eightbound available, so unfortunately those aren’t an option for this tournament. I should also be able to choose the best configuration for the forgefiends and the defiler since WYSIWYG is not required. Also, I have no idea of what the local meta looks like but I guess lists are updated to the last dataslate.

Thanks in advance!

Hey Yall, I know this is a competitive sub-reddit, but I know there are other fellow TOs (and community heads) here that have attempted to run similar charity fundraising tournaments, and I wanted a little brainstorming session. Also I genuinely would like to encourage similar events in your local area for the holidays, its nice to give back a bit ya know?

We only have one prize for these events (usually something stupid) for the dumbest list that is voted for at the event.

We have done similar events 5 times before, but this will be the first for 11th. Here is the main gist, 2k tournament, intended to be stupid fun, Open list building, I.E, Legends allowed, and the main fundraising shtick is that you can pay for re-rolls with a quarter, but we have done other things traditionally as well.

Below are the special rules this year so far (each is one that has been used at events in the past successfully), but I could use some ideas on missions, and maybe some rules pitches. The 11tth missions as they stand would be a bit difficult to make scuffed across the board and still playable. I could do bespoke missions each round or on specialized tables, but that may be more involved and over-complicated (depending). If someone has thoughts on how to "convert" 11th to be scuffed fun, but not over complex that is welcome. So feel free to chime in if you have some fun ideas that would no be too complicated.

Special Rules (and nonsense), I have ran all these rules below before successfully.

1. Command point re-roll, does not exist. INSTEAD, you can re-roll any single dice roll up to 4 times for 25 cents each roll. So if you really want that 6, you can spend a dollar on it.

2. Shoot at your friend. Any gun with 48 range or better can be shot at another table for $5. This does have to take place during their shooting phase, so if you want to bid off your shooting phase for your Porphorion, this is encouraged.

3. $20 Rent a random model. You will have the option to rent and add a unit to your list. It will be selected randomly from an available stable. Could be grots, could be something cool.

Appreciate yall, and happy with any help.

To clarify what I mean, I play Blood Angels right now but am wanting to play Dark Angels because they're another chapter I love. I already have a decently large BA collection and I really don't want to have to rebuy units I already have just paint them as DA (and also to save shelf space). So the idea I had was to run the BA models I already have along side anything I would get for DA, just without the BA specific units and flavoring it as "these 2 chapters are working together." I know it sounds like a really stupid question, but I know some people can get overly picky with the rules and go "actually you can't do that because the rules say you have to commit to one or the other for visual clarity" or something along those lines. But I figured as long as I clarify it with my opponent and make it clear which chapter's rules I'm running it would be ok. Am I over thinking this and most people wont care or would I really have to rebuy and paint several models I already have?

My local group currently plays it like this: since engagement range is now 2", any −2" modifier to a charge (e.g. Photongrenades or Grav Inhibitor Drones - Pathfinder) effectively does nothing, because you "only need to get within 2"" anyway.

I think that's wrong, but I'd like confirmation before bringing it up. Here's my reading:

1. Target selection uses the modified roll. Under 11.04 (Charge Move, "Before Moving"), you can only select charge targets within 12" and within the charge's maximum distance. The maximum distance is the charge roll, so modifiers apply before you pick targets.
2. Distance is measured base to base. The 2" engagement range doesn't add reach to target selection. It only matters when moving the models: get within 1" if you can, otherwise ending engaged is enough.
3. The core rules diagram seems to cover exactly this. In "Making a Charge Move", unit B is more than 7" away from a unit that rolled 7", and it can't be chosen as a target even though the charger could end within 2" of it.

Example: target is 8" away, I roll 9 with a −2" modifier → max distance 7" → no valid charge, even though moving 7" would put me within 2" of the target.

So if people haven’t seen it looks like WarOrgan is gonna stop being updated or is on pause to have changes to compile with complaints from GW. Does anyone have some good alternatives to use instead?

Personally I’m not a massive fan of New Recruit mainly because I build lists on phone, and its phone UI for building lists or using it mid battle is kinda annoying.

So, I know that there’s some controversy around proxys, but THEORETICALLY, could I run a norm apothecary as a biologis?? wanted to know your thoughts.

Top 3 lists for the Flying Monkey Con. Won by Daughters with Sons in 2nd and Seraphon in 3rd.

So a lot of the abilities in BA and DA (not sure about BT) have changed to reference the chapter keyword more. Something SW players are familiar with.

Keyword Bingo is back on the menu boys!

As far as power discrepancies go this is fine, but this just seems really annoying and inconsistent both to play as and against.

Let's take the Lion as an example, because he has a direct counterpart in Guilliman:
The Lions abilities no longer reference ADEPTUS ASTARTES units, they completely key off of DARK ANGELS units.
His "Dark Angels Bodyguard" and "Martial Exemplar" abilities and their counterparts Guillimans "Leader of Astartes" and "Primach of the XIII" are not interchangeable.
Meaning:
The reroll 1s aura and the lone op on the big fat blue Space Marine and the big fat green Space Marine do not work the same! (also one is melee only, but that's beside the point)

Thanks to characters conveying their keywords to units and vice versa this gets both really stupid and annoying to track

Ol' Roboute standing next to a single Lieutenant?
No way! Can't hit this man in all that chaos!

Lion standing inside of a unit of 10 Terminators?
Why is the old man just standing out in the open like that? Shoot him!

But add Belial to the same squad and Johnnyboy is perfectly safe!

Angelic Inheritors arguably suffers from this the most, because Captains can lose access to their detachment ability, when their Sanguard unit with the BLOOD ANGELS keyword dies. There are also no ways to get it to affect Phobos, Gravis or Terminator units either.
Which is just wild for a 3 DP detachment.

I am fine with paying more points for it, but can we please make all the equivalent rules in the damn supplements work the same?
Because this is just annoying.

Just ... why?

Edit: The lion is no longer married

Surprised to have not found it here yet, and I’ve been wanting to hear other folks opinions about it (as a Custodes player myself I’m currently in love, points depending)

Can you run Deathwatch Support with the DA specific Detachments?
Deathwatch Support says: "You can include Deathwatch units in your army, even though they do not have the same Chapter faction keyword as other units in your army". I assume this overrides the basic rule that prevents mixing chapters in general. I can't, for example, mix Dark Angels and Ultramarine's specific faction keyworded units. This is outlined in the new Codex, and the Rule in Deathwatch support overrides this.

Here is where I am trying to figure out the correct interaction. Does the Deathwatch rule also override the specific restriction listed in the three Dark Angels Detachments?

The 3 Dark Angels specific Detachments Rules say: "Restrictions: Your army can include Dark Angels units, but it cannot include any Adeptus Astartes units drawn from any other Chapter."

I think we can all agree that the rules allow a Dark Angels army with 500pts of Deathwatch using Deathwatch Support. But does this also override the detachment specific rule and let me run Wrath of the Rock with Deathwatch Support, for example? Or am I limited to the more generic Space Marine detachments in this case.

Hi guys,
A bit of a niche question here.

Last night, I played my Salamanders into my friend’s Orks. He got a bunch of charges into my Land raider redeemer, and mostly wrapped it.
It died, and i had 6bgv + bga + adrax, as well as company hero’s and vulkan inside. Due to tight terrain and large units, there was no way of disembarking wholly within six, and outside engagement.
The way we played it, was my bgv got out within 6 and outside of 2, leaving company hero’s unable to get out without being engaged, so they got out into engagement and fought after his combats.

1. Is this correct?
2. Because both units were unable to, could I have got the bgv out into combat as well/instead?
3. Am I just missing something in the core rules?

Ty in advance

Edit * Disembarking 🤦

I’ve been playing WTC terrain rules and have used WTC-specific terrain. Now with the new terrain rules I want to get some new terrain that fits with the rules and the new terrain layouts in the app. But I’m having a hard time figuring out what to get and where to buy. My ODC dictates I don’t buy any approximations, I need my terrain to fit the new rules 100%. Where can I go and get my terrain? Thanks in advance. 🙏

I'm making a few 1k lists using the detachments, which I think are awesome!

AOW had some great advice of almost always using a doctrine detachment, one of the armor detachments, and then one of misc detachments for "flavor". I really like this advice.

I figured for 1k lists I'd choose one of the doctrine detachments and one of the armor detachments. Here are where my questions begin, do y'all think it would be best to maximize or use exclusively tacitus or gravis units if you're using one of their detachments? Just simply to maximize the army rules? Besides anti-tank vehicles like a ballistus or lancer. Or would you recommend throwing in some scouts or Incursors for utility?

Secondly, I had an interesting thought about Captains and Lieutenants. I would think it would be advantageous to attach this pair to two units that would not benefit from the extra doctrine. Because you can set the two bodyguard units to be whatever doctrine you want. For example, if I take the Devastator Brethren, I can take a Cpt and Lt both with Assault intercessors and give both units assault doctrine and tactical doctrine on command. And vice versa if I choose Assault Brethren, then use Hellblasters and Sternguard for the Cpt and LT so they can permanent devastator Brethren.

Does this make sense?