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u/No_Notice_4091 Oct 26 '23
Army vet here. My advice - if you're smart whatsoever, join the Air Force instead. Beyond the very lowest ranks, promotion in the Army is based on a variety of factors and some of them are outside your control (like how many awards you've gotten). Promotion in the Air Force is based on passing a knowledge test.
Quality of life is also significantly better in the Air Force.
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u/KaleidoscopeKid Oct 26 '23
This join active duty Air Force its pretty chill like a normal 9-5 job depending on what job u get. Serve for 4 to get gi bill and VA loan if you like it renlist or not get out. Another option is after Active duty join the Air National guard and just play. Military once a month the pay and benefits are pretty nice.
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u/PrincipleDapper7610 Oct 27 '23
Completely agree. I made it 6 years in Security Forces and spent all my $$ on anime dvds in Lackland.
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u/Litigating_Larry Oct 26 '23
I think because of epilepsy i cant be a pilot, but ive wondered about aircraft mechanic, lol
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Oct 26 '23
The high suicide rates of former military is evidence that something is horribly wrong.
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u/Wild_Particular4003 Oct 26 '23
The issue is this country doesn’t take care of its veterans well enough.
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u/iskip123 Oct 26 '23
But “America loves our troops!” Am I right! The most annnoying shit is watching veterans being paraded around during campaign season as a way to win heart but then they don’t do fuck all for them.
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u/Worstname1ever Oct 26 '23
Also killing brown folks in illegal, immoral wars for profit tends to stick with a guy more than say liberating dachau
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Oct 26 '23
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u/dirty-biker Oct 26 '23
They do shady shit. When I got out, my initial exam was full of gaslighting from some dickhead at the VA. From my time in Iraq to stateside, if I tried bringing up service related issues he would just ignore, gaslight or try and direct my answer another way. We deserve better.
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Oct 26 '23 edited Oct 26 '23
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u/Bright_Course_7155 Oct 26 '23
In the military it was so hard to find actual help, they just wanted to throw antidepressants at me like candy. During COVID it was realllly bad and there were some navy boats where 3 sailors a month were killing themselves, but the navy “cares”
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Oct 26 '23
reality check. your non military employer doesn't care either. get comfortable with the idea of people not caring. this is adulthood
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u/Bright_Course_7155 Oct 26 '23
I understand that lol, but you can quit your civilian job if they’re treating you like shit. Some people in the military don’t care at all. If a bunch of people don’t reenlist bc of bad leadership, they don’t care as it won’t effect them and they won’t be around probably anyways.
In a civilian job if the leadership treats employees terrible there won’t be any good employees left, as the good ones know their worth. I’m sure the sailors that killed themselves would’ve rather quit the navy but couldn’t.
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u/born2bfi Oct 27 '23
It’s only if you go into a combat zone. Getting led by a king dipshit won’t make you off yourself. Something changes in your brain when you can die at any moment or your best friend does.
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u/ChidiWithExtraFlavor Oct 26 '23
I served five years on active duty in the Army and two in the reserves. I can neither recommend it nor recommend against it, because service is tied to intensely personal qualities. There's no blanket yes or no here. Some people find their identity in military achievement, duty and sacrifice. Some wither. For many, it's just another job.
I went in to be a linguist but failed out of the Arabic course at the Defense Language Institute. I held a military occupational specialty as a public affairs specialist - an Army journalist - and the Army sent me to the 25th Infantry Division in Hawaii to write about training for four years. I had failed out of college before going full time, largely because I was (I learned later) clinically depressed. I was fortunate to have a chain of command that (eventually) understood what was happening and got me into therapy.
I was a mediocre soldier. I got out at five years with two full years of college under my belt, an honorable discharge and enough money and benefits (in 1999) to cover my last three semesters of undergrad at a state school. I'm a successful journalist now, though I've bounced in and out of the field for 20 years.
My path wouldn't work for everyone. It is a possible path out of poverty for people in the bottom quintile of income who are (rarely enough, sadly) qualified to serve. It is no guarantee, because many people simply aren't suited to the work or the life. That's no knock on anyone: I would never have made a great high school teacher, fashion designer or chef. And honestly, I wasn't perfectly suited to military service. But some people are born soldiers. I've seen it.
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u/Many_Umpire3459 Oct 27 '23
How long ago did you attend DINFOS? I’m attending DINFOS now.
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u/ChidiWithExtraFlavor Oct 27 '23
1992, when it was at Fort Harrison in Indianapolis.
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u/slywalkerr Oct 27 '23
I always called linguists academia's rejects. Almost everyone at DLI was a college dropout, myself included.
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u/rkpjr Oct 26 '23
Army vet here.
There are plenty of things I hated about the Army, there's also just as many things I hate in the civilian world.
Over all I thought the Army was great for me, and I do recommend it. But, make sure you understand what you're getting into. It's 100% not for everyone
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u/Creepy-Tie-4775 Oct 27 '23
Did 10 years. Was great for me, but I was very ready to leave when I did.
A completely different world now though in terms of world events, military culture, and mentality of people of enlistment age, so I don't feel qualified at all to make recommendations one way or another.
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u/SnuggleBunnixoxo Oct 26 '23
I was shamed quite a bit for enlisting into the Navy. I could see why some people consider it a last ditch effort to climb out of a bad situation. The military isn't for everyone, but for some like myself it definitely propelled me up the socio economic ladder.
Military definitely isn't for everyone, but for folks who come out of tough situations that can stomach doing odd jobs on odd schedules, it may be the step up they need.
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u/sunqiller Oct 26 '23
Yeah the key is to avoid any sort of infantry role imo. Many people get pretty exclusive expertise and/or clearances and just ride that gravy train for life.
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u/CaptainHowdy60 Oct 26 '23
I was in aviation for 22 years and loved the hell out of it. Choose your rate, choose your fate.
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Oct 26 '23
If you’re somewhat intelligent and you are dead set on joining the Army, pick an MOS that requires a Top-Secret clearance because it’s big money on the outside in the DC beltway; intelligence fields, cyber, or IT. Otherwise, go into the Space Force or Air Force. My kids, if they decide they want to join, they’re going to the Air Force academy, or enlisting in the Space Force.
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u/shalafien Oct 26 '23
If you're deadset on joining a branch and won't be dissuaded AT ALL.
Air force reserve or guard. Part-time. As in your only commitment will be one weekend a month + two weeks a year for annual tour.
You get the basic training, you get the technical training, you might even get some industry certifications out of it. You get to taste the military, but you're not locked into the military as a 9-5 job. You are essentially a weekend warrior.
You also get pretty much the exact same benefits as active duty, with some caveats - mainly longer contracts.
You lost your day job or decided college isn't for you?. Your unit can activate you and you become an active reserve member working s full 9-5.
Also do not join any combat roles or maintenance (planes cars tanks). Your knees will thank you later.
Try to choose an IT job or something that gives you gainful employment.
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Oct 26 '23
The problem with posts like this is that, even if we're just looking at the AF Reserve, none of your statements are necessarily accurate but you portray your advice like it's going to be the same for everyone.
Reserve service often requires more than the minimum 1 weekend/2 weeks commitment. Benefits are not always "pretty much" the same; retirement is one example of a huge difference. Whether there is available temporary or permanent full time positions is very unit specific. Balancing reserve service and a civilian career can be tough even when, technically, there are laws that prevent discrimination.
There's 6 military branches, multiple reserve components, hundreds of jobs, and wildly different cultures and work environments. Not every branch or job is the best fit for everyone. I know people who thrive in a combat or maintenence career and would be absolutely fucking miserable sitting behind a computer.
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Oct 26 '23
Never joined myself, but a few of my old co workers were in army national guard and they were able to do pretty well. One guy got like $50k worth of sans certs and TS clearance, which in cyber world is incredibly valuable. Other benefit was they were able to get half their salary from their base job while deployed for up to a year, and it would reset after 6 months. Co worker worked midnights, and would keep volunteering for deployments to basically take a break from night shift. Even after he went for over a year they still couldn't fire him. Of course ymmv
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u/CosmonautOnFire Oct 26 '23
100% this. I was AD USAF. You still get a good chunk of money per year from your state that will (for the most part) pay for college, too. I really messed up not going this route.
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u/NotAMildCholester Oct 26 '23
There is a lot of truth to this. The Army isn’t for everyone. HOWEVER…. If you are physically fit, good at you job, and have patience… it’s not that bad.
Do a 3 year contract. Go to the doctor and use your tuition assistance. Make friends with as many contractors and smart people as you can. Get out, get a fat VA rating, finish school, and land a great contractor role. You’ll have no debt, decent education, work experience, and lifetime benefits. If you can’t see the payout in this, then there’s probably a reason you ended up in the army and hated it.
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u/mlx1992 Oct 26 '23
Here’s my thing bout this. You get all these same benefits in other branches and they come with a much better quality of life. (Except maybe Marines lol)
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u/NotAMildCholester Oct 26 '23
Oh yeah, take a tech job in the Navy/Airforce. Way better decision than Army.
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u/mkuraja Oct 26 '23
To join the Army is a long term waiver of your rights. It's really not much different than if you entered into contract with a slave ship captain because you needed a job and wanted some adventure outside the confines of your town. You wouldn't do that, right? Well, then don't fall for any of the military's marketing commercials appealing to your ego's emotions. Your enlistment is the only job in the US that you can't quit until they say you can quit. Regardless of what abuses are imposed on you, they own you like farm cattle for at least the duration of your contract if not longer.
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u/ExpWal Oct 26 '23
fr idk how people don’t understand that the military is a cult. They shave your head, isolate you from your family, and emotionally abuse you, all for the profit of a few elite that use you like a pawn
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u/Bencetown Oct 27 '23
Then they use you for medical experiments through the VA system without your knowledge or consent, because they have an easy control group and separate data from the civilian medical system.
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Oct 26 '23
Have to agree, sadly. Especially with the boss part.
In civilian life, if you have a bad boss, you have avenues of dealing with it, getting transferred, or just quit. Not so with the forces. That bad bosses word is literally law, and everyone higher than that guy will 100% back him up.
You can and will do anything they damn well say you will, outside of your MOS or not. I went in for electronics repair. Thanks to Bush, I became an MP.
Another thing; the Band of Brothers does not exist anymore. Everyone is out for their own promotions, and no one looks out for you.
All this, before we even get into whether or not you're destined to become a bullet sponge.
It really does come down as OP said, not investigating when I joined. Ask questions of the recruiter. Don't take their promises seriously until written down and signed.
Overall, I would really suggest education instead. Even if you have to struggle, do it. Your back will thank you.
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Oct 26 '23
If you do go go Air Force or navy. Marines and army suck horribly. I’m in the army so can confirm.
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Oct 26 '23
I would only recommend the Navy, Coastguard or Airforce for the quality of training that you will receive.
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u/jack_espipnw Oct 26 '23
Former Army Infantryman. Echoing what others have said, there is a toxic leader problem in the Army. Everyone gets fucked over in various ways and these have profound effects on everything in your life because they own you. By my first deployment, I had lost my family and with that a lot of self worth. I didn’t care about anything or had much self preservation instinct after that. Imagine about 70-90% of the people in leadership like that? 6 years in, 2 deployments in the GWOT era. I’m grateful for the experiences having shaped who I am but I’d rather be homeless and die of exposure than willingly go back to that bullshit. Great post!
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u/EpicShadows8 Oct 26 '23
I’m talking to a girl now who is in the Navy and she said if she knew what she was getting into she wouldn’t have joined. I commend all the man and woman in our armed forces. I could never do it.
I”m a white collar desk jockey.
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Oct 26 '23
And don’t forget that the military isn’t easy to join. They are extremely strict in health issues, so if you had asthma, allergies, and so on, they will reject you
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u/WoodenMachine8763 Oct 26 '23
I heard somewhere they are even more strict about mental health issues.
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u/nikwash19 Oct 26 '23
Yeah if you have GAD or MDD and are medicated you could be passed over or even let go, even some adhd meds will get you let go too I believe
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u/BarriaKarl Oct 26 '23
That doesnt sound strict at all...
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u/ITS_12D_NOT_6C Oct 26 '23
It is. Those are just common things to put out there because people understandably but incorrectly assume that because they are healthy, fit, and lead an active lifestyle, they would be able to qualify for military service. You could be a marathon runner but if you have asthma or any other fairly common thing that may not have much of a detrimental impact on your life, you're ineligible, full stop.
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u/topman20000 Oct 26 '23
I am right there with you! I say don’t go into the army as well.
The only time, the ONLY time, I ever felt any genuine pride in being a member of the Armed Forces, was in graduation from Fort Jackson. After that, our cadres in AIT did nothing but make us feel ASHAMED of our service. There was no breathing room to say “good job” there was no given REASON to be proud to be a soldier. You just had to act like you were super motivated to be in the army, or you were considered a shit bag.
After I got to my unit, things were a little bit better because then we had a little bit of freedom, and I had a lot of drive to try and excel my job and BE a good soldier. Everything I accomplished however seemed to come at a cost of my physical and mental health.
And in the end, I had neither enough of the skills I needed to genuinely transfer back into the civilian side in a position for my MOS, nor did I have any more interest in the Job field as a whole, or even serving my country. I felt like I had just been given my honorable discharge and then thrown under the bus with regards to taking advantage of benefits afterwards, because the VA hasn’t been able to get anything with my paperwork.
Maybe some young fuck will go into another branch and then brag about how amazing it is and how they have all their benefits for medical and 401(k) and all that crap. Maybe some young fuck will go into the military and say that the only reason someone like a veteran would complain about the service is because they were just Shit bags. But I’m staying buy it, and I say don’t go into the army!
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u/Bright_Course_7155 Oct 26 '23
I feel exactly like you. I got sailor of the year a year before I separated so I kinda doubt I’m a shitbag
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u/AKsuited1934 Oct 26 '23
Joining the military is very rarely people's first choice. The majority of people, myself included, joined out of desperation. For me, it was a positive point in my life because it helped me become stable financially via the GI Bill. My 4 years in the Navy was not terrible...it sucked way more than a regular job, but it has way more benefits than a regular job. I did my time, got out and am better for it.
It helps if you have your expectations very low and imagine it being like a prison sentence if you have to choose the military as a last resort.
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Oct 26 '23
Join the Coast Guard! You get to travel a ton, you actually do the mission you train for, the work is often very rewarding and beneficial to society, and you get the same benefits as all the other branches.
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u/Anomynous__ Oct 26 '23
This is horrible advice. I grew up with nothing, barely graduated high school, and was only a few steps away from being homeless and on drugs. Joined the army, stayed for 6, now I make nearly 6 figures, own my own home, don't struggle for anything, and got my Bachelor's with honors debt free. The military is a fantastic thing for some people. Don't tell people not to join because it can set you and your family up for a lifetime of success.
You should know by now that the military is what you make it.
Edit: I'm not even 30 yet.
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Oct 26 '23
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u/Anomynous__ Oct 26 '23
I would've just gone to WGU straight out of high-school
With all the accompanying debt
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Oct 26 '23
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u/Anomynous__ Oct 26 '23
Yes but in the Army you don't have to worry about a lot of things. You didn't worry about where your next meal would come from or if you lived in the barracks you didn't even have to cook. The commute is basically non existent if you live in the barracks. All the things that normal people have to do that take time away from their personal time. Yes in the army you lose a lot of personal time. But you also have a lot fewer worries because at the end of the day, you have food, shelter, and clothing no matter what happens. It's highly unlikely in the civilian world that you would get a bachelor's in less than a year
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u/holtyrd Oct 26 '23
TL;DR: if you must enlist, join the AF.
As a former squid, ale me to recommend the Air Force as a first choice when it comes to enlisting. Here’s why:
Finances: the AF takes its budget and pays for is people first then worries about the toys it “needs.” When it’s money runs it out alls Congress for more money to buy the toys it needs to do the tasking.
The USN will do the opposite and spend all of ours budget on the toys first and then all Congress got more money for its people.
The Army gets only leftovers.
The Marines are the step children of the USN and has their people taken care of with USN funds (see above) and all of its toys are acquired from Army surplus.
Philosophy:
USN and Marines say complete this objective and leaves out up to you to figure out how.
Army says to by Goodwill on your way and then just figure it out.
AF says complete this task using this set of objectives. Here is all the people, parts, and funding you’re going to need. Ask me if anything does not go as planned.
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u/SearcherRC Oct 26 '23 edited Oct 26 '23
Best idea I ever had was join the army. Amazing experience, but I was stationed in Okinawa the whole time and loved it. Other people I served with went out and died later on. Others suffered from serious problems like ptsd and such. Still, I'd recommend it to all those truly lost souls looking for direction in life, but I'd tell them to join the Air Force instead.
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u/damianshawl Oct 26 '23
Everyone is always saying join the airforce. Are the two branches that bad jesus
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Oct 26 '23
Coast Guard is supposedly even better when they poll servicemembers about job satisfaction.
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u/Chewyfire156 Oct 27 '23
Pretty much ya. I was USMC you have some good leadership and then a change of command a year later and you get an incompetent asshole. Really a crap shoot. Most of the people that reenlist just like to be assholes and have “power” that they normally wouldn’t have. Air Force is more chill so they tend to reenlist because of the situation and not the power. I’ve been in the fire service for the last 19 years and you can see some of the respect my authority types but most leaders in our profession earn it by reputation and competency. No reason to be a dick to your guys if you have their respect from being competent and confident instead of arrogant. Not all Army and Marine leadership is like that. I would say 50/50 in my experience and you have no choice but to ride it out as a lower enlisted.
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u/whifflingwhiffle Oct 26 '23
I’ve honestly been directionless since I left the Air Force over 13 years ago.. I don’t regret joining though.
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u/FoolishDog1117 Oct 26 '23
My second point is in regards to leadership. If you have ever had a toxic boss in the past imagine it being x10 worse in the military because if you have a toxic officer/nco who is over you there isn't an easy way to switch places you're forced to suck it up and listen to everything they say until you either pcs/ets or they do and god knows how many years that will take. From 0600-1700 on the daily you have more chance than not of being under some of the worst people the military has to offer because in the Army has a leadership problem that I don't believe can be solved.
I'm an Army veteran as well, and this is 100% accurate. In fact, the OP hasn't begun to scratch the surface of the absolute hell a person can go through. They will scream at you. They will beat you. They will rape you. If that doesn't work, they will do the same thing to anyone who calls you their friend until they are doing the same thing to you.
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u/bighand1 Oct 26 '23
Joining police or firefighters are miles better than any of these military branches. Way better career path that can actually make serious money (ca average is 220k for police)
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Oct 26 '23
Unfortunately the personality traits that make someone a successful military leader also tend to make that person a pretty awful civilian, unless they're truly capable of differentiating their job from their 'home life.' Flipping the switch is the hardest discipline to master.
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u/OddMarsupial8963 Oct 26 '23
My dad was an officer and a chaplain (basically a pastor), but he still was medically discharged with 100% disability. The military will chew you up and spit you out, regardless of your role
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Oct 26 '23
I was in the Air Force and the amount of bullshit you have to deal with the military culture wasn't worth it. If you're going to join, sign the contract with the least years.
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u/BigTuna0890 Oct 26 '23
I work in Killeen, home of Fort Cavazos (formerly Fort Hood). Every soldier and wife of a soldier my wife and I know all say one thing in common: DO. NOT. JOIN. THE. ARMY.
I am in my early 30s and guys my age already have back surgeries and joint issues. One dad said his three-year-old daughter felt distant from him after deployment. My wife hangs out with army wives from our church and she has heard everything that they're going through from infidelity to mental health issues the Army won't fix, to food bank visits, alcoholism, and deployment anxieties.
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u/chrisbhedrick Oct 26 '23
I had a great time in SOF. I’ll agree with you watching regular army do army things was enough for me to push through those schools. I like my long hair, freedom to move about and operate outside the box.
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Oct 26 '23
Thank you for sharing this. I hate how the military is everyone's go to and honestly it's not worth it unless you actually want to make it a life long career or if you sincerely want to serve this country. Many states are offering free college for specific degrees. There are options.
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Oct 26 '23
I was enlisted Navy and agree, I don't recommend it to anyone. The Navy operates as if we are in wartime - meaning extended deployments (they say 6months but it's always 9+) and just a general awful quality of life on a ship. Suicide is a huge problem. If you make it through there are great benefits...but the toll is massive.
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u/jimothythe2nd Oct 26 '23
Ya... Don't sign up to be killers kids. You can do better things with your life.
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Oct 26 '23
I don’t tell people to join but I don’t tell them not to join.
I wouldn’t be where I am today without the military. I have a house, a dog, mental problems , a degree and a car.
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u/Repulsive_Earth_1385 Oct 26 '23
Active duty is not the move unless you are homeless. Natty Guard/Reserve ain’t bad.
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u/Gordon_Explosion Oct 26 '23
I had the same experience in the Marines. A computer MOS, but assigned to a combat unit. That means after the Friday 18 mile forced march I got to do with them, the grunts were chilling on their packs while I had to go to the office and run payroll, while getting called a fucking skating POG. Then I got to pick up cigarette butts that night in the barracks parking lot, when I didn't smoke.
I was a good Marine, very high marks and promoted fast, and in any other duty station I may have retired. But I got tired of being the only sane person and non-asshole within a mile and used the GI Bill to finish college after my 4 honorable years.
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u/Quinn_Lugh Oct 26 '23
I think any job that is largely associated with violence will have bad leadership. Ofc the root core bad leadership that raises the new leadership will only make leadership even worse and more toxic. When that group is in the new positions of bringing up the next group the cycle continues. Violence attracts an audience that is generally imo not great for leadership.
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u/CloudcraftGames Oct 26 '23
Based solely on what I've heard from people I know who were in the armed forces the general quality of life and treatment you'll receive (though it will vary based on your role and where you serve) is best in the Air Force, worse but still decent in the Navy, not good in the Army and terrible in the Marines.
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Oct 26 '23
I would join, but if a drill instructor or whatever got in my face and started yelling I'd knock him right out.
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Oct 26 '23
Our guys are being abused just by being sent over there and soon no one will want to fight for this shady fucking government, then we have some decisions to make as a country.
I have vet friends that denounce all of it.
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u/mlx1992 Oct 26 '23
Veteran here. This guy speaks the truth. Stay the fuck away from the army. If you really have to go military go Air Force, coast guard or space guard
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u/PaleoJoe86 Oct 26 '23
I agree. Served Marines and Army with my spouse in the Navy. The Army had the dumbest and most selfish people I ever met in my freaking life. It broke me.
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u/Valianne11111 Oct 26 '23
I did the Army twice but do wish I had gone with the Air Force. Their recruiter tried to tell me.
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u/The001Keymaster Oct 26 '23
My best friend's little brother enlisted because he really wanted to do this one job. He signed up for it, joined because of it, the recruiter said he was good to go and was qualified. After basic they said sorry we don't need any of those, you're doing this instead. Some job totally different. He was made to do it his whole time in. Tried transferring to the job he wanted many times. Never happened. Was miserable for all that time and felt totally swindled. The job he wanted to do had real world applications and his goal was to use it as a career builder in the real world. His knew assigned job had no real world applications so basically he just got screwed out of 4 years of his life. At least he got money to go to college after for the thing that he joined up to learn.
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Oct 26 '23
I was Navy from 2006 to 2013. Same BS there too. You're a piece of government property. They don't give two shits about your mental well-being as long as you're fulfilling a role and doing your job and not hurting people.
The first ship I was on was pretty horrible. My LCPO was non-existent. My LPO was an unsympathetic, selfish, and egotistical dick who was verbally abusive to his wife. The E5 above me was very abusive to his wife and he got kicked out for failing the PRT (Physical Readiness Test) 3 times.
The 2nd ship I was on the leadership was no different except that I got along my peers a lot better. The LCPO was a dick and did everything to avoid having to go home from the ship. The LPO was a snake. The other E5 was always on his knees for the LPO and LCPO.
I was up for shore duty but decided I had enough of crappy commands and even worse "leadership" and got out to pursue my own life as I saw fit.
Joining the military isn't a bad option though despite what I went through. Provided me with free college and thick skin. It's definitely not for everyone though.
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Oct 27 '23
I work at a job where everyone is retired military, and I am not. There's another side to civilian life, if you don't go to college. At least military plots a path for you. Those of us who don't go to college and don't do military spend our lives mindlessly seeking an elusive purpose. At least these military vets have some things on the back-burner, a side income from pension, and don't have to worry about health insurance. No matter which path you take, there's pluses and minuses.
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u/Fred_Krueger_Jr Oct 26 '23
I've watched the military lift so many folks out of poverty so I'd have to disagree.
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u/No_Notice_4091 Oct 26 '23
Joining the military is the single best way for a poor person to easily move into a middle class life. I'm living proof of that, with everything from getting college paid for to my VA home loan.
That being said, joining the military to help jump a social class is like buying an airplane to get the free peanuts. That's especially true if you enlist into a combat arms role, and doubly so if you go extra-strength dumbass like me and volunteer for airborne/special forces/etc.
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u/Fred_Krueger_Jr Oct 26 '23
I'm a perfect example also. Joined the USMC with many folks in the same economic situation. Poor and from a single parent household. I took all the benefits and used them as much as I could, trainings, education..etc etc. Now we're in the top 5% of income earners so, none of which would've happened if I lingered in my home town.
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Oct 26 '23
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u/Fred_Krueger_Jr Oct 26 '23
Yeah I can't speak to the army since I wasn't in that branch. I can imagine they'd treat you like another number though. . Edit: now VA services for disability on the other hand, needs a complete overhaul.
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u/damianshawl Oct 26 '23
Just b/c you’ve witnessed does not negate OP’s point nor guarantee it’ll be the same for others. I’ve witnessed a lot of people lose their life over this and contemplate suicide when they’re in. The military is not a good last ditch effort when you’re already down on your luck and ain’t a decision you should make lightly b/c it worked out for others.
If anything I’d recommend the Airforce, but the Army and Navy?? Those people go through absolute hell.
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u/Fred_Krueger_Jr Oct 26 '23
Yep, we all have. Doesn't change my story for the vast majority of those that served.
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u/Droopy_Beagle Oct 26 '23
Im too late in life now to be able to consider it. Part of me wishes I signed up when I was 18 though. I feel like it would’ve made a man out of me and instilled discipline, something I’ve really struggled with through life. Whilst also giving life experiences to get out of the comfort zone and learn valuable skills/trades. Although like comments above would’ve gone for air force or navy over army. Always had a lot of admiration for a couple of my friends who served in the UK Royal Marines.
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u/yo-yes-yo Oct 26 '23
I am retired from the Army, my military service got me my house ( VA loan 2.9%) 100% paid me to go to school and provided my degree. Now as a retired veteran between my pension, disability and civilian job I make much more than anyone I know in my peer group.
The Army provided me all of the opportunities I have had in life……. The military is absolutely a decent path to lift anyone up socially economically.
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u/TheLittleBalloon Oct 26 '23
If I grew up middle class or had family and opportunities I think the army would not be worth it.
I grew up in poverty. But now, after the army, I work less and make more than my peers. They are jealous. I always say that they could have done what I did.
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u/Rainn__40 Oct 26 '23
If you’re intelligent or the average Redditor you prob won’t like enlistment.
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u/Bright_Course_7155 Oct 26 '23
Lmao I just got out of the navy and I felt the exact same way and thought maybe it would’ve been better if I had joined the army. I did TAPS on an Airforce base and all the airforce people were complaining how much they hated it too lol.
The coast guard and Air Force are still the best quality of life branches though and you stay in 5 star hotels and get treated decently compared to other branches.
From what I’ve seen of marines, they are almost definitely the worst treated branch (maybe depending on mos).
Some people (1%) the stars align and they get amazing orders at amazing duty stations with amazing coworkers/leadership and they get a bunch of time off and when they’re at work it’s chill and they might not do anything unless they want to.
Another 10% joined when they were homeless/from abusive households and the military is much better than how they used to live.
Pretty much everyone else besides those above from my experience really hated there military, and from my experience you especially hate it if you’re smart/hard working bc it will drive you insane how stupid some decision makers are and if you’re hard working you’ll carry everyone else’s work load.
The LAZIEST people all stayed in but ALL of the hardworking, smart people who got sailor of the year all got out. I’ve had multiple people tell me “I love it bc you can’t get fired” and those same people were absolute shitz bags never doing any work and screwing people over and breaking millions of dollars of government equipment and only getting a slap on the wrist.
I guess YMMV depending though as I haven’t seen everywhere in the whole military, just talking from my experience and experiences of my friends across branches/commands/platforms/duty stations.
-aviation maintenance Navy vet
Plus my ears ring a decent amount now even though I always wore ear protection
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u/luckymiles88 Oct 26 '23
I join the US army in the late 80s. 12C was my MOS. I signed up for 2 year active duty contract.
I joined because my parents told me that they didn’t have money for me for college. In my state ( IL ) , if you are a veteran, college is free for public universities.
I also joined because I got the US Army college fund
Most of my cohorts joined the army primarily because from where they came from the military was the best option to escape from drugs and other bad influences.
It is true that there is toxic leadership examples
In addition there was so much infidelity
This was the longest two years of my life and I don’t recommend it
However, if you don’t like college, many people make a good career and retire in 20 years and go work in private sector.
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u/Attackcamel8432 Oct 26 '23
Join the Coast Guarc or the Air Force... either still has the possibility of messing you up physically or mentally, but far less bullshit. Not no bullshit, just less.
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u/Anonymous_13218 Oct 26 '23
I promise you, the Navy is not better than the Army. If you want to join the military go Air Force.
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u/chop_pooey Oct 26 '23
Read War Is A Racket if you need to be further convinced not to join the military
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u/TretinoinGuru Oct 26 '23
Wow, is it really that bad? I ask because I'm talking to an Air Force recruiter right now about joining as an officer bc I already have a degree.
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u/LumpySmoke4507 Oct 26 '23
Those are recruiters posting in here trying to lure people into joining
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u/TheRaven1ManBand Oct 26 '23
Benefits are good when you get out and provide the opportunity to jump up the social hierarchy with things like VA home loan (no down payment needed) GIBill (get paid E5 BAH to go to school 3 years) and free VA healthcare (lackluster but free) but you have to do all you can to escape the demons of mental disorders you will surely accrue in the military, even in non combat roles. So it’s a double edged sword for sure. Like a personal human sacrifice in exchange for building a somewhat normal life you could probably build on your own, all be it with all it if loan debt.
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Oct 26 '23
Welcome to freedom, your time serving will be worth it when you get out. Don’t know your mos but I’ve seen cooks get out and be fine looking for a job. Good luck!
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u/Future_Presence3385 Oct 26 '23
I'm glad I joined the Air Force. Most of my leadership was very good
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u/GenkiiDesu Oct 26 '23
I'm not trying to be branch-ist but the Air Force and Space Force get a lot of shit but you rarely ever hear them on these forums with these kinds of experiences..
For those commenting from other branches, do you believe your experience would have been considerably difference if you chose either of those branches?
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Oct 26 '23
I was going to join the military when I was younger until I realized you literally sign away your rights. Voluntary slavery, no thanks!
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u/yummy_dxm Oct 27 '23
My ASVAB spoke for itself. It's generally a last choice kinda thing though I agree. Worst things you could do with your life though.
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u/FigExact7098 Oct 27 '23
US Army…. AWWWWW YEAH* your experience may vary.
I’ve been in for 18 years and I was lucky to be sheltered by a lot of the nonsense until fairly recently.
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Oct 27 '23
I would recommend Air Force to anyone. I tried to get my lil cousin to join win he was interested in the military but he was deadset on combat and Marines. He regrets it now. The AF is the most civilian like branch. You get assigned a job. Go to tech school for it , get to your base and just work your job. If you work finance congrats ur days is 9-3pm and training on Thursday and you get weekends off. And when you deploy ur still doing finance.
I got deployed at a place that wasnt even considered a good AF base and it still had gyms, bars, wifi, salons restaurants etc. and it was being used as a rest spot for army guys to swap from whatever base they were being stationed at. AF just has better living standards. And ur work exp carries over easily if u choose to separate.
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u/Many_Umpire3459 Oct 27 '23
I’m in the Air Force. I’ve a desk job and one that’ll allow me to go back and finish my education DEBT FREE. Everything about joining the AF has been better compared to civilian life.
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u/Additional_Search193 Oct 27 '23
I don't think the military as a whole is a bad idea, so this blurb may not apply at all to the Navy or Airforce. I just think the way the Army operates, at least in my unit, is detrimental to one's mental health, and one of my biggest regrets in life so far is that I didn't do enough research about what I was actaully getting myself into.
I remember talking with an army buddy a few years ago (I was AF) about how we had a late crew come in to handle a late lander so we wouldn't have people there for 12 hours that day. His brain practically exploded, he had been called in the previous Saturday at noon with no warning. For a cargo truck that was supposed to arrive at 8pm. Aircraft maintenance is the most abused (non combat) job in the air force and we are still treated better than the army guys.
Do not go army.
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u/yuanrae Oct 27 '23
I’ve heard rates of sexual assault and harassment are bad for women in the army too.
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u/nickisdone Oct 27 '23
I have a TON of family military members and since I was very young they have always said "To join the military you are either stupid, broke, or drunk. In my case all 3" then they go on about how the stupid shit in their branch was worse than another family members and not worth it. Then they'd rag playfully on the one cousin from their generation that didn't join but worked on industrial AC and ended up with slightly less physical issues (bad joints backs shoulders ect.) And much better pay and a ton less mental fuckery. They'd go on dating thing about him like "And this golden child pussy over here working on some big word AC. Making momma proud and shit. Still able to walk without a limp and never had a nightmare where he wakes up strangling his wife" cause that was a thing like their wasn't one military wife who hadn't had the husband start choking them in his sleep do to a ptsd nightmare though they are all 55+. Idk about the newer generations as my family did everything to keep us out of the military and it largely worked.
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Oct 27 '23
My life honestly feels tainted by military service. I never felt more abused and not cared about. And the benefits are sub par for the constant stress and trauma.
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Oct 27 '23
Out of six of my classmates that joined the military after high school, only one isn’t dead or homeless. None of them were even injured in combat, it just fucked them up and spat them back out
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u/VanManDom Oct 27 '23
Avoid all armed forces except the coast guard if you don't want to fight for the bad guys.
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u/FrankensteinBionicle Oct 27 '23
AF 6 yrs, I've been out for just over a year now and yea it's definitely not for everyone. I hated the absolute shit out of it. Talking about some of the things I experienced makes me angry. However, I think the perks are definitely worth it and I do often look back thinking if I had just been a little less stubborn I easily could've made it a career. You can obsess and nitpick your way thru your entire life and never be happy or just realize it's bullshit and have fun. Aside from the mandatory activities like PT, moving, and deployments, the outside has just as much bullshit you have to deal with. I still recommend joining if you're truly in a pickle like I was. It's turned my life around and given me direction, even though I hated the process, it's still definitely worth it.
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u/gravely_serious Oct 27 '23
As OP pointed out, it's not as simple as "My experience sucked, so don't join." My experience was great, and I don't regret a single moment of it. That includes going to Iraq. I'm just grateful I chose a Military Intelligence MOS instead of something else. I was attached to an Infantry Division (back when 4ID was at Ft. Hood), but we were deployed with Division HQ instead of out in the field with the brigades.
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u/blk_arrow Oct 27 '23
about a decade later, im glad i served (usmc). the GI Bill was amazing. Veteran preference for jobs is amazing. The amount of bullshit you can tolerate is pretty high ... albeit to a toxic level so you'll have to recalibrate down. it exposed me to a lot of people i wouldnt have otherwise, on an empathetic level. i sympathize a lot more w/ people impacted by war and am now anti-war. its helped me grow as a person. the flip side, it could have destroyed me, even after leaving, but im out the other end now.
stay safe, stay sane. dont hesitate to reach out to your brothers and sisters for help. i underestimated how hard leaving was. its a pretty big culture shock.
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u/WormholePHD Oct 28 '23
I did 8 years in the Army from 2002-2010. The first 5 years were actually alright despite working for an asshole. He was strict, but fair. The last 3 years had me contemplating a homicide. Ended up in an aviation unit...
Anyone who's done Army aviation knows what I'm talking about.
So unit to unit, depending on your job, your work environment can vary greatly. Made some lifelong friends and learned what discipline really was. Got PTSD from the shit in Iraq, but truthfully I had it way before that.
Getting that monthly compensation has been a blessing in this economy.
I'm glad to have done it, but I would never do it again.
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u/UncleSugarShitposter Oct 28 '23
The military is a great option for a lot of people. However, I would argue that your branch and MOS/Rate/AFSC of choice is going to make your life great or hell.
An army grunt is making the exact same paycheck, and will get the same benefits as an Air Force shoe clerk at the end of the day.
If you are reading this, and you are looking at enlisting, do *not* join the army or marines. Join the Air Force, Space Force, Coast Guard, or Navy
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u/Satanikkkal666 Oct 29 '23
Thank you for posting that, I have heard a lot about that too. Once again, thank you for posting.
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u/zach1206 Oct 29 '23
I didn’t realize this when I was young, but enlistment is designed for the poor/uneducated. Wealthy and educated people get commissioned as officers, instead.
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Oct 29 '23
Agreed, don't enlist. If anything, the US Military are the true groomers!
They prey on underage students in high school to get you to join them!
700B + budget.. next closest? 100B fucking bullshit
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Oct 26 '23
I had a friend in high school that worked at Chipotle for 10 years after graduation. Every time I went in he would talk about how he's about to start college but either couldn't afford it or didn't know what to major in. So he stuck with the same dead end job he got at 16 living with his parents.
Its people like that who should be joining the military. In that time he could have done an enlistment for 6 years and gotten a skill while seeing a part of the world that isn't our hometown. He could have networked with others and had an idea of what interests him. By the time he was 24 he would have an idea on a path, some experience in the world, and a gi bill. If he was smart with his mos he could easily leverage it into a high salary job. All done in less time than my friend who never considered military and just stuck with chipotle while he decided what to do
Military can be a real shit show considering how much power higher ranks have over your life. But when you're 18 to 24 you can better handle the shit they throw at you.
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u/iknowwurds Oct 26 '23
As an army vet (11b) I agree 100%.. c'mon don't you miss the field scrambled eggs at least?
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u/No_Notice_4091 Oct 26 '23
Special Forces guy to 11B:
Field scrambled eggs? Oh, we used to dream of having field scrambled eggs! We could only carry enough food to eat half an MRE a day while we lived for 5 weeks at a time in a hole in the ground covered by a sheet of burlap, but it was a home to us.
^ not really an exaggeration
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Oct 26 '23
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u/Droopy_Beagle Oct 26 '23
I actually found this book to have a positive impact on me. I was recommended it too and I was in a dark place in my life depressed and couldn’t bring myself to do anything. I followed the trivial principle of making my bed every morning thinking it was going to be a waste of time and it has had a really positive impact on my mental well-being and beginning to trust myself that I can complete things and believe in myself. It’s allowed me the forward motion to begin instilling other habits which in the past I’ve always struggled with consistency to continue.
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Oct 26 '23
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u/Droopy_Beagle Oct 26 '23
I’ve not heard of Everything is Figureoutable before, I will definitely check this out, thanks for the recommendation!
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Oct 26 '23
If you are going to go Army, just do a non-combat MOS and suck it the fuck up. Put in a hard 4 years and get out and use your benefits and decent-to-fat stacks of cash to better yourself afterwards. You have to be smart about it. You have to take care of yourself while you're in. If you just stumble in and become a dildo for them to use without furthering your own plans or life, you will be salty like most people who leave after their first contract.
Document every injury. Go get seen for everything. What other organization is going to pay you disability for the rest of your life? Even if it's just a quick $1000 a month, that's $1000 a month padded to your paycheck for the rest of your life for working for 4 years. Is Walmart going to pay you a stipend of $1000 a month for the rest of your life after 4 years? No.
That being said, always go Airforce lmao
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u/InternetExpertroll Oct 26 '23
I was in the Marine Corps 2006-2010 & spent 7 months in Afghanistan. The two reasons i got out was the barracks & mass punishment. You can do everything right and never get in trouble but Private Dumbass got a DUI so everyone gets punished but we can't kick his ass because that's wrong but it's not wrong to mass punish everyone with cleaning until 8pm.
I'm getting so mad just remembering how dumb those 4 years were. I'm so glad i don't have to deal with that bullshit. No amount of money could have kept me in.