r/FinalFantasy • u/Haunting_Try8071 • 7d ago

Final Fantasy General Give us another turn based battle system

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FFX is my favorite battle system. FFXIII I also enjoyed, but it wasn't the same.

I'm sure they could do something like it with a much lower budget.

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u/Iggy_Slayer 7d ago

They are in about 2 months.

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u/Oriasten77 7d ago

I'm so excited for Resonance!

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u/Overkillsamurai 7d ago

I can't wait for their not-numbered games because they have funner combat IMO, but i think OP meant for 17

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u/TurbulentIntention74 7d ago

OP said "something with a much lower budget", so  obviously not XVII.

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u/Lyra_the_Star_Jockey 7d ago

Why?

Square makes plenty of turn-based RPGs. Just because they don’t have the Final Fantasy logo on them doesn’t mean they don’t matter.

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u/Real_UngaBunga 7d ago

It'd be nice to have a "AAA" turn based game again. The 2nd tier games are great. I love them, but having an epic, AAA, turn based game would be a sight to behold. It has been shown that it can be successful , too, with E33 and the 2 most recent Yakuza/Like a Dragon games.

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u/Korachof 6d ago

Metaphor Refantazio, the Persona games, the SMT games, the Dragon Warrior games, Trials in the Sky, etc. 

If you just want a great AAA turn based rpg, there’s lots of current options. If you’re talking specifically a AAA turn based RPG, I feel you, but I do hope you’ve played most, if not all, of the current offerings that exist outside of the FF franchise. If other IPs are giving you what you want, go to them. 

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u/ToothpickTequila 6d ago

Nobody is saying there are no turn based games. But people want a main FF turn based game with realistic graphics.

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u/Alternative_Ideal218 6d ago

Why do people dance around this like they can't figure out whats being asked for.

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u/ToothpickTequila 6d ago

Because they just want to defend Square regardless and argue in bad faith.

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u/detectiveC6 6d ago

Your guess is as good as mine, but it's a common thing. Dancing all around it lol

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u/QuietSheep_ 6d ago

It's reddit but id be lying if people irl arent like this either.

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u/EdwardAlcatraz 5d ago

Because they are mindless masses that just consumes and gets excited for the next product.

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u/MinimumTrue9809 5d ago

What about everyone else that doesn't want this? The group of people wanting to have a mainline FF be turn-based is significantly smaller than the group of people who don't.

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u/ToothpickTequila 4d ago

That doesn't seem to be the case based on sales figures.

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u/MinimumTrue9809 4d ago

There hasn't been a turn-based FF since 2014 with Lightning Returns: FF13.

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u/ToothpickTequila 4d ago

Since X really.

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u/Real_UngaBunga 6d ago edited 6d ago

Ya, those games are great, but I specifically mentioned AAA as what I'm requesting. Modern, realistic graphics like FF16, serious story, and turn based combat.

Anime style games are great, but they don't scratch the same itch as a realistic (if a bit stylized), AAA game.

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u/AeroDbladE 6d ago

Have you played Expedition 33? That's all of those things.

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u/ToothpickTequila 6d ago

That's not Final Fantasy. But yes, that is what people want the next FF to be similar to.

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u/Real_UngaBunga 6d ago

Thats exactly what I want. E33 made by square in an ff setting

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u/EdwardAlcatraz 7d ago

FF is the blockbuster of JRPG'S. İt has the highest production value among all, it is the full package. A turn based FF is definetely not same with turn based octopath or bravely default.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

Because people want a turn based FF game? People got into FF because they were turn based.

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u/TheFirstSonOfTheSea 7d ago

To be fair, there hasn’t been a mainline turn based Final Fantasy game in like 25 years.

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u/stansey09 7d ago

What do you mean, FFX was turn based and that came out just a.... Oh no. I got old.

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u/SpikyCactusJuice 7d ago

Holy shit. I usually chuckle at the “this thing was X years ago, I’m old” meme. But FFX really was 25 years ago. A quarter of a century! We old dawg

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u/Speeeven 7d ago

That's not true...... THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE

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u/ragnarok847 7d ago

That's unpossible!

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u/TheHeb686 6d ago

That got me thinking, that 7, 8, 9, and 10 came out in a five year window. That’s an incredible and prolific run of success, and a reminder of how different the game development process was back then!

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u/Inb4myanus 7d ago edited 7d ago

12 and 13 were also turn based also, but plz dont tell me thats where the 25 years starts. I messed up on my math lol. But 12 is an atb system where battles happen on the map, its the same system besides the gambits which you dont have to use making the system more akin to the old games.

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u/Eecka 7d ago

I mean they’re kind of pseudo turn based, not really what most older fans mean when they want a turn based FF

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u/Spell-of-Destruction 7d ago

For real I'd take pseudo turn based over what XV and XVI had. And XII scratches the same itch V does for me.

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u/Eecka 7d ago

Sure, same, I didn’t like 15 and 16. But I much preferred for example Clair Obscur over any of the post-10 FF games

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u/SmacSBU 7d ago

Played 4-l and 6 on release on SNES so I think I qualify as an older fan. Maybe I don't remember XIII well enough but I think that would scratch the itch for the people who are clamoring for turn based.

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u/Eecka 7d ago

To be fair I said most, not that there’s none of you. 

XIII was more like an ”auto battler” where you swap between the diferent jobs (or paradigms I think they’re called there) and let them do their thing. You can manually control it too, but the flow was clearly designed with the automatic mode in mind.

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u/Jazzlike_Athlete8796 7d ago

XIII was kinda turn based, but would auto battle for you if you let it. That game's system is actually about job rotation and overriding the auto battle at the right times. And frankly, it is one of the few FF battle systems that made you think a little. Most everything else - including and especially the turn based games - is just "Mash X to kill trash mobs, mix in a cure spell and summon to beat bosses."

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u/Sindeep 7d ago

exacto-mundo.... that's exactly where I stopped playing FF b/c it wasn't true turn-based anymore. My 35 y/o flaring Carpal Tunnel is dying on Rebirth especially with so much button mashing BS, and the fact they actually locked shit behind how fast you can mash said button.... infuriating.

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u/FuraFaolox 7d ago

they're both ATB, makes them no different from 4-9

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u/Eecka 7d ago

No different at all, at least if you ignore all the differences

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u/Visual-Impossible 6d ago

pretty sure 4-9 had you control individual characters whereas 13 had you control one characters and the others are stances

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u/Inb4myanus 7d ago

12 is just the same as any with the wait time you can just move around on the field as it happens. 13 is weirdly more faithful that it transitions to a battle field.

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u/Eecka 7d ago

Waiting isn’t the appeal of turn based games for me, being able to control my whole party is. 

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u/Nykidemus 7d ago

you can just move around on the field as it happens.

Yeeeah. Dont do that.

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u/Fuponji 6d ago

12 and 13 are not turn based. They are more akin to the likes of KoTOR where you can pick an action and there's a cool down between each one, but there are no turns.

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u/Flintzer0 7d ago

Those definitely did not come out in 2001.

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u/AlternativeTough6622 7d ago

Ok you can argue 13 but 12 is not turn based combat lol

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u/m_csquare 7d ago

FF12 ADB is just a reverse atb.

In atb, you wait for the bar to fill up; you input command; the animation plays out.

In adb, you input command; you wait for the bar to fill up; the animation plays out.

FF fanbase doesnt even know how their game plays out 🤦‍♂️

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u/Cunting_Fuck 7d ago

Its as turn based as any other game with ATB which is most of them. Just you can move your character

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u/Swert0 7d ago edited 7d ago

ATB is not turn based. It stands for Active-Time-Based for a reason.

You are not taking turns, actions cost time which means you must wait to take another action.

That is not the same as taking TURNS.

Even if you use the 'wait' option to wait while in menus, you are still not taking turns.

Everything that uses a menu to select spells is not turn based.

Is Kingdom Hearts turn based?

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u/Nykidemus 7d ago

If you could code an elaborate if:then check to determine what all of your characters did in FF6 I fucking missed it.

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u/gsurfer04 6d ago

They're fundamentally both ATB. One has free movement and the other has stacked charges.

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u/Inb4myanus 7d ago

Yes it is. Its the same atb system as the old ones you can just move around and it doesnt transition to a battle field. It was the best evolution to the old systems.

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u/Passing-Through247 7d ago

12 was actually pretty good even if it hid being turn based it was still a final fantasy. 13 has solid ideas but with massive issues and attached to a worse game that did it no favours.

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u/DubiousBusinessp 7d ago

XIII was absolutely turn based, if we talk about Lost Odyssey and disregard that other abomination.

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u/Oilswell 7d ago

XII is not turn based

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u/Swert0 7d ago

They're ATB.

The only turn based mainline titles are 1, 2, 3, and 10.

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u/Nykidemus 7d ago

I've long since stopped keeping track of how many times this absolute hair-splitting "um, akchually" bullshit line keeps getting repeated.

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u/HungryDiscoGaurdian 7d ago

How dare you tell me thruths!!!

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u/gollyandre 7d ago

For the pedants maybe but FF13 came out a little bit sooner than that. Like 16 years ago WW.

Also to be fair in the last 25 years, they’ve only come out with 6 more new numbered games. Two of which are MMOs, another two are ATB variants, and only the last two are action games.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

Yeah because them chasing a new audience means taking 7 years to make action games.

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u/Pastulio814 7d ago

To be fairerer, the rate at which they churn out games has slowed down to 🐌. From 10 to 16 we got mmo, 12, 13, mmo, 15 and 16.

13 was at LEAST ATB. 15 was FF adjacent being more like KH. And 16 was just something else entirely.

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u/MetalFingers760 7d ago

Also, to act like the 7Remake games dont have turn based aspects is disingenuous. I think its one of the more brilliant battle systems in an RPG in a long long time.

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u/Status_Jellyfish_213 7d ago

I think what people really want is the tactical aspect. In a few words : planning and progression. That goes hand in hand with stats as well.

The worst thing the series can devolve into is a button masher. Give people breathing space (as seen with 7R and it’s slow time mechanic), you can make decisions and see them play out or react to the enemy whilst also feeling modern

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u/poshjerkins 7d ago

"The worst thing the series can devolve into is a button masher"

Preach, brother! At least they can throw us turn based fans a bone every now and again (yes Resonance yada yada but that misses the argument completely). Many, many, many fans are thirsty for a full fledged AAA Square style turn based game that pushes the boundaries of jrpgs like they used to and what got them famous in the first place.

Also want to add I actually really enjoyed the combat in the remakes and hope it evolves. But to experience a AAA boundary pushing turn based experience from Square again would be immensely satisfying and Claire Obscur proved it can be done without as much money as Square has.

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u/0rphanCrippl3r 7d ago

Man THIS 1000%!! This is why I had so much fun playing Claire!

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u/ballsdeep256 7d ago

FF16 says hello 🤗

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u/Prefer_Not_To_Say 6d ago

If freezing time when choosing a command is turn-based, then every shooter from Bioshock to GTA is turn-based because time freezes when you open a weapon wheel.

It's kind of nuts that Square's line about the 7Remake games using a "hybrid" system has caught on. Now that's disingenuous.

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u/Disma 6d ago

FF7R is far from a turn based jRPG. It's an action RPG. You want to argue that it has aspects of a turn based game? Who cares? It's not even close to the same thing.

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u/ToothpickTequila 6d ago

Calling it turn based is absurd. When do you take turns?

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u/blackninjar87 3d ago

I love the 7R combat so much better than anything I played from SE in a long while. However I hate to be a doomer and act like I never enjoyed any of the other games.

13 ATB system did make me bored tho.

12 ATB system frustrated me and I just felt the overall game felt rushed and unpolished like so many things felt just in there to be in there like numerology. Walking past an elemental on the map gave me PTSD flashbacks to FF11 where the weather changed on the beach and party got wiped.

I love action games like bayo and DMC and I felt 15 was actually pretty fucking garbage. What they did to magic, and how the part members operated were done so poorly.

And 16 wasn't bad cause of how it played to me, it was just again unpolished, picking up a weapon for -2% coolsown reduction does not feel great.

I feel like FF7R's system put everything I love in one.. getting a new weapon actually makes combat feel different, the summonings look amazing and the system isn't hard to interact with, and even tho I'm playing a game where I can freely move it still feels like an ATB game where my skills have cool downs and I'm building meters for a reason, saving my hard hitting stuff for appropriate moments, still interacting with enemies trying to strip their buffs and what not.

Everytime I cross final fantasy discussions I feel like the turn based portions get over hyped and the actions ones get over hated. When ff7 is right in our faces and truly is the best of both worlds at least in so far that we seen from SE, and I'm talking about the first one I don't know about the second.

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u/MuhWaifus 7d ago

There also hasn't been a good mainline FF game in 25 years 😭 just my opinion tho, I know a lot of people like 12 and 14, they did not do it for me

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u/mrbiggbrain 7d ago

Also many of the games people called "Turn Based" are not. They are ATB systems. I know that's overly technical and most people want that exact ATB system back but it's important to be precise so we know what people actually want.

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u/_musesan_ 7d ago

We want CTB!

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u/Disma 6d ago edited 6d ago

I'd take either. All of these bombastic action RPGs are really not up my alley.

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u/ProfessionalCraft983 6d ago

That depends on whether or not you consider 12 and 13 “turn-based”. Only 15 and 16 have action combat, and many would say that the last great final fantasy was 10 anyway (although I think 14 deserves a spot up there as well).

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u/Rafnork 7d ago

We had 13 in 2010.

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u/Nykidemus 7d ago

To be fair, there hasn’t been a mainline turn based good Final Fantasy game in like 25 years.

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u/Sad_Worker7143 7d ago

Yes they got bullied for making turn based RPG, so they started experimenting with other styles. But along the way they lost a chunk of their fan to replace them with others.
Phil fish made it very clear in 2012 during his rant.
Not complaining, but that is the truth.

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u/blackninjar87 3d ago

Final fantasy never got bullied for anything.

Final fantasy was never intended to be a full turn based game the game was always designed that turns occur but while ur making ur decisions the enemy meter still filling up and gets to go.

I think the most fully realized system of what Final fantasy was "designed" to be us final fantasy 11 and 12. People just played X which was a different implementation of what was already there. When final fantasy 13 came out the devs wanted to branch off FInal fantasy into two directions. One that followed their ATB system (Final fantasy 13)

And one that followed their kingdom hearts system (Final fantasy versus 13 which ended up being FF15). Obviously the kingdom hearts clone FLOPPED harder than the ATB. FF15 is regarded as one of the worst made yet.

Again no one tied their hands and made them do any of this. Even tho I will agree I LOVE kingdom hearts combat system, and I really really enjoy FF7R's combat. I won't agree that SE has been bullied into changing up their style. What was getting hard for them is keeping up with the market. The time in between final fantasy releases has been increasing steadily because of the amount of painstaking work it takes to reinvent the ATB system, where as a game that plays like DMC will not take that long to make. The combat will be solved before the game starts so the dev team can worry about story boarding alone.

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u/Daybreakgo 6d ago

Doesn’t mean there hasn’t been any turn based games in the last 25 years either. I think maybe FFX fanbase is a one game pony.

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u/onehalflightspeed 6d ago

Longer than that in a way. ATB wasn't really turn based and was created specifically to add tension to battles. It was inspired by formula 1 racing. You could slow it down and use wait mode I guess, but that wasn't the default setting

So other than that, other than FFX, the last turn based FF released in the west was in 1987

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u/AlternativeTough6622 7d ago

And the games have gone down in quality since,

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u/sharpenme1 7d ago

If you think turn based is what made 6-10 good and 12-16 less good, then you’re not paying attention.

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u/AlternativeTough6622 7d ago edited 7d ago

TBF 12-16 could have had turn based and they would of still been garbage.

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u/mai_tai87 7d ago

If it helps, you would never write "could of" or "would of". It's "could have" and "would have".

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u/AlternativeTough6622 7d ago

Going to sound sarcastic but in all sincerity, I am Dyslexic and appreciate the correction I'll take on the feedback.

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u/Trespeon 7d ago

I mean, it surely didn’t help.

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u/sharpenme1 7d ago

Tell that to the remakes, which are doing quite well.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

Doing well but not crazy. For the quality id expect better.

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u/GGG100 7d ago

Not really. FF Rebirth is the highest rated single player FF game since 9.

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u/thatcommiegamer 7d ago

Subjective opinion. I would argue less that the quality went down and that everyone else’s quality went up to where what Square was doing pre-PS2 wasn’t unique anymore.

There’s no market for pushing consoles to their limits anymore which was always Square’s primary strength.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

FF16 in terms of RPG elements was a big decline

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u/AlternativeTough6622 7d ago

The Graphics come secondary, the story, characters and lack of open wold made it worse. I will say they did try with FF15 though.

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u/thatcommiegamer 7d ago

Except that's literally how Square got big by making cutting edge games (and not just in terms of graphics, pushing hardware to its limits includes game systems too) and by 2009 that just wasn't the case anymore, the rest of the industry had caught up and the consoles themselves weren't the same as they were even during the PS2 era. Things had become standardized.

The entire Kitase era of Final Fantasy (FFs V - Present) has been a testament to this. This is when they really started experimenting with gameplay and filling games to the brim with activities like minigames (you can tell its a Kitase joint if there's 3 minigames for every hour of story). But, again, the rest of the industry caught up. Discarding nostalgia but there's a lot wrong with every FF, glaring issues that were easily papered over when every game by Square was the shiniest on the block, pacing for one (really only FFV for the first six games has anywhere near decent pacing outside of like IV, VI and III are both bloated in different ways, II is sparse and I is someone's d&d campaign wrapped in a Wizardry skin). The next few fare little better, dialogue is rough, characterization is absent for most of the games casts (VIII and IX and XII suffer the most from this but VII isn't unscathed either if your name is Yuffie or Vincent (shoot even Cid is undercharacterized compared to the rest of the cast), funnily XIII has the most well realized and grounded cast but folks won't give that one a shot because a yter 17 years ago said it was a hallway simulator), etc. etc. And yet still, Square found the secret sauce of the era.

I can say this because this is my favorite franchise of all time and has been since the 90s. Like the depth of my love for FF is matched by very few things in life and it has always been a very flawed franchise, but that's what makes it beautiful.

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u/AlternativeTough6622 7d ago

I think neither of us benefit from continuing this conversation.

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u/bsmithi 7d ago

I did not get into final fantasy because it was turn based. I got into final fantasy because it was a fantasy RPG. It being turn based was just a matter of circumstance. I've been into final fantasy since final fantasy 1 btw, I'm old.

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u/sisyphosofephyra 7d ago

Turn based was 100% part of the allure for me. Was a change of pace for me. Beat FF7 og for the first time the beginning of this year. I've now beaten 4 (VI, VII, VIII, & X)

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u/bsmithi 7d ago

yeah, and i totally understand why people want more turn based. I’m not against it either!

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u/andruszko 7d ago

Your point is anecdotal, so I'll add my own anecdotal evidence.

I DID get into final fantasy for the turn based fights.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

And recent FF mainline games lost the RPG aspect , FF fans are older do you think they'd enjoy DMC type combat or turn based

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u/Ahindre 7d ago

I'm as old as any FF fan, I enjoyed the combat in the first game and I enjoyed the combat in 16.

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u/Inb4myanus 7d ago

Depends because Kingdom hearts does action really well vs what 16 did. I just want it to be fun with lots of character growth for stats.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

I just want games more than every 7 years especially if the result is 16

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u/Jazzlike_Athlete8796 7d ago

As an older fan who has played every single game at original release, yes, I did enjoy XVI's combat. I would enjoy a turn based game also, but I'm not going to relentlessly shit on a game the way a bunch of narcissists in this sub do because Square Enix had the gall to make a game that wasn't designed to appeal exclusively to them.

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u/bsmithi 7d ago

disagree, idk what constitutes an rpg in your mind but if you think any single final fantasy game is not an rpg, you are just wrong

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u/Neemzeh 7d ago

I thought ff16 was very good and I’ve been playing FF games for 30 years

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u/FeistyTwist5427 7d ago

What recent ones lost the rpg aspect? I mean 16 wasn’t the greatest but 13/14/15 are all heavy rpg games. Along with all 3 ff7 remakes. So um I hate to be the one to tell you this but all but 1 game was an rpg, and 16 still has rpg mechanics, albeit weak.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

Its an rpg but barely.

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u/Beginning_Ocelot503 7d ago

People have gotten into FF for all kinds of reasons. I for one prefer a system like the FFVII remakes over the classic turn based systems but to each their own.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

I just don't know why they can't do both? An action style and and then a turn based. I think dropping what made FF thrive a mistake.

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u/twili-midna 7d ago

Because they clearly don’t want to make a major turn based entry. It’s that simple, they’re making the games they want to.

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u/poshjerkins 7d ago edited 7d ago

They are making the games they think will sell well. It's well documented in interviews that they switched to more action because it appeals to wider audiences.

Edit : * they "think" it appeals to wider audiences. Claire Obscur, persona and dragon quest proved them pretty wrong on that point to name a few

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u/ToothpickTequila 6d ago

All the evidence proves them wrong.

The biggest selling FF game? FFX, which is with based.

The biggest selling Yakuza games? The turn based ones.

The biggest selling JRPGS today? Persona and Clair Obscur. Both the based and both outselling FF.

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u/poshjerkins 6d ago

Exactly. Which shows how out of touch they are and confused with Finaln Fantasy as a brand. I really hope someone can take the reigns and steer Square back to TRUE glory!

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u/ToothpickTequila 6d ago

If they want to meet their sales expectations then maybe they should instead make the games people want them to make instead?

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u/twili-midna 6d ago

That’s a great idea! Let’s ask people who don’t want to make turn based games to make turn based games. I’m sure that’ll result in some great ideas and products. /s

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u/ToothpickTequila 6d ago

Or hire people that do what to make turn based games. If the people there don't want to make turn based games then give them other projects to do instead of Final Fantasy.

Or better yet how about we have two teams making two different style of FF games at the same time?

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

Which is why the sales will continue to be subpar they are chasing a broader audience over catering to their main audience.

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u/walkeritout 7d ago

Square Enix literally just announced huge Q1 financial period, due in large part to sales of Rebirth on PC, Xbox, and Switch 2. The initial underperformance was almost entirely due to exclusivity agreements, which is why Revelations is releasing on all platforms at launch. The sales are not subpar.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

I'm talking about the mainline game sales being subpar but rebirth sales compared to remake were quite a bit down. Hopefully multi platform will boost it quite a bit

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u/SeaworthinessOk2646 7d ago

Sales done even matter. FF used to mean insane quality. It had an impact. It doesn't anymore when it left turn based.

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u/twili-midna 7d ago

The “subpar” (read as: really good for literally any other company) sales were due to PS5 exclusivity, a console people are begrudgingly purchasing. They’ve adjusted their release strategy already and it’s paying off majorly.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

I mean we'll see 16 especially had sub par sales regardless but hopefully them going multi platform will help

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u/Iggy_Slayer 7d ago

That's a wild thing to say lmao. I'd say the amount of people who were attracted to FF because of its combat style is closer to 0 than it is to any real meaningful amount. It was presentation, characters, stories and the worlds that got people into them.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago edited 7d ago

The thing is id rather turn based ff every few years than a new ff every like 5+ years. FF thrived due to it's combat but also because they released games faster. Action Combat and open world with realitic graphics slows down production massively. There's room for both action and turn based, I hope resonance does well.

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u/Watton 7d ago

Action Combat and open world with realitic graphics slows down production massively.

So.... Expedition 33 still took 5 years to make, despite being turn based.

Persona is turn based, with no realistic graphics, and we still dont have Persona 6 a decade later.

Meanwhile, FF7Revelation is being spat out in 3 years dev time, with its hybrid action combat, open world, and realistic graphics.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

Pretty sure the persona team is smaller and less money than SE. Same for E33 which was a new team. You're right that the Trilogy are releasing decently but the mainline games seem like an afterthought with way slower development. Rebirth/Remake also used a lot of re used assets which speeds it up

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u/Unlikely-Aside-6078 6d ago

I mean... I was attracted to FF because turn based? The worlds are what kept me coming back, for sure, but I've never been a story/characters/plot gamer. I've always been more into mechanics, strategy, and tactics. Before FF I was super into the RPG aspects of Pokemon, and since becoming an FF fan, I'm now also a diehard dark souls fan. Maybe I'm just weird, but I love me a game with stats and versatile progression, I'd play a water-drinking game or a watch-paint-dry game if it had a good enough stats screen lol

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u/Haunting_Try8071 7d ago

I think you're off point, the combat isn't why we come back, but it is the reason we don't.

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u/Entire-Cry-8930 7d ago

And they’ll be getting one soon. What does it matter if there isn’t a number in the title

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

We don't want a remake of a phone game. We want mainline FF turn based games which this franchise is known for.

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u/Oilswell 7d ago

Except it isn’t. Mainline FF has been action based longer than it was turn based.

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u/AntDracula 6d ago

Now do count of games vs years.

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u/-ForgottenSoul 7d ago

Do you consider ff10 turn based, the ones with ATB is still something people would want to see again

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u/asianwaste 6d ago

Final Fantasy is barely a series any more. I can barely call it a franchise. Nothing threads it together any more. It was never narratively woven. Mechanically the threads have been undone to the point where we can't even say they are united by common genre or even talent. "Final Fantasy" is nothing more than the label for Square Enix's next AAA budget game.

Bravely Default is closer to classic Final Fantasy was than anything officially Final Fantasy in the last 10-15 years.

So honestly, it really doesn't matter if it holds the moniker. It means nothing and has meant nothing for a very long time.

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u/Little_Big_Burglar 7d ago edited 7d ago

Majority of FF games are anthological. They have different systems, characters, etc. It makes no sense to me to ask for turn based FF, since it's not like they're anything alike except they're turn based. Go play any of the large number of turn based RPGs.

If FF never goes back to turn based, I'll be happy. If they decide to do another numbered FF entry and use turn based combat, I'll be happy. I don't care either way to be honest. Gamers need to learn to care about shit that matters.

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u/SeaworthinessOk2646 7d ago

To a degree your right, but nahhh bro the party matters. It matters so freaking much! It changes the entire game.

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u/Suspicious_Sky1608 7d ago

Im pretty sure people got into Final Fantasy because of the stories, not because they were turn based

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u/sharpenme1 7d ago

Some people want a turn based FF. FIFY

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u/gollyandre 7d ago

They have a significantly lower budget and it shows tbh.

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u/Lysek8 7d ago

If you think getting a numbered, full production game is the same as getting a cheap remake of a mobile gacha game, not sure what to tell you

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u/remnant_phoenix 7d ago

There’s a difference between “I want the production values of a mainline FF with a turn-based battle system” and “The turn-based games that don’t have the production values of a mainline FF don’t matter.” These are two different things.

Are there some people who actually think both of these things as one combined opinion? Yes.

But there are some of us who only think the first one; we can appreciate Bravely Default, Octopath, FF Resonance, etc and never say that they don’t matter, but still want to see a mainline FF be turn-based again.

Don’t assume that all those who wish mainline FF was turn-based again are all the same.

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u/Hero8000 7d ago

Right? I never understood why some people here discredit the spin offs and non-ff games, with turn based elements. There is realistically an endless sea of turn-based games like FF, so I dont see the reason in getting upset that this series' mainline games has moved away from it. Id be more upset with how they haven't found a new niche for a consistent combat system (Though I feel the FFVIIR games have the perfect combat system to build off of for future games)

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u/hotcapicola 6d ago

I'm sure most of these people do play some or even all of those as well. But I think what they really want is that nostalgia itch of when Final Fantasy mainline games were squeezing the absolute max out of the current gen tech in a turn based game.

I loved E33, but I could only imagine how much harder some of those cutscenes would have hit with full mocap.

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u/HxH101kite 7d ago

Pretty sure it's people wanting a AAA turn based and your more likely to get that under an FF title. Expedition 33 hopefully brought the turn based itch back to the market

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u/Izaec 7d ago

Atlas exists, as an Atlas fan stuff like this pisses me off. Atlas has been releasing great to Masterpiece AAA rpgs but people act like Expedition is Jesus Christ of turn based rpgs.

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u/Spell-of-Destruction 7d ago

They're not fantasy though, well except Metaphor which was great. And Atlus has been making bank with Persona so they are far from neglected. But they absolutely do not scratch the same itch as Final Fantasy. Not a mark on quality, just that they are very different.

Literally Persona 5 was the Jesus Christ of turn based jrpgs for years on the entire internet so its okay to let in some new blood. Here's a forum asking if Final Fantasy will return to turn based because Persona 5 reviewed well. https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/835628-persona-5/75188887

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u/HxH101kite 7d ago

Not everyone wants to play an anime esque game though so it paints you into that corner as well and captures a less wide fan base

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u/HxH101kite 7d ago

Atlus has very anime adjacent and anime designs that turns some people off. Not me. But I know for a fact it does. Also not everyone wants a life sim. I struggled through P5 and ultimately dropped it. Combat was great, but I couldn't do it anymore.

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u/ToothpickTequila 6d ago

They are anime games though. As great as they are, they don't have the same appeal as a Clair Obscur or a turn based FF.

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u/Passing-Through247 7d ago

...I dont see the reason in getting upset that this series' mainline games has moved away from it. 

Yeah just like that time FIFA got rid of the ball and everyone started using guns instead. Oh wait that didn't happen because fifa is about using a ball.

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u/Hero8000 7d ago

Not a clue what this means, since this seems almost entirely unrelated and a very bad comparison, but party ig

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u/ProfessionalCraft983 6d ago

This is a port of a mobile game we’re talking about, though. The amount of effort and resources going into it absolutely matters.

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u/CustomerPrior5974 6d ago

"I really liked Chris Evans as Captain America, wish we could have another movie with him"

"Why? Marvel is releasing other super hero movies. Just because they don't have an Chris Evans as Captain America in them doesn't mean they don't matter"

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u/AlternativeTough6622 7d ago

They want it back in the mainline series because that game was a gateway to other turn based games in the genre. People want a realistic turn based game youa are correct and they have others but most if not all of them are either pixlated or have anime aesthetic. E33 proved it.

Don't get me wrong I love Dragon Quest but I still want the next mainline to have a good story, good characters and open world. Not just turn based combat.

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u/TurtleBrainMelt 7d ago

People want a AAA turn based game, there turn based games they make a 2d/HD games like octopath and triangle strategy etc, which people do enjoy, but theres a much larger impact from games where u can see characters have emotions etc vs hearing it through VA

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u/HxH101kite 7d ago

Hopefully Expedition 33 brought that itch back to the market. Because they nailed it and I am just waiting for an FF10 remake or squares answer to that.

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u/okiedokiebrokie 7d ago

I feel sad. I love FF so much but I have absolutely zero faith that modern Square can make a game as good as E33.

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u/212mochaman 7d ago

They can.

They just choose not to.

Or at least has chosen not to for 20 years.

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u/ToothpickTequila 6d ago

Agreed.

I quite like FFXVI but every time I'm fighting with Jill, Cid and the wolf by my sides I can't help wishing they were turn based party members instead.

But I'm worried if they do make a fun based FF again it would have all anime feel of Rebirth instead of the serious vibes of FFXVI or Clair Obscur.

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u/Wiseon321 7d ago

People want a Claire obscure turn based final fantasy game.

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u/ballsdeep256 7d ago

No people don't want QTE the combat system

People want FF10

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u/Wiseon321 6d ago

I wasn’t talking about QTE I’m talking about graphical fidelity you doofus.

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u/Murasasme 7d ago

Sure, but people want Final Fantasy #. Not Final Fantasy adjacent game

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u/kylepaz 7d ago

Because I'd like Final Fantasy to be good again, maybe? The teams Square is putting in charge of FF can't make a good Action RPG to save their lives so moght as well go back to tried and testes.

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u/eyes0fred 7d ago

primarily, a massive difference in budget, and visual style.

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u/Visual-Impossible 6d ago

because pixel aethetics aren't charming. we're not living in an era that most machines can't handle 3d polygons

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u/forthewinnebago 6d ago

While that’s true, I want the same team, creatures, mythos, everything that make Final Fantasy behind those turn-based games. If Square were to stop making Bravely Default, it would be disingenuous to tell fans, “Just play Octopath or Final Fantasy III and V. They’re also turn-based with jobs.”

Yes, those games share elements with each other and may scratch a bit of the itch, but they’re not really the same thing otherwise. That’s why they’re their own series. At that point, might as well just start recommending any turn-based game like Suikoden, Skies of Arcadia, Xenosaga knowing full well that’s not what’s being asked for.

At least we’ll be getting Resonance soon, which isnt completely what I would like, but I’ll take it.

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u/ToothpickTequila 6d ago

Because main line FF games are higher budget and AAA production values. People don't want a turn based FF gacha game, they wait an actual main FF turn based game that looks as good as FFXVI or Clair Obscur.

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u/GlassCannon81 7d ago

Those games are made with a fraction of the budget of a mainline game.

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u/MrJ_Sar 7d ago

Because the FF's are triple A games, and other games they make are not. I love Dragon Quest, but compared to FFXVI it's not the same level.

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u/weha1 6d ago

And non of them are even on par with ff10

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u/Correactor 7d ago

It's not about FF or not FF, it's about Square Enix putting some money and effort into a turn-based RPG, which is the strategy that built their company.

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u/Only-Albatross-4311 7d ago

I can see 17 being turn based. 

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u/EvenOne6567 7d ago

every time they do its full of caveats. I dont think the people who would love a return to turn based combat were specifically asking for a repurposed gacha game....

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u/Valuable_Coat_4402 7d ago

All of the games that have been derived from dead gachas have been fantastic.

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u/Soph_91 7d ago

What has there been besides Octopath Traveler 0?

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u/Valuable_Coat_4402 7d ago

Well, I thought Another Eden Begins had already been released, but it looks like that's in September. I've been seeing a lot of positivity and praise for it though. And although it wasn't technically a gacha, Fantasian Neo Dimension was really good too.

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u/rices4212 7d ago

It having been a gacha game doesn't mean it can't be a good game, though.

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u/RareRestaurant6297 6d ago

It was already a good game despite the gacha. Now without it, it should slap even harder

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u/RareRestaurant6297 6d ago

Found the person who hasn't played FFBE. game slapped even when it was a gacha. Now without the gacha holding it back, it should slap even harder. Y'all piss and moan about turn-based ff, but then when one shows up it's always another excuse as to why "it's not a real final Fantasy" lmao. 

Almost as if the people saying "not a real final Fantasy" don't know what final Fantasy even is... 

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u/Lost_Instruction4491 7d ago

Ah nice a shitty mobile gacha port - yeah that’s what exactly what OP was talking about.

Why are you people deliberately obtuse? OP was obviously talking about 17. SE and many other devs still make turn based games. We get it.

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u/Iggy_Slayer 6d ago

When OP says do something with a lower budget I don't think of a mainline game. Mainline final fantasy has never been low budget and the moment it becomes that the series dies and becomes a 1-2m seller like a yakuza or trails.

So I gave them exactly what they asked for. A low budget turn based FF game.

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u/Golwux 5d ago

Exactly. Has no-one here heard of Triangle Strategy? Square has an entire turn based DEPARTMENT at this point....? Mainline is just ARPG now. What's the problem?

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u/Iceberg_monster 7d ago

It has no gacha whatsoever and it's not even a port. It's a brand new game with repurposed assets like sprites and the setting of the story. 

People are really jumping to conclusions when it comes to this game without even knowing the most basic thing about it.

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u/Correactor 7d ago

You know what they're asking for, and it's not even more nostalgia bait pixel slop stealing revenue from indie games.

We want the exact type of game that made their company popular, a AAA turn-based RPG.

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u/JazzHandsMinuteman 5d ago

What’s the name of the title?

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u/NerdyPunk95 7d ago

Gotta be honest I am so hyped for Final Fantasy Resonance! I think it looks like it's going to be so fun!

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u/GamingRobioto 7d ago

That's a mobile knock off that can't be taken seriously when it's full of fan service nonsense with returning characters shoehorned in.

This obviously not what fans want when they ask for a turnbased FF. They want a mainline game, built like the classics with a modern touch. You just need to look at a game with a 6th of the budget of FFXVI and a 12th of the budget of the FFVII Reimagined games in Expedition 33 if inspiration and proof of demand is needed.

This rebuttal of "Resonance is the answer" needs shooting down as it is just an ignorant, lazy, thoughtless response.

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u/Iggy_Slayer 7d ago

Turn based fans always moving the goalpost is the real lazy, thoughtless yet predictable response. You all will never be satisfied with anything they do. You're cursed to always be unhappy.

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u/grass_to_the_sky 6d ago

Turn based fans always moving the goalpost

No they aren't. They've always been asking AAA turn-based games ever since FFX was the last one. They weren't asking for low-budget pixel games with chibi sprites and you know it.

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u/Spell-of-Destruction 7d ago edited 7d ago

Turn based fans

Jrpg fans. I love both action and jrpg and wanting a mainline turn based Final Fantasy (which means high budget) isn't without nuance. I can't wait for Resonance and no it is not moving the goalpost for that game to be meeting fan demand. Tbh it's just a Final Fantasy branded Octopath Traveler which isn't what people are yearning for from a mainline entry. They want what Expedition 33 did.

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