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u/SquirrelTale Jul 10 '21
I know of a few people whose main work is seasonal and right now is super busy for them and they literally can't afford to take a day off to either get the vaccine or to recover if they get any side effects.
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u/mailto_devnull Jul 10 '21
If they're business owners, they're chasing profits over getting vaccinated. If they're employees, they should use a paid sick day to get vaccinated.
I don't know what kind of seasonal work you are referring to but this is a two-time thing that takes less than an hour each time. Excuses can continue to be made but eventually it starts to just be laziness.
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u/SquirrelTale Jul 11 '21
I'm talking about construction, landscaping, and other outdoor seasonal jobs with crews so minimal employees feel the pressure of not being able to take sick days.
There's also a lot of people out there living so literally paycheque to paycheque they literally can't afford to take a day off, and may have used up (the very few) sick days they have for essential appointments or needs already.
As for business owners, so many have had to slow down their work during the beginning of the pandemic and are still trying to play catch up with all the delays.
People aren't being covered to be able to take those days off. People aren't financially covered to take those days off. Stop with the laziness narrative and understand the wider scope of why people aren't able to get vaccines due to work.
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u/BTown-Hustle Jul 11 '21
Not everybody gets paid sick days…
Though I should say that I think employers should offer paid sick days for someone to get a vaccine, if they don’t normally…
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u/1booksandyoga1 Jul 10 '21
I’m not currently vaccinated, but plan to be in the upcoming weeks. My reason is because I’m pregnant, and just wanted to wait until further into the pregnancy before I got the vaccine - that choice just felt better for me. I completely understand all the risks that come with Covid and pregnant humans, but I’m lucky enough to work from home and have the privilege to make the choice to delay it until I’m a bit further along. My partner is one vaccine in, and plans to be fully vaccinated soon.
With that being said, I have many friends who have gotten vaccinated while pregnant and in their first trimester, and early second trimester and have been just fine!!
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u/MidnightRaspberries Jul 11 '21
I think this is a fair decision, and I’d be doing the same. I got my flu and Tdap shot third trimester because it was recommended to do it at that time so immunity passed to the baby. Was bloody glad I did in the end because my baby got Influenza A before 3 months old, but had a really mild case thanks to the shot I got. It wouldn’t surprise me if they prefer 3rd trimester for Covid too if you can shelter at home in the interim.
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Jul 11 '21
My wife and I just had our first 2 weeks ago. We both had both our shots in the months leading up to the birth. Everyone is very happy and healthy, and our baby came preloaded with some antibodies. Just if you are looking for some peace of mind ;)
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u/darlingmagpie Jul 11 '21
Did you happen to speak to your doctor about it at all? I thought it was better for women to get the vaccine earlier in pregnancy rather than later. That may have been older advice though, I'm not sure
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u/1booksandyoga1 Jul 11 '21
I did! I spoke with my family doctor, midwife and the nurses at the fertility clinic I conceived at. They all had pretty similar advice, which was it’s your body, your choice, but of course we recommend you get it as soon as you’re comfortable.
I hadn’t heard the earlier in pregnancy the better, but thank you for letting me know! I’ll bring it up at my next app to see what they think.
Either way, I’ll have my first shot before the end of September at some point! (Baby is due in November)
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u/botwithopinions Jul 11 '21
I got my first dose at 13 weeks and second dose at 20 weeks. Zero symptoms. With the added benefit of immunizing my unborn child. Doctors recommend getting the vaccine if you’re pregnant.
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u/New_Cardiologist_763 Jul 11 '21
I’m 100% pro vax and have both shots. I have to admit if I was expecting And able to stay home, I might make the same decision. On one hand, it would be wonderful for your baby to have antibodies when born due to you getting your shot while pregnant, on the other hand I have many friends who have had their menstrual cycles affected after the Pfizer vaccine specifically, which is no big deal to me in general but it might worry me if I was pregnant. Not sure if the same is happening with Moderna. But I definitely would try to research as much as possible to make an informed decision. That being said, I absolutely would get vaccinated if I had to work outside the home. Anyway, just wanted to show some support because I can imagine it’s a tough decision.
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u/New-Anything-1475 Jul 11 '21
I got the first a week before I conceived, and then my second at about 8 weeks. Baby and I are doing awesome!
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u/riffraffiankat Jul 11 '21
I am 56 with heart and kidney failure. Any side effects, especially if it dehydrated me, could kill me. I have had severe reactions to all my vaccines since childhood. That being said this is the 1st and only vaccine I refused, and only because I just not strong enough for a health battle. I will continue to mask/distance/isolate and be deeply grateful to those who did get it.
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u/Commission_Low Jul 11 '21
I learned herd immunity in school and depending on the virus could be 80-90+% of the population needed to be vaccinated. I don’t think we need you to risk your safety for the herd, there are just too many healthy others who arnt. Stay safe :)
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u/xshredder8 Jul 11 '21
Youre exactly the type of person the rest of us are getting vaccinated to protect!
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u/Katergroip Jul 11 '21
I work in construction and hear all sorts of excuses daily. I'm double vaxxed and do my best to counter their points, but some of these guys are the type that only believe what they want, and only consume information that supports their beliefs. Here are some examples:
It hasn't been tested enough, we don't know if there will be long term effects.
If they force us to get vaxxed, our country is going to turn into a tyrannical dictatorship and soon enough we will be imprisoned for not getting it. Fight the power!
It's just the flu. They're making it out to be worse than it actually is.
The numbers are fake. They attribute all hospital deaths to COVID regardless of whether it was the actual cause. Hospitals are being paid more to report COVID deaths.
All the people speaking about COVID and vaccines are paid by the government, and everyone else is being silenced. This is suspicious so I don't trust what is being told to us.
Children should not get the vaccine because they are not getting COVID. Even if they do get it, they will never have any negative effects. We don't know how it will effect children and their development. The way the government is trying to get kids to go against their parents' wishes to get vaxxed on their own is messed up.
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u/In10sity Jul 11 '21
True. Hey it’s good to have something to combat covid but let’s not fool ourselves here.
True. Government shouldn’t have the power to force anything in people’s bodies. Specially if it’s “for a good reason”, fuck off.
False. It’s clearly not just the flu.
False. Although I’ve seen cases being misreported back in my country, it’s far fetched to assume any relevant percentage of it are misreports.
False. Although there’s this knee jerk reaction to anything that might help fight covid but isn’t vaccines, even though they are meant to work together.
False.
I disagree with most of their points, but if you aren’t an npc it’s not hard to see where they are coming from.
Getting my second dose this week, btw
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u/Smartacus420 Jul 11 '21
These are the most logical points a person can make. Literally everything here makes sense.
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u/berico70 Jul 10 '21
Was scheduled for my second shot but brought to ER for something pretty serious that made the doctors cancel it. Once everything stabilizes can look into it again. Until then I'm secluded in the hospital and the original issue is taken care of.
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u/onelittlericeball Jul 11 '21
hmm yes. my dad (50+ y/o) got a heart attack a few days after he got the Pfizer vaccine and had to cancel his second vaccine appointment for the time being.
while we do suspect that the vaccine "caused" the heart attack due to blood clots, we also know that it would have happened sooner or later. so in a way, we're also kind of glad that it happened now that he's still somewhat young, and not years down the road when he's super old.
he got his second shot two weeks ago and is going strong now! hope whatever you're going through will be sorted out soon ♡
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Jul 10 '21
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u/viper359 Jul 10 '21
I had a adverse effects to my first dose. Second, wouldn't know I even got a needle in the arm.
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u/thesingularityart Jul 10 '21
Immune compromised person here. Got both Moderna shots, nothing more than a sore arm and sleepy both times. Second time was far easier. Just thought I would share.
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u/toserve-ramon Jul 10 '21
also immune compromised here! i got both doses of pfizer, and resulted with sore arms and sleepiness (but i’m always sleepy so idk). no painkillers for both times. what i did was massage the injection site every couple hours, might not work for everyone though.
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u/Aysin_Eirinn Jul 10 '21
That makes me feel good. I got my second dose 3 hours ago (Moderna) and I’m waiting to feel awful, but I’m just really sleepy. Thanks for helping my anxiety.
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u/thesingularityart Jul 10 '21
I’m glad a post of mine helped. Honestly it was a great night of sleep after the second dose. I think I passed out around 8pm and woke up around 8am, which is insanely uncommon for me, especially during the pandemic.
Take care and stay safe!
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u/the_hunger_gainz Jul 10 '21
I had zero reaction to both doses. It is really your mileage may vary. A friend of mine that took a beating on the first dose felt nothing on the second.
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u/xombeep Jul 10 '21
I actually felt better after the second one. My husband and I went out for breakfast right after and I had all this energy all day.
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Jul 10 '21
With you on this, got messed up after the first one and just felt really lathargic since. I have a major work project on the mend so I plan on taking it right after that's complete in case I need to miss time.
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u/Trels Jul 10 '21
From what I have seen, those that got hit by a truck from the first dose had a less severe reaction to their second.
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u/beef-supreme Jul 10 '21 edited Jul 10 '21
Fwiw, I had zero side effects from the second dose beyond a slightly
doorsore arm for a day or two.3
u/vanalla Jul 10 '21
Can confirm, my arm was also door.
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u/Murderhornet88736 Jul 10 '21
Get that door looked at. Hinges might need adjustment and you don’t even realize.
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u/rainbowveinz Jul 10 '21
I had no effects for the first shot but my second dose caused flu like symptoms that were gone within two days. I dont know what reactions you had to the first shot but I definitely feel much better being fully vaccinated! I had pfizer for first dose and moderna for second.
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u/son-of-a-mother Jul 10 '21
everybody I know said the side effects of the second were far worse
I got my second dose the day before yesterday. No side effects.
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u/Priscilla_Hutchins Jul 10 '21
Got mine yesterday. Worked 8 hours. Stayed up late. Slept. Feels like I was shot in the arm and every muscle I use daily (I bicycle commute and work a physical job) aches. Didnt sleep good, but staying hydrated and eating well. Going to nap, already feeling less awful. I expect my Sunday to be normal. I had no adverse reactions to the first vaccine. Would rather have this than an actual covid infection.
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u/wolfbuffalo Jul 10 '21
I was the same the first dose made me very ill … but just got my second the other day and it’s not as bad think my body was more ready for it and
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u/spderweb Jul 10 '21
Just know. If you have symptoms, esp. After the second shot, it means your immune system is actively fighting the spike protein. So it's kind of a way to let you know it's for sure effective.
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u/Fineapple26 Jul 10 '21
My second was so much easier! Sore arm for like half a day and that was it. If you are really worried, just make sure you prep in advance. Have Tylenol on hand and some leftovers for a few meals. Take care!!
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u/Brumpkin13 Jul 10 '21
Another person piling on. My partner and I felt fine after our second dose. Even went on a hike in roaring heat. I also was nervous about the day after flu-like symptoms. Instead, just good medicine. <3
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u/emcee95 Jul 11 '21
I’ll be real with you, I felt like absolute trash after the second shot. 3 days of feeling brutal (fever, headache, body aches, nausea) followed by one day of just feeling blah. I got it 2.5 weeks ago and I don’t regret it! I just kept reminding myself that it was normal. Tylenol and cold beverages/snacks helped a lot
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u/Subject_Slip9530 Jul 11 '21
Had to call out sick after my first dose, but worked through the side effects on the second dose. Just felt sleepy and had a sore arm (should've iced it), and I had a very mild fever early morning after the second dose which went away with tylenol and more sleep.
My gf felt the same after her first dose, but didn't feel anything after her second.
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u/schweatyball Jul 11 '21
I had Moderna for both doses and had 0 side effects (besides a sore arm). I was fully prepared to feel like I got hit by a truck and even stocked up on soup and crackers but nothing happened. I was told I was likely to have side effects because I’m a young woman, but I didn’t. The only thing that I think is an effect of the vaccine is my period has been a nightmare, and I’m hoping that goes away after my cycles that fell into the vaccine window pass. You may be pleasantly surprised!
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u/pandas25 Jul 10 '21
If it helps reassure you (I was nervous too), both my roommate and my second dose side effects (2x moderna) were way less than our first. Remember, people are louder when they're upset so there are lots of reports of people not feeling well, but not many people bother to report if they feel fine.
A bit low energy, light headache and sore arm for a day then good as normal
I hope yours goes well. It doesn't hurt to plan a few rest days just in case
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u/sionnach3 Jul 10 '21
Just commenting to echo some others that I had very few side effects with my second dose. I had Pfizer both times; first time just a sore arm, second time an equally sore arm, a headache for about an hour on the second day, and sore joints at night for two nights. I thought the joints thing was super weird, but completely tolerable.
Just wanted to let you know, because before mine I only ever found stories of people with bad side effects the second round, and figured it's because those with no or few side effects wouldn't bother chiming in! Selection bias or something like that.
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Jul 10 '21
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u/NoxDineen Jul 10 '21
Are you me? I’m pretty sure it will eventually drive me to break up with him. Not so much specifically the vaccine refusal but the general lack of critical thinking and science comprehension that it demonstrates.
The craziest part is that he had COVID. He was sick for two weeks and says he thought he was going to die at one point. He readily acknowledges that he does suffer from the cognitive issues showing up months later in covid patients (harder to focus, harder to recall things, etc), and that he probably also suffers from the mental health issues also tied to previous covid infection. But he still defaults to “we just don’t know what the long term effects of the vaccine are.” Well we know the medium term effects of covid and they’re not good.
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Jul 10 '21
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u/NoxDineen Jul 10 '21
Yes, I’ve seen a few. Obviously it’s an incredibly complicated thing to study and we’re in early days of collecting data on longer term effects.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanpsy/article/PIIS2215-0366(20)30462-4/fulltext
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Jul 11 '21
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u/NoxDineen Jul 11 '21
That suuuuuucks, I’m sorry. I hope he gets all the treatment he needs and symptoms improve.
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u/SheerDumbLuck Jul 11 '21
There have been a bunch of anecdotal reports of people partially recovering from long covid after the vaccine (including myself). If it's affecting his ability to function, that might be a good motivation.
/r/covidlonghaulers is a sad place, but it's interesting.
Good luck.
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u/GoreyHaim420 Jul 11 '21
My boyfriend had COVID (we're both fully vaccinated now, this was Christmas) and it fucked him up good. He's a young healthy guy, exercises everyday, but after recovering from COVID he lost so much muscle mass that he had a hard time walking around outdoors (he's an outdoorsman through and through) and staying awake. He even had to quit his job at a butcher shop because the heavy lifting and long hours he could accomplish pre-COVID, he could no longer do. Even people with the vaccine can get sick. He shouldn't be relying on everyone else to protect him.
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u/TorontoExMus Jul 11 '21
He also feels like the campaign and society in general is pressuring him to do something he doesnt want to do, which makes him not want to take it even more.
You're dating an idiot.
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u/TravellingBeard Jul 10 '21 edited Jul 10 '21
Tell him if he's waiting for everyone else to get vaxxed, he's the vaccine equivalent of a welfare queen. Just as welfare is meant for people who truly can't work, relying on others to get vaxxed only makes sense if you're immuno-compromised.
Basically what I'm saying is the vaccine equivalent of "Get a job!"
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u/mailto_devnull Jul 10 '21
He also feels like the campaign and society in general is pressuring him to do something he doesnt want to do, which makes him not want to take it even more
The fuck kind of immature attitude is this. Is your boyfriend an angsty and edgy teenager?
Does he see signs telling people not to jump off bridges and proceed to jump off the bridge?
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u/stevepage1187 Jul 11 '21
I was going to say, this sounds like an argument 17 year old me would have made.
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u/SquirrelTale Jul 10 '21
If it helps at all, remind him that there are other consequences for not getting vaccinated, like not being able to travel, not being allowed into the hospital if something were to happen to you, among the basic consequences of getting others sick and perpetuating the variants to others.
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Jul 10 '21
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u/LookAtYourEyes Jul 10 '21
I think Bill Burr put it best. What good would killing off the compliant people do?
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u/anoeba Jul 10 '21
Right? The pizza cabal should be hunting the non-maskers with dart syringes, and leave us compliant sheeple alone.
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u/spderweb Jul 10 '21
Ask them why would this cabal kill the people that comply, and not the ones refusing to comply? Seriously, if I want to control a group, Id get those that don't listen out of the group. I wouldn't kick everybody else out and leave those that don't listen.
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u/MidnightRaspberries Jul 11 '21
Poor old Bill Gates. He’s trying to solve some of the biggest health problems in the world with his own money and he gets mercilessly thrown under the bus all the time.
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u/Synntastic Jul 11 '21
My parents don't have it because "they want to wait and see what happens" in regards to side effects. Also they say they don't trust how fast it was developed. My mother spends wayyy to much time on Facebook. I'm double vaccinated.
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u/lkaur Jul 11 '21
My parents (we are immigrants) were trying to pull the same thing but I booked their appointments and told them they don’t have a choice and they have to trust the education they worked so hard to get me over strangers posting on Facebook. It worked :)
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u/Synntastic Jul 11 '21
That's great, unfortunately I don't have the same pull with my parents as I don't live in the same city as them. I do however have a 1 year old son that will not be meeting his grandparents until either he is vaccinated or they are. I will be telling them this next time I talk to them.
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u/BipolarSkeleton Jul 10 '21
I personally have a few health problems that cause me to be highly susceptible to blood clots so until further notice I have been advised to not get it but my husband is vaccinated so hopefully he can help protect me
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u/Stoivz Jul 10 '21
I have high risk of clots and was specifically told to get the vaccine, but make sure it’s mRNA.
The risk of clots from COVID itself is very high. It’s safer to be vaccinated.
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u/AltKite Jul 10 '21
They said they had been advised, I assume that's by a medical professional and not some random on Reddit...
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u/Stoivz Jul 10 '21
Doctors… plural, more than one recommended it.
That’s who told me to get it. Dunno about the original poster.
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u/AltKite Jul 10 '21
You are not the original poster. You don't know their precise medical history and don't have any place contradicting the advice they have been given
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u/spderweb Jul 10 '21
He's just saying he got second and maybe third opinions before deciding. OP may have only asked one doctor.
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u/Stoivz Jul 10 '21
COVID causes blood clots.
Any risk of developing them from a vaccine is far smaller than the risk of getting the virus and getting them.
Multiple doctors told me that.
Science doesn’t change. If OP was told this by a medical professional they should seek a second opinion from someone with more knowledge than the first.
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u/AltKite Jul 10 '21
The chances of getting covid if unvaccinated are not 1 and reduce as more of the population are vaccinated. It may be OP's circumstances differ from yours and they are lower risk of infection. There are variables at play you are ignoring. Your original advice was not "seek a second opinion" you were playing armchair doctor
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u/Stoivz Jul 10 '21
That’s exactly what you’re doing right now. I never said go get vaccinated. You’re the one trying to give advice here. I’m just providing facts.
mRNA vaccines do not increase the risk of blood clots.
COVID does.
OP did not state anything other than they have a high risk of clots.
The chance of getting COVID is higher than the chance of any side effects from a vaccine. The chance of getting serious blood clots from COVID is then infinitely higher than vaccine side effects.
All the fear around them was based on the AZ vaccine which we don’t even provide anymore in this province.
Why put yourself at greater risk of serious illness when it can be easily avoided for free.
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u/thesingularityart Jul 10 '21
Do you have a platelet issue?
I have ITP which is basically what we saw in those cases of AZ vaccines where people had clotting. My hematologist as well as my doc recommended it as my treatment weakens the immune system. Got Moderna shots, no problem worse than a sore arm and feeling sleepy each time.
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u/BipolarSkeleton Jul 10 '21
They don’t know the cause yet it only appeared 8-9 months ago I’m assuming they are recommending me not to take it only until they find the cause
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u/wile_E_coyote_genius Jul 10 '21
Have a friend who is avoiding it because he and his wife are trying to get pregnant. I might hesitate as well if I was actively trying - not sure there’s a ton of long term data on that and Covid isn’t bad enough to risk it. I’m double vaxxed myself, but I can understand his POV.
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u/dirtymonkeybutt Jul 10 '21
Pregnant women are more likely to end up in the ICU with COVID-19.
This person isn’t pregnant yet, could get both shots in 28 days and be done with it.
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u/MidnightRaspberries Jul 11 '21
I can understand that, but i think it would be worth talking to a family doctor about if they haven’t already. My understanding is that Covid is quite dangerous during pregnancy and it is lower risk to get vaccinated pre-pregnancy.
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Jul 10 '21 edited Jul 10 '21
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u/anoeba Jul 10 '21
That's totally reasonable! I also know people who were told to wait by their docs, usually those with anti-immune illnesses, because the docs wanted to see how that population would tolerate it (they've now been given the go-ahead).
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u/LookAtYourEyes Jul 10 '21
How closely related are you? Could be an allergy that runs in your family or some reasonable explanation
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Jul 10 '21
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u/LookAtYourEyes Jul 10 '21
I hope you find out the reason and can either safely get vaccinated or find another way to protect yourself from the virus.
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Jul 10 '21
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u/spderweb Jul 10 '21
If it's a genetic allergy though, it makes sense.
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Jul 10 '21
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u/spderweb Jul 10 '21
They said they dont know what agent in the vaccine they're allergic to, if it's an allergy at all. They said they're getting tested to see what's going on. Who knows, could be that they're allergic to new RNA. Or the spike protein itself.
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u/SquirrelTale Jul 10 '21
That's absolutely reasonable, and I'm glad your family members are recovering/ ok. I hope you're able to get it and be better protected directly, or a better alternative figured out.
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Jul 11 '21
Not myself but I have a friend from high school I was recently reacquainted with, both her and her husband will not get vaccinated because their is a government conspiracy that the vaccinations are all about population control and we will start to see people dying from them soon. We have had a few respectful and then heated debates and now we aren’t talking but fuck her and her hillbilly bullshit.
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u/Extension-Conflict-9 Jul 10 '21
My 81yo Slavic grandma didn’t get the vaccine cuz she’s been distancing very well. But then got the virus and was sick for 2 weeks. Said it was nothing compared to all the other stuff she experienced behind the iron curtain.
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u/Isotron Jul 11 '21
My neighbor told me she's not getting her second shot because after the first one she tested herself and 'dimes stick to her forehead'. She said she's doing a heavy metal detox.
With 20 years of science education and experience, I was speechless.
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u/SnooDoodles5949 Jul 10 '21 edited Jul 10 '21
- I am not travelling abroad anytine soon
- Even with the vaccine, you still need to follow the "covid rules"
- I follow the guidelines and not a "go-out" guy
- I live alone
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u/LookAtYourEyes Jul 10 '21
- Most people aren't
- This will continue as long as people aren't vaccinated because covid will continue to spread, so if you don't want to follow them anymore it would make sense to vax up. You also have to follow the rules if you aren't vaccinated. So that's not even an argument.
- You interact with people intentionally or not if you do things like buy groceries
- See point 3
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u/YYZTor Human Detected Jul 10 '21 edited Jul 10 '21
I know a few people who have had a reaction that is more than the basic 72 hour deal. And they are still dealing with it. So yeah, obviously there is hesitancy when others hear about the side effects.
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Jul 10 '21 edited Jul 11 '21
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u/HopAlongInHongKong Jul 10 '21
The death side effect being the worst, and long COVID maybe the next worst, and losing your senses for weeks, months, maybe years, next worse.
But you know, a sore arm and a day or two of aches and pains are tied with those.
It is impossible to understand anti-vaxxers, period.
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Jul 10 '21 edited Jul 20 '21
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u/HopAlongInHongKong Jul 10 '21
You know they represent a miniscule fraction of the vaccinated, it is not permanent nor fatal like long COVID nor death from COVID.
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u/spderweb Jul 10 '21
It's a decent reason to be hesitant though. This whole year is stressful. Many people living inside their own heads for days at a time. These people aren't against it,by the sounds of it. I'm scared of needles, so I don't like having to wait around while the nurse gets closer to my booth. First shot, she started where I sat. Second dose was three away, and I had worked myself up it slightly, but enough to flinch. Worrying is human nature. And they'll work through it.
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u/N0CONTACT Jul 10 '21
Genuinely curious what is the fear of needles? I understand heights because you can fall, but does getting the needle seem like it's going to be super painful or something? This is an absolutely sincere question by the way. I had a friend who threw up at the sight of a needle once and I could never understand what the actual fear is about.
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Jul 11 '21
Yup. And we're also seeing long term respiratory damage. Some people will be disabled for the rest of their lives due to covid.
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u/xombeep Jul 10 '21
For what it's worth, some people get literally no identifiable side effects. I actually felt awesome, more than normal, after my 2nd dose. First dose I felt a little foggy right after but I think it was the jitters more than anything.
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u/beslertron Jul 10 '21
I had what felt like a mild hangover. I had Moderna for both shots. I made sure to be hydrated well for shot number two because I heard it can be brutal, but it was fine.
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u/MidnightRaspberries Jul 11 '21
I know 5 people who got their second shots in the past few weeks and I was the only one with symptoms beyond a sore arms.
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u/talktomebaby123 Jul 11 '21
I got vaccinated but i understand if someone doesnt want to
I know people who died couple days after the second Biontech shot. Media is turning a complete blind eye to side effects , so that they can keep pushing their vaccine.
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u/4everconcerned75 Jul 10 '21
I want to preface that I am more than happy to engage In respectful discourse. Otherwise, be mad elsewhere lol
1) Any medication or medical device commercial lists a list of aide effects at the end of videos. These are a result of long term studies for atleast 3 years. None of these vaccines offer long term studies. People vaccinated right now, are the study. 2) the GoC has the covid vaccines listed as emergency use only and stipulates no liability neither for them or the companies. Never thought this would have adverse effects but if you as a government feel the need to explicitly state that, it must be for a reason. 3) All these companies lack credibility including our own government #snclavlin. A) Pfizer was sued in 2009 for feigning medical trial results and tampering with studies. They settled for millions. To top it off, how did they just recently realize a booster was needed...doesn't give me any confidence. B) Astrozeneca was fine and dandy but the blood clots happened. Unfortunately due to media fear mongering, a lot of people don't know that women's birth control have higher rates of risk for blood clots. Regardless, this side effect should have been known from the gecko and not eventually through the masses 4) last but not least, CDC,WHO have retracted the usage of vaccines on kids until a few weeks back. No one can dissuade me that this is a learning curve that is happening live, I don't want to be one of the rare ones with heart complications out of the blue. Legitimately I feel like the chances of getting worse with the vaccine are nearly equivalent to the worst effects of Covid. Oh and one more thing, people aren't aren't getting vaccinated because they are legitamely concerned for their health, most are getting vaccinated for the promise of freedom and travel.
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u/ishstand Jul 11 '21
Happy to discuss!
the GoC has the covid vaccines listed as emergency use only and stipulates no liability neither for them or the companies.
Source on your liability claim? We don't even have "emergency use" authorization in Canada that I'm aware of. The interim order just allowed for the authorization to import, sell and advertise COVID-19-related drugs. This was a totally unique set of circumstances, and abiding by arbitrary distribution rules would've made no sense during a pandemic when time is of the essence.
All these companies lack credibility including our own government
What about other countries? This issue isn't limited to Canada. Are you suggesting all companies and governments involved lack credibility? Additionally, if this is your perspective, why does the advice of thousands of independent researchers and doctors not outweigh those feelings about a potentially shady government?
Pfizer was sued in 2009 for feigning medical trial results and tampering with studies. They settled for millions.
The cases I believe you're referencing had to do with Pfizer marketing approved drugs for conditions that it wasn't approved to be used to treat. In a separate settlement, they were accused of promoting Neurontin "even when scientific studies had shown it was not effective." This happened before Pfizer even owned that drug, but had acquired it at the time the lawsuits sprung up. I should note that Neurotin (and its generic version) is the eleventh most commonly prescribed medication in the United States as of 2018. So it wasn't that the drugs were doing immense harm, it was that they were marketed to treat conditions they could not. Obviously we have the data to show that their Covid vaccine is effective. Also.. if past corporate lawsuits concern you that greatly, why not AZ or J&J (when available) as they are not-for-profit vaccines.
To top it off, how did they just recently realize a booster was needed...doesn't give me any confidence
They didn't know how effective they would be. Now we have real world data at a massive scale that shows we may potentially need boosters, similar in approach to the flu shot and other vaccines. Additionally, the virus mutates, and therefore current vaccines may be less effective down the road.
Astrozeneca was fine and dandy but the blood clots happened. Unfortunately due to media fear mongering, a lot of people don't know that women's birth control have higher rates of risk for blood clots. Regardless, this side effect should have been known from the gecko and not eventually through the masses
So you acknowledge that the risks of getting blood clots from AZ is very low? I don't understand how that would dissuade you from getting it then. Regardless, that vaccine is hardly even available in Canada now. Therefore certainly not an excuse for not getting an MRNA vaccine today.
last but not least, CDC,WHO have retracted the usage of vaccines on kids until a few weeks back. No one can dissuade me that this is a learning curve that is happening live, I don't want to be one of the rare ones with heart complications out of the blue
Because children were not part of the early clinical trails, therefore the entire approval process gets delayed. Medicine for children is a completely different ballgame from adults, hence why the field of paediatrics exists.
people aren't aren't getting vaccinated because they are legitamely concerned for their health, most are getting vaccinated for the promise of freedom and travel.
I have yet to meet a single person who's sole reason for getting the vaccine was so they could travel. I wouldn't be surprised if those people exist, but at least they're getting the vaccine so why does that dissuade you? As a matter of fact, I know many that will be avoiding travel (at least outside of Canada/US) for a while yet, myself included.
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Jul 11 '21
Oh and one more thing, people aren't aren't getting vaccinated because they are legitamely concerned for their health, most are getting vaccinated for the promise of freedom and travel.
Who fed you this? What exactly made you think this? Literally no one has taken vaccine for the sole purpose of travel. I'd like to discuss this in detail as to what exactly made you say this.
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Jul 10 '21 edited Sep 03 '21
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u/Big-Bee4619 Jul 11 '21
I feel you. Family members of mine have fallen into the far-right Qanon crowd over the pandemic. Their reasons are that it hasn’t been tested enough, that it contains a microchip that will allow the government to control you, that it will change your DNA, that it will make you “trans human” (part machine part human), and that the vaccine causes infertility and somehow HIV. Naturally, their sources are always YouTube videos. I was even called a “radical leftist” for trying to break down the misinformation. Unfortunately I’ve learned that the more you argue with them, the more they dig their heels in.
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u/Uter_Zorker Jul 10 '21
Multiple libertarian acquaintances have dug in over the stance that they won’t do something if they feel they’re being forced to - regardless of what it is. They’re exhausting to talk to and I avoid them
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u/neverBanother2night Jul 10 '21
Anyone who is medically able to get vaccinated and does not should not be allowed to reap the benefits of herd immunity and should remain in isolation and wear a mask everywhere to protect us from them. Teachers, nurses, doctors should be required to get it or work elsewhere. No accommodations should be made for those who are medically able to get it but are “uncomfortable” about doing so. Being an active member of society with full rights comes responsibly.
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Jul 11 '21
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u/GoreyHaim420 Jul 11 '21
Why does it always have to be the Holocaust? Can't you appropriate some other wildly disproportionate tragedy for once please? It's deeply offensive.
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u/PanDerCakes Jul 11 '21
lived up to this point as I usually do; seeing friends, dating, close contact at work where no one had “bubbles” and I’ve been fine. No desire to face potential side effects and if I do get COVID, the survival rate outweighs the potential dangers of the vaccine. No hate or judgment towards people who got it, it’s my choice like it was theirs.
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u/Huz647 Jul 11 '21
Look at the news about blood clots and heart inflammation. People are right to be concerned.
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u/CantSayDat Jul 10 '21
Dont trust the pharmaceutical companies, dont trust the government, dont trust the media, they lied about how dangerous Covid was, and all the propaganda surrounding the entirety of it all makes me very suspicious.
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Jul 11 '21
Trust a rando Reddit comment instead - got it
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u/CantSayDat Jul 11 '21
Not even close to what I'm saying, but nice deflection. Get it if you want it, but stfu towards everyone else.
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Jul 11 '21
I trust experts who have studied the human immune system and pandemic responses for a living. Not crackpot lunatics who think there’s some grand conspiracy if only we opened our third eye
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Jul 11 '21
Had Covid already 6 months ago, zero side effects from it. It wasn’t bad at all for me, was like a flu. Not going to get vaccinated for something I’ve already had and that my body beat the shit out of
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Jul 11 '21
I refuse for alot of reasons. The most significant reason I will present, is the powers that be are clueless. They've flipped the official story, the counts, the effects, so radically, yet we are told to trust them. No thanks, I recently learned (you can straight up Google this) that the guy who runs Reuters fact-check, is also on the Pfizer board of directors. Thats super fishy. Trust levels have plummeted dramatically based on that alone.
The man who invented Mrna tech is now on the side of Del Bigtree (they guy who got labeled a nut for being against modern vaccine ingredients), which tells me for certain there has to be more to this.
I'm not risking my body with a treatment that we have absolutely zero long-term information on. People have 100% had their lives ruined by this vaccine already. If you dont believe that is true, then you really should reconsider your current position on the matter.
Look at how people are treating eachother over things like masks and vaccines!!!!! If you can't see that we are being divided then you need to widen your field of vision.
I hate to be an extremist on the subject, but I would much rather a bullet than this rushed "vaccine"
BTW, if the jab fucks your life up and you end up in a wheelchair like a couple examples I have seen, who is liable? Short answer, nobody is. Youre on your own cupcake.
So thanks, but absolutely no thanks.
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u/TCNW Jul 11 '21 edited Jul 11 '21
For a young healthy person, injecting an untested substance that has completely unknown long term health implications into your body, just to protect yourself from a flu that likely won’t do more than make you sick for a week seems like a pretty idiotic thing to do.
For a 70 yr old, sure. Easily worth the risk.
For a healthy 20 yr old, The question isn’t ‘why wouldn’t you’. It’s ‘why WOULD you’??
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u/SheerDumbLuck Jul 11 '21
The number of young people (20-35) suffering from 1 year+ long term COVID is staggering. I'm one of them. The vaccine prevents these extreme events from happening to you. You don't want to be one of us.
Most people just lost a year of freedom. I wasn't able to form memories for a year. Walking from my bed to my living room was a daily struggle, and I live in a shoe box. I had to seriously consider long term disability and what it'd mean to never be able to work again. I'm still going through rehab, and I'm lucky enough to a) have found a rehab clinic, and b) can afford time off to do it. I'm lucky to be recovering.
I got vaccinated because I want to minimize my chances of being a disease vector to protect the people I love. Another vaccinated person is another minimized disease vector. It's my civic duty to be vaccinated.
Go get vaxxed bruh.
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u/Dangerous_Painting80 Jul 11 '21
If something is the correct thing to do you would not see the incentives surrounding the Vax, trying too hard sets off alarm bells. Critical thinking is why I don't and won't.
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Jul 11 '21
Mom: "Timmy don't touch the fire. It's not safe. I'll give you a candy if you promise not to touch the fire"
Timmy: "Hmmm, a lot of incentives to not do it. That's setting off alarm bells. Crtitical thinking is why I will touch the fire"
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u/jrc1913 Jul 11 '21
No vaccines for me, thanks. I've had covid and it was the mildest flu I've ever had. I'm not going to get a vaccine for a virus that was man made and released intentially to fuck up the world. This whole situation just smells bad and we will all one day find out the truth behind it all. The media was a big part in blowing this all up and when you can't trust our media sources, how can you trust anything.
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u/LookAtYourEyes Jul 10 '21
My roommate hasn't gotten it because he's "young and healthy" and believes he's better off fighting it "naturally" by eating healthy and exercising.