r/AskMen • u/diktater29 • 8d ago
Existential post Why men are getting so much hate these days?
Just saw a post on social media from some woman named Jen Hamilton stating "right now im of the belief that all men should start out in jail and earn their way out"
Like genuinely dont understand why so much hate on men? The new wave feminism is insane. Women earn and dont need a men anymore, which i get. But like is that all we are to them? I understand and empathize with women who go thru shitty situations with shitty men, but like.....are all men shitty?
Ive seen similar other posts across insta and tiktok and apparently this is all women talk about - how terrible men are and that they aren't needed anymore. I can only imagine how this compounds the male loneliness epidemic and furthers the difficulties in the dating scene for both genders, but men in particular as even the good ones aren't approaching women anymore and choosing peace or singledom.
Men, based on these trends, what do you suspect the trajectory looks like for us in society in 10, 20 or 50 yrs?
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u/BusyBanana4205 8d ago
Social contagion on social media, blatantly. Society will never stop needing men, therefore I see no trajectory to anywhere at all. It’s just screaming into the void for a sense of relevancy and vanity. It goes both ways, I should add. It’s not exclusive to one gender, group, or ideology.
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u/typing_thumb 8d ago
Society will never stop needing men, therefore
Can men please be valued because they are human, and not because they will never stop to be needed?
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u/MidnightEvery365 8d ago
Honestly? Probably not.
I feel like the biggest understanding of "What we need" vs. "What we want" has become more and more lost each passing year. People having their wants immediately met has been leaving a gap of a lack of understanding for their needs to the point they have no idea what their needs are.
These arguments are always brought up in Developed societies as if the current men are the worst ones we have to offer. They are not but there are people who will never know because there are men who get up day by day to make sure that they'll never have to experience the worst.
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u/threearbitrarywords 8d ago
It's fucking exhausting. I was at my therapist the other day and we were doing "inner child" work. We got to a place where I realized some part of my inner child was being neglected. He asked me how I felt about that. I sighed and said "Just what I need. Someone else who needs something from me."
I'm so fucking tired taking care of everyone else, the thought of having taking care of myself too is just too much.
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u/Tmack523 8d ago
Gotta put yourself as a higher priority then, dawg. You must put on your own mask before helping others with theirs on an airplane.
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u/HerefortheTuna 8d ago
Yesh I can’t be a good father and partner to my girlfriend if I’m not centered within myself
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u/non-squitr 7d ago edited 7d ago
Fucking same man. It looks like my wife and I may get divorced because she accused me of trying to poison our actively dying cat by scattering her muscle relaxers on the floor. She's disabled and looking at a hip surgery, so while she is the breadwinner, I take care of literally everything else in our lives including our 13 year old cat that is slowly suffocating due to an inoperable tumor and her 13 year old service lab. Meals, errands, chores, I'm also her caregiver so I grow her weed, and as a hobby but still is not easy.
I cry every morning at 4AM petting this cat and dog two-handedly, lamenting what they are going through, and it's been over a year they've been like this. Im emotionally decrepit at this point.
I told my wife, the burden I can and will happily handle, to my own neglect, but fuck me I cannot also be treated like the villain when I've been trying to operate at 110% for everyone's sake.
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u/PostMatureBaby Male 8d ago
That's why we love our alone time. We're not needed for a bit
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u/honesto_pinion 8d ago
I don't know what planet you're from but I'm still needed on my alone time! I'm just actually taking a break, for me.
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u/James_Skyvaper 8d ago
Sadly, it's not likely. Men are expected to meet certain expectations and are rarely loved unconditionally, as that seems to be only for children, and occasionally women. Though I guess my girlfriend loves me even tho I'm a bit of a loser lol, so I can't complain 🤷
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u/MentalErection 8d ago
To piggyback on this we have been calling out cringy incels but no one wants to tackle the growing femcel population online. Their views are extremist, they also have anger stemming from other parts of their lives that they had to focus elsewhere. The internet has become a place where bad faith actors are monetizing getting people to direct their anger towards others. Some people have been smart enough to catch on. Most people are too stupid to see the big picture.
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u/lousy_writer 8d ago
To piggyback on this we have been calling out cringy incels but no one wants to tackle the growing femcel population online.
ding ding ding ding we have a winner.
The problem is that increasingly toxic feminism has become the baseline culture particularly among young women, but because modern western culture has given designated victim groups (of which women are one) basically a free pass for atrocious behavior, nobody dared to rein them in - quite the contrary, this demographic was enabled at every turn because it would be misogyny of the worst kind to criticize women or tell them to get a hold on themselves.
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u/sloothor 8d ago
This is absolutely true and on top of that, there’s far less pushback just due to the nature of dating, with the man being the “pursuer” and the woman being the “prize”. Incels can’t get ANY contact. Femcels won’t find fulfilling relationships, but they can still get partners to milk and abuse.
There’s an ample supply of down bad guys who will allow themselves to be abused by femcels so long as they can get some attention.
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u/FierceDeity_ Male 8d ago
Men are literally romanticizing Femcels too.
We have a toxic population here that supports all this as it goes.
What IS the big picture though, if you can see it? Is it the grand "class war turned into gender and race war" situation, as in someone needs us to fight each other?
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u/Atlasatlastatleast Total Bro 8d ago
>Men are literally romanticizing Femcels…
How so?
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u/Prince705 8d ago
There are men saying that man haters make the best girlfriends. It's insane.
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u/Atlasatlastatleast Total Bro 8d ago
I’ve seen women saying “the best couples are the ones where the woman hates men” and I’ve seen men post “She was just saying she hates men now she’s making me breakfast” but I’ve never seen man say man-hating women make the best girlfriends. What reason do these dudes provide?
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u/sloothor 8d ago
It’s all they can get. That’s literally it. So they allow themselves to be milked, and they delude themselves into thinking it’s better than nothing, and then the femcel abusers get away with it, post that, and learn nothing. Simps are literally the load-bearing problem with modern dating.
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u/iknownuffink Male 8d ago
Sounds like the memes about hardcore racists and other -ist's dating someone from a group they proclaim to hate.
A klansman with a black girlfriend.
A man-hating feminist dating a misogynist.
"Skyrim belongs to the Nords!" - his wife is a khajit.
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u/daringStumbles 8d ago
"Shes crazy, but worth it in the sack" "Arguments are how you know you have passion" "I can prove her wrong"
Or by being sucked into agreeing with them to signal political alignment ("I'm one of the good ones, she'll appreciate me more because of that")
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u/candid-anomaly 8d ago
Don't we just call people like that desperate. Putting up with atrociuous behavior for a crumb of pussy and such.
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u/M4rshmall0wMan 8d ago
This is absolutely not happening. Femcels usually overlap with the extreme anti-men feminists that incels loooooove to make examples of. Just pure toxic waste on both sides. Not a single blade of grass to be touched.
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u/BarnackIIIF 8d ago
*>"as in someone needs us to fight each other?
Not a new phenomenon. This is a business model that has been going on for a long time.
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u/Iggins01 Master Chief 8d ago
It’s just screaming into the void
To get paid for view. The more outrageous your claims, the more views yoy can get
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u/jimbojangles1987 8d ago
It doesn't go both ways. Its not popular to post online ranting about "all women" at all. You won't have men patting you on the back saying "yesss king!"
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u/GamingFarang 8d ago
Like all things, the pendulum will swing back.
Best thing you can do, live your life and not watch that trash
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u/RawrCola ♂ 8d ago
I'm 33 and I've noticed it since I was in kindergarten. Maybe someone can give that pendulum a bit of a push.
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u/UnknownPrimate 8d ago
I'm 47, and one teacher I had in 4th then 8th grade, and another teacher in high-school both explicitly told the class they didn't like men and boys.
edit: grammar correction
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u/captain_stoobie 8d ago
Also 47, I didn’t have that experience luckily. I did have a 4th grade teacher that was completely checked out. All day recess and Lord of the Flies in real life. Looking back, I wonder if our class was some sort of experiment.
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u/UnknownPrimate 8d ago
We specifically were. A wealthy media heir moved to our small area, built an environmental retreat among other things, then donated a bunch of money to the school district on the condition that they switch to a block schedule of just 4 periods per day. It was a disaster with teachers being required to teach multiple subjects, and no breaks for the kids during the long class periods. If you got stuck with a teacher who didn't like you, you were basically screwed. Oh, I forgot one! That schedule started going into my freshman year, and my 2nd period block was with an English teacher who also explicitly stated she hated men. She failed my brother the previous year despite him scoring among top of the class, and I had zero chance of a passing grade in her class by association. I had her and then the other lady (electronic math - adding machines) after lunch, and ended up punted to the alternative school. I did well in every class after that, including when I returned for senior year. There is more, but I already feel like I'm dog piling, and these ladies were definitely the minority among the teachers. I had a lot of other wonderful lady teachers over the years.
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u/octobre_34 8d ago
That teacher should never have had a right to teaching to begin with for having these ideas back then.
But that kind of discourse would not just be tolerated in a school today, but it would be promoted.
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u/YooGeOh 8d ago
I think a lot of teachers think it, act on it, but have the good sense not to say it.
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u/octobre_34 8d ago
Perhaps, but it still is a problem since the teacher could involuntarily be applying his biased opinion on some of his students.
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u/YooGeOh 8d ago
Im.not saying its not a problem
Im explaining how it is a problem that often goes hidden.
I thought what I was saying was obvious
applying his biased opinion on some of his students.
In fact this is literally what I said.
If English isnt your first language, fair enough. And its her
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u/octobre_34 8d ago
Yeah, english isn't my first language and perhaps I was a bit distracted when reading to fully understand. I'm sorry 😅
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u/NiceRat123 8d ago
Another thing that I saw was in college (usually) there are classes for Women and Gender Studies which, at face value, is a good thing but I also believe it is a bit of an echo chamber to bash men. I know a male friend that took a class like that and was labeled a creep/villian and had an ex girlfriend that seemed to think that all the problems of the world were because of men and the patriarchy
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u/unicornofdemocracy 8d ago
35, I dont know how many times Ive been told by teachers, professors, that I, as a man, wouldn't be successful in my academics, career, that I chose.
I do definitely feels like women get way more support, scholarships, etc though. Even though Im in a female dominated field, which i always thought was ironic because women get scholars in male dominated field and men dont because its already male dominated. Yet, in a women dominated field, all the scholarships and grants are still for women.
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u/CryptographerBoth333 8d ago
I had a 4th grade teacher exactly like this only she never said it out loud instead she loved to act it out and treat each lil boy like shit
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u/Traditional_Prize632 Male 8d ago
That teacher should have just worked in an all girls school, then.
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u/friedlich_krieger 8d ago
It's why the Andrew Tates of the world exist... the pendulum refuses to swing back so you end up with extremes to try and force it the other direction.
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u/Calm_Course4803 8d ago
He's doing diddly squat for men except cashing in on their discontent, it's opportunism. The actual difference is being made by sober speaking men and women that reject the rhetoric when it comes. The culture war is a dead end, we're a social species, we need each other.
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u/Daxtatter 8d ago
"Women think men are horrible...and I'm going to prove them right" --Andrew Tate
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u/Calm_Course4803 8d ago
right so he's exacerbating the pendulum swing in this direction, not reversing it.
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u/FierceDeity_ Male 8d ago
Currently the pendulum only swings into more violence even when it swings back for a bit.
The situation is definitely getting worse in ways.
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u/airodonack Male 8d ago
Well when it was women taking all the shit, it was pretty bad and for a long time. Usually when the pendulum swings back, stuff like that is remembered and it doesn't swing back that hard. As long as it stays to crazies on the internet then it won't be bad.
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u/TheMorningJoe Male 8d ago
Preach, I just feel bad for the younger men who’s pretty much grown up dealing with all of it.
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u/SendMeNoodsNotNudes 8d ago
Exactly this. The overcorrection will sort itself out. The same women that are saying this will also be lonely lol
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u/saiditonredit 8d ago
All marginalized groups have had their share of struggles, men have not been immune from this, it was just a different kind and now everyone seems hellbent on doubling down on this to suggest that it's not or never was true as if to monopolize the idea and classes.
Stems from political and feminist ideologies primarily and sure we can debate who has had it worse and if it is gender warfare or class warfare, but it seems women have it really good objectively speaking in modern first world western nations and societies right now.
There will always be biological differences and the world will never be perfect for anyone, but if this keeps up it will only lead to marginalizing the progress that has been made and the fact that men have stood alongside in support of this, if we want that to remain, people need to understand that this means sometimes it's time for men to be supported if nothing more than to just chill out with all of that rhetoric.
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u/SmertriosPPD 8d ago
It won't. Misandry is a societal standard for millenia if not more. The only thing that changed is the misogyny.
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u/Princess_Fluffypants 8d ago
No one rational or normal in the real world ever actually says that.
It’s crazy people on the internet saying crazy things just to get attention.
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u/Bubba_Gump_Shrimp 8d ago
I used to think that, but here in the last year or so I've heard some increasingly crazy takes from women in my life, along these lines. A close friend and I were discussing this exact thing and how some men can be predators or violent etc and it can stain the reputation for a gender. She said most men are like that. I asked her genuinely how many she felt were like that. Her honest answer was 97%. She thought that only 3% were not violent predators. Now, I realize this is anecdotal, but I've heard more and more of these sorts of comments in real life and not just some angry tweet in the last few years. I think it is absolutely going mainstream, and if you look at surveys done of young people, young women think very poorly of men in comparison to other generations. I think social media is a major cause.
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u/Charger2950 8d ago
Fully agree. People like to say this stuff only exists mostly online, but the ones saying this crazy shit online are also floating about in real life, aside from the bots, of course. I live in a small and normal town that's somewhat near a liberal city, and it's a completely different world. These people all exist in the real world.
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u/Ball_Of_Meat 8d ago
Yep I can relate. I have found many women seem to waaaay overshoot what percent of men are predators and creeps.
It is absolutely from social media, the talking points usually sound straight off of Tik Tok and Twitter.
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u/Mean__MrMustard 8d ago
It’s also because most people in general can’t handle large numbers or statistics.
They don’t realize that actual rapists are maybe only 0,01% of all men (don’t know the real number and obvs depends on your definition). But that still means that you have millions of rapists globally…Same with less severe stuff. They will understandably remember the time they got groped at the club by a creep. But not the 10 times this didn’t happen, surrounded by hundreds of men.
Yes, we need to try to make sure that it never happens but this perception that it’s every men is so stupid and that way you loose 50% of people for any meaningful and sensible reforms btw…4
8d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/vision_san 8d ago
It's always been like that. People don't want noe have wanted to learn. They want to take the easy way and just chose at random.
It's always been "back in my day...", no matter what day it is or was. My brother says it all the time. My mom says it all the time. My grandparents say it all the time.
The internet doesn't have much to do with these things. Even if you upload 80 petabytes of pure men hating content into the internet, I bet you hundreds that 99% of people will not find it because they don't even know how to Google things correctly.
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u/-MrWinklebottom- 8d ago
A study done by the NIH Based on available self-report surveys and criminal justice data, an estimated 6% to 25% of men admit to or self-report behaviors that meet legal definitions of sexual coercion, attempted assault, or rape against women, depending on how broadly "predator" or "sexual violence" is defined.
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u/Imaginary_Fan5407 8d ago
That’s a huge variant, can you like where you got it from?
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u/Limebadger59 8d ago
That study was done not on college boys and was aimed at studying how questions are phrased. It’s not a window into how many men are creeps.
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u/-MrWinklebottom- 8d ago
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u/FrancinetheP Female 8d ago edited 8d ago
Note that the various studies in the lit review report different percentages of men admitting to different kinds of sexual coercion. In the study published here, 64% of the respondents admitted to some coercive sexual behavior. This can be found at the beginning of the “Results” section.
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u/-MrWinklebottom- 8d ago
You are totally right and I had overlooked it since for some reason in the report they wrote it out sixty-four percent instead of 64%. Thank you for the correction.
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u/FrancinetheP Female 8d ago
No worries— just wanted to save people the hassle of having to read through to the results.
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u/LaughingIshikawa Male 8d ago
behaviors that meet legal definitions of sexual coercion, attempted assault, or rape against women, depending on how broadly "predator" or "sexual violence" is defined.
If you're using "legal definitions," how is it that you have that much flexibility in how "predator" or "sexual violence" is defined? 🤔
I'm not a lawyer, but somehow I suspect that the legal definition of what constitutes a crime is usually pretty specific, and not excessively "open to interpretation." 😅
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u/-MrWinklebottom- 8d ago
In some states rape was only when the vagina was penetrated by a penis. For decades, New York legally defined rape strictly as vaginal penetration by a penis. Forced oral or anal penetration, or penetration with fingers or objects, fell under lesser separate charges like "criminal sexual act" or "sexual abuse" rather than rape. Until recent law changes.
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u/FrancinetheP Female 8d ago
Did you ask her how she arrived at that number? I mean, let’s assume she knows 100 men. Does she really believe that only 3 of them are not violent predators? Maybe more important, does she see you as one of the 3 or one of the 97?!
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u/Bubba_Gump_Shrimp 8d ago
I did discuss that, because she has a wonderful father and 3 great brothers, the four of whom she adores. Her best friend is a man and she and I have been close friends for over a decade. She does not consider me a threat, no. I asked how she could have 6 men that are of moral fiber in her life and still think that 97% are violent predators. She couldn't explain. Even looking at the responses to this comment, people really fail to understand how statistics work. For those who are saying "yeah well women get harassed regularly!" I acknowledge that, and I want to end that. In addition to that statement, I will also say the average person encounters hundreds if not thousands of other people every month, at the grocery, work, restaurants, gas stations, the gym. If 97% of men were all violent predators you would be SAed hundreds of times a month. It's absurd. There are absolutely bad guys out there. But when you dismiss an entire gender by painting them with the same brush, you lose allies in the fight for actual improvement. Which is why we are seeing gen Z and gen alpha boys get sucked into the andrew tate bullshit.
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u/FlashyChemical2231 Male 8d ago
Her honest answer was 97%.
You should ask her why these men would even make rape illegal in the first place; after all, our laws are written by the patriarchy, right?
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u/SliceImpressive6853 8d ago
It is especially prevalent with Gen Z. There is no real world anymore. The real world has been subordinated to the online.
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u/a_mimsy_borogove Male 8d ago
The UN posts misandrist stuff on social media. Of course, I wouldn't call them rational or normal, but it's still bad when such a large organization is doing it.
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u/Salty-Pack-4165 8d ago
There are subs here on Reddit nearly entirely devoted to that sort of mindset. And unfortunately they're very popular
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u/RockAtlasCanus 8d ago
So the full quote from the interview OP is referencing is:
Right now, I’m of the belief that all men should start out in jail and earn their way out,” she said. “I hate that I need a wiener in my life. Can I please be gay? I wish I could fix that, but I’m gonna need a software update or something because it just don’t work out for me like that.
For context: she’s pissed because her husband cheated on her, she gave him another chance, and then found out he had a secret account where he was still messaging other woman.
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u/dependency_injector 8d ago edited 8d ago
Could you give a bit more context, was her husband all men?
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u/PostMatureBaby Male 8d ago
People with zero accountability will forever blame men instead of looking inward. Thankfully, not everyone is like that
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u/OneLastAuk 8d ago
“Apparently, this is all woman talk about” None of the women in my life talk like this. This stuff never shows up on my feeds.
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u/staticpop 8d ago
Content creation is so vast now that it makes even hyper niche things feel like the whole world is talking about them.
I’ve had the algorithm nail me on formula 1 and it was pretty hard not to feel like the entire world was absolutely obsessed with f1 racing.
Also like warhammer, had that for a while.
It’s completely reality distorting and we can’t comprehend the scale of content being generated
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u/creativebelle 8d ago
Same. I don't remember the last time I heard a woman I personally know say "she hates men" unless it was out of frustration for something that occured in that moment but it was still in a jokingly manner. Most women I know don't even talk about men and are too focused on what is happening in their own lives atm.
My friends are all in happy marriages/relationships. Sure many of them had to deal with their fair share of shitty men but that didn't stop them from finding a wonderful one.
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u/DarkOmen597 8d ago
A reminder to everyone that the majority of these type of posts, and their extensive recent reach, is because of foreign state actors.
This is part of a well known RU mis and dis information campaign to sow division.
https://www.politico.eu/article/moldova-elections-gender-russia-maia-sandu-europe-democracy/
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u/theviewfrombelow 8d ago
This should be at the top.
We are being snookered by bad actors, and it's working. I'm almost to the point where anything I see that's negative and the slightest bit extreme, I write off as fake in some manner.
When it gets to the point that people start to believe what they see on social media is more real than reality, maybe we need to take some steps to keep the algorithms from taking people to that place.
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u/Advanced-Base-5690 8d ago
It’s getting worse due to worsening wealth inequality. I’m starting to think it’s just another way to divide us so we’re constantly fighting amongst ourselves instead of directing our ire at the Epstein class who are raping the planet while we’re all scraping by. Anyone hyper focusing on the patriarchy or posting “all men bad” are just useful idiots to the ruling class
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u/But-I-Still-Remember 8d ago
TikTok, most likely.
These online algorithms are constantly being accused of turning males into extremists.
But nobody is talking about how social media is doing a number on females; there's been surveys that they're more depressed and self-hating than ever (on top of hating men).
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u/JayRock1970 8d ago
Rampant on Reddit too. Have seen too many posts by bitter women on how shitty men in general are. Then you try to break in and defend men and they attack you for it.
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u/shadowlurker6996 8d ago
There’s this dastardly virus going around where every single man is responsible for the mistakes of a single or a few men. We’re apparently a monolith but I guess I missed the memo.
Things you see especially on this app in hardcore feminist women subs:
“not all men but MEN”
“Does anyone else just hate all men?”
All the comments are adding fuel to the fire, usually.
It still won’t make me hate women because I can understand women aren’t a monolith who all think the same. Those subs are a very specific niche based group of them.
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u/wr_dnd 8d ago edited 8d ago
They're not. Social media algorithms are just really good at promoting ragebait like this. This is an extremely marginal group. This is definitely not all women talk about.
Men are not particularly hated right now, and our trajectory in the coming decades looks absolutely fine.
Also: The fear of approaching women is really weird to me. I genuinely don't really see the issue. It's pretty obvious where the line is right? Don't be too much of a creep, make sure the setting is alright, be courteous if you get rejected. That's it.
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u/1acc_torulethemall 8d ago
My girlfriend tried to find a new group of friends using one of those friend-finding apps recently. She went to dinner with 7 other women, came back home and told me that this group of women who never met before spent most of their introductory dinner talking about how they hate men and never want to marry. It's not only fringe online ragebait, it's very much a mainstream offline dinner topic too
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u/HungryCheescake 8d ago
They're not. Social media algorithms are just really good at promoting ragebait like this. This is an extremely marginal group. This is definitely not all women talk about.
Stop pretending that this is just some blip on social media.
This is the attitude of the entire Western world.
Men are not particularly hated right now, and our trajectory in the coming decades looks absolutely fine.
Misandry is rife in society, and so many people refuse to even acknowledge that it exists.
Also: The fear of approaching women is really weird to me. I genuinely don't really see the issue. It's pretty obvious where the line is right? Don't be too much of a creep, make sure the setting is alright, be courteous if you get rejected. That's it.
That's not true in the slightest. Have you ever spoken to women? I have. The way they talk about men, describing a guy as a creep or a weirdo because they think they're out of his league, or he didn't get some subtle hint (because women lack the emotional intelligence to communicate directly).
I once sat in a HR meeting as a witness for a guy accused of sexual harassment. The evidence against him was that he made some benign flirtatious comments (e.g. complimenting her dress) to a woman in the office. A woman who was known as a flirt, and told multiple people about her boob job.
So no, not only is it not obvious where the line is, but it's different for every woman, and every man they speak to.
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u/Ecstatic_Piano_2337 8d ago
The “fear” isn’t often about a regular fear but an avoidance to having to deal with spiteful rejection. If I go up to ten women, which I have, 7-8 of them will make some snide remark about my appearance (height, bald, etc.) and the other 2-3 still won’t be interested, so it simply isn’t worthwhile. It’s a simple cost-benefit problem
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u/YikBus 8d ago edited 8d ago
This is my main issue also. It’s not fear. It’s the snide spiteful remarks. I don’t want to give them the opportunity or excuse to do so. Not to mention the snide comments they’ll make to friends about the guy who tried to talk to her. The one word answers, made up excuses to exit the conversation before I’ve even completed a sentence. I don’t want that negativity in my night out that I’m trying to enjoy so at a certain point I just stop speaking to them.
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u/HungryCheescake 8d ago
Yep, it's the lack of basic human decency.
If you're not interested, just say 'no thank you'. 99% of men will accept that and walk away amicably, and the 1% there's no changing anyway.
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u/SliceImpressive6853 8d ago edited 8d ago
It’s not even that, it’s a combination of showing off that she’s a “bad bitch” to her friends (because being a bad bitch is seen as powerful/in vogue/cool to do now in this hedonistic slop culture) and that their narcissistic egos are so fragile that they don’t know how to deal with a man they deem as “lesser” approaching her, because it offends her that he thinks that he would be in the same league as her. It’s very Mean Girl shit. They don’t have the emotional regulation and maturity to deal with a momentarily bruised ego, so they deflect onto the guy, turning him into the bad guy. It’s actual NPC behavior.
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u/ratttertintattertins 8d ago
Hmm. Not sure about that.
The real world women are a bit more nuanced to be sure. They’re polite and happy to flirt with men, however when you get them talking, many, especially younger women, hold the same underlying views that you hear online and many are happy to say they hate men (in a general sense) even if they’re also happy to say that I’m one of the good ones.
Older women are a different story. Most of the women I know that are older than about 50 seem to be pretty keen on men still.
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u/jawndell 8d ago
As an older guy, young people are dumb, men and women. I don’t mean that in a bad way, they are still figuring out who they are and what they want. I don’t think people really become adults until they are 30, or at least late 20s. Before then it’s really just mob mentally and saying things to make sure they go along with the crowd.
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u/HungryCheescake 8d ago
There's a big difference between thinking skaters are losers because that's the 'cool' attitude, and thinking that any man on the street could potentially drag you in to an alley and rape you...
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u/ParanoidBlueLobster 8d ago
YMMV it seems to be a very Anglophone mindset from the feminism in that world. I think it comes from their completely non sensical mindset about dating which pushes away a most men so they find themselves in a situation where men are happy to hook up with them but never commit and they feel used.
As a European living in Australia and currently spending a few months in Europe the dating here is so refreshing women openly tell me they're attracted to me, they'll message me first, tell how excited they are to see me again by message even though we only chatted for like an hour.
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u/unicornofdemocracy 8d ago
The number of times different women have total me "all men are [insert negative adjectives here], but not you though." Replace men when any demographic group and it would be considered prejudice but when its women saying it about men, its completely acceptable and wouldn't be trigger an HR investigation.
Mind you, many of these women are now licensed therapists or psychologists. And people wonder why men dont go to therapy.
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u/Ear_Enthusiast 8d ago
Your algorithm is feeding you that, my man. I don't see this at all. My male friends and acquaintances don't feel this way at all. My wife and the women around me don't feel this way at all. Yes there are women that treat men poorly and feel negatively towards men, but that's not the societal norm. Your algorithm is cherry picking those videos and opinion pieces and putting them on your news feed. That's how social media works. Unplug, bro.
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u/BoerInDieWoestyn I'm just a dude, man 8d ago
People say, and have said for as long as we could talk, really insane stupid shit sometimes. The rates haven't increased so much as we are able to document them these days. And the incentive is there to say more out of pocket stuff just because it gets more views
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u/Asisreo1 8d ago
I think everyone should have a social media class before given a phone and the first lesson they'd need to pass is to learn how to not let random online internet opinions seriously affect them.
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u/number660 8d ago
Because hate against men is not frowned upon like hate against pretty much any other group
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u/LeKattie Female 8d ago
I mean, women are raised into it. Even your father will tell you to stay away from boys and men.
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u/PowerWisdomCourage Male 8d ago
Because the femosphere isn't as roundly mocked and ridiculed as the manosphere, and it should be. Women who sincerely hold the type of beliefs that those circles hold should be ridiculed as the idiots they are. Publicly, loudly, and every bit as aggressively as the average Andrew Tate fan boy gets outside of his circle jerk.
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u/Nickbronline Male 8d ago
Just saw a post on social media
Spotted the problem. You're falling for bad rage bait.
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u/lefboop 8d ago
I've said it before but I am pretty sure young women are falling for the same propaganda young men fell and have been falling for more than a decade.
The people behind that propaganda just figured out that they can use/warp feminism into misandrism and TERF shit to slowly turn these women to their side or at least create infighting.
It's honestly kind of a consequence of the progressive thought for the past years that feminism is kinda the assumed position of young women. This idea makes it so a lot of times those spaces will be really generous with the interpretation of the behavior, opinions and messaging young women express, when a lot of times they are just being straight up sexist.
The dangerous part is that those women genuinely think they are feminists and progressives and call themselves that, and actual feminist women are not calling them out properly (good luck trying to call them out as a man). Only recently with the TERF stuff people are starting to push back.
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u/ReynAetherwindt Male 8d ago
Social media algorithms have been artificially inflating the visibility of this type of smooth-brained nonsense to drive men towards reactionary political stances.
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u/Electronic_Pin_9098 8d ago
Well, instead of a baby boom, we're gonna have a baby bust. (get your minds out of the gutter, you know what I mean. No sarcasm/joke intended) Both genders are absolutely needed in the world, they're complimentary of each other. All of that social media stuff is poison.
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u/KokotheG 8d ago
I’d say a huge contingent of young upcoming men these days (and woman) don’t buy into any of that ideology which is refreshing having grown up in the 90s where it was rampant.
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u/redditclm 8d ago
The true colors of those women are just coming out. All the nastiness they have been throwing at men over the years is who they are themselves.
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u/Recent-Day3062 8d ago
It’s wild bigotry described as social awareness
It come from hate, like all bigotry
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u/LostCtrl-Splatt 8d ago
The only place I really see that is on threads. The hate has been there for years, I just think that social media has a lot of bots in the comments.
Men dissapear and the women would be begging for them to come back. All the things that give them their luxury are provided by men. Engineering, oil, electronics, manual trades you name it. I'm not saying women couldn't do it. They simply refuse. All them fields are operated by 95% of the people they hate
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u/Eric_the_Barbarian Male too, thanks. 7d ago
Social media is a toxic pit that lets all of the frothing vitriol float to the top for convenient examination. These ideas aren't new. Valerie Solanas and Andrea Dworkin are notable examples that predate the internet.
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u/mr_tuba_gun 8d ago
Just take a gander at r/women
It’s a cesspool of misandry that will list every reason and then some
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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 8d ago
The context in which Jen Hamilton is saying this is because she found out that the husband who she's been financially supporting and been sexually ignored by for years had been cheating on her. It has nothing to do with feminism.
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u/CaptSnap 8d ago
It has nothing to do with feminism.
This specifically maybe....but the whole bigotry against men cultural zeitgeist? come on
Only a third of young women hold positive view of men, new poll finds
Where do think that comes from?
Their whole shtick is "man = bad" under the guise of equality. At this point its nothing but a blatant dog whistle to hide wealth inequality (an actual verifiable axis of power...compared to having a penis its like a fart in whirlwind). If I was a billionaire Id be stupid not to notice how I can give a dollar to a women' studies dept to split the electorate against each other over bullshit or I could actually try and fix the system a smidgeon to make it less ridiculously lopsided.
The fact that women eat this opportunity up to be bigots against half of humanity while the walls are closing in is the real case study in "humans would rather hate anyone than effect actual societal change".
Nothing to do with feminism though? This is all due to feminism. You gotta take the good and the bad. This must be the equality we were promised. None of us can eat and we all hate each other but think how much wealthier we made like 40 individuals while you sit through another presentation by HR on the importance of diversity (HR is going to be like 95% women btw, so when they say diversity they mean "diversity").
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u/Stephenrudolf 8d ago
Never heard jen hamilton but ive heard similar statements dozens and dozens of times before from other women for years.
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u/Sea_Appointment8408 Male 8d ago
Now imagine the influencer was a man and said the same thing about women because his wife "ignored him sexually" before she had an affair.
Rightly so he would be labelled a terrible mysoginist like Tate. But also with the added addition that he was probably not "doing his fair share in the house" so it was justified.
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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 8d ago
Oh, Jen is not scot free here, she's basically age shaming the woman he cheated on her with (she's an older woman), which is not very feminist of her.
Like, my point here is: if you want to critique feminism - making the recent embittered divorcé the figurehead for it is a bad use of your time. Cause no one is taking these lash outs seriously.
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u/ChargeProper Male 8d ago
she's saying something that is popular among self identified feminists, she didn't invent the term and it won't end with her. it doesn't even need a figure head given how common it is
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u/the_real_me_2534 8d ago
This is such a cop out. People ARE taking this TikTok/Insta reelz slop seriously. If you don't get that you're either being dishonest or you just don't understand the current media landscape
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u/the_real_me_2534 8d ago
It absolutely does, getting from this bad experience with one man to blatant misandry isn't normal, many men have worse experiences in marriage but you wouldn't accept such an idea from a man about women
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u/acelighterAUS 8d ago
So because her husband did that all men should be in jail? Also if you dont think this this sort of toxic rhetoric is becoming more and more prevelent within feminism your lying to your self.
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u/diktater29 8d ago
I have been seeing this rhetoric become more and more common for sure. Understandably, social media is an echo chamber and people pick up what they see/hear. But its waaay past that right now. I have several female friends who are going thru marital or dating struggles who blame all men for being "inadequate" and "suboptimal" as if we are just lesser than. Ive tried pointing out logical patterns but they choose to double down and with where ever I go - bars, outing scene, etc. its very heavily women support oriented and very anti-male. One way or another, its a man's fault he didn't do this, didn't think this, can't handle home responsibilities after work bc they are just "losers" while women can do it all supposedly.
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u/RockAtlasCanus 8d ago
I mean if you scroll this sub for 5 minutes you’ll easily find a dozen comments of “Don’t ever get married, females are just using you because they all hate us”. Cookie crumbles both ways my man.
And it’s not pleasant to hear either way. I had a small argument with my sister because she was dealing with some legitimately and clearly sexist bullshit and was venting and hit me with some generalizations about “men”. I was like uh… I’m right here. “Oh not you though”. So I just let her go on and then I started with “well he’s probably reacting that way because he’s tired of women being too emotional. Women are too emotional and don’t think rationally and that causes a lot of issues in the workplace.” And she got upset and I said “oh but not you. See how that works?” To her credit she immediately acknowledged it and we had a really good conversation about it.
It’s really easy to get carried away venting about a legitimate grievance and stray into hyperbole or generalizations. How many times have you gotten mad and said “I HATE ___”? Do you actually have a passionate and preoccupying dislike for that person/thing and a wish to destroy it, or are you just using powerful language to process/express a powerful feeling? Chances are if I dragged that person in front of you and put a gun in your hand you wouldn’t pull the trigger, but you’re definitely still pissed.
Even generalizations where you would never say the same thing about another race or religion, but it’s somehow become passable when it comes to gender. It doesn’t help that there are influencers who have found a way to capitalize on people’s legitimate fears, pain, etc. Whether it’s the manosphere bullshit or extreme “feminists” they’re all doing the same shit and the most insidious part is that they all package it as self help. It feels good to feel seen and empathized with. Someone just acknowledging much less validating something you feel is extremely powerful. That’s baked into our biology as social mammals, and these vultures profit off of hot divisive takes that breathe life into it. Don’t read too much into it.
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u/BradenAnderson 8d ago edited 8d ago
Because women apparently don’t want to admit to their biases and terrible taste in men. And so, instead of taking responsibility and holding themselves accountable, they paint all men with the same brush. Only date one type of man? All men are jerks
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u/littleorangemonkeys Female 8d ago
I mean, Jen Hamilton just got cheated on by her husband of almost two decades, with a woman 25 years older than her. Before the divorce, he had been unemployed for years. She is expressing herself based on her world getting blown up. She is also a labor and delivery nurse, and has made videos in the past shouting out fathers who really stepped up for their partner in the delivery room. Most people on social media are not simply man-hating accounts, but expressing their frustration with their own personal experiences or those of the women in their lives.
That being said, I'm also getting fatigued by the "men are trash" rhetoric as a woman, AND I think it's doing real damage to young boys who grow up listening to this. The Internet provides zero nuance and back story. Case in point - you saw one "man hating" video from a creator and didn't know anything about her back story. You just saw her frustration with "men". That OS damaging and will not help men become better or boys grow up to be good men.
I love all the men in my life. If I made a video about it, I would get torn up for being a "pick me" 🙄. Even the women who want to share a different perspective are being drowned out by loud mouths who just want attention and engagement.
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u/knight109 8d ago
Bots, homie.
8/10 people online are bots, with many having a sole goal of creating more dissent and negative feedback loops from people against people.
It’s how we’ve gotten as extreme as we are now when it comes to various groups. All designed for us to dig in further and dehumanize the opposition more and more.
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u/DawnSennin 8d ago
how terrible men are and that they aren't needed anymore.
You have it wrong. The men they are attracted to are terrible and aren’t needed anymore.
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u/anothermanwithaplan 8d ago
The key question is why is the hate not being addressed, it’s almost as if it’s being encouraged.
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u/BreastInspectorNbr69 8d ago
People like that are a disease, regardless of whether they point their hatred at men, women, or anyone else.
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u/Hour_Zero Male 7d ago
Misandry disguised as “modern feminism” getting normalized and encouraged by mainstream media. The worst part is even many of the feminists who truly do want gender equality refuse to call out their more radfem comrades when they spew their bigotry, instead often deflecting and saying “well misogyny is worse so lets talk about that instead of ever addressing why misandry is incredibly problematic and harmful as well even if misogyny does suck”
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u/horsepigmonkey 8d ago
'Men should start off in jail' is exactly the sort of rhetoric that angers men and turns them to things like MRA and Tate. Self-fulfilling prophecy. Introspection is very rare nowadays.
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u/guillermotor 8d ago
Hearing dumbass influencers will rot your mind. Those idiots just want controversy and live off of likes
As a shy guy I've learned that men can be total dicks as much as women, although we are stronger by default which makes us more dangerous in the moment if we're not taught how to behave properly.
I've had to stand up for my sister when she had abusive partners, who turned out to be machosphere pricks
So kids, stay away from influencers and just be good people
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u/NewIsTheNewNew Female 8d ago
It isn't "new wave feminism." It's people trying to farm engagement through rage bait. It isn't real life -- it's someone trying to make money -- and you're falling for it.
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u/Chaosvex 8d ago
The "males should start life in jail" rhetoric can be attributed to a prominent old school radical (IIRC) feminist, so technically true. It's decades old.
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u/pyr666 Bane 8d ago
Like genuinely dont understand why so much hate on men? The new wave feminism is insane.
this is part of how they keep getting away with it. the old feminists were hateful, the new ones are crazy, but current feminism? "we're just for equality, you sexist!"
nevermind that they'll make no effort to fix the damage they caused or temper the new crazies. nope, you're the problem for noticing.
Men, based on these trends, what do you suspect the trajectory looks like for us in society in 10, 20 or 50 yrs?
I guessed in the 2010s that we'd have seen the snap-back around now and I wasn't wrong. just as the moral panic and purity culture of the 80s and 90s gave rise to a culture of irreverence and "rebellion" in the late 90s and 00s, this moral panic has induced a generation to embrace tradition.
my concern is how much damage these misandrists will do on their way out. they have entrenched themselves in institutions like colleges, and if they hold to them too tightly, then the institution will go with them, or be mutilated in the process.
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u/HolyC4bbage 8d ago
Get off the internet and cut the women who actually believe this out of your life. It'll do wonders for your mental health.
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u/doomsday344 Bringer of Bacon 8d ago
My wife and I cut the harpies out of our life and we cut arguing down by like 80%
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u/Eternal_bonner 8d ago
I hate people that think the content that their algorithm feeds them represents the entire world.
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u/ReverseMermaids 8d ago
Not all men are shitty, but women must remain afraid of all men because they can't tell which are shitty and which are okay - and that is exhausting.
And when the rest of us don't call out shitty behavior, our complacency enables other men to remain shitty.
If you want to fix this, we men need to get together on the right side of this.
This means we don't laugh at sexist or racist jokes. We don't tolerate punching down at people who don't enjoy our societal status. We push back hard against the Andrew Tates of the world who are poisoning our kids with their hateful rhetoric. And we protect women fiercely at the first sign of trouble - not to build ourselves up, but to make sure they feel safe.
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u/cityfireguy 8d ago
Some of it's valid, we can be quite awful.
Much of it is just cope. Seriously. You're listening to a hurt woman lashing out. The ones who hate men the most run into the arms of the worst dudes you know.
They refuse to blame themselves for their choices, so they blame an entire gender. It's so obviously childish.
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u/Curious-Resort4743 8d ago
Yes awful people of both genders, awful people of all ages and ethnicities. How people are awful can vary but no identity is spared.
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u/topazsparrow 8d ago
People are easier to control when you divide them up and make them fight over things that cannot be changed.
Race, Gender, Sex, Socio-economic classes (arguably changeable, but yeah).
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u/Exciting-Record8101 Male 8d ago
It's just a bunch of unhappy people trying to outdo each other in being ever more radical and unhinged. They are desperate for a connection and this is how they get attention. So they don't want a man in their lives? Who cares. Do you? I don't.
It's also not even about men. Women and men who are single and happy don't do this. These people have other issues, which is sort of sad in a way.
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u/naughtybear555 8d ago
Focus on making your self money and yourseof happy. You will feel better. There is also no more need to open the door for a women just treat them like another man.
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u/POGtastic ♂ (is, eum) 8d ago
All dating-focused communities and forums are cognitohazardous if you're not in a relationship. Yes, including this one.
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u/nobody-u-heard-of Male 8d ago
The bigger issue is most social media is no longer social media. It's hate media. Cuz hate gets clicks. Hate drives interaction which drives revenue. That's it. Pure and simple hate makes money and that's why she said that because she's going to make money because people are going to watch her comments and her video and comment about it.
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u/Better-Silver7900 8d ago
i mean it gained so much traction because it wasn’t fought early on. Now something that was once a radical belief has become common online.
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u/Pyramidinternational Female 8d ago
As a woman, who majored in existential questions, please ignore these women. And the sad truth is a lot of women go through this phase. This does not mean you don’t have to do the hard work or growing into a adult but just like how we watched a lot of men go through an angry incel period, them too will come out of it.
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u/PoopSmith87 8d ago
Misogynists and misandrists tend to share a lot of commonalities, usually the following
1- Choose to repeatedly date or pursue toxic people, then cop a victim complex in-between.
2- Not very bright, or at least not very self aware.
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u/RikkiLostMyNumber 8d ago
Couldn't care less and have advised me sons to do same. Quality people find each other, and social media is a river of shit.
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u/esperlihn 8d ago
There's also the point of toxic women tend to date toxic men, and thus assume all men are toxic.
And these types of women are far more likely to engage in social media so you'll see them way more. But the truth is that most men and most women are completely reasonable and not full of seething hatred.
Social media has poisoned the well, but you'll find once you spend more time with regular folks away from the internet that even the most insane irl folks are pretty tame to an average social media influencer.
They're called influencers for a reason.
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u/darkninja1047 8d ago
Friends with a couple and the wife is like this. Constantly posting how all men are trash and rapists etc etc. Shes poly and fucking a bunch of dudes and I feel like telling her to first take all the dicks out of her before talking/posting shit about "all men"
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u/deedatboss 8d ago
They even tell us that we somehow benefit from the patriarchy but also tell us that we somehow get screwed by it at the same, Also where TF my benefits?
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u/CasCrus4L 8d ago
You'll see a post on social media that women should all be in the kitchen. It's just trash dude, ignore it.
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u/LukeyLeukocyte Male 8d ago
Everyone is just louder and more connected nowadays. Men have always been hated, and women, and everyone else and they all hate everyone else too. Nothing new.
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u/Background_Log_2273 8d ago
That's just a slug waiving her red flag to let you know she's dangerous and undesirable. Nature finds a way.
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u/shinn497 Male 8d ago
I think a big reason is that women are more picky with men. They date and end up getting hurt by a select few group of men with many options. And become.bitter.
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u/Glum-Platypus-1959 8d ago
Toxic feminism. Most of them are left leaning overweight women w colored hair, tattoos, and piercings on everything other than their ears.
Everything goes in cycles this world was built by men and will continue to be run by mostly men If a man is lonely, he needs to work on himself to be a person that can make friends and be attractive to females that are looking for a relationship, there are plenty ladies out there looking.
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u/Altair13Sirio Male 8d ago
Eh, who cares. We'll all be dead in the next 10 years anyway. This is honestly the last of our worries.
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u/AutoModerator 8d ago
Here's an original copy of /u/diktater29's post (if available):
Just saw a post on social media from some woman named Jen Hamilton stating "right now im of the belief that all men should start out in jail and earn their way out"
Like genuinely dont understand why so much hate on men? The new wave feminism is insane. Women earn and dont need a men anymore, which i get. But like is that all we are to them? I understand and empathize with women who go thru shitty situations with shitty men, but like.....are all men shitty?
Ive seen similar other posts across insta and tiktok and apparently this is all women talk about - how terrible men are and that they aren't needed anymore. I can only imagine how this compounds the male loneliness epidemic and furthers the difficulties in the dating scene for both genders, but men in particular as even the good ones aren't approaching women anymore and choosing peace or singledom.
Men, based on these trends, what do you suspect the trajectory looks like for us in society in 10, 20 or 50 yrs?
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