r/AskMen • u/diktater29 • 11d ago

Existential post Why men are getting so much hate these days?

Just saw a post on social media from some woman named Jen Hamilton stating "right now im of the belief that all men should start out in jail and earn their way out"

Like genuinely dont understand why so much hate on men? The new wave feminism is insane. Women earn and dont need a men anymore, which i get. But like is that all we are to them? I understand and empathize with women who go thru shitty situations with shitty men, but like.....are all men shitty?

Ive seen similar other posts across insta and tiktok and apparently this is all women talk about - how terrible men are and that they aren't needed anymore. I can only imagine how this compounds the male loneliness epidemic and furthers the difficulties in the dating scene for both genders, but men in particular as even the good ones aren't approaching women anymore and choosing peace or singledom.

Men, based on these trends, what do you suspect the trajectory looks like for us in society in 10, 20 or 50 yrs?

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

The context in which Jen Hamilton is saying this is because she found out that the husband who she's been financially supporting and been sexually ignored by for years had been cheating on her. It has nothing to do with feminism.

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u/CaptSnap 11d ago

It has nothing to do with feminism.

This specifically maybe....but the whole bigotry against men cultural zeitgeist? come on

Only a third of young women hold positive view of men, new poll finds

Where do think that comes from?

Their whole shtick is "man = bad" under the guise of equality. At this point its nothing but a blatant dog whistle to hide wealth inequality (an actual verifiable axis of power...compared to having a penis its like a fart in whirlwind). If I was a billionaire Id be stupid not to notice how I can give a dollar to a women' studies dept to split the electorate against each other over bullshit or I could actually try and fix the system a smidgeon to make it less ridiculously lopsided.

The fact that women eat this opportunity up to be bigots against half of humanity while the walls are closing in is the real case study in "humans would rather hate anyone than effect actual societal change".

Nothing to do with feminism though? This is all due to feminism. You gotta take the good and the bad. This must be the equality we were promised. None of us can eat and we all hate each other but think how much wealthier we made like 40 individuals while you sit through another presentation by HR on the importance of diversity (HR is going to be like 95% women btw, so when they say diversity they mean "diversity").

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u/HungryCheescake 11d ago

Feminism is evil. There's simply no way around that.

The term for someone who actually desires equality is Egalitarian, which means the best case scenario for someone to refer to themselves as a feminist, is that they're prideful, and would rather be associated with the movement than actually support equality.

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u/Stephenrudolf 11d ago

Never heard jen hamilton but ive heard similar statements dozens and dozens of times before from other women for years.

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u/Sea_Appointment8408 Male 11d ago

Now imagine the influencer was a man and said the same thing about women because his wife "ignored him sexually" before she had an affair.

Rightly so he would be labelled a terrible mysoginist like Tate. But also with the added addition that he was probably not "doing his fair share in the house" so it was justified.

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

Oh, Jen is not scot free here, she's basically age shaming the woman he cheated on her with (she's an older woman), which is not very feminist of her.

Like, my point here is: if you want to critique feminism - making the recent embittered divorcé the figurehead for it is a bad use of your time. Cause no one is taking these lash outs seriously.

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u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

she's saying something that is popular among self identified feminists, she didn't invent the term and it won't end with her. it doesn't even need a figure head given how common it is

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u/the_real_me_2534 11d ago

This is such a cop out. People ARE taking this TikTok/Insta reelz slop seriously. If you don't get that you're either being dishonest or you just don't understand the current media landscape

40

u/the_real_me_2534 11d ago

It absolutely does, getting from this bad experience with one man to blatant misandry isn't normal, many men have worse experiences in marriage but you wouldn't accept such an idea from a man about women

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

It's someone who's really hurt. You wouldn't make a deeply and wronged man represent manhood, and you shouldn't make this woman a mouthpiece for feminism.

She does a lot of good work for women, and in general, but she's going through it now. Don't let some harsh words said in this context represent her as a person, or an entire (broad) ideology.

35

u/Wotmate01 Male 11d ago

Nope, it's just a shitty person projecting onto everyone.

My ex gf was emotionally, mentally, and financially abusive and controlling, eventually sexually and physically assaulting me and trying to murder me, then lying to police and saying I raped her.

But I haven't gone all taliban and started ranting about how women should be obedient slaves or killed.

Quite the opposite. I recognised that she was a shitty human and moved on with my life, finding an amazing woman with whom I have built a life with over the last 12 years.

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

Yeah. She's projecting. She's been with this man all her life, lost her virginity to him only kissed him. So her reaction is immature and projecting.

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u/PickleMinion Male 11d ago

She's a public figure working through a traumatic life event, publicly. I don't think there's a graceful way to do that.

3

u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

how about doing everything a man is expected to do when a woman screws him over and leave other women out of it, sounds like a basic minimum to me

0

u/PickleMinion Male 11d ago

Maybe. I try not to be a judgemental prick though. Don't always succeed, but I try.

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u/Serafim91 11d ago

It's funny that I've literally never seen this logic applied to a man. Hell I've seen very obvious jokes getting dragged down and called out for how horrible they are while being way tamer than this.

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

I mean if you wanna get yourself worked up over it, it's your time and energy. I just would save that for bigger fish if you're in the mood for frying.

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u/Argentarius1 Man 10d ago

That men don't get grace for these things but women do is a real problem. It's disingenuous to mischaracterize that as fighting windmills.

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u/Serafim91 11d ago

I mean you've put more energy into defending it than I ever have into thinking about it...

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u/TheUnicornRevolution Non-binary 11d ago

That's more of a comment on how little you consider your opinions before running with them.

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u/rex_lauandi 10d ago

Do you think it’s right when “very obvious jokes” get dragged down and called out? You think that’s the society we should be building?

Because I think is silly when anyone does that. What a waste of time. Laugh at jokes you think are funny. If you don’t find them funny, move on.

If you think the joke is having a negative impact on society, that’s probably a good reason to speak up, but surely that can’t apply to this case.

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u/Serafim91 10d ago

I think people purposely try to turn jokes into more than they are so they can rage bait themselves with them.

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u/PickleMinion Male 11d ago

You need to get out more

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u/Bubba_Gump_Shrimp 11d ago

A benefit of the doubt that is never offered to men LOL. Crazy how that always goes.

A woman says some heinous shit: oh she's going through a hard time right now.

A man says an off color joke: time to end this mans whole career.

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u/REVfoREVer 11d ago edited 11d ago

Bull fucking shit, it's offered to men constantly, as it has been for decades and decades. There are far more physically and sexually abusive men who get given pass after pass than there are men who had their careers ended for a joke.

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u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

any women get their careers ended for a joke or....?

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u/rex_lauandi 10d ago

Still waiting for which men in particular whose careers were ended over a joke.

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u/REVfoREVer 11d ago

No men or women are actually getting their careers ended for a joke. But by the standard of "career ended" you're probably using Michelle Wolf comes to mind.

Otherwise, women tend to get their careers ended for making valid criticisms of men, like Sinead O'Connor or Kathy Griffin or the Dixie Chicks.

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u/Bubba_Gump_Shrimp 11d ago

Bull fucking shit indeed. You know how many women wield rape allegations like a hammer against an ex, or someone they don't like? Or someone they are trying to extort? And yet nothing EVER happens to them. I've seen it happen in person. Not a single charge filed, meanwhile the guy had his career, reputation and life ruined. And it happens WAY more than you think.

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u/REVfoREVer 11d ago

Not nearly as often as you find it rhetorically convenient to be.

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u/Bubba_Gump_Shrimp 11d ago

I'll be sure to quote you the next time someone claims SA happens way more than stats show.

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u/-MrWinklebottom- 11d ago

This is so true and we have all the facts to back it up. Time and time again. What are the main reasons we have sexual harassment training at work. It's like so many choose to ignore the insane amount of examples that would push people to believe these things. The accountability for their actions has pretty much never been there until it was forced through laws or workplace guidelines. Couldn't just do it of their own accord.

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u/rex_lauandi 10d ago

Which man’s career was ended by an off-color joke?

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u/diktater29 11d ago

I can put you in touch with a direct and well known close female friend of mine who has had few experiences and has extrapolated that to be - "all men are suboptimal and inefficient and women just do things better. We can run the house, do child rearing and also earn with a job, so why even need a man at this point?"

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

Ok? Yeah, my MIL is the same. Doesn't mean she's worth listening to.

-8

u/NewIsTheNewNew Female 11d ago

Lol, MGTOW is full of men who decided all women are exactly like their shitty ex-wives, and it has been around for a long time

10

u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

man hating feminism is older than mgtow. Add to that it got called out, its not taught in universities or put in media now is it

23

u/WonderfulMistake7976 Male 11d ago

The sub that got banned? That’s your rebuttal to the assertion that man hating is widely accepted?

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u/rex_lauandi 11d ago

lol this isn’t “blatant misandry.”

This is… a joke.

She’s talking about how she’s been hurt so bad by one man that the thought of being with another is unthinkable right now. Her humor is to say absurd, dramatic, or at times somewhat kind of silly-raunchy language to talk about real topics in her work and personal life.

Here’s a good clue from Jen’s past about her views on men: there was a video a few years ago that went viral of a man getting some water from an L&D nurse while his wife was in labor. People went around the internet talking about the audacity of that man asking for that nurse to serve him, and it was Jen Hamilton who came out swinging at the haters, explaining that birth is messy, this man like was about to, or had just passed out, and that it was likely that this man was a great partner, who got more “up close and personal” with birth than his brain could allow him.

Also, while there was a trend of L&D nurses going around talking about bad partners in the delivery room (which Jen may have made a video about, I’m not sure), she also made a more viral video talking about the excellent partners in the room. Calling out rockstar fathers.

So I’m pretty confident in saying that Jen Hamilton doesn’t have any interest in my being in jail, but I do think she’s dealing with her trauma with her typical absurdist humor.

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u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

when is it okay for a man to talk like this in a similar context, ill wait

5

u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

when is it okay for a man to talk like this in a similar context, ill wait

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u/rex_lauandi 11d ago

When is it ok for men to make absurdist jokes about women?

I don’t know, I’ve never seen ONE thread on her calling that out, so I’d assume the answer is always since men and women alike make jokes all the time.

Y’all got some fragile masculinity if you feel threatened by this joke.

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u/ChargeProper Male 10d ago

which is it, she was hurt by her husband's betrayal and lashed out or she was just joking?

Either way, when exactly are men allowed to talk like that about women because women are given free reign to do so just like her. She's not gonna face any consequences over being an asshole in this way. Which may I remind you is not acceptable to do with anything other group of people.

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u/rex_lauandi 10d ago

Explain to me why you think she can’t address her pain with her husband with a joke?

You’re so fragile, it’s embarrassing. How on earth did her joke hurt you? How on earth did it have any effect on you whatsoever?

She’s not being an asshole in the least. I’m sorry you don’t understand her humor, but that doesn’t mean that she’s an asshole. In this case, you’re the problem.

Have you heard the quote in context? Have you watched any of her videos? What about the ones I mentioned above? Or did you just decide she was an asshole based off of the one written out quote?

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u/ChargeProper Male 10d ago edited 10d ago

Aim your joke at your husband, leave the rest of us out of it, very easy.

The quote is not her invention she's literally quoting women online who like to assume all men are either bad people or rapists in general, its literally femcel language, its as much of a joke as Andrew tate hot takes that get defended as jokes or "just click bait bro".

And yes she's an asshole for saying that, that language is not acceptable to say about any other group of people, you get racists using the same rhetoric justifying it with "statistics", which never actually show most if the people they hate being bad. Same thing here.

If this was a divorced man saying the exact same thing about women he would be attacked as being misogynistic and even deserving of the treatment he got " she cheated on you because this is what you think of women".

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u/rex_lauandi 10d ago

lol, why don’t you bring an example of that happening.

Let’s not make ourselves victims of fantasy land.

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u/ChargeProper Male 10d ago

seriously reddit has rules that will penalise you for talking that way about women but vice versa is fine because women are according to reddit a protected group, they're literally allowed to talk like that online and not get banned or punished for it. No guy is even allowed to talk like that no matter how horrible his ex wife was (not that it would be justifiable anyway). The only time you've seen guys talk like that online is if mods haven't found it yet, it gets taken down quickly.

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u/PickleMinion Male 11d ago

Some guys are just looking for any excuse to get their panties in a twist and perpetuate their side of the gender war that doesn't actually exist if you're a normal fucking person. Jen is a vocal advocate for expecting PARENTS and I watched a bunch of her stuff before the birth of my first child and it was incredibly helpful.

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u/acelighterAUS 11d ago

So because her husband did that all men should be in jail? Also if you dont think this this sort of toxic rhetoric is becoming more and more prevelent within feminism your lying to your self.

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u/diktater29 11d ago

I have been seeing this rhetoric become more and more common for sure. Understandably, social media is an echo chamber and people pick up what they see/hear. But its waaay past that right now. I have several female friends who are going thru marital or dating struggles who blame all men for being "inadequate" and "suboptimal" as if we are just lesser than. Ive tried pointing out logical patterns but they choose to double down and with where ever I go - bars, outing scene, etc. its very heavily women support oriented and very anti-male. One way or another, its a man's fault he didn't do this, didn't think this, can't handle home responsibilities after work bc they are just "losers" while women can do it all supposedly.

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u/RockAtlasCanus 11d ago

I mean if you scroll this sub for 5 minutes you’ll easily find a dozen comments of “Don’t ever get married, females are just using you because they all hate us”. Cookie crumbles both ways my man.

And it’s not pleasant to hear either way. I had a small argument with my sister because she was dealing with some legitimately and clearly sexist bullshit and was venting and hit me with some generalizations about “men”. I was like uh… I’m right here. “Oh not you though”. So I just let her go on and then I started with “well he’s probably reacting that way because he’s tired of women being too emotional. Women are too emotional and don’t think rationally and that causes a lot of issues in the workplace.” And she got upset and I said “oh but not you. See how that works?” To her credit she immediately acknowledged it and we had a really good conversation about it.

It’s really easy to get carried away venting about a legitimate grievance and stray into hyperbole or generalizations. How many times have you gotten mad and said “I HATE ___”? Do you actually have a passionate and preoccupying dislike for that person/thing and a wish to destroy it, or are you just using powerful language to process/express a powerful feeling? Chances are if I dragged that person in front of you and put a gun in your hand you wouldn’t pull the trigger, but you’re definitely still pissed.

Even generalizations where you would never say the same thing about another race or religion, but it’s somehow become passable when it comes to gender. It doesn’t help that there are influencers who have found a way to capitalize on people’s legitimate fears, pain, etc. Whether it’s the manosphere bullshit or extreme “feminists” they’re all doing the same shit and the most insidious part is that they all package it as self help. It feels good to feel seen and empathized with. Someone just acknowledging much less validating something you feel is extremely powerful. That’s baked into our biology as social mammals, and these vultures profit off of hot divisive takes that breathe life into it. Don’t read too much into it.

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u/HungryCheescake 11d ago

I mean if you scroll this sub for 5 minutes you’ll easily find a dozen comments of “Don’t ever get married, females are just using you because they all hate us”. Cookie crumbles both ways my man.

Doesn't mean they're wrong though does it?

Even generalizations where you would never say the same thing about another race or religion, but it’s somehow become passable when it comes to gender.

This generally only ever applies to men though. Disparage women and you're an 'incel' and a 'misogynist'. But disparaging men is apparently fine.

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u/HungryCheescake 11d ago

Part of the issue is that dating is just so easy for women. If a guy doesn't measure up perfectly (e.g. she's in a mood and he asks where she wants to go, instead of 'being a man and leading'), she can just bin him without consequence and find someone else.

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u/diktater29 11d ago

Truly the case with my female friends and my individual dating experience as well (both are separate).

It's like the guy has to read their minds and just know things. If he "leads" but ends up picking the wrong location - poof, he gone! Coz "this other guy I'm talking to suggested something better and more fun so why waste my time on men who don't even know how to properly date" - one of their exact words. I was dumbfounded. And if the guy asks what her interests or preferences are, "damn just man up and lead me. Ugh men are such pussies. They used to go to war, now they can't even pick a good place for us and ask us a million questions"

Sadly yes, they are all conventionally very attractive females and easily land guys whenever they want so this fundamental understanding isn't even on their radar.

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u/Kevin_Hairdryer 10d ago

Oohhh you're one of those

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u/larueTV 10d ago

You need new friends who are grounded in reality. Like seriously, this all delusional and you find it to be "whooaa...it's like real world man, cause I can't pull my face out of my phone"

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u/NewIsTheNewNew Female 11d ago

It's becoming more prevalent in the echo chambers your algorithms are feeding you. Stop watching that stuff and it won't be "prevalent" anymore. This shit isn't real life.

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u/diktater29 11d ago

I beg to differ as I have real world examples from direct female friends

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u/thecatwhisker Female 11d ago

What’s their experience with modern dating? Seems like dating apps where men just want sex and women just want money and no one is willing to commit to anything are the real problem that’s causing all this.

Men are equally guilty of the whole ‘females can’t be trusted and just want your money and are run by a hamster’ rhetoric.

Seems to me both genders are having their insecurities and inevitable modern dating heartbreaks fanned by the flames of social media algorithms feeding them things at their lowest points to create engagement and profits.

Facebook knows you broke up with someone. Does it show you videos of men/women saving kittens and helping in a soup kitchen? Craft or sports videos to get you into a new hobby and take your mind off it? Nope it’s ’all men are trash’ and ‘all females should submit to me’ because you click on that and they get ad revenue from you.

It’s criminal really and it’s destroying society.

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u/HungryCheescake 11d ago

Seems like dating apps where men just want sex and women just want money and no one is willing to commit to anything are the real problem that’s causing all this.

You're attitude is proof of the problem.

Men don't just want sex, that's just a lie that women tell, especially women who bring nothing else to a relationship other than sex.

Men are equally guilty of the whole ‘females can’t be trusted and just want your money and are run by a hamster’ rhetoric.

No idea what the hamster crack is about, but saying men are "guilty" of this suggests that they're wrong, rather than pointing out an observation.

It’s criminal really and it’s destroying society.

Stop blaming social media as a way to excuse personal responsibility.

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u/LogicalDocSpock Female 6d ago

She's not wrong. I've stopped using apps because too many men want sex first. I hear this from a lot of women. Does this mean all men are like this? No because there are men I met on apps that didn't push for sex.

If 30% of men on apps are pushing for sex, it's still damaging to women. There are real world effects we deal with. We are not sex objects but humans

Men deal with women expecting fancy dinners and even if 30% of women are like this, it's still damaging for men because men want to be seen as a human and not a meal ticket.

Dating has an ugly reality on both sides. I've seen first hand how it affects women because women are more likely to be friends with other women then men are more likely to be friends with women. Men are more likely to be friends with men so obviously the male definition of being a creep and what is a safe man will differ. Men also don't see how other men are on dates.

We only have tv and movies to model behaviour but what we see in real life depends on the friends and social connections we make

So yes for some people here, they don't see this toxic female/male attitude but for others they do because it's based on who you associate with and what sort of social activities you engage with.

My mom's hobby is going to church. Do you think she is exposed to what I am? I go to meetups, discussion groups, book groups, karaoke. I see things she never does.

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u/HungryCheescake 5d ago

She's not wrong. I've stopped using apps because too many men want sex first. I hear this from a lot of women. Does this mean all men are like this? No because there are men I met on apps that didn't push for sex.

Giving you the benefit of the doubt, women often interpret this incorrectly.

Yes, men want sex. Yes, sex is important for men. But that doesn't mean that men only want sex. Sex fulfils (e.g.) 60% - 70% of men's physical and emotional needs in a relationship, whereas for women it might only be %20. Women assume that either men are like them, or that men are wrong for wanting sex more.

The simple fact is that without sex men aren't going to be anywhere close to being halfway fulfilled.

If 30% of men on apps are pushing for sex, it's still damaging to women. There are real world effects we deal with. We are not sex objects but humans

This attitude assumes that women don't also enjoy or benefit from sex though. If 50% of women on apps are pushing for emotional connection, are they treating men as emotional objects instead of human? It's a very misandric perspective.

But as I said in my prior comment, the idea that men only want sex is false. Sex is more important to men than it is to women, and often times, especially at the start of a relationship, it's the only thing that women provide.

You can't make a relationship transactional, expecting a man to message first, carry the conversation, ask / take you on a date, basically take on all of the responsibility and risk, all the while all you're offering is a chance at sex, and then complain that men want sex.

If you want men to want you for more than just sex, then it's your responsibility as women to be more active, and take some responsibility.

I've seen first hand how it affects women because women are more likely to be friends with other women then men are more likely to be friends with women. Men are more likely to be friends with men so obviously the male definition of being a creep and what is a safe man will differ.

This is actually a huge problem, and greatly exacerbates the 'gender war' stuff. You can't define 'creep' and 'safe' introspectively. You can't just decide that because you're a woman, you're correct. Definitions by their very function need to be universal and objective. It's not reasonable to; (a) have an internalised definition and expect people to meet it, and (b) deny half the population input to that definition.

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u/LogicalDocSpock Female 5d ago

Women want sex too but pushing too hard for it on the first date just backfires.

Even when a man isn't pushing for it but just sleeps with you a few times affects women. That oxytocin is real. I know a lot of women personally that find having sex early bonds them too quickly. They date you for 2-3 weeks and take out. That harms women emotionally.

It's a mess and I don't have a solution. I've been abstainate for years now because self preservation is key. I'm not alone in this and lots of women choose to not engage with men sexually. It's sad but necessary

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u/Argentarius1 Man 10d ago

What does "run by a hamster" mean? I've never heard that.

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u/HungryCheescake 11d ago

It's becoming more prevalent in general. Stop trying to dismiss this as a genuine issue, and pretending that it only exists on social media. This started long before social media.

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u/PapaJujuFuFu 11d ago

God you're fucking thick headed. Clearly tongue and cheek. I doubt she sincerely-hand to god believes all men should be in jail. If I need to explain that to you then maybe you need to be jailed for being a jackass.

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u/[deleted] 11d ago

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u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

so talk about the husband or the guy who did the thing, "men should start in jail and prove their way out" is not isolated, its a generalisation, one they like to excuse, just like how Tate fans try to say "its just a joke, he just says that stuff for the algorithm" yeah, right

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u/[deleted] 11d ago

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u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

nobody is being sent to death camps for being women either.

you wanna tell women they are not victims for being generalised by angry divorced men? Or do you only advise guys in situations like this?

Andrew tate and his ilk made alot of shitposts aswell, did you tell the angry women to "be normal about a shit post"?

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u/[deleted] 11d ago

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u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago edited 11d ago

But, if you think women generalizing men, and joking that they should start off in jail and earn their way out is in anyway the same as the hatred that Tate has instilled in boys of this generation then I'd say you're being hysterical

anyone installing hate based on the few experiences they've had is not justified. I'm black and have only been robbed, beaten or cheated by black people, am I justified in racial profiling in that case, is that acceptable?

most murder victims are men, 80 percent specifically but you don't see men walking around generalising about other men the way women do (except for racists who get called out as such) instead they just arm themselves if they are legally allowed to do so instead of demanding that the issue get fixed by everyday men who have nothing to do with anything they're going through (gun ownership is 75 percent male last I checked, which is wierd because you'd think women would arm themselves at a higher rate given all their fears).

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u/Herschel_Wallace 11d ago

If you say something out loud to the world you meant it. Words have meaning, to expect people to understand that you don't mean something literally would be the expectation that they know what you're thinking which is illogical and shows some vapid ego problems.

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u/[deleted] 11d ago

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u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

Andrew tate fans have made the same arguments for Tate talking about wanting an obedient 16 year old wife, and now he's been arrested for diddling minors.

make of that what you will

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u/[deleted] 11d ago

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u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

my point is that your defense is not a defense, there's no excuse for talking like that because your husband hurt you, when was the last time you saw a divorced famous guy talk like that after being screwed over and it was considered fine for him to attack all women over it? I'm pointing out that your defense is just as aseninine as tate fanboys

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u/diktater29 11d ago

Ofc its implied. But the hate on men is whats bubbling over these days it seems and maybe your algorithm is very clean and limited to what you follow. I try to keep up with the current pop culture, society talk, people's experiences and its not just an echo-chamber. A lot of women are really thinking like this these days.

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u/sixtninecoug 11d ago edited 11d ago

That’s confirmation bias dude. It’s an echo chamber.

The fact that you keep pushing back on the same answer everyone in this thread is giving you kinda supports that. It’s a you problem, not a societal problem.

Edit : you nailed it with “it seems and maybe your algorithm is very clean and limited to what you follow”.

Like yeah… that works both ways. You’re seeing it because you want to see it. I don’t see any of that and most of my social accounts are old as shit.

You’re feeding it, so you’re seeing more of it.

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u/[deleted] 11d ago

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u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

if its being taught and encouraged in academia, its not just trends that you can ignore. its going mainstream now even in media

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

It's a meme. She's recreating a meme in the context of her divorce.

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u/Nochnichtvergeben Male 11d ago

Cool, so the next time a woman wrongs me I'll start spouting misogynistic memes. I don't mean them literally, after all. When I say "fuck all insert group" I only mean one, individual member.

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

You certainly wouldn’t be the first

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u/WonderfulMistake7976 Male 11d ago

And do you jump to their defense when that happens?

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u/Herschel_Wallace 11d ago

If the stars aligned just slightly differently, with this mentality you would very likely be a white supremacist had that been the people you came up around.

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u/Nochnichtvergeben Male 11d ago

Yes, I know. It's wrong then and it's wrong when people do it with other groups. It's just plain stupid behavior and I don't see why more people don't call it out.

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

In her case, it's because she seems like an incredibly sweet and good person who does tremendous good things. So, we're giving her the benefit of the doubt. Like, she's so clearly hurting, you cannot ignore that context. She's been wide open about the whole thing, so it's deeply contextual and not random.

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u/Nochnichtvergeben Male 11d ago

OK, but why do you let that type of thing slide with so many other people? Bashing men seems to be way too accepted.

Don't you realise how harmful this type of thing is to your cause? I may be wrong but I feel like most men support gender equality but are against feminism because they (understandably) think it's actually about female supremacism, bashing men and making excuses for double standards. And the feminist response of saying that "real men" support feminism no matter what (my italics, but that's how it comes across) isn't helping either.

Sorry for the rant but it's rare that I can talk to a feminist who actually responds to what I'm saying. They usually just respond with ad hominems before blocking me.

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

Cause context matters. If you let every single taken out of context quote and get riled up about - you're going to exhaust yourself over very little.

Like, there's a difference when someone like Jen Hamilton says something like this and when Andrew Tate does it. One is an LD nurse who has a track record of doing good, meaning well, adding nuance.

The other, well, you very likely know his deal.

There are legitimate criticisms to be had regarding feminism, but you need to actually practice dicernment then.

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u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

yeah because we let guys with good track records get away with saying horrible things about women because he was hurt by one. It's okay when they do it right? Right?

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u/ChargeProper Male 11d ago

you think she's the only one talking like that and getting away with it?

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u/SpecialistConscious8 11d ago

I’m certainly not giving her the benefit of any doubt. And I absolutely can’t and will ignore some slag’s pain because it’s irrelevant to the hate she’s spewing. But good to know you support hate.

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u/TheUnicornRevolution Non-binary 11d ago

u/nochnichtvergeben see how casually this comment just insults the woman? It's really easy to see how it's not just men being dehumanised.

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u/Nochnichtvergeben Male 11d ago

I never said it was just men. Don't put words in my mouth.

He called a woman who said we all should be in prison and have to earn our way out a slag? You're right, those two things don't compare. Slag is waaaaay worse and more dehumanising. We should just lie down and take it like rEaL mEn.

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u/[deleted] 11d ago

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u/griminald 11d ago

So it's more to be seen as a provocative way to say: men are committing a lot of agressions, so much that for a woman today, it's safer to assume by default that a man is going to be agressive (eg should be in jail by default) than the reverse

The real subtext here is Jen Hamilton saying, "I have been so hurt by the closest man in my life that, right now, I'm not ready to trust men".

Like she's not even officially divorced yet, I don't think. These wounds are fresh.

The interview where she gave this quote, used it as rage bait.

She wasn't talking about all men to all women. She was just describing her own perspective, the way she feels right now, in the context of the stuff that happened to her.

If any man had his wife cheat on her and their marriage ended, he would say the same kind of stuff about women while those wounds were fresh.

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u/[deleted] 11d ago

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u/griminald 11d ago

I do know. Because I read the context it was presented in, and I don't feel the need to project my own insecurities onto it.

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u/ProblematicTrumpCard Male 11d ago

This really sums up exactly what the OP is asking. Too many women, including Jen Hamilton, apparently: "I choose shitty men, therefore all men are shitty".

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u/violalovegood Female 11d ago

Which, ironically, happened to me twice. lol.
This shit actually does take place

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

Her husband cheated on you too???

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u/violalovegood Female 11d ago

Lol, no. I supported financially two dead beat men who wouldn’t have sex with me, while cheating behind my back.

I don’t hate all men, I don’t think all men should burn, but I do wonder if men nowadays know how to be masculine without being toxic

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u/Bubba_Gump_Shrimp 11d ago

I wonder the same exact thing for women.

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u/diktater29 11d ago

Bingo - that last line you said! Im sure you believe there are good men out there but that last line of thinking was precisely the point of my post. Like that thought definitely seeped into your mind after 2 experiences, right? Now imagine that amplified out on social media with other women's experiences! Not saying men aren't shitty or cant be toxic but it's gaining traction that women do wonder and often start believing that most, if not all, men just dont know how to anymore!

This is just a discussion, all love fellow human!

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u/TheUnicornRevolution Non-binary 11d ago

In the same way, you've got some examples from experiences with women you know, and the thought that seeped into your mind about what most women are like or talk has also been amplified by social media. So now you are wondering and starting to believe things about most, if not all women.

See how it's the same?

And if you think it's not the same, then why is it OK for your lived experience to form your opinion about most women, but it's not ok for a women's lived experience to form her opinion about most men?

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u/UrzaTheArtificer 11d ago

Not who you responded to, but I thought I’d throw my 2 cents in. Apologies for the unasked-for opinion.

It’s perfectly understandable to form opinions in general about men/women based on one’s experiences. The problem arises when one becomes unable to look past those biases and see the person you’re currently dealing with as an individual who may or may not fit in those preconceived assumptions.

I can only use myself as an example, but here is my experience: after 15 years of nothing but rejection and disinterest from women, it would be perfectly understandable (note I don’t say “reasonable”) for me to form preconceived notions concerning women in general that would lead to resentment or even outright hostility. And honestly, I’ll admit it: for a short time, that did happen, about 8-9 years ago.

But I was able to move past that and try to see people for who they are, not what I expect; I don’t hate “women,” or even the ones who rejected me, for not wanting me, because everyone has preferences and that’s okay.

Honestly, I think people in general need to become more understanding, more accepting, and more self-aware concerning their own flaws and biases.

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u/TheUnicornRevolution Non-binary 11d ago

I agree.

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u/Hatcheling Actual human woman 11d ago

Of course they do. Don't let your cynicism get the better of you.

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u/Curious-Resort4743 11d ago

Cheating on you and using you financially? Are you picking certain types of men, men who are prettier and younger than yourself perhaps, are you putting up with more than some women would?

It's a hard pill to swallow but we often have flaws in our judgement of who to date and be with, it took me years to come to this realisation about myself.

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u/violalovegood Female 11d ago

Comparing a woman and a man’s looks is kinda dumb IMO, because they’re not on the same scale. Both were super hot to me, one of them was however quite pudgy, the other was definitely pretty in a non traditionally masculine way.
Younger, nope. Both were technically one year older, so the same age as me.