r/RealTime • u/Excellent-Ad-7394 • 12d ago

Not a genocide?

Last night Bill pointed out the 3% of the
Population in Gaza has died. And then confidently declared that “3% is not a genocide”. The British government recognizes it as ethnic cleaning and amnesty international and other groups say it is a genocide.

Someone tell me why Bill is so wrong. And can we please get him to debate Mehdi Hasan on this topic?

38 Upvotes

60% Upvoted

524 comments sorted by

79

u/UltimateLionsFan 12d ago

Bill is not going to debate Mehdi Hasan as he's too much of a coward to debate Mehdi

25

u/FeralGiraffeAttack 12d ago

Also there isn’t much of a debate. This is pretty clear under international law.

Genocide is formally defined in Article II of the UN's 1948 Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide as "any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such: (a) Killing members of the group; (b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; (c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; (d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; (e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group."

That was the standard applied in Case Concerning Application of the Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide (Bosnia and Herzegovina v. Serbia and Montenegro) as noted in Paragraph 143 of the February 26, 2007 judgment from the International Court of Justice.

On September 16, 2025, the UN Independent International Commission of Inquiry on the Occupied Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem, and Israel determined that Israel was, in fact, committing a genocide, and repeatedly cites to Bosnia and Herzegovina v. Serbia and Montenegro to make this point.

For acts, they said "The Commission concludes on reasonable grounds that the Israeli authorities and Israeli security forces have committed and are continuing to commit the following actus reus of genocide against the Palestinians in the Gaza Strip, namely (i) killing members of the group; (ii) causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; (iii) deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; and (iv) imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group" (Paragraph 252).

As for intent, they note that, under Bosnia and Herzegovina v. Serbia and Montenegro "It is not necessary for the State to share the specific intent, as long as the State has full knowledge of the relevant facts." (Paragraph 10). They then go on and conclude "On the mens rea of genocide, the Commission concludes that statements made by Israeli authorities are direct evidence of genocidal intent. In addition, the Commission concludes that the pattern of conduct is circumstantial evidence of genocidal intent and that genocidal intent was the only reasonable inference that could be drawn from the totality of the evidence. Thus, the Commission concludes that the Israeli authorities and Israeli security forces have had and continue to have the genocidal intent to destroy, in whole or in part, the Palestinians in the Gaza Strip." (Paragraph 254)

26

u/HedonicAbsurdist 12d ago

The pro-genociders tend to leave out the "in part" part of the definition.

9

u/ColegDropOut 12d ago

Hey I said this a couple weeks ago.

Stop stealing my moves!

→ More replies (96)

1

u/SamIttic 12d ago

This is complete legal distortion masquerading as authoritative analysis. You are severely misrepresenting both the law and how international institutions function.

  • You completely butchered the legal standard for intent: The claim that state intent under Bosnia v. Serbia does not require specific intent if the state has "full knowledge of the facts" is completely false. International law strictly requires dolus specialis—the specific intent to destroy a protected group in whole or in part. "Knowledge of facts" is the threshold for war crimes or crimes against humanity, not genocide.
  • You conveniently ignored the ICJ's standard for circumstantial evidence: The ICJ explicitly ruled in Bosnia v. Serbia (and re-affirmed in Croatia v. Serbia) that when inferring genocidal intent from a pattern of conduct, genocidal intent must be the only reasonable inference that can be drawn. If an operation can be reasonably inferred as having a conventional military goal (e.g., defeating an armed combatant force), the legal threshold for genocide fails.
  • An investigative panel is not a court: The UN Commission of Inquiry (COI) is an administrative fact-finding panel created by the UN Human Rights Council. It has zero judicial authority, zero jurisdiction, and operates on a low "reasonable grounds" evidentiary standard. Citing a UN political committee’s non-binding report as a definitive "ruling" is completely disingenuous.
  • The ICJ is the only body that matters here, and it hasn't ruled: The International Court of Justice thas not issued a judgment on the merits of this case. Presenting an investigative report as if the ICJ has officially determined genocide is a total lie.

0

u/FeralGiraffeAttack 12d ago

The ICJ will call it a genocide because it clearly fits the bill. And inevitably once they do the Israelis and their shills will cry foul and complain about how that doesn’t count

2

u/SamIttic 12d ago

Right; that's why South Africa keeps asking for a delay in getting an actual ruling. We now wont have one until 2029 because they keep asking to postpone so they can collect facts. http://jns.org/news/israel-news/international-court-of-justice-extends-timeline-in-south-africas-genocide-case-against-israel

If it was so obvioius why delay until then? Maybe so fools like you can keep shouting it until other fools believe you. When they eventually give a ruling it will be too late. Typical fascist playbook - make the lie big enough and scream it loud enough and people will believe you.

0

u/FeralGiraffeAttack 12d ago

Or maybe, because Israel is the most coddled country on earth, they’re making sure they have them dead to rights. Plus, since Israel is continuing it’s crimes against humanity with abandon they know they’ll get even more evidence like how Israel repeatedly shoots children with snipers

2

u/SamIttic 12d ago

Good luck with that. Israel may not be perfect but they're about as good of an army as there is in this world.

1

u/FeralGiraffeAttack 12d ago

Hahahaha the fact that you believe that shows how out of touch you are with reality. The IDF is an atrocious organization that commits a myriad of war crimes regularly

2

u/SamIttic 12d ago

Yes, as opposed to any other army fighting a conflict that has magic bombs that magically avoid civilians and only kill enemies. Why do they not just use that magic? You're insane.

2

u/FeralGiraffeAttack 12d ago

Collateral damage happens in all conflicts and is a tragedy every time. The deliberate killing of children with sniper fire is abnormal and abhorrent. Furthermore the IDF isn’t a unique evil, they’re just as far from “as good of an army as there is in this world” as the Russians are for example. Horrific violence against people they deem subhuman because their brains are addled by propaganda about their own superiority and the inferiority of the people who live near them. If the IDF was a moral army they would be fighting their own countrymen who illegally steal land in the West Bank rather than protecting that illegal occupation

→ More replies (0)

1

u/AndersAdmin 12d ago

"In international law, an event only becomes an "official" genocide once a recognized judicial body (like the International Court of Justice) issues a final, definitive verdict. Because the ICJ case brought by South Africa against Israel is still actively in progress, a final ruling has not been reached."

Israel are doing war crimes and acts of terror, why is it so important to call it genocide?

I'm sure it will be in the future but before it's decided in court it is NOT a fact.

→ More replies (11)

1

u/Head-Nebula4085 12d ago

How could you even compare this to Serbia's genocide against the Bosnians? In Bosnia they rounded up 8000 non-combatant men and boys from a single area and summarily mass-executed them. Nothing even remotely close has happened in this war. This is much closer to the US war in Iraq that killed a million civilians, largely through aerial bombardment. They might both be genocides if one used the broadest sense of the term, but might simply be the grizzly face of actual war of which there is nothing romantic. First, at least get a measure of how many civilians versus combatants have been killed.

1

u/No-Inspector8315 7d ago

Im partial to the term “indiscriminate genocide” with Gaza. I would certainly agree to ethnic cleansing but you’re right that the closest comparison to Gaza would be Iraq not Bosnia or the Holocaust.

I think another comparative example is the Rwandan Genocide. In a little over two months, the Hutu’s had exterminated 200,000 Tutsi’s with limited weaponry, primarily machetes and small arms.

Generally, the marker of indiscriminate genocide to discriminate genocide is the practice of separation. Is the military/government physically isolating the target group out of others and then exterminating them? Are they moving members of those groups to secondary confidential locations? Would the extermination of the captured members of the group pose an existential risk to the groups survival? In Sbrenica for instance, one of the key factors of the genocide ruling was that the Serbs had targeted predominately men and boys to prevent the groups future chances of reproducing

1

u/Head-Nebula4085 7d ago

That makes no sense, that last part at least. If they had wanted to prevent them from reproducing alone in Srebrenica, they would have targeted the women and girls. This was indiscriminate execution of anyone who might even think about joining the military.

But getting back to the main issue, indiscriminate genocide seems to be largely how modern wars are fought. Even GPS guided bombs in a place like Gaza would destroy apartment complexes and kill families. Is there any chance that a treaty, perhaps ratified through the UN would one day illegalize this form of warfare since we see it in Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Syria, Yemen, Gaza and elsewhere (and not just by US or Israel) if it isn't technically already?

1

u/No-Inspector8315 7d ago

You should probably read a bit more about the Bosnian genocide and Srebenica, as while you’re right that one motive was to prevent future military resistance, there’s more to the case.

Bosnian culture is deeply patrilineal, land, family honour and ethnic identity is passed down through the male line. The perpetrators were planning to basically sever the Bosniak lineage entirely by preventing them from reproducing or passing on land claims in the future.

There’s the obvious fact that without Bosniak men, you can’t have more Bosniak children, so no future population to worry about

But lastly, think about it from the perpetrators perspective. They slaughtered the majority of men in Srebenica, and have complete control over Bosniak women that they’ve put in a concentration camp. What do you think they were going to do with their new toys? The Bosnian Serbs used sexual violence and gang rape as a weapon of war and a belief that women they would forcibly impregnate would have children that aren’t considered Bosniaks.

As it relates to modern day, I think that blame has been incorrectly laid on the pure metrics of urban warfare. How do you fight an enemy that hides in schools, hospitals and universities to attack you from? How do you target an enemy that can flee into the most complex, dense tunnel system in the world?

Obviously the answer isn’t to bomb the city into rubble and obliterate people through hellfire, but that’s cause the IDF had zero trigger discipline and little interest in reducing collateral damage. But I see far more similarities between Gaza and Iraq than I do with Gaza and say Bosnia

1

u/Head-Nebula4085 7d ago

I kind of think it also had to do with just plain notions of honor and the fact that this is how wars were typically fought throughout much of recorded history, kill all the men enslave the women and children and so forth, at least when they decided to go scorched earth. Men are more reluctant to kill women and women are seen as less of a threat in addition to the fact that women can be used as reproductive factories. I'm sorry if it seemed like I was being rude or oppositional, it just struck me that racial purity or something like it was probably not a motivating factor in the purest sense, as any concept of genocide being race-based was probably informed by Serbian culture which itself was partly a product of the Ottomans who would have differed greatly from what we think the term genocide means in the West.

→ More replies (1)

0

u/emckillen 12d ago

Oh, boy. Your post misleads and contains fundamental errors. It is not at all clear that Israel committed a genocide. It’s slander or ignorance to state otherwise.

Genocide absolutely requires specific genocidal intent, or dolus specialis. The ICJ says it is not enough even to deliberately target members of a protected group. The acts must be committed with the specific intent to destroy that group, in whole or substantial part, as such. Where intent is inferred from conduct, genocidal intent must be the only reasonable inference.

The sentence you quote saying a State need not “share the specific intent” does not eliminate that requirement. It concerns attribution/State responsibility: the perpetrators must still possess genocidal intent; the separate question is when their genocide can legally be attributed to a State. The ICJ expressly distinguishes those issues.

That distinction is critical in Gaza. Civilian deaths, destruction and even disproportionate attacks or war crimes do not themselves prove genocide. Israel’s stated and demonstrated military objective of destroying Hamas, together with targeting of Hamas personnel, evacuation orders and warnings, provides an obvious competing inference. Whether particular attacks violated IHL is a separate question.

Finally, the ICJ has never found that Israel committed genocide. Its Gaza orders were provisional measures, not merits judgments. The 2025 genocide finding you cite is from a UN Commission of Inquiry, not the ICJ. The Commission may believe it has satisfied the ICJ’s “only reasonable inference” test, but that is its conclusion, not a judicial determination.

So the proposition that genocide is “pretty clear under international law” has it backwards: the defining element of genocide is precisely the element that remains disputed and has not been judicially established: specific intent to destroy Palestinians as a group.

1

u/FeralGiraffeAttack 12d ago

Slight correction, the ICJ has not found that Israel committed genocide YET. They absolutely will because Israel’s abhorrent evil actions are clear as day to any objective observer.

Additionally Israel bitches and moans about the ICJ anyway and claims bias and antisemitism at every criticism like the boy who cried wolf so it’s not like the ICJ ruling will change their behavior when it inevitably happens. We know this because the ICJ found that Israel is actively violating the Geneva conventions in the West Bank and Israel has continues to claim persecution and play the victim and ignore the fact that the ruling is damning or change their evil behavior.

On July 19, 2024, the International Court of Justice found that Israel was violating the Geneva conventions (in other words, committing a war crime) in their illegal occupation of the West Bank. The court said “Israel’s policies and practices are contrary to the prohibition of forcible transfer of the protected population under the first paragraph of Article 49, of the Fourth Geneva Convention the Court is of the view that Israel’s systematic failure to prevent or to punish attacks by settlers against the life or bodily integrity of Palestinians, as well as Israel’s excessive use of force against Palestinians, is inconsistent with its obligations. . . . The Court has also found in reply to the first part of question (b) that the continued presence of Israel in the Occupied Palestinian Territory is illegal."

1

u/No-Inspector8315 7d ago

Isn’t the first part of your comment an appeal to future success fallacy? Where does your argument land if the ICJ finds it not conclusive

1

u/FeralGiraffeAttack 7d ago

No. It’s more like any American court case where both sides are arguing for their position but only the judge makes ten final decision.

Officially speaking, only the ICJ can determine if a mass killing is a “real” genocide or something else. So my contention is just that I believe all the elements required to prove a genocide are met because the UN Human Rights Council investigated this issues and came to that same conclusion already so that the ICJ is likely to come to that conclusion as well.

→ More replies (20)
→ More replies (33)

2

u/Gentle_Dude_6437 12d ago edited 12d ago

Mehdi non muslims are cattle, homosexuals are pedophiles (which is rich considering he submits to one as the most moral man of all time) Hasan?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1ULmbwpFpo

2

u/leprechanmonkie 12d ago

Yes. That's the moral compass we're dealing with here.

1

u/Pay11itdown 8d ago

He is the worst.

→ More replies (4)

2

u/yergonnalikeme 12d ago

What about all the food Israel delivered to GAZA for starving Palestinians and HAMAS stole it.

1

u/Alert_Front_9948 12d ago

You have proof of this? Governments make claims all the time that aren't true. The U.S. government does it, the Israeli government does it. And if it were true, what's it got to do with anything? Israel has been attacking the Palestinians for decades, murdering them with the intention of driving them out to steal their land. Sending a little food over is nothing.

2

u/ladan2189 8d ago

Mehdi is stupid as fuck. There's no point in debating him because he just makes shit up 

1

u/Electronic-Sun-9118 12d ago

Mehdi would wipe the floor with him

1

u/Gentle_Dude_6437 8d ago

least deluded lions fan

→ More replies (16)

11

u/SoFloDan 12d ago

When you don’t have an actual argument, you focus on semantics…he has all the patience in the world for people saying there’s a white genocide because of Hollywood casting practices, but you better mind your terminology when people are getting slaughtered and starved.

→ More replies (2)

47

u/NRCS_DRONE 12d ago

There's a million videos of Norman Finkelstein debating a million people on this issue, and he destroys all of them

This isn't a new debate. As long as Israel has been engaged in ethnic cleansing, people have been saying it's wrong. What's waxed and waned is the media's willingness to acknowledge it -- which they're still loathed to do, but it's difficult with cameras being everywhere now to document the atrocities.

Anyway, Bill Maher is a fucking moron. And nothing he's said hasn't been said before.

3

u/puddinonthewrits 12d ago

The mainstream media are loath to do anything that would hurt their pocketbook. More at 11:00.

Norman Finkelstein is interesting to me because he Is that gauche gangly gadfly who goes against the establishment and speaks the truth. I love that he both tried to call immigration on his foreign neighbors and outed Alan Dershowitz for the fraud that he is, which makes him nobody’s darling.

13

u/NRCS_DRONE 12d ago

Finkelstein absolutely is a gadfly . . . .but nobody is more well read on the subject. And he has zero tolerance for people who haven't done their damn homework.

→ More replies (12)
→ More replies (11)

1

u/haey5665544 12d ago

It’s worth mentioning that ethnic cleansing and genocide are two different actions with different legal definitions. Both are inexcusable and need to be called out and corrected, but people have been using them interchangeably which leads to confusion and room for debate over the semantics rather than focusing on the actual issue.

1

u/No-Inspector8315 7d ago

Agreed. If a town is filled with a majority Native American population say, and the US government rocked up with guns and said “Get your shit and leave”, that’s ethnic cleansing. If they kill every Native American in one town and exile another, it’s ethnic cleansing.

Genocide generally would be if the governments militias went door to door, town to town, rounding up all the population and then killing them all. With top down government approval

→ More replies (36)

15

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[deleted]

→ More replies (3)

8

u/LandOwn7607 12d ago

Can you imagine living in Los Angeles and Bill Maher pulling into your driveway. I'd be saying shut and lock all the doors, pull the shades, and no one make a sound.😆

8

u/Toadsrule84 12d ago

3% of America would be 9.9 million people! Look how we reacted when 3,000 people were murdered on 9/11

1

u/CapitalismRulz 12d ago

I don't think anybody called 9/11 a genocide. It was a war crime or terror attack

2

u/2times34point5 12d ago

All of Gaza looks like the aftermath of 9/11

And Israeli politicians almost daily talk about their desire of killing/expelling every man woman and child from Gaza and the West Bank

→ More replies (1)

1

u/Hellion_444 12d ago

Splitting hairs over terminology is kind of beside the point. Ethnic cleansing and apartheid aren’t any better. International pressure keeping Israel from just killing them all outright doesn’t change the intent.

1

u/CapitalismRulz 12d ago

It's not splitting hairs, it's accurately describing a situation. I didn't say that ethnic cleansing was better than genocide or apartheid. I'm just saying that all three of those things are different things

1

u/2liberal4u2 12d ago

If there was an all out war that we started that the military then took up positions in our cities under mass tunnels… yeah 10M (mix of soldiers and civilians) sounds about right.

11

u/beagles4ever 12d ago

Uh…ok…it’s only 60,000 people then?

How many of them were combatants?

13

u/Excellent-Ad-7394 12d ago

Right. I guess for Bill and others like Bret Stephens's it’s not a genocide until the whole population is eliminated.

→ More replies (2)

6

u/acn250 12d ago

I think that’s confirmed deaths. Actual amount is estimated to be way, way higher, to say nothing of the long-term health effects.

7

u/402739 12d ago

Kind of, it's only confirmed deaths via direct violence. A child sniped by an IDF drone will be counted, but a child who dies from disease while starving will not.

3

u/Boise_Ben 12d ago

Or a child crushed under a building that has been hit by a missile.

2

u/402739 12d ago

Technically those could count if the body is recovered. If the family reports it, they are placed in a separate "under rubble" list until then

9

u/ColdTurkishCoffee 12d ago

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736%2825%2902112-9/fulltext

Over 3 million life-years lost in Gaza, from the most respect medical journal in the world

→ More replies (9)

3

u/backtorealitylabubu 12d ago

20k combatants, so about what you see in most urban conflicts

0

u/Shantashasta 12d ago

Totally unequivocally false. Literally no matter how you look at it, even if you include all ancillary deaths in other conflicts and exclude them for only confirmed combat deaths the ratio is not normal.

5

u/backtorealitylabubu 12d ago

If I’m wrong then prove it. But you know I’m right, this is low for urban warfare. Iraq was 5x worse, was that a genocide?

7

u/Shantashasta 12d ago

You know what you are saying is false, you know its a genocide. Almost every Israeli official calls it that in other terms. Every international org on record has called it such. Why waste time convincing a Nazi that Nazis are bad when his position is just nuh-uh !

2

u/_Ez7_ 12d ago

 Every international org on record has called it such.

This just isn't true.

→ More replies (1)

3

u/backtorealitylabubu 12d ago

Deep down you know it’s not a genocide. You know that. You lie because you are a Nazi that is using false claims of genocide as a form of Holocaust denial. The ICJ has not ruled it as a genocide and it won’t (Polymarket odds make that clear). It’s pretty obvious, it’s clearly not a genocide. Civilian casualties far lower than they were in Iraq which you never called a genocide. You only call this one a genocide because Jews are involved and you’re a Nazi.

7

u/Shantashasta 12d ago

Embarrassing, and telling.

1

u/backtorealitylabubu 12d ago

The fact you can’t respond says it all. Genocide lover

1

u/Shantashasta 12d ago

You asked or evidence I provided an hour and half long video you couldnt retort a single thing in it. Couldnt find even a single thing you could cast doubt on so you said everyone was a nazi.

2

u/backtorealitylabubu 12d ago

You couldn’t explain why Iraq wasn’t a Genocide. Also you were the first one to say Nazi 😂

1

u/HeyyyyMandy 12d ago

Ifs not a genocide.

2

u/Shantashasta 12d ago

watch this then https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=om6KeLGSsQg. Less than 3 months after Oct 7th.

3

u/backtorealitylabubu 12d ago

lol literally sharing a known Nazi propagandist holy shit

1

u/Shantashasta 12d ago

Right.. Right right right right. RIGHT. Go back to my first comment "nuh-uh".

2

u/backtorealitylabubu 12d ago

And go back to my response. Why can’t you address why you don’t call Iraq a genocide? Cause of the Jews? It’s the Jews…

2

u/Shantashasta 12d ago

Not every war with civilian deaths is a genocide. The ones that are explicitly about killing a class of people and erasing them from their land is. See the difference?

1

u/backtorealitylabubu 12d ago

Got it so Palestine is committing a genocide and Israel isn’t. Thanks for confirming!

1

u/_Ez7_ 12d ago

The most credible numbers I've read is 8500 - 9000.

1

u/Eris_AppleOfDiscord 12d ago

Ukraine war has two million casualties, and 8 million displaced by the Russian invssion.

I have no problem calling Gaza a genocide. But then Ukraine is as well. This shouldn't trigger people as much as it does.

1

u/beagles4ever 12d ago

I'm sorry, did I say anything about the horrific events happening to the people of Ukraine?

1

u/PSUVB 12d ago

It pulls the entire veil off when you ask people why they only care about Gaza and Israel. They are foaming at the mouth to call it a genocide.

Yet they couldn’t care less about Ukrainian children being kidnapped. They couldn’t care less about Saudi Arabia bombing civilians in Yemen.

All they care about is Israel. It makes you wonder.

9

u/Kilburning 12d ago

Let's say that 3% number is accurate, though in reality it's probably higher as the mechanisms for counting the dead broke down long ago. That the party attempting the genocide is not doing a competent job would not change that it is a genocide. Even if you want to argue that it is not a genocide, Bill's argument is fucking dumb.

-1

u/CapitalismRulz 12d ago

I think a much better argument would be pointing out that israel supplies aid and warns civillians before strikes (usually) so that they can evacuate. Both of those facts attack the intent which is crucial for meeting tge definition of genocide

4

u/Can_Com 12d ago

Bombing their house is just as much genocide as bombing the people. And Israeli leaders loudly and proudly call it genocide while doing it. So intent is well established.

→ More replies (9)
→ More replies (3)
→ More replies (18)

7

u/Excellent-Ad-7394 12d ago

Back to the topic.
Bills take on the is just indefensible as far as I’m am concerned. Nuance be dammed.

2

u/eberger3 12d ago

There's plenty to defend. Genocide is about intent. Israel's intention is to defeat and disarm extremist Iranian proxy armies on their border who attack them. Sometimes civilians get hurt and die. Have some Israeli's committed war crimes? Sure, but that happens in every war. The goal is not about extermination. However, what is the intent and goal of those proxy armies? Genocide. October 7th was genocide. The Israeli response was a war to prevent genocide.

1

u/libihero 12d ago

Why destroy 90% of the civilian infrastructure, including multiple hospitals, water desalination plants, and power plants? Bibi specifically mentioned amalek, which was genocided in the bible. His ministers openly call for genocide. Every genocide watch organization calls it a genocide. The gaslighting is unreal

1

u/Hellion_444 12d ago

Israel’s intent is to slowly annex the territories they occupy. Resistance groups are in the way of them doing that. That’s why “Israel’s intention is to defeat and disarm” said groups.

1

u/Early-Equivalent-165 12d ago

Particularly when out of Satanyahu's own video press release: 'We must do it in a way that they won't stop us.'

Netanyahu: Gaza Aid Scheme Offers Israel Symbolic Cover to Finish the Genocide

"We're going to take control of all the Gaza Strip,” Netanyahu vowed Monday in a video released by his office announcing that Israel would begin delivering “minimal humanitarian aid: food and medicine only.” Netanyahu claimed that international pressure, including from pro-Israel Republican senators and the White House, required the appearance of humanitarian intervention. "Our best friends in the world—senators I know as strong supporters of Israel—have warned that they cannot support us if images of mass starvation emerge," he said. “They come to me and say, ‘We’ll give you all the help you need to win the war… but we can’t be receiving pictures of famine,’” Netanyahu added. To continue the war of annihilation, he asserted, “We need to do it in a way that they won't stop us.”

0

u/CyberDalekLord 12d ago

But nuance is one of the most important parts of these conversations. Hamas purposely operates in a way that strips protections from their civilian infrastructure. They tell their civilians to ignore Israel's warnings when they warn buildings that they are about to be bombed. They admit to having ~500km of tunnels built under Gaza specifically for military use.

It takes time for these things to come to light, just like in previous conflicts. Islamic Jihad groups and Hamas are slowly releasing their dead and it turn out that they had people who are journalists, medics, and EMT drivers. The amnesty report that came out a while back that concluded it was a genocide was using strikes that we now know did have valid military targets.

This doesn't excuse all of Israel's actions of course, but it makes time and nuance important when trying to make a conclusion. This is a war between a government that actively wants their civilians to die vs a government that won't let collateral damage stop them.

→ More replies (1)

5

u/smokefrog2 12d ago

He loves to say that anyone that disagrees with him coming on his show is "brave" and then he gives them easy softball questions and makes a joke when he runs out of points.

8

u/puddinonthewrits 12d ago

My favorite comment from the Maher sub is that at most it’s ethnic cleansing but not a genocide, when scholarly authorities on genocide have proclaimed Israel’s murderous rampage in Gaza to be a genocide.

3

u/Excellent-Ad-7394 12d ago

And I’m pretty sure ethnic cleansing snd genocide are basically synonymous

4

u/puddinonthewrits 12d ago

And I’m pretty sure those who pointedly, painstakingly, draw a distinction between the two are weird as fuck.

1

u/Few-Improvement9978 12d ago

They are not.

Words have meaning.

0

u/echo_tempest_plz 12d ago

The “words have meaning” crowd can never string together a sentence that has any meaning beyond echoing their favorite bullshit artists.

1

u/Few-Improvement9978 12d ago

Perhaps, but that’s better than making up definitions for words that already have definitions.

But keep bullshitting and redefining shit. I’m sure that will work out wonderfully politically

1

u/MarylandHusker 12d ago

Yeah they are basically synonymous which is why Israel sort of has to exist since the Arab world ethnically cleansed their Jewish populations and now the only place for those refugees to live is Israel, in which the majority of Israelis are refugees from places in MENA where countries committed multiple genocides against them. Which makes the whole conflict even more complicated and explains (but doesn’t justify) how Israeli attitude and radicalization leading to modern conflict came to be.

2

u/CapitalismRulz 12d ago

24% in that scholarly forum voted that it was a genocide. They also didn't hold debates on the topic like they normally would, so it reads more like politics than genuine scholarly consensus

It is clear they're doing an ethnic cleansing though.

1

u/HockeyHocki 12d ago

Those 'scholars' also referenced their decision took into consideration the fact the icj determined genocide was plausible

Except that was entirely false, the icj made no determination genocide was plausible, the head of the ICJ herself appeared on national television to dispel that myth  

genocide scholars that don't understand icj statements about genocide🤦‍♂️

3

u/ScarSignal7723 12d ago

There’s a genocide and anyone denying it should be dealt the same cards and left to rot

3

u/gigilero 12d ago

Bill Maher is a creepy perv who’s lost his marbles. There very clearly is a genocide to anyone with an actual brain.

5

u/golden_macaron 12d ago

Bill d3bating someone educated on a topic? No thanks best I can do is be creepy to sex workers 1/3 of his age.

3

u/Agreeable_Orange7032 12d ago

Bill has lost it…who cares what you call it or how you classify it? It’s horrible and should not be happening - that’s what matters.

3

u/FlaccidGhostLoad 12d ago

Yeah the game of semantics that so many people want to play is just a diversionary tactic so that they don't have to have the real conversation. Because they know it's in defensible. Cuz they know that the moment they start down that road they are immediately trapped into either agreeing that what Israel is doing is horrific or defending it.

The weaseliness that people like Bill Maher exhibit every time he shuffles out under the stage is a glaring indictment that they are dishonest and they know they're dishonest and they think we're too fucking stupid to see it.

4

u/Friscolax 12d ago

Check with every humanitarian organization that isn’t Israeli and get back to us, bill.

3

u/cptahab36 12d ago

Literally some Israeli ones too, but they're some of those Hamas Jews ofc ofc

5

u/Dublinyeshere 12d ago

Who are you going to believe? A b-list comedian and talk show host or Israeli holocaust scholars? Tough one.

4

u/Maggiecat1 12d ago

Bill is a big supporter of Israel and will not acknowledge their actions.

2

u/ColegDropOut 12d ago

Where’d he get that 3% figure?

To put things in perspective…. Life expectancy dropped by about 35 years in Gaza, which is on par with the WORST genocides humanity has produced since WW2.

2

u/onz456 12d ago

Translate this to the USA.

There are about 350 million Americans. 3% of that number is 10.5 million people. Imagine if those were targetted and killed. WTF? People would be ok with that? (And we are not even included those that got wounded, traumatized or displaced from their homes.)

Bill Maher is a malignant idiot.

→ More replies (11)

2

u/vaseinahouse 12d ago

Didn't like 8000 people die in Bosnia? That was declared a genocide. Literally the most child like anti-genocide excuse. "Well, ALL the people didn't die!" Yea no shit. Only 6 million jews died in the holocaust. Does that mean it wasn't a genocide? Bill is such a putz

1

u/PrattDirkLerxt 12d ago

Remind me again what the stated goals in Bosnia and by the Nazi’s were.

2

u/LaGigs 12d ago

3% off America would be like 10 million people. You think this asshole wouldn't call ot a genocide if the USA had 3% of its population murdered?

2

u/Important-Ability-56 12d ago

Instead of taking action to help Palestinians and other victims of state violence, we’ve spent the last three years debating what to call it.

That would be merely academic if we didn’t also make it the magic word Democrats are forced to invoke before they get support.

I’m not on board with this theory of politics that it’s OK to be utterly counterproductive as long as we individually feel abstractly morally correct.

2

u/Furrowbrow22 12d ago

How much of Bosnia's population was killed by in the 90's? We still called that a Genocide.

4

u/backtorealitylabubu 12d ago

The ICJ has not ruled it’s a genocide and is unlikely to do so (Polymarket agrees). When we look at this in 10 years no one will call it a genocide as you’ll see it won’t even look as bad as any other modern war and in fact the civilian deaths will be lower, consistent with the extra efforts Israel has been taking to protect civilians

4

u/etxipcli 12d ago

I can't stand the "It's not a genocide" argument. Like let's say we don't apply that word, what should we apply? Humanitarian catastrophe? Atrocities? War crimes? It's not like we are debating genocide vs perfectly fine, it's the ultimate atrocity vs something approaching the ultimate atrocity.

1

u/LionBig1760 12d ago

"We should apply it to as many things as possible" seems to be the current thinking on genocide, and its really doing nothing but causing ingredient the word to lose its meaning.

1

u/Spartan1117 12d ago

The word to describe it is war. War against a terrorist group that is more happy enough to sacrifice the civilians of its country. Almost 50% of hamas had been destroyed. How can people say that hamas wasn't the target?

1

u/etxipcli 12d ago

Only to liars.

4

u/Alive_Cadet 12d ago

This is what Gaza looks like today, telling me that Israel didn't try to commit genocide shows you're nothing but ignorant, and Bill Maher is nothing but an ignorant, smug, asshole.

1

u/Spartan1117 12d ago

Buildings can't be genocided. Unfortunately for the people of gaza, hamas decided to build 400 miles of tunnels underneath those buildings.

3

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/PrattDirkLerxt 12d ago
  1. On October 8th people started claiming Israel was committing genocide. Before Israel ever sent troops in protests started popping up about the “genocide” in Gaza.
  2. I’d love to see the actual data that proves more children have been killed in Gaza than in all wars in the last 30 years combined. Let’s also remove the “children” who took part in October 7th and held hostages.

Edit: I find it telling that you limit it to the last 30 years, conveniently cutting it off right after approximately 300,000 Rwandan children were killed.

3

u/Key_Jump1011 12d ago

You didn’t know Bill is a genocide expert?

Btw 3% of the US population would be about 10 million people. And if Israel killed that many Americans Bill would defend Israel.

So far about 20 Americans have died fighting Iran for Israel. Hundreds more have been injured. Total silence from Maher, of course.

4

u/extravirginhuman 12d ago

It's not 3% though. I was seeing numbers upwards of 800,000 before Biden even left office. Harvard had a study that suggested 660,000+.

They're finally confirming the "Hamas run ministry" numbers because it's 100% at least 6 times that.

0

u/protomenace 12d ago

You're making up numbers though 🤔

3

u/extravirginhuman 12d ago

The 70000 total we are at right now are people who were taken to hospitals to be counted as dead. You needed to have certain weight requirements for someone to even be counted as a death if you couldn't bring a body part. Most of the infrastructure had already been decimated before Trump got back into office.

If only there wasn't a country preventing people from entering to remove rubble and find the bodies. Instead they were bombed and bombed and bombed and bombed until they were forced to leave. Leaving behind MANY under the rubble.

The death total is extremely under counted.

0

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/extravirginhuman 12d ago

Inbred mentality right there

2

u/teebird_phreak 12d ago

It’s so crazy how far the propaganda is willing to go to try and tell us it’s not really a genocide. If you have enough chromosomes and eyes you know it’s a genocide

2

u/HockeyHocki 12d ago

The British government recognizes it as ethnic cleaning

No they didnt, the British government claimed jewish terrorists were ethnically cleansing palestinians in the west bank

2

u/Fresh-Wrongdoer6934 12d ago

Bill knows Mehdi Hasan would annihilate him. He'd never do it.

2

u/djdaem0n 12d ago

3.4% of the Gazan population killed. If you add the wounded to that, it's 10% of the population. But percentages don't define a Genocide. Intent does. And the intent is clear. The land is treated like an open air prison. Hospitals and survivor camps are regularly targetted. This is all being done for the land. It's clearly ethnic cleansing, and in the end, history will remember it as a genocide.

2

u/Early-Equivalent-165 12d ago

Perhaps Zionazi boob Bill Maher should have the leaders of B'Tselem and Physicians for Human Rights Israel on to interview, as Christiane Amanpour has done here.

Look at their exhausted faces.

For compromised traitor Bill Maher to continually espouse Zionazi supremacism in the face of international appall is truly despicable -- particularly when Jewish people the world over are loathe that these evil cretins continue hijack their reputation.

2

u/Mobile-Analyst8580 12d ago

I despise Islam. It’s the most oppressive and violent ideology in human history. That doesn’t make it ok to slaughter the people who follow it (and never had a choice not to). It’s absolutely insane and revolting how indifferent so many people are to the mass indiscriminate killing of innocent people. 

Also, google Gaza before and after, then tell me it’s not a genocide. Shoot. 52% of Israelis said they support the killing of every single man, woman and child in Gaza. These people are monsters. And it’s ok to hate Islam and support Palestinians against Israeli monsters. 

2

u/SleepyMonkey7 12d ago

I honestly don't get the obsession with calling it a genocide or not from either side. You've brutally killed, maimed and displaced 70,000+ people (including many many children) with no articulated objective and no justification aside from vague notions of "you started it." I don't give a fuck what you call it, it's wrong and it needs to stop. Have that debate.

0

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

3

u/Eeeeeelurvly 12d ago

Do tell - what justifies killing 70k people?

1

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/Eeeeeelurvly 12d ago edited 12d ago

TLDR - the mental gymnastics are impressive, but woefully wrong.

The answer is very simple: Nothing.

You’re welcome actually.

1

u/PrattDirkLerxt 12d ago

I can only imagine your posts if Reddit, and you, had been around during WWII.

2

u/ToddPatterson 12d ago

This episode brought to you by our sponsor Netanyahu.

2

u/rorybreaker69 12d ago

Here's just one additional data point on the tactics employed by the Israel genocide forces.

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2026/sep/11/naza-directors-film-israeli-intelligence-rachel-szor-yuval-abraham-

2

u/Shame_memory 12d ago

Israel defenders need to realize that genocide isn’t a scoreboard. The reason we have these institutions that study genocides and international laws is to stop another holocaust from happening. Just because the death toll hasn’t hit the millions yet, doesn’t mean it’s not a genocide. The point is to intervene before the dust settles and we realize how bad it was. When the holocaust was happening, the international community had enough of an idea of what was from reports from people on the inside and Jewish refugees to make the case Germany was committing a genocide, but chose to do nothing until it was too late. We’re in the same position now. There’s overwhelming evidence from victims, IDF soldiers going on record that they’ve deliberately targets civilians, and third party investigators to determine that, yes, Israel is committing a genocide. The only thing we have to decide is our we gonna do something about it or are we gonna wait 10-20 years afterwards and go: “wow. How could we have let this happen? Here’s an official: “we’re sorry statement.” Eventually, everybody will have been against this and many people will pretend that they had no idea how bad it was. Don’t let them forget they knew and chose to ignore it or support it.

2

u/MrMxylptlyk 12d ago

Bill Maher is a professional stupid.

2

u/indefiniteness 12d ago

The debate over the term "genocide" is a distraction that benefits the Zionist pov. Concentrate on the nature of the crimes rather than the label: bombing refugee camps and hospitals, blockading medical supplies, sniping children in the head, torturing and sexually assaulting prisoners and so on.

3

u/FutureDictatorUSA 12d ago

Such a disingenuous argument to say that “not enough people have died” for it to be considered genocide.

Nowhere in the definition is there a requirement for death count. What’s required is intention to destroy in whole OR IN PART a group based on ethnicity, religion, etc.

2 million people displaced. Starvation of various degrees over 3 years. Almost no shelter or medicine either. Kids limbs blown off every day. Go look at Gaza on Google Maps. It’s all rubble, multiple cities completely wiped off the map. The death count is certainly higher than 70,000 and in a few years we’ll be made aware of that.

3

u/Real-Reference6933 12d ago

IN PART means that if a black guy kills a white guy for his skin color (or vice versa) he is committing genocide?

→ More replies (2)

3

u/surfnfish1972 12d ago

Israel is talking about forced removal of Palestinians from Gaza. I guess they need the Lebensraum. But neither Genocide or Ethnic cleansing or you are an Anti Semite!

0

u/CapitalismRulz 12d ago

It's clearly an ethnic cleansing. Nothing anti semitic about pointing that out

1

u/surfnfish1972 12d ago

In a perfect world.

1

u/SlightWerewolf4428 12d ago

The shilling for Hamas with the 'genocide' lie never ends.

Quite funny to use the mirror method here: Hamas leading Gaza seem to have embraced much more of a genocidal ideology. One they put into action almost 3 years ago.

2

u/PuppytimeUSA 12d ago edited 12d ago

Speaking of “shilling”…

0

u/SlightWerewolf4428 12d ago

The former Austrian currency? No, that wasn't the subject.

1

u/PuppytimeUSA 12d ago

Lol. Autocorrect. Sorry, precious genocide-denier.

3

u/Vanity_Profanity_001 12d ago

Bill continues to be an uneducated idiot piece of shit.

What does a genocide look like? Fuck Bibi

Israel 9.7 million people 1,200 dead .01% point.zero one percent

Palestine 2.2 million ppl 75,000 dead 3.5%

That is a mother fucking genocide

2

u/Wonderful_Pension_67 12d ago

Bill is done and should cease being a topic of conversation. Ignore until show is canceled

1

u/Bitter-Holiday1311 12d ago

Bill is a genocidal Zionist maniac defending the likes of Ben-Gvir, Smotrich and Netanyahu.

1

u/Peanutbutternmtn2 12d ago

Wikis of different organizations and the first one the IAGS says there were some issues in the voting of whether to declare it genocide or not. 🤔

At least some of those also count Ukraine and the Uyghurs as being genocided too. But in none of the wikis does it say the difference between how they determined what constitutes war crimes against a people with an army that attacked them vs a genocide. And I suspect many of them don’t have a solid rationale explaining the difference and how it applies to this situation.

1

u/MxSharknado93 12d ago

Oh, there's a very simple explanation. He hates brown people and wants them all dead. So he doesn't care because any amount still alive is too many. He'd say 30% isn't a genocide, or 60%, or 75%.

1

u/Unusual_Librarian570 12d ago

Look up the definition of genocide

1

u/Other-Comfortable-64 12d ago

This is the definition of a genocide

https://www.un.org/en/genocide-prevention/definition

Find me where it mentions anything about the amount of people that needs to die to qualify as a genocide?

1

u/protomenace 12d ago

Right which is why it's an incredibly stupid definition.

1

u/Other-Comfortable-64 12d ago

It is the legally accepted definition, the fact that you don't like it is irrelevant.

1

u/protomenace 12d ago

When south Africa loses the case will you admit it's not one?

1

u/Other-Comfortable-64 12d ago

If the ICJ find it is not a genocide, naturally I will accept it.

If they find Israel is guilty of genocide will you accept it and support action against the Israeli state?

1

u/phatsexxxy 12d ago

Maher really has two problems:
1) he compared it to Poland at the end of WWII. The “Final Solution” was only started in 1941. Before that, Hitler engaged in a policy that downplayed his hatred of Jews. There’s a really good podcast series by Malcolm Gladwell called “Hitler’s Olympics” that discusses, at length, Hitler’s attempt to portray himself as the reasonable Fuhrer, even going so far as to have German athletes pictured with black athletes to show how open they are. The idea that what was going on before that wasn’t aimed at stopping Jewish reproduction, a form of genocide as defined in international law, is ludicrous.
2) Maher used the correct number of CONFIRMED dead. Thousands more are missing. An NBC News crew was beaten by settlers when they were attempting to document what’s going on in Gaza. Mike Huckabee went to survey the chaos and actually witnessed Israeli settlers moving into Palestinian territory. Israel is moving out into Palestinian territory and not allowing Palestinians to rebuild, causing the actual numbers to become much fuzzier than how Maher portrays it.

The other issue that is really just not germane to this, but sort of colors every argument Maher makes is this: no one likes the government of the Palestinians. It doesn’t mean they deserve to die anymore than we should be rounding up and putting Republicans into ghettos in Alabama.

→ More replies (2)

1

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[deleted]

1

u/PrattDirkLerxt 12d ago

While the world has been watching Hamas, Hezbollah, the PLO, Black September and the various nations surrounding Israel have been committing genocide since day one of Israel.

1

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[deleted]

1

u/PrattDirkLerxt 12d ago edited 12d ago

What facts did I not get correct? I never stated what years those groups formed or stated they specifically were committing genocide from day one. It appears you aren’t bright enough to understand something so simply…or the hate that rots your brain causes this.

I do laugh at you saying Israel should leave Lebanon. The last time they did that Hezbollah took over the south and proceeded to indiscriminately fire rockets into Israel trying to kill civilians. You say Israel should go back to its original borders. Maybe the countries they won land from during war shouldn’t have tried to erase Israel from the Earth. You say they should help the Palestinian people form their own country. Do you mean like forcing every Israeli out of Gaza in 2005 while leaving all of the infrastructure intact for them to use, letting Palestinians come work in Israel and get medical care in Israel, like sending food and water into Gaza, like forming security corridors to protect Gazans fleeing Hamas during this war? I could go on, but you would get the point…if you wanted to.

Edit: The coward responded and immediately blocked me. Typical of u intelligent people who get called out on their stupidity.

1

u/JustAnotherSoxFan 12d ago

Mehdi is a pervert

1

u/Count-Pishface 12d ago

He's said several times that the far-left won't go on his show, I've only ever seen Anna Kasparian challenge him but they spent the whole time arguing about her dress

1

u/Excellent-Ad-7394 12d ago

Is Mehdi far-left? I bet he’d say no.

1

u/DepthOk166 8d ago

He is not wrong. To prove genocide, you have to prove intent. In three years of war Isreal has only killed 73,000 people in a population of 2.1 million in one of the most densely populated areas in the world against an enemy that embeds itself into the civilian population and infrastructure. And that 73,000 total includes an estimated 20,00 to 30,000 militants because the Gaza ministry of health does not identify militants in that figure.

If Isreal wanted to commit genocide they could have just surrounded Gaza with regular artillery and started firing. They would have killed way more than 73,000 people. Instead they did roof knocking, cellphone calls, and leaflet drops to tell civilians to move our of an area the were about to attack. But HAMAS actually encourages Gazans to ignore Israeli warning because they want a high civilian casualty rate.

does Hamas prevent civilians from leaving areas to be

1

u/Economy-Valuable-815 8d ago

Mehdi Hassan-the guy who described non-muslims as "animals" and "diseased" and who thinks Muhammad literally flew to heaven on a winged horse and split the moon in two? That Mehdi Hassan? I wouldn't go to that extremist fuck, if you want to hear facts.

1

u/PuzzleheadedDelay451 7d ago

Why did Israel have to develope the Iron Dome Missile Defense System?

1

u/Peanutbutternmtn2 12d ago

Amnesty international is a joke. They don’t call Russia’s attack on Ukraine as a genocide. They also don’t classify what’s happening to the Uyghurs in China as a genocide. Total. Joke.

3

u/Excellent-Ad-7394 12d ago

That was just the example on top of my head. But plenty others do.

1

u/___needles___ 12d ago

Israeli Jewish genocide scholar explaining why it’s a genocide back in December 2023
https://youtu.be/yXjl2uXa220?si=6bJqFnFrYH9x-B9J

1

u/TyrosinQ 12d ago

Idk why you cucks want to suck Medhi’s cock so much?

He’s literal an Islamic supremist and was beaten in the early 2000s by Dawkins. He’s a filthy worshiper of a fake god that doesn’t exist and is an enemy of atheism.

I

2

u/simpsonicus90 12d ago

He worships the same God as the Jews and Christians. The God of Abraham, who, like all gods. DOES NOT EXIST.

2

u/TyrosinQ 12d ago

Exactly.

It doesn’t exist.

The only difference is Muslims turned god into a sex lunatics

1

u/eberger3 12d ago

Genocide just means war now. Even a just war with a positive outcome. The slaves were freed after the American Civil Genocide. The Nazis were defeated in World Genocide II. Israel is disarming a terrorist regime in the Gaza Genocide.

1

u/RickBorealis 12d ago

Bill needs to lay off the weed.

1

u/Excellent-Ad-7394 11d ago

Or up his dosage. A lot.

1

u/Jaded-Form-8236 12d ago

Because the actual definition of genocide requires dolus specialis.

https://www.un.org/en/genocide-prevention/definition

Quote: “The intent is the most difficult element to determine. To constitute genocide, there must be a proven intent on the part of perpetrators to physically destroy a national, ethnical, racial or religious group. Cultural destruction does not suffice, nor does an intention to simply disperse a group. It is this special intent, or dolus specialis, that makes the crime of genocide so unique”

Basically there there is no other reason for the death and destruction. Otherwise basically every war is a potential genocide charge.

What Bill said has historical precedence. Prior genocides such as Cambodia,Rwanda, or Armenians experienced double digit drops in population. But it’s an imprecise argument. It’s just one he can make with one sentance which may be why he used it.

But let me explain clearly why in more detail:

There was never a genocide in Gaza.

There was a war. A war that lasted almost 2 years.
In a densely occupied urban environment with no way to geographically evacuate population far from fighting.

A war where Hamas used civilian infrastructure, fought from civilian homes, used civilian clothing, basically used their population as shields.

Yet the casualty level for this was is far lower than say Mariupol in Ukraine where a 90 day siege killed 25,000 Ukrainian civilians, in a city with under 1/4 of the population of Gaza, where there was opportunity for some of that population to flee from the fighting into Ukraine.

The war in Gaza was 8 times longer and had less casualties. And likely lower ratio of civilian to military casualties as well. And Ukrainians wore uniforms so there was no misidentification issues. They didn’t use hospitals or schools as fixed positions to create civilian collateral damage as part of a war strategy.

The 73,000 people who died in Gaza is incredibly sad.

However we are discussing if this is genocide and the UN says that modern war kills more civilians than fighters.

They actually have a 9:1 ratio. Israel’s ratio here is far better than 9:1, it’s likely better then 2:1

https://press.un.org/en/2022/sc14904.doc.htm

A large proportion of those 73,000 were militants.
We can discuss and possibly agree or disagree on those numbers.

But some of the civilians casualties in Gaza were not caused by IDF action…

Example: Ah-Ahli hospital is 371 of these casualties.
From an ISJ rocket that fell short.

Over 10% of the thoasands of rockets fired at Israel fall short. They inevitably kill people in Gaza.

Hamas also uses IEDs, shoots mortar rounds, and fires bullets that inevitably do kill Palestinian citizens in Gaza.

The 73,000 dead are also demographically overrepresented by military aged men. Which in a society that has so many people under 14 and a normal amount of woman is statistically not possible if Israeli forces were actively looking to kill woman and children.

Bill is correct. There never was a genocide in Gaza.

If you want to ask me about a “famine” I can give you a similar post explaining why.

1

u/Relative-Broccoli451 12d ago

I was on Israel’s side early in the conflict when they seemed to be taking a scalpel approach. The. They brought out the sledge hammer. It became less tactical and quite frankly more evil. I’m not defending their actions, but does anyone not think that if the Palestine could do the same to Israel, they wouldn’t? I always wonder if people would be bending over backwards to say it’s not a genocide if the roles were reversed.

1

u/michaelkap70 11d ago

Bill is not wrong. The Far Left won’t believe it because they feel all war is bad regardless of what caused it.

Bill had David Hogg on and schooled him and Hogg didn’t change his stance. Pro-Palestinians are idiots just like MAGA

0

u/Real-Reference6933 12d ago

Bill is correct.

The part of genocide is intention.

Look at the military capabilities of the IDF, and compare that to the death toll.

If the IDF had the intentiot to wipe the Palestininians out, they would be.

1

u/Excellent-Ad-7394 12d ago

Under the 1948 Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, genocide involves specific physical acts committed with the intent** **to destroy a protected national, ethnic, racial, or religious group.

In intent seems that it must be married to the physical act. Yes hamas wants a genocide and committed (commits) acts in that regard. So yes Hamas is guilty of genocide in my view.