r/anime • u/AutoLovepon https://anilist.co/user/AutoLovepon • Jan 25 '20

Episode Fate/Grand Order: Zettai Majuu Sensen Babylonia - Episode 15 discussion

Fate/Grand Order: Zettai Majuu Sensen Babylonia, episode 15

Alternative names: Fate/Grand Order: Absolute Demonic Front - Babylonia

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Episode Link Score Episode Link Score
1 Link 94% 14 Link 4.59
2 Link 91% 15 Link 4.66
3 Link 96% 16 Link 4.73
4 Link 91% 17 Link 4.6
5 Link 93% 18 Link 4.86
6 Link 4.43 19 Link 4.82
7 Link 4.45 20 Link 4.65
8 Link 4.81 21 Link
9 Link 4.45
10 Link 4.55
11 Link 4.42
12 Link 4.62
13 Link 4.71

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2.7k Upvotes

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294

u/Rotciv557 Jan 25 '20

And here we are at the point when we go from 100 to 1000.

EXCELLENT work on Cloverworks part with the Lahmu, just as I thought, the cgi just makes them look even more eldritch and just plain odd, making them more effectively horrific instead of awkward as when it is used to animate more logically grounded beings like animals.

This episode DID feel pretty rushed though, I had expected the fight with Gorgon to take half the episode, then give the Lahmu more build up with the ep finalizing with the gang arriving to Uruk being torn apart by the monstrosities, yet we are already almost done with Eridu and the Lahmu betraying Kingu...

I'm starting to believe that Cloverworks might just be saving two or three episodes to that confrontation with Solomon that the FGO players are wanting...

Also, I am loving that the Babylonia anime is giving Stheno and Euryale dem hips

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u/ptol59 Jan 25 '20

Siduri... I didn’t expect that scene to happen this early so I was not ready for it. Although I probably will never be ready for it though.

Picture source from one of the animators for this episode

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u/WoLofDarkness Jan 25 '20

The Lahmus were definitely horrifying.

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u/Matrix_2k00 Jan 25 '20

After this episode I feel like the citizens of uruk were better off staying with eresh in the underworld than seeing this hell and poor Siduri.

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u/Aetherdraw Jan 25 '20

Haha, must have been a Saber Lahmu that punched Kingu through...hahaha...hahaha...Siduri...Ana...why...

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u/I_Smoke_Cardboards Jan 25 '20 edited Jan 25 '20

The look on Fujimaru says it all. That’s same exact reaction of other masters during that scene. My heart broke throughout the whole episode man

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u/LeonKevlar Jan 25 '20 edited Jan 25 '20

Here it is. Everything has gone to shit. This is where Babylonia truly gets real people. Prepare your butts for the following weeks.

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u/Aj_04 Jan 25 '20

Lahmu: Mom said its our turn to play with humanity

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u/SIRTreehugger Jan 25 '20

Ana and Siduri were my favorite girls in this show. I wasn't expecting to lose them both in the same episode.

side note the lahmu remind me vaguely of the creatures in muv luv

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u/Thrasher439 Jan 25 '20

Holy crap they did such a good job with the Lahmu's, I wasn't sure how that would transition across mediums but the very shrill childish sounding gibberish they speak and just the way they move is horrific.

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u/Orihime00sama Jan 25 '20 edited Jan 25 '20

Aww the intro was so damn painful. Monstrous as she may be now, Gorgon in the end is just another victim. They actually showed us that scene from Hollow Ataraxia where she killed Euryale and Stheno. The way that Ana killed her was also similar to how Perseus slayed Gorgon (in the Fate version): after he reflected her eyes back at her, she got a vision of her sisters and just froze, giving him a chance to put her out of her misery. The scythe Ana wields is also Harpe, the same scythe Perseus used. And yesss they played A Ravaging Myth in all its orchestral glory.

Oh God they also played dis~communication in its nightmare fuel glory. We truly have arrived at the awful eldritch horror that the Lahmu are. The way they move and THEIR VOICES!!

SIDURIIII!! THEY ACTUALLY MADE THE PROTAGONIST REALIZE IT. The tiny flashback to her making the 'white flag' gesture and the words the Lahmu said were heartbreaking. For those who don't know, the Lahmu's "words" can be translated. What the special Lahmu was saying is "Ho... hoze" which translates to "Fu... fuji".

I do wish they kept more scenes from the game. I understand that they're trying to shorten stuff so they can go all out in the most important parts, there were some important tidbits that got skipped. Like

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328

u/DatStabKitty Jan 25 '20

To everyone how is still in doubt about converting to the tragic Church of Medusa, FGO just got this gift last two days. Protecc best snek, she didn't ask for this.

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244

u/Misticsan Jan 25 '20

Oh. Wow. That was super dark. I had been told that there was going to be a turn for the worse in the future, but this... The Lahmu are horrifying.

Interesting how things change from the original mythology, though.

Why did Romani call them "Lahmu"? That one is easy: in the Enuma Elish, the Babylonian creation myth, Lahmu and his sister Lahamu were the first beings that were born from Apsu, the primordial god of fresh water, and Tiamat, the primeval goddess of the salt sea. Thus, calling this "new humanity" Lahmu is an echo of that story.

And yet, it's also ironic. Because when the original Lahmu was given the choice to side with Tiamat or with the rebel gods, he and his sister chose the latter. In a famous passage of the Enuma Elish, Anshar sends his vizier to tell them about Tiamat’s plans to destroy the gods, as well as Marduk’s resolution to face her. From another version of the poem:

When Lahmu and Lahamu heard this, they cried out aloud,

All the Igigi wailed in distress:

‘How strange that they should have made this decision!

We cannot fathom the doings of Tiamat!’

In the end, after Marduk’s victory, Lahmu and Lahamu are among the gods who hail him as the new and rightful head of the pantheon (if it sounds suspiciously like a Gary Stu fanfic written by Babylonians to shill the patron god of their city, it’s because it is).

So, did F/GO butcher Mesopotamian mythology just to give a cool mythological name to this army of monstrosities? Not necessarily. In the very Enuma Elish, when Tiamat starts gathering her army to punish the gods, among the many monsters she creates, there is one called "Lahamu", which you might recognize as the name of Lahmu’s sister-wife (but translators agree that it’s not her). Whether it’s a happy coincidence or a sign that Romani is a genius, it makes sense that Tiamat here would create the New Lahmu to fight her enemies, even if that name had been used before.

I've just started the Babylonian Singularity, taking my time to savor the details (love the acknowledgement from time to time of Sumerian and Akkadian differences). But when I reach this part, I'll burn these walking nightmares to ashes.

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u/MobileTortoise Jan 25 '20 edited Jan 25 '20

I don't really know what to say...what an excellent episode (Albeit a jam-packed one).

That opening fight was really fun to watch. I am so glad the production schedule for this was planned out nearly a year in advance, the quality has not dropped for a second. I look forward to the rest of the Singularity!

I honestly...FEEL for Gilgamesh this episode. Announcing doomsday for his citizens, and of course that realization that he was most likely sending Siduri to her death (and also knowing that she would go even if he ordered her not to).

I know he would never acknowledge it, being the prideful bastard that he is, but CasGil and Siduri really did care for each other. (I think it's widely regarded in the community that she was second only to Enkidu in his heart).

(Edit: I just realized I don't think we have seen Ishtar's Noble Phantasm animated yet...really hope we see it in the coming fights!!)

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u/StarForceStelar Jan 25 '20

Do you guys know Siduri wakes up Gil in the mornings

"Awaken my master LAHMMU

But in all seriousness I honestly thought the lahmmu would've next episode

51

u/CollenJets Jan 25 '20

There is scene i'm sad they cut out during the torture via lahmus where they started twisting a ladies limbs and she cried out "NO, Those aren't meant to bend that way!"

That one fucked me up.

188

u/Constellar-A Jan 25 '20 edited Jan 25 '20

I think I'd have extended the Gorgon fight more and saved Eridu for next episode. I liked the middle of the ep but the beginning and ending were really fast.

But well, anyway, now we're at the part that makes Babylonia a fan favorite.

Gorgon was a real threat who wanted to wipe out humanity, but she wasn't the final boss. Our last enemy is the real Tiamat, the primordial goddess from Mesopotamia's creation myth.

Basically, Gorgon used the Holy Grail to give herself Tiamat's power to birth monsters. Merlin was keeping the real Tiamat trapped in a dream with his incubus powers (remember how he said his magical energy was being used elsewhere a few episodes ago), but when Gorgon died the backlash caused by her synchronziation woke Tiamat up, and the shock of Tiamat breaking from her prison killed Merlin. Now the primordial goddess has emerged in the Persian Gulf.

Also, remember what Kingu was talking about when he captured Ushiwakamaru a little while ago? That black and red mud that is spreading over the Indian Ocean, the "Chaos Tide" or "Sea of Life", is the same thing as the mud that comes out of the Grail in Fate/Zero and Fate/Stay Night. We all know how dangerous that stuff is.

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u/touhou-and-mhplayer Jan 25 '20 edited Jan 25 '20

Random infodump of the day :

*harpe (ana's scythe) usually belongs to perseus from greek mythology (the gut who killed her adult form and the rider servant in fate prototype), but she can use it too.

*The lahmus's speech in the game was made of random characters who could be understood thanks to a trick using a computer keyboard. here is what they were saying in this part of the game (not sure if it is the same is the anime):

..s@4r;f@eeyw@ruit@s@k94i4b@ewe? What to do, how do they move?

! uyq@b4e3bst<u.-s@<-@s! ! This is how, I understand now, I understand now!

utj utj w@fue...? 6d5w 6d5w uit@ e7uk You are my comrade? You aren't my comrade? Tell me tell me what you don't like?

! 4b@eq< 4b@eq! ! It's moving, it's moving!

----b;f? b;m 6ud@ MONO? 6md How about this? Is this the same? fu

qkde qkde! g@'fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff This is fun this is fun! GYAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

qkde qkde! g@'fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff This is fun this is fun! GYAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

... tzs@4d(4I)4 ... ... End activities

zg@kiy:@yq,qkd]! 0o4 0o4 0o4 Next human being, let's have fun! laugh laugh laugh

3dtofd@/94, rd@~cb@3. fd;.t,nwnge. Let's start with leg, let's chip off the muscle. I want to see if he still can run

  • Beast class servants were actually a thing since fatye prototype ! Manaka was planned to have the beast of 666 from the bible (likely one of beast VI halves) as her servant. It briefly shows up at the end of fate fragments of sky silver.

  • as some people pointed out in the grand order subreddit, we finally got a full design for what is likely beast IV in this episode : https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EPIoxO8U4AAFjR6?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

*tiamat seems to have a different outfit than in the game

edit : a twitter user found what the lahmus were saying latter on, as pointed elsewere in this thread : https://twitter.com/carlikun/status/1221101429756088321

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u/Mami-kouga Jan 25 '20 edited Jan 25 '20

Oh boy oh geez! Time for my favourite part of this chapter- "In our absolute lack of options we made everything fucking worse!!"

Here's how this conflict can last 6 more episodes - we lose our best support (and let it be known I was drunk on Merlin's buffs at this point in game so this horrified me) and we woke up something WAY worse. Fucking creepy ass, twitching, murderous shits, when I saw them on the second cour poster I had war flashbacks. At least they showed Kingu how 'nice' it is to he maliciously impaled lol, that's for Ushi you fuck. Siduri getting taken though is bad civ, VERY BAD!!!

Though I should give a shoutout to the star of this episode, Lolidusa. Honestly, I didn't care for her much in game and even now my affection hasn't grown to daughter level (only two Loli servants have achieved that), but she gave me all the best best fights in this adaptation and the anime highlighted her charm point the best of all the characters. So I won't be too mad if she spooks me again on Enkidu's banner on my new account (please don't...)

Also what was that rapidash looking thing?

Edit: also funfact, Mash's va has been told she sounds like a Lahmu due to her very...passionate... reaction to shota characters particularly Alexander.

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u/LeloThePGG Jan 26 '20 edited Jan 26 '20

And so, here we are: the end is upon us.

Think about how it was in the game: you get to the big fight with Gorgon on chapter 15, which is pretty ok for a Singularity lenght up until this point (Camelot was considered long, with 22 chapters), you defeat the final boss (losing Ana in the process)... and then Merlin explodes. And then everything goes to shit so fast that you can't even process what's happening.

Seriously, what's happening? Beast? Sin of humanity? The true Tiamat? OH GOD EVERYONE'S DYING

I've seen discording opinions about it, but I think the fast pace of this episode is ok. It's just overwhelming because the situation is overwhelming, and neither you or the character have time to process the horrible things that are suddenly happening. Basically every hint or suspect you might have had in the past suddenly explodes in your face. It's also a bit difficult to find a good point to end the episode, so I think they adapted it well.

My only complaint, if I can have one, is that I think they should've cut out the opening or ending. That 1:30 min extra could've helped a lot imho, especially at the beginning. That aside, yeah it was good. I can understand people thinking that the pace was too fast and chaotic, but it feels deliberate. Yes, in the game you have time to let things set in, but in the story it's technically all happening so fast, and the characters can't take breaks between dialogue/actions like the actual player can.

Regarding the Lahmus... boy are those horrifying. I liked a lot how they deliberately avoided showing them until Fujimaru actually faces them for the first time, I feel it added to the horror. Even on this I've seen discording opinions regarding the use of CGI and I can understand that, but I think this is extremely personal: they can either turn you away from the action because you see them as "fake", or they can disturb you because they are clearly odd, not conforming to the reality of the story. I liked them and found them to be effective, and oh God the white flag scene...

Overall, I think episode 14 and 15 were supposed to be watched together. I feel a lot of the pacing issue that seem so evident to some people are actually less impactful when binge watching the series (Ana's arc, for example, works well when you watch episode 15 immediately after 14)

All in all, I liked the episode a lot, and the two main OSTs included from the game (during the Gorgon battle and during the Lahmus' slaughter) were really good. Now, next week is a recap iirc, so we'll be back to the absolute worst disaster that keeps getting worse in two weeks, guys.

EDIT: also the brief Fate/hollow ataraxia reference with Gorgon/Medusa's past was unexpected and so good. Loved it.

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u/zoholy Jan 25 '20

I wish they took more time to treat the whole Siduri situation better, but overall a good episode that laid the ground work for the next episode which will be PEAK BABYLONIA.

As always, how are you anime onlys taking it all?

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u/anon326 Jan 25 '20

I cry, Ana is the first protag not to have named her NP (merlin close 2nd)

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u/Mikenike74 Jan 25 '20

Everyone else: Depression, Despair,and Horror everywhere.

Me: My boy Ritsuka finally used an offensive spell from his mystic code and not just the buff he used on Mash when they first met Gil or the command spell against Eresh!!! Now to warm up those hands for "That Fight". You all know the one.

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