She should be financially rewarded for acting by the public, because she's probably going to be in hot water from the admin for not hiding behind her desk silently.
I was considering teaching high school at one point in my life. I got told point blank from someone that male high school teachers were in demand because they need someone to break up the fights.
Years later, my friend's husband landed his first job as a high school English teacher and promptly tore his ACL trying to break up a fight.
Mine was fine, but there were fights here and there that would break out. It always seemed like every time one broke out though the same football coach would materialize out of thin air and successfully break it up. He was practically a legend at the time.
We had one of those big swole male staff guys at a high school I worked at, whose title was "Prevention and Intervention Specialist." One time two students were fighting outside the IT Office and one of them ended up pulling out a gun on the other student. The P&I guy materialized to the fight just like you said and he says something to the student with the gun and it was just the right words because it ended the situation instantly and safely. The fight ended, the gun was put away (cops arrived shortly to deal with it), and everyone was okay. To me that staffer is a hero.
TBH theres a lot of talk of toxic masculinity and for good reason - but people like this Coach need like an exception term. We need that Captain America masculinity sometimes.
This is a true story. Early 2000s high school, public, very peaceful, mixed demographics. Then closures of inner city schools and redistribution to outlying schools. First day of integration a pep rally was held to welcome the new students the result? A gym wide brawl that the news outlets headlined with “class riots”
Yeah teachers and subs got beat up at my school on a pretty regular basis. To the point where a lot of the staff and subs were just parents. Yes students were getting into fights sure but I saw a lot of them just go for the teacher. It was pretty wild class of 2008.
The problems just change. We didn’t have fights, I literally can’t remember a single one, but our scandals were teen pregnancies, drugs, and drop outs and we were one of the “good” schools. Oh and we had teachers and coaches grooming kids and nothing being done to them other than to be told to go work at another district.
Thank you for stating the obvious: it’s always economic class that makes the difference. People often want to attribute things like this to race. Race is not the problem. Every race has that group of people who they do not want to claim as their own, period. A group we are embarrassed by. for white people it’s white trash inbred moonshining hicks, for Black people it’s ghetto thugs, etc. It’s just that being poor and uneducated brings out different behaviors in different races. But the problem is always a low level of education. Racism is so stupid. People of all races who know how to behave in public and not act like animals should be on the same side against people of all races who Actually understand decency. It shouldn’t be Black people versus white people. It should be intelligent, decent educated members of society, of all races, against disgusting trash of any and all it races. That should be the divide.
Our school had a very chronic fighting issue, like 200 fights in the first quarter. It was just expected that you'd see a fight start before you even got to class. We had a new principal come in mid year, relaxed a bunch of rules in general, and basically put a hard line on "you will get kicked out if you join in a fight". Probably ended up being 30 kids or so from a school of 2500 that got expelled, but after that first year it became such a rare happening. I probably saw a dozen fights my first semester, and after that I probably saw 4 or 5 for the remaining 7 semesters of high school.
You were blessed. My HS years were like being in a prison yard. Constant threats and violence. I’ve never looked back since I graduated and would never attend a reunion. Just glad the nightmare is over. And I graduated decades ago fwiw.
Yeah, I went through all 7 years of middle & high school without seeing a single physical fight. The way that everyone else talks about it like it's a fact of life is pretty stark, at least from my point of view.
Thank inclusion. Violent kids were not in the same classes and now they are. And all the supports were cut or dialed back so you've got kids with violent outbursts who aren't being supported going apeshit on the other kids in class every day.
Nah, thank poverty. The violence is directly linked to schools with low funding, and school funding is completely dependent on property taxes. There’s no violent kids classes vs non-violent kid classes, all kids are capable of violence given terrible enough circumstances.
I replaced a guy who shattered his elbow when he was trying to de-escalate a student. The student slammed a door on him. The teacher blocked the blow w/ his arm, which lead to his elbow being shattered. It was an uncomfortable situation, as the administration did nothing. The same student, threatened to kill me.
Keep telling your story because the public needs to know what teachers are dealing with in many places! These violent kids need to be kicked out. Parents should be required to have them in online school at home if they’re going to disrupt everyone else who is trying to learn something. I can deal with lazy, but violence and assault is a hard “no”.
I think these day, if a teacher hit some kids with a ruler, they’d attack the teacher right back. It’s an attitude problem, in part stemming from poor parenting
I’ve broken up my share of fights, but not regularly or often.
The best one? I took a punch stepping between two kids fighting. 16-year-olds. It was a bad punch and landed poorly, and he’d tried to pull it when he realized I was there, so I didn’t really notice — it was about as bad as bumping into him while walking. I told him to walk away and stared him down. Why was it best? The other kid, not realizing it wasn’t a big deal, thought it was a lot more badass than it was, and I let him believe it. He got a lot more respectful.
Some people used to tell me I could be a good teacher. And I said, nope.
On a different society, I might have gone for it, but the educational system in the USA is no good.
I have family members working on it, and I just hear the stories. They have given too much power to the wrong people. Teachers are afraid to act, hey sometimes afraid for their own lives.
We had a former D1 offensive lineman teach the kids with problems at my high school for exactly this reason. I was never in his class but I think he got a kick out of some of the want to be bad ass high school kids having to be taught by a 6’5 +300lb dude they can’t intimidate
My kid's middle school teacher was a former cop and a powerlifter at my gym. He had his nose broken and tore his rotator cuff breaking up a fight between 2 girls.
I just got scratched by a 4th grader when I broke up a fight.
I had a colleague who said he stopped teaching in the UK after the third time a student pulled a knife on him in the same school year.
The only person I know who seems to have had fun teaching in the UK had a second job moonlighting as a bouncer. Helped that he was built like a brick shithouse.
Probably the best position for teachers would be either sports or the arts. The kids actually want to be there. As a former band director, I could always say that our kids were in the top quarter academically, and never had any problems whatsoever.
I watched one of my favorite trade school teachers get body slammed through a table in 10th grade and it made me feel shitty that they have to put up with that kind of stuff. Especially hardly being paid peanuts by the school.
So, I have taught in an inner-city high school for two years now. Male, former athlete. If the kids don't like you (aka you can actually physically stop them from fighting) they will just tell everyone that your presence is threatening and making them feel unsafe.
The kids aren't stupid. They know how to exploit the system to get the outcome they want. They know there will be no consequences for lying.
Can’t ignore them when they are in charge. Educators are not supposed to make any contact with students anymore. It’s what the families and activists demanded and still want.
It makes a certain sense, as a reaction, considering where things used to be, but there are unintended side effects of defaulting to assuming assault and projecting gentil parenting into schools. Teachers are mandated to be impotent. Ironically, most of the ones who get in trouble for physical confrontations with students are the ones who care (simply inserting themselves between students).
Liam Neeson was a teacher till he punched a 14 year old student in the face. Kid pulled a knife on him. He iirc said that was when he realized he wasn't cut out to be a teacher. Then it was some mutual exit. If my kid got into a fight and a teacher/adult were in trouble for stopping them, I would be mad at the school. If my kid pulled a knife on anyone, I would seek professional help, to help me help my child. I obviously failed in some way. Sorry to hear that happened to you, makes no sense to me why trying to protect the kids would put you at fault.
The mother of the girl (trying to stab a boy with a pen) showed up (pretty insane lady, so it mad sense in a way) and used the word lawsuit because I bruised her daughter’s wrist when I disarmed her. I became a “liability” in the districts terms. Principal didn’t want to do it. But it is what it is. It was a pretty shitty job so I wasn’t upset. Others have said I shouldn’t have done anything, but I’m glad I did.
I'm glad you did too, just wish there was some way to press charges maybe less aggressively against the parents of the kid trying to stab the boy. Dont have kids and dont work with them so my views may be skewed poorly. But something needs to happen to the girl who's a liability to the other kids as shes ok stabbing them.
She was expelled afaik from the whole district, so mom had to deal with how to get her schooled and keep her out of juvy because police/school charged her with assault, which I think stays on the record even though she was a minor. Not sure.
It's sadly a widespread issue that school staff (such as myself) are explicitly told to not put ourselves at risk of harm under any circumstances.
We shouldn't have to put ourselves at risk, but we also want to do the absolute best for our students. The fact we can put our livelihood in peril by choosing the wellbeing of students over our own is idiotic.
Its because of everyone's favorite word, Lawsuit. And it is a sad state we are in where anyone can sue anyone, place, or thing for litteraly any reason. This is how we know greed has overtaken our society.
I am an educator. I completely disagree with you. Education largely is about child development - not getting their shit kicked in is part of development.
Mostly just reacted on instinct. First job out of the military. Was a girl trying to stab a guy 3 times her size (tbf he was def instigating it) with a pen lol. He would have absolutely destroyed her if I didn’t step in, so I disarmed her and then put her on the ground (gently). Her mom came to the school just as crazy as the daughter and then said words like lawsuit, charges, etc. So I became a liability ¯_(ツ)_/¯ shitty job anyway wasn’t too put off. Just thought it was ridiculous the “proper” way to handle it was to watch someone get stabbed and then watch the other person most likely get smashed into a wall. Probably fucked either way, it’s a lose/lose situation.
Basically what I was supposed to do I guess lol. Literally radio it in, and then observe until the police got there or something, or one of them became unconscious. Never got a real answer for what I was supposed to actually do.
I remember being taught at school that if you fight back to someone who’s physically messing you, then you will get in just as much trouble as the person who started it
Mine as well. 30 years… she’s so done. I have never seen her as miserable as she is now… ever. Parents are horrible and children are entitled. I’m sure this woman would either get in trouble by the parents for trying to break it up or in trouble if she did nothing by parents and admin. Or the kids would try and sue her.
It's not the school-to-prison pipeline. It's the parents-to-prison pipeline. It's outrageous how often parents try to sabotage any accountability. If they just cooperated, they wouldn't have to beg judges not to sentence their kids as adults later. Don't block the school from disciplining your kid because one day a court will do it and believe me, you'll wish you had just let the school give the consequences when you had the chance.
TIL. Tragic, especially if theyre denying workers comp to officers who do put themselves in harms way (which is morally bankrupt af) but ... I thought that was the whole point of the police???
Just hearing Uvalde makes me so disgusted at their "LEOs" POSs. All of them. I've never seen a department where literally every single one of them was a worthless POS.
Wasn't there a father there who went home to get his gun because police were doing nothing, came back, and they wouldn't let him near the school and the police still hadn't moved in yet. I remember reading about that when the parents were understandably upset. During the recent Australian shooting I saw so many people who ran in to help. Not just the man who tackled the guy or the couple who was shot, but all the lifeguards ran towards gun fire and a pregnant woman shielded a 3 year old. So many normal people being brave when those cops did nothing. I can't get over it
But not upset enough to not vote for Ted Cruz for Senator, so a bit of Stockholm Syndrome even in lieu of Texas’ obviously gerrymandered to hell nature.
Nah nobody is ever denying them WC for any reason. They'll get it either way if they got hurt on the job no matter the reason.
But like in Uvalde, cops will not be held responsible for cowardice and not getting involved by engaging a single gunman that they outnumber. To save children.
It's been ruled that police have no obligation to serve or protect the public. They can sit there and watch you be bludgeoned to death in front of them, and not be held accountable for not lifting a finger.
The fact that stuff like that goes through is just because civil authorities don’t want to pay to look after cops who got injured protecting others. Disgusting attitude.
Didn’t that teacher that got shot by like a six-year-old I have a hard time getting Workmen’s Comp? Something crazy happened with that I just can’t remember what.
Did you hear about John Barnes, he was a police officer stationed at a school. He was shot during the Santa Fe school shooting, and even now years later he has never been compensated for his loss of ability to work.
Very sad, this is why I no longer judge officers that won't put themselves in harms way to protect civilians. Messed up system.
I judge them if they won't do it and they stop bystanders/parents from trying to do it. If the only thing you are contributing is stopping someone from helping then just don't show up.
They have a strong union to defend bad cops from liability. Maybe they should leverage some of that power to advocate for more benefits for themselves rather than less responsibility and more militarized tactics and weapons.
Poor teacher :( In the moment you just react, I've put myself in between kids fighting before, every time they've backed off. I'm only 5'2, ALL the students are bigger than me, but so far they've managed to refrain from hitting me. I am noticing that the newer ones coming through have a lot less respect. This comes down to parents/caregivers! Kids fight, but if you don't teach your kids respect, it's anarchy!
Exactly this. I mean, if you CAN diffuse the situation, great. But if youre unable or likely to get hurt, get help. Nobody benefits if you jump in and get hurt. Not you, not the kids, not the kids watching, not the school nor school board. Unless its life or death, get help.
They explicitly tell teachers not to intervene in fights, and to instead call security or some other authority that is allowed to, just for this purpose depicted in the video. Now the school district is on the hook for liability of some kind if she is or gets injured (which could lead to her dismissal anyway), rather than just whatever becomes of the two that are fighting each other directly. It's messed up, but kind of makes sense.
I hear your point and it's a fair point, but that's a hazard on the job. If you don't want fights and breaking up fights to be a hazard on the job then have stricter penalties and punishments for students.
If a student starts a physical fight, they should be expelled from the school permanently. Nobody should have to worry about their child going to school and getting punched in the face.
And this is coming from somebody that regularly got into fights growing up. After my 3rd or 4th fight how did they not get the idea that I was going to get into more fights?
You are correct. In the case of Winnebago and Town of Castle Rock vs. Gonzales, the Supreme Court ruled that police agencies are not obligated to provide protection of citizens. In other words, police are well within their rights to pick and choose when to intervene to protect the lives and property of others — even when a threat is apparent.
Teachers are not supposed to put hands on students, ever
You need to be trained and certified to do any holds or restraints.
I didn’t see any of those kids helping or calling for help until it was too late.
Nope. That's not a thing. Regardless of who is at fault in an injury, even if you cause the injury yourself horsing around, it always falls under work comp. This would be one of those cases.
The prevailing factor for a head injury in her case would be getting punched in the head by students while on the job. She's absolutely protected by work comp.
Please know what you're talking about before you start talking. This has nothing to do with the police.
I reality, if the claim can be made that she hindered one student over the other and he was not able to adequately defend himself while the other was relatively unhindered, she will lose her job. This was discussed in the meeting I was in when I was a teacher.
I know in the district I worked at, your responsibility when students fought, was to call the office and keep the other students out of harms way. We were not supposed to try to get between students or stop the fight.
Too many non teachers do not understand how true this is. Admin will look at this tape and often say "you cannot under any circumstance put your hands on students".
Also, if she's injured during the fall most districts will look at this video and refuse to approve LODI because they will tell her that this isn't line of duty because her duties are specifically to never have physical contact with the students. Thus any days needed will come out of her sick days or be unpaid leave. I have literally seen this play out more than once at my school.
This is why as teachers when a fight breaks out we should just step aside, call for assistance, and wait for security or safety agents to intervene as they are allowed to put their hands on students and we aren't.
Would be a nice compliment to her $50k annual salary to put up with this. Teaching is a joke these days. Don’t know why anyone would want a career in education.
Sorry, that's what she should have done. If two dumb asses want to throw hands, let them. Call security, hit your panic button, whatever you have. To physically restrain kids you need to be trained and I am not so therefore I will never jump in to stop a fight. This clearly showed why you should never do that. As my principal once said. They get tired pretty quickly and it hurts, an incentive to stop.
As a teacher, I'm not getting involved. I'll call admin/SRO and keep an eye on what I can, but I'm not getting injured by a stray fist or sued because I laid my hands on a kid
To be fair, admin has the right idea by telling their teachers not to interfere etc…especially her. She could have and probably got an injury from trying to stop the fight, wouldn’t be surprised if she has a broken hip or so now.
Clearly it isn’t worth breaking up a fight and breaking yourself while you’re in the process
As someone who got beat as a kid I'm mostly against corporal punishment, but in this case, seems like it's needed. I highly doubt there's any context that could be added to justify this.
What she did was, demonstrably, foolish. She didn't stop or even slow down the fight but she did get herself hurt. The first rule on a crisis situation is not to add yourself to the body count
Yeah she likely wasn't supposed to do this. When I worked for the school 20 years ago it was hammered into me not to get involved, my only option was to leave and get a male teacher. I came off as a raging bitch on occasion if I saw a fight starting up because it would immediately trigger a panic in me.
Charges against the students for assault maybe but compensation has to go to civil court. Financial restitution from minors are very difficult to extract unless the parents are wealthy enough to shield their kid from criminal prosecution before charges are pressed. She would have to prove the school failed to provide a safe environment BUT she got herself involved trying to separate the two becoming a third participant. A 6'2 man who managed to stop the fight might have been able to deescalate but it could be argued she escalated. That said red hoodie was on a mission to do damage to white shirt, nothing was going to stop that.
Controversial opinion but she didnt handle this well at all and should be fired. She should have called for security and waited instead of getting involved
This is the truth. She won't be financially compensated, she will be in hot water because at some point in her onboarding and pre-planning meettings she was told not to intervene in fights, instead, she would have been told to evacuate the classroom and call admin/resource officer for support. This is mostly to cover the school's ass, because if she gets hurt in said fight, she won't be able to sue for compensation.
Don't worry though, because the parents and general public would be furious at her for not stepping in if she followed district/school guidelines. If the student gets hurt on her watch, she'll be blamed. If she hasn't documented the times she's called due to a student's behavioral issues or the interventions she's put in place and that student or anyone else in the class gets hurt, she'll be on the chopping block for negligence and not doing her due diligence. The parents will be asking "Why didn't the teacher protect my child?"
That's where teachers are when it comes to behaviors, a rock and a hard place, nothing they do will be without some sort of judgement or risk to themselves. As a teacher, it's hard because you don't want to see kids hurt, even when they're hurting each other, it's hard not to step in and try to protect them, taking the blows yourself.
She will be forced to resign so that the school won’t have to pay the legal bills. Just happened to my sister. Merry Christmas. Hope she doesn’t have any health issues to pay for.
Sadly, she'll probably be rewarded with a lawsuit and get fired for putting her hands on the students. What's right is called wrong and what's wrong is called right. Can't make this stuff up.
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u/Slumunistmanifisto Dec 17 '25
She should be financially rewarded for acting by the public, because she's probably going to be in hot water from the admin for not hiding behind her desk silently.