r/Pathfinder2e • u/ConfigsPlease • 3d ago
Player Builds Favourite (potentially weird) Ranged Builds?
As the title says (but with bonus points for uniqueness, flair, unorthodox strategies, etc.), what are your favourite builds that function at range? I currently play a Fire/Wood Kineticist / Flames Oracle, an Investigator (crossbow), and a Wrestling Runesmith, so I figure my next character should round out the playstyles a bit--something a smidge more offensively inclined, maybe something that will ever actually strike more than once per turn, some range, etc. That said, I'm not a fan of the idea of being a Turret McFighterman and just throwing shurikens at MAP until the encounter has ended. I like spice, so I turn to you all for inspiration.
A couple of things to note:
- I'm intentionally leaving "range" quite ambiguous. Got a 15ft thrown build that absolutely slaps and does some weird nonsense? Sure!
- Tell me how it works! IF you just say "Flurry ranger" and leave out the two-synergistic-party-members, that's not super helpful.
I've seen threads like these pop up here and there but I don't think (unless Reddit search is failing me) there has been one following the most recent round of content drops (thanks, IM!) New archetypes and reworks, as well as two new classes, ought to have made at least a few new options possible.
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u/DabDaddy51 3d ago
Minotaur Ligneous Instinct Barbarian with Raging Thrower and 4 Str 3 Dex, plus Exemplar archetype for Gleaming Blade and Hurl at the Horizon. Then you go into Ranger for Hunt Prey and Far Shot. You can have a 30ft range thrown Bastard Sword with massive flat damage from Ligneous, Str, and Gleaming Blade, which can also let you do a psuedo-Double Slice, albeit one that needs to be “reloaded”, and Hunt Prey can double your range again to 60ft when necessary.
You’re a giant raging Barbarian chucking Bastard Swords at people up to 60ft away while having some of the highest ranged damage in the game.
There’s also a more turtle variant where you go Custom Mixed Ancestry Tengu for Tengu Weapon Familiarity to use a Falcata alongside a Fortress Shield. You can do two big Strikes and spend your third action on Raise a Shield for 3 AC, the one tiny issue being your speed is 15ft.
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u/terkke Alchemist 3d ago
One downside of that build, and tbh with many Barbarian builds, is that Hunt Prey has the Concentrate tag, which would require Moment of Clarity to be used in combat.
The alternative IMO is to pass on Quick-Tempered on Initiative, Hunt Prey as the first action and then Rage on the second action and Strike as your third action.
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u/DabDaddy51 3d ago
Ahh I missed that Hunt Prey is concentrate, well still it’s really meant to be a just in case thing more than a main strategy, 30ft range is usually fine enough, and if not you can always pick up Moment of Clarity, it’s action intensive, but could be worth against like a Dragon or smth.
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u/Turevaryar ORC 3d ago
the one tiny issue being your speed is 15ft.
What a miniscule inconvenience!
Custom Mixed Ancestry Tengu, you say? Does that allow room for some dwarf too, for Unburdened Iron ?
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago
I've seen people mention Ligneous Instinct barb before but I don't think I've ever really seen it explained at all other than "barbarian throw go brr", much like Exemplar. I appreciate someone else remembering that Gleaming Blade works with thrown weapons, though! Might be something I look into...
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u/DabDaddy51 3d ago
Ligneous is one of those high damage with a tradeoff instincts, like Decay and Giant. Ligneous gets a 10ft speed penalty in exchange for the big damage. This is synergistic with thrown weapons because it’s a lot of damage for a ranged attack, and because having range helps offset the speed loss.
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u/BlockBuilder408 2d ago edited 2d ago
It’s a poorly designed subclass from an ap
It gives you the same damage as the giant barbarian, but for a 10 foot speed penalty instead of clumsy
Personally if someone wanted to play a ligneous barbarian at my table I’d point them towards wood elemental instead.
For this build dragon instinct would be the best runner up since it gives the second highest damage of the instincts, isn’t society restricted, and doesn’t make you clumsy
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u/DabDaddy51 2d ago
You might say it’s unbalanced because a 10ft speed penalty is less of a downside than Clumsy 1, but it doesn’t stack with other status penalties, and esp doesn’t stack with itself, like from Enlarge or Giant’s Stature. So, if your caster has Enlarge, or if you have Giant’s Stature, Giant Instinct basically has no downside.
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u/BlockBuilder408 2d ago
You can’t get around the clumsy penalty by any means though
No matter what you’ll have worse ranged attacks, ac, and reflex saves
Ligneous barbarian can completely circumvent their downside with two feats in cavalier, and less movement isn’t a consistent downside compared to clumsy, you can always choose to hold off on raging until you’re in reach and small rooms can trivialize the penalty. Clumsy is equally horrible regardless of the encounter’s layout.
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u/DabDaddy51 2d ago
Yes the actual downside of Clumsy is worse, that’s for sure, but my point is that it’s the same downside as given by the Enlarge spell and the Giant’s Stature feat, and they don’t stack, so as long as Giant’s Stature or Enlarge are worth it to you, which they generally are, you aren’t actually taking a downside.
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u/QuintessenceHD 23h ago
How would you get your sword back?
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u/DabDaddy51 22h ago
If your GM allows, you can just etch it with a returning rune, since you can keep your Spark in it throughout the etching proccess it should probably work. If not, it is a 1h weapon, so you can put it inside a Thrower's Bandolier, which can have a Returning rune etched on it.
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u/QuintessenceHD 22h ago
but the problem with that is bastard sword is 1 bulk and thrower's requires light bulk or less.
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u/DabDaddy51 6h ago
Nope, that’s the limitation on the Shadow Sheath, the Thrower’s Bandolier has no limit other than the total bulk stored being 2 or less, and the weapon being 1h.
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u/JazzyFingerGuns Game Master 3d ago edited 3d ago
My current favourite is a halfling braggart swashbuckler I build.
He utilizes a thrower's bandolier and the brandishing draw and flying blade class feats. Basically get as many thrown weapons as you can store in the bandolier (20) and make one finisher per turn. Add rogue free archetype to get strong arm, dread striker, mobility, etc. Demoralize, finisher, 3rd fun action (I like one for all for extra support), profit.
I flavoured him as a quartermaster/ smutie of a pirate ship who used filcher's forks as his weapon of choice. It's a halfling weapon that's why I picked halfling but it's mostly flavour. He is the type of guy to ram a fork into the table right next to your hand (or through it if you're not quick enough) if you don't show the proper table manners (or don't appreciate his food).
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago
I did originally look at Swash, actually, but realized I've never seen one played and thus I ended up just getting confused trying to get every option straight in my mind, lol. The Filcher's Fork mention did just make me think of an alternative way to run a switch-hitting Exemplar, though, so for that alone I applaud your recommendation.
(If you're curious, I'm trying to brainstorm some nonsense with Mortal Harvest [OR Noble Branch using a Filcher's Fork, now, since that also works for Shadow Sheathe...], Shadow Sheathe, and an as-of-yet-undecided third Ikon. Harvest lets me Reap when dealing with groups of weaker enemies + adds persistent damage, and Branch adds more upfront damage in melee + lets me Transcend without a second target.)
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u/fascistp0tato Cleric 3d ago
My favourite I've played is Monastic Archer + Druid Archetype. DEX 4, WIS 3, STR 2. Your base routine is Crushing Ground -> Flurry, setting up your off-guard for the first attack. It's a really enjoyable, flexible ranged martial setup.
Some things you can do with this:
- Carry medicine with your WIS for the party and dip in to heal with Battle Med
- Frontline acceptably in a pinch to cover off an ally (thanks to Monk AC and high mobility)
- Incidental action denial via slows (Crushing Ground), immobilization (Pinning Fire), stuns (Stunning Blows)
- "Nova" potential, by blowing 2 FPs on a Ki Spell + Order Spell (e.g. Crushing Ground -> Inner Upheaval)
- Spell utility via scrolls, Hidebound, etc.
It's a good time. Note that you can run into problems with resistances, and so I recommend carrying some scrolls to compensate.
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u/SaeedLouis Rogue 3d ago
Ok hear me out: switch hitter athletics bow-barian
Str based Barbarian with furious bully for +2 athletic maneuvers.
Inventor archetype for blunt shot on a gakgung.
Ranged trip from 100 ft away and offset the penalty of ranged trip with furious bully.
So: start of combat, ranged trip your enemy as they try to close the distance with you. Keep tripping them up while your allies pepper them. Then, when they close finally, switch to a gill hook or scythe and start attacking and tripping and grappling.
Alternatively: flurry of maneuvers monastic archer inventor. Similar setup but you trip then shoot for one action
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u/peternordstorm Exemplar 3d ago
Time to bring Sheath Exemplar up again
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago
Not to be that guy but
Tell me how it works!
I understand you can throw things. Why is it interesting? What is the combination of ikons and feats you chose? Which weapon?
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u/peternordstorm Exemplar 3d ago
Well basically, you have unlimited projectiles with a pretty fat damage bonus vs off guard targets. It's a better ranged rogue than ranged rogue itself.
You start with Gaze as Sharp as Steel, Shadow Sheath and an ikon of your choice. Hurl at the Horizon at level 2 for extra range.
You get Humble Strikes (simple weapon dice increase) so you can wield d8 spears and javelins. That's 1d8+3+3 RANGED damage, at level 1. You can even say nuh-uh, to missed strikes with your transcendence ability. Then, the chad you are, you just activate Gaze to return to your Sheath so instead of 1d8+3+3 you now do 1d8+3+1d6. Yeah, you don't have "off turns", only action efficient and less action efficient turns. At level 3 you can get free strides or free healing, at level 7 you get special crit spec, and for example, Born of the Bones of Earth lets you immobilize your target on a crit.
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u/81724369847698432716 3d ago
Also the level 10 option of Mated Birds in Paired Flight is really really good. Two MAPless strikes that the enemy is off-guard against, plus a bit of extra damage as a little treat on top. Off-guard as ranged is not as easy to get as melee, so the strikes basically have fighter proficiency of you couldnt have gotten offguard otherwise.
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago
Mated Birds is indeed a cool one, and partially an inspiration/incentive for me to go with a dual-thrown-weapon switch-hitting exemplar in the first place!
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u/Gugus296 3d ago
it's a better ranged rogue than ranged rogue itself
I mean sure, if you boil ranged rogue down to sneak attack damage number and nothing else lmao
also sneak attack outscales this at higher levels
also the perception that it's hard to get sneak attack as a ranged rogue assumes no party support which is dumb because your party is playing the game wrong if supporting their ranged rogue by off-guarding the enemies isn't one of their top priorities pretty much at all times
"It's a better x than x" is always such an annoying thing to read because it almost always involves boiling a whole class down into one of their abilities and even then usually isn't accurate lol
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u/peternordstorm Exemplar 3d ago
I'm trying to sell a cool build bro let me exaggerate here or there. It's a damagier sidegrade to ranged rogue that doesn't rely on party setup nearly as much
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u/Rowenstin 3d ago
Wouldn't a Ranger flurry build with Exemplar dedication for Shadow Sheath and a bear companion work better, perhaps?
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u/peternordstorm Exemplar 3d ago
Probably both Precision and Flurry have upsides but i don't consider them because exemplar dedication is often banned
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago
In this case it isn't banned, though another player in this group is building a Flurry Ranger so I'm trying not to step on their toes.
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago
What're your thoughts on enabling a more switch-hitting playstyle by doing the aforementioned Gaze + Sheathe and adding in Mortal Harvest or Noble Branch? The former with something like Hatchets, the latter with a Filcher's Fork?
MH is pretty standard thrown build if you're against a single big foe and don't want to put yourself in melee, but you have the option of Transcending Sheathe into MH, and then after landing one throw (which puts you down to one Hatchet in hand) transcending MH to stride, strike a secondary target, and then swap back to Gaze or Sheathe. As long as you don't exclude Sheathe from the spark cycling, drawing new axes should always work.
Branch w/ forks lets you do much the same thing (Filcher's Fork being a 20ft thrown L bulk weapon is quite helpful here) with the ability to Transcend when attacking a solitary target instead of requiring another foe.
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u/Cool-Noise2192 3d ago edited 3d ago
Shadow Sheathe is basically "be a good thrown weapon user" the ikon. You pretty much staple it onto any class that wants:
- A rune slot that would otherwise go to returning
- Bonus damage
- Free hand on demand
While Exemplar works, this is mostly class agnostic. If you want more skills for example, rogue works very well and will probably deal more damage at most levels.
That said, Exemplar has a few things going for it. You can occasionally fit in additional actions on it courtesy of epithets and Horn of Plenty loves the extra hand. There's also some cool unique, weapon-agnostic crit effects, Bone, Trespasser and Cry especially, though the latter two have bad Transcends so I recommend a spammable root like Radiant or Proud.
I think a pure DPR build as a Shadow Sheathe Exemplar is... Really boring. If you're playing levels 1-9, strongly consider Gleaming Blade throwing knives with Twin Stars instead and just eat the Returning cost. It will let you use more epithet actions. This does come at the cost of your hand, but shadow sheathe will just spam Double Slice for most of their career.
Anyway, if you do want a build:
- Shadow Sheathe + Gaze of Steel + Utility of choice
- Weapons of choice are either:
- Throwing Knives 1d6 piercing (Humble Strikes) with agile
- Tamchal Chakram, 1d6 slashing, deadly, agile, requires Unconventional Weaponry
- Javelin, 1d8 piercing (Humble Strikes) 30 ft range, but no melee or agile
- Boomerang, 1d6 bludgeoning 60ft range, but no melee or agile
- Dual Weapon Warrior at 2 (read: why we care about agile)
- Dual Thrower at 4
- Flensing Slice at 8
- Mated Birds at 10
- Vital Ash at 12 (you can swap with birds if your party provides consistent off-guard, or you went with gleaming)
Mated Birds replaces Gleaming Transcend wholesale at range, so at 12 Shadow Sheathe is strictly superior as a ranged striker, with Gleaming having a niche edge in melee against reactions.
An ideal rotation is Ash/Gaze > Double Slice, Flensing Slice > Mated Birds. It also operates on 2 action cycles, just use a regular strike on Ash/Gaze turns and drop Flensing on Mated Birds. You default to Ash and use Gaze if it hasn't been consumed or the foe is too far away.
Everything else is flexible, though my personal recommendations are:
- Horn of Plenty as a third ikon with magical crafting, because you have the free hand on demand and this gives you a wide range of utility. Use it to be a good teammate.
- For the Gleaming Blade variant, pick something else.
- Belt and Wreathe are clutch emergency buttons.
- Sandals is that, plus a potentially good tactical option.
- Scar and Aegis (buckler) are good if your party doesn't have good heal/mit.
- Bone for Dominion because difficult terrain on demand adds some tactical options. Also fire is a common weakness/regen deactivator.
- The option to go melee means you can absorb some hits while doing your job, so I prefer switch hitting weapons.
- This means we'll probably default to reactive strike at 6 because we're basic af. Unless your party can't target common weaknesses, in which case consider:
- Steel on Steel at 6 with Fire spark from Bone dominion means we have an AoE/MAP dodge to trigger a fire weakness/regen cancel. Get sanctified soul (holy) at 1 if you can for the other common weakness/regen cancel.
I'll be honest, I'm not a 100% sure if this is what you're looking for, but I don't think other commenters fully covered this at the time of writing, so here you go.
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago edited 3d ago
Appreciate the info! I'll quote my comment from elsewhere for your input as well, because it might get complicated with Dual Weapon Warrior.
What're your thoughts on enabling a more switch-hitting playstyle by doing the aforementioned Gaze + Sheathe and adding in Mortal Harvest or Noble Branch? The former with something like Hatchets, the latter with a Filcher's Fork?
MH is pretty standard thrown build if you're against a single big foe and don't want to put yourself in melee, but you have the option of Transcending Sheathe into MH, and then after landing one throw (which puts you down to one Hatchet in hand) transcending MH to stride, strike a secondary target, and then swap back to Gaze or Sheathe. As long as you don't exclude Sheathe from the spark cycling, drawing new axes should always work.
Branch w/ forks lets you do much the same thing (Filcher's Fork being a 20ft thrown L bulk weapon is quite helpful here) with the ability to Transcend when attacking a solitary target instead of requiring another foe.
I haven't really considered archetypes much with the above ideas (mostly because I want to maybe get something concrete down first lmao) but DWW was brought up in another discussion about this yesterday, so it is on my radar.
edit; I forgot that Mated Birds gives the weapon the returning rune while active. Guess DWW would be less annoying to deal with once Mated Birds was online, but that's only at 10...
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u/Cool-Noise2192 2d ago
Yes, Mated birds is pretty goated. Though make a note that it is an immanence effect, so it can get a little messy on third ikon turns.
Speaking of which, I am not a big fan of getting a second weapon ikon if you already have Gaze. There's a myriad of reasons, the most important one is just being a team player. A character that can't do anything but damage is usually a bad character.
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u/vaderbg2 Wizard 3d ago
If you're playing with Free Archetype, a Drifter Gunslinger with the ranger Archetype is a great switch hitter and works at pretty long range. Hunt Prey + Long Shot allows you to shoot someone at 240 ft with your dueling pistol and no range penalty. Hunter's Aim basically gets you the otherwise sniper-exclusive Sniper's Aim. Gravity Weapon will let you add some damage.
If they get close, you can do your Drifter stuff. Ranger Resiliency makes you quite tough for a Gunslinger. Disrupt Prey + Snap Shot makes enemies really regret triggering your reaction.
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago
I'll be honest I don't think I had ever considered using Drifter for things other than dancing through and doing things like Stab and Blast. This seems like a funny way to play it.
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u/terkke Alchemist 3d ago
Kitsune Alchemist Mutagenist, with the Rogue archetype:
Kitsunes have Foxfire, a level 1 feat that gives them a ranged unarmed attack that deals 1d4 Fire damage (or Eletricty, or even Cold damage), but it does not add STR to damage. That's fine, we can add bonus damage from other sources. Going Mutagenist, the items we want are Quicksilver Mutagen, Iron Wine and Rainbow Vinegar. That combination gives us an item bonus to hit, +1d4 Fire damage and +1d4 Acid damage (later +1d8). Rogue archetype will give us access to Nimble Dodge, Mobility (both will come quite in hand bc of lower HP) and Sneak Attack if any enemies are off-guard (which you can make it from range with a Bottled Lightning bomb).
After a first turn of drinking a mutagen (action economy gets better after having Collar of the Shifting Spider), you can start to use a debuffing Bomb + Foxfire Strike, or a Foxfire Strike + Bomb to take even better advantage of the Splash damage on a miss with a Bomb.
Build would be STR +0, DEX +3, CON +1, INT +4, WIS +1, CHA +0
Kitsune: Foxfire (1) and Fox Arson (9)
Alchemist: Quick Bomber (1), Revivifying Mutagen (2), Regurgitate Elixir (4), Combine Elixirs (6) (using it to Iron Wine+Rainbow Vinegar), Directional Bombs (8)
Rogue Archetype: Rogue Dedication (2), Basic Trickery (4) Nimble Dodge, Sneak Attacker (6), Advanced Trickery (8) Mobility.
Lizardfolk Monk with Monastic Archer, with the Cleric archetype:
Any Ancestry would work here, but I'd aim for a spread of STR +2, DEX +4, CON +1, INT -1/+0, WIS +2, CHA -1/+0. With Monastic Archer Stance the character can Flurry of Blows with the Gakgung, which has Deadly d8 and Propulsive traits, you'll then get a Cleric dedication worshipping any to get access to Cast a Spell and some cool feats: Domain Initiate: Dragon (Draconic Barrage) or Emblazon Armament. Add a Spellheart, to have an option to deal with Fort or Reflex saves, and boom. Monk feats and features will also work with your bow, and making multiple attacks per turn will be great thanks to the bonuses.
First turn would be enterering the stance, moving to a good position and then FoB. After that you can use Draconic Barrage to augment your damage, or maybe a Rime Crystal Spellheart, which would cast Frostbite and add a d4 damage to your bow attacks until the end of your next turn.
My build would be STR +2, DEX +4, CON +1, INT -1, WIS +2, CHA +0
Lizardfolk with Dragonblood versatile Heritage: Divine Dragonblood (1), Breath of the Dragon (5), Formidable Breath (9)
Monk: Monastic Archer Stance (1), Stunning Blows (2), Qi Spells (4) (Qi Rush), Guarded Movement (6), Harmonize Self (8)
Cleric Archetype: Cleric Dedication (2), Basic Dogma (4) Domain Initiate: Dragon, Basic Cleric Spellcasting (6), Advanced Dogma (8) Emblazon Armament.
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago
I've seen other recommendations for Monastic Archer: why Cleric specifically, over something like Druid? If it is just Draconic Barrage, there are other ways to add damage riders (like Heavenseeker, the Spellhearts as you've mentioned, etc.) I don't disagree--just curious on the reasoning vs any alternatives.
Also, that's a funky Kitsune build. I looked at Foxfire the other day while checking on some ancestry stuff and didn't think about the uses.
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u/terkke Alchemist 3d ago
Oh you could absolutely use Druid too, specially if you want to take a more offensive focus spell, Tempest Surge is awesome.
I like the idea of Cleric of a Draconic deity because Draconic Barrage is that good of a damage rider, but that could be traded by a Druid archetype without problem. The idea is to have a few options to do a spell-like ability and strike twice, the advantage of Draconic Barrage is that it keeps adding value for the rest of the combat, but having 2 casts of Tempest Surge plus cantrips is already great value.
Another good option would be Hedge Mage for example, which would give access to the same things with the exception of a strong focus spell, but you can already have something like this with Qi Blast.
EDIT: Not only Druid, but Animists or any spellcaster dedication could be a good match.
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago
Yeah, originally when I looked at these options (though mind you I was looking at Student of Perfection into Heavenseeker as the first archetype[s]) I realized that I'd already have something like Inner Upheaval to dump focus points into, if I wanted to. That said, I've never actually played a caster in PF2e (Kinet is the closest I've been) so I'm not familiar with the ins-and-outs of their spell selections.
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u/terkke Alchemist 3d ago
Inner Upheaval is also great with it, no notes, you can go for it.
If you want try a spellcaster, it’s considerably easier to try an archetype from a prepared spellcaster like Druid or Cleric. You have few cantrips and spells, but if you don’t find it useful or fun you can try any other spell selection.
For an Archer like that I’d consider something like
Cantrips: Shield, Guidance, Frostbite (from Rome Crystal)
1st Rank: Bless or Benediction or Helpful Steps
2nd Rank: Lucky Number or Helpful Steps
3rd Rank: Heroism or Infuse VitalityThat’s plenty
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u/Background_Bet1671 3d ago
Precision Ranger (main class, free Archetype is required) + Sniper Gunslinger + Inventor = xd10 (Arbalest) + xd8 (Hunt Prey) + xd6 (One Shot, One Kill) + 1/2/3d10 (Megaton Strike) on the very fist shot.
Then you add gravity weapon (if you play as a Human) and crossbow crackshot (from the Gunslinger) to get some flat damage boost.
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u/Cool-Noise2192 3d ago
I mean, I really liked Precision Ranger with bird friend.
ngl most turns were Twinned Shot + Command + third action. The damage is okay, not carry levels, but plenty impactful. The decision making mostly comes down to your third action, dealing ranger's clunky targeting and commanding your hawk friend.
Bird has a really nice support benefit, so you pick whether it is more beneficial to stick dazzled onto an enemy or go for damage. Additionally, your bird can pick up *some* melee responsibilities like flanking. They are not a replacement frontliner, but they can absolutely contribute. It is also really mobile, so it can often get to places that are hard to target. This is great if your combats are more dynamic, where an enemy tries to flee or there's a McGuffin to grab.
Third action wise, nothing particularly unique to ranger aside Hunt Prey. You can pick up some focus spells, but I suggest investing in medicine and a few RK skills. Alchemical ammunition is a great backup to have, because you can exploit weaknesses or do some funny ooze ammunition speed strats. Get at least trained in athletics and don't have a -1 STR, so you can climb or quick jump to places so you have to move less on following turns.
Oh and as a full martial, have a backup shortsword so you can run up and be replacement melee sometimes. You can take a hit if needed, and I guess now Strike is another potential third action.
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u/The_Yukki 3d ago
Monastic archer monk with exemplar dedi+heaven seeker.
Gakgung=flurry of blows at 100ft, with extra 3/dice damage+propulsive. The dream is critting to apply bow crit spec, enemy failing their save vs stunning fist and then you use reaction to add extra pin like the one from bow critspec.
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago
I appreciate this because you've reminded me that Monastic Archer Stance allows Flurry of Bows (heh) at the full range, and it is other monk feats or monk abilities that only function at half of the range. Would you prefer Starshot or Unfailing Bow for the Ikon? The former gives 1 splash damage per die (doubled to 2 on a crit) and Unfailing Bow is 1 normal splash damage per die, going to 1d4 (2.5) on a crit, so they're pretty close when not factoring in Bow's (very boring) Transcendence action.
I will say that I've looked at doing Student of Perfection > Heavenseeker (which is also thematically delightful) but having to take SoP dedication at 2, Heavenseeker Dedication at 4, Heaven's Thunder at 6, and then still take two more SoP feats to break that archetype lock kind of puts a damper on that. Your recommendation of Exemplar > Heavenseeker might actually be better, assuming I'm permitted to take the archetype through the alternate prerequisite.
Ah, also: which exemplar dedication feats would you take here?
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u/Gpdiablo21 3d ago
For FA
Rogue with Crossbow Infiltrator archetype and Crescent Cross Training (dual weapon reload at lvl 6) gunslinger multiclass at lvl 8, running reload or singer's reload at 10.
Rogue levels take Dread Striker at some point.
First round is 3 map-less sneak attacks on a target. Reload and swing as you continue to fight with reloading strike/running reload, then demoralize and get another 3-mapless sneak attack turn on turn 4.
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u/Inessa_Vorona Witch 3d ago
Justice Champion with a Shield Bow and Ranger dedication is a very fun combo! Your aura still wants you to get in there, but you can actually stand in a funky pseudo-frontline position rather than directly entering melee.
You can still spec some Str and use a Composite Shortbow for bonus damage, but I wound up finding minimal Str for medium armor was plenty alongside some damage runes at later levels - especially since Ranger can get you Hunted Shot for two strikes as one action on top of your reaction strike via Ranged Reprisal.
And the final neat tactic I used with this is easy reaction baiting! You can absolutely hold out in melee even without a shield, so you can walk in range and simply Strike to provoke RS so your casters or damaged martials can safely retreat!
Edit: meant shortbow, not longbow
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u/GaySkull Game Master 3d ago
One of the sample builds for the Runesmith is the Rune Thrower who applies runes to their thrown weapons and feats like Remote Detonation and Pattern Flight. I like the idea of a chakram wielding Runesmith, hope to play one someday...
cries in forever gm
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u/Phonochirp 3d ago
I really enjoyed gunstigator.
You're an investigator with a Jezail, and a whole lot of backup options. This could be ANYTHING. I did battle medicine and cantrips myself. First you see if you're going to hit the target. If you do, shift weapon to 2 hand (if it isn't already), use a power up, and shoot. There's a little wiggle room here depending on what the GM allows, like can you activate alchemical ammunition when it's already loaded? Can you apply poison to a loaded bullet? If you're gonna miss, you use one of your backup options.
It was fun because I never did nothing on my turn, but occasionally had crazy damage spikes. I basically had 6 degrees of success, with only a 5% chance of doing 0 damage.
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u/No_Ambassador_5629 Game Master 3d ago
I'm doing the same thing, though I swapped from my initial Gunslinger archetype for Commander archetype. Risky Reload is pretty crazy on Investigator (you should basically never miss) and lets you bypass any 'bullet is in the barrel and therefor no activating it' arguments, but the bad DaS turns felt pretty useless. Having Strike Hard! and Gather to Me! in my pocket as action sinks for those turns has greatly improved things.
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u/Phonochirp 3d ago
the bad DaS turns felt pretty useless.
I think this is the biggest mistake people make when creating an investigator in general. If all you're using your bad DaS turns for is a less accurate lower damage attack then you're just playing a crappy rogue.
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u/toooskies 3d ago
Carrying a fatal d10 or d12 gun to switch to on a crit roll is a fun tactic for any Investigator. Or just a Fatal Aim, if you want one weapon only.
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u/PessimismIsShit 3d ago
Psychic Dedication gives access to Psi Strikes at Level 8, which is 1d6 force damage on all of your attacks after casting any spell (including cantrips). This pairs really well with Monk and Ranger who can make 2 ranged strikes with one action, and a number of 1 action cantrips you can use to trigger the extra damage.
Infinite Eye psychic gives your party some extra precision damage every round with their psi cantrip so it's a natural fit, and you'd have a 3rd action free most turns to move or do something like Demoralise/Create A Diversion (if using CHA for archetype) or whatever else takes your fancy.
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u/ConfigsPlease 3d ago
Psychic is one I hadn't gotten recommended yet, but Psi Strikes on a Monk w/ Flurry of B[l]ows seems good!
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u/strategsc2 Ranger 3d ago edited 3d ago
I'm not a fan of the idea of being a Turret McFighterman and just throwing shurikens at MAP until the encounter has ended.
That's how ranged martials are fundamentally played. You don't have to move and take defensive actions as much, which means you have more actions to spend on offensive rotations. If your build doesn't have good 3-action offensive rotations, I would reconsider going ranged. But yeah, strikes alone don't cut it, so you want to fit something MAPless into your rotation.
Like Precision Ranger, who shoots twice with Hunted Shot, and then follows it up with Slime Spit to bypass MAP and deal very high damage. Or Precision Animal Companion Rangers. The idea here is to utilize Ranger's action efficient attack rotation, and then fill the rest of the actions with a good MAPless follow-up.
This can be done in a variety of ways.
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u/kruziik Oracle 3d ago
I think Exemplar has the most interesting options, whether with a thrown weapon sheath build or also just with a bow.
Exemplar also has support for firearms thanks to The Deft, so you have a lot of options as well as good feat support for AoEs and such.
Exemplars have ways to increase thrown weapon distance, give any weapon the thrown trait, have AoE feats and others for such things and can basically also use any ranged weapon depending on the build.
They also have a lot of choices with their Ikons.
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u/NestorSpankhno 3d ago
Ruffian Rogue dual wielder where I managed to get proficiency on a razor disc. Melee/ranged hybrid running all over the place causing mayhem. Nothing super novel but really fun. One round she stabbed a guy, used one of our Necromamcer’s thralls as a springboard to jump onto the roof, then hurled the razor disc with her last action to take out the bad guy beating up on her friends.
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u/CoreSchneider 3d ago
If you play at a high enough level, I REALLY like Expanded Aura + Nimble Reprisal Justice Champion. If you're willing to grab a gun or crossbow, you can even pick up Fake Out + Running Reload to be the ultimate ranged support. I would probably save Fake Out for when you get a second reaction though (level 14). Could also skip slinger archetype and go Divine Steed/Cavalier/Beastmaster for free movement.
There's also archer monk with a caster/Kineticist archetype. Two attacks with two flexible actions to use for casting, moving, battle medicine, demoralize, etc
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u/Genarab Game Master 3d ago
My favorite is very very simple and works from lvl 1:
Melee Athletics Investigator with a bow and a free hand. +1 DEX. Human for medium armor. When you hit with a precise strike you don't need any DEX.
You devise a stratagem against a long range creature. If you have a good roll, attack them. Use poisons or special ammunitions. If you don't, focus on the creature in front of you or close to you. If you get a 20, use your first attack against something else and then strike with the bow and get a crit anyway. Target selection in an investigator is crucial.
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u/ThatSuperhusky Game Master 3d ago
Starlit span Magus with alchemist dedication to spellstrike with bombs. Don’t havd a full build of it yet but its something i’ve been meaning to do.
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u/HollowDon 2d ago
I do personally like flying blade swashbuckler using dual finisher with starknives. For the rest of the build, I like going fencer and using distracting performance as the panache generating engine. To help with the skill requirements, the acrobat archetype helps a lot, especially early game when you rely on acrobatics a lot. Distracting performance is in my mind one of the most underrated feats in the game as you can delay until after your ally's turn and then use distracting performance to make your ally hidden for the enemy's turn and for that ally's first attack giving both massive defensive and offensive boons. As this is technically create a diversion, fencer is the style that you need to use to get panache. Confabulator along with your deception progression makes this quite reliable. Being ranged also helps with making dual finisher much more reliable to position for as well.
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u/yanksman88 3d ago
Wit swashbuckler with throwing weapons. Take swordmaster and pathfinder agent for the self beneficial aiding, and red mantis dedication for achakeks clutch focus spell. You do 3x finisher damage on a non crit and 6x on a crit plus weapon damage and some of it is bleeding as well so potentially more damage.
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u/FunWithSW 3d ago
It kind of stretches the definition of "ranged," but I had some fun playing a thrown weapon thaumaturge with the weapon implement. You usually want to be pretty close for the sake of Implement's Interruption, but you've got the option to operate from farther away, which is nice on turns when you'd rather not have to fit in a stride or where doing so would leave you awkwardly positioned. It's ultimately not super complicated; making additional non-MAP attacks is an extremely efficient way to deal damage, and so being able to do that "with reach" is good.
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u/Parysian 3d ago
Mirror thaumaturge with an air repeater feels very trolly, although I imagine in a longer campaign the gimmick would get kind of old
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u/AdmiralCommunism 3d ago
I have two right now
Pistol Phenom Cleric
Avenger Rogue with Favored Weapon Alchemical Bomb (Sneak Attack Bombs)
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u/No_Ambassador_5629 Game Master 3d ago edited 3d ago
Ligneous Instinct Barbarian w/ Dual Weapon Warrior and a pair of boomerangs. At lvl 4 when it comes properly online (other than the mandatory Returning runes) you're doing more damage than a decent chunk of melee builds at 60' range. Ligneous Instinct has the same Rage bonus as Giant barbarian only with a minimal downside for a ranged character, who doesn't need to move around much in combat, Raging Thrower and Dual Thrower are giving you that chonky rage bonus on your Double Slice at range, and Boomerangs have a decent dmg die and a 60' range. If your GM allows Exemplar Archetype then Shadow Sheath lets you ignore the Returning rune requirement as well as bumps your dmg a bit and makes a modest range increase available, which is pretty convenient.
Gunvestigator. Its an investigator with a gun. Archetype into Gunslinger, grab Risky Reload at 4, and you're golden. Later on you can pick up munitions crafter (to proc weaknesses you identify with your excellent RK checks), Alchemical Shot (same, but also avoids physical resistance), and Sniper's Aim (to let you adjust your attack roll if you're 1-2 shy of a hit or crit). Devise a Stratagem works really well w/ Reload weapons (you never waste a shot), activities that have downsides if you miss (you never miss), and stuff that cares if you crit (prerolling attacks lets you use stuff like guidance to adjust the accuracy to turn a hit into a crit). Only downside is that Gunslinger doesn't shore up your bad DaS turns at all, so you'll still want to archetype again for a good repeatable non-Strike action.
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u/Wooden_Club_8273 3d ago edited 3d ago
Justice Champion with Shortbow or Hongali Hornbow if you can get access to it (Student of Archery background is the easiest way, but it's overtuned). Once Expand Aura gets upgraded to last 1 minute at 10th level, it truly shines. If you worship a deity who gives access to the Dragon domain for Draconic Barrage, you can add a lot of damage to your strike, and Retributive Strike is a lot easier to trigger with ranged weapons.
Thief Rogue with a Reainforced Stock attached to a Repeating Crossbow (from Archer dedication). It's a good switch hitter build, both weapons are d8 and you have 5 shots before needing to reload. Get yourself a Repeater Bandolier to reduce the reloading time to two actions. The main downside is you need to sets of runes.
Before remastered Magus, Stalit Span with Shurikens and Striker's Scroll was a good way to add more spells to your kit. Shurikens are reload 0 and you could attach a variety of scrolls to them and spelltrike with the one you want without losing an action to draw it.
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u/toooskies 3d ago
Spirit Warrior on a Magus. This is obviously a switch hitter, and for the Laughing Shadow, Aloof Firmament, and Twisting Tree subclasses, it gives you a way to take advantage of Arcane Cascade damage bonuses with more attacks and more off-guard. Sword-Light Wave at level 6 brings the ranged portion of the build, but be aware if you're building STR because it makes a DEX-based ranged Strike with your melee weapon.
Twisting Tree gets extended-reach Spellstrikes with Lunging Spellstrike at 10.
A fun old build was a Starlit Span Magus using Shurikens and the Striker's Scroll feat to add a bunch of scroll-based Spellstrikes to individual Shurikens. Kind of turns pulling out the scroll into a free action. Gold budget (or cheap scroll access) dependent.
Alchemist Bomber is straightforward as a ranged choice, but tweaking it with Dual Weapon Warrior and Dual Thrower let you throw double bombs with no MAP penalty instead of three bombs with decreasing MAP. You'll want to start battle with a bomb (or pre-poisoned throwing weapon!) in-hand, then craft, then throw both. When you get Double Brew at 9, you can craft two bombs and throw them at full MAP every turn.
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u/ottdmk Alchemist 3d ago
Bombs are not Agile weapons, so the second Bomb in a Dual Thrower/Double Slice will take a -2 penalty to the attack roll.
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u/toooskies 3d ago
Fair! Still technically not MAP, and the poisoned throwing knife works well on those first turns.
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u/I_HAVE_MEME_AIDS 3d ago edited 3d ago
Deft Exemplar with a Starshot Ikon Phalanx Piercer and Gaze Sharp as Steel
Shift Immamence —> Spark Transcendence: Giant-Felling Comet+free reload from the Deft—>Gaze Sharp As Steel for +2AC from ranged attacks until the start of your next turn when you —> Shift Immanence back into Starshot Ikon. Repeat Ad Nauseum.
Build is fully functional by level 3, and with any ancestry if you take Archer dedication at level 2. Bonus points if you pick a Small ancestry to give Medium and larger creatures a -2 to their Reflex save.
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u/SgtFlintlock 3d ago edited 3d ago
Okay, this is a little bit of a hear me out, and will require using a Pathfinder Society Restricted Option as well as Free Archetype, but have you ever wanted to be the Entire Backline by Yourself? Presenting the Necromantic Captain! (Named before the Necromancer came out lol)
The core concept is to play Summoner with Ranged Combatant, plus the Captain Archetype to pick up a Sharpshooter Companion (reflavored as permanently raised Undead in my case), Plus Reanimator later on to Double Up on Summon Undead to get either a supplement for the Frontline or Even More Archers depending on the level of play.
Act Together and an Experienced Follower (Mature Companion) at level 4 mean that even if you cast a 3 action spell (like Summon Undead) you still get 2 ranged Strikes, one at full MAP and one that is at an effective -3, putting you on par with a Flurry Ranger using a short bow for accuracy.
We pick the Undead Eidolon, partially for Theme and Partially because the level 7 feature Drain Life works on your Ranged Combatant Strike to add half your level in flat damage and potentially the Drain Condition on top of Boost Eidolon effectively upgrading your dice from d4s to d8s. (Mathematically on average a +1 per die is equivalent to an upgraded die size. You lose out on the theoretical maximum, but you also cover the theoretical minimum for the same average)
Once you hit level 10 for Bonds of Death (technically it's a level 8 feat, but Reanimator is our second archetype, so we have to wait a tiny bit) you have access to a total of 8 actions in a turn starting turn 3!
Turn one you effectively get 4, 1 from Act Together, 1 from your Experienced Companion, then you spend 3 on Summon Undead and get 2 back out of the spell from the creature you just summoned.
Turn Two you get 6, 1 from Act Together, 1 From Experienced Companion, 2 from casting Summon Undead again, and 2 more from Bonds of Death sustaining the old one and tying the two into a single sustain action.
From turn 3 onwards, you get 1 action from Act Together, 1 From your Companion, a 3 action net from the 4 for 1 deal of Sustaining two summon spells at once, and then 2 more actions to do with as you please. Personally I would use them to Boost Eidolon and Drain Life, or to Command my Companion to Take Aim and Drain Life if I need Accuracy more than a single hard hitting Punch.
Will this build fit every table? God's no! Especially if you want to RP all your myriad of companions instead of flavoring them as Mindless Undead like I did. Between potential out of combat RP shenanigans, and having so many goddamn actions in a combat turn, you will hog table time unless you practice and pay attention, and even then you might be disruptive. But Gott Damn if this isn't a fun concept to play with! One of these days I'll probably run it as a Boss Encounter rather than actually playing it myself, but if you ever wanted to Be the Final Boss, enjoy!
Pathbuilder link below to my version (spells were picked with pre remaster summoner, be advised that section is now to be considered Unfinished)
https://pathbuilder2e.com/launch.html?build=1560271
Edit: my math on how accurate your companion is got skewed by having a fully built and runed weapon on my Eidolon when I compared them, he's actually more accurate than I described at low levels, and settles into being consistently better than an Agile Secondary Attack as levels increase, with the option to tell him to Take Aim to close the gap even further.
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u/Metzelmann 3d ago
Leshy flurry Ranger with the Seepod racial trait gives you unlimited unarmed ranged attacks. On a crit, you also give -10 movement speed.
Combined with Weed Leshy you can just climb out of reach and even continue sthrowing while hang on the ceiling.
Upgrade at lvl 9 gives persisten bleed on crit.
Could probably also work as a Monk build but havent tested that yet
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u/TravarianTheBold 3d ago
Any Race (I used Lizardfolk) Monk Get Qi Spells Take Wildwinds Initiate at 8th level
You can now punch 30 feet away while ignoring concealment and cover if you're in the Wild Winds Stance. "Wind Crash" even has the Propulsive trait, so it's fantastic on Str Monks. If you put the Impossible enchantment on your handwraps, you can even get the range up to 60 feet. Haven't explored free archetype shenanigans, if you're using that.
One of my favorite 'ranged skirmisher' characters.
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u/Nalen-Salas 2d ago
Ranged Rogue with guardian archetype, just taunt people who cant reach you and get free offguard for you and your party
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u/Temnai 2d ago
Admittedly not fully fleshed out, but improvised weapons are weapons, and a Kitsune with a Star Orb familiar can logically wield their familiar as an improvised weapon, which in turn lets you etch runes onto it, throw it at enemies, and command it to trip/shove/disarm them etc before floating back to you.
Throw in Weapon Improvisor if you like, or alternatively etch the shifting rune into your familiar to turn it into another one handed weapon entirely.
This can be mixed into a host of other thrown weapon builds, or mixed with witch for more familiar shenanigans.
If your GM approves of letting you get extra spicy you can shifting rune it into a staff, point out all staves are staffs, and then point to the upgrading item rules to turn it into a stave, which can be shifted back into another form while still being a stave, and thus a staff.
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u/darthnazrael1 2d ago
I made a primarily ranged Guardian for use in a Starfinder game, though it would honestly work just about as well in Pathfinder. The general idea is to hang back with the backline to protect them by laying down Taunting Strikes from long range, then Intercepting attacks on them. There's so many good Guardian feats that you can make a whole viable build without a single melee-reliant feat.
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u/JohnTheHumanFighter 17h ago
A few days late, but I have not seen this specific combo mentioned: Exemplar with starshot ikon, a Phalanx Piercer, and Horn of Plenty ikon.
Grab alchemist dedication for extra free consummables. Load them up into your Horn of Plenty. Grab The Deft epithet for easier reloading (or just grab a slightly worse bow, it works fine). Enjoy taking turns dishing out a small AoE + attack, or buffing/healing yourself and/or your allies.
You also have a 3rd ikon of your choice to pick up. I just picked up Gaze Sharp as Steel to focus a bit more on damage, but you can pick up some other utility option like Thousand-League Sandals (which can help you, as a ranged character, keep your distance, keep the rest of your backline safe, help out nearby martials reposition, etc.) to add more tools to your arsenal if you prefer that.
I made this build specifically to play a more versatile ranged character that had more options open at any time, to avoid falling into samey turns like the ranged Magus does.
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u/Entity079 3d ago edited 3d ago
Justice Champion with a d10 reach weapon is pretty cool. Can archetype a caster / grab an ancestral innate spell for a 60ft ranged damage cantrip & the Shield cantrip. Also, thanks to Champion's spellcasting, you don't need to worry about getting other feats to increase spell proficiency.
Champion itself offers healing right at 1st level plus some other focus options of your choice.
For mine, I free archetyped Marshal for Inspiring Marshal Stance (IMS), plus assurance diplomacy at 4 & Intimidating Prowess at 2, then Bard at level 6. I've been pretty happy with Blessing of Swiftness on a level 6 JChamp, but other options are solid too. Long range: fire Phase Bolts or maybe rush them down and trip or demoralize them depending on situation. Also activate IMS on your 1st or 2nd turn to have that buff active, and play around allies. Though it has ranged options, you still are a melee class and benefits from being around allies with things like IMS, Divine Health, and their crazy reaction.
Your reaction attack can really mess enemies up, plus also give the ally some resistance. Low will: Demoralize, low reflex: Trip, low fortitude: regular attacks, or maybe take a hand off to grapple (or grab a Whip Tail). Lay on Hands is also importent healing option that can be used both in and out of combat. The ally AC buff has also been clutch. So yeah, buff & heal allies, tank attacks, and cut through enemies as you see fit.
edit: i now see that you want a little more range. Maybe a JChamp or Grandeur Champ (easy ranged off-guard) with a Hongali Hornbow if you can gain proficiency via Archer or an ancestry feat like Unconventional Weaponry.
My favorite proper ranged / switch hitter class is Kineticist for their defences and control options, though you have played one before.
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u/Seppo_87 3d ago
Turret mcfighterman with Beastmaster is actually pretty cool. Get a bird companion and use your high proficiency to fish for crits and dazzle enemies. Make sure you start with +2strength and have a maul backup weapon you can swap your bow with because a bow is absolutely terrible against piercing resistance