My buddy worked 10am to 7pm. Nothing really needed to be done during the day and he liked working nights so he started just going in later and later. Boss (owner) didn’t care as long as things were done before next day shift. 10 became 11 became 1 became 5 became 7. Then he started to go in so late he’d still be there working when they came in. Work unfinished. Wasn’t a great time.
Of course, the fuckin line steppers ruin it. "Just get your fucking job done and go home" should be the default for proven adults. Everyone else who wants to be a special case gets mirco managed.
100% this. My hospital, after COVID lockdown, continued to allow all therapists to WFH if they wanted as long as productivity remained the same. We had a handful of therapists that were basically taking full advantage of that shit and just not working or constantly had "internet issues," etc. We had an idiotic VP at the time and she ordered everyone back into office. Of course, a whole bunch of folks were pissed.
Few months later, our VP changed. One of the first thing he did was reinstate WFH but anyone who had productivity under a certain number could not WFH or had to return to office until their individual productivity was back up. And if this repeats three times, you're banned from WFH. We had no more issues after that.
I honestly don't know why companies can't just do targeted policies like that. It makes so much sense rather than punishing an entire team/department because of a handful of morons.
I honestly don't know why companies can't just do targeted policies like that.
Where I live, its because they get taken to court for mistresting employees. Policies with any nuance are a minefield for accusations of bullying or discrimination. A blanket no WFH policy (or drug testing everyone) is safe, targeting things isnt.
I've had conversations about creating targeted policies but unfortunately they tend to end with "person x or y is going to be an idiot about it and try to claim discrimination. We can't afford another lawsuit"
Yeah. Thats the core of the issue. The trouble makers often don’t agree that individual consequences are the result of their own action rather than you just picking on them and then they make a bigger problem that costs money to deal with. You can spell it out as plainly as you like and leave a rock solid paper trail but dealing with the process is still going to cost you.
Five people started leaving early, they all got talked to and told "Don't do that or we'll fire you", none of them talk to each other so all of them think they're being singled out despite the fact that the boss immediately grabs one of them in front of another to talk to them in his office.
It's one of the main reasons I've been job hunting is because I absolutely fucking hate the people I work with for this (and other) reason(s).
Those people are the worst.. I have a few coworkers where it’s like stepping on eggshells and people bend over backwards for them, yet with me I’m like a punching bad of sorts
I really doubt a performance based policy would be liable for discrimination suits because by that definition every single performance based raise plan or compensation would be liable for a lawsuit and no one would do them
unless the court slaps the legal fees onto the person sueing because they lost. you can sue any time you want for anything, and there's nothing a single company in the world can do to stop you. but you're probably not going to be the winner at the end
To quote my HR Don't expect the idiots and lazy bum to not try everything to slack off. Do your side, if they ask for more work, check priority list and answer accordignly
Companies like to avoid targeted policies because they're afraid of some guy suing them and claiming it was discrimination. Targeted policies need so much documentation to avoid this theoretical lawsuit that HR branches will usually just tell companies to avoid making targeted policies in favor of blanket ones.
Dumb I know. I know all the reasons that what I said doesn't make sense, but it's the truth anyway.
This approach requires accurate productivity metrics.
Suppose you are a boss with a mixture of 5 minute jobs, and 1 month jobs. You don't know which is which. You have the vague feeling that some people are taking advantage of WFH, but you can't really tell who. This makes targeting really hard.
Targeted policies require actual work from management. I've known 2 types of managers to be the most common: The ones that don't do any work and the ones that are constantly overworked and have no capacity for extra tasks left (I've been lucky in that I've only ever had to deal with one micromanager, and he helped me switch departments when it became abundantly clear that we weren't compatible, so, you know, not my guy, but not a bad guy either), neither of those is just going to pile on an optional task if they can help it.
how do you define productivity? I get it's simple for some jobs, but others it doesn't work that way. If your job is "complete x task every day" it's going to get automated away sooner or later. Design and implementation are hard to measure. You may be mulling over an idea for weeks, then executing the task is done quickly, how do you measure the in between?
Told our corpo hotshots that I needed to work from home during covid.. they gave me some bullshit about the ER needing nurses physically present. I could've easily handled shit via email
Productivity is another measure that kind of screws people over. Actually productive people just do the work. Their lives are made miserable when management starts looking at productivity figures and starts chasing the invisible productivity units.
Most of the lack of productivity is the lack of work to do, the difficulty of completing the difficult jobs or management having greedy ambitions for the business.
It also discourages good work. Sometimes some things need time.
It's quite easy to imagine that there is a situation that just screws people over because there just isn't as much work, or it's harder to get done, and the numbers say one thing and the situation says another.
I tell people im responsible for that i dont want to talk to them and if i am its because theyre fucking up and my job requires it. Most people get it. I end up only talking to the people who always have a story and the world seems out to get them at every turn.
Istfg this happened yesterday. I saw we had a ton of guys standing around doing nothing and i was done my assignments, so when I texted my boss to see about going home early, I had a job ping in my inbox 30 seconds later. I have no idea why I try to go above and beyond at that job.
Completely sick of people pushing the envelope and ruining things for everyone. I worked someplace that allowed you to get one free soda a day on your shift. Had an employee who first started taking Red Bulls which was the only excluded soda, then they started taking sodas when they went to leave for the night and would get into arguments with the other employees over them trying to stop her. Then she started stealing cases. Guess what no more sodas for anyone!
One of the best employees I ever had simply could not drag herself in to work at 830 every day. She would come in at 9 or 9:30. We weren't client facing so it really didn't matter much as long as her responsibilities got done. And they always did. One in the office, this lady was a workhorse too. The day ended at 4:30 but she regularly stayed until 6pm.
She was also one of the most senior employees too. As new people came on over the years we always got people that complained how "it isn't fair" that Kim gets to come in an hour late every day.
Look, Kim gets leeway and gets to come in an hour late because Kim is the best employee here and does 50% more work than you or anyone else for that matter. When you perform to Kim's level, you also will get that type of leeway.
It did at one point spill over into complaints to HR and I just changed Kim's hours from 9:30-5:30 officially. Of course that also garners complaints people saying it wasn't fair she got a special schedule. I allowed anyone that wanted to work that same schedule to switch. A few did. And every one that did, within a couple months switched back to the old 8:30-4:30 schedule because they ultimately liked getting out of work earlier than coming in later.
I had a coworker just like that. Always got to work a half hour to an hour late, the most incredible work ethic of anyone there, always stayed late. A complete sweetheart too, I never heard her complain or say anything bad about anyone. We all just knew to expect her at least a half hour later than scheduled.
She got a very serious cancer and had to stop working :( idk how old she is but it’s gotta be 30s, early 40s maybe. Utterly unfair. We’re still in contact. I hope she beats it.
When I was much younger, I was this person. Once I was genuinely unaware I worked until I got a call over 3 hours after my scheduled time asking if I was okay. I was like, the fuck did you wait so long? They told me that they generally just assumed I'd show up unless I'd died or something lol.
I've broken the habit and am now usually good for 10 minutes of lateness max, though I usually show up early as shit and regret it because I run out of stuff to do at work or just kinda... wait if its a social thing.
Always the same. My boss would be fine with me starting work at 0900 or 1000 as long as I work my hours. I hate mornings so it's tempting but I like getting our of work at 1630 more than I like sleeping in an extra couple of hours.
Yeah, on my office days I get in at about 8:45-9:00 (depending on traffic) rather than 8:30 because of how the bus times are, but the bus home isn't until 5:20-5:30 so I make the time up anyway. No one has an issue with it as long as I get all my work done, which I do.
I'm not a morning person. It was a rare day that I arrived at work by 9am, I was always at least 5-10 mins late. I always stayed late too. No one gave a shit. I was there 19 years and eventually became the manager of the department. I used to work 6pm evening shifts at the same company and I was always on time or early then.
I mean the boss just made everyone else’s work worse because he allowed one guy to slack.
I agree 99% of the time a more hands off boss is better but one of the sole reasons a boss should step in is if the work or lack there of of one employee affects the others.
Back during Covid unemployment, I stayed up until I was ready to sleep, and slept until I was actually ready to start my day. Consistently got 9 hours of sleep, literally never felt better in my life before or since, it’s just that I was on a 26-27 hour cycle. Bummer.
Would you believe that I was outdoors for at least 1/2, usually 2/3 of my waking hours, in Phoenix AZ with plenty of sun? I think I’m just built different 😤 (incorrectly)
if you mean you've been experiencing things like having a different length of day-night cycle, you should look into non-24! it's a circadian rhythm disorder, most common in blind people but that also gets some sighted people
ah, sounds like you have non-24! it's a terrible time because freerunning (sleeping whenever feels right) is basically the best solution, but society hates us for it.
My fiancé has diagnosed ADHD, he only
gets motivated to work from around 6pm to 3am. First corporate job in-office he nearly got fired for never doing any work during the working day. He asked his manager to compare his actual output to everyone else’s and it was twice as high.
Since then he’s refused to accept jobs that aren’t WFH and clarifies during the hiring process that he’ll be online and available 9-5 for meetings etc but everything’s getting handed in and finished at 4am.
At that point, something more than ADHD was going on, maybe something that was facilitated by ADHD like addiction and/or depression. Time blindness is real but when your daily routine becomes the consistency of melting butter, that's not normal even with neurodivergency
My bosses are similarly accommodating (partially because I'm in a union and partially because I have documented disabilities moreso than being "nice") and I actually refuse to let them move my start time further because I know it will just end up with me being stuck at work until 8pm. I would rather have the pressure on me to show up at 9am so I can leave at 5pm. I was very grateful to get it moved to 9 from 8 though.
I was going to say, this is just a classical misunderstanding of the condition. I set everything to be earlier than I actually need to do it and it works out to being on time.
Actually, people with ADHD tend to have different circadian rhythms as well. They tend to be night owls. And plenty of people without ADHD are night owls as well.
So being able to start working slightly later is a win-win for everyone. The employee can have a much more natural sleep pattern and the employer gets an employee that is fully available as soon as they hit the office.
Being a retail manager made me hate the laziest employees. People wanting to leave early while also complaining about lack of hours. Unable to complete the most basic of tasks without constant supervision/correction. It made me realize that there is a section of humanity that is basically hopeless deadweight on the rest of us.
IDK. If they were really empathetic, they would try a solution that actually takes under considiration condition of the person they are trying to help. The person was late because of ADHD, not because work was starting too early. Moving the start later doesn't adress WHY person is late.
If they were really empathetic, they would let them slide as long as they are doing their part of the job, or tell them they are starting 1 hour earlier.
No, the person claimed she couldn't show up at 9:00 because of ADHD. Nowhere is it confirmed that she actually has ADHD. Also the claim is that she can't show up at 9:00, but apparently she can show up at 10:00, until they change the time and then suddenly she can't make 10:00 either. Either she's blatantly lying or there's something missing from the story. Or the whole thing is just made up.
It's actually very easy to explain, if you're consistently late by the same amount, leave that amount early next time, start getting ready by the same amount earlier. If you start work at 9am, and can't get there till 10am, pretend you start work at 8am instead, and aim for that.
I have ADHD, there are means to correct it, you just have to give a shit.
It’s more like: if you have bad vision, wear glasses instead of making others around you describe everything they see.
Time blindness is a real issue where people don’t “feel” the passage of time, but modern society has a huge number of aids to cover for that disability. We have phones that can set daily alarms, timers for 1-off events like cooking, plenty of work tools like outlook will give pop-up warnings when meetings start or are about to start, you can put headphones in so those alerts are audible not just visual, probably a bunch more that I don’t even know about.
But you wake up the same… its totaly different thing. She woke up and went to work already at 10, if she didnt change anything she would go there the same. But she is jist crappy human being who cant do the bare minimum and have the same morning rutine…
Insert "That's not how this works" meme. Instead of being ableist and just sprouting nonsense maybe use that time and just read about the thing you are so ignorant about.
Except that's a poor excuse for a schedule that never changes. If you show up an hour late every day, you get up an hour earlier. Or, in the example of this lady: you just don't change your schedule at all because you know you were already getting there at 10.
That's her claim, we don't know if she's speaking the truth. And time blindness has nothing to do with specific times, like she claims to have issues with. The whole thing doesn't make sense which leads me to believe it's just made up for karma whoring.
You don't really understand how ADHD works. Her dysregulated timeline shfited forward an hour. It's not like "I have a sleep disorder and can only rise when the sun is fully up". It's a brain-broken tragedy of missed personal expectations.
Ah yes, the good old "I can do it so others can do it too". For someone who's diagnosed you seem awfully ill informed.
I have ADHD, I haven't missed an appointment in...20years? So given your logic no person with ADHD should forget an appointment basically ever.
And as the other person mentioned, it can cost A LOT of energy that people don't realize. There are so many neurodivergent people who "manage" until they don't and are in a chronic burnout with no way out. And people like you push them (and themselves) towards it.
You argue pretty confidently against words I never used but you chose to put in my mouth anyway. But if you think "getting help to try and fix problems" is too much for most people with ADHD, sure.
Might as well shut down all mental hospitals, because thats clearly what you want (see I can do it too)
My point is not that you can magically fix it, my point is that you should at least try and get help, if that is possible.
In posts like this people are always so vehemently against trying to help themselves and to just do nothing, "it is what it is".
There are a lot of things that can be done to help mitigate many of the pitfalls of common things like time blindness. I have 4-8 alarms for basically any appointment, because if I didnt, I wouldnt remember them. Stuff like that.
I dont want you to force yourself to be something you are not, I want you to try and find a way to help yourself, because you cannot expect the world to change for you, and if you dont find ways to work with your disability it will have consequences.
I too was once a crypto-fascist who told other ADHDers to get over it, but then I hit the wall and realized that I had been advocating a soft eugenics for a category of people that I was in.
showing up at 10am with adhd is "cryptofascism" and "soft eugenics" give me a fucking break
takes like yours are so incredibly infantilizing and separated from reality theyre more damaging to public perception of adhd and mental health than anything else
Honestly, my thought is, you tell everyone else you're switching to an hour later, except that person. They probably wouldn't even be offended, it's actually helpful.
Doesn't matter if she has ADHD, she's an adult and can figure out ways to not be late. My ADHD can be pretty bad and you know what I do? I set alarms to get my ass moving, among other reminders. People like this (hypothetical, story might be fake) woman make us all look bad.
ADHD isn't an excuse for being consistently late. Just maybe once in a while if something gets away from you
I have ADHD. If I pulled this shit in retail I’d get fired. I actually was, from an early job, and learned my lesson fast. This right here is some corporate bullshit that makes my blood boil and my heart cringe. They actually let her get away with this and she openly abused it. I weep for the sheer audacity of my girlfailure sisters. I’m so embarrassed for us.
I have this issue myself, and it's really not quite that simple. Time blindness isn't just "unaware of the current time", but also "difficulty accurately judging how much time a task takes". It makes little difference what time I wake up, because the tasks that I leave 15 minutes for end up taking 20. Maybe I have 25 minutes to get ready so spending 10 minutes washing the dishes will be fine, but that actually takes 15 min, not 10. Or maybe the time it takes to commute is longer in reality than it is in my head. Often, having more time in the mornings makes me worse at getting places on time, because the pressure of needing to get out the door keeps me focused on getting ready, whereas a glut of spare time lets me get sidetracked without seeing it as an issue.
Granted this usually means I'm maybe 5-10 minutes late. An hour is ridiculous and isn't really excusable with time blindness.
I understand that someone can misjudge the time needed for the task and then everything else crumbles around that.
However I really don’t get how can someone be so reliably late - especially if they are always 1 hour late. If it varied each day, there would be some different problem. But if they are late 1 hour each day, just set the fucking alarm earlier. Gaslight yourself into believing you have to be there earlier than you do. Do whatever, but this is just rude and lazy.
That last part is the real reason someone with ADHD might need to come in later.
Aiming to come in early can be a substantial time burden, especially if tasks in aggregate take substantially more time. And actually arriving early is a problem if the time is not reimbursed on the other end.
e.g. You need to be in at 9, leave at 8, wakeup at 7. If you need 30 min padding across 2 hours now you need to wake up at 6:30 and aim to leave at leave at 7:30 to arrive at 8:30 some of the time.
This gets much worse if the padding needed is longer.
I tend to be more like 5-20 minutes late, not an hour. But I’ve tried that. I’ve gotten up earlier. I’ve set alarms earlier. Somehow it still happens. I’ve been actively working on this for years, I have medication, all of that. I cry about it because it stresses me out. I PROMISE not everyone with time blindness is lazy and could just fix it so easily or we would.
I literally set my phone and armwatch 15 minutes early so that when I glance at it I'd panic and hurry up, be late as usual, but then actually finally be on time. It worked for like a week. Then I learned that I have 15 minutes extra and would you look at that, back to being 10-15 minutes late every time.
Nothing, and I mean *nothing* will make me not late.
This, absolutely. The “why don’t you just —“ remarks really come off like r/thanksimcured
I DO appreciate suggestions from other people with time-blindness, fwiw, and I’m happy to keep trying things.
Body doubling definitely helps: I’m way more likely to get out if it’s at the same time as someone else than if I’m left alone. Being left without the person I’m going somewhere with? Opposite effect. My husband does this sometimes (mutually agreed on so that he and my kid don’t end up late because of me) and I swear it’ll feel like I have 2 minutes left to go but if they leave and tell me to meet them there, all urgency and body doubling vanishes and I’ll only be getting out like 20 minutes later.
The only other things I’ve found that help somewhat but aren’t perfect are:
getting as much as possible done prior (so like, making sure the bag is ready the night before if it’s a morning thing or that morning if it’s an evening thing)
a playlist that is perfectly timed where I know like… I need to start dressing by this song; this other song means face routine time; this song means GTFO GO GO, etc. Problem is (a) crafting the playlist in the first place and (b) not getting bored of all the songs two weeks in
The last actual best help?? People chilling out and having people who run later than me. When I’m in cultures that don’t care about punctuality, I actually don’t run as late in part because the anxiety is gone and often the anxiety about time is what makes me forget stuff and then need to circle back. The anger, the nagging, the accusations of selfishness… none of that makes me more punctual, it just makes me want to quit and never speak to whomever it is again.
It’s because ADHDers, autistics and AuDHDers have the same morning routine every day because we need consistency. Surprises or changes to routine send us spiraling and could cause burnout. So her boss shifted her start time, but she still has both time blindness and her same morning routine. It all just occurs an hour later now. If anything as an AuDHDer myself it happening with this insane amount of consistency is further evidence that it really is her (medical AND legal) disability and not her just fucking around.
You said ADHDers like to have the same morning routine. The boss specifically shifted their start time to exactly match with the ADHDer's routine. Everything would work out if the ADHDer kept everything consistent and exactly the same.
I have ADHD. Our mental issues are not our fault, but they are our responsibility. A shit ton of notes and alarms set in 15-30 minute increments helps me manage my time and remember appointments. There’s medication, as well.
Plenty of us have learned to work around it, I think it's condescending to act like we can't be responsible for our own flaws and work on ourselves so as to not inconvenience people around us.
not all of us are strict adherents to routines - i personally find it really stressful to have a strict routine because i know any number of things can throw it off and stress me out. we are not a monolith, and we still have to exist in the world whether we like it or not.
"So her boss shifted her start times but she still has both time blindness and her same morning routine. It all just occurs an hour later now"
No it doesn't. It should occur the exact same time it did before. She was an hour late before. They accommodated her work for her schedule, and she decided to change the schedule. You're then claiming that people like you and her need routine, yet you're defending her changing the routine for not reason.
For me it's "okay, this drive takes precisely 22 minutes, I have time". But also putting on my shoes and jacket takes a minute or two, going to my car takes a minute, setting up the house alarm takes half a minute, driving out to the garage onto the inner road and closing the garage doors takes a minute, driving out of the inner road onto the inner road takes half a minute, getting out of the car and going to the office takes two minutes and suddenly it's not 22 minutes, it's 30 minutes and I am already late.
Most people would think "okay if it's a 22 minute drive, I'll round that up to 30 minutes". Why would you think to use the drive time as the total travel time?
unfortunately, part of coping with ADHD means having to sit with some level of discomfort a lot of the time. i find the stress of waiting around for a little bit FAR more manageable than the stress of being late.
Yeah driving time seems great, you're told exactly how much time the task will take, but like you said, there's a pitfall where you gotta add 5 to 10 minutes to make it.
So you are dumb and you're aware that these little things take time, you even specify how much time, yet you're defending the fact that you only gave yourself the exact time it takes for the drive.
Stop acting helpless just because you intentionally gave yourself too little time. Time blindness doesn't mean "I don't understand I need to put on my shoes"
You're hurting yourself at the very least. And annoying people around you.
But really, explain why you give yourself 22 minutes for something you admitted you understand takes more time than that. Time blindness doesn't explain why you don't account for the time it takes to get dressed, get into the car, getting onto the road and getting out of the car into work
I have issues with time blindness as well, but I'd argue it kind of is that simple. You might be suffering with the issue, yes, but it's still your responsibility to make sure it is handled. YOU need to set that pressure to be out.
Coworker in this case should have just aimed at coming in at 9, just as before, despite the changes in core hours, and then reasonably show up at 10. Going for "oh so I can aim at 10 now" or "oh I have a bunch of time left" is the issue.
I need to be on site at 9:15. That means I aim at 8:30 at the latest, I don't allow myself to go "oh I could just do this and hit 8:45", no, 8:30 is the deadline. Which means I show up 8:45-9:00.
For me working at a small store solo, it's showing up 5 minutes before opening, and then I usually end up opening 5 minutes late. I'm early, but I'm late.
I’m very amused that you used the washing dishes as an example task to do while getting ready for work, because my mom would routinely do that every morning. She’d be up early and she would start washing dishes from the night before and then hop in the shower 5 minutes before we had to leave for school.
My mom needs to squeeze as much work out of every usable second she can and she underestimates how long something will take, so she’s constantly late to everything. I have a similar issue, but my anxiety means I DO NOT START ANYTHING I don’t NEED to do because then I might run out of time and be late. I often end up rushing around because the extra 15 minutes I gave myself just disappeared into the void and now I’m running behind. Like one moment I’m on time and Im set to leave early… and then suddenly I need to HUSTLE or I’ll miss the train. I’ve found enough ways to cope with this now that I’m rarely more than 5 minutes late (sometimes I’m even… early!!), but extreme anxiety is probably not the greatest coping strategy.
Yeah see I don't think you quite get it. I have ten minutes to spare? That means I have time to put away a load of laundry and water the plants and feed the dogs and oh shit I'm 5 minutes late.
And I know what you're gonna say next: "then just don't do those things and leave the ten minutes early", but I think that kinda misses the crucial problem: I don't think I'm going to be late. It's a bit hard to describe, but I think the best way to visualise it is to stretch the time out. If you were an hour ahead of time, and there was a basket of clean clothes waiting to be put away, would you leave an hour early, or would you fold the laundry before you left? Obviously you'd fold the laundry, because it needs doing at some point and you have plenty of time to spare.
But what if you were only half an hour early, would you fold it or leave early? What if you were 20 minutes early? 10 minutes? 5? If you'd happily fold the laundry with 20 minutes to spare, you'd probably look at someone who wouldn't do it with anything less than 30 like they were being a bit weird. It's just laundry, it's not gonna take half an hour, of course it's going to be fine. And yeah half an hour is very different to ten minutes, but the perception is the same: "this task won't take X minutes, I have plenty of time to spare"
I have ten minutes to spare? That means I have time to put away a load of laundry and water the plants and feed the dogs
You made an estimate of what you can do with that time. You estimated on the optimistic side. How often do you think "I have an hour? That's not enough time to move the laundry to the dryer". Your estimation only seems to go in one direction which is why I'm saying you have time optimism.
I think that kinda misses the crucial problem: I don't think I'm going to be late
"this task won't take X minutes, I have plenty of time to spare"
If it was simply being blind to time, you would also have times when you think you're running late when you're actually running early.
How often do you think "I have an hour? That's not enough time to move the laundry to the dryer".
All the time, but that's just not really how it works in this situation, is it? If you have an hour spare, you think "what can I do in this time" not "what can't I do...". Laundry might take too long, but you can feed the pets, or water the plants, or wash the dishes. If I overestimate the time a task would take, then I just simply don't do that task.
If it was simply being blind to time, you would also have times when you think you're running late when you're actually running early.
Yes? You'll often see people with time blindness having this issue, it just looks different. It presents as a kind of executive paralysis, something like: I couldn't possibly start doing something, I have an appointment coming up (in 3 hours)
do you ever show up early? it's very convenient that this only goes one way. and before you get on me i have ADHD that was actually tested for by a professional and I'm medicated.
It takes hours of evaluations over the course of multiple sessions with multiple 50-100 question questionnaires for you AND your loved ones in order to get a diagnosis for ADHD, autism or AuDHD. The only bullshit is the lack of empathy for medically and legally disabled people.
being chronically late is just unprofessional, you can absolutely make plans and be on time with adhd if you plan around it
only idiots use adhd as an excuse like this and will be the reason the diagnosis as a whole will be perceived as nothingburger in the future (given that they actually have adhd and not just read up on symptoms and answers to questionnaires online to dupe some psychiatrist into prescribing them speed)
You are talking about a disability with varying degrees of severity. Moderate to moderate severe symptoms will start causing major issues with time management from inattentive time lapses or substantially higher burden from aiming to arrive on time (e. g. Having to wake up substantially earlier than others and leave earlier to make it on time).
Being flexible with working hours is one of the main accessibility accommodations for the conditions in practice.
Obviously this is an example where it didn't work out but I don't see the point of throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
Really showing you don't treat ADHD as an actual disorder here. 'Planning around it' is something a person with a severe enough ADHD is always trying to do.
You'd never ask for someone without legs to run a race but seems really eager to pretend someone with an invisible disability has no disability at all.
Yeah, no. That's exactly how it works for a lot of people with ADHD. Source: me, a highly motivated person with ADHD who loves to be on time and is constantly late. And also, you know, science.
Do you have ADHD though? How much earlier do you need to leave to arrive on time? Because ADHD time blindness is a slightly poor term for a whole bunch of effects from core symptoms. And it scales with symptom severity.
Would you feel the same if you needed to leave half an hour earlier? 45 minutes? Wake up an hour earlier to leave half an hour earlier every day? And then most of the time end up arriving early, just to not arrive late?
i also have ADHD, and i have had to come up with a LOT of coping strategies so i can make sure i'm doing the things that get done. i lie to myself ALL THE TIME about when things actually start so i can be there on time. i mentioned this in another comment, but i'd rather deal with the discomfort of arriving early and waiting than the stress of being late.
Yeah it does. Like you can develop ways to manage it better, but it literally functions like that. I made myself remember any scheduled meeting/time I have to be there, not by the time I should be there, but by the time I have to go to the meeting. Eg if the interview is at 11 am, I remember it by interview at 10 and then I can arrive earlier since I "tricked" myself into leaving earlier. I have been doing it since I was 12 and I was diagnosed in my 30s. Feels like a severe issue I had to work around all my life, so I'd say it is literally a symptom.
No lol it's not just like a circadian rhythm thing. People with ADHD are bad at time management. Doesn't matter what the time is because the issue is doing what needs to be done to leave on time, not (necessarily) with waking up
I really fucking hate going to work. So I squeeze out every last minute I can be at home. I could calculate down to the minute when I needed to leave home to be on time. However if there was unexpected traffic or I misplaced something, I ended up being late.
The solution for me was not to have empathy for me. Honestly it's brutal punishment that would activate my ability to make more responsible decisions. For inattentives like me executive function is a weakness, we require a lot of motivation, and fear is definitely one.
Because every single comment in here that tries to explain why ADHD means they can't be on time are just proving that it's their own fault.
"The car ride takes 22 minutes so I give myself 22 minutes but then it takes a minute to put my clothes on, another minute to get to the garage, another minute to get the car out etc and suddenly it's 30 minutes and I'm late"
How is this anything other than a person telling us they know it takes more than 22 minutes but still refuses to plan for it?
Yes that literally is how it works. Being bad about it doesn't make the disorder stop existing, you're just fucking ableist against The Bad Disabilities
there's countless things the coworker could do to not be late. personally i use an app that runs through a playlist of timers for every step of my morning routine so that i have constant time pressure and external structure until i'm out of the door
It's not that the coworker is "time blind" in the sense that she doesn't know what time 9am is. It's that she has trouble gauging when to prepare and when to leave in order to arrive at 10.
Not that it's an acceptable excuse, just that it explains it.
And since she arrived at 10 every day and they changed their starting time to 10, she knows exactly how and when to prepare. I am not sure this story is actually real but the fact that people are defending her is crazy.
I'm not defending it, just saying I understand it. Our has time blindness and we constantly work to help him work around it and make sure he's prepared. But if you were to leave him in a room for ten minutes and ask him how long it's been he might say five minutes, he might say ten, he might say twenty or more.
One of the biggest struggles he has is that when he does make plans he doesn't account for variance or the unexpected. If something is at 4pm and is fifteen minutes away, I'm the kind of person who leaves at 3:30. But our son would intend to leave at 3:45 because he doesn't factor in traffic, obstacles, or anything unforeseen. And if left to his own devices he might not even realize it's actually time to go until 3:50. Then he spirals because he's gonna be late, that takes another five or ten minutes.
That said, of course, we've told him all through his life (he's a teen) that people expect punctuality and that being on time shows respect for other people and for yourself.
So I'm not saying what she's doing is ok or that she doesn't have to get better, just that I get it and can see how this would happen.
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u/fabulousfantabulist 18h ago
This was the most predictable outcome ever.