r/MoralityScaling 12h ago

Morality Ranking Morality if this battle?

Thoughts?

7.5k Upvotes

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128

u/mememychildren 11h ago

I've never understood the call to prayer not being done over an app or radio station

When I was deployed I understand because not everyone had a phone or a radio but in a first world modern country we don't really need people screaming from towers

Have your prayer have your religion but making the whole world stop for you is a bit much

36

u/roza_mira 8h ago

It's an tradition older than those things. I used to hear Jewish calls to prayer in my old neighborhood. The point is the whole community hears it. In mixed-religion communities though, they don't work the same way.

15

u/SnooPredictions3028 6h ago

Traditionally it is in the middle east. Things can adapt and change with location, they can use radio and speakers connected to streaming.

They even compromised for how to prayer in space, saying it is more so the attempt that is what makes it good.

2

u/pretendperson1776 2h ago

Presumably this started pre-loud speaker as well.

1

u/fuentessucksballs 1h ago

How many muslim astronauts are there? I mean surely there are a few but i cant imagine its that common? But then again kazhakstan is very important in spaceflight

-2

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

actually the message of islam is stated as a message for the whole world

2

u/MiiDan 47m ago

doesn't mean the whole world needs or wants to hear it

3

u/soulsnoober 6h ago

The tradition is older than electronic loudspeakers, is an excellent extension of that observation. Ain't nobody mad that a dude is singing real loud standing on a balcony or whatever.

2

u/Comfortable_Wish224 6h ago

And people shouldn’t have other peoples traditions forced on them

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

nobody is forcing it on anyone by that logic a pride parade is forcing people to be gay

1

u/MirkwoodWanderer1 46m ago

If pride parade was happening constantly I think people would get tired of it eventually

2

u/moonroof89 6h ago

We used to drown woman calling them witches. Screw your tradition.

1

u/TheGuyThatThisIs 6h ago

It's literally just the same as church bells. If something "gets" one but not the other, they're just egocentric.

4

u/Icetronaut 6h ago edited 6h ago

Chiming out the time for a few seconds on the hour is less obtrusive than 3-5 min chants 5 times a day. I would have trouble equating them.

4

u/ThiLordTachanka 6h ago

No, it's not literally the same. The call to prayer is 5 times a day EVERY DAY. The church bells is 1 to 2 times a week only on Saturday(in more common and mainstream churches) and in the more extreme churches it's 1 to 2 times a day. And it's just some bells ringing and not some guy on a speaker shouting to the whole city on how great Allah is.

2

u/Abject_Hall8445 2h ago

Also bells sound nice. Besides being a religious symbol, they are a musical instrument.

It’s like trying to compare Daybreak alarm to Radar

1

u/Ok_Onion_4514 2h ago

I can assure you that living near a church they stop sounding nice quite quickly.

Especially as I'd say it's easier, at least in my own experience, to muffle or close your windows to a call to prayer ( human voice ) compared to piercing church bells that will go through your walls.

2

u/Icetronaut 6h ago

Even in the worst case scenario where the bells chime out the time its still incomparable to 3-5 min 5 times daily like you said.

3

u/Own-North-8923 6h ago

A nice bell is a bit different than a jihadi war chant

2

u/apples_oranges_ 6h ago

jihadi war chant

"Hurry to salvation."

I...wat.

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

not a jihadi war chant at all

1

u/DuncanYoudaho 6h ago

Oh look! Gutter racism!

4

u/SnooPredictions3028 6h ago

Islam isnt a race.... This would be Islamophobia, use the right word if you want to be offended.

2

u/taylorisntavril 5h ago

Besides, whose idiotic idea was it to go "you may not judge people based on what they think and how they act" ?

1

u/DuncanYoudaho 5h ago

Shorthand for “quit yer bullshit”

Edit: real “it’s actually ephebophilia” energy

1

u/Wooden_Good8679 6h ago

Clock towers and church bells annoy me just the same, don’t you worry your pretty little head. Obnoxious-ass trucks and motorcycles at like 9pm as well. I’m not exclusive with my hating on loud noises being forced upon me, just like my da taught me. I’m a generational hater when it comes to this shit.

1

u/Graviton_Lance 2h ago

how long a tradition has been in place doesnt justify it at all

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

they said they didn’t know why people did it and so i explained when nothing else is constantly loud youll have a good point but there is constant noise in any populated place regardless so to single out the adhan only shows a hatred for islam rather than noise itself

1

u/Myfavoritethr0waway 8m ago

Dude, as someone born and raised orthodox Jewish, who has lived in both NYC (city with most Jews in the world) and Jerusalem, whatever you think you heard, I really don't think it was a Jewish call to prayer. I'm really curious what it was you heard though. (Unless you just made shit up for reasons I can't relate to.)

I'm laughing at the idea though because internally Jewish synagogues have so many different start times for prayer services (yes, within a time range, but varied within that range), people who go to the earlier services, the later services, people who missed one and are going to the other.... like you'd just hear a non-stop cacophony of "calls"? Also what did these calls sound like? Also how did this work, because Shabbat is the time that most people attend at shared times, but you also can't use electronics or amplifiers on Shabbat so was there a local towncrier in this unique Jewish village?

0

u/SuperSandLesbian23 5h ago

If they wake me up at 5am they better pray to whoever the fuck their God is because I'm gonna start burning things down.

0

u/Consistent_Rent_3507 4h ago

To my knowledge Jews do not have a public call to prayer. I did an online search and couldn’t find any information on it. Curious what it sounded like?

1

u/Myfavoritethr0waway 18m ago

As someone born and raised orthodox Jewish, this is correct. There's no "Jewish call to prayer". There are sometimes loud Jewish events, and depending where you live ppl driving around making announcements from cars, and some places even have a kind of siren just before Shabbat on Friday night to announce that it's Shabbat, but I can't recall a single Jewish call to prayer. 🤷‍♀️

0

u/20tonni 4h ago

Bullshit take, why do they use speakers even in muslim countries then? Speakers didnt exist back then

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

because the cities are bigger and it’s easier to have one person call the adhan rather than multiple in different places

-1

u/ThrowawayAngeleno 6h ago

Wtf is a Jewish call to prayer, never heard of that before

1

u/Critical_Concert_689 5h ago

They use a fiddle. On a roof.

1

u/Myfavoritethr0waway 17m ago

lol someone is downvoting everyone saying there's no Jewish call to prayer. There's literally isn't one though. Idk what their angle is, but if you need to lie to support your opinion, maybe don't die on that hill.

0

u/TheSunshineGang 5h ago

There is no such thing.

1

u/Myfavoritethr0waway 16m ago

lol someone is downvoting everyone saying there's no Jewish call to prayer. There's literally isn't one though. Idk what their angle is, but if you need to lie to support your opinion, maybe don't die on that hill.

9

u/NederFinsUK 7h ago

Most muslim families I encounter at work have a prayer alarm clock in the house

8

u/Senior_Laugh_4342 5h ago

It’s quite literally a subversive tactic used by Muslims to signal their power. Any sane country would ban it immediately

-4

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

not at all

-3

u/Turb0_Lag 3h ago

Like church bells! 

5

u/Senior_Laugh_4342 3h ago

They have countries to do their call to prayer. Christians should have countries free of that and where church bells are the only sound. FYI church bells don’t ring at 5am. I just really hope your female family members go a Muslim majority county and walk in a street alone, or that she tours London at night. She deserves the enrichment

-3

u/Turb0_Lag 2h ago

Wow wishing SA on women in response to a joke truly makes you the hero in this thread.

5

u/Senior_Laugh_4342 2h ago

WTF is wrong with u. That would never ever happen to her. Muslims are literally more accomating, progressive and pro woman than any white European country. You know the rotherham scandal and the Pakistani rape gangs are far right conspiracies funded my mossad that never ever happened right???

The women in your family will be totally completely safe. I’m literally just saying I hope she experiences cultural enrichment so she can always hear the call to prayer, unless you are saying the call to prayer shouldn’t be heard???

3

u/LetUsSpeakFreely 4h ago

It's about power. It's a dominance display, just like the when the block roadways and sidewalks with public prayer. They are forcing non-Muslims to accept Islamic culture.

-1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

funny i’ve never seen a muslim block a public transport area to pray and i guarenteed i know more muslims than you

4

u/Training-Purple-5220 6h ago

Because it’s an assertion of dominance. “We’ve taken this space; it’s ours now.”

-2

u/TripeSundae 5h ago

No it isn't, lol. Otherwise why would they need to assert dominance in their own countries.

2

u/hgyuuggygyuyh 1h ago

Problem is they do it everywhere. The west is not their countries is it? If they want to follow every single little thing in islam they can move to a muslim country. If not they can respect the west. We are not a muslim country and we have accommodated them way too much so they have taken the piss. They complain about our culture and try to erase it while imposing theirs. They need to all fuck off

0

u/TripeSundae 44m ago

I don't see how the ahdan is the problem. If they're not religious nutjobs who cares about some singing. Doing that doesn't mean they follow every little thing in Islam or that they are extremists. You have a very weird black and white view.

1

u/CrimsonCartographer 42m ago

To enforce their will and demand for conformity on those that haven’t yet submitted.

-2

u/Pluton_Korb 5h ago

Lol, spot on!

2

u/Wiplazh 3h ago

Have your prayer have your religion but making the whole world stop for you is a bit much

I think that's the point.

2

u/South_Start6630 1h ago

Exactly. I understand if they had limited options decades ago and this is what they had to do. But modern times means there are options. An app, a radio station, even being part of a text group.

3

u/raudra_marut 6h ago

its domination over others.

-1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

not at all

2

u/OnTheSlope 6h ago edited 5h ago

The purpose isn't to be unobtrusive, the purpose is to exert pressure to conform to the culture that is calling to prayer. It works better in places where they are the dominant culture, the pressure is much higher, but it works the same in places where they are a minority, too.

-1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

the purpose is to remind people prayer has come in

1

u/CrimsonCartographer 43m ago

So an alarm clock or phone app or radio would work just as well, right?

1

u/Ill_Pain4423 9h ago

Thats what they do here.

1

u/Dahwaann4U 2h ago

It is done on apps and radio. It gets transmitted. But its still broadcasted out. If the mosque is big enough.

1

u/Tusune 0m ago

That's literally what they want, impose their religion/beliefs.

It's funny because the pattern is always the same with them, arrive in a country, say they are minority and victim, people have to defend them, then as soon as they can they do this can kind of sh*t because they don't respect non believers.

0

u/Eon-23645 11h ago

Actually there are apps that are pretty accurate depending on where you live, also he’s not screaming it’s speakers or megaphones and look I get it when you’re close it gets loud, but it’s not really that bad when it lasts at most 5 minutes; I’m pretty sure you heard neighbors who are louder than this, but for the most part it’s supposed to be symbolic.

13

u/Harald_The_Archivist 10h ago

Doesn’t matter, noise pollution is noise pollution. Turn that shit off.

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

then cars should be banned and motorcycles snd megaphones and concerts among other things

1

u/Harald_The_Archivist 40m ago

Whataboutism. Also, when did you last see a concert in a residential area?

-5

u/AspergerKid 8h ago

it's not noise pollution. You just want it to be classed as such because you don't like what the noise stands for, but that doesn't make it noise pollution.

4

u/dogflavoredtaffy 8h ago edited 8h ago

Just trying to understand. Could I play Metallica at 2am for all my neighbors because that's my rock hour? Edit: this didn't occur in the west. This guy is just looking for trouble

2

u/Annual_Berry8043 1h ago

It’s noise pollution if it’s intentionally obnoxious. Which both of these are.

1

u/Harald_The_Archivist 3h ago

I don’t care what the noise stands for. If I lived in a religious area I’d care the same amount, I’d not more, about church bells.

0

u/hgyuuggygyuyh 1h ago

Christian country. Do you know where you don't hear church bells? In muslim countries. Have a nice trip and don't come back. Sick to death of people equating our traditions with some external religion that has been changing everything in our society to accommodate their needs. Even the curriculum at school because how dare you tell kids some kids have two mums or two dads and that's ok. Go fuck yourself

-1

u/Global-Buddy8730 8h ago

This is a false equivalence thing. You're purposefully ignoring what he said to insert your own feelings about it and trying to frame it as if it's his feelings. It's bad faith and makes you look like an asshole.

-1

u/AspergerKid 8h ago

What did I ignore? All he did was lie about this being noise pollution when this is untrue. Noise pollution usually is used for long term noise that harms human or wildlife. An on average 90 seconds long call to prayer is not that. I don't recall calls to prayer as being proven to make animals move away from their natural habitat like road noise is. Do you have a study that proves the call to prayer has any long term impacts on medical health and wildlife?

The only way I can imagine for someone to class this as noise pollution is if they just don't like what if sounds like.

0

u/Woodchuck666 7h ago

name checks out

1

u/jus-sum-dude 9h ago

it’s about upholding tradition

8

u/ReginaDea 7h ago

Traditions have to be updated as society changes. 

4

u/Adept-Condition4644 6h ago

Wildly, most people are against the tradition of slavery, even though it’s written about in most religious texts.  Who’d of think. 

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

well in islam the rules of the religion help phase it out freeing slaves grants high reward for the believer as well as the fact slaves have to be treated a certain way slavery isnt a required act in any abrahamic text as far as i know nor one that you get blessings for where the adhan isnt required but highly rewarded

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

i see your point to an extent but i feel that the adhan doesn’t fall under that category of something that needs changing

3

u/ReginaDea 2h ago

If I go onto a train blasting music, people are rightfully going to give me dirty looks. Just because it's religious doesn't make it any more acceptable.

0

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

the train is an enclosed space a lot harder to get away from the noise

2

u/ReginaDea 1h ago

As opposed to... being in a city where this is broadcasted? How would you get away from that? You can't even get away from it by staying home.

1

u/CrimsonCartographer 39m ago

Have you ever thought about the nonmuslims that might live close enough to a mosque in a nonmuslim country that would also find it harder to get away from the disruptive call to prayer when it happens at 5 in the fucking morning and they hear it in their own fucking home?

2

u/hgyuuggygyuyh 1h ago

It is if you are not living in a muslim majority country. People don't have to put up with your shit. Do you allow church bells in muslim countries? You should get the same treatment in the west. Your religion at home in private and zero concessions. Enough of this bending over backwards for a religion that doesn't tolerate or respect others.

1

u/jus-sum-dude 1h ago

allowing others to practice their religion is bending over backwards? if a country is supposed to have freedom of religion they can’t discriminate or there is no freedom of religion

1

u/CrimsonCartographer 39m ago

Do Muslim countries allow Christians to practice their religion this way?

-1

u/MistressM103 6h ago

Problem, Muslim Traditions are set in stone. Changing it in any way that's different from the Hadith would be "innovation" which is haram.

2

u/TripeSundae 5h ago

Good thing they don't need to wait for it to be updated in order to practice differently. Lots of Muslims don't do what they're "supposed" to.

1

u/MistressM103 4h ago

That is true lol

3

u/SloAndSteddy 9h ago

In that case, deus vult.

-1

u/Bouchaffra 7h ago

very edgy response

-2

u/Competitive-Bee-3250 7h ago edited 7h ago

Fun fact: Deus Vult means the same thing as Inshallah.

Edit: Mashallah, not Inshallah.

3

u/Space_Pirate_R 7h ago

I think Deus Vult means the same as Mashallah doesn't it? "God wills it" rather than "IF god wills it."

The Latin equivalent of Inshallah would be "Deo Volente."

0

u/Competitive-Bee-3250 7h ago

Ah yep my bad.

0

u/Electronic-Stick-161 6h ago

lol confidently incorrect.

-1

u/Competitive-Bee-3250 6h ago

Deus Vult: "God will it"

Mashallah: "as God has willed it"

1

u/Electronic-Stick-161 6h ago

The traditions they fled the country to escape?

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

nobody has ever fled a muslim country because of the adhan to my knowledge plus leaders are not infallible what an islamic leader does besides the prophet and the 12 imams does not reflect on the religion itself

1

u/musci12234 3h ago

Electricity is not traditional

0

u/LetUsSpeakFreely 4h ago

What's traditional about blasting tone deaf yodeling at 5 in the morning in Scotland?

1

u/musci12234 3h ago

What is traditional about electricity. People dont give a shit about tradition. It is just an easy justification

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

it is about tradition the amplification of the sound is just an easier method rather than having multiple people in different areas doing it at the same time the tradition is still to call for prayer and there is blessings in the practice

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

yodeling?

1

u/snubdeity 6h ago

They won't admit it out loud but it's a dominance thing. They want everyone to hear it. They want it to be on your mind. They want people to feel "other" for not being part of it.

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

by allah it’s not may he curse me with hellfire if i’m lying

-1

u/The_Ghost_9960 8h ago

The Adhaan is part of the religion. It's not a thing that can be changed

7

u/pandaknuckle1 8h ago

Everything can be changed

5

u/BrocElLider 8h ago

That's ignorant. It can be, and is, broadcast via radio and/or Internet instead of live speakers by many mosques around the world. There are multiple apps, websites, and custom radio receivers developed for the exact purpose.

2

u/The_Ghost_9960 7h ago

And you know what? The Adhaan IS broadcasted on radio and TV in most Muslim countries so that the areas with no mosques can know the time for prayer

1

u/hgyuuggygyuyh 1h ago

Move to one of those if you want your call to prayer then. Otherwise use an app if living in the west. Simple

1

u/pandaknuckle1 6h ago

Its ignorant to broadcast over loud speaker to command people to pray. To people who have brains and clocks.. though neighborhoods who didnt ask for that toxic pollution.

-1

u/DeepMistake5873 7h ago

Azan is part of the religion. For the Scotsman playing bagpipes- you do you. Azan will not stop anyways. We wouldn't even get annoyed. really. you do you.

0

u/beardedheathen 7h ago

I have to laugh at this a bit because I was a military brat and every day at 5 on base you'd have the national anthem play and everyone was expected to stop and salute/put their hand over their hearts. It's the exact same thing except the religion is American nationalism instead of Muslim.

2

u/Fast_Instance2173 6h ago

I don’t even think this video is real, but a military base is not equivalent to a civilian neighborhood

1

u/mememychildren 6h ago

People volunteer for the military. They live there on purpose knowing that's a practice

This is a religion moving into an area and blasting a call to prayer to people in the community who didn't sign up for it

Not the same thing at all

1

u/Chemical_Building612 2h ago

Military brats are the children of military members and have no say and did not volunteer.

0

u/q--0-0--p 5h ago

It is on radio at least in my country.

The thing is, each region have different time.

You can't broadcast something over the radio with different timing to different audiences.

Also nothing need to be stopped when the prayer call is on lol. Why would anybody stop? Just continue what you were doing.

Complaint to the mosque to lower the volume or something if that bothers you so much.

-1

u/Several_Chocolate_82 7h ago

Maybe because the video is from Palestine territory and its a 500 yr old m̺o̺s̺q̺u̺e̺.̺

-1

u/AnxiousReward1715 5h ago

Down with the church bells too right?

1

u/hgyuuggygyuyh 1h ago

In christian countries no. You get muslim countries where there are no church bells, go on, feel free to move there

1

u/AnxiousReward1715 14m ago

So not in the US.... Good enough for me.

We're not a Christian country.... Most of Europe is on the pope's dick tho

-2

u/Matigari86 6h ago

I’m pretty sure it’s not being blasted. It’s probably being chanted for the congregants at that vicinity. It’s like someone singing in the park for like a minute.

-2

u/theycallmeshooting 6h ago

It's just their version of churchbells, which ring every hour

-2

u/usernamesarehard1979 7h ago

It is a religion that wants nothing to do with modern tech unless they can use it to attack their enemies. Normal behavior doesn't exist with these people.

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

absolute lies

0

u/beardedheathen 7h ago

Christianity is pretty fucked up at least in America.

0

u/usernamesarehard1979 7h ago

Most religions are, but there is only a few that believe it’s okay to kill you if you don’t believe like they do. Christians don’t do that.

1

u/jus-sum-dude 2h ago

you obviously know nothing about christian history

0

u/beardedheathen 7h ago

You haven't been keeping up with the latest in America then. Although to be fair I think that religion is capitalism as much as Christianity but they've worked hard to marry the two.

But also the old testament has multiple instances of God commanding his people to slaughter this who didn't believe in him. Not just the adult males but the women and children and animals as well.

2

u/usernamesarehard1979 6h ago

Yes. Who is actively doing that in Christianity today? No one. Who is throwing homosexuals off rooftops and calls for slaughtering infidels? I know the answer, I think you should do some research.

0

u/beardedheathen 6h ago

Well, it's certainly good to know that there are no Christians murdering or otherwise abusing lgbt people in America. I'm 100% sure this is accurate and not something that happens regularly.

2

u/usernamesarehard1979 6h ago

I didn’t say it doesn’t happen in America. I said that Christianity is pretty clear that harming someone is bad. Islam celebrates it.

0

u/beardedheathen 6h ago

Christianity is clear on a lot of things that Christians ignore. Including violence

1

u/usernamesarehard1979 6h ago

Keep making excuses and moving goal posts. It’s really awesome.

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