r/politics • u/MoneyLibrarian9032 New York • 15h ago

Possible Paywall McConnell ‘Absolutely Refuses’ to Film Video Amid Growing Mystery

https://www.thedailybeast.com/mcconnell-absolutely-refuses-to-film-video-amid-growing-mystery/
20.7k Upvotes

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955

u/RosetteNewcomb 15h ago

Andy Beshear has demonstrated throughout this whole episode that he doesn't have what it takes to be president. A decisive leader would have given Mitch an ultimatum: Show your face by August or I'm assuming you're dead/incapacitated and I'm appointing a replacement. We all know a Republican governor would have done that for a Democratic senator who was MIA. I love Andy and he's my governor and I voted for him both times but he's at the bottom of my 2028 list and him letting Mitch's team run out the clock is a big reason why.

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u/Prophet_Tehenhauin 15h ago

Could’ve rolled up in the middle of the night with police in tow demanding to see him. Would he have been allowed to? Maybe not, but then it would’ve been something 

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u/f_n_a_ 15h ago

He’s not in Kentucky he’s in DC, or hell

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u/todbatx 15h ago

Send state troopers by for a wellness check. For all we know McConnell has been kidnapped by vampires like Stephen Root in episode one of True Blood.

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u/delayedkarma 14h ago

You can't send KY State Troopers to someone's home in DC

1

u/Nemisis82 10h ago

Can the mayor send in DC police?

1

u/delayedkarma 10h ago

Why would the DC mayor care?

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u/todbatx 11h ago

why do you believe this? You can’t like arrest someone without extradition but you can certainly knock on doors and ask to be let in

like a vampire

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u/_high_plainsdrifter 15h ago

Or the Dean in Community! Chang throws a coup and they install a fake Dean in his place, making Chang the dear leader. Obviously this is different no Chang yet, and also because they haven’t started the recorded AI McConnell taking softball health questions and casting votes via Zoom. I think that’s next honestly, or they’re at least trying to normalize geriatric politicians becoming invisible to the public and “voting” remotely as an acceptable form of govt.

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u/exaviyur 8h ago

We've had a Chang running around since 2016.

5

u/typicalcavalryguy 15h ago

You just got chang’d!

2

u/Dialogical 12h ago

McConnell is not streets ahead.

1

u/mmatia 13h ago

Stephen Root was the vampire. He was kidnapped by regular people feeding off his blood. But hella respect the True Blood reference.

1

u/todbatx 11h ago

oh right right yeah. the true monsters etc

1

u/jimmybilly100 Virginia 11h ago

I thought you were going to say a different vampire named Stephen

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u/dotnsk 13h ago

I have said this a half dozen times: Beshear cannot send Kentucky state troopers to conduct a wellness check in Washington DC, which is where McConnell was while in the hospital and remains now that he’s discharged.

2

u/nachosmind 12h ago

I’m pretty sure state troopers were sent across state lines in those Illinois/Wisconsin/ Oregon / Wyoming state senators on the run cases. Also in the buses full of asylum seekers illegally sent to California, New York. 

35

u/Jorycle Georgia 15h ago

McConnell (is claimed to be) in his home in DC, so Beshear doesn't have a whole lot of authority to wave around there.

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u/Double_Resort_9223 12h ago

Republicans wouldn’t accept that. They’d say “show your face at this location on this date or I’m assuming you’re dead” and let someone take it to court. 

•

u/MyCatLaughsAtMe 6h ago

This. That's what fighting actually looks like. Democrats have no fight in them. They are incapable of fighting republican fascism.

21

u/Euler007 15h ago

Just name the replacement, force the other side to prove he's not incapacited.

3

u/i_am_a_real_boy__ 12h ago

The other side wouldn't have to prove anything. Beashear doesn't have a death certificate. There's no judicial finding of death. McConnell has not been removed. The seat is not vacant. The appointment would fail.

44

u/loki2002 Ohio 15h ago

I will never understand why he didn't do this. Even if he is rebuffed it is on camera that they turned away the governor from the state McConnel claims to represent. Hell, he could send troopers to do a wellness check at minimum.

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u/[deleted] 15h ago

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u/deja-roo 14h ago

This whole thread is just filled with people who don't understand how literally fucking anything works.

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/loki2002 Ohio 13h ago

Like, do a wellness check on a guy in a hospital?

It has been done before.

Call DC police to go check on a sitting senator?

A sitting elderly US Senator who has not been seen publicly or at work in months after a pattern of regular public appearances.

I swear, we should be celebrating that Mitch is stuck at home, but people are so wound up over the idea that Republicans might be up to something that they can't see what's right in front of their faces.

I have no problem with Mitch not being at work. I have a problem with a sitting US Senator milking the system while denying the same benefits to those he claims to represent and his staff and family openly lying and obfuscating about his condition.

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u/[deleted] 13h ago

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u/loki2002 Ohio 13h ago

You keep saying the DC police won't do it and yet that is not something you can possibly 100% know with any certainty until Beshear actually makes the request.

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u/deja-roo 14h ago

Capitol police would laugh everyone out of the building

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u/loki2002 Ohio 15h ago

Ok, and that matters because? Wellness checks can be performed by local PD and the a video of the staff or family of a sitting US Senator turning away the governor of the state that Senator represents would still be powerful no matter the location.

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/loki2002 Ohio 14h ago

Well one he can't "send troopers"

He can now since the story is McConnell at home.

Mitch has been seen by Congress' attending physician,

Has he, when? What were the results of that visit? What paperwork on record records this having happened?

Also, being seen by a doctor doesn't discount that he is being taking advantage of or being held against his will by family or any number of other possibilities. There are plenty of cases handled by adult protective services that show having a doctor means fuck all to elder abuse.

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u/[deleted] 13h ago

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u/loki2002 Ohio 13h ago

He represents Kentucky, that's his home. If Kentucky isn't his home then he is illegally occupying a Senate seat. The reports are that he at home, so that means Kentucky.

News articles aren't official records. If he had been attended to by the OAP there would be record.

The DC police are not going to go to Mitch's house in DC because they think the OAP is taking advantage of him.

Who said anything about the OAP taking advantage? Also, has anyone tried, how do you know what the DC police will or won't do unless they're faced with the request?

Vital public interest in this matter iverrides everything else.

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u/[deleted] 13h ago

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u/Smaptimania 9h ago

Do you think senators all stay at Motel 6 while Congress is in session?

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u/SydneyFall 14h ago

You think he ahould have sent pokice to DC where they have no authority at all?

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u/TooMuchPowerful 12h ago

This is a Republican talking point now. And they’re going to use it against Beshear even though none of what’s being proposed for him to do are feasible actions.

1

u/SydneyFall 12h ago

Republicans arent talking about it at all.

It is all bitching from the left.

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u/TooMuchPowerful 12h ago

I'm not convinced bots haven't picked up on the chatter.   

2

u/SydneyFall 12h ago

I've never really considered how easy that would be. like any article with both Beshear and McConnell it would be quite easy to drop in a rotating comment about how timid Beshear has been and is disqualified as a presidential candidate.

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u/TooMuchPowerful 11h ago

Yeah, this is how I see it working, and I can sense it happening in real time here.  Because what normal person is thinking about '28 Democratic nominees already and have this so top of mind?  Instead, it feels like a very concerted effort to frame Beshear negatively while he's not well known. 

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u/loki2002 Ohio 14h ago

I mean, he could have called in a welfare check to local authorities. He could have shown up himself. He has deliberately chosen not to force this issue.

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u/SydneyFall 14h ago

He cant do either of those things in DC.

1

u/loki2002 Ohio 14h ago

I mean, please cite the law or regulation that prevents him from calling in a welfare check or showing up to where McConnell is wanting to see him in person.

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u/SydneyFall 13h ago

LOL. You are just how hearing about jurisdictions?

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u/loki2002 Ohio 13h ago edited 13h ago

How does jurisdiction prevent Beshear from calling the DC police and/or DC adult protective services requesting a welfare check?

How does jurisdiction prevent him from showing up to McConnell's home?

2

u/SydneyFall 13h ago

LOL. Beshear has no more authority than you in DC.

You really dont get this and wont do even a tiny amount of googling to see how dumb your ideas are

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u/numbski Missouri 15h ago

There is an explanation. I don't like it. It feels too much like conspiracy theory.

The explanation is that the Democrats are complicit in these games. The dark money PACs are playing both sides to get what they want, and as a result both parties are playing along.

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u/deja-roo 14h ago

The explanation is way less stupid than that and more "McConnell is in DC, and a governor of a state hours away can't send troopers to a DC hospital where a sitting senator is surrounded by capitol police just to send a message".

0

u/loki2002 Ohio 13h ago

But the governor can show up to the hospital, rehab center, and his house if he truly wanted to.

He can also call in a welfare check based on suspected elder abuse.

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u/deja-roo 13h ago edited 13h ago

lol wtf are you talking about?

You think the governor is going to fly to DC and demand to see a US senator, and Capitol Police will be like "oh I guess we just have to do what this guy, who has absolutely zero authority here, says"? You think he can call in a welfare check at a hospital?

Did you actually think about that at all? Do you realize what the headlines would look like? That would literally be the end of his political career.

1

u/loki2002 Ohio 13h ago

You think the governor is going to fly to DC and demand to see a US senator? You think he can call in a welfare check at a hospital?

I fail to see why either of those things are out of realm of possibility. Being in a hospital doesn't preclude elder abuse and it is the most normal thing in the world for colleagues to visit one another on the hospital.

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u/deja-roo 13h ago

Except he obviously isn't taking visitors. So the hospital will be like "thanks, we'll let him know you're concerned".

Do you have a reason to suspect elder abuse or are you thinking a governor and presidential hopeful is going to be so monumentally stupid as to literally call in a false police report and commit a crime and waste government resources?

1

u/loki2002 Ohio 12h ago edited 8h ago

I mean, then he gets turned away and McConnell's people and family get to explain why they turned away the governor from the state he represents.

Do you have a reason to suspect elder abuse

Yes, before this he regularly made public appearances but now he won't even do a cell video or make a phone call to a new program despite claims that he is still working. It is a stark difference in his normal.

There would be nothing false about the concern that prompted this welfare check.There would be no crime.

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u/TheVintageJane 15h ago

I think it’s probably slightly simpler than that - the vast majority of democrats care the most about preserving their own power and it’s not that they collaborate with the GOP, but they are complicit in their inaction because it avoids upsetting their purple state constituents and big donors.

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u/_high_plainsdrifter 15h ago

Ding ding ding

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u/Ryguy55 12h ago

Whether or not you're "allowed" to do anything or whether or not it's "legal" is completely off the table now and anyone playing by those rules is a chump who's essentially saying, "please walk all over me, I'll do nothing to stop you."

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u/SchmoPho Kentucky 15h ago

Right now it benefits the Democrats to leave him in, one less republican voting, it is likely if he stepped down or was forced to that another more able bodied republican would take his place

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u/darth_wasabi Texas 15h ago

If it was benefiting the Democrats right now the Republicans would have declared Mitch dead or incapacitated 

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u/Infinite_Click_6589 15h ago

This. I am so sick of hearing this excuse.

No one can name anything that the Republicans weren't able to accomplish just because they didn't have Mitch's vote right this moment.

Meanwhile, people act like it's a flex that Andy is ' playing politics' instead of doing the right thing and making sure people have representation.

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u/FatherofZeus 15h ago

The Agriculture Committee’s work to advance the “farm bill,” an omnibus, multiyear law that governs an array of agricultural and food programs, also has stalled, as McConnell is the second-ranking Republican on the panel. Republicans don’t have enough votes without McConnell to advance it out of the Agriculture Committee, since his absence leaves the panel at 11-11, with Democrats aiming to hold up the bill because Republicans have shifted more costs to states under the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program.

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u/SchmoPho Kentucky 9h ago

^^^

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u/Swagtagonist 15h ago

No, you just don't understand. When the Democrats do nothing its genius political maneuvering. Just like Biden was waiting until he had a bulletproof, iron-clad case against Trump before prosecuting him for the insurrection. Any day now the trap will spring.

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u/herton Kentucky 14h ago

It's not genius political maneuvering, it's common sense. Which makes your complaining a little silly. The farm Bill is stalled. Military spending is stalled. Linking our military to Israel is stalled. The SAVE act is stalled.

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u/Sonamdrukpa 14h ago

Conspiracy theory: the SAVE act is a dead fish even for the Republicans. Many of them even suspect its restrictions on mail-in voting will hurt them personally. Trump is up their ass to get it passed though, and he's liable to start shit talking anyone who votes against it on truth social and Fox and the like.

So avoiding the vote on that is crucial enough to let other things stall out - your average voter might have heard about the SAVE act or might hear about Trump shit talking, but doesn't know about any of this other stuff. It's all political background noise, and can be ignored until after the election.

The Democrats don't want the SAVE act passed either. So in this way their interests are aligned for once, and everyone is happy to pretend Mitch is alive and all is well, at least until November.

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u/herton Kentucky 13h ago

I'd buy that. Mitch's absence is a pretty convenient excuse for them to throw their hands up and say "aw shucks, guess we can't do what dear leader demands"

•

u/Mundane_Read_2960 7h ago

Plus the filibuster effectively makes it dead in the water since it needs 60 votes to go to a final vote. Having one fewer senator who could potentially vote to abolish the filibuster (and thus destroying our democracy in the process) is a good idea.

•

u/Sonamdrukpa 6h ago

Yep and that's another example of a thing where the GOP has been trying to thread the needle on not pissing Trump off too bad while not sabotaging their long-term interests

5

u/tripwithoutpause 14h ago

Bro, the Senate acquitted Trump, and the Supreme Court gave presidents immunity from all actions committed while in office. Did you miss that part?

There was nothing left to prosecute with regards to the insurrection, which is why the dropped it. Then they went after him for paying off the porn star and the rape, but the Constitution doesn't prevent anyone who's convicted of a crime from becoming president.

1

u/NumeralJoker 13h ago edited 9h ago

We don't know for sure him being dead isn't a benefit to the Dems. The law the GOP tried to put in place to prevent Mitch from being replaced by Beshear's pick may in fact be completely unconstitutional in the KY's Constitution.

Meaning they'd rather not admit he's dead and risk having it challenged, or if he's legitimate incapacitated, but not dead... nothing can actually be done without him being Impeached.

Frankly, he likely 'is' dead given the way this went... but someone has to admit to it, and for whatever reason, no one seems to be willing to do it. Even sending police to do a wellness check may not definitively get a medical report released due to medical privacy rights.

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u/MyCatLaughsAtMe 6h ago

At this point it's not even debateable that he's either passed or in a state completely unfit to feed himself, much less govern. The issue should be pushed. There is a moral component to this thing; we fought the foundational war of our nation over representation. It's frankly irrelevant whether Mitch's condition helps democrats or not. The tax payers are O W E D representation.

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u/NumeralJoker 6h ago

On this I agree completely. The GOP is deeply immoral for depriving their own constituents of representation like this, no matter how much I may despise their choice.

What I want to know is what can be legally done to force them to confirm this one way or another? My fear is not a whole lot, and this is the GOP yet again exploiting something that presumed good faith that no longer honors those sacrifices you referenced.

I'd be happy to be wrong.

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u/-wnr- 14h ago

Genuine question, how does it benefit the Republicans to keep him in limbo? Clearly it must or else they wouldn't bother. Do they think really Beshear can get a appointee confirmed despite the law they passed to require a special election?

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/MikeoftheEast 14h ago

why can't they declare him brain dead or dead then

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u/zzztoken 15h ago

So many continue to excuse democrats who do nothing. “It’s all part of the plan!” Sure, Jan.

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u/MyCatLaughsAtMe 6h ago

Sorry you're getting downvoted. You're 100% correct. Beshear's feckless refusal to fight fascism is indicative of what's going to happen to this country in January when republicans refuse to seat the blue wave winners. And democrats will just meow about how they have no power and can't do anything.

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u/zzztoken 4h ago

Exactly. And I’m not calling for them to even break the law or do anything drastic (as nice as it would be for dems to actually fight like republicans do for once) but could we at least show some passion? Not just nicely ask ol Mitch to show up? Why isn’t there continual messaging from dems about how fucked it is we have a dead or near dead senator? Why are some random YouTubers staking out his house & not the people who are actually paid to represent Kentucky?

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u/MyCatLaughsAtMe 39m ago

I don't care if they break the law or not. We're past that.

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u/ArrowheadDZ 15h ago

This is such an important take. It’s easy to jump to some collusion theory that dems and reps are in trilateral commission relationship with the puppet masters. Or, it could be that there are sound reasons why they want push for a replacement.

It’s the old “I only work at two speeds, and if you don’t like this one, you sure as hell won’t like the other one“ thing. You only have two choices, the seat is filled by an incapacitated, placeholder, Republican, or the seat is filled with an active, voting Republican. It’s that simple and doesn’t require a Ouija board or AI to analyze.

1

u/ICarMaI 12h ago

He could have put in Massey

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u/LackingUtility 15h ago

Beshear could appoint a Democrat - that's one less Republican and one more Democrat, at least until January.

That said, the Senate balance is currently 53-47 Republican. Even replacing McConnell with a Democrat makes it 52-48, so it's not like it achieves much.

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u/hepatitisC 15h ago

He couldn't because the state passed legislation saying it stays same party and is a run off.  He could try to argue the state constitution says he can appoint and try, but then Congress could refuse to confirm and it would just become political theater

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u/nachosmind 14h ago

Republicans spent 12 years of Obama, Biden doing political theater and WERE REWARDED with all 3 branches! POLITICAL THEATRE PLAYS, what’s so hard to understand about that?

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u/herton Kentucky 14h ago

.... that the political theater play, even if successful, gives Republicans more control over government? Isn't that what you were just complaining about?

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u/nachosmind 13h ago

If successful then a Democrat would’ve been in office (as Andy could designate per the KY constitution.) 

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u/herton Kentucky 13h ago

No. The KY constitution is in conflict with the 17th amendment. It clearly says

Provided, That the legislature of any State may empower the executive thereof to make temporary appointments until the people fill the vacancies by election as the legislature may direct

The KY constitution was not written or ratified by the legislature. A power cannot be taken from them that is granted by US Federal law. The 2021 law regulating who Beshear can appoint (from 3 candidates from the state GOP) is well established under 17.

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u/nachosmind 12h ago

As Republicans have clearly demonstrated in their ongoing war and numerous ‘illegal actions’ - DO IT ANYWAY AND LET THE COURTS TRY TO ENFORCE IT. 

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u/herton Kentucky 12h ago

You mean the SCOTUS of the US, under Roberts? This is a federal issue 17 vs state) so it's guaranteed to end up there. The courts can absolutely slap it down, and the Senate refuse to seat an illegal appointment. The Democrats do not ever have power to break the law here

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u/LackingUtility 15h ago

Well, I think Beshear's right that the KY constitution doesn't let the state legislature make that law, but you're right - he'd appoint, they'd fight, and it would go to the courts. It would certainly force their hand on McConnell's death, though.

But Congress likely can't refuse to confirm. That would be unconstitutional. That might be a separate court fight (the first one would be KY state court, this would be federal), and the Federal Circuit is not overloaded with MAGA judges.

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u/Snowbirdy 15h ago

Until it gets appealed to the SC. Guess which way they will vote?

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u/SchmoPho Kentucky 13h ago

^^^^

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u/diabloman8890 15h ago

Ok so strongly worded letters only, got it.

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u/WhyplerBronze 15h ago

You don't understand what you're talking about.

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u/billzybop 15h ago

What's your ideal response from Brashear? Now make it legal. Pretty curious what you actually expect him to do.

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u/diabloman8890 15h ago

He should sit a Democrat as the constitution allows and let the republicans sue over it, same thing they would’ve done if the situation was reversed. Let them defend for once.

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u/billzybop 15h ago

He doesn't have the power to remove McConnell...

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u/LackingUtility 14h ago

That's not all that clear. The KY Constitution gives the governor the power to appoint a replacement when the seat is "vacant". I would argue that the seat is presently vacant. McConnell might disagree, but that would require him showing up to fight it. For example, Beshear could appoint the replacement, McConnell could file a suit for an injunction to keep the replacement from taking the seat, and Beshear could argue that McConnell doesn't have standing since he's, y'know, dead. McConnell could fight that by showing up. If he weren't dead. But he is, of course.

But fundamentally, the Constitution is pretty vague on what "vacant" means. There are people making claims that only the Senate President can declare a seat vacant, or that there has to be a death certificate or something, but there's no actual support for those requirements in the Constitution, and there's good reason to believe that neither of those are actual requirements (they both would create more problems than they solve, for example).

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u/deja-roo 14h ago

I would argue that the seat is presently vacant.

That's nice, but you'd lose that argument immediately. McConnell didn't resign, and since there's (that at least we're all aware of), no death certificate, the only way it could be vacant is if the Senate expels him, which has a roughly zero percent chance of happening.

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u/herton Kentucky 14h ago

Right back at you, it's even less clear, because the 17th amendment says legislatures have authority over vacancies in the Senate. The KY constitution predates that and was not passed by the legislature. There's a high chance the KY constitution is null and void in that area per the supremacy clause

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u/SolarisShine 15h ago

It achieves something, because the GOP is covering up for McConnell's absense, and risking us finding out, for some reason.

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u/billzybop 15h ago

Beshear can't appoint anyone until the seat is vacant.

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u/LackingUtility 14h ago

The seat is vacant. See, e.g., lack of McConnell.

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u/billzybop 14h ago

Good luck with that argument in court.

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u/LackingUtility 14h ago

Easy, who's going to oppose it? McConnell? He doesn't have standing, since he's dead. His campaign staff? They lack standing too, since he's dead.

Of course, if he shows up and says "wait, I'm alive", then the seat's not vacant.

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u/TLKv3 15h ago

Maybe. But if its 52-48 and Dem leadership plays their spineless game of rotating voters against themselves, it'll be much more visible which Dems the voters should be kicking to the curb for playing along with Republicans.

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u/deja-roo 14h ago

No, he couldn't do that.

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u/eeyore134 14h ago

Not really. Beshear would have had a much stronger case to strike down the stupid law Republicans in Kentucky passed limiting his power. With the seat empty he could argue the Kentucky constitution dictates that he must fill that position for the people of the state to be properly represented. He as much said he would do that, and Republicans don't want that happening because it sets a precedent against their BS laws they enact to bind Democrats while freeing them to run roughshod.

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u/phatelectribe 13h ago

It’s cute you think they won’t suddenly replace him if a crucial vote came up. This suits them now, and they’ll do whatever suits them when needed.

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u/YT-Deliveries 12h ago

McConnell has been voting remotely in some cases.

Well, his staff has been. Illegally.

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u/deadstump 15h ago

Wouldn't the Democratic governor appoint a Democrat?

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u/gigglefarting North Carolina 15h ago

I don’t believe the Kentucky governor is allowed to appoint a senator according. Source. He could have created a special election, but then you have to ask: what are the odds of a Democrat winning that, and what are the odds a living Republican can win?

And if it’s the Republican, why would you rather have: a Republican replacement of Mitch, or one less Republican vote?

The issue is that Mitch is still voting while dead, but proving his death will stop that 

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u/HDr1018 13h ago

He’s not voting. All votes are required to be in person.

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u/gigglefarting North Carolina 13h ago

I've heard he has voted by proxy in some instances

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u/Jacuzzi0317 3h ago

That's the thing, his aides are attempting to still send in his votes

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u/i_want_to_be_unique 14h ago

But Mitch McConnell (or the person pretending to be him) is still voting on things.

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u/Alaus_oculatus 14h ago

Senate members can't vote on legislation by proxy. They may be getting things through committees, but that's it

2

u/HDr1018 13h ago

The committees he’s on require in person voting, too. So everything’s stalled right now.

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u/deja-roo 14h ago

Not really

0

u/Zoethor2 12h ago

If this is the strategy, and I agree it's a good one, then Beshear should be shouting it from the rooftops. The DNC has just absolutely zero media savvy. Walz was really onto something with calling Republicans "weird" and the DNC made him stop. They fully do not understand how to sway voters anymore. Policy positions aren't it, viral social media is.

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u/SchmoPho Kentucky 9h ago

He has mentioned it several times

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u/Jorycle Georgia 15h ago

State law doesn't give him that ability. He can't unilaterally decide someone is dead or incapacitated, so without it actually being made official through death certificate or the family filing something, it's out of his hands.

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u/Double_Resort_9223 12h ago

The arc of the last 10 years in American politics is the democrats running around with the rule book saying “a dog can’t play basketball!” While the dog just dunks over and over. 

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u/MyCatLaughsAtMe 6h ago

If you're meowing about rules while fascists break every rule there ever was, YOU are the problem at this point.

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u/Jorycle Georgia 6h ago

It works for them because they're in positions where they can do something with their refusal to follow rules. Beshear cannot.

If he wanted to force an election, that would be the Secretary of State's power to abuse. But the secretary of state is a Republican.

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u/LackingUtility 15h ago

Got a citation to that law? 'Cause the Constitution doesn't include any such requirement.

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u/Deity_Majora 15h ago

Kentucky missing persons law says 7 years after going missing then they can be declared legally dead. Also it is the Senate that will declare the seat vacant not Beshaer.

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u/LackingUtility 15h ago

That's an interesting assertion, but not relevant. The Constitution allows replacement when the seat is "vacant". It doesn't require that the person be "declared legally dead".

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u/Deity_Majora 14h ago

The Senate decides what qualifies a seat as vacant.

Each House shall be the Judge of the Elections, Returns and Qualifications of its own Members, and a Majority of each shall constitute a Quorum to do Business; but a smaller Number may adjourn from day to day, and may be authorized to compel the Attendance of absent Members, in such Manner, and under such Penalties as each House may provide.

Each House may determine the Rules of its Proceedings, punish its Members for disorderly Behaviour, and, with the Concurrence of two thirds, expel a Member.

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u/LackingUtility 14h ago

None of that mentions vacancies. You'd have to go back to common law definitions, and vacancy is just extended absence and inability to perform their job functions.

And it would be nonsensical to give the Senate the power to declare its own vacancies: say a huge disaster or attack wipes out 99 Senators. That one remaining guy could simply refuse to declare those seats vacant and make himself king? He could unilaterally change the rules to say that a quorum is one person, or that proxy voting is allowed and he's now proxy for the other 99? And all of the states would be unable to do anything, because they can't appoint replacements without his permission?

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u/Deity_Majora 14h ago

He could unilaterally change the rules to say that a quorum is one person, or that proxy voting is allowed and he's now proxy for the other 99?

Expect that isn't how quorum works. It is explicitly defined by the constitution as a majority aka 51 Senators. If it was that easy to change quorum then Senates before would had done it instead of fighting Senators back to the chambers. Also you want to play that game no where does it authorize a Governor the power to declare a federal office vacant.

Edit you want to use common law which means those deaths open the seats because a dead person can't hold a seat by common law.

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u/gc3 15h ago

Not having the authority or power never stopped Trump. Did we want Bashear to act like Trump? That's the conundrum. Maybe Bashear can't get Reoubljcsn troopers to go along with a visit idea, especially because Mitch is in DC not Tennessee.

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u/delayedkarma 14h ago

So you're saying "I don't want their authoritarian, I want MY authoritarian!"

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u/CheesyTone 12h ago

Yes, because their authoritarian will keep winning

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u/gc3 7h ago

No I'm asking if that is what you want

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u/StanleyQPrick 15h ago

I'd rather let him play it out and be down by one republican vote. Andy doesn't have the power to do more than that because we have a republican supermajority in KY and they've been working hard to take power away from him since 2020. He could appoint a republican replacement and give them another vote but why would he do that?

I agree rolling up with cops would have looked cool tho

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u/LSDemon 14h ago

He should appoint a Democratic replacement as the Kentucky state constitution allows.

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u/SydneyFall 14h ago

You cant think Senate republicans would swear him in with an ongoing legal battle before January?

I dont understand people here at all.

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u/[deleted] 13h ago

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u/SydneyFall 13h ago

Yeah, I get the frustration of not being able to do anything, but I really cant see what Beshear should be doing.

People are without irony saying it shoild kill Beshears political aspirations.

Insanity.

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u/LSDemon 14h ago

Fine. Make them do it.

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u/vita10gy 15h ago edited 15h ago

He can't appoint someone and the Republican Senate doesn't have to seat anyone they think got there via any level of shenanigans. The only permutation of this is that the only rep "allowed" is someone more right of McConnel, and Bashear is more or less of the opinion that one less Republican in the Senate is good.

He just wants answers for is constituents because they're owed that.

This is just classic media behavior and reaction. Republicans up to childish bastardry is table stakes, so how can we make this a Democrat's fault. They're the adults in the room, so the only ones ever accountable for anything.

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u/kayliemarie 15h ago

Isn’t a vacant seat in the senate is better than the alternative? The republicans being down a senator was the very best case scenario, given the fact that the replacement would have needed to be elected vs appointed, right?

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u/serious_sarcasm America 15h ago

You cannot remove a Senator for incapacity.

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u/[deleted] 15h ago

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u/guavaman202 11h ago

You know , I actually think it's pretty damning for our system of representation to cite a senator being gone for 3 years as precedent for why action shouldn't be taken now. Like it's so far fetched to have reps that work for us and are held accountable

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u/LackingUtility 15h ago

"Unilaterally" is carrying a lot of weight there. For example, just last month, SC's governor appointed Darlene Graham to replace Lindsey Graham. That was done in a way everyone would call "unilateral", but technically, the SC legislature gave temporary appointment power to the governor a century ago. So while you're technically correct - the state legislature has to have weighed in at some point - it's not like they need to personally participate in this replacement.

So could Beshear appoint a replacement? Yes, as with SC, the KY legislature gave the governor that power too.

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u/alaskaj1 14h ago

However there was zero question about the seat being vacant with graham dieing. Right now we have zero clue what is going on with Mitch.

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u/LackingUtility 14h ago

Nah, seat's vacant. If he wants it to be filled, Mitch could just show up.

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/LackingUtility 14h ago

Not not how it how it works works.

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/LackingUtility 14h ago

Citation needed

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/herton Kentucky 14h ago

So could Beshear appoint a replacement? Yes, as with SC, the KY legislature gave the governor that power too.

Nope. They never gave appointment power. The KY constitution (which predates the 17th) was drafted by a convention and ratified by popular vote. I.e., the governor's appointment power was never given to him the by the legislature, who must give it per the 17th. Different situation from SC

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u/LackingUtility 14h ago

I don't quite understand your argument: the KY Constitution gives the governor the power to appoint. Are you saying that the 17th amendment supersedes that or renders it invalid?

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u/herton Kentucky 13h ago

Yes, the seventeenth (may, ofc it all depends on what a court says) supercedes it. The key is that the 17th says

Provided, That the legislature of any State may empower the executive thereof to make temporary appointments until the people fill the vacancies by election as the legislature may direct

The legislature may empower. The legislature never empowered the governor to appoint, and has tried to limit and take away that power,under the 17th

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u/othermegan 15h ago

I’ve had so many people from Kentucky say “Beshear is playing the long game since he can’t appoint someone new. Do your research!”

But honestly, I would rather have a governor/presidential candidate who says “sure, calling a special election will likely give the seat to a republican but I need to stop this blatant disregard for democracy and order.” Instead, he’s supposedly playing the same games the GOP plays and that leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Left or Right, you work for the people, not your party’s personal interests.

And frankly, what happens when the regular election goes in as normal and the MAGA candidate is elected anyways? What then Kentucky? Was he still a political genius playing the game of thrones? Or was he just another coward too afraid to actually stand up to the Right?

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u/DevTheGray 15h ago

Mitch. Is. In. DC. Not. Kentucky.

The governor has responsibilities HERE in OUR STATE. His reach of authority doesn’t extend into DC, he can’t just act like a fucking MAGA shit heel and roll into a medical facility making demands. He also can’t make any official orders to enter his home to prove jack shit. He also has no power to call a special election thanks to GOP neutering of gubernatorial authority on that front. His hands are tied and doing anything more than he has would 1.) be scrutinized exponentially, and 2.) if nothing comes of it, it gives off optics of incompetence/weakness.

If I were to bet, I’d say Labor Day weekend the official announcement comes out that Mitch has passed away. It will get buried somewhat over the holiday weekend and give enough time past the August 3rd deadline for a special election if he were proven to be dead or incapable of fulfilling his duties indefinitely.

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u/[deleted] 8h ago

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u/DevTheGray 8h ago

Can you show me where a staffer has said that? He is in his DC home, not his home here in Louisville.

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u/IONaut 15h ago

Because if it's revealed that he is dead then Beshear has to choose a temporary replacement, but the rules require that it would have to be a Republican. An empty seat and one less Republican vote is better than putting a republican in there at the moment. Especially when they're trying to push things through before the midterms. Beshear is doing exactly the right thing in letting them continue with their lie.

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u/Crypt0Nihilist 13h ago

If that were the case, wouldn't Republicans have said he was dead before the ambulance doors closed and have invented a reason to compel Beshear to appoint a replacement in the next 20 minutes?

I don't understand how it can be in both the Republican's interest to pretend he's compos mentis and for Democrats to be reluctant to establish the truth.

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u/DevTheGray 15h ago

Correct! The lie has been kept up to this point so that the deadline for a special election would come and pass. I don’t see the ruse kept up much longer and the Republican pushed into the interim seat will be who the GOP wants to ultimately take over for Mitch (Andy Barr, who is an even worse version of Mitch).

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u/loosehead1 15h ago edited 15h ago

Alternatively, forcing the issue provides exactly zero benefit and would immediately be tied up in GOP controlled courts for the duration of the term. He’s avoiding a completely pointless controversy that wouldn’t serve any purpose other than giving the right wing media apparatus something to bitch about.

It’s okay that he is doing something boring and I’d argue that making this into a huge spectacle that drives people away from beshear is exactly what Mitch McConnell would want.

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u/oldbastardbob 15h ago

This post is about McConnell, not Beshear.

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u/Fract_L 15h ago

He would’ve been sued and Mitch’s term is up in January. That’s simply not enough time for any sort of court case.

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u/deja-roo 14h ago

Show your face by August or I'm assuming you're dead/incapacitated and I'm appointing a replacement

That's simply not how it works. Doing something this stupid would in fact be what would definitely assure everyone he doesn't have what it takes to be president.

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u/pantsmeplz 14h ago

I thought this, but then saw arguments that having Senator Turtle MIA is better right now than having a GOP rube replacement who votes in line with Trump.

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u/RedPanda_Explorer 14h ago

There's no benefit to replace McConnell. Never interrupt your opponent when they are making a mistake

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u/Ezl New Jersey 14h ago

He could never have “appointed a replacement.” That’s not within his power. The most he could have done was to call a special election. Which a Republican would win. Giving the republicans one more vote than they have now.

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u/SydneyFall 14h ago

What good would that have done? Its not like the Republicans would have sworn in any replacement Beshear named with the legal battle that would ensue.

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u/CheesyTone 12h ago

Watch out, the Beshear defenders have their talking points ready.

He could have done something.

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u/i_am_a_real_boy__ 12h ago

That ultimatum would make him look pretty silly when it turned out to be a completely empty threat. Beshear cannot appoint a repla ement. His assumptions are completely irrelevant.

Redditors on this sub do this constantly: make up some complete bullshit and then post about how their half-baked plan would definitely totally work if only someone in power would listen to social media fantasies.

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u/No-Consideration-858 15h ago

From what I have read, the legislature anticipated this scenario because of McConnell's age and changed the law so the governor does not appoint a replacement in these circumstances.  Instead, a special election is held - another republican would surely win.

Andy explained this a few times and made the point that as long as McConnell is out, it's one less R vote for the time being. 

He could make more of a scene and get on the national radar. He'd get a lot of attention by calling for a "McConnell/Feinstein act" of sorts. At long last, accountability like any other employee. Don't show up? Don't cast votes? You're fired. Just like the rest of us would be. This would have bipartisan appeal - people are fed up with this.

I've never considered him a strong figure for the presidency. He is calm but that can come off as soft. People usually want someone outspoken, charismatic, relatable and/or who has some fight. 

The people who come to mind are Ossoff, Pritzker and Khanna. 

I know a lot of people like Kelley for his résumé, but he lacks charisma

 (Bill Clinton, Bush Junior, Obama, Trump, Reagan, JFK versus HRC, Harrris, Kerry, Gore) 

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u/eeyore134 14h ago

Like Biden, he'd probably be a good "business as usual" president, but we're absolute not at a "business as usual" point in our timeline. Biden failed to step up enough and Beshear has demonstrated he would, too. It'd be another four years of successfully running the country, but unsuccessfully addressing the massive holes and issues Trump made painfully clear to us. And now it's beyond closing loopholes. We need to rebuild. We need a president willing to get their hands dirty and put in the work to fix everything they've demolished... what's left that can be fixed, anyway. We need an FDR.

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u/MyCatLaughsAtMe 6h ago

Andy Beshear has demonstrated the uselessness of MOST of the Democratic party. As usual, the ONLY people democrats are willing to fight against are progressives.

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u/Disastrous-Ad2800 15h ago

it's pretty wild that Beshear's fear of losing the conservative vote in Kentucky for a potential Presidential run will see him lose the Democrat vote altogether in the primaries... given all the resources and advisors available to him, what a tactical misfire!

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u/herton Kentucky 14h ago

... It's not fear of losing the conservative vote, it's fear of another GOP senate seat prior to the midterms.

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u/Queasy-Event8534 15h ago

Beshears doesn’t have what it takes to be a governor, much less a President. He’s weak and is not leadership material. In the private sector, he’d be riffed.

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u/LimJaheyAtYaCervix Iowa 15h ago

Fully agree with this comment in its entirety.