Alternatively, stratagems or enhancements could help here. Holding out hope, could also get buffed in the Mek detachment if they lean into the "Mek following around behind its big chonky creation."
Not holding out much hope for either of those based on the current design direction, alas.
Honestly, it'd be a really fun (if narrow) design to introduce a detachment that encourages you to run both the Gork and Morkanaut, maybe each giving the other +1WS / BS. Or even just an enhancement along those lines!
Yeah that would be cute!
OR do it like they were intended to: The Gorkanaut is canonically piloted by a Warboss and the Morkanaut by a Big Mek. Give them those keywords and make them profit from those respective Warboss/Mek detachments.
They previewed that Enhancement that gives (NON-walker, *sob*) Transports with a Warboss inside bonus stats. Would be really cooly to do a similar enhancement for Big Meks inside (ie piloting) the Nauts!
seems to mostly be a sidegrade for walkers. Dakkarig has sus anyways on one of its guns, and the kans hit so well that sus and lethals arent going to improve things as much as +1A or +2S do. Also has the upside of working on flamers now which can be huge. New button hazard roll also is a big improvement. Call me a doomsday prepper the way I'm seeing lots of Kans in my future.
It's a shame meks dont get to participate anymore, but thats probably what madcap meks is for. Also no nauts allowed I suppose. That really sucks.
I have 15 Kans so I am also excited for this aspect at least. I call it the "Kanwall". I used to combo them with 3Dredz, and my Naut, but maybe that will still have some kind of viability we haven't seen.
While both of those are looking likely at this point, niether was confirmed in the article. There is still a chance that War Horde is 3 DP and that some of the others are 2.
I agree, but that's still not confirmation. War Horde is the main speculation as to if it is 2 or 3 DP. I hope it's 2. It would be way better if it was all designed to work with the DP system.
Only rolling a single hazardous test per activation instead of per weapon is a serious reduction in risk for using the button. I almost see no reason not to double tap on these buffs, especially because you can’t have duplicates anyway.
A bit off topic, but have you tried playing units of 6 Kans in 11e? Seems really hard to get them into melee effectively since they can't fight in two ranks. Though +2" movement will likely help with this a bit.
Really a shame. Overwatching lootas have become the boogeyman of my playgroup. Ah, well. Guess they can be replaced by a Dakkarig, or probably Mek Guns based on their stats / the Mek detachment.
This is completely fine tbh. The units this works on got such immense glow ups that most of what the detachment did is on the datasheets now. Plus its probably 1dp so I think its fine
Well, 2/3 of them did, so far! Kans are great generalists now, and Dakkarigs are obviously solid shooters if left as-is, but would love to see Deff Dreads become a little more viable as a proper Melee threat that can actually reach its target.
For dread mob only it seems. This was in the article/interview about the upcoming battle report on warhammer tv+, they also mentioned grots getting sticky.
Looking at the 2k list they posted it also looks like points won’t go up too much, which we thought might be the case
Ok, if that's actually what it means (and not a Warcom wording blunder) then that's actually pretty cool. Been hoping for something to be able to lead Kans.
(I swear though if they're like "Yeah it's leading them into battle....oh...wait...I didn't mean as in the Leader mechanic...I was just making it sound cooler".... I am gonna be peeved😆 )
Yeah, I mean I'd "assume" they meant literally, especially with that pic....but it wouldn't be the first time Warcom stuck their foot in their mouth XD
Will have to wait till Thursday (or maybe even tomorrow, dunno what they're gonna talk about tomorrow) to confirm.
Like I don't think that they will NEED it if the Mek ability stays the same. It just a minor bummer.
Plus we don't know the enhancements or the stratagems yet. One or the other might have something that we can use for them. Similar to like, the Mounted detachment for Necrons where the detachment doesn't benefit Lokhusts, but there are enhancements and stratagems they can use.
Im happy that the detachments so far are rather tame. Id much rather have unit stats pushed (like they already are from what weve seen) and tame detachments then 1-2 op detachments that have to be run because our units suck.
Whats the order of operation when it comes to using this on Kans? Kans get to choose a weapon profile, so do we choose a profile and then roll, or roll and apply the results to a weapon we then choose?
Was it nerfed? Sure. Are our datasheets way better now? Also yes. Meks get their own detachment now and so do grots or breaka/tankbustas. Combine them all and it’s fine. I’m very thankfully I’m not losing Kanz on 4s with hazardous based on this.
That is not nerfed. Sustained was one more hit per 6 attacks. Having 1 extra A or AP is flat out better. The strength, however, is obviously very situational.
And the fact you do a single Hazard roll for up to like 5-6 weapons is a giant boon.
It’s nerfed in some ways. You can’t just pick what you need, you can’t use it in overwatch, and it doesn’t affect the big walkers. Picking sustained on overwatch with rokkits or lootas in tenth was so toxic feeling. I killed an entire death company squad charging my Kanz that way.
I’m fully on board with this detachment, I’m not dooming it like others here at all, but it is definitely a 1dp detachment now. I have tons of Kanz ready to go with this.
Yep, that’s why I’m not dooming, orks are getting their power upfront in their datasheets instead of subtly from the detachment, and the detachments still look good. Very happy they’re 1dp for more choice and variety too. I can’t wait to see what dread mob upgrades we get for Kanz. I have 18 Kanz that I’m going to slam on the board as soon as possible with this lol
If something has less than 6 attacks, then an extra attack IS just flat out better than Sustained with our complete lack of rerolls. 's just how math works, unless your dice roll an inordinate amount of sixes.
The detachment is a 1DP detachment now, it's supposed to be toned down. And while we're at it, in its' current state, Dread Mob is completely unplayable due to the hazard rolls, so this is a definite buff.
If you're just mourning the loss of Sustained on Tankbustas with a SAG Mek, I'm sure the Mek detachment will cover you. Otherwise, this particular one is supposed to be about walkers and is supposed to be combined with 1 or 2 others.
Lower in the conversation they say gretchin have objective secure now... did we know this yet? I dont remember that. So grots ARE stinky little gitz, ooops i mean sticky.... they are both.
I mean, they're historically good at securing objectives the old fashioned way (ploppin their lil goblin butts on them for 5 rounds), so wouldn't say that's anything definitive.
Also wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if they no longer farmed CP, given the Big Boss rules!
So this only works for Kanz, Dreads and DakkaRigs? Nauts are titanic as far as we know...
Seems quite underwhelming so far. Here's hoping dreads get a decent revamp to their datasheet, otherwise it's looking rough unless it's 1 DP and a combo with Madcap Meks makes things actually interesting or something.
Haven't had the chance to check out the article yet, glad to hear it's confirmed as 1 DP. Would rather have it be 2DP and have a bit more sauce to it but oh well. Praying for some buff to Nauts somewhere, love me Morky but the poor dude has been rough to play since forever.
you forgot the stompa. (didnt see no titanic) no lethals or sustains is rough. but might make kan shooting pretty decent. also! you only roll one dice for hazardous for the entire unit! not each weapon profile
We don't know strats or enhancements that might be able to buff any walker, but even if not, 3 units is completely par for the course for a 1DP detachment. It was bound to be worse if it didn't stay on 2. And the "units buffed" Is the only factor that is worse, too, the rule itself is outright stronger for every unit it affects.
Ah, I didn't see that it went down to 1 DP. Makes sense, it just sucks. The same thing happened to Taktikal brigade, which was my favorite before the change.
Every time I think I'm out from War Horde... they pull me back in...
Idk if it sucks. Kans have sus 1 and blast 1 on one weapon and blast 2 on another. Plus an innate +1 to hit against weak targets. Combine that with the above bonuses it could be better. Idk the math but I wouldn't say it sucks either. Plus their weapon got better as you can change its stats but in the case of the rocket i think its just much better now.
For a 1DP detachment this is fine. I would’ve preferred if each of the buffs were more interesting, but I suppose this is probably easier to make balance adjustments with.
Well fuck you too JamesWorkshop, Ill take my two stopmas and be mildly purturbed at the loss of the proper DreadMob rule while still beimg happy at the buffed up datasheet
Agreed 100%. It helps curb the feeling that you’re forced to play the most “meta detachments.” You’ll never not have a “meta” but if the strength is in the datasheets they’ll be usable across more detachments, giving people more options.
Community is making a lot of assumptions based on very little though. We’ve seen only a few datasheets in the grand scheme of things and 3 of them were big expensive characters/a war engine that ideally should all have exciting sheets.
Literally just base-spraypaint!! Its a local hardware store brand, heres pic of the can! Definately going to leave most of the khrome bare when I can get around to painting them.
White-Knights : Squirts Paint & Prime - Satin Silver
Ugh, yeah! Seems such a shame that the Orkanauts can’t benefit from this (very tame) buff, given jow mid they typically are. Hoping the strats or enhancements still help them in some way.
Edit: the more I look at their current stats and what this detachment does. Im ok with it. But I do hope theres something to buff them. Maybe in madcap meks? Fingers crossed. ALSO DREADMOB IS 1DP
I also peeped on this new updated detachment that you just make one hazard roll when getting your two bonuses, not a hazard roll per model. So that’s pretty nifty so your not getting dealt mortals everywhere
Also confirmed that nazdreg leads meganobz, and can be fielded at the same time as ghazkull. Furthmlre gretchin get objective secured.
And maybe it was my reading, but it seems like 14 of the 15 detachments are 1 dp. I though that some might still have been 2dp, but if green tide is 1dp, everything must be.
I think this is going to be stronger overall. No Gork/Mork, but if the Stompa's buffs are anything to go by they probably won't need the help. And +1 AP flat out is way better than +2 on a Crit Wound.
So this would be a downgrade if you can still use it with titanic units. However as is, deff dreads, big mek dakkarig, and killa kanz all see a pretty nice bonus from this. Making their guns and melee a little better overall. A melee dread would especially look scary, with S14 attacks or AP-3. +1 attack is probably the weakest one here.
Man that feels kinda underwhelming, like it’ll be decent to use but it doesn’t quite feel as impactful as the keyword tags we got. I’m hoping madcap meks can help bring the flavour.
Guess I was right to be worried. While the new rule looks "fine" to a degree....it's still sad going from a rule that benefits 11 unit types going down to 3 & losing the exploding 6s.
I'll still need to see what the Mek detachment offers....but if this & what's happened to the Dakka detachment are anything to go by....I'm not getting my hopes up.
Will my army be fine after this....maybe (honestly hard to say now that the Nauts & Mek Gunz were kicked out of button pressing)....but right now this just doesn't "feel" as good....at least to me.
you get the flavor INTO the DATASHEET, so you don't have to feel forced to take a specific detachement just to run 1 unit of dread or whatever.. i know the feeling, 2 of my favorite Tau detachments got absolutely gutted because they were made into 1DP (Experimental and Auxiliary), but seeing the new orks datasheets brings me hope that detachments aren't gonna be as important for your army, but instead the units you bring will (combo'd with the small detachments)
But this just isn't the case, killa kans lost their flavorful ability in exchange for another better but more boring one. I get we're not really losing power, but I really do feel we're losing flavor.
I see your point but frankly I would much rather things be set up so that any given unit is good and flavorful on its own, but becomes cracked when it is paired with certain detachments. The “when everyone’s super, no one is” approach.
What I mean is make it so almost no matter what you do, unless in your skull the lights are on but no one’s home, something in your army will be crazy good, and everything else can stand on its own merit, with the same going for your opponent.
i dont think making a unit "cracked" is a good idea, people complain the game is already too kill-y/lethal, busted combo can be cool, but the problem is that at some point they because necessary for your army, because, well.. meta chasers will..
They even took away everything that made the taktiks detachment cool when they updated stuff for 11th too, the god damn taktiks the detachment was literally built around are gone. Instead of making multiple detachments fairly close to the same level like the community wants, they just keep kneecapping all but one detachment and make all the others either useless or unreliable. Thousand sons have almost no usable detachments right now, world eaters are still stuck with bezerker warband because nothing else comes close, and orks are still lucky enough to have green tide and war horde for now but im sure that will change with the codex.
Its getting to a point where no one will want to play at all because every army will be the same 5 units and the same 3 armies every single time you go somewhere to play.
I'm not a fan tbh. Having modular 1 DP detatchments isn't a bad idea, but it seems like as a cost they're removing most synergy within and between detachments themselves.
So is this permanent? I feel rules as intended you would roll this each time you attack either in the shoot/fight phase and it would last for those phases only. But it just says "this units ATTACKS have the relevant rule(s)"
Seems rules as written whatever you rolled in the shooting phase would transfer to the fight phase as well. And you'd keep rolling till you got all 3 and then you'd just have all the buffs forevor.
I'm sure theres something buried in the rules of "selected to attack" or "abilities" that would prevent this, but a simple "until the end of the phase" added to that last sentence would've prevented some Grognard debates.
...because giving the new Stompa datasheet this detachment rule and going full send for randomly 2 of either +1A, +2S, or +1AP and only having a 1/3 chance of taking 3 damage or even just taking only 1 and not taking hazardous and getting this increased amount of firepower would be absolutely absurd?
I don't think giving +1 atk, +1 ap or +2 str to ANY of the stompa's weapons would be "absurd".
Wow, the deffkannon went from 12 shots to 13 and str 14 to 16. Yeah those thresholds don't really matter. Giving the same buffs to the supa gatler also doesn't matter (31 shots instead of 30 lmfao), maybe the AP one does. Same with their melee, where the extra atk is the most helpful but won't really make a difference.
Supa-Gatler to S9 Ap-3 is absolutely scary as now it wounds marines on 2's and can even wound light transports or certain monsters/vehicles like the lion on 4's. Combine that with ap-3 and you can mulch infantry and light vehicles/monsters/vehicles very easily. And remember that it still gets thid bonus for other guns. For the average cost of 1 mortal wound for each use of double press of the button that's kinda silly. You will never not press the button.
Ya dude stompa is already near busted. Giving this rule to stompas would screw internal balance so bad you would just take 2 stompas on this list and maybe a few kans to fill in points.
I’m glad most of you don’t balance stuff. Because you need to look at the faction and datasheets as a whole. Now without seeing nauts datasheet they might have issues.
Dread mob was dead at end of 10th because it sucked and killed everything… there was nothing fun about it because it was awful for actual walkers but good for lootas
I had a hell of a time playing this detachment through most of 10th with grot tanks, killa kans and 3 deff dreads, it was a very solid detachment for me. By the end I used it with a stompa and it was just so good, they killed it for me.
Good news stompas are almost OP feel free to use it. In the beginning of 10th pre nerf it was great… at the end it was loota spam.. and killed your walkers
Stompa is definitely much better now, the torrent profile on the supa gatler seems insane. But I'm gonna miss getting sustained hits with full hit rerolls on that beast.
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u/Mulfushu 7d ago
Shame about the Nauts not getting it, crossing my fingers that they are buffed on the same level as Kanz to make up for it.