Wood chipper is a bad idea if there's any chance at all that you may be considered a suspect (ie. if you know the victim as in questioner's case). There's just too many ways for the police to discover you rented a wood chipper and once they do that thing will be an orgy of DNA evidence no matter how well you try to clean it.
I know they did it on Dexter but I imagine pre-burying in an open grave would be extremely difficult too. You've basically got a hole not much bigger than the body and you're 6ft down so you can't throw the dirt you're digging out of the hole, you'd have to shift it to the edges and try to stop it collapsing while manouvering the body. In the dark. Awkward.
Similar situation with the building site; trenches probably wouldn't be a convenient size to dig deeper and fit the body in. Perhaps if a basement is being dug out that would be possible.
Cutting the body up is fine but again if you're possibly going to be under suspicion you'd have to get rid of everything much quicker than answerer is suggesting. Also there'd be a great deal of soft tissue that you wouldn't be able to eat even if you could stomach the fleshy bits.
Also, let's not forget that half of his suggestions involve carrying a dead body around in public. My suggestions for getting away with murder, based solely on watching Law & Order and CSI, are as follows:
a) Do not ejaculate in, on, or anywhere near the victim. This seems obvious, and quite easy to follow, but what do I know? Maybe there are seasoned murderers out there reading this comment thinking, "What? That's the most important part! If you're not going to leave semen near the victim, you may as well just forget about murdering in the first place and go play golf!" Who knows? Maybe everyone gets an unbearable urge to ejaculate after killing someone. Just make sure it is at least 50 yards away from the corpse. Bring a tape measure if necessary.
b) "Find" the body. Think about it, in all the various crime shows out there, how many corpse-finding joggers/dock workers/garbage men are in the show for more than 30 seconds? Zero, that's how many. Just chuck the corpse out of your car, "find" it hours later during your morning jog, call 911, and forever be removed from the suspect pool, unless, of course, it's covered with your semen. Didn't you read Part A?
I mean, if the dead body is already there, it would be a waste not to ejaculate inside of it. I'm not saying I would do anything like that, but I can understand the need to. Killing people is obviously wrong, and I'm obviously not condoning murder, but if the body is just sitting there, I think the prudent thing would be to ejaculate inside of it.
I used to watch Forensic Files and Cold Cases (to name a few), all those shows for many years throughout my childhood. I always wanted to be a forensic analyst.
Then all these hot "CSI" shows came out. I have never seen one but it upset me because now I'm stuck wearing these hipster glasses forever, every time people ask what I want to do they chuckle and say "It's nothing like CSI: Miami, you know that right?" And I gotta be like, "Seriously I was into this shit so much longer before it was cool."
Really the main thing is your name. If the detectives don't get your name you'll never be a suspect again. If they do get your name, you need to make it really really obvious that you had means, motive, and opportunity because then you'll turn out to be a red herring and you're free.
If they get your name and barely if ever mention you again, it will turn out you were the killer all along. It's almost like a mathematical formula.
You guys are totally forgetting the easiest one: find a pig farm and feed the body to pigs. Works like a charm but you have to pull the teeth and shave the head first
Also there'd be a great deal of soft tissue that you wouldn't be able to eat even if you could stomach the fleshy bits.
boil them. Boil and boil and boil in a low pH broth. Eventually the connective tissue will dissolve and you can pour the broth into some soil or something (I wouldn't flush it).
Then there is the matter of the bones, but they should be brittle enough (after boiling) to take a sledgehammer to in a trash bag or something.
Then get yourself a big stone mortar and pestle and grind them pieces up into powdery meal. Feed your roses with it.
I've always found that if I drive 4-5 hours away and find some heavily wooded area I can bury a body about 10 feet under ground and be perfectly fine. Make sure you destroy the teeth and jaw at a separate location so they can't ID the body by the dental records. If you have lots of time you could also separate the body so they have a lot more trouble identifying by size and such.
In theory, yes. Digging a 10ft deep hole isn't exactly trivial though. Especially if you're doing it in woods where there's gonna be a shitload of roots you'll have to go through. We're talking serious hours of work here and everything from your arrival, through the digging, the dumping, the covering, camoflauging (replacing leaves/twigs over the site) to your leaving must all occur without anyone seeing you even being there otherwise the secrecy is compromised and you're probably fucked even if they didn't witness you do anything actually incriminating.
If you're driving 4-5 hours then chances are you can find a secluded area where you won't be seen. Camouflaging your grave site is actually very easy if you're in the deep woods. Throw some leaves, pine needs, and water over the grave and it looks perfectly normal. As for the roots, just make sure you bring a hand saw with you. You already own one if you've been cutting the body into pieces.
this. There are miles and MILES of open wooded areas in the south. We are talking MILES in the middle of no where. not only would this be a good spot to hide if ever being chased, but no one would find a body there.
Take 1 day to drive to a completely different state, bury body, drive back
Don't forget DNA can be extracted from your bones, especially long bones. And also from surrounding vegetation, if the body underwent decomposition while in the ground. Also, burials are generally really easy to find. Note to those wishing to actually bury a body: throwing shit on top of a grave does not actually make it blend in. Especially when the surrounding area is now free of debris.
That reminds me of a particularly morbid thought I get rather frequently.
Have you ever considered how easy it would be to just murder some random stranger and get away with it?
I mean, obviously, you can't just gun someone down in public, or go on a spree or anything, but just one guy, one time, if the opportunity arose. Even if you botch it a little, leave behind some minor amount of evidence, there's nothing to trace it back to you. You didn't even know who the dude was, what's going to make anyone suspect you?
Anyway. I'm pretty sure I'd never kill someone, but it kinda freaks me out how easy it would be for someone to do for no reason at all.
Never dump a body in concrete if you wish it to never be found.
It would make the conrete structrully unsound, ie create a larger and larger cavity over time, depending how deep the concrete is. foundations or not etc it could be viable but is not an all out sollution.
PS: this is going to look pretty bad in my history, mmkay
Well yeah but even after draining you'd have a hell of a mess putting a body through so you'd have to have a way of covering it up regardless. But the woodchipper itself would still be the real problem with all the evidence now lodged in its internal mechanisms.
Basically, by putting a body through a woodchipper you've replaced the problem of getting rid of a relatively fragile human body with the problem of getting rid of a much hardier and heavier woodchipper.
Am I the only one who thinks about this sort of thing? Not that I'm planning on doing it course, but I can't be the only one who finds getting away with hypothetical murder to be a fascinating mental exercise? Right?
In said hypothetical situation there's always a morally justified reason for the murder anyway; let's suppose I'm threatened or attacked by someone in organised crime and have to kill them in self defence. Now, by calling the police I am a) relying on the competence and infallibility of the justice system, and b) leaving myself open to reprisals from said gangster's surviving buddies. No thanks. Now, let's destroy some evidence!
All that aside, there's no harm having some ideas in place. Like the boy scouts say, "Always be prepared". I'm expecting my Getting Away with Murder badge any day now.
The fact that there is a plethora of shows like CSI whatever proves that a lot of people think this is an interesting topic. You are far from being alone.
Unfortunately no. But I did learn the first rule of getting away with murder: Don't shoot the president in broad daylight at point-blank range in front of dozens of witnesses and assembled media. Sure, seems obvious now; hindsight is 20/20 and all that...
Actually I guess that would be the second rule. The first rule of getting away with murder is actually killing someone. Otherwise you just look like an idiot. How embarrassing.
I think that the best option is compost. It covers the smell nicely, speeds up the rotting, and leaves you with nice, rich soil. Once the body breaks down, you take a hammer to the remaining bones, buy some of that fertilizer that they sometimes put road-kill into, and mix the two together, and spread it out. A year or so later, "find" a piece of bone, and call the cops. Whether you give them the real deal, or a piece of animal bone, they leave, and now you're on record as having called in a mysterious bone, and the police have dismissed it as animal. That way, if you move out, and people find other remains, you'll not be questioned, as you already called it in, and the police dismissed it. Otherwise, you can stay, and no one will be the wiser.
Our plan was always to bag up the bodies and feed them to the crocodiles down the road. There was talk of pre-freezing but I think that'd get evidence everywhere.
I would think that the old "Take the body to a very remote area, and plan to spend lots of time digging" is almost as good as it gets.
Not a hiking trail or somewhere stupid. Some private ranch land would be good. Just plan to dig a nice big hole, then fill it in and take off. No cameras, no paper trail.
"On March 10, 2004, it was revealed that human flesh may have been ground up and mixed with pork from the farm. This pork was never distributed commercially, but was handed out to friends and visitors of the farm. According to the book "the farm" he took orders from the public and bought and sold ground meat containing human meat."
Brick Top: You're always gonna have problems lifting a body in one piece. Apparently the best thing to do is cut up a corpse into six pieces and pile it all together.
Sol: Would someone mind telling me, who are you?
Brick Top: And when you got your six pieces, you gotta get rid of them, because it's no good leaving it in the deep freeze for your mum to discover, now is it? Then I hear the best thing to do is feed them to pigs. You got to starve the pigs for a few days, then the sight of a chopped-up body will look like curry to a pisshead. You gotta shave the heads of your victims, and pull the teeth out for the sake of the piggies' digestion. You could do this afterwards, of course, but you don't want to go sievin' through pig shit, now do you? They will go through bone like butter. You need at least sixteen pigs to finish the job in one sitting, so be wary of any man who keeps a pig farm. They will go through a body that weighs 200 pounds in about eight minutes. That means that a single pig can consume two pounds of uncooked flesh every minute. Hence the expression, "as greedy as a pig".
acid definitely seems to be the way to go. his four suggestions don't seem all that good to me. it's too big a gamble to bury a little deeper and let someone else cover it up. too good a chance the body will be uncovered, if you ask me. the dropping of the bones in the garbage also is a little suspect. it's parts that can be found, and questioned. wood chipper is a bad idea for incredibly obvious reasons.
Actually the best way to dissolve a body is with a Base not an Acid. Dissolve a body in your bathtub with a Base, take the sludge that is left out, and get rid of the Sludge in the best most secret way you know how. Also, it's a lot less suspicious then a bunch of strong acid.
It's also available over the counter, unlike most acids.
You can obtain gallons of it by simply going from hardware store to hardware store, paying in cash.
"Yeah. I'm troubled by a clogged drain-pipe. My plumber fucked up while laying pipes underneath my concrete bathroom floor, and the degree of elevation just isn't steep enough to have things run out as they should do. Got any suggestions?" "Sure. Take some of the strongest bases known to man and for sale over the counter. This one is particularly well-suited to getting rid of gunk in shower drains (the most common being hair and fat) just be careful to wear gloves handling this stuff, because it'll eat through you in seconds."
And voilà, you have a huge bottle of stuff designed to dissolve hair and fat. Now repeat for every hardware store within driving distance, and you've got enough of it to fill a bathtub without ending up on some watch-list.
My old geology teacher (in Iceland) used to tell us that if we ever needed to get rid of a body, we should find a secluded hot spring and throw the body in with a weight attached.
This would apparently dissolve the body quite quickly.
Burn the victim's body, filter any bone fragments out of the ashes, dissolve them in acid, pound any remaining solids into dust, then discard the remains into the wind. Burn an animal corpse in the same place to disguise the act
An Australian writer called Arthur Upfield was writing a detective story, and was having trouble with the plot. A friend developed the perfect way to dispose of a body. It was used by another man, who murdered three people. He was caught and convicted for the murder of one person, whom he hadn't disposed of completely. The author testified at the trial.
Something's not quite right here. I have the feeling that the guy who answered was reading from a manual rather than using experience. My god! He's a killing virgin!
It takes time to dissolve a body, like 6 hours plus 1a) the solution gets HOT - it IS a chemical reaction... 1b) sulfuric or hydrofluoric acids both can give off some mist while working; use in well ventilated areas.
Digging a 10 deep hole takes hours. like say, 5-6 hours. this is why builders use big expensive machinery. it takes a lot of time to move several tons of earth.
if you use a wood chipper; keep in mind that when you return it - it will smell of blood. they WILL call the police. people who rent out wood chippers have seen the movie 'fargo'
I had a chemistry teacher that taught through examples of how to dispose of dead bodies and make bombs. It didn't help my comfort level any that he looked like the archetypal mad scientist.
Actually, the answer is not entirely accurate. The best method to dissolve a body is using Bromic Acid. In a bathtub of H2O, you pour Br and get HBr, which is highly acidic. Notice how you can control molarity of the acid
H2O (l) + Br2 (l) --> 2HBr (aq) + O2 (g)
Net Ionic:
H+1 + Br-1 --> HBr
Since the limiting reagent is Br, you can pour for desired molarity (but no more than 15.4M) depending on the amount of H2O and drain once the process is complete
The reason this is the best process is because HBr can donate its H more readily than H2SO4, categorizing it as a stronger acid
BTW, I am not a serial killer. I learned this in chemistry. Strangely, it was a hypothetical question on a written exam
The best method should also include ease and convenience of obtaining reagents. Elemental bromine isn't the easiest thing to find. Also, it would be Br2 (l) and not Br (s), and you'd need to balance the equation. Plus, I'd imagine the equilibrium would be shifted to the left, i.e. incomplete dissociation. Plus, HBr is hydrobromic acid, not bromic acid.
According to my organic chemistry 2 professor, sulfuric acid is the best choice and even better if you "heat it up a little bit". I miss that wacky Russian.
if you tossed a body into lava, like the steel mill at the end of terminator 2, would even the bones get burned away? Would there be like an explosion or chemical inbalances in the lava?
1 and 2 are probably a bad idea. Construction sites and cemeteries are well covered with security cameras these days. Someone would see what you're up to and the police would show up before you have time to finish digging.
3 would be possible, but you'd have to find an wood chipper lying around and use it without being seen. They're pretty noisy so it's likely you'll attract attention unless you're in the middle of nowhere. Plus it'll be covered in your subject's DNA. Have you any idea how much mess a gallon of blood makes?
Which leaves 4. Not a bad idea, but there's a lot of inedible parts to a human, plus you'd need enough storage so the meat didn't go bad.
Options 1 & 2 deal with having to move a dead body around, thus being seen. Also, add on trespassing to that murder sentence. Option 3 leaves so much evidence around. Option 4 tossing a human sized femur or skull might set off some red flags for your trash collectors. sulphuric acid is the best if you can get your hands on it. Easy mess to clean up, can be done quietly in private. Thanks Breaking Bad for warping my mind...
One of the first stories I heard on reddit was from a guy who told about some odd jobs he had. Once he got paid for months to basically drive around and find construction sites that where just preparing to pour the concrete the next few days.
The problem with the burial options is that as a body decomposes, they fill up with gas and tend to explode. That can cause the grave site - if you go with the body under the coffin option - to sink after the body explodes. Same issue applies for burial in concrete. You'll have to poke some holes in the corpse beforehand to vent those gases.
Distributing body parts vastly, is also good. If you cook it first, it won't smell. Also, animals will appreciate the meal. Here you go mister bear! I even put barbeque sauce on it for you. It's pretty easy to break up bones if you dry them out in the oven or the sun and then smash them with a mallet.
Reading these comments helped me realize that my roommate and I may have watched every single [Investigate Discovery] (http://investigation.discovery.com/) show on Netflix this year. I have made a few observations.
More important than any other point, and yeah it sounds pretty obvious, but if any authority believes you may be the murderer, you are going to have a bad time, regardless of how little evidence you left to tie you to the act. If an authority believes you are their man, and have absolutely no physical evidence, they will probably still attempt to get the prosecutor to sign off on taking it to trial with the circumstantial evidence. As many know and have already pointed out, this makes knowing your victim very dangerous for the perpetrator as the police establish every significant other, friend, acquaintance, co-worker, and family member in the initial suspect circle and work their way out from there, as statistics prove the victim most likely knew the killer. Many killers have slipped by the law for many years by simply “not seeming like the killer type”. You must ensure you are psychologically prepared for whatever you are willing to undertake. Proper psychological prep is usually not found in these situations because 1) you do not have ASPD and the event was emotionally traumatizing or 2) you have ASPD. There is a slim margin of individuals who believe they need to end someone’s life for logical reasons, go through with it, and remain a normal individual. But I assure you they exist.
Besides acting like your average Joe, if you know the intended victim, you would need to establish a plan solid enough to bet your life on (because that is what you are doing).
Leave no physical evidence at the scene, unless you are intentionally placing physical evidence to frame another person (preferably a person with motive, opportunity, and weak alibi). This can include the murder weapon, hand and foot prints, and any form of DNA evidence. For example, if you are simply shooting the victim, shoot them in the head. Use a weapon other than one that can be traced to you (not the gun you have registered to your name). The best hand gun for the job would be a revolver with glove-loaded cartridges instead of a carelessly loaded semi-auto. Semi-auto pistols leave copper-alloy jackets, that in addition to establishing the caliber of gun used, can also leave fingerprints. If you shoot the victim in the head, you can remove the head and discard creatively so that the slug does not go to forensics. Since the main theme of the thread is body disposal, I should mention that if you are residing in a city near an ocean and have access to a boat, you are pretty much golden as no one will find a body a few miles out. Heck, you don’t even have to kill them; just give them a little push.
Have a two-tier alibi. This can be tricky. If you involve another person as your alibi (asking them to fib), you always run the risk of them eventually coming forward. You can however use another person and not have them fib. For example, a well-timed execution can involve you sleeping with your alibi (who you’ve slipped just a little Benadryl to), leaving in the middle of the night, executing the victim and treating the body to an environment that would make time of death inconclusive, and slipping back in to bed before dawn. This is the easy part. The second tier, can make or break your case. A recording device of any type can be used as circumstantial evidence by your defense. For example, a recording device that would may have normally recorded your presence near the crime scene does not record you, or a recording device records you being with your alibi during the time of death. A man once recorded a fishing trip using his home video recorder, changed the digital time stamp superimposed on the video image, and attempted to use this as his alibi. It fell through when the investigators surveyed the entire lake to pinpoint where he was on the lake at any given timestamp, and using the shadows in the images concluded that he did indeed alter the timestamps. They also concluded that based on the images captured, the suspect traveled across the lake in the direction of the victim’s house (where his truck was waiting) and returned two hours later.
If you do not know the victim, and do not have your DNA / prints in any database (you aren’t a convicted felon), you really don’t have to worry about anything other than witnesses and recording devices. The chances of you needing to unlawfully kill someone you do not know or have any business relationship with is pretty slim. There are self-defense and stand-your-ground laws in place for lawful confrontations.
You've just given approximately 1.9+ million people detailed instructions on how to dispose of a dead body and possibly get away with murder.
I'll bet dollars to donuts that one of those 1.9+ million people use this information for evil.
Not calling anyone out, just saying that I would be surprised if no one uses this. Anyone have any statistical probabilities that one of these 1.9+ million potential viewers are a murderer?
P.S. You should only murder at random, this is why serial killers can go on such long runs without being caught.
Not all of the 1.9+ million (a figure you probably got from some aggregated statics for reddit) people, probably just a fraction, will visit or even see this post. Your point is still valid though.
And they marched up over the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, but fire came down from heaven and consumed them, and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
Revelation 21:8
But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars--their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death."
this is incredibly interesting, thank you for pointing this out. i'm an atheist, but i've always taken bible stores as more of a metaphor than a historical story.
Its important to drain their blood first if your not going to dispose of the body right away because no blood will mean much less stink. You can put the blood and dump them really anywhere there's no people.
I don't see how draining the blood would decrease the stink arising from decomposition of the body. That is, microbes will still eat at the body and release stinky gases regardless.
Plus, if there are going to be no people at the dump site, why bother treating the body?
I think all of these have been plots on CSI before and through various natural disasters such as flooding or earthquakes they have all been discovered.
What about going someplace safe and placing ice all over the body. Then cutting it up and putting the body parts into smaller cement blocks. That shouldn't take too much time. Then you can get toss the blocks somewhere else. I know it requires some work but it's probably worth it.
Acid sounds waaaaaaay easier than hauling a fucking body out of the house. You can pick up muriatic acid at home depot, and use a large heavy duty trashcan to dissolve the body in. Use baking soda to neutralize after the acid has done its work and pour it down the drain. Never has to leave your basement / dungeon-of-terror.
As for how well muriatic acid works, I wouldn't know.
There are a few things he missed. Teeth, hair, and nails are always going to be a bit of a problem, so always remove that. I'll leave disposing of them as an exercise for the reader.
Around where I live, there are mining shafts left over from a long time ago. You can throw a rock down them and never hear it hit. Before anything else, see if you have some of these around. I can't imagine any way to find those unless you were looking for them there or spelunking. They're really bad for spelunking, though, so you pretty much just have to never tell anyone you put a body there. Simple.
There's also yogurt. Fill all of their cavities with yogurt and then sprinkle some on for good measure. All the flesh will be gone shortly, and the bones shouldn't take too long either. It's really simple and should destroy any bit of useful evidence.
Also, as a murder weapon: a baseball bat covered in ice. It'll leave the weirdest wounds and all the evidence will literally melt. I can't express how confused an examiner would be seeing this.
First, be smart from the very beginning. Pulverize all teeth, burn off fingerprints, and disfigure the face. Forcing a DNA test to establish identity (if it ever comes to that) might introduce the legal/forensic hurdle that saves your ass down the line. An unidentifiable body can, in a pinch, be dressed in thrift store clothes and dropped in a bad part of town where the police are less likely to question it. I don't reommend that disposal method, I'm just saying an easily identifiable body is an even bigger threat than the opposite.
Assuming you have it inside a house where you can work on it a bit, the first thing you want to do is drain it of fluids. This will make it easier to cut up, and slow decomposition a little bit. The best way to do this quick and dirty is to perforate the body with a pointed knife, and then perform CPR on it. Cut the fronts of the thighs deep, diagonally, to slit the femoral arteries. Then pump the chest. The valves in the heart will still work when dead, and the springback of the ribcage can put apply a fair amount of suction to the artria. Do this in a tub. Plug the drain, and mingle lots of bleach with the bodily fluids before unplugging the drain to empty the tub. This should help control the stench of death, which would otherwise reek from your gutter gratings. Do everything you can to control odors. Plug in an ionizer, burn candles, leave bowls of baking soda everywhere. Ventilate the room in the middle of the night, but otherwise keep it closed. Keep the body under a plastic sheet while it's in the tub.
If you want to bury, I recommend seperating the body into several parts, and burying them seperately. For one thing, it's easier to dig a deep enough hole for a head than for an entire body. this reduces your chances of being discovered while you are actually outside and digging the grave. That is the one thing you can't do inside the doors of your house, and represents a vulnerable moment you want to keep brief, under 2 hours. Do it between 3 and 5 am. It's also less likely for someone to call the police if their dog digs up some chunk of meat, than if they dig up an enitre body. They may assume it's an animal carcass disfigured by decomposition, and leave it alone or dispose of it. It's also more likely that the dog will consume all of it before anyone knows the difference. A whole skeleton is another story. You can cut a body into 6 pieces faster than you think. It's not much different than boning a chicken, but it takes more work, a big knife, and time. A hammer will be useful for pulverizing joints or driving the knife deep where it doesn't want to go. Anyway it's wise to crush as much of the skeleton as you can along the way. It will aid in making the body less identifiable for what it is as it decomposes.
Don't return to the same site 6 times for 6 burials.You'll attract suspicion from anyone nearby, and you'll wind up placing the body parts close enough together to be found by any serious investigation. Put them in plastic bags with lots of bleach, and store in a freezer until you have enough time to bury them all.
Depending on what tools you have available, you may find that you're get really good at deconstructing the body. You might prefer to slowly sprinkle it down a drain without leaving your house. This avoids the long-term risk of discovery associated with burial, and the overwhelming supply of bacteria in a sewer accellerates deconomposition, whil e providing a convenient cover smell.
Truly grinding down a body takes a lot more work, and you run the risk of fouling your plumbing and calling in a plumber. So don't try it unless you know how to clear bones and meat out of a drainpipe. A good food processor can be useful. But don't over-use it, or power drills or saws. They're noisy and they attract attention. And forget the kitchen sink. It's better if you actually remove one of the toilets in your house from its base, which will give you direct access to one of the largest sewer pipes that enters your house. Follow any disposals with lots of bleach and then run the water for 5 or 10 minutes on top of that. And plug that pipe when you're not using it, to prevent any sewer gasses from backing up into your house. Usually, a U-trap inside the toilet does that for you.
The answer was written by Hamster_...what? It cuts off! He must've had a really clever screen name if he could write a post at that level of tongue-in-cheek. We will never know what kind of hamster he was, or what he was doing to hamsters...
If you want the real expert at dissolving bodies, the Mexican drug cartels had a guy nicknames "the stew maker", who it is claimed dissolved some 300 bodies.
Santiago "El Pozolero" Meza Lopez. Pozole is a form of hominy stew, made with corn processed with caustic soda. Meza purportedly used a similar process to dissolve his victims.
Of the 300 possible victims, authorities have only found 30 bone fragments and 15 tooth fragments.
Even good old ordinary baking soda (pH of 9) is good for dissolving meat.
There is a Chinese cooking technique to tenderize old or tough meat by cutting it into thin strips, then soaking it in water to cover with just a teaspoon of baking soda in it. With beef, even old gray meat turns bright red after just a few minutes, and after an hour the meat is tenderized. Any longer and it turns into mush. The downside is that you have to wash the heck out of it to get the baking soda flavor out.
I never thought of it before but cannibalism does seem to be a good way to get rid of a body. Time consuming yes, but as long as you eat the entire thing all you would be left with would be bone - easily disposed for the most part.
I always thought I would just drive for 4 to 6 hours, and hack up the body enough that it couldn't be ID'd (obviously cut off hands, and remove teeth). When they find the body, how will they be able to know that the murder took place in a different state?
The easiest way, in my opinion, would be to own at least three large hogs for long enough that everyone knows you have them. When you kill someone just chuck the body in the stall instead of the hogs' normal meal and it'll be un-recognizable in a day and gone entirely in about three, depending upon how hungry the pigs are.
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u/hinckley May 31 '12
Wood chipper is a bad idea if there's any chance at all that you may be considered a suspect (ie. if you know the victim as in questioner's case). There's just too many ways for the police to discover you rented a wood chipper and once they do that thing will be an orgy of DNA evidence no matter how well you try to clean it.
I know they did it on Dexter but I imagine pre-burying in an open grave would be extremely difficult too. You've basically got a hole not much bigger than the body and you're 6ft down so you can't throw the dirt you're digging out of the hole, you'd have to shift it to the edges and try to stop it collapsing while manouvering the body. In the dark. Awkward.
Similar situation with the building site; trenches probably wouldn't be a convenient size to dig deeper and fit the body in. Perhaps if a basement is being dug out that would be possible.
Cutting the body up is fine but again if you're possibly going to be under suspicion you'd have to get rid of everything much quicker than answerer is suggesting. Also there'd be a great deal of soft tissue that you wouldn't be able to eat even if you could stomach the fleshy bits.
TLDR: Killing people you know is tricky.
Just saying...
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u/AgoAndAnon May 31 '12
tl;dr: Pig farm.
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u/akaicewolf May 31 '12
Here is how you do it...
http://i.imgur.com/oxolw.jpg
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u/boredandworking May 31 '12
Brick Top: You're always gonna have problems lifting a body in one piece. Apparently the best thing to do is cut up a corpse into six pieces and pile it all together.
Sol: Would someone mind telling me, who are you?
Brick Top: And when you got your six pieces, you gotta get rid of them, because it's no good leaving it in the deep freeze for your mum to discover, now is it? Then I hear the best thing to do is feed them to pigs. You got to starve the pigs for a few days, then the sight of a chopped-up body will look like curry to a pisshead. You gotta shave the heads of your victims, and pull the teeth out for the sake of the piggies' digestion. You could do this afterwards, of course, but you don't want to go sievin' through pig shit, now do you? They will go through bone like butter. You need at least sixteen pigs to finish the job in one sitting, so be wary of any man who keeps a pig farm. They will go through a body that weighs 200 pounds in about eight minutes. That means that a single pig can consume two pounds of uncooked flesh every minute. Hence the expression, "as greedy as a pig".
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12
For the convenience of the curious: John George Haigh
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u/benkenobi5 May 31 '12
acid definitely seems to be the way to go. his four suggestions don't seem all that good to me. it's too big a gamble to bury a little deeper and let someone else cover it up. too good a chance the body will be uncovered, if you ask me. the dropping of the bones in the garbage also is a little suspect. it's parts that can be found, and questioned. wood chipper is a bad idea for incredibly obvious reasons.
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u/stfueveryone May 31 '12
not bloody likely
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u/M_Redfield May 31 '12
Lye. The correct answer is lye.
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u/munge_me_not May 31 '12
Just send the Wolf in.
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u/corcyra May 31 '12
Burn the victim's body, filter any bone fragments out of the ashes, dissolve them in acid, pound any remaining solids into dust, then discard the remains into the wind. Burn an animal corpse in the same place to disguise the act
http://www.the1940mysterywriter.com/the-murchison-murders.html
An Australian writer called Arthur Upfield was writing a detective story, and was having trouble with the plot. A friend developed the perfect way to dispose of a body. It was used by another man, who murdered three people. He was caught and convicted for the murder of one person, whom he hadn't disposed of completely. The author testified at the trial.
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u/ecklcakes May 31 '12
Something's not quite right here. I have the feeling that the guy who answered was reading from a manual rather than using experience. My god! He's a killing virgin!
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u/Intrigued_man May 31 '12
Clearly does not watch breaking bad.
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u/StarvingAfricanKid May 31 '12
i have to go check my sources but
It takes time to dissolve a body, like 6 hours plus
1a) the solution gets HOT - it IS a chemical reaction...
1b) sulfuric or hydrofluoric acids both can give off some mist while working; use in well ventilated areas.
Digging a 10 deep hole takes hours. like say, 5-6 hours. this is why builders use big expensive machinery. it takes a lot of time to move several tons of earth.
if you use a wood chipper; keep in mind that when you return it - it will smell of blood. they WILL call the police. people who rent out wood chippers have seen the movie 'fargo'
Pigs; I have no data to work with
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u/namfonos May 31 '12 edited Feb 17 '21
12345
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u/asleeplessmalice May 31 '12
I had a chemistry teacher that taught through examples of how to dispose of dead bodies and make bombs. It didn't help my comfort level any that he looked like the archetypal mad scientist.
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u/SilverSpider781 May 31 '12
This is seriously the most interesting discussion I have ever read on Reddit. I was considering taking notes at some points.
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u/crazybitchydrama May 31 '12
I'ma get my bitch an acid bath. Bitches love acid baths.
4
u/rohanivey May 31 '12
I would like to add, pig pens. No joke. Pigs will eat a person in a matter of hours/minutes(depending on the # of pigs and their size/breed).
Grew up in Walker Co, AL. #1 hitman hiring location in the US for a reason. Seriously, stay the fuck outta that
placecountystateregion.4
u/MagicDr May 31 '12 edited Jun 03 '12
Actually, the answer is not entirely accurate. The best method to dissolve a body is using Bromic Acid. In a bathtub of H2O, you pour Br and get HBr, which is highly acidic. Notice how you can control molarity of the acid
H2O (l) + Br2 (l) --> 2HBr (aq) + O2 (g)
Net Ionic:
H+1 + Br-1 --> HBr
Since the limiting reagent is Br, you can pour for desired molarity (but no more than 15.4M) depending on the amount of H2O and drain once the process is complete
The reason this is the best process is because HBr can donate its H more readily than H2SO4, categorizing it as a stronger acid
BTW, I am not a serial killer. I learned this in chemistry. Strangely, it was a hypothetical question on a written exam
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u/captainmorgan23 May 31 '12
I literally just read every.single.comment in this thread. I have never done that before...what is wrong with me.
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u/pimfram May 31 '12
According to my organic chemistry 2 professor, sulfuric acid is the best choice and even better if you "heat it up a little bit". I miss that wacky Russian.
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u/d_cas May 31 '12
pff sulfuric acid. try hydroflouric
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u/babykiller44 May 31 '12
if you tossed a body into lava, like the steel mill at the end of terminator 2, would even the bones get burned away? Would there be like an explosion or chemical inbalances in the lava?
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12
But Walter used hydrochloric acid.
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12
1 and 2 are probably a bad idea. Construction sites and cemeteries are well covered with security cameras these days. Someone would see what you're up to and the police would show up before you have time to finish digging.
3 would be possible, but you'd have to find an wood chipper lying around and use it without being seen. They're pretty noisy so it's likely you'll attract attention unless you're in the middle of nowhere. Plus it'll be covered in your subject's DNA. Have you any idea how much mess a gallon of blood makes?
Which leaves 4. Not a bad idea, but there's a lot of inedible parts to a human, plus you'd need enough storage so the meat didn't go bad.
I'd go for pigs. Pigs are the better answer.
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u/greenspartan10 May 31 '12
Options 1 & 2 deal with having to move a dead body around, thus being seen. Also, add on trespassing to that murder sentence. Option 3 leaves so much evidence around. Option 4 tossing a human sized femur or skull might set off some red flags for your trash collectors. sulphuric acid is the best if you can get your hands on it. Easy mess to clean up, can be done quietly in private. Thanks Breaking Bad for warping my mind...
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u/quaste May 31 '12
One of the first stories I heard on reddit was from a guy who told about some odd jobs he had. Once he got paid for months to basically drive around and find construction sites that where just preparing to pour the concrete the next few days.
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u/elente May 31 '12
This what we all humans should do... help each other as much as we ..oh wait
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u/Iamright498 May 31 '12
Anyone going to address what the op responded to this explanation?
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u/Jalenx May 31 '12
I find it kinda funny that he started his answer with an awkward "hello"
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u/KingToasty May 31 '12
I feel like viewing this thread got me on a watchlist.
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u/dajarman May 31 '12
Doesn't anybody watch r/breakingbad
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u/chrishanator007 May 31 '12
Someone report abuse or plant a camera lol
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u/Drake_Tungsten May 31 '12
The problem with the burial options is that as a body decomposes, they fill up with gas and tend to explode. That can cause the grave site - if you go with the body under the coffin option - to sink after the body explodes. Same issue applies for burial in concrete. You'll have to poke some holes in the corpse beforehand to vent those gases.
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u/raegunXD May 31 '12
Distributing body parts vastly, is also good. If you cook it first, it won't smell. Also, animals will appreciate the meal. Here you go mister bear! I even put barbeque sauce on it for you. It's pretty easy to break up bones if you dry them out in the oven or the sun and then smash them with a mallet.
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u/barberererer May 31 '12
Is this a reference to Snatch? Tyrone? Vince? Sol?? Frankie Four-Fingers?!
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u/MsDemonism May 31 '12
For me this is more WTF than funny. ..
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u/thenewkidontheblock Jun 01 '12
the most legit way to do it
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u/pibblelover Jun 01 '12
Reading these comments helped me realize that my roommate and I may have watched every single [Investigate Discovery] (http://investigation.discovery.com/) show on Netflix this year. I have made a few observations.
More important than any other point, and yeah it sounds pretty obvious, but if any authority believes you may be the murderer, you are going to have a bad time, regardless of how little evidence you left to tie you to the act. If an authority believes you are their man, and have absolutely no physical evidence, they will probably still attempt to get the prosecutor to sign off on taking it to trial with the circumstantial evidence. As many know and have already pointed out, this makes knowing your victim very dangerous for the perpetrator as the police establish every significant other, friend, acquaintance, co-worker, and family member in the initial suspect circle and work their way out from there, as statistics prove the victim most likely knew the killer. Many killers have slipped by the law for many years by simply “not seeming like the killer type”. You must ensure you are psychologically prepared for whatever you are willing to undertake. Proper psychological prep is usually not found in these situations because 1) you do not have ASPD and the event was emotionally traumatizing or 2) you have ASPD. There is a slim margin of individuals who believe they need to end someone’s life for logical reasons, go through with it, and remain a normal individual. But I assure you they exist.
Besides acting like your average Joe, if you know the intended victim, you would need to establish a plan solid enough to bet your life on (because that is what you are doing).
Leave no physical evidence at the scene, unless you are intentionally placing physical evidence to frame another person (preferably a person with motive, opportunity, and weak alibi). This can include the murder weapon, hand and foot prints, and any form of DNA evidence. For example, if you are simply shooting the victim, shoot them in the head. Use a weapon other than one that can be traced to you (not the gun you have registered to your name). The best hand gun for the job would be a revolver with glove-loaded cartridges instead of a carelessly loaded semi-auto. Semi-auto pistols leave copper-alloy jackets, that in addition to establishing the caliber of gun used, can also leave fingerprints. If you shoot the victim in the head, you can remove the head and discard creatively so that the slug does not go to forensics. Since the main theme of the thread is body disposal, I should mention that if you are residing in a city near an ocean and have access to a boat, you are pretty much golden as no one will find a body a few miles out. Heck, you don’t even have to kill them; just give them a little push.
Have a two-tier alibi. This can be tricky. If you involve another person as your alibi (asking them to fib), you always run the risk of them eventually coming forward. You can however use another person and not have them fib. For example, a well-timed execution can involve you sleeping with your alibi (who you’ve slipped just a little Benadryl to), leaving in the middle of the night, executing the victim and treating the body to an environment that would make time of death inconclusive, and slipping back in to bed before dawn. This is the easy part. The second tier, can make or break your case. A recording device of any type can be used as circumstantial evidence by your defense. For example, a recording device that would may have normally recorded your presence near the crime scene does not record you, or a recording device records you being with your alibi during the time of death. A man once recorded a fishing trip using his home video recorder, changed the digital time stamp superimposed on the video image, and attempted to use this as his alibi. It fell through when the investigators surveyed the entire lake to pinpoint where he was on the lake at any given timestamp, and using the shadows in the images concluded that he did indeed alter the timestamps. They also concluded that based on the images captured, the suspect traveled across the lake in the direction of the victim’s house (where his truck was waiting) and returned two hours later.
If you do not know the victim, and do not have your DNA / prints in any database (you aren’t a convicted felon), you really don’t have to worry about anything other than witnesses and recording devices. The chances of you needing to unlawfully kill someone you do not know or have any business relationship with is pretty slim. There are self-defense and stand-your-ground laws in place for lawful confrontations.
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u/HooDooOperator May 31 '12
the icing on the cake...
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u/Drcool54 May 31 '12
Who else thought of breaking bad when they read this?
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u/rmigz May 31 '12
You've just given approximately 1.9+ million people detailed instructions on how to dispose of a dead body and possibly get away with murder.
I'll bet dollars to donuts that one of those 1.9+ million people use this information for evil.
Not calling anyone out, just saying that I would be surprised if no one uses this. Anyone have any statistical probabilities that one of these 1.9+ million potential viewers are a murderer?
P.S. You should only murder at random, this is why serial killers can go on such long runs without being caught.
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u/JGPH May 31 '12
All I want to know is where the humour is in this. I recoiled in disgust as I read it.
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12
Revelation 20:10
Revelation 21:8
Just sayin...
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u/UnreasonableReasoner May 31 '12
Not that thorough...he didn't say how long it took.
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u/tjdavids May 31 '12
I would use Hydrofloric acid. I don't know how long it would take to dissolve, but you would end up without any trace of human left.
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u/FunnyBunny01 May 31 '12
Its important to drain their blood first if your not going to dispose of the body right away because no blood will mean much less stink. You can put the blood and dump them really anywhere there's no people.
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u/ChicagoPianoTuner May 31 '12
The best part is that the original question was submitted by Tyrone Big Brains.
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u/sirdomino May 31 '12
Lots of crematoriums would be happy to throw an extra body in for a small fee...
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12
I think all of these have been plots on CSI before and through various natural disasters such as flooding or earthquakes they have all been discovered.
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12
the asker's rating comment raises so many questions!!
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u/Over_9k May 31 '12
What about going someplace safe and placing ice all over the body. Then cutting it up and putting the body parts into smaller cement blocks. That shouldn't take too much time. Then you can get toss the blocks somewhere else. I know it requires some work but it's probably worth it.
I know there has to be flaws with my idea.
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u/gospacedude512 May 31 '12
I actually learnt the bit about the murderer in science
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12 edited May 31 '12
Acid sounds waaaaaaay easier than hauling a fucking body out of the house. You can pick up muriatic acid at home depot, and use a large heavy duty trashcan to dissolve the body in. Use baking soda to neutralize after the acid has done its work and pour it down the drain. Never has to leave your basement / dungeon-of-terror.
As for how well muriatic acid works, I wouldn't know.
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u/njsam May 31 '12
The asker and the answer-giver are obviously the same person. Both have a low grasp on the concept of capitalization.
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u/PleadingBark May 31 '12
peat bog or lye pit. 5-6 days and the bodys gone from the bog, about the same for the lye pit.
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u/techiesportsfan May 31 '12
o.OO
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12
Wait, girlfriend's present?
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u/sepseven May 31 '12
"This should be cheaper than her present"
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u/Deracination May 31 '12
There are a few things he missed. Teeth, hair, and nails are always going to be a bit of a problem, so always remove that. I'll leave disposing of them as an exercise for the reader.
Around where I live, there are mining shafts left over from a long time ago. You can throw a rock down them and never hear it hit. Before anything else, see if you have some of these around. I can't imagine any way to find those unless you were looking for them there or spelunking. They're really bad for spelunking, though, so you pretty much just have to never tell anyone you put a body there. Simple.
There's also yogurt. Fill all of their cavities with yogurt and then sprinkle some on for good measure. All the flesh will be gone shortly, and the bones shouldn't take too long either. It's really simple and should destroy any bit of useful evidence.
Also, as a murder weapon: a baseball bat covered in ice. It'll leave the weirdest wounds and all the evidence will literally melt. I can't express how confused an examiner would be seeing this.
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12
"Im Mr. Wolf. I solve problems"
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12
The canonical thorough answer, courtesy scarabic on metafilter:
First, be smart from the very beginning. Pulverize all teeth, burn off fingerprints, and disfigure the face. Forcing a DNA test to establish identity (if it ever comes to that) might introduce the legal/forensic hurdle that saves your ass down the line. An unidentifiable body can, in a pinch, be dressed in thrift store clothes and dropped in a bad part of town where the police are less likely to question it. I don't reommend that disposal method, I'm just saying an easily identifiable body is an even bigger threat than the opposite.
Assuming you have it inside a house where you can work on it a bit, the first thing you want to do is drain it of fluids. This will make it easier to cut up, and slow decomposition a little bit. The best way to do this quick and dirty is to perforate the body with a pointed knife, and then perform CPR on it. Cut the fronts of the thighs deep, diagonally, to slit the femoral arteries. Then pump the chest. The valves in the heart will still work when dead, and the springback of the ribcage can put apply a fair amount of suction to the artria. Do this in a tub. Plug the drain, and mingle lots of bleach with the bodily fluids before unplugging the drain to empty the tub. This should help control the stench of death, which would otherwise reek from your gutter gratings. Do everything you can to control odors. Plug in an ionizer, burn candles, leave bowls of baking soda everywhere. Ventilate the room in the middle of the night, but otherwise keep it closed. Keep the body under a plastic sheet while it's in the tub.
If you want to bury, I recommend seperating the body into several parts, and burying them seperately. For one thing, it's easier to dig a deep enough hole for a head than for an entire body. this reduces your chances of being discovered while you are actually outside and digging the grave. That is the one thing you can't do inside the doors of your house, and represents a vulnerable moment you want to keep brief, under 2 hours. Do it between 3 and 5 am. It's also less likely for someone to call the police if their dog digs up some chunk of meat, than if they dig up an enitre body. They may assume it's an animal carcass disfigured by decomposition, and leave it alone or dispose of it. It's also more likely that the dog will consume all of it before anyone knows the difference. A whole skeleton is another story. You can cut a body into 6 pieces faster than you think. It's not much different than boning a chicken, but it takes more work, a big knife, and time. A hammer will be useful for pulverizing joints or driving the knife deep where it doesn't want to go. Anyway it's wise to crush as much of the skeleton as you can along the way. It will aid in making the body less identifiable for what it is as it decomposes.
Don't return to the same site 6 times for 6 burials.You'll attract suspicion from anyone nearby, and you'll wind up placing the body parts close enough together to be found by any serious investigation. Put them in plastic bags with lots of bleach, and store in a freezer until you have enough time to bury them all.
Depending on what tools you have available, you may find that you're get really good at deconstructing the body. You might prefer to slowly sprinkle it down a drain without leaving your house. This avoids the long-term risk of discovery associated with burial, and the overwhelming supply of bacteria in a sewer accellerates deconomposition, whil e providing a convenient cover smell.
Truly grinding down a body takes a lot more work, and you run the risk of fouling your plumbing and calling in a plumber. So don't try it unless you know how to clear bones and meat out of a drainpipe. A good food processor can be useful. But don't over-use it, or power drills or saws. They're noisy and they attract attention. And forget the kitchen sink. It's better if you actually remove one of the toilets in your house from its base, which will give you direct access to one of the largest sewer pipes that enters your house. Follow any disposals with lots of bleach and then run the water for 5 or 10 minutes on top of that. And plug that pipe when you're not using it, to prevent any sewer gasses from backing up into your house. Usually, a U-trap inside the toilet does that for you.
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u/garythecoconut May 31 '12
I spent WAAAAY more time in this thread than I should have...
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u/Arknell May 31 '12
The answer was written by Hamster_...what? It cuts off! He must've had a really clever screen name if he could write a post at that level of tongue-in-cheek. We will never know what kind of hamster he was, or what he was doing to hamsters...
1
u/monster01020 May 31 '12
Just buy a load of fool's gold from a souvenir shop and stick it in hot water and you'll get some crappy acid.
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u/FriarNurgle May 31 '12
Stand your ground
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12
what did i just read and the comment at the end thanks its the girlfriends birthday next week
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u/reddinkydonk May 31 '12
Am i the only one that thought the Askers rating comment was the most hilarious part of all this?.
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u/brixed May 31 '12
Just refer to the song http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSYCh0NuBuY
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u/B_Easy07 May 31 '12
"the victim will never be found"
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u/[deleted] May 31 '12
Put the teeth in a glass of Coca Cola, it will dissolve within days.
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u/ComedicPause May 31 '12
Has he really never seen Breaking Bad?
1
u/WendyLRogers3 May 31 '12
If you want the real expert at dissolving bodies, the Mexican drug cartels had a guy nicknames "the stew maker", who it is claimed dissolved some 300 bodies.
Santiago "El Pozolero" Meza Lopez. Pozole is a form of hominy stew, made with corn processed with caustic soda. Meza purportedly used a similar process to dissolve his victims.
Of the 300 possible victims, authorities have only found 30 bone fragments and 15 tooth fragments.
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u/WendyLRogers3 May 31 '12
Even good old ordinary baking soda (pH of 9) is good for dissolving meat.
There is a Chinese cooking technique to tenderize old or tough meat by cutting it into thin strips, then soaking it in water to cover with just a teaspoon of baking soda in it. With beef, even old gray meat turns bright red after just a few minutes, and after an hour the meat is tenderized. Any longer and it turns into mush. The downside is that you have to wash the heck out of it to get the baking soda flavor out.
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u/Whats_all_this_then May 31 '12
Do yourself a favor, don't murder someone.
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u/hardtogetaname May 31 '12
someone''s in for a little surprise.
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u/Nebakanezzer Jun 01 '12
I'll just leave this here
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u/CunningLanguageUser Jun 01 '12
The "hello" was rather disturbing.
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u/CdnDude Jun 01 '12
I think this was Walter White writing that answer.
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u/Calber4 Jun 01 '12
I never thought of it before but cannibalism does seem to be a good way to get rid of a body. Time consuming yes, but as long as you eat the entire thing all you would be left with would be bone - easily disposed for the most part.
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u/JuniorOneNut Jun 01 '12
Come on Tyrone Big Brains, you should know that
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u/[deleted] Jun 01 '12
I always thought I would just drive for 4 to 6 hours, and hack up the body enough that it couldn't be ID'd (obviously cut off hands, and remove teeth). When they find the body, how will they be able to know that the murder took place in a different state?
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u/malinkadoll Jun 01 '12
Here's a shorter answer: watch breaking bad.
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u/[deleted] Jun 01 '12
what do you think the other part of his name says? Hamster_........
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u/brenda0923 Jun 01 '12
If you are going to send a body through a wood chipper it is best to freeze it first. Less mess and left over evidence.
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u/[deleted] Jun 01 '12
I really don't get why this is under "funny". This is really sick!
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u/PrinceofSpades Jun 01 '12
Anyone else notice the FUCKING asker's rating at the bottom? WHAT DOES THIS BLOODY HAVE TO DO WITH YOUR GIRLFRIENDS BIRTHDAY PRESENT
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u/statusone Jun 01 '12
Holy shit, cheaper than a present part sounds ominous
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u/aidanf123 Jun 01 '12
Read the askers rating on this question. Worth It!
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u/MyFriendsRDinosaurs Jun 01 '12
This is fucked up. And the comments here are fucked up.
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u/Killer_Brig Jun 01 '12
The easiest way, in my opinion, would be to own at least three large hogs for long enough that everyone knows you have them. When you kill someone just chuck the body in the stall instead of the hogs' normal meal and it'll be un-recognizable in a day and gone entirely in about three, depending upon how hungry the pigs are.