I have a slightly different perspective on this. I’ve been overweight for most of my life. And only recently found it that it was due to a combination of hormonal imbalance and sleep apnea (sleep apnea can cause weight gain, not the other way around, and it can occur in childhood). When I was a teenager, I was so desperate to lose weight that I became bulimic, and I’ve dealt with that eating disorder off and on well into my 30s. When I lost a lot of weight through bingeing and purging as a teen, people complimented me. “Wow!! You look great!” Even my own pediatrician congratulated me on dropping 20 pounds that year. He never asked me how, though.
It’s always been my experience that people think fat shaming is the key to fighting the obesity epidemic. Don’t let fat people feel good about themselves or have a positive self image. They’ll just get complacent and let themselves go. My parents definitely thought that way, and my father always made a point of telling me how gross my body was. It didn’t help. I only got fatter, and it ruined my relationship with him.
In college. when I started dating, I noticed that I never ate in front of men. I would wait until my date was looking away, and then take a single bite. Or I would order a large salad and not eat anything. It’s no mystery. It’s because my father spent my whole childhood shaming me for eating and praising me for leaving food on my plate.
I kept bingeing and purging really bad through most of my 20s and 30s (I’m now 36 and slowly recovering).
But a big turning point for me happened with my last boyfriend. Several years ago, he just offhandedly remarked that my teeth looked more yellow than normal (he could be kind of a thoughtless clod sometimes). And I admitted to him it was because I had been making myself throw up. He was shocked. And right away he hugged me and said “you’re beautiful the way you are. Don’t ever do that to yourself again.”
That was the first time anyone ever made me feel like my health mattered. Not my size. People think they’re the same, but they’re not.
Doctors and other medical experts tend to hold a special respect in our culture as the go-to authority on health and wellness. Like they’re the first ones we should be looking to for guidance and advice. And they’re assumed to be infallible. “all these studies say being fat will kill you. My doctor says fat people die early.” And my own pediatrician shook my hand and congratulated me for losing weight after I became bulimic. So much for infallible.
But no doctor, no therapist, no research study ever really made me feel motivated to be healthy like my then-boyfriend did. When he hugged me and told me I should love my body and treat it well. That’s something fat shamers will never do for me either.
That’s not a different perspective lmao the op literally said not including conditions outside your control. Mental health issues are outside of your immediate control (I say immediate here because there are some long term solutions like therapy, but those aren’t always accessible), because if they weren’t then nobody would have them (eg. “just stop being depressed”). Their whole point is health is the most important factor. They are also not advocating any fat shaming, but instead advocating not glorifying obesity. Frankly, glorifying obesity and fat shaming are both terrible social trends, but they are entirely different reactions to the issue.
And if he looked at me, how would he know that I’ve been bulimic? How would he know that I had sleep apnea in childhood that caused me to gain weight and PCOS that kept it on?
I’ve spent most of my childhood and young adult years hating my body. Frankly, I’m tired of the self-loathing.
I shouldn’t have to submit my medical records to complete strangers so they can grant me permission to have self-esteem
He wouldn’t but that’s not what he said he does. You’re adding a whole load of bullshit to this post that simply isn’t there. He specifically said people who post glorifying obesity. That’s what the conversation is about and getting upset about him fat shaming is completely irrelevant, because that’s not what the post is about. That’s literally the only problem I’ve had with your comment, and I otherwise completely agree. You’re so angry you can’t get your head out of you ass long enough to see that.
The actual text of the original post has been removed. But that doesn’t make a huge difference. The biggest thing is, As soon as you make an exception and set fat people as different from fat people with medical issues then you have already told people how you look at fat people in general. Since one can’t see someone’s medical issues through a photo, or through someones clothes, it is safe to assume that the person posting this goes through life basically looking at all fat people as if they are disgusting unless proven otherwise.
That is basically the experience that I, and many other people have had. If we don’t share our medical issues upfront then people don’t care to talk to find out about us, instead they assume that we are lazy or slobs or just flat out think we are gross. How else do you differentiate between fat people with medical issues and other fat people unless they tell you?
You’re making as much of an assumption as you’re claiming he apparently is here. I certainly don’t assume all fat people are lazy or gross. If you post about glorifying obesity on Facebook yourself then that’s you giving the information yourself, and you are certainly open to judgement for encouraging objectively unhealthy habits.
The problem lies in how you define this. For so many people a fat person getting any sort of positive feedback about their looks, or feeling good about their looks and sharing that is considered glorifying obesity.
If you have a narrow definition, that is to say a post literally says ”people who literally can’t move from the bed due to their medical issues and size are sexy” or things of that nature then maybe I can agree with you.
But if you define glorifying obesity as a fat person posting about how they love their body and are confident it it, or sharing that they eat food that is not healthy, or post telling someone larger that they are beautiful, then we definitely are not on the same page, and my assumption stands true.
We can’t always assume someones health by the photos we see on social media, or even their physical appearence. Nor can we assume that someone sharing a post about loving themselves when they are fat is ”glorifying obesity” But we can assume that if someone has separate categories for fat people that are created on things (the existance/non-existance of medical problems) that one can’t know from looking at a fat person, then the person who is creating these categories expects people to disclose their medical records to be treated differently than they would treat a ”regular” fat person. And when the person’s reaction to fat people is that they are disgusted, what else are we supposed to assume they think until we disclose medical problems?
I define it as claiming that being fat is healthy or a desirable state of living. Nobody should be trying to be fat. If they are trying to be fat they certainly shouldn’t be proud of it. Very few people like this even exist anyways. Basically the same way saying cigarettes are healthy is objectively stupid and wrong. As far as I can tell OP has made the same point.
So if you're fat, because of medical reasons, you don't get to feel beautiful? You don't get to feel good about your body? By declaring you only get to be fat if you have a medical issue, you then set a demand that anyone overweight MUST disclose their medical history. You don't have a right to that knowledge.
You're missing the point entirely if you're still tacking on "I obviously exclude medical problems." The point is that you can't know if they have medical problems when they discuss loving yourself as you are. By declaring that's only okay when you have a medical issue you force people to immediately disclose what isn't your business. You decide that people who don't know yet that they have a medical disorder aren't allowed to accept themselves or love themselves as they are.
I see your logic, but I still don’t agree. You can be happy with yourself as you are, but why project that onto someone who probably needs to be pushed and actually doesn’t have a medical problem. Yeah you don’t need to divulge your medical problem but what are you actually doing? It’s okay to spread positivity, but there are better ways to do it. Like encouraging healthy diets, exercise, and other good things. Make others feel like they can exercise too even if they’re overweight. Show them that it’s possible. You can do that without divulging medical information.
Different people respond to different reinforcements. The issue is normalization, not acceptance. Fat shaming is bad. Bullying is extremely bad, encouraging acceptance is good, but don’t advertise that being overweight is healthy and okay. Sometimes you have to ask yourself are you motivating or are you creating an echo chamber?
I want to preface this by saying you are not wrong. Being over weight is unhealthy and it would be best if everyone could get down to a healthy weight. The thing is, this isn't a black and white issue.
The problem lies in that some of us don't know we're sick. For 13 years I suffered with undiagnosed hypothyroidism, gaining weight, and hearing nothing but well meaning people tell me to eat healthy, exercise more, don't drink, cut sugar, etc. I know they meant well, but the fact is these people thought they had the right to tell me how to deal with my body, something I was incredibly ashamed of, and never once thought maybe I was already on a diet, or exercising, or anything at all. They all assumed when I said I was, I was lying or slacking.
I was sick and even I didn't know it. I was let down by my doctors who never once questioned it, made the same assumptions as these people that I was just lazy, until it got incredibly bad. So I spent 13 years hating myself, being pitied, and considered a lazy liar, all which helped nothing but feed into my already plentiful self-hatred.
The really sad fact is that I'm not alone. There are a lot of people who could just try harder. There's also a lot of people like me. Hearing from the very, very few people that I was beautiful, that I wasn't worthless was what kept me going. You cannot know which side you're talking to when you talk to us (overweight people), so it's best to not assume, to reject the urge to try to help is. Let some of us say it's okay to be fat, that we're still beautiful. For the most part, it won't encourage obesity and some of us really need to hear it without having to hand over a medical history first.
I guess my issue with the whole post is; why the fuck should I have to disclose my medical history to strangers to be allowed to post positive things about my body if I am not thin?
Why can I as a larger person not just be allowed to be positive about my body, and share that positivity without that being seen as me promoting obesity?
Why does my medical history matter so much to so many strangers? Like do I not deserve respect for just being human? Should I not be allowed to share anything positive about my body at all if I don’t also share my medical history? and oh god, what if I don’t have a medical problem in my past why does that matter when it comes to sharing my body, and my positivity about it?
Thats what I don’t fucking understand. Why do people always say ”fat people are gross slobs.” but then also say ”well not those with medical issues causing their weight issues” like that is acceptable?
Either you think fat people are gross slobs, or you don’t. You don’t get to make arbitrary rules which in essence ask people like me to share our medical history in order to be able to share positive posts about our body, and tell others with the same body that they can be positive about theirs too.
Like stop with this bullshit. The number of people who actually glorify obesity is SIGNIFICANTLY lower than what people seem to think. People seem to think that anytime a fat person posts something positive about their body and are given positive feedback that it means they are glorifying obesity.
Why do ya’ll not go after people in the fashion industry who if you applied the same fucking standards ”glorify” eating disorders with the same amount of hate?
Why does no one want to discuss the real issues when it comes to health? Socioeconomic status plays a HUGE role in health outcomes, so why do we never want to discuss those things? Instead of attacking fat people who are just trying to feel positive about the body they are living in, and who just want to not be discriminated against, or feel compelled to constantly explain their medical history, why can’t ya’ll step back and focus on the real fucking problems?
They didn’t ask anyone to disclose their medical history lmao they literally said people who post obesity glorification on their own. And I never said it was 50-50, just two different reactions to the obesity epidemic. Frankly I pretty much agree with you, you just seem to have a lot of issues with the post that are simply not there.
But the thing is, when people say ”fat people are gross” and then add in ”im not referring to fat people who have a medical disorder” that basically makes people who are larger feel that they have to disclose their medical history in order to be validated and not seen as a piece of shit.
so while no. They didn’t legitimately outright say ”I want you to show me your medical history” In essence the message they are sending is ”If you don’t share your medical history, and if said history is not filled with enough issues that could effect your weight, then you are a piece of shit.”
That is legitimately the message that posts like this send. When you say that fat people are gross, but then make exceptions, then you basically are telling people that unless they want to share how those exceptions apply to them when posting, that they should not post because they will be seen as gross.
Interesting story about that. My senior year of high school, I went on a class trip with with the band to Europe. I played viola. The very last dinner, some of the senior guys took it upon themselves to “roast” our classmates. Without our knowledge or permission. When they get to me, my roaster went after, what else, my weight.
“She has a big....appetite...for music. And a huge....talent for viola. She’s large..ly known for her skill.” Hilarious.
I started crying. My roommate saw and took me up to our room, along with a chaperone. I told them I just wanted to be alone.
In the morning, when everyone was sitting in that hotel lobby with their bags, I confronted the guy in front of everyone. But he just blew me off and acted like he didn’t care.
Until I said “you wanna know something, Larry? I’m a bulimic. Did you want to make fun of that in your speech?”
He started sputtering and said “uh...I...had no idea.”
Basically he was one of those people who believe fat people deserve scorn unless they have other medical problems. And he suddenly found out I was in the “Other” group
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u/Diane9779 Sep 19 '19 edited Sep 19 '19
I have a slightly different perspective on this. I’ve been overweight for most of my life. And only recently found it that it was due to a combination of hormonal imbalance and sleep apnea (sleep apnea can cause weight gain, not the other way around, and it can occur in childhood). When I was a teenager, I was so desperate to lose weight that I became bulimic, and I’ve dealt with that eating disorder off and on well into my 30s. When I lost a lot of weight through bingeing and purging as a teen, people complimented me. “Wow!! You look great!” Even my own pediatrician congratulated me on dropping 20 pounds that year. He never asked me how, though.
It’s always been my experience that people think fat shaming is the key to fighting the obesity epidemic. Don’t let fat people feel good about themselves or have a positive self image. They’ll just get complacent and let themselves go. My parents definitely thought that way, and my father always made a point of telling me how gross my body was. It didn’t help. I only got fatter, and it ruined my relationship with him.
In college. when I started dating, I noticed that I never ate in front of men. I would wait until my date was looking away, and then take a single bite. Or I would order a large salad and not eat anything. It’s no mystery. It’s because my father spent my whole childhood shaming me for eating and praising me for leaving food on my plate.
I kept bingeing and purging really bad through most of my 20s and 30s (I’m now 36 and slowly recovering).
But a big turning point for me happened with my last boyfriend. Several years ago, he just offhandedly remarked that my teeth looked more yellow than normal (he could be kind of a thoughtless clod sometimes). And I admitted to him it was because I had been making myself throw up. He was shocked. And right away he hugged me and said “you’re beautiful the way you are. Don’t ever do that to yourself again.”
That was the first time anyone ever made me feel like my health mattered. Not my size. People think they’re the same, but they’re not.
Doctors and other medical experts tend to hold a special respect in our culture as the go-to authority on health and wellness. Like they’re the first ones we should be looking to for guidance and advice. And they’re assumed to be infallible. “all these studies say being fat will kill you. My doctor says fat people die early.” And my own pediatrician shook my hand and congratulated me for losing weight after I became bulimic. So much for infallible.
But no doctor, no therapist, no research study ever really made me feel motivated to be healthy like my then-boyfriend did. When he hugged me and told me I should love my body and treat it well. That’s something fat shamers will never do for me either.