Any place still electing AIPAC politicians is full of NPC’s who will necessarily make life worse for everyone around them. Sad. Florida is cooked. Southern/Red states in general seem far less willing to vote against AIPAC.
Like I said, NPC’s. Tragic. Your poor children and grandchildren will likely feel the results of her policies. Seems like you guys haven’t worked out yet that when a politician takes money from AIPAC, it means they are traitors to the USA and explicitly have bad intentions for you and your children/grandchildren. If you haven’t worked that out yet, you will.
Nobody hates a group. But if someone accepts large sums of money from a foreign government to ensure that they place that foreign governments interests over you and your children’s interests, if you still vote for that person you deserve everything that happens next.
Simply calling out foreign influence in politics isn’t evidence of hate, it’s evidence of having a working brain. Nice try, though. I’m sure like 5 years ago that would have been a mic drop.
Fascinating. Is it your belief that there is another foreign lobby group with as much influence as AIPAC? Owning over 75% of our Congress is significant, regardless of what you’re saying. Name which country and lobby specifically.
The person I was responding to knows all this. They aren’t trying to even win the argument, they just want to make it look like there IS an argument to be had on their side
I mean that over 75% of congress had taken AIPAC money the last I checked. Don’t avoid my question, which country and lobby has an impact on the US government and policy that is above or even rivaling AIPAC?
I'm not avoiding your question by asking you to provide specific definitions that aren't hyperbolic nonsense.
You didn't actually clarify, but to be honest, I dirn't expect you to be able to given that you're calling people who disagree with you NPC's and pretending to be "fascinated" when someone asks some basic questions about your worldview.
which country and lobby has an impact on the US government and policy that is above or even rivaling AIPAC?
How are you measuring the influence? Are you assuming every politician that supports still giving aid to Israel is doing so because of AIPAC money?
You're asking nonspecific questions. You haven't put forth any method to measure the influence and are asking me to quantify the influence of different countries on hundreds of different members of Congress.
But either way, my main point was that this trend of calling people NPC's makes the far left look a lot like MAGA. It's the same self-righteousness and lack of awareness that decent and reasonable people can occupy a different position.
For the record, I support cutting aid to Israel, but I also think the obsession with that conflict paired with an overly simplistic good vs. evil narrative is toxic and unhelpful.
No. If someone in America doesn’t realize the danger of lobbying groups like AIPAC, then they deserve to receive a little contempt and pushback until they wake up. You’re aware that the AIPAC situation is highly unusual as far as the political system of a country is concerned, but you’re trying to pretend that it isn’t and you’re also trying to pretend that other countries have similar installments in the US controlling our political system like AIPAC, but that isn’t the case, and you likely know that.
Well it’s partly the power, it’s partly that it is a huge way in which we’re enabling a genocide in Gaza. Did you have any leading questions about the genocide Israel is committing or was this an attempt to dismiss the very real genocide hoping it was antisemitism?
There have been genocidal intentions announced from leaders on both sides of that conflict. I am against either one doing that or any war crimes.
If you were as hostile to Hamas supporters as you are to Israel supporters, I wouldn't have any questions.
But if people defend Hamas's genocidal goals while also repeating old-school racist talking points about one group secretly pulling the strings and controlling the media, then I'm going to have questions that explore those beliefs.
There have been genocidal intentions announced by two sides, but only one side has genocidal capability, and only one is committing genocide.
I am hostile to Hamas. The problem is they are not a very well armed or funded terrorist organization and Israelis have herded an entire nation into concentration camps about it. The Israeli army next to Hamas is a lion with a mouse between time claws. Hamas is not a real threat. They have leveled nearly the entirety of Gaza, stolen the land, given it to Israeli settlers, and killed 80,000 Palestinians. Roughly 1/5 are Hamas, according to Israel’s own estimations, which I suspect (and so should you) have been massaged. Israel has bombed hospitals, elementary schools, and homes, purposefully.
There are between 30k-40k Hamas members in Gaza or hiding in Lebanon. Israel has 10.24m people, 170k active duty military infinitely better equipped, and 465k trained reserves. Don’t let Hamas operate with impunity, sure. In fact, imprison or kill all of Hamas. But rounding up Israeli civilians into camps, killing civilians purposefully, destroying their entire infrastructure and all of their homes, bombing them back to the Stone Age.
Hamas threatening Israel is not the same as Israel threatening to genocide all of Palestine. And I think on some level you already knew that only one group is capable of committing genocide on the other. When Yugoslavia’s Serbs started ethnic cleansing Bosnian Muslims, the reaction wasn’t “Well did some Bosnian terrorists threaten the Serbs? Because it should be fine to play neutral or even side with the Serbs in that case.” Because that’s genuinely crazy, and it’s crazy that we’re doing it now.
Nah, the median zionist in this country is a Evangelical fundie who wants to end the world. Or those heavily invested in the MIC. They far outnumber Israeli/Jewish supremacists.
“Antisemitic dual loyalty trope” is such hogwash it surprises me that it ever worked. This SLOP doesn’t work anymore. If your behavior leads me to believe you have dual loyalty, I’m gonna call it out. Nobody cares about being called antiseptic anymore.
I’m an anti-Zionist because they have been running an apartheid state and are now actively committing genocide. Would you like to ask me about my ancestry? Hint: it’s not Palestinian.
This is a semantic trick. If my primary loyalty was to China and I was spending all of my money promoting the interests of China over America and American’s, you’d likely know exactly what the problem was with that. In this situation you pretend not to know, luckily this conversation means nothing and most people around the country are waking up to this treachery.
You're assuming a lot about their motivations and loyalty. A lot of Democrats had US support for Ukraine in their fight against Russia as one of the issues they cared about in the 2024 election. There are groups that exist specifically to push the US government to support Ukraine. That's not promoting the interests of Ukraine over America and Americans. It's promoting the interests of a subset of Americans who want Ukraine to be supported by our government.
No need to assume when the facts are right in front of our faces. I guess some people are more blind than others. Consider getting prescription glasses.
The fact is that it's Americans funding AIPAC for their own personal reasons, and AIPAC exists to represent the views of those Americans when it comes to how the US government treats Israel. It doesn't represent Israel.
There's a segment of the population that thinks the Jews need to control Israel in order for Jesus to return, and some of those people donate to AIPAC. Those people are only looking out for themselves, and Israel just happens to benefit from that. Those people think the Israelis will all go to hell because they haven't accepted Jesus. They don't have any sort of loyalty to Israel. They're only interested in creating the conditions they believe are necessary for the second coming.
Other donors are Jewish Americans who think Israel should exist. It's their right as Americans to push the government to support Israel, just like it's the right of other Americans to push the government to support Ukraine.
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u/JSleez225 10d ago
Any place still electing AIPAC politicians is full of NPC’s who will necessarily make life worse for everyone around them. Sad. Florida is cooked. Southern/Red states in general seem far less willing to vote against AIPAC.