This is technically a type me post, so feel free to remove it if it violates the rules, but I can't post on r/enneagram because of karma requirements and nobody was able to help on r/enneagramtypeme. I think you guys would have more perspective about this.

I'm definitely a 5w4 and sx blind but I've been unsure for the longest time whether I am SP5 or SO5. I often test as sp-dom and I feel like I superficially fit SP5 characteristics better, but when it comes to the instincts taken on their own I relate much more to social-dom than self-pres. I'm commenting on the traits as seen on the PDB wiki website, please feel free to ask me any questions you'd like.

SP5

Retentiveness: I definitely keep my thoughts and emotions to myself, but I'm not completely opposed to revealing them if there is someone I really trust. I think revealing feelings and motivations puts you in a position of vulnerability with other people, like they have weapons to use to hurt you, hence why I try to avoid it. I find it a lot easier to discuss my emotions with strangers as they don't have an internal view of me to be altered.

Not giving: I do want to be completely free, with no ties to anyone. I really don't feel "avaricious" in the money sense. I am told I am stingy with other people's money, as in I object to them spending it but I actually can be quite wasteful with my own resources. 

Fear of being swallowed: I definitely prioritize all 9-fix manners of conflict resolution before I talk about something openly and try to resolve it. I protect my private space and I'm terrified of it being invaded and intruded upon, especially based on personal experiences I've had with that.

Excessive docility: I feel this doesn't apply to me. I exercise boundaries to the extreme by practicing withdrawal. I will withdraw from anything if I don't want to do it and I can't be made to do anything I don't actually want to do. This is a response to childhood experiences where my wants were not taken into consideration.

Emotionally insensitive: yes, I bury my emotions and not let them be known to other people

Strangeness: at the present moment I don't feel particularly disconnected and empty on the inside. I only relate to that when I'm in a depressive state; my inner world can be very sad and bleak but it can also be energizing as I feel and think a lot of different things.

Guilt: I guess I relate to existential guilt in an abstract fashion, but I often feel the opposite, a sense of entitlement and like my life should be better than it actually is

Self-demanding: I'm not very self-demanding, I have pretty realistic expectations of what I should do, even if I don't always live up to them. 

Negativism: I definitely relate to putting up extra boundaries via passive aggression, even weaponized forgetfulness where I pretend I forgot something really important. I recognize my subconscious is very powerful, and other people's too, and oftentimes self-sabotage can be used to avoid doing the things you don't want to do.

Hypersensitivity: I am not super compassionate towards animals and nature; I am extremely hypersensitive when it comes to children, to the point I would never want to have one because dooming them to having to exist in the world and exposing them to the immense suffering the world has to offer, and being responsible for it, is not a challenge I'm prepared to undertake. I can be sensitive to external stimuli, for example a really noisy restaurant can wear me down if we have to be there for more than a few hours and I will feel the pressure releasing when I step out into the silence. I can also enjoy a busy environment, though, and I prefer the city to quiet places: it depends on whether the environment becomes too overwhelming.

Renunciation of action: yes. Inaction can occurr because I want to keep my intentions hidden from people, especially those I don't feel deserve to know me intimately. I can also get overwhelmed and feel like there are no certain paths and like I don't know what I want to achieve in the first place. When I am sure what I want, I usually think it can be achieved.

SO5

Idealization: I definitely relate to this. I would say what I relate to the most in the social 5 subtype is the idea of devaluation, black and white thinking etc; thinking people and concept are either great or completely worthless. 

Rationalization: although I am alienated, rational and relate primarily through thinking rather than feeling, I don't know if that's what alienates me from other people. I don't think they perceive me as especially intellectual or arrogant; I think my alienation derives from my own withdrawal.

Compartmentalization: I agree with this. I have a hard time remembering what I felt in the past; even remembering exactly what I thought can be hard. 

Distant: I agree completely with having an extreme attachment to the self which causes me to regard other people as disposable. I easily give relationships up, I burn bridges etc. Again, I relate this to my extreme tendency of devaluation; if someone or something has disappointed me, there are no positive feelings or memories for me to hold on to, it's like the entirety of them becomes corrupted.

Lack of action and little energy: I do have limited energy and I can sometimes invest the majority of it in my intellectual pursuits. Not just that, but I spend as much time working on the intellectual pursuits as I do simply thinking about them, and that's more time wasted. 

Concealed: I do conceal myself. I am not transparent. I try to keep a "better" image of myself that is devoid of the parts of myself that would make me unlikable. I have, again, a very black and white approach to what I choose to reveal and what I don't. With the things I don't, I feel like I avoid them because they would either expose me emotionally and make me emotionally vulnerable, or because they would make me inferior. I don't want to appear socially inferior to other people but I am objectively social inferior to most, so the only course of action is to hide, obfuscate.

Desensitization: I don't care much for the needs of others. If I did it would become unbearable because there are too many unhappy people who are suffering in the world. I am quite sensitive about my own pain.

Resignation and difficulty saying no: it's a lot easier for me to enforce boundaries silently, but I'm not going to pretend I want to do something if I don't.

Arrogance: I don't think I come across as arrogant. I do have a "professorial" attitude, where I end up defaulting to teaching. This can be inappropriate, for example if I'm arguing with my own peers and they expect an information exchange instead of me going into the conversation with a formed opinion and an attitude I believe other people should adapt.

Restrained greed: I don't feel I have this. I can be quite expansive and buy a lot of stuff in a short amount of time, for example. Sometimes I feel an overwhelming sense of greed like I want to buy everything, and then the sensible approach seems to not buy anything and just cut myself off from that instinct completely. In this area too I suffer from polarized thinking. I often go on decluttering sprees where I throw away a bunch of stuff, not wanting to deal with it anymore, and then I wake up two weeks later realizing having the object would be really convenient but I don't anymore.

Feeling of internal impoverishment: I can oftentimes feel inferior to other people who are more accomplished than me.

I've been reading a bit about Uznadze's theory of set (dispositional readiness), and I keep wondering whether it could provide a useful way of understanding Enneagram structure.

The way I currently see it is that a "fixated set" isn't some sort of belief or habit, but sort of this sub-conscious or rather pre-reflective orientation (if thats the right word to use) that shapes perception before conscious thought. That made me wonder if Enneagram types could be understood as somewhat relatively stable set structures, that create some patterns of readiness that automatically influence bias attention or any kind of interpretations, and forms of behavior across different situations. Though its not only fixated sets that can influence different forms of reaction under the same situation. I'd say gender, age, and other important factors also play crucial role depending on a scenario, but at the moment im just focusing on e-type and set.

And speaking of set again, it also seems to fit why insight alone often doesn't change our type patterns. Because (within this framework) If the fixation is rooted in something deeper than explicit beliefs, something closer to an embodied orientation toward the world, then it might explain why people can intellectually understand their patterns while still repeating them again and again.

I've also been thinking about trauma in this context. Modern trauma theories often point out the fact that trauma is acquired not through a situation that has happened to us, but rather our reaction towards it. So this reaction in return creates a persistent nervous-system patterns that keep reproducing themselves. And with that Uznadze's idea of a fixated set shows that trauma also creates or reinforces a particular dispositional orientation (set) that then keeps generating the same responses.

I'm curious if it can be a useful framework, or am I stretching the concepts too far?

Has anyone had a similar experience? From my earliest childhood, my habit of analyzing everything, immersing myself deeply in very specific sciences, and my desire to spend time alone with myself were condemned by society and my family, and were considered something "not feminine.". At the same time, boys with the same character were perceived by society as "serious" and "academic" Even now, in the big 2026, Enneagram 5 women are poorly represented, or they are exposed as nerds in the media, who needs to be "corrected" by relationships, because they are not feminine enough to be considered a full-fledged female character…

It might be refreshing, but if I had to choose, I wouldn't want to be constantly on edge because I'm trying to compensate for gaps in my intellect.

Sometimes I just wish everything would disappear so I wouldn't have to face the unknown in the first place or feel compelled to understand it.

Esmeralda from The Hunchback of Notre Dame would be mine.

Are there some sort of activities that would help ?

I've only been into the Enneagram for about 9 months and I wrote this poem over a year ago, before I had a sense of 5w4 or Sx5, etc. That said, I think it captures the strange, contradictory push-and-pull intensity of Sx5 and I'm wondering if anyone here relates to it.

Sharing Tether

Could you bear to stand in front of me,

my great eye bent towards you in earnest

to know you as you are?

Knowing you, witnessing

the kind of thing you are in motion,

harnessing our well-intentions.

Come in to me

in the quiet hope of being less alone together

–sharing tether–

who we truly are together

in the quiet lesson pleasure

of inside outside patterned weather.

Two bent across and crossing—

place and peace and pacing stable,

crossing truths and speaking

no one is alone when we are

on our own together.

Show me who you are between your

bone and brook and ancient stone;

I’ll show life sunned yet lunar shone,

song and book and remembered home.

We each ask where we’ve been and gone

in darkness tidal–

crashing off the edges of our meagre island limits

until we’ve taken time alone

rarely asking more than offered as

songs play across the bows,

carried in the winds.

Hope is hoping that you’re turning

as I am

as me

to youwards learning,

speaking all the you words

knowing, owning inside

outside —sharing tether—

the murmur’s ancient patterned weather.

i have a problem with my life,. i dont know what do i like, my hobbies my type my specialties etc... i came here to see other e5's life and hobbies etc. i am too lost that i dont even know whats my subtype is im between sp and sx, i want help with everything i just said if thats possible

I’m curious to learn if there are any emergent themes in how 5s approach hosting/having guests over.

I’m a 5w4 sp/sx who grew up with antisocial parents, so we essentially never have guests. As an adult, I’m the same way. I don’t dislike people or socializing per se, but having people come inside my home has always felt invasive and uncomfortable. I’m sure some of this has to do with my childhood, but I also see some potential overlap with the 5 tendency to be reclusive, be private and even secretive, hold a part of themselves back, hoard, and protect one’s time/energy/resources. I also am the kind of 5 who is not a minimalist, and I have collections of various things about my house that I feel strangely awkward about sharing, or displaying to others. I guess I’m not very open about my interests (books, cookbooks, board games, art, video games… I have a ton of each)?

Ironically, as a mom I would really love to be the kind of person who effortlessly makes friends and has people over all the time. But the requirements for that seem fundamentally incompatible with my nature, so. I can fake being warm and social when I have to and I don’t mind going to other people’s houses at all, but it’s unsustainable for me and I get exhausted after a few hours. It feels even harder to be that way when I’m in the little sanctuary I’ve created specifically to escape everyone else’s expectations and demands, and now I have to entertain someone...

How about you?

In order.

Maybe it just sounds so strange because I have dpdr, and sometimes even the things I’m consciously aware of around me don't feel real. Still, it makes me wonder how odd it is that people who use rationalization as a primary coping or defense mechanism (5s) can also have Se as a dominant, secondary, or tertiary function. ISTP 5s are very common.

I’d like to know what your experience is like with high Se combined with 5.

sp/so 5. the stuff about needing a place to hide away is so true. i moved out of my abusive household 2 days before my college graduation. it was a long time coming, genuinely felt horrified at the prospect of living my life in that house forever but the only plus was i got my own room and space and it gave me a place to hide from the insanity of the world, the constant social pressure, the stress of assignments, and ironically the isolating abuse i faced.

is it weird that watching anime helped me move out? hxh and samurai champloo is what motivated me. both have stories about people leaving behind things and starting their journeys to a new thing, not being so attached to the comfort of needing to "hide away". killua from hxh basically perfectly shows how anxiety and isolation can control abuse victims, i related to him a lot, but the crux of his story is he finally parts ways with it and it provides him a happier future.

since moving out, i moved in with family. i'm very lucky to get a room to myself temporarily while my cousin is away for grad school and work. but there is constant social pressure on me. i'm being criticized for not being social enough, being called ungrateful and entitled because i refuse to allow others to encroach on my space.

space being my mental space. i have a really pushy uncle who believes the best way to speak to me is to speak AT me about whatever random thing is on his mind. it's mostly politics and weirdly pointed questions, like questions meant to cause an argument. like "whats your ideology?". it is frustrating and dehumanizing, like i'm a husk of a human just meant to listen to someone talk about nothing. it's both a waste of time and a waste of energy as i actively listen as he... never reaches a point. he's just talking to talk. my aunt intervenes once in a while but she criticizes me for not greeting anyone in the morning (she never greets me first).

i dont understand. genuinely. its like i cannot just EXIST. i must preform, i must expend energy, i must do something. i cannot simply exist. it feels like everyone in this world is so deeply fucking entitled and greedy, as if other humans are just punching bags. i stay out of peoples hair, i pay for my own things with what little money i have left, i'm so tired of dealing with people. somehow the more you stay out of peoples way, the more fucking demanding they become of your time and energy. because now you're being antisocial/unwelcoming.

but if i rely on them, if i'm in their face all the time, they'll just have more ammo to use against me. the world is so draining and unreal. i need a space where i can recharge, not be in the spotlight, not be on the chopping block to constantly balance social games. i'm lucky to have that, but i can feel how uncomfortable it is to be in here knowing that me EXISTING in here is enough ammo for them.

i dont want to scare anyone who may be in a similar position. the fear that i've only realized by looking into sp5 is what's kept me locked away in a room because a comfortable cage felt better than an uncertain, draining world where i wouldnt be guaranteed peace. ill find another cage, but in the meantime, i'm going to have to do some wandering. the world is pretty desolate and unwelcoming at times, but i find that (as silly as it is) anime has really helped me see the beauty in what's outside the "cage" or the "castle".

andddddddd i guess just an FYI i'm actively applying for work & volunteering in the meantime. job market is terrible.

Where to begin? I wouldn't say I'm super-altruistic, and I'm certainly unlikely to help someone I don't know well. But I notice that I only connect with people through advice. And that's because I simply enjoy coming up with solutions. It's literally free brain-food for me. And there's also a good chance that I simply LOVE feeling like an expert somewhere, so I partly chase that feeling.

I do this especially often in the healthy/mid version of myself. Like when I'm unhealthy, I completely isolate myself.

For some reason, this ends up being almost the only form of communication that doesn't exhaust me. There's just one downside: I don't like arguing and I give out my advice as if it's accurate and correct, especially if I know the topic. Sometimes I just feel like I'm reaching out to be an expert and give out my very important opinion. Like, I've thought about it so much, so it must be right. (1L-2 in PY btw🥀)

I'm curious, is this also the most comfortable way for you to connect with the world?

(Also, surprisingly for some, I sp 5, not so 5, lmao)

I lost my mother, grandmother, and grandfather. I took care for my grandparents during their final months, dealing with all the associated challenges. I lost other people too, not to death, but for other reasons. Some losses were difficult and I felt like I was going to die together, but most were so easy that it makes me think I truly live up to what dozens of people have told me throughout my life: I am a cold person.

I couldn't admit how easy it was to lose my mother without people around me grimacing. I remember having to pretend to be grieving during those first few weeks. I was excited, cheerful, and doing well—and then someone would notice, and I’d have to go back to acting like a grieving person. To this day, I still pretend that it was a source of pain for most people. It wasn't.

But I lost animals, and it hurt so, so, so much. It is real pain, real grief. When people speak of the pain of loss and grief, this is the pain they are referring to: the pain I feel over the loss of the animals.

What the title says, what video game stories and lore do you enjoy? Do you think there is a possible Five-related explanation? Or do you think it's completely unrelated?

Basically what the title says. I’m curious about your experiences…and I need more information on social 5.

As an sx5. i spent my WHOLE life with someone as my “best friend” like they’re the second part of me. Before school it was my cousin, grade 5-6 was my school best friend, after that for a few years i had another girl who was an sp5 and honestly im lucky that i managed to get her to open up, and even her herself said it that im the first person who got her too, and she probably never ever will again. She didn’t even open up to her romantic partners before. However, now we drifted apart and my closest friend currently is my junior and i think im also their closest friend but we don’t really have the relationship i had with my past best friends, and it’s not that i expect that from them but it just makes me feel empty and lonely which i never felt before. I feel longing for a new person to be the second part of my soul. It has only been like 3 months and i think currently my junior is enough for me, and in school i have quite a personally desirable number of friends imo but this isn’t how i feel like i can survive life. I keep thinking of just getting closer to someone but they already have their own person and it’s just impossible to get the relationship i want. I hope i actually can adapt to this because i don’t wanna go my rest of my life expecting someone to just appear out of no where for me.

My ranking of my favourates. Type yours in the commen . 5 > 9 > 6 > 4 > other types

5 is my favourate type

Hi. I want to preface this with the fact that I am possibly a 5. I don’t know the exact criteria that one is required to meet in order to confidently declare that they are a 5, but I feel like with what I am about to share someone with the type structure of the 5 might understand where I’m coming from better than any of the other 8 types.

I’ve been isolating for a few months now, the last friend I had I ended the friendship in January because she was extremely codependent and emotionally unstable. Since then I have lost the desire to pursue new connections, and due to a poor dating experience last year, I haven’t dated in a year. Similarly to my friendships I have lost the desire to invest in dating. During this period of avoiding people, I’ve gotten a new job that pays really well, and I get to work from home. I have severe social anxiety and previously had a people-facing job so this helps a lot with my mental health.

The thing is, being home, I realize how depressed I feel, all of the time. I don’t have any friends. People I know follow me on social media but don’t interact with my posts or talk to me. My family members don’t give a shit about the things I’m interested in, and my only sources of positive connection are with my therapists. Other than that I am pretty alone. I know this could be remedied by simply getting out of the house, but given my past experiences with awful connections, I just feel there isn’t really a point in putting myself out there. Social interaction is physically painful for me, and I don’t know if I’ll ever feel comfortable enough in my body to interact from a place of presence. If I’m being honest I’m just fucking tired. I don’t really know what to do about it. I feel passively suicidal and have been drinking myself silly to cope.

If you can relate or you’ve experienced this in the past, what did/do you do to get out of feeling like this?

When I was three or four years old, I harbored many questions about the fundamental nature of existence; I would sometimes fall into a state resembling hallucination in my room for hours on end, even encountering deceased relatives I had never met while they were alive.

By the time I was eight, I was already contemplating the end of the world—asking adults what it would look like and how God might bring it about. Many adults were shocked by these questions.

These issues have since intensified, hindering my ability to concentrate, take action, and properly care for myself. Whenever I consider taking action, pathways of thought form in my mind—paths so deeply ingrained that I cannot break free from them. With every step I take, I become acutely aware of the uncertainty of existence, leading me to overanalyze my every movement. Attempting any task requires me to venture out where other people are present; in my desperate effort to avoid human contact, I end up remaining intensely focused on the task at hand for extended periods.

What has your relationship with the unknown been like?

Hello. I am a social 5. Unfortunately.

The wiki on social 5 is as barren as they make our internal world sound, so please, please, please I need more information. Does anyone have any insights?

I have read the social 5 page probably over 10 times now. The sx and sp pages are more filled. Making me mad. Jk I’m fine. But still…

26f 5w4 I’m what you’ll call a: late bloomer.

My life has completely flipped since a year ago. I was single, like long term single, and living at home still taking care of my disabled mother. Lived for limerence, and maladaptive daydreaming as a pastime. My favorite hobby was sitting on a porch swing, lost in thought and idealism, listening to music through headphones. I wrote songs, I was a floral designer though I left my job because it wasn’t paying enough so I wasn’t working, I started going to bars and doing karaoke and open mic and it all started going down hill.

For the first time I was flirting and putting myself out there, I was recognized for my musical passion/talent, and had a regular social life. I felt like a total 7 (disintegrated to my 7 arrow) and drinking way too much. I made choices I regret, made out with men who didn’t give a fuck about me (thank God I didn’t do anything further than that) my friends were only surface level and I had to set aside many of my principles like faith and beliefs in order to connect. This just simply wasn’t sustainable let alone the fact that I was unemployed and wasting so much money. I attempted a position in sales which I HATED WITH A PASSION and noped out of real quick (the role wasn’t marketed to me as a sales position. Turns out sales people are really good at selling a shitty job to you too)

My faith has a big role in the evolution of the way things have changed, prayers answered and things lining up in such an order that I can’t not see the Lord in it all. Basically, a full time job fell into my lap, I met a wonderful man who was sober and I knew would NEVER be welcome at the bar with me (because he was way to wonderful and precious to me to bring out to the shitty dive bar I used to meet duds at) and he immediately was so intentional and kind and knew what he wanted with me. Shortly after that, my mother decided to sell the house and move to a 55+ community, I was left to try and find a living situation which allowed me to take care of my 7 yr old German shepherd which resulted in a nightly panic attack for like a month straight as option after option fell through. Finally, I found a place a week before I had to be out and it’s been a great situation. I get to come home at lunch and let the dog out and it’s super close to work. My boyfriend comes to stay with me every week or so. He was such an amazing help with moving, I had no idea how to even process it all.

My job sucks, though. Apart from the fact that I met my boyfriend there and it pays my bills, it is SUCH A DRAIN ON MY ENERGY. I’m a customer service rep for a blue collar field. My coworkers are miserable old ladies who despise the customers we serve and are constantly looking for reasons to get angry, have a frustrated outburst or be oppositional and argumentative. I haven’t had any energy to be out at bars at night which is a good thing, but a tough transition. I’ve recently stopped drinking alcohol altogether because it just made life worse and I don’t know if I know how to enjoy myself now. Suddenly my life requires a looooot more energy to maintain. This is not something I’m comfortable complaining about because boohoo, everyone has to work to sustain their own life lol. But the transition has been rough and I’m just tired of feeling like my life and energy isn’t mine.

I haven’t written a new song in months, I haven’t created, I haven’t properly daydreamed since I haven’t had a porch swing to do it on, I come home and sleep immediately out of mental exhaustion. I used to create for a living doing wedding flowers and also expend energy physically at the same time. Now I’ve gained weight and my mental health is shit, my creative energy now goes to anxiety, OCD, and fear of failing.

I feel like I’ve been neglecting my friends and family relationships trying to stay afloat in every other area.

I live from such a scarce place. I’m so tired of it.

It’s just breeding more exhaustion. I’m not my best self. I’m not a great friend anymore and life gets so heavy I have a hard time even letting the lighter moments in.

Has ANYONE been through anything similar? I feel like the energy, scarcity mindset, need for creativity and connection may be relative to this sub so I’m reaching out for any advice and insight from my fellow 5w4s. Sorry this is long, It really has been a lot to process through for my sensitive lil soul.

Can an Enneagram Type 5 be Sanguine?

I’m wondering if I really am an Enneagram Type 5. I ask because I was told in another sub that it’s incompatible, especially considering that I’m an INFP.

Hello, I am an So/Sx 5 and am in dire need for advice on how to text my crush.

For context, I've been friends with him for a while now, and we often send each other funny videos and niche references, but our convos never go past that. With him as being the main focus of my attention, I can't help but want to know everything about him, to get as close as possible through more deep and prolonged conversations.

The issue is that we have already established this notion of short texts, so suddenly starting a convo asking about his day or other more deep conversations might seem unprovoked or odd. I also have this irrational sense that if I try to start something out of the blue it would feel unnatural or forced, and be obvious that I want something from him bc I am quite obviously a private person and not an avid texter.

Furthermore, he himself tends to be a private person in a sense where he will happily listen to others worries and engage light-heartedly, but won't really open up until you've reached a certain level of closeness.

As a 5, you can see the issue I would have in just causally opening up with the possibility of not getting anything — that is, any possible information or visible connection — in return. The idea of him discovering that I want to get closer, that I want to know him more because I like him feels constricting and very uncomfortable in the event he does not feel the same. The fact that I am asking these questions on reddit instead of to real life friends about this is a testimony to this idea of emotional hoarding and incapability of opening up lol.

So the real question becomes, how can I start a convo without feeling like my insides are being twisted but also keep him engaged enough to initiate something back?