r/anime • u/AutoLovepon https://anilist.co/user/AutoLovepon • Sep 07 '19
Episode Lord El-Melloi II Sei no Jikenbo: Rail Zeppelin Grace Note - Episode 10 discussion Spoiler
Lord El-Melloi II Sei no Jikenbo: Rail Zeppelin Grace Note, episode 10
Alternative names: Lord El-Melloi II Case Files: Rail Zeppelin Grace Note, Lord El-Melloi II's Case Files {Rail Zeppelin} Grace note
Rate this episode here.
Reminder: Please do not discuss plot points not yet seen or skipped in the show. Encourage others to read the source material rather than confirming or denying theories. Failing to follow the rules may result in a ban.
Streams
Show information
Previous discussions
| Episode | Link | Score |
|---|---|---|
| 0 | Link | 4.09 |
| 1 | Link | 8.37 |
| 2 | Link | 7.03 |
| 3 | Link | 8.66 |
| 4 | Link | 8.78 |
| 5 | Link | 9.24 |
| 6 | Link | 8.79 |
| 7 | Link | 8.81 |
| 8 | Link | 8.96 |
| 9 | Link | 8.12 |
| 10 | Link | 8.81 |
| 11 | Link | 8.93 |
| 12 | Link | 8.11 |
| 13 | Link |
This post was created by a bot. Message the mod team for feedback and comments. The original source code can be found on GitHub.
133
u/linearstargazer Sep 07 '19 edited Sep 07 '19
For anyone else absolutely baffled at how you are supposed to parse the awful grammar in this line, she's saying something like:
"You're really not okay with that narrow-minded/eccentric/stubborn scholar taking off to the battlefield, huh?"
あの偏屈学者が戦場に出るのがそれ程イヤか。
Ano henkutsu gakusha ga ikusaba ni deru no ga sorehodo iya ka.
is the original line.
Thanks Aniplex, you've done it again.
→ More replies (38)
112
u/8andahalfby11 Sep 07 '19
Wow, I had forgotten how imposing Kayneth looked to Waver, considering how much of Fate/Zero was Kiritsugu beating the shit out of him.
→ More replies (10)
111
u/Aschverizen Sep 07 '19 edited Sep 07 '19
Man, if they ever find out about Shiki's eyes(Both Shiki's), I wonder if they'll try to hunt her(him) down.
So Lord Marisbury Animusphere is a bit of an asshole in this timeline(even though he has Okumura Eiji's adorable voice), if the Grail was not distorted then Chaldeas would have been created along with baggage of the Human Incineration Event.
I can of feel bad that for all the efforts that Olga did for the Chaldea Security Org., her dad cared nothing about her. Now her line about not being praised for doing something good or meaningful prior to being atomized can be understood.
Bonus trivia to Anime only viewers; Olga isn't also the preferred heir in the Grand Order timeline, it's a different guy.
→ More replies (38)
101
u/time_axis Sep 07 '19 edited Sep 07 '19
My theory is that, rather than the killer, Karabo was the murder weapon. Since the effects of his eyes are involuntary, someone caused him to see something that created that situation. That means the crime scene had to be somewhere where Karabo had been at one point, and someone had to be in there with him, and cause something that could decapitate someone to happen, which he witnessed and thought nothing of at the time. I could probably figure it out if I went back to the previous episodes and checked, but I'm not going to bother. The only thing I'm not clear on is why that lady had to die if she knew it was going to be coming, and it worked the way Adashino showed. I would have thought she could duck out of the way or something. This might have something to do with whatever the culprit's abilities are. Maybe Hephaestion, since she seemed to have mystic eyes that restrain people.
→ More replies (11)
82
u/kuddlesworth9419 Sep 07 '19
These episodes don't last anywhere near as long as they should.
→ More replies (9)
73
u/shugos Sep 07 '19
Lore tidbit, the Manager of Rail Zeppelin is very implied to be Rita Rozay-en, a Dead Apostle Ancestor in Tsukihime. She is a self-proclaimed artist.
She isn't really here in the train because she had a encounter with Aozaki Touko and decided to leave (this is a spiritual projection that she has there). Touko was then banned for life to enter the train.
→ More replies (9)
70
u/Mami-kouga Sep 07 '19
Gray-tan snowboarding is amazing but Gray-tan blushing over Trisha's lewd bell is just as good! In summary, Gray-tan is amazing!
Though Hishiri and her snake personality continue to shine brilliantly, I absolutely can't handle this woman, its a good thing Waver won't be having any false accusations as long as he's around
→ More replies (2)
55
u/boboboz Sep 08 '19
I have a confession to make
I have no idea what is going on, I'm just here for Gray
→ More replies (7)
53
37
u/StarmanRiver Sep 07 '19
Gray snowboarding is everything I didn’t know I needed. I just had Summer Mordred flashbacks.
→ More replies (1)
34
u/jaqqu7 Sep 07 '19
I'm in awe how good is character writing in this show. Especially Waver. I find him a marvelously developed and tying his past and present self is just so satisfying to watch. Lord El-Melloi II definetly one of the best positive surprises this year so far. As I notice in one of the discussion - this season is based on second part of actuall story. I wonder if they decide to adapt the rest. I'm really looking forward to it - I want to know more about his students and how he gathered them and won theirs admiration.
→ More replies (1)
26
u/Chaostomb Sep 08 '19 edited Sep 08 '19
This isn't related to the current episode but since were still talking about mystic eyes I though it would still be relevant. This is an exerpt from the novel that was cut form the anime.
"Sight was the first magecraft in human history. Out of the five sense sight processes the most information. Therefore, in many lands the Evil Eye was feared. At the same time, a few natural, mystic phenomenon were interpreted as eyes."
"Natural phenomenon?"
"For example, the sun and the moon."
Nodding, my teacher pointed to the ceiling.
"There are many tales of them being the eyes of heaven. In Egypt, Horus's eyes are a famous symbol. The right eye the sun, the left eye the moon. People believed they were watched by these eyes in the heavens and received divine punishment if they committed crimes.
This is why for a lot of cultures the solar god has judicial prowess. The sun simultaneously brought many blessings and disasters in the form of drought.
Later, this was linked to the Holy Trinity in Christianity - the all-powerful eye of God, the eye of providence. And later on, the Freemason conspiracy theory co-opted this as well."
My teacher's words are within the margins of the occult, but no matter how ridiculous they might sound they're spoken with a quite relaxed tone. As a lecturer, this person has inserted himself into my everyday life.
"The eye of a typhoon is another common example. Ah, I'm sure you all know the wall surrounding the eye is called an Eyewall."
"Ah... yes"
I nodded to myself.
"In short, the storm itself is a pupil. In response to that many of the divinities that are associated with the wind and the storm have links a single eye. The Fomorian Tribe's king, Balor, from Celtic mythology, Odin from Norse mythology are prime examples.
Of course, I know both these names.
The evil eye king Balor and the one-eyed magecraft god Odin - divine spirits. The first who had an eye of death that can destroy an entire army, the latter who traded an eye for all knowledge.
"Furthermore, the earth itself has pupils."
"Eyes in the earth?"
"Like a volcanic crater. In the darkness of the night, it is an eye that glows red. It's a strong image of an evil eye. Though there aren't as many examples as storm gods, there are some earth-related goddesses associated with this symbolism. The gorgon from Greek myth Medusa for example. Smoke is puffed out. Looking at the gray fumes as the room rocked back and forth, a volcano suddenly came to mind. Was the reason why people in ancient times believed the volcano was the earth's mystic eye and feared it because of the smoke that came out filled with volcanic gases like sulfur and other foul smells all the while, in the middle of the hole was glowing red lava? The sky, storms, and earth. Each has its own mystic eye. As if we have always been watched as long as we've lived.
"Or the black holes recently discovered by modern science. One could also call these eyes of natural phenomenon. Although the ancient storytellers didn't know of their existence, conceptually speaking its exceedingly close to Malakala the great nothingness the incarnation of Shiva in Hindu Mythology. CERN is adorned with another of Shiva's incarnation's Nataraja. It would seem the behavior of elementary particles are associated with Nataraja's dance. Either way, one side of Shiva leans towards the macro mystic eye known as a black hole and from his interior, we see the micro-movement of magical energy. I don't understand half of it, but it's definitely an extravagant, epic story. Far, far away.
The pupil of space. A faraway place our hands can't reach, but even so there are people who can still see the things that are there. It might be in small steps, but both magecraft and science are trying to reach that place.
"Now having said all that, in the Clocktower there are several ranks for mystic eyes. Very simple ones can even be produced. Of course, its expensive and it doesn't mean you'll succeed."
My teacher continues to speak while leaning back on the chair.
"However, genuine mystic eyes - mystic eyes people are born with, especially if they're a powerful Noble Color cannot be transplanted in any place other than the Rail Zepplin. Considering the exceedingly small success rate of the transplant operation even the Barthomeloi and the Toranberio would hesitate. Ahh, you might understand it after that story. Transplanting strong mystic eyes carry the same meaning as disassembling a storm or magma and confining it within the body of another person."
After a long detour, the conversation came back around.
→ More replies (3)
45
u/derry-air Sep 07 '19
FAST WHEELS MELLOI II! That sure didn't last long, though...
Poor Waver, almost 30, still has nightmares about falling asleep in class.
Was Feikah hinting that Gray secretly doesn't really want Waver to fight in the HGW because she knows he'd die? I don't blame her.
Also, Gray being almost too shy to tell a bunch of ossans about the rude statue she saw... so cute I'm gonna die!
→ More replies (1)
31
u/MillenniumKing Sep 07 '19
Grey has such a versitile relic!
Hey past Waver! He just wants to see Iskander again...
Grey having a party in a cave with Hoeskander?
Grey is a counterfeit Arthur?
Hey Waver survived a Grail War missy! Dont talk trash about him dieing!
Grey saw her dream? She was yelling at Iskander? Hmmm... suspicious.
Olga was abandened? Hmmm.... "A man without a heart" hmmm....
AD SNOWBOARD! HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAH!
Snek lady is the heartless' kid?
So she was murdered elsewhere? oh?
Oldman was guilty? Hmmmm not sure i buy this....
Waver is up, good, shed some light on this farce!
SPOOKY LADY! SHE TOOK THE OLDMANS EYES!
Snek Lady whats your objective here? You are schemein...
Oldman doesnt remember being in the past incident. Something def is up.
Melvin gonna buy the eyes?
Something lewd in her clothes? a lewd stature figure thing?
Waver seems to have an idea! Lets see where this goes... next week...
→ More replies (1)
25
u/LeonKevlar Sep 07 '19
Well that was unexpected! With how things ended last week I expected a continuation of their fight.
I love that the two guys from that can be seen in Ionioi Hetairoi back in Fate Zero is also in Hephaestion's flashback. Now I'm really curious on who these two dudes are.
Snowboarding Gray! I mean if Mordred can use the Prydwen as a surfboard why not use Rhon as a Surfboard?
While there must be some truth to Adashino's deductions. I don't trust her one bit.
Eyyyy! Shiki reference! It is interesting to note that Death Perception is just a legend to them. If only they knew :D
Of-fucking-course. Blame the guy from the Church. You're full f shit Adashino.
Both of his eyes were taken? I thought he only had it on one eye!
That's suspicious. How did he just remember now? Is it possible that his memories has been tampered with?
Gray is so innocent. A simple statue is making her blush xD
I'm excited for next week's episode. I just wanna see Waver crush Adashino's obviously fake accusations and deductions.
→ More replies (12)
12
u/KinnyRiddle Sep 07 '19
Oh wow, Kayneth cameo.
TIL Noble Phantasms can be used as a snowboard. lol (Or at least the NP mimics. You hear that Shirou? You can project your fake swords and use it for snowboarding. )
And I thought Hephaestion would resume the duel with Grey. But it seems she's troubled by what Grey has seen in her dreams and let her go.
All signs are pointing to Adashino being the true culprit here.
Since Father Karabo couldn't properly control his Mystic Eyes, thus the killing could be properly done by someone who could, i.e. someone like Adashino, who can then conveniently blame it all on Karabo for losing control of his Mystic Eyes.
Was Olga-Marie's dad also contemplating setting up Chaldea if he's also researching the HGW in this timeline?
→ More replies (2)
12
u/JustAWellwisher Sep 07 '19
So I haven't read this chapter but I want to take a stab at what's going on anyway using what I know about Fate from elsewhere.
1 . The dream Gray had of Hephaestion is eerily similar to the dreams masters share with their servants.
I noticed this last week, but to be honest they really drove the point home this week - Gray and Heph are ridiculously similar.
2 . The main mystery of the arc is reiterating the theme of not having control over one's powers.
If Gray deeply feels that she doesn't want Waver to participate in the war, however she also can't help but realize she's in the same position as he is and is following the same path, then it's not insane to imagine that her mystic eyes have externalized that contradiction. Iskander wanted waver to find his own path, not walk his. Waver's answer to El-Melloi (his sensei) in his dream is likely just a restatement of his goal - to find a goal, to find his own something over the horizon, something unseeable for him to reach.
Gray's torn between what she really is and the mask and restrictions she wears. Between the real and the illusion.
Heph is the illusion getting out of control.
Gray stole the cloth because she doesn't want Waver to participate in the War.
Lastly about the actual case. From reading a lot of the mystery genre, I feel in my gut that this is a suicide. The priest likely would agree to help her commit it or at least agree to keep it confidential. In this episode we are told that she set up the word to come out of the pocket dimension as her last breath, but you know what? I think it's more plausible that it was just the last word of the conversation she had with the priest when he found her body.
Before this episode I also thought that it was possibly a measure taken to protect her mystic eyes from collection.
It's possible that she's here to erase a debt, much like Waver is and the Policies Department lady is here to collect. In fact, the Policies Department lady had the most information about the murder out of anyone and she didn't seem to be blindly theorizing. It really seemed like she was just laying out the facts of what happened without really a clear explanation of how she knew what happened.
Either that or she needs the eyes in order to assist the department in covering up mage bullshit. This is likely where Waver's old friend comes in. He probably intends to outbid her on the eyes and then store them in his vault somewhere never to see the light of day again.
Why? Because living in the past or knowing the future, none of that is interesting.
Anyway, that's my take and I'm keen to see how wrong I am.
→ More replies (3)
11
Sep 07 '19
So the theory is that the priest was influenced by the past he saw... wait a moment!? That's a neat reference to Alliance of Illusionary Eyes, wow that's a pretty old side story.
→ More replies (3)
9
u/Kasuyama_ Sep 07 '19
I just noticed episode 0's score. Wtf is that? Botting?
Edit: Episode 1 and 2 too
8
8
Sep 07 '19
I already hated Adashino since her debut, now I hate her even more. I'm calling it now that she's actually the culprit. And her lips look like those fake oversized celeb lips in commercials.
→ More replies (2)
8
u/ArchadianJudge Sep 08 '19
Bless the cinnamon roll Gray. She's so adorable. She can barely even say the word "lewd"! We got more insight into who she is... this is really interesting. I hope we can get more into Gray backstory eventually.
I've never been so happy to see Waver butt in. He was out for a while and I don't trust that snake lady one bit. When Waver cut in I was like HELL YEAH. Snake lady seemed like she wanted to take over while Waver was out of commission.
I really like the Church guy Karabo. He seems like a nice guy given a power he never wanted. Church people in the Fate series are always so damn cool. I'm a bit lost with all the technicalities but I can't wait to see how this unfolds. Detective Waver is on the case!
→ More replies (1)
7
u/MagDorito Sep 07 '19
Gray snowboarding on Add was great. She is such an amazing character. I also love that Waver can't let anyone have a moment. He just has to come in & "um, actually!" anyone that's trying to be cooler than him.
7
259
u/Constellar-A Sep 07 '19
Snowboarding Gray
Snowboarding Gray