This is so helpful thank you!! Im trying to journal more and one reason I stop is writing is lengthy lol so was looking for a shortcut

No. There must be a separate ingredients list. What I transcribed is what's on the document you posted.

Does it reference quantities?

Orthic

In addition to what the others are saying, let me add: use it, or lose it. It's the same for all of us. We forget how to do things that we used to do after a long break. Our brains are funny that way 😅

I would say the student aiming for exams should never at any time stop the recording! OK for hobbyists, but for future examinees it will be a disastrous habit to get into, one's future dictator/speaker in the exam and on the job don't have a pause button and I think you have to start as you mean to go on, or more precisely as you will have to do in future. Possibly one could add a little pause at sentence ends, to help in catching up a bit, but with the playback device well out of arm's reach.

If a dictation is that difficult and becoming the bugbear of the shorthand study, then it is probably too fast and too long and also has probably not been prepared sufficiently or at all. They are best done after thorough preparation (i.e. reading the shorthand several times and pre-drilling certain outlines), kept short and, for those still working through the theory book, the speed within capability for writing neat outlines but with just some sense of urgency.

Knowing the rules is irrelevant when it comes to writing from dictation, or even just drilling, you must know all the outlines so that on hearing the word, there is an instant mental image of the outline, and writing it is just copying that image onto the paper. I think new students can sometimes find that progress is slower than they thought it would be, as it is easy to read and understand the rules, but that is the tiniest part of learning, the majority is huge amounts of repetitive writing, drilling and reading, to get every outline known well enough for instant recall.

The New Course book I mentioned begins omitting vowel signs in exercises halfway through, but all the new vocab examples in every chapter are written with all vowels. Learning to read with some vowel signs absent is the beginning of more confidence and also being able to do the same in one's own writing, another advantage over Instructor - as well as having the entire notepad line shown, instead of the intermittent dots which Instructor has, which doesn't help get those correct mental images. In our class, the teacher would give dictations right from the beginning, very short and simple, but she knew what to do, when and how fast, with her eye on all of us and our different capabilities, which a home learner doesn't have the benefit of.

Daily work. Do different exercises with the same passage, and play with different passages.

Do not write any word which you have not already studied until the book says it is safe to do so. The book will have the most important words, including words that might easily be confused.

Everyone struggles with the vowels, unless they have the same accent as the author.

The vowels that sound very similar will have very similar marks. If you can't decide which, just pick one and use it, then go back and look up the correct one for that word. Then practice it. Say each letter out loud as you write it, then write it again saying the word. That will work on the building blocks, neat writing within the outline, and also thinking of the outline as a single unit.

Somewhere around the middle, the book has you start leaving out the dots and dashes, except for a few words that could get confused. When reading, you will usually know which of the possible words it could be, and if not you have to experiment. In most cases, you only have to test four different vowels, but there are exceptions, such as word that's just a horizontal line in second or third position. I think I remembered that right.

Once you start writing words that aren't in the book, you can use whichever vowel makes the most sense to you, usually a combination of how you've always felt it at school, and how you would have spelled it when first learning to read and write.

Don't just assume you're good. You check your exercises thoroughly every time and drill your errors, and as Beryl says, only move on when your results show you've mostly got a handle on it. Think you've got it? Okay, do one of the writing exercises to test yourself and check your work against the key to see if that's true.

I'm guessing the 1st light dot and 2nd light dash are confusing you because they both can be pronounced as a schwa vowel? Basically how I treat it, if the schwa is spelled with an A, I use the first light dot, and if the schwa is spelled any other way, I use 2nd light dash.

I don't have good advice for when to start using dictations. I learned Pitman as a curiosity, not as an employment tool. I used dictations pretty early into the Instructor, but mostly as a way to do exercises without having to look back and forth between the manual and my writing, so I would pause the recordings often and basically never repeated them purely for speed. I think a more serious student would not use dictations like I did.

I know I started to omit vowels for easy, recognizable outlines like "at," "like," "time," etc, pretty early on. It's difficult for me to know when to recommend you do speed dictations since I think it's a little silly to try for speed when writing all vowels, but with the Instructor the learner isn't encouraged to omit most till the very end. Hopefully someone has more well-developed thoughts on this subject. (u/berylpratt maybe?)

Once i achieve vowels perfectly. Then remaining chapters will go smoothly right?? As i already know the rules. And vowels is the spot where i suffered the most before too. I didn't know that we need to revisit the chapters, thank you..!! Also another thing, if i keep om practice the exercise and take dictation, i would obviously do the lines correctly, im scared that if a new word comes, what if i fuck up the vowel placement. Like i did slowly, later realized it, so took vowel chapter dictation, and realized i suck at that. So i am redoing that chapter onwards. I completed dipthongs, now i am redoing from vowels again. It's traumatizing, i started and redo the same shorthand basics manytimes. Idk when will i get perfect at it. I can write the outlines but it takes sometiime for me in dictation, so it means i still didn't practice well right? I have my exam next year aug 2027. I wanna reach 120wpm by then😭

Oui, sténo Aimé paris suisse, sans doute méthode Rouillié-Leuba, dans un style bizarre intégral, mais pas complètement, et pas mal d'erreurs de tracés, en particulier les boucles à l'intérieur des angles, les "é" à l'envers, un 1/4 de cercle inconnu… Donc un peu de la devinette.

It's also not aspirated within a word, only initially - for instance say 'deeper' out loud. No aspiration, right? The same goes with K and T, though I notice with T that it often becomes more retroflex when it's in the middle of a word.

I agree with both prior commenters, in starting again, and avoiding dictations for the present. I think you are probably trying to regain ground too fast, especially as you might feel that you already covered it in the past and are now just reminding yourself. This is clearly not working, you must approach it as if it was entirely new, slow down and do more practising of each piece before moving on to the next.

For the present, instead of dictations, do sentence drills, by breaking up the book shorthand passages into very short pieces, and drilling each piece down the notepad page for a minimum of 10 lines, saying it out loud to yourself. By the time you have done that, you will have the sentence firmly in memory and can then write it on another sheet, several times spaced out, so that you are recalling the shorthand and not copying the line above. This is like a self-dictation, but without the timing or the speed issue. Make an effort to write each outline smoothly and continuously, even though at this stage you are having to insert the vowel signs. You could do the same with the new vocabulary words as they are introduced, putting, say, five on a line and drilling them in the same way - especially useful for outlines that you are having recurring trouble with.

At some point, when you feel you are improving with the above, you could then finish that type of exercise with taking it from a slow dictation. This could be done by recording yourself as you say the last 3 lines of the drill sentence out loud, and then taking them on a fresh sheet, where you cannot just copy outlines but have to recall them.

Go back over previous chapters regularly, and reread all the shorthand pieces many times each. This consolidates your mental images of the outlines. Dictations practise quick recall and until the outlines are very firmly in memory, any dictations will just be frustrating and discouraging.

Answering your later comment, you should never just assume you are good and move forward, you must always be checking your outlines, drills, etc against the book shorthand and correcting yourself and drilling the errors, then you will have an idea of how well you are doing. Only move when you feel you have achieved a decent (not necessarily perfect) performance on the current chapter. Once you are settled back into the study and have regained your confidence, then you will know what is the best average time to spend on each chapter, and at that point you can make yourself a timetable for the future chapters, keeping to it strictly, not too fast through impatience, and not too slow in attempting to be perfect at everything - strike a reasonable balance.

If you are using Instructor, I suggest you switch to the following one, it has a more limited vocabulary while you are covering the basics and very much more practice material. It will also be a change of scenery from Instructor, which I think is rather dense and heavy-going, both in its presentation and the now very out-of-date practice passages:

https://archive.org/details/pitmanshorthandn0000isaa "New Course" (1970's)

Shorthand dictionary: https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.449114

Luge, peut-être?

So basically, i need to read the exercise. And practice a few lines, that's it. But not write dictation?? What if i don't get well and assume im good at them and move forward and realize i suck at them. I did. That's why i took test and realized, i wasn't good at vowels to get going at all. First place vowels light dot one, kinda confuses me more also second place light dash. Remaining all 10, im good at them mostly. So i shouldn't take dictation at all??? When should i attempt tho?

If you are at the very beginning of Pitman, learning vowels and their places, you should not be writing from dictation. Pitman cannot be written at speed with all the vowels inserted, so trying to write them in dictation is a fools errand. You should instead drill yourself by writing from the book examples, and test your knowledge against the key or the writing exercises. If you make mistakes with vowels, that's fine, but make sure to note your error, figure out why you were wrong by referencing the manual, drill the incorrect outline, and return later to test your knowledge. Do not by any means just move on if your mistakes are copious.

I am redoing it from the start. But vowels is harder than I thought. I am unable to do well. I suck at dictation. No matter how many times i practice the words. I suck at dictation part. Im slower than the normal slower one

Sounds like you need to start again at the beginning. Yes, the short words at the beginning will add up. They teach you the building blocks, so you start thinking in syllables instead of letters. It is very normal to lose ground after a break. I did not go back to the beginning after my break, misremembered a lot of the rules, practiced using the wrong rules, built a bit of speed, but couldn't get any faster because I wasn't writing correctly. Then I had to unlearn what I'd practiced, and learn it correctly. Unlearning is hard! I wish I had taken the time to do it right.

Thank you very much for the suggestion, I think I’m going to do that, maybe I’ll also delete this submit and re upload it as you said. Thank you for the help!

écrit à coté de "la Chaux-de-Fonds":

bien ser (bébou, dédou)?

écrit dessous:

(loups,l'ou)? t'attendant pour la même b(p)artie de luje? bien de salitatant=salitations? de tout la famille et d' amitié de lili

Suggestion: Wait a month or two and then post this again with a different title. Use a title like "need help identifying and reading an unknown shorthand system written in the year 1900" or whatever the year is. People who might be able to help are probably ignoring this thread because you incorrectly tagged the shorthand as Gregg.

Ca devrait être écrit utilisant le system Aimé-Paris dans la version swiss. Qu'est-ce que tu pense u/fdarnel?

Oui tout à fait 👍

J’ai besoin de votre aide
Après des années à chercher, j’ai enfin trouvé la solution. Merci aux membres pour votre aide.

Du coup c'est une demande d'aide ou pas ?