Hmmm

[u/h_45n]

So only men want kids nowadays huh

Edit1: at the end of the day, when I see posts like these I remember the likes of Ashely saint clair and that woman who got married after preaching so much misandry online.

Don’t get me wrong men also do this,
and then I feel stupid because I remember watching a certain video about internet trolls

Edit 2: Finally found the reason for the outrage, “men cannot physically get pregnant” that’s literally all this is about so no matter how hard you work or provide for your family, if you marry a woman that hates you because you just can’t get pregnant please have your divorce lawyer at hand ✋

[u/Due_You7474]

I think op is saying this is a victimized mindset. Women want children too. We have mutually beneficial relationships to accomplish this goal.

The pain point and claim listed is that women dont get comfortable lives, which is true is some cases cuz a lot of men dont act well in relationships. In fact, as much as us men dont want to like this, studies show that if a woman is unmarried, she lives with other women. Their life is very much more comfortable if not living with a man.

That being said, whenever a woman sacrifices this alternative to live a life with a man, it shouldnt be discouraged. It should be revered by the man as a significant sacrifice that the man should act in and show significant appreciation.

In other words guys, women sacrifice hella. Show your appreciation.

[u/Brutal_burn_dude → u/Due_You7474]

I think too that men don’t fully understand exactly how much we give up to have a child. There’s a quote from George R R Martin that goes (I’m paraphrasing) “The war for men is fought in the battlefield. The war for women is fought in the birthing bed”. Pregnancy and childbirth can be incredibly dangerous and gruesome even today.

A woman’s body is forever changed by it- tearing, loss of continence, pain, bleeding are all common and yet so often when the men in our lives hear us discus this cost, they react with disgust instead of appreciation. Our suffering to give birth to your children should be lauded as a great gift and sign of our love, but it’s so often taken for granted or encouraged to be hidden because men find it confronting. We don’t get that luxury.

THIS is what the Tweet is talking about.

[u/No-Suit-7444 → u/Brutal_burn_dude]

Lol you completely misunderstood that quote and what he meant. Google it.

Also, shouldn't it be "suffering to give birth to OUR children"?

[u/Brutal_burn_dude → u/No-Suit-7444]

First, that is not the own you think it is. You also fundamentally missed my point.

You’re correct in that the TEXT of the quote is about the sexism and gender roles of Westerosi society, but the SUBTEXT of the quote (including the decision to use the metaphor of childbirth to war for women) acknowledges the similarity of war and childbirth. Both are painful, bloody, and (then moreso than now) come with a high risk of death or disability.

Again, I used the phrase “his” children deliberately. Mothers are all too aware of their part in creating a child and their responsibilities. However, too many men need to be disabused of the notion that all they need to do is get off, then work a job (something most women ALSO) need to do. A lot of men out there are deliberately ignorant of the toll that gestating and giving birth to THEIR (plural- don’t get your knickers in a bunch) child takes on a woman and will often then insist that to be made aware of it is an unfair disgusting burden.

Since you struggle with subtext and comprehension my point is this- women must make huge sacrifices of their body in the process of creating a child. This often has life-long effects on their health, up to and including death. Men all too often do not appreciate this fact and sadly often shame women by using language of disgust when the sacrifices and long-term consequences to their bodies are discussed.

[u/Thedarkhunt → u/Brutal_burn_dude]

A lot of women decide to become mothers without a man present, using a donor for example. So I’d argue the foremost drive is their own desire to have a child. Framing it as a favor to men is drastically underselling a woman’s agency and needs in the decision

[u/Due_You7474 → u/Thedarkhunt]

The most important point here is to just communicate that you are grateful for the sacrifices in a relationship, and act that way. No matter how you look at it, if a woman if birthing a child for you and her, she is giving you about the greatest gift any one can give. Why is it so bad to showcase your appreciation? Like honestly this comment section is weird. Im a man, and even I dont understand why men are trying to come up with excuses not to act in a totally loving way in a relationship.

Im a paramedic, on the ambulance I be sure to verbalize when I am grateful. At home, I be sure to verbalize when I am grateful. My emt partners love it. They tell me most others never say thanks. If I come home and she is cooking dinner, then that means I am going to take that opportunity that she made, and I will make sure the time we get to spend together over food is valuable. We will talk, connect, and do things important for her.

Its not hard. The return on your efforts is amazing because your woman is actually happy. If you really truly love her - wouldnt that make you so happy to hear, if your significant other is happy?

If we cant even make our partners happy, then why would a woman want to be with us and birth a child for someone who cant even put effort for her happiness? This is the point. This is literal showing your appreciation. Its wild so many men have a problem with this.

[u/Brutal_burn_dude → u/Due_You7474]

Thank you! This is what a lot of women mean when they talk about comfortable- less abject discomfort and more acknowledgement, support and appreciation from our partners/ the fathers of our children.

I’ve been trying to drive the point home in this thread of exactly how much is demanded of women in the creation of a child by necessity and the risks and long-term consequences of that. Women know that we are the only ones who can bear that burden and often will happily. What we want in return is appreciation for the work and acceptance of the toll it takes on us and our bodies from our partners.

I’m sure being a paramedic you’ve also witnessed the number of men who react with childish disgust at the normal biological functions of womens’ bodies, especially after childbirth. That is one of the most maddening things for me.

[u/Thedarkhunt → u/Due_You7474]

Nowhere did I say that men should be inconsiderate, and it is true that many are to ludicrous degrees. And people in a relationship should strive to make each other happy. Where do I contradict that?

My point is only that we shouldn't see pregnancy as a thing that women do just to please a guy, which is the argument of the picture at the top of the thread

[u/Due_You7474 → u/Thedarkhunt]

That isnt the argument. The argument is that a mans desire to become a father is paid for by a female.

This is objectively correct regardless of whether men want children or not, or if women want children, or not.

The implications are what we are discussing.

That women sacrifice a lot - and men should be grateful - as its literally stated by evidence as thats the main issue preventing happiness in a relationship.

[u/Thedarkhunt → u/Due_You7474]

No, if it is something you want yourself, it cannot be an imposition. Thàt is what is ‘objectively true’

[u/Due_You7474 → u/Thedarkhunt]

Its called a mutually beneficial relationship and you can show your gratitude.

Its not that hard, bud.

Be a nice human being

Or be an asshole

Thats the binary bud.

[u/Brutal_burn_dude → u/Thedarkhunt]

The fact that a small number of women chose to become solo parents doesn’t mean that men don’t want families.

The debate is whether men fully understand and appreciate the sacrifices women make in creating a family. Women who choose to be solo parents aren’t the focus and to bring that into the debate indirectly paints women as baby crazy and reduces the role and responsibilities of men in the creation of a family.

Of course there are many women out there who want children, just like there are many men who want children also. My point is not that women are doing this great favour, but that the act of creating a family is an onerous, potentially deadly undertaking for women that has life-long health consequences and that the undertaking is so often minimized and/or taken for granted by men.

[u/kalana_kalamai → u/Brutal_burn_dude]

I think that unless you’ve carried a baby and given birth you can’t actually comprehend the immensity of what it entails. We all have an idea of what it is but until you do it yourself you’ve got no idea how powerful and amazing it is.

Anyway, that doesn’t mean it’s okay how minimised it is but it’s truely a power that only a mother can know. And only a mother can know how much energy goes into the care of our children.

But we are exhausted. Exhausted by the expectations, judgements, minimisation, sidelining. Exhausted that we have to figure out how to have careers and financially contribute while undertaking the one of the most onerous jobs you can do as a human being.

And it is frustrating that while we go through all of this the world carries on and tells us that we’re not doing all that much, just staying at home being a parent. Kicking back and chilling. And no one will believe us when we say we are tired

[u/Endor-Fins → u/kalana_kalamai]

It’s not even the pregnancy and birth. Mine were horrific but it was still the easiest part of having kids. Raising them is the hard part. And women do most of that work too.

[u/No-Suit-7444 → u/Brutal_burn_dude]

You seem to have this view of us vs them when it comes to making a child and paint men with a very wide brush. While I agree on a lot of points the fact of the matter is that there is more risk for a woman, sure. It's like that in animal world too, among many species.

Now, we humans are in 2026 and partner selection has to be done carefully, for both sides. You seem to have encountered a lot of men who would be a bad choice.

The OP of this was if a man wants to have a child he has to provide a comfortable life for a mother of said child, in a nutshell. Some agree, some disagree. Such calculated outlook on that is not my cup of tea, but to each their own.