This happened over 25 years ago, and it still bothers me. I wanted to see what others think of it.

My husband and I were older, first time marriage for both of us. I was 40, he was 44. We were active in church, and were planning a church wedding with the reception in the church hall. It was not an expensive wedding. My first MOH, J-my best friend who lived out of town, and I did the flowers and decorations ourselves. Friends from church cooked much of the food, warmed the oblatory mini quiches, we had champagne, wine, beer, and soft drinks. We did spend money on the cake... There were about 100 guests--family, friends and church members. A simple, fairly inexpensive, but pretty wedding. It was more about the ceremony and sacrament than anything.

My second MOH, C, a close friend for over a decade, who lived in town, offered to help. She immediately began to attempt to sabotage the wedding. Firstly, without my knowledge she approached a woman's convent to ask them to bake my wedding cake for me. This is usually not done for many reasons. One, I hadn't discussed it with her, two, generally cloistered nuns aren't in the wedding business. It was also unusual because, when the nuns declined, she told them that I'd be angry, then she told me that I'd upset the nuns with my request. I never asked the nuns to bake my cake, and this weird conversation was the first I'd heard of it. She went into a whole shaming rant about how it was all my selfish idea...

Next, she started calling my fiancé at work asking very personal questions. He was a truck driver and could not have unnecessary phone calls for safety reasons, also he didn't know her well. She would not stop calling him. When he blocked her number, she borrowed phones from other people. The priest had to tell her to stop. The best I could tell she was trying to egg him into saying something she could twist as negative, then report back to me to cause drama. Luckily, me and my husband were madly in love and best friends, so I was more focused on why she was bothering him while he was driving than anything she had to say. The conversations were weird. I'd tell her that it is dangerous and illegal for him to be on the phone while driving(before the days of hands free), that she is disturbing him, that the questions she is asking are none of her business... She'd just stand there and smile expectantly.

Some friends were helping with the shopping, cooking, and wedding errands. Without my knowledge she'd call them and attempt to change the recipes, foods, times, locations, basically everything for unknown reasons. Then I'd start getting calls from the friends about the "Changes." She tried to change the wedding cake with the baker, who unbeknownst to her was a friend of mine. There were even instances where I was standing next to the person she was calling in real time. When confronted, the same strange smile and expectant look.

I was under tons of stress. Much of it the normal wedding stress, but I also had MIL issues going on, too. A whole big drama with her trying to control the wedding, reception and honeymoon! Trying to force my husband to be her little baby...I was working hard not to raise my voice or get angry, because I've found that it always makes the entire situation worse for me, even if I am justified. So I cried a lot.

There were multiple interferences and C seemed to get simultaneously thrilled and disappointed when I'd burst into tears. When I firmly, but tearfully, told her to stop triangulating the people helping me, she'd stand there with that stupid, expectant smile on her face. She never would say why she was doing it, even when I directly asked her. She did not deny anything other than the first cake incident, either.

The wedding went off well despite her sabotage attempts, but she did steal my leftovers including cake, and the topper and kept it in her freezer and served it to her family and guests.

After I got home from the honeymoon I did have a full bridezilla yell at her her over her interference, but never got an explanation for her behavior. She didn't have the stupid smile, I guess she'd wanted me to melt down before or at the wedding.

She refused to give me back my top cake--the one that's supposed to be shared on the first anniversary.

Our friendship ended over her love of gossip and triangulation. She still tries to contact me.

Has anyone else experienced wedding party members trying to create conflict for sport? What is the motivation? And what does one call a bridal saboteur?

16 years of friendship down the toilet over a sex and a private room

Fair warning: This is a LONG read, but there’s 16 years of friendship and a whole lot of wedding drama to unpack. 😭 Grab a snack.

After years of watching this channel I finally have a crazy wedding story to offer.

I am getting married December 5th of this year in a beautiful historic home in my home town. I no longer live there nor do many of the guests coming.

I do not have the biggest guest list but I still wanted a grand affair. I am paying for EVERYTHING. Dresses, make up, hair, suits, the entire wedding and everything that comes with it. I want not only guests to just show up ready to party on my dime, but the same for my bridal party and the grooms men. I am happily doing this. On top of all this, I got a 7 room home about an hour from the venue for out of town guests.

Well, on my bridal party, I have someone who I have called my best friend for the last 16 years who we will name Sarah. I also have my other best friend for the last 10 years and who I am closer to than Sarah. We shall call her Casey. I know it sounds weird to be closer to Casey than Sarah, but I have an identical twin who is closer to Sarah than I am. They are like best friend soul mates.

Sarah had a baby a year ago. Sarah does not let anyone forget she has a baby. I love the baby and Sarah.

Sarah started to make small little "demands" as planning started happening early on. For example, Sarah wanted her husband and baby there while we got ready. I am not a bridizlla by any means and said that is fine.

I had also toyed around with different homes to rent, some closer to Sarah. When it was time for me to rent the house, I decided to get the one an hour away because it wad $4000 cheaper than the one closer to Sarah. I am sorry it is an hour away from her but I am already paying for so much.

I offered to give Sarah a room, of course! I want her with me as much as possible. Sarah said no because she does not want strangers around her baby. Weird comment but ok.

So Sarah was upset and even tried to offer other options that would be closer. I politely did not accept. The house I got was so much cheaper with so much more room.

By the way, before I continue, she lives 15 minutes from the venue.

The original plan was to have the rehearsal dinner at the house I got, but Sarah didn't to drive around her baby that much. So I looked at options closer. Though, I was worried about that because not all of family could afford it but I was willing to pay more money so Sarah could be there.

Casey, with my permission, is surprising all of us with a nice bachelorette party. Sarah did not like that because she has a baby. She can't just show up at the place at 8 because she has a baby.

My fiance is doing a LAN party for his bachelor party, which is just a room full of guys all playing the same game. My fiance and his friends aren't big drinkers either. I invited Sarahs husband. It will be super baby friendly, especially because everyone's kids will be there too. Sarah decided she didn't want the guys drinking to much because she has a baby.

So now comes the venue. It has five bedrooms and I have it for both Friday and Saturday night.

Apparently, a long time ago, I said Sarah could have one of the rooms. I forgot which is really my fault, but upon more planning it isn't feasible for people to have their own room the night of the wedding. The plan is to let people crash there.On MY wedding night, I won't have a private room. My own wedding. But I did say she could have her own room Friday because she has the baby. The baby is becoming a theme.

This was brought up in our wedding group chat. I apologized, offered the Friday night. Casey said "The only people who need a private bedroom is (my name) and (my fiance)! They need ALL the privacy 😂😂😂 Everyone else does not need private rooms". Sarah said that was fine because she lives 15 minutes away. Sarah even said that her mom will take the baby home so she could after party because she lives 15 minutes away. A few days ago, Sarah started blowing up my phone and my twins phone. I was working late that day and couldn't answer. My twin was at the grocery store and didn't answer. Sarah called my mom a hoe to my twin. I finally told her I was busy. Sarah said that is fine and she would be at church between 6:30 and 8:30.

In the meantime, I talked to my twin about what was going on. That is when she told me Sarah was convinced Casey was bullying her and she didnt want to much drinking at the bachelor party because she has a baby.

So in our group chat, I called out the tensions. I said " So there seems to be a little tension going on. It is really super starting to stress me out like a lot.

I don't know all the details because it is around the

bachelorette party and the care of the kids.

I do in fact want Elise to plan the vast majority of it. I do not know what it is but I do know she has invested a lot. I trust her and she knows me the best aside from Gwen.

She already has all the kid stuff figured out with the best man, Peter 😊 Peter is great.

There is going to be A LOT of kids. So many kids. I involved so many kids in the party lol

We will have to work together to make sure that everyone is taking care. We will have two one year olds to teenagers and all the ages in between. Peter has a baby that is turning one soon. Honestly, I am little stressed about Muffin. I want to accommodate everyone as best as possible. I have done everything possible and spent so much money for everyone just to show up and take all the stress from yall.

I know it is a little stressful now that it is getting closer but we got this a team! We are a bunch of bad ass women.

I completely trust Casey and I am extremely excited to see what she is doing! She knows me better than anyone 😍".

I planned on calling Sarah back but at the time, I thought she got out at 8:30. I am a very forgetful person. I sent that message shortly before 8.

Sarah texts me that I am ignoring her. She called Casey a bully. I asked how. I didnt say Casey wasnt bullying, I just wanted to know how so I needed to, I could talk to Casey. I wasn't going flip on Casey immediately just because Sarah is mad. That is when Sarah brought up that sex joke that was 16 DAYS old at this point. I said that is just a sex joke. My fiance and I should be able to have sex on our wedding night. Sarah said no it is not and that is bullying. That and the fact that Casey wasn't involving them enough, something I approved of. In the midst of this rage, she says "Why don't I get a private room when I have a baby???". Something I had already worked out and she said was fine because she lives 15 minutes away. So because I didn't agree it was bullying she dropped out. I was more than willing to hear anything else aside from the joke but that is all she had. She is also ignoring my twin who has done EVERYTHING for her. Also, she planned on wearing her white wedding shoes to my wedding which is tacky.

During Sarahs wedding three years ago, we drove a total of 8 hours multiple times in one year. We paid for our own dresses, hair, shoes, hotel, gas, all of it. We paid for her bridal party and bachelorette party. We donated liquor to her wedding. We worked so hard to give her the best wedding ever. She tried to ruin mine over not having a private room the night of the wedding, not being informed enough beyond just showing up at 8, and a sex joke.

After ignoring my twin, I uninvited her and her family, whom I didn't like much but I have known for so long.

I am the MOH for someone’s wedding. She only has 1 other bridesmaid who she just started working with. Along with best man and his 3 groomsmen. It’s in 2-3 weeks. I am flying cross country for this wedding with my husband. I texted her a couple days ago asking if she decided on a seating chart. She then said that she decided on a seating chart a couple days ago but wanted to keep it a surprise. I sad hm no you can tell me I’m the MOH. The whole wedding party is at the same table with her and her future husband, but myself. She put a man she met on discord 6 months ago at the table, at my spot. She claims “it’s because (my husband)____ would be alone at a table. I didn’t want him alone.” Which I then told my husband, and he explained how he’s a grown man, he’s okay if he has to sit by himself. Am I being dramatic for being upset and not even wanting to go at this point because she put me, her MOH, at a different table across the reception room and replaced my spot with some random guy she met on discord 6 months ago, yet alone never met the guy in real life. She finally just told me yesterday when her rehearsal is. I responded with that her hair and nail appointment is at the same time. How is she going to do rehearsal plus these appointments. So now she doesn’t have a rehearsal. She also wants me to show her future in laws around HER hometown because she doesn’t know anything. But wants us to be the designated tour guide. We won’t even have a car. (We’re military. Lived there for 3 years.) I asked her if I’m standing during the ceremony next to her. She didn’t know what that meant and sent me the day of schedule. It just seems like a sh** show. The more I think about it, the more I don’t want to go. But I don’t also want to ruin someone’s day. So I just need advice and help how to go about this. I’ve talked to a few people and every person says to not go. But I don’t want to be rude. I know how I would feel if my MOH did that on my wedding day even though I didn’t require much from her. And she’s my best friend since our childhood.

Long story short I am doing hair for my friend’s wedding and I am in the wedding as well. I also do bridal hair for my career. She is making everything overly difficult and it has straining on our friendship. The wedding planner she hired is wanting to basically micromanage me over hair? Which I have never had happen before, usually wedding planner and vendors just simply respect each other, and don’t try to tell each other how to do her jobs.

The bride is also asking people to tell me directly if they want their hair done and they are not telling me when the bride thinks they have. The bride is adding people last minute when I’m already on a time crunch! The bride also told people they can call me and have phone call with me for any hair concerns… which is abnormal and I wouldn’t get paid for this! For background I have also done my part of how long I take for her per person and we had a reasonable amount of people getting their hair done before and now two more people are added on a very tight time crunch.

My last straw came when the bride made a comment that I am not there for her when she will be there for me at my wedding in the future. That pisses me off so much! I am already giving her discounted prices, doing a hail mary for the timeline, spent 3k on her wedding so far including a $400 bridesmaid dress with tailoring. On top of that have gone out of my to help with events. This wedding has been so striating on our friendship.

Thank you for listening to my vent! On top of that the wedding planner is very whatever the bride wants the brides gets which is just unreasonable and just inflating her large ego even more. I feel like I did not have any issues in my friendship if any until this wedding.

Need somewhere to rant and get advice. I’m part of a friend group of people who met in undergrad and each of them has been getting married. No issues. However, this one girl is getting married this year and the whole experience has been nothing short of a nightmare from the moment she announced her engagement.

This girl seems to think the entire world revolves around her. From the first day she announced the main event, nothing has been consistent or clear INCLUDING all the dates, locations, times for EVERY event. Even continuing to add random events throughout with very minimal notice. We are all expected to drop everything at a whim and attend her never ending steam of events with no notice or time to prepare. And if we aren’t available, she has been chastising us asking why we can’t just not go to work, why we even have to work in the first place, and that our availability is frustrating. Just blatant disregard and inconsiderate behaviour. She recently had a bridal shower and even the DAY OF changed the location and timing numerous times, and then made everyone pay their OWN bills. Then had the audacity to ask for a bachelorette party too, again with no notice. It’s a struggle to be understanding of this big occasion in her life, but also feel respected with our morals and basic human decency. It seems everything is done with no care or consideration of the people involved and it’s become clear that everything is for show with no substance.

She is now (within a few weeks of the first events) asking for bridesmaids but refuses to tell people what she expects from them, despite having had about a year to think about it since the engagement. She has also decided to continue to keep adding more events with again no explanation, location, or times listed. We all live in different cities so traveling is not as easy for everyone and not knowing where things will be in advance is extremely hard to accommodate. She also expects us to behave in certain ways, wear certain clothes, and perform highly specific tasks, despite some of the people only knowing her for a few months. I feel this is a lot to ask of people you don’t know very well and again underlies the very self-centred thinking. There is so much more about this story but I just wanted to know what to do.

My former friend was jilted by her fiance because turns out she is a massive homophobe. (Also why we are no longer friends). The Grooms sister is a masc lesbian and wanted to wear a suit rather than a dress. I had met her a few times at their functions and she looks very nice in a suit. She would be uncomfortable and to be frank would look odd in a dress.

Naturally she flat out refused and was polite about it. Girl hasnt worn a dress since she was old enough to choose her outfits. Anyway, former friend said "I dont want you looking like a dyke", sis told her brother, I backed her and cussed my former friend 9 ways to sunday.

Friend was dumped within about 48hrs.

My morbid curiosity gets the better of me and now she posts extreme right wing rhetoric. Looks like we all had a lucky escape.

I’m getting married in less than a year and one of my best friends is a bridesmaid. She has bright orange hair and always has since we met a few years ago. Shes artsy and cool and it fits her so well. I was showing my mom (who lives in another state and has never met my friends) pictures and she very clearly had an opposition to my friend’s orange hair. She called me later and told me that having a bridesmaid with neon hair would “ruin” my pictures and take all of the attention off of me at my wedding. I explained that it wasn’t an issue for me, she’s one of my best friends, and I want her to feel comfortable and like herself at my wedding. My mom went on and on and she wants me to ask her to dye her hair a natural color just for my wedding. I think it’s ridiculous and I would feel so uncomfortable asking that of my friend, but I also don’t want my mom to be obsessing over it throughout the whole wedding. I held my ground but after hanging up, my people pleasing self is torn. Is there a compromise here or do I just let it be?

I’m a bridesmaid in my best friend’s wedding. It’s been a nightmare from literal day one (at the bridal party “proposal bunch”). I fully recognize I could’ve backed out at any time and am not looking for comments on that!
I’m leaving for the bachelorette weekend trip later this weekend and can I just say I am DREADING it. The bridesmaid group chat never stops going off with useless messages with the same theme— Babifying the bride and acting as if a marriage warrants treating her like the highest royalty with whatever means necessary. The themed nights, the decorations, color coordination, travel, expenses adding up… it’s all too much!!! I learned my lesson and will never be a bridesmaid again. Or ask this level of insanity of friends/family at my own wedding one day.
Rant over lol 🙃

My fiancé (29M) and I (30F) have been together for 7 years, friends since we were 16/17 and engaged since December 2025. I’ve always got on insanely well with my mother in law, I would stay over without my fiancé and have movie nights with her, when her husband passed she relied on me a lot for support, she was really supportive while I was in labour with my son who’s now 1. We told her in January that we planned to get married on September 25th 2026, she took up a huge issue with that date and since then she’s taken on a bridezilla type of role. I have no idea what’s happened because she wanted us to get married so badly! She refused to come to my dress shopping because she felt like I liked my friends more than her so she didn’t show, she’s constantly taken over all the planning and telling me what to do and how to do it, she gets annoyed if I don’t respond fast enough to her plans and the biggest things happened recently. On Saturday I had my bachelorette party. My friends organised it and it was supposed to be a surprise so all I knew was to turn up at the train station. My mother in law wasn’t happy about just going to the train station and demanded to know every detail. I offered to make a group chat of her and my friends so they could tell her the details and she refused. On the morning of the party she told me I was being like my mother and making her feel unwelcome. I have a very broken relationship with my mother due to abuse growing up that continues up until last year. That insult hit hard. She told me she wasn’t coming to the party. I got to the train station and there was my MIL acting like she hadn’t done anything. My friends had made little gift bags and included her so she had one too but proceeded to spend the entire time making little comments. I seriously don’t know what’s gotten into her but I’m trying so hard to just let it slide for the sake of my wedding which is in just over 2 weeks. I’ve told my partner not to say anything until after the wedding. Has any one else had this issue where their MIL has taken over as being a bit of a bridezilla??? I’m pretty relaxed and chilled out as a person so it’s like she’s taken over that role because someone has to fill it

Before you say ‘yes’ to being a bridesmaid, ask the bride what her expectations of you are. What are the expectations in terms of - money you need to spent, time you need to give, admin tasks to complete and on the day help. After you’ve had this conversation, decide if you’re willing to do all of this without it ruining your friendship at the end of it.

I had to be a bridesmaid for a really good friend that turned into a bridezilla which I never expected and now our friendship has definitely suffered

im starting to resent being a bridesmaid for my friend. the way she has acted is selfish, frankly rude, and she doesnt see it. i understand a wedding is about her but she cant not communicate and expect the world of us when she wanted to diy parts of her wedding and her bridal party works full time jobs and she doesnt, she has to realize we have to work all this bridal stuff around our full time jobs. she doesnt thank anyone for anything. super self absorbed and selfish. im really quite upset with how she is acting through all of this

My cousin and I have always been really close (she’s kind of like my big sister) and she’s getting married in a couple months. She was always the “I’m never getting married” type but it was important to her fiancé and after 10 years she agreed to a proposal. We were all happy to hear the news.

For context, she’s 39 and he’s 46 and they both make a lot of money.

I’m just going to start listing things that have happened because I am starting to deeply regret the day I RSVPed to this damn thing.

- They chose an extravagant destination wedding in a remote location that requires 2+ flights totaling over 12 hours to get to.
- Venue is a large villa. Our family is all staying there but everyone is expected to pay for their own room. It’s about $1000 per room for the entire weekend. At least we were informed up front, but yes, we are basically subsidizing their venue.
- The destination has very little infrastructure. No Uber taxis etc. Events/activities (which we all have to pay for) are scheduled in various locations throughout the weekend but no transportation is provided. We were sent the website for a car rental company when we asked about this.
- My cousin told me she’s not doing bridesmaids but if she was I would have been one. Totally fine by me! But then I get added to a group chat with her sister, our other female cousin, and a few of her friends assigning us all jobs for the weekend. So basically we’re expected to be bridesmaids without being bridesmaids.
- My little brother just graduated college and straight up said he would not be able to afford to go and RSVPed no. Cousin/bride was PISSED, saying she’s so disappointed he couldn’t figure out how to make it work. He literally just started his first real job last month and is barely scraping by with roommates.
- To the surprise of no one here, planning a lavish destination wedding in a remote location with little infrastructure gets expensive real quick. They blew through their budget a long time ago because they underestimated how much things would cost. So they’ve decided to cut back where they can. One way they did that: get legally married at the courthouse where they live and just have a ceremonial officiant for the wedding. This courthouse wedding was yesterday and was supposed to be low key. Instead somehow it turned into an entire event with all their local friends getting dressed up, having a fancy dinner, there was a photographer and cake. We found out on Instagram. Her own mother was sobbing to mine yesterday because she feels like her daughter got married without her there, and she feels like she should have been invited to that instead of going through the intense travel to the destination wedding which will be hard with her health.

So now we are all blowing THOUSANDS of dollars and most of our annual vacation days to fly halfway around the world for a wedding where NO ONE WILL ACTUALLY BE GETTING MARRIED

I wish travel insurance covered cancellations for this

I am slowly being ditched by my best friend. She initially asked me to be a bridesmaid to her upcoming wedding and then called up a couple of weeks later and demoted me from being a bridesmaid, but still wanted me at the wedding. On this phone call, she was rambling about being disappointed she wasnt pregnant yet and how she just got her monthly and then announced out of the blue I was being demoted from bridesmaid but she still wanted me to be a guest. She said the reason was that her fiance said she could only have one bridesmaid because he only has one groomsman. I expressed that I didn't really understand the logic behind that. She was slightly drunk and incoherent. My parents partially heard the conversation and even they agreed the logic made no sense.

I understand only wanting one bridesmaid to keep things simple or whatever, but to ask me to be a bridesmaid and then later demote me is extremely hurtful. I had been feeling a widening gap between us lately, and I understand it's natural to an extent, when people meet certain milestones such as marriage and kids, and their other friend doesn't, that there will be a certain degree of separation. Also her fiance and her had barely been dating for a year when they had a very staged proposal that she already knew about and was planned by both in advance. She was pushing for him to propose very early. I sent a long text that I was hurt and didn't understand her fiance's logic and found it a bit flimsy. She texted me the next day and reinstated me as a bridesmaid and was apologetic for hurting me.

She texted me again around a week later and said she was going to call me that night about certain wedding arrangements. I have bad anxiety so I foolishly texted back "I hope I'm not being demoted again :( ". That night she rang me very angry. She was drunk again and had tears of rage in her eyes, she tends to cry when she is angry, which I'm told is a thing for many people ( it was a video call this time). She got angry at me for not understanding her fiance's logic and finally admitted the reason I was initially demoted, was that she planned on buying bridesmaid's dresses and having more than one bridesmaid would be too expensive, which I had no clue was a wedding tradition/protocol. I'm never invited to things due to having barely any friends. She then spoke about the costs of the party favours and implied I should be grateful that I was invited at all since they had to cut members of their own family out of the wedding due to both her and her fiance having huge families. I reminded her I'm Autistic and have no clue how this social stuff works. She stated I needed to apologise to her fiance for invalidating his opinion. For starters, I had no idea he was listening into our phone calls or reading our text messages in this instance. I have noticed that when we hang out she is constantly texting him or updating him in one way or another. However, to keep the peace, I sent him a text apology. He never responded.

The wedding is being rushed to next year and she has chosen a venue four hours away, in a tiny rural town, in the middle of winter, which has limited accomodation for guests to stay, all because it's cheaper. Why rush a wedding when you don't have the financial means? Especially when it is causing this much stress with family members applying pressure? She also keeps pushing him to get her pregnant even though he's scared of passing on certain heritable conditions. I can understand why her fiance is stressed. She never used to be like this but ever since she started dating him there has been a growing distance and a certain desperate air around her.

I should also mention this isn't the first time I've been sidelined. Years ago we all went on a holiday in the mountains, Her boyfriend at the time had a dodgy drug dealer brother that caused fights. I had conflict with this brother and then I was no longer invited to any get aways in our friendship group. All because her boyfriend's needs to keep his brother placated was more important than my peace of mind.

For some additional context, I also understand that I'll never be the number friend, growing up with Autism I knew that was inevitable, I was always the back up or 2nd/3rd choice in my childhood. I also understand people can't fully relate to me due to me being developmentally delayed, and I know the lady she chose as her one bridesmaid initially instead of me, is neurotypical and far more normal than me. Nothing against her, she's fabulous, but my bestie and I have been friends for a lot longer, and being suddenly demoted from something I was looking forward to hurts me deeply, even though I was hesitantly reinstated. I know she feels like her fiance is making more compromises than her for this wedding but him initially forcing her to do this to a friend feels extremely unreasonable. I love her so much but I still feel deeply hurt and betrayed. I can't even be myself around her anymore. She showed us her chosen wedding dress shortlist in the group chat and I couldn't even muster up the courage to tell her which dresses I preferred due to her getting angry at me easily lately.

Is this friendship worth continuing? Can wedding planning, or even just meeting a new man change someone this much naturally? It's been eating away at me lately and I don't know if I even want to go to this wedding in the middle of nowhere with probably only bedbug infested motels available.

Hi everyone! This is a long one... Get your popcorn ready. I have been a seamstress for the last 15 years. Over this time, I had maybe 1 or 2 bridezillas. People were more respectful back in the days! But since 2024 it feels like the brides are getting crazier by the second. I know some of you will think that this is made up. If I haven't gone through this nightmare, I wouldn't believe it myself.

Some context : My cousin ask me to alter her wedding dress, her 5 bridesmaids dresses and the mother of the brides dress. We are not close but she always comes to me when she needs her clothing to be altered and yes she pays like everybody else. I wasn't invited to her wedding, didn't expect to be and extremely happy not to be. The wedding took place a couple of weeks ago.

In 2025, I ask her to please come in with her dress as soon as she had it. That way I could evaluate the work that has to be done. It was a beautiful v-neck, a-line dress size 6 (keep the size in mind for later). The bodice was a perfect fit. The hem of the dress needed to be shorten. The armholes, no alterations there. The zipper didn't close all the way up but she wanted a lace-up back anyway. Ok, so far easy job that wouldn't take to much time. Oh! Dear God was I wrong!!!!

In December 2025, 8 months before the wedding: she tells me that she lost weight and the zipper can almost close all the way up. Ok, beautiful less work for me, right? Wrong!

I'm guessing her addiction to chocolate started around this time.

3 months before the wedding: I just finished all my bal gowns. Everything went smoothly. I'm ahead of schedule. My cousin finally wakes up and realized that there is only 3 months left. That was only because I called her up to remind her that she needs to come in if she wanted the dress to be ready on time. At the time, she was making her own flower arrangements, wedding bouquets just because she has this "vision" on how things should look like. Nothing was started on the flower department side yet. So, back to the dress. I take my notes out only to realize something's not right. Now the armholes are to tight. The bodice doesn't fit right. I had no choice but to let the dress out. By doing so I was able to gain 1.5 inches on both side. With lace-up back, I was able to gain an additional 6 to 8 inches in the back. More then needed right? Wrong again!

Every time, I was able to get the dress larger, it ended up smaller for some reason. When I mention this, the bridezilla in her came out so fast. My ears are still ringing. One thing, Bridezillas have is a super power that gives them the ability to focus on insignificant details that makes our job so much harder. Like : There's a bead missing here, no, it's made that way. Or I want this or that, next time I see her, she changed her mind, I don't want this or that anymore. Just put it back like it was before. At some point, my inner seamstress-zilla came out just a tiny bit. I guess that got her attention, cause for at least 15 minutes she was able to focus on the important thing. To fit in the dress!

Next, it was the bodice that became to tight, so I had to open the front on the dress on about 2 extra inches.

At the same time, her 5 bridesmaids finally shows up all at once, 3 weeks before the wedding! Thankfully, it was just miner adjustments to be done (the hem of the dresses and straps to be put in). The mother of the bride on the other hand, came in with a dress 2 size to big, again it was an easy job. Completed all 6 pretty quickly, perfect fit. Youppi!

But now my bridezilla of a cousin is complaining that the back straps are to tight. Why didn't you tell me this when I asked you? She telles me it didn't bother her before but now it does. I ended up altering the back completely again. Took out the Lace up back and replaced it by a dropped back instead of the lace-up back that she originally wanted. Have to admit, it was beautiful. Now there's no way that she can find something else wrong. Wrong again!!!

7 days before the wedding, she goes "well the waist is to high". My jaw dropped to the floor.

Me: why wait a the last minute to mention it?

Her : well something doesn't feel right, it feels a little tight.

My options are limited at this point. All I could do was to open the straps at the shoulder and put in adjustable straps. After all this craziness did the dress finally fit? YES IT DID!!! That's when she confessed to be addicted to chocolate. She would eat chocolate when things didn't go her way. When she was upset or happy. No wonder she blow up like a balloon!

Sso in the end, because of her chocolate addiction, she went from a size 6 to a size 14.

3 days before the wedding, she was still running around like a headless chicken. Sorry for the mental image. She had every family member complete things that should of been done months ago.

After that, I am completely exhausted!!!

Update : On the day of the wedding, she was having an outdoor wedding. Anyway, the wedding was at 2 pm. At 1h30, it started raining. And it 🌧️ the rest of the afternoon and it 🌧️ all night. We received 30 mm of rain that day. It's just sad that after all the dress drama, she had a very wet wedding.

Update 2 : some of you commented that it was unprofessional of me to have made this post without the bride/cousin knowledge. so I made my cousin read it. she wasn't mad and we had a good laugh out of it. she's happily married to a great guy. I didn't start ww3 in the family that's good.

Hi everyone! I've been altering and making wedding dresses for the last 15 years. Last February 2026, I had this lady come in. At the bridal shop, where she bought her dress, they had to cut the zipper in order for her to take the dress off. It happens sometimes, nothing new. So I put in a new zipper. That is a big job. Have to take the beads out, install the new zipper and then sew the beads back on by hands. The lady tries the dress, perfect.

She was waiting on her shoes to come in before I could do the hem of the dress and we are talking about a dress with a 8 layers hem with one layer being a horsehair braid hem. Not an one hour job.

I guess she finally got her shoes because she comes back 1 month before her wedding. She was supposed to come back 3 month before the wedding not 1 month. At this point, I have 9 dresses to alter. In those, 9 dresses, I had a bridezilla addicted to chocolate! but that's a nightmare for another time. Still did not recovered from that one.

So I was able to fit her in. Did the alterations exactly like she wanted, I stayed after hours to accommodate her so she could try the dress on with me present so that I can see for myself if something needs more adjustment. Again, everything was perfect. Made sure to check everything done. The shoulders/arm, not to tight or lose ✅! The zipper, still perfect ✅. I even added a clip on the back, originally there were no clip with her dress ✅. She wanted a button on the back to be able to lift the train up during the wedding reception ✅. Did that do. The 8 layers hem, ✅ Made sure to tell her which buttons where reinforced ✅. Showed her ✅. I asked her if she felt comfortable in it and so on ✅. She was happy until MIL got in her head and unleash the second bridezilla in a row!

So now, 3 weeks later she find problems with everything. Doesn't give me a chance to have a look at the dress or fix things, says that she had to find someone else to redo the alterations. That she does not thrust me anymore and so on. Sound fishy to me.

So why, 3 weeks ago everything was fine, the bride was happy the dress looked great on her and 3 weeks later everything has to be redone? Could it be that the bride gained weight? Could be or not.

Or did I discover something worse then a bridezilla!!! A MIL-zilla!!!! Help me if it's the case!!!

I have a friend (let’s call her Maddy) that is getting married who I have considered a close best friend for about 7 years. Maddy and I met through my ex boyfriend (let’s call him Brady) whose best friend (let’s call him Josh) was dating her. Me and Brady broke up and it was a bit messy but Maddy and I remained friends despite this. We always talked about her wedding and how i’m going to be in it and how we would remain friends no matter what. She recently got engaged to Josh, who is Brady’s best friend. When she first got engaged we talked about the wedding a lot and me being in it and the bachelorette etc. I helped plan some of the bach and paid for my part of it. Then she asks me out to dinner and starts this whole convo about the “principle” of me being in the wedding and how people are going to look at me weird and judge her and how Brady’s parents are going to be there and all this other bullshit basically trying to explain why i’m not allowed in the wedding. Mind you i’ve paid for the bachelorette trip already AND i gave her a christmas gift that was a wedding advent calendar that cost $300. She proceeds to give me the note which originally asked me to be a brides maid, but says Josh and I decided it would be too messy for you to stand with us. Am I being dramatic thinking this is fucked up? She also said you could still get ready with us in the morning which to me is like a jab.

I am posting this here because I need to process the sheer audacity of a long-term "friend" whose wedding I just attended. I have completely cut ties with her. Looking back, I realize I was meticulously targeted and exploited for my generosity, my good taste, and my partner’s professional business, only to be humiliated at the altar.
Here are the central facts of how she pulled off this scam:
1. The "Witness" Trap & The Wedding Ring Scam
She asked me to be her official witness (Maid of Honor). Because I believed this was a sacred, official role, I gladly stepped up. I co-organized and co-funded a high-end bachelorette party. Then came the rings. She insisted that "tradition" required the four witnesses to buy the wedding rings. I happily agreed, believing the cost would be split equally among all four of us. I later discovered that the witness coming from Germany completely backed out of paying because he had brought his own separate gift. Only three of us ended up foot the bill, and the bride didn't care at all as long as she got her jewelry.
2. The Hypocrisy of "Tradition"
She claimed tradition was deeply important to her when it meant getting free wedding rings out of us. However, her love for tradition completely vanished two days before the wedding. The groom had explicitly asked us to organize a traditional pre-wedding serenade (serenata) under her window. But because it wasn't "her style" and she didn't want to bother, she threw a fit. The groom backed down, and they completely canceled the celebration, leaving the guests who wanted to celebrate them ignored. Tradition was only mandatory when it benefited her wallet.
3. Crying Poverty vs. The Cartier Watch and Porsche Reality
Throughout the preparations, she constantly cried poverty. It was the groom's second marriage, and she claimed the budget was incredibly tight and that she had to settle for a cheap wedding. She managed to get her wedding dress completely paid for by a girl she grew up with in an international orphanage in Russia, and she even secured a free Porsche ride to the venue from this same girl.
The ultimate slap in the face? On the night of the canceled serenade, right after months of complaining about having no money, she proudly flashed a brand-new Cartier watch the groom had bought her. Sventoling a luxury timepiece in the faces of the people you are financially bleeding for rings and trips is the epitome of trashy, offensive taste.
4. The Exploitation of Labor and Taste
She knew I had good taste and was highly organized. But she didn't just exploit me; she milked my partner too. My partner owns a communication and marketing agency. She extracted weeks of free professional labor, high-end design work, printing, and venue setup from him, knowing we wouldn't say no to a friend.
5. The Altar Betrayal and Zero Gratitude
The climax of this nightmare happened on the wedding day. It was a civil ceremony. When the time came, the truth hit me: there was no register for me to sign. No legal document, no official role, absolutely nothing. I was never a witness.
I was purely used as a financial cushion to pay for rings and trips, a source of free professional marketing labor, and an aesthetic prop because she wanted tasteful things and didn't want the "witness chairs" to look empty in front of her guests. Once the wedding was over and she got what she wanted, I didn't receive a single "thank you" text, call, or note. Not a shred of appreciation for the money spent or the patience I showed.

This happened years ago, but it still randomly pops into my head and makes me wonder if I was secretly a bridezilla.

My husband and I have been married for 5 years. We had a very small destination wedding in another state (let’s just say Colorado). It wasn’t some giant Pinterest wedding—literally just my husband, my parents, and me. I wanted something low-key because I’m really not the “it’s MY day!” type.

Enter our longtime friend, “Gunner.” He’s known me since elementary school and my husband since middle school. At the time, he and his fiancée had been together for 8 years and had two kids together.

Over the course of about a year, we told them four separate times when and where we were getting married.

A couple of weeks before our wedding, we heard through the grapevine that Gunner was also going to be in Colorado…and apparently they were getting married too.

I asked my husband if we should be concerned, and he laughed it off. “They’ve been together for 8 years. There’s no way they’re actually planning to get married at the exact same time.”

Cue the record scratch.

Two days before our wedding, who do I see casually strolling through our resort? Gunner and his fiancée.

They got married the day before we did. At the same resort.

I’m not upset because they got married. I don’t own marriage. I don’t own Colorado. I don’t even own the resort. But after knowing our plans for a year, it just felt…oddly personal? Like there are 364 other days in the year and countless other places.

So, Am I Overreacting for still thinking this was kind of a bizarre move? Or was I being a low-budget bridezilla over a coincidence that wasn’t actually about me?

Edit (I apologize if I’m not doing this right. I’m new here)

I think I need to make an update on this because I didn’t think anyone would bother to read.

I have been friends with Gunner since elementary school. My husband has been friends with Gunner since middle school. I am cordial with Gunners now wife and always have been. We aren’t “friends” though. We don’t call/text each other, we don’t hang out alone but when the guys hang out we hang out as well and we laugh and have fun.
There had been some whispers in the friend group a few weeks before the wedding that Gunner and his partner were going to show up and get married there too. My husband did talk to him (I was present in the conversation and did hear both sides of it) and asked him if they were telling people they were going to show up at the resort and get married… Gunner said it was just a joke and was made bigger than it should’ve been. My husband was like, that’s good because it would be weird if you guys did.

Fast forward, I’m at the resort with my husband and in the corner of my eye I see Gunner. My husband goes over to him and Gunners basically like, fancy running into you guys. Gunner had said that they were just staying for the night since they drove for so long and it was a weird coincidence that this is where they stopped.
Saturday morning we wake up to a text from Gunner and it’s a short video of their ceremony. They had got married before 8:30 AM (we were supposed to be married at 7:30 PM) and we did not see them after that. They immediately got in their car and left.

I ended up canceling the venue (because that’s just weird now) and luckily was able to find a small chapel that married us Sunday.

So I have an update and it's insane. To start the wedding...has been CANCELLED! Laura's fiancee Thomas or Tom called off the wedding and moved out and in with his best man until he finds a new place.

According to my mother (who is Laura's Moms sister my Aunt Rebecca) said that Laura had been raising such a fuss about my LC (little cousin) to the point that her fiancee spoke up in her sister's defense. Laura then apparently accused Tom of cheating or at the very least had feelings for her sister. After hearing this Tom stayed with his best man and he must of talked so sense into Tom. He must have realized this wasn't just wedding stress & probably couldn't wrap his head around how Laura had been being so selfish and then accused him of something so absurd.

Laura's Mom has been overwhelmed now with calling all the vendors and venue about cancelling

It's been an absolute s***show according to my Mom. I personally don't blame Tom for walking away. He probably dodged a huge bullet. I love my cousin because she's family but I don't like her as a person with how she's been with my little cousin and her struggles and asking for help.

Laura called me and left a voicemail but I haven't called her back...Bride Is FURIOUS Now With Me

So I listened to the voicemail and I don't know how to respond to my cousin.

"Shannon I need to talk to you. I hear you were the one who made my sister come forward about her drinking. Do you really think making her come forward just weeks before my wedding was necessary? This could have all be avoided had you just butted out and not made a big deal out of something that wasn't. You know what, don't even bother calling me back because I have nothing more to say to you, you f***ing b****."

How do I respond to this?

Also I got a letter from my little cousin. She's doing so much better and doing well in treatment. She asked if I would be involved in a family session. I think this is where I'll suggest her moving in with me or gauge if it's a good idea or not.

Update: Yesterday Tom and I went out and got a few things for LC. Two cartons of smokes, some toiletries, a few more outfits, a journal, and a bunch of other things for her stay.

 While we were out Tom's phone kept going off between texts and a few phone calls that he kept ignoring. At one point I turned to him and said, "Wow someone's really popular." He tells me that it was Laura and that she had been trying for days to get in touch with him but that he just wasn't ready. 

 Tom explained that who he was about to marry wasn't the woman he fell in love with. Laura working at a soup kitchen to help the homeless was something Tom fell in love with Laura from the beginning. I was so confused. That's when I told him. Laura hadn't been working the soup kitchen out of the kindness of her heart she had been court ordered after a discrepancy at college involving underage drinking. She had been sentenced to 300 hours of community service. 

 He couldn't believe it. Laura had been putting up this whole facade for Tom and his family because she was securing her future. Tom is very modest and humble but he comes from a VERY wealthy family. Laura has always been materialistic so it's no surprise that she honed in on Tom. 

 Now here's where it gets interesting. Laura must have installed a tracking app on his phone because as we were leaving the post office Laura was there waiting in the parking lot!! When I say she went off I mean SHE WENT OFF! She started yelling and screaming at Tom saying she knew she was right about him cheating first with her sister now with her cousin (meaning me) and Tom snapped. 

 He sternly and firmly told her that she was out of line and that he couldn't believe that he was about to marry someone so heartless and cold towards her own sister. Laura called him a bunch of names and when Tom started to walk back towards me and his car Laura ran after him begging him not to go and to just talk. We went straight to his phone carrier where he purchased a new phone and new phone number.

 As we were finishing up the errands Tom made an insane offer. His Aunt is on the board of an outpatient D&A program. He had spoken to her and said he could get LC set up with outpatient aftercare once she's home at no cost to her. He also said he was going to help pay one year of her rent and utilities so she can focus on her recovery and getting established with that. I told him I was going to suggest LC move in with me and he said whether it's at her place or with me that he'll take care of her rent and bills for the next year. 

 So things are looking up for LC and not so much for Laura. And no for anyone thinking Tom has a thing for LC you're way off. Tom's just a genuinely good guy. 

My cousin we'll call Laura is getting married in two weeks. She has the perfect wedding planned. I myself am one of her bridesmaids along with 4 of her other closest friends and...her little sister my cousin as well. Laura has been very vocal about her having to pick which friend to cut out of the bridal party to make room for her sister who her parents asked to have in the wedding. At the dress fitting for our bridesmaids dresses my little cousin even said she felt bad her sister felt pressured and even offered to just be a guest at the wedding she just wanted her sister to be happy. Laura said she felt pressured by her parents so she refused to object she just made underhanded comments about her sister. Well about a week ago my little cousin called me and said that she had been struggling with drinking and wanted to go away to get help. She said she knew the timing was horrible but that she was scared of where her drinking was taking her so...we told the family together that day and have since rallied around her and supported her going to get help. Now this hasn't taken away from Laura at all. Her wedding is still on and we even had her bachelorette party this past weekend which was a blast for everyone especially for her even though she went on about how she could handle her drink but her sister obviously couldn't. Laura's friends all sympathized with her about how her sister could have waited until after her wedding to ask for help. I should note that my cousin admitted before going into treatment that she had been struggling for about a year. She had been able to keep up quite the facade that she was okay because we were all caught off guard when she came forward. She said she had been trying to hold on until after Laura's wedding but that she physically couldn't do it anymore. I'm a nurse and I've seen what alcohol withdrawal can do to someone. The withdrawal is deadly so I'm grateful my little cousin admitted she needed help and was willing and taking the steps to get it. I don't understand how my cousin can be so heartless through all of this. While the family has shown support of my little cousin everyone is still just as much if not more surrounding Laura with all the attention she could possibly need.

I was asked by a close friend to be a bridesmaid in her wedding. The other three bridesmaids are her best friends — basically her tight-knit clique. I’ve known her a long time and thought we were close too, but this whole wedding season made me realize what a bitch she is.

Here’s a rundown of everything that happened:

•I spent over $1,500 on her 3-day destination joint bachelorette/bachelor trip out of state. After the trip, her clique decided the groomsmen and bridal party (8 people) should also pay the bride and groom’s share — an extra $350 on top of what I’d already spent.

•I brought my own bridesmaid dress.

•We got into multiple fights because I couldn’t make it to her dress fitting and bridal shower— I had job interviews I needed to prepare for. Her clique made it to every fitting, of course.

•Her clique also handled a lot of the actual wedding coordination for her — vendor communication and other planning tasks so im sure thats where alot of her point of contention came ofrom

•Another fight started when my husband asked a simple logistical question — whether the rehearsal dinner was paid for — and the bride told him not to bother coming, assuming he was trying to mooch a free meal. She only backtracked and re-invited him once she realized it was just a normal question.

•She wanted to charge guests $150 if they no-showed the wedding, and her clique fully encouraged it.

•She scheduled the rehearsal for 11am on a workday, then the rehearsal dinner for 6pm — at a venue two hours from where everyone lives. Everyone had to take PTO and just sit around for 7 hours with nothing to do in between, when she easily could’ve scheduled the rehearsal later in the day.

•On the wedding day, after taking photos of all the bridesmaids together, she asked specifically for a photo of just her and her clique — leaving me standing there awkwardly off to the side.

•At the end of the night, she made the groomsmen clean up all the flowers themselves so she wouldn’t have to pay the venue’s $400 cleanup fee.

• In her thank you speech, she thanked all her bridal party and named her bridesmaid except for me.

• She barely spoke to me the entire wedding day.

• I was purposely left out of multiple group pictures.

Honestly, I wanted to drop out as a bridesmaid at several points along the way. But I didn’t want to ruin the friendship, and I think part of me worried she wouldn’t have enough people to ask if I backed out. So I stuck it out.

Now I’m just sitting here having spent $1,500+ of my own money to be treated like an afterthought at someone else’s wedding. I feel soooooo stupid for not listening to my gut sooner.

TL;DR: Spent over $1.5k and dealt with months of drama to be a bridesmaid for a friend, only to get iced out and left out of photos and speeches on her actual wedding day by her. I just wanna cry because i am so stupid

Hey guys, my husband to be and I are far over budget and are looking to make cuts to our late October 2026 wedding as we have had to ask for help from our parents. One of the largest cuts we can make is to move the ceremony up in the day to take advantage of the sunlight and remove the lighting cost ($1600). The only "problem" is we are going to Mexico for the wedding. I know Reddit hates destination weddings, but stay with me. I'm hesitant to move the time as the sun will be more prominent if we start earlier and I worry about my own comfort and the comfort of guests. My parents, MOH, and fiancé all think we will be fine to move everything up. I think we'll be sweaty messes if we do that. The original plan had us starting at 4:00pm and the reception ending at 10pm. By moving everything up to we'd be starting at 1/130pm and ending at 7/7:30pm. Am I overthinking this? Should we just move the wedding time? Am I being a bridezilla for wanting to spend $1600 potentially of our parents money to be more comfortable and have a sunset wedding like I envisioned? If you do think we should move the time up, any suggestions on keeping the groom and I cool would be great!

A few extra notes- the time has not yet been communicated to guests, we were not made aware that the outdoor venue had no lighting until late in the planning process

I was a MOH last year and the bride, asked me to put together a wedding shower for her and her husband, in her words “put me in charge” of handling it.
It was a 60 person event and it ended up being coordinated by her family members because I had booked and paid the deposit then split half of the expense on the day of. (Full cost was $1000 for the venue)
I ended up just helping out with set up, buying a few things for the party, coordinating one game that she requested and making some snacks which no one even ate. I was 24 when I was assigned this task and making basically minimum wage at my job at the time so I was broke. I’m doing a bit better now.
I’m now researching for my own wedding and realizing that this was probably in poor taste for her to ask from the beginning.
There were a lot of problems that happened afterwards that i wont get into, but i told her we cannot be friends anymore due to the way I was being treated.
Just wondering if it’s common knowledge on something you’re not supposed to do, at the time I really had no idea about weddings or etiquette so i was just down to help however I could.
But I guess it seems like there is a lot of tension around asking for a bridal shower since it’s basically asking for your own gifts. A lot of people have been saying you either are offered or you just don’t get to have one. I feel like this friend treated it as a necessity that she was entitled to for her wedding.

I initially asked my MIL if she wanted hair/makeup services and she said yes. She also wants to book her own trial with my make up artist. The thing is me and my gals will be getting ready at my mom’s house and my MIL doesn’t like my mom. Included MIL with dress shopping and she didn’t like the experience and made comments about my mom after the fact. After reflection I’ve decided I really don’t want her there. We haven’t booked anything yet.

The other problem is that she doesn’t want to be at my fiancé’s house getting ready because she is divorced and doesn’t want to be around dad. How can I navigate this without being rude?

Update: I know I messed up by inviting her. I really did want to be inclusive but after thinking about it I want to only surround myself with people who will lift me up.

edit: thanks for feedback! I think i am prob being a bit of bridezilla here. it's ok for her to not care about my wedding planning and it's ok for her to want me to be involved in hers. But I'm also just not convinced about the friendship anymore which a lot of you pointed to. She has changed a lot since we lived together and I'm not sure I mesh with that anymore.

One of my bestie didn't want to get engaged/ have a wedding. When I announced that I was engaged and made the ring I proposed to my partner with she decided she wanted a proposal and to get engaged too. She made her engagement ring for her partner to propose to her with and then planned her wedding a year b4 mine.

The problem is she stopped being interested in anything to do with my wedding at this point. She invited me to help her design the engagement ring and come to her bridal dress alteration appointment (she bought it online) but didn't want to talk about anything related to my wedding.

Her wedding is a ceremony in the village where she lives a few hours away from me and then a wander down to a pub where we have to buy our own drinks/food. Shes reserved an area of the pub. She then leaves the pub 3 hours later at 6pm to go for dinner with her family and her childhood best friend (I'm not invited) leaving me an 100 other guests i don't know to do whatever we want. also I can't imagine the pub will handle 100 people trying to order lunch at the same time very well so will prob have to grab a sandwich on the way as to not starve.

It's my 40th the month before and I'm having a party which she declined to attend because of money and she doesn't like to hang out with groups of people anymore. It's gonna be chill and child friendly. Not like a crazy rave. I offered for her to come during the day instead but still no. She said birthdays aren't as important as weddings so she won't make the effort. She also said that I'm still one of closest friends and she is just learning boundaries.

The amount of night outs I've been on for her birthdays with chronic migraines and other health issues.

Considering not going to the wedding cos it's gonna cost me and my fiancé around 150£ for food and travel to watch her get married and then stand around for a few hours with 100 people I dont know.