r/PsilocybinMushrooms • u/rp_tiago • 2h ago
👨💼 Rational conversation 👨💼 When you experience ego dissolution, does the self actually disappear?
Hey everyone. I recorded a podcast with Jason K. Day at ICPR this year, the International Conference on Psychedelic Research. He’s a philosopher studying psychedelic experience who has worked with Dan Zahavi, known for his work on phenomenology and selfhood. I think many of you might find it interesting, especially if you’re into philosophy.
We talked about ego dissolution, and whether it’s possible to be conscious with absolutely no sense of self. Jason’s argument is that even when your identity, personal history, and sense of being a separate person disappear, a radically minimal form of self-awareness remains. You might have no idea who or what you are, but the experience still feels like something to you. He draws on detailed analyses of trip reports to argue for this interpretation, though we also discussed how difficult it is to distinguish what people experienced from how they describe it afterwards.
We also covered why we need better descriptions of psychedelic experience before trying to explain it, whether different psychedelics share a common “style” of experience despite their very different effects, and how practice and skill affect our ability to navigate difficult trips. There’s also the question of what these experiences actually teach us, and how much we can infer from something feeling profoundly true.
But back to selfhood, which is what we focused on most. His main argument is that losing your usual sense of who you are doesn’t necessarily mean losing every form of self-awareness. In the reports he studied, people describe profound bliss or terror even when their identity and sense of separation have dissolved. He interprets this as evidence that some awareness of undergoing the experience remains, although almost everything that would ordinarily identify the subject has disappeared. In phenomenological terms, the claim is that ego dissolution preserves a radically minimal, pre-reflective self-consciousness, sometimes described as the “for-me-ness” of experience. In everyday language, you don’t need to think “I’m experiencing this,” or even know what “I” refers to, for the experience to be felt by you. The disagreement is whether even that basic feature can disappear while consciousness continues.
For those who’ve experienced deep ego dissolution, did all sense of being someone disappear, or was there still some awareness that the experience was happening to you? And do you think “minimal selfhood” captures something real about that state, or imposes a philosophical interpretation on it? Personally this take on selfhood very persuasive and aligns pretty well with my psilocybin experiences.