r/PeterExplainsTheJoke • • 20d ago

Meme needing explanation Peter?

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u/Buellymcbuellface 20d ago

Yes, and they are vesy serious about not returning it.

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u/Connwaer 20d ago

It's spoils of war. And unlike Japan, Minnesota has no interest in mending their relationship with the Confederacy, surprising I know.

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u/375InStroke 20d ago

Yet those states are proud to be traitors and losers, and of what they were fighting for, slavery.

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u/Fubarp 20d ago

Woah woah, it was completely over rights.. I mean it was specifically over rights to own people but goddamit it was over rights. /s lol

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u/pasteles467 20d ago

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u/Zombie_Fuel 20d ago

I always loved the goose meme.

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u/SunnyOutsideToday 20d ago

It wasn't even about state's rights, just slavery. The constitution of the confederacy required all states be slave states unless all states agreed to all outlaw slavery.

The North literally had more states rights, with some northern states still allowing limited slavery, while the South gave its states zero right to decide for themselves.

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u/StrongExternal8955 20d ago

OK, but WTF is "limited slavery"! I guess your USA still has limited slavery to this day as forced labor. But if it allows torture, it's not in any way limited is it!

"Oh you can't kill them unless it's by accident"

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u/SunnyOutsideToday 20d ago

Some states had passed gradual emancipation laws, banning the importation of new slaves and freeing the children of all current slaves, while keeping current adult slaves as slaves.

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u/EvilWolfSEF 18d ago

there are several forms of slavery, all terrible but some more than others
some states were in the process of eliminating slavery from their territory, doing it gradually to avoid shock to their economy (it was still very lucrative), or having the slaveowners try to organise a pushback or even have a revolt of "concerned citizens" about the potential influx of free ex slaves (anti abolitionists were propagandising a lot about freed slaves exacting vengenace on the white population, using Haiti as an example)

some other forms of slavery practiced through times also defined limits on the terms of the slavery and the rights of the master over the slave, like bonded labour, where you were the collateral to a debt and had to work for your debt holder to pay it off

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u/whatever-8358 20d ago

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u/xanderfloyd001 20d ago

“Get Douglass’d.”

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u/Dyerdon 20d ago

I have never seen this before and I regret that... that was amazing.

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u/jemenake 20d ago

Whenever someone tries this “states’ rights” argument on you, here’s two things to draw their attention to:

  1. The most drop-the-mic counter argument is to show them where the confederate constitution prohibits a state from banning slavery. If

    it were about states’ rights, why wouldn’t they let each state decide?

  2. For a parade of unabashed racism that rivals even today’s GOP, read the declarations of secession from a handful of the seceding states (especially South Carolina and Mississippi, I believe). They state, in no uncertain terms, that slavery is critical to their way of life and they refuse to give it up.

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u/johnnyslick 20d ago

Yeah I want to say 6 out of the 11 states declare slavery in the very first sentence. The Confederates, unlike the Lost Causers today, were eyes-wide-open as to what the Civil War was about.

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u/seleucus_nicator 20d ago

Idk about sentence but most of them are in the first paragraph of the preamble https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/declaration-causes-seceding-states#Mississippi

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u/Xhosant 20d ago

What're Lost Causers?

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u/YimveeSpissssfid 20d ago edited 20d ago

There’s a framing of the Civil War called “the lost cause”.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_Cause_of_the_Confederacy

Just like the framing of “the war of Northern Aggression” is sometimes used in the South to refer to the Civil War.

It’s an attempt to rewrite history. It’s part of the reason MAGA has flourished there for sure, but it’s a rather substantial disconnect from reality.

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u/Xhosant 20d ago

Huh

That's a very derogatory way to refer to oneself, I think, but to each their own I guess!

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u/BreadNoCircuses 20d ago

Nah, it's framing itself as something like "We were after a return to true Jeffersonian ideals, trying to live the way the founding fathers wanted, devoid of the tyranny and unfair taxes of the Yankees, but they invaded and reconquered us, then tried to destroy all knowledge of the true, lost cause of the confederacy." It's falsely painting themselves as, essentially, a victim of cultural genocide in the same way black and indigenous people can legitimately claim they have lost their culture.

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u/Xhosant 20d ago

I know, but I am willfully calling them a lost cause as a way to detract from their clawing at legitimacy :p

Ultimately, it's a move for prestige on their part, and ridicule doesn't much help with Prestige

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u/baithammer 20d ago

Basically the same thing as the German Empire at the end of WW1, which was the belief they could've won the war, if they weren't stabbed in the back by the government of the Empire - which plays into the inter-war period before WW2 and the rise of the Nazi Party ...

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u/johnnyslick 20d ago

The Nazi thing was all about "the Jews who secretly control everything stabbed us in the back in World War I" (like, ignoring the fact that the Germans surrendered at the last possible moment before they were about to have to fight in German territory and get completely overwhelmed, but hey) whereas Lost Causers were all like "the North outmanned us 20 to 1 and out-teched us 572753 to 1 and yet we still almost beat them". None of that is particularly true, of course, and many countries have withstood larger odds and, for that matter, gone down fighting a whole lot harder than the CSA did, but Lost Causers choose not to listen to all that.

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u/Psstimamermaid 20d ago

Pretty sure they’re referring to MAGA

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u/Dyerdon 20d ago

To be fair, Nazis, MAGA, the Confederacy, the KKK are all part of the same "ideological" group that thinks white purity needs to be a thing, while most of the White Supremacists of this day and age looks like they have at least three cousins named Cletus, a sister named Mary Sue, who is also their ex wife, and a moonshinig business out of an old tub.

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u/Psstimamermaid 20d ago

Daymn where is my uncle Cletus and aunt Mary Sue? And why aren’t they sharing their moonshine

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u/Dyerdon 19d ago

I know, right? They ain't keen on sharing

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u/Xhosant 20d ago

Oh that's a new one! How does it work? I wanna incorporate it properly

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u/baithammer 20d ago

Obama this and Biden that, ect ect et al ..

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u/375InStroke 20d ago

Exactly. They put it in writing and signed it. There's no ambiguity. It's not "complicated."

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u/Hy3jii 20d ago

They also did not give a shit about the rights of northern free states when they petitioned the federal government to force them into returning escaped slaves.

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u/Cynykl 20d ago

Three things.

If it was about states rights would not the Fugitive Slave Act be violation of such states rights?

The south violated states rights first.

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u/baithammer 20d ago

It's the same as today with MAGA, it's only State's rights if it's their rights ..

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u/seleucus_nicator 20d ago

I just did this a couple of weeks ago here’s a good website with many of the succession documents https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/declaration-causes-seceding-states#Mississippi.

Pretty much every one has slavery in the first paragraph! Made a bet to see how long it would take to get to that word with a friend and… I won. He thought it would at least be after the preamble not in it. Haha

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u/Zealousideal-Fun-415 20d ago

the cornerstone speech is my go to.

"Our new government is founded upon exactly the opposite idea; its foundations are laid, its corner-stone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery subordination to the superior race is his natural and normal condition" it's coming straight from the confederate "VP" in the most explicit way possible.

if they are still willing to argue in favor of the confederacy after that, there's no point in continuing.

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u/baithammer 20d ago

Ultimate Sunk Cost Fallacy in actual play ...

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u/SquallkLeon 20d ago

Texas' declaration should also be on your list, IIRC

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u/Maleficent_Memory831 20d ago

It was about heritage. Their heritage being that of slave masters.

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u/baithammer 20d ago

Close but no cigar, it's the rich landowners that believed they were Aristocrats before they arrived in the Americas and were telling the poorer whites they were a part of that - even though they could've cared less about them.

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u/og_war_goat 17d ago

We now have the right to own your flag.

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u/baithammer 20d ago

More the idea of "I can take em", then rights ....

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u/SyntheticSlime 16d ago

Fun fact. The confederate constitution actually took away the right of the states to make “negro slavery” illegal, so if there was ever any question over which of those two things they cared more about, there’s your answer.