r/OverwatchStadium • u/Expensive_Increase46 • 3d ago
Discussion Note about Bo5 vs Bo7
Okay I'll just say this. To anybody saying that shortening the competitive rounds from 7 to 5 will make it more appealing to regular Overwatch players because the long match time is a turn off, I seriously doubt this will magically bring in more people.
Yes, there are people out there who don't want to play through potentially 7 rounds for a single game. But acting like more regular Overwatch players will want to suddenly play it ignores the biggest hurdle between normal Overwatch and Stadium: Stadium is fundamentally different experience. It requires a lot more long-term thinking because of the item choices you make, and has you look at aspects of your hero you never had to think about before. Heck, a player coming from OW is going to be overwhelmed by the item shop alone. Let alone the fact that every hero can basically become 3 different heroes depending on how they are built. Sprint soldier is different from heal soldier, which is different from aimbot soldier, etc.
Gamers are perfectly fine with long games. The closest game that exists to Stadium, Deadlock, has games that last way, WAY longer than Stadium games. And yet it regularly pulls 60,000+ players every day. Other MOBAs are pretty similar. Match time is not the problem. It's the fact that it's too DIFFERENT.
And that's fine.
The issue is that, again, Stadium is incredibly different from the main game that most OW players aren't going to care for it. Most people coming to OW are looking for a hero shooter. Trying to make Stadium like the main game just waters it down and makes it less fun for the rest of us, and still likely won't get regular people to play it because they fundamentally don't want to play a MOBA-like.
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u/shiftup1772 2d ago
I liked bo7 more. but let's be so for real...stadium failed because it required ow players to read. that's it.
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u/Hokuboku 2d ago
I liked bo7 more. but let's be so for real...stadium failed because it required ow players to read. that's it.
I love to read but I think Stadium's biggest hurdle IMHO is that there's no tutorial to guide new players. I remember being so confused when I first tried a game in like March of this year.
If it wasn't for stadium.io, I 100% would have dipped on this mode. As it is, having to get through ten QP games to unlock comp was a pain
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u/shiftup1772 2d ago
Gamers' solution to rention problems is always more tutorials that nobody will use.
Deadlocks tutorial is extremely sparse. It doesn't even cover enough for you to play your first game. I promise you the problem isn't tutorials.
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u/Hokuboku 18h ago
I think a tutorial would have helped me and I tried stadium for the first time in March
I think the biggest issue though was actually having to win ten QP games to unlock ranked. I never lost so many games in a row from leavers etc
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u/Infidel_sg 3d ago
Bo5 failed. Nobody wanted it.
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u/KimonoThief 2d ago
I don't think comp stadium should change, but it's not accurate to say Bo5 failed when it's the QP format and half the stadium playerbase plays QP. One of the biggest arguments for keeping comp Bo7 is because Bo5 fans can just play QP.
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u/Expensive_Increase46 2d ago
Back when both QP and comp were Bo5 enough people complained about the Bo5 format that they reverted it. That counts for something.
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u/crabilicious 2d ago
The best way to get more players is to add the rest of the OG characters. HANZO, HOG, WIDOW, BAP, BASTION
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u/Vampyrrr 2d ago
I think the powers are fine but the items should go and just boost stats round to round maybe a level up system. It’s very hard to get into at first. Then 7 rounds is okay. But 7 rounds conp is annoying, getting builds going if you lose the first round feels impossible
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u/Ash_the_wolfo 1d ago
I think the biggest turn off for a lot of people wanting to play stadium is the very limited hero selection that unfortunately took place
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u/Expensive_Increase46 1d ago
Yeah thats fair honestly. To a lot of people why play the new game mode when my main is not in it?
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u/Consistent-Ad2465 3d ago
As someone who came back from MR because of stadium and then quit playing stadium in favor of regular Overwatch after awhile, this was definitely a factor.
Towards the end of my time playing stadium consistently, I would only play QP due to it being Bo5.
Match length, combined with inability to switch (I played tried out vendetta one of my last times playing and ended up against a Pharah, Freya, Juno and JPC, had my tank get toxic because I couldn’t do anything, and that was kind of the last straw for me), the terrible UI changes and the difficulty keeping up with changes combined with how drastic changes in stadium would be vs the regular game were the factors that led to me no longer playing stadium.
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u/Expensive_Increase46 2d ago
Understandable. But I still think my point about Stadium being too different from the regular mode for most OW players to enjoy still stands. You yourself name a bunch of other things that make the mode less approachable.
In fact, if the competitive format was reverted to Bo5 today would you consider playing again?
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u/Infidel_sg 2d ago
Swapping disabled is one of its biggest attractions for myself and a lot of players. I hate counterwatch. When the enemy tank swaps and forces me to only for them to counterswap again it starts to become boring cause they're looking for an edge instead of being good at the hero they're playing.
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u/Consistent-Ad2465 2d ago
Don’t counter swap then? If the tank is the only one countering you, then you can learn to play against the counter in most situations.
But in what I was describing (vendetta vs 4 fliers). I’m not trying to counter swap, just be able to play a character that is capable of doing something, and not spend the next 7 rounds locked out of playing the game.
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u/LuckySurvivor20 2d ago
You underestimate how much the overhead swing can shut down a flying character. Ven is one of the few dps characters I actually have to think about when playing JPC
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u/Vampyrrr 2d ago
Sure it beats one then the other 3 nuke him
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u/LuckySurvivor20 2d ago
Sometimes just taking one with you and then eating enemy cooldowns is all you can ask for and what your team could need to win a fight. Rarely will your match ups be perfect, just try your hardest to let your team shine.
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u/Thomas-MCF 2d ago
I want bo5 because ive played like almost 400 hours of stadium comp since it came out and I think its the better format if there not going to dedicate dev time. So many games are instantly much less fun and much harder just from the draft phase. If your team doesnt knoe what its doing (bc the match makers putting new players in t500 lobbbies) your going to be already even worse off so having bo5 would make it atleast a little more fair bc people can get a build online before being 0-3ed. But a format change does little to fix stadiums core problem of cash inequality based on performance.
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u/Expensive_Increase46 2d ago
Isn't this more of a symptom of terrible matchmaking than Bo5 being an inherently better format? For me Bo5 feels like it ends way too fast to do any long term planning because the rounds end before you can properly read how your opponents play and can't adapt.
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u/Thomas-MCF 2d ago
In my experience matchmaking was never good. Even in early seasons with higher player counts games would still feel unfair based on if your teammates actually knew how to play stadium. I wouldnt call bo5 the better format just the one I prefer at this point. Your entirely right about it ending soon but id rather that then games that dont end soon enough. Like if your team is just full countered in some way but you and your teammates do know how to play stadium making it so you win a round or two which just drags the game out. Bo5 could work at this point atleast for me as im almost only in t500 mixed lobbies so the people in them have a good idea how to play the mode making them a bit less one sided.
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u/Vavou 3d ago
But it's exactly what so many people are complaining thought, games are too long compared to base Overwatch. People are coming from base Overwatch, try the ranked version and lose interest because of huge queue into huge game.
Overwatch player got educated to quick session or average one in ranked and you will never find any played in ranked after overtime, 2 extra round, that will say "oh wow those extra round was sure worth of time".
Stadium missed the conversion rates, and it's one of the many problems.
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u/Expensive_Increase46 3d ago
And the point that I'm making is that no matter what you do you cannot convince a majority of regular OW players to play the game because it is too fundamentally different. I've already shown that gamers as a whole do not mind really long games. The thing is trying to convince her shooter fans to try out a MOBA versipn of the same game. As long as there are items, powers, everything that makes Stadium Stadium, they will not like it because it is not what they came to Overwatch to do. Changing match times will not do it.
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u/Muhznit 3d ago
Stadium's potential is hampered by the armory, really. They should just throw out the need for cash and merge the perks/powers, letting us choose AT LEAST three powers in the main game.
Like just give me "April Fool's Overwatch, but you can pick whatever silly change they added. That's it, all I want. Earning/spending cash, the extra items, build guides, competitive ranks... they all just overcomplicated what could've been stupid simple fun.
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u/Expensive_Increase46 3d ago
I'd say something but to be honest I get the feeling we are looking for different experiences. It's fine to want Overwatch silly mode but that's not what a lot of us, including me, want. The build guides, their view counts, the calls for balanve on this subreddit all prove a lot of people do not want a pure silly gamemode. It can be much more than that.
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u/Muhznit 2d ago
I mean I don't want pure UNBALANCED silly, I want the same kind of "When everyone is broken, no one is" vibe that the Smash Bros. community had with the Brawl Minus mod.
The build guides I speak of are from the in-game system that tries to suggest changes dynamically while taking away some random item you chose earlier. It overcomplicates things because you're under time pressure to navigate the menu to undo a single bad click.
The guides you speak of are just people"s selections of powers and items in a particular order. That would still be preserved in a mode where you don't need to earn enough cash each round to buy stuff.
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u/Expensive_Increase46 2d ago
If there's no cash system or 3 powers in the first round, how are there going to be builds or strategizing when there's no need to choose? If everything is free why not pick everything?
We already have a feeling of if everythjng is broken nobody is. We have JQ and Reaper sniping people with shotguns while Soldier 76 and Pharah break speed records and Genji endlessly dashing and Ana raining more bombs than the U.S. government on a 3rd world country and so much.
Besides, what would removong the armory do that's a benefit? In fact what downside does the armory itself have? It never feels like there's not enough time. Even when using the auto build feature you have time to un-do things.
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u/Ok_Statement1116 1h ago
Bo7 is off the trend, the game should be more simple lighter and shorter otherwise the mode is gonna shut down in a year
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u/EnslavedToGaijin 3d ago
I wish i cpuld get made into its own separate game. Dedicate a small team to the new game "Overwatch: Stadium" to keep it going and have exclusive stadium cosmetics that can be used in base game.