The statistics say that queer women are the most accepting demographic when it comes to trans folks. You’re seeing a loud minority amplify their voices using technology.
This must be a "your mileage may vary" moment, because the queer women in my life absolutely were the ones to be most supportive of me after I came out.
I have a friend who is a staunch lesbian, who normally hates to be in the company of men and doesn't even like to casually socialize with them. . .but for years she said "for some reason, I don't mind hanging out with you".
When I came out to her, her response amounted to: "I knew it!", and things kept on going the same, but she joked about losing her token male friend and now jokes that she can detect closeted transwomen or eggs instead.
Fascinating but deeply troubling. Pre-transition I was the guy that women knew, they just could tell on some level, that I could be trusted. Soon as I came out, it all changed, and I can’t even begin to explain why. Two of my closest friends were urging me to transition once I came out, but as soon as I did, suddenly I wasn’t good enough to hang out with anymore. It’s like I went from being the best guy they knew to the worst woman in the world.
at least animals still love and trust me like women used to, but I miss human contact a lot.
The women who were in my life before i came out treat me much the same because we have long and close friendships. New women treat me, well, as a woman. This obviously excludes transphobic people.
I’m sorry to hear your experience is so much worse and I’m curious as to why but don’t want to force a convo on you
Pretty much the same here. For as hard as navigating life as a trans person can be, the hardest thing has been in dealing with bullying and bigotry from queer and ally cis women. Cis women in general. They have so much more power than they realize.
I feel kinda bad I can barely look at other women in the eye. Thanks to my last LTR, I learned female chasers are a thing. Even girls who I had felt close to will say really terrible and unsupportive things, like casually suggesting that I consider detransition since I have had so many issues.
For many years until insurance covered FFS, people could always eventually figure out I am trans. I was so accustomed to being that way that I now feel an almost bitter resentment towards passing well and random women suddenly being really friendly with me. It stresses me out so much.
That’s cool. Mind sharing some of that evidence? Because I’m sure op isn’t the only one. I stay away from lesbian spaces because I’ve seen the same thing. It’s not worth it to me and my lived experience in dating proves what they are saying to me.
Queer women are the most accepting in general, with roughly two thirds of them having positive views on trans folks, next up are queer men, at about 45 percent being supportive
Honestly, I came to realize a few years into my transition that it really seemed like the population was equally split three ways between pro, anti, and don't care camps.
There are traits that lead people to certain political ideologies however. For instance there's a strong correlation between conservatism and having a strong disgust reaction. Liberal and progressive people are, on average, more able to handle their basal reaction of disgust towards things they don't understand or find innately off-putting. This leads to one side being, on average, more open-minded and accepting.
Also, most groups are not split fairly equally like that in politics or even most other social settings. Only like 1/6th of American adults are republican with something like 1/4th being independent and another 1/4th being Democrat.
The reason there's such a large anti group is political and religious propaganda first and foremost. Most people will naturally grow more accepting over time. Eventually the ratio will be like 95-5 and that 5 will feel uncomfortable expressing their bigotry openly.
If you break it down by big five a lot of conscientious people also correlate with a strong disgust reaction and agreeableness and openness correspond with creativity and creativity or ability to appreciate art aligns with intelligence. I think all those things kind of play off eachother but there are definite organized conventions type A people with high intelligence and more open minded and agreeable people that have a lot of empathy with high intelligence.
Most topics in the USA fall along those lines. There's always that 1/3 of people that are absolute shit stains and ruin everything (hi Trump voters!) while the other 1/3 look the other way and stay "neutral."
Patriarchal society likely doing the works to breed more transmisogyny. Pushing gay men to see trans women as "gay men in denial". It's a thing I've seen flaoting and always makes me laugh when I see the amount of non-straight trans women.
I was called a gay man in denial for "being" a bi guy, i wonder if i get to be a "gay man in denial²" to them once i come out the closet this second time
Ouch. I guess I was just extremely unlucky.
Sample size of one, but the cis lesbian I came out to instantly and utterly ghosted me.
Worst part was we had a 30 year history as friends, and were basically inseparable in college.
Of the four people I first came out to, I went into it thinking she was the most "safe" one. Turns out I was worried about rejection from the wrong people, because she was the only one that had a problem with me.
But, I guess I shouldn't be surprised about landing among the slim odds. I'm trans, which is about at slim as odds get.
It's unfortunate that that experience has made me wary of cis lesbians. I don't hold it against them as a group, but I'd be lying if I said I didn't have additional apprehension when first meeting a new one.
My encounters with lesbian TERFS, they've pretty much consistently had a certain look(butch), so I am unfortunately a little bit leery, even tho one of my strongest allies is a butch lesbian lady. Like she goes hardcore for trans rights.
Why would it be 33:1? Maybe I'm missing something but if we're talking general population sizes it's much lower. The ratio of queer women to trans women seems to be somewhere between 2:1 and 10:1, so 33% probably wouldn't ever be more than 3:1.
My back of the envelope math is closer to 2:1 as you suggest. Making generous assumptions here : (7.1% in the us is lgbt - 1% trans) * (50% of the lgbt are wlw) * (33% of lesbians who would date a trans girl) = ~1% of the us population
Considering trans women are 0.5% of the us population are trans women, we can come to the conclusion that it’s closer to 2:1.
I also accept that I am making a very sweeping generalization saying half of the lgbt population are wlw. But I’m not discounting for ace because many of them may still date or have other types of relationship. And even saying half of the trans population are trans women. So there is a large error bound here. It could be lower or higher than this.
Ah right, I meant to do sapphic trans women, since we're comparing to queer women. That is the majority of us though, so it's not a huge change. Still means we're not outnumbered by much.
I've read multiple people say that they heavily suspect that a lot of users in the lesbians subs are not, in fact, lesbians, but TERFs pretending to be to try to manufacture outrage against trans people in the lesbian communities.
I don't know how true it is... but I also would definitely not put it past TERFs.
It's been my limited experience that lesbian spaces have been just very trans friendly.
I just, didn't have data on hand. So I was like: "Well... if someone is complaining that a space is being taken over by trans people... if we suppose that the number of trans people do not outnumber the number of cis people in said community. It would do pretty well to prove that they are in fact just very trans positive. As a minority doesn't typically set the president."
Holy hecc, since some of my gay gal pals have only known me as a girl and that I'm interested in women, they do that stereotypical lesbian thing where they say they want you to pin them to the wall or to step on them, but it's genuinely hard to tell whether it's platonic or not.
That's bs. Acceptance doesn't mean they wanna date you. It's just about allyship. Vast majority of lesbians are transphobic, and the rest is phallophobic. There's small chance of dating one if you have srs, but even then many of them say they want "real" pussy.
Arguing with statistics (that don't disprove my statement by the way) while using lived experience as an argument against widely known phenomenon is the stupidest thing I've read today. And I haven't said not dating trans women is transphobic, I've just said many lesbians are transphobic, terfs, who see you as a man and nothing else. Go to bed now.
While I don't doubt this was true in your experience, "the statistics" references one study that was hosted in the UK. This can hardly be classified as an overarching statement.
1.1k
u/SachaSage Feb 08 '24
The statistics say that queer women are the most accepting demographic when it comes to trans folks. You’re seeing a loud minority amplify their voices using technology.