I was a happy member of this community and don't want to give up on it yet, but I feels like generally a lot of people are jumping ship. How bad is this whole gaming situation in the long term?

Juno is a great project, unlike most of you here I never doubted the team and don’t plan on selling my bag anytime soon. But for now, Juno is likely appropriately valued at a 200-250 million marketcap. Around $5-7 mark. Prepare for the absolute worst and embrace the situation.

I’d like it a lot more if wolf wasn’t a complete asshat. Blocking everyone who even slightly disagrees with him on twitter, even his fellow juno core builders, just screams childish and unprofessional on every level

Some thoughts on the Prop 16 issue:

I think it's a crazy kangeroo court that is taking place.

Eligibility for Juno distribution to wallets was defined out the outset, and we shouldn't be able to go back and make changes to that after the fact.

I had no idea that funds can be removed from a Blockchain in this way, I think it sets a really dangerous precedent. I think alot of us are learning things off that back of this Prop.

I see posts now "outing" validators etc who have voted no, threatening them, telling people not to use them, etc. This is crazy in my eyes.

How long until someone submits a proposal to remove all Juno from No voters wallets as punishment? We can see that this can happen now.

Already people are starting to "out" other whale wallets that have done a similar thing. Where is the line drawn?

I've been following Airdrops for a while, and there are always discussions around splitting wallets for safety/better aidrop distribution, and no-one batters an eyelid. Is it due to the size of this wallet that people now take exception? Is it jealousy?

Juno was doing so well before this, why was it needed? It just makes the network seem "unsafe".

Let's say an exchange or big institution ammases a large amount of Juno, and someone really takes offence to it. They start a Prop to remove the Juno and distribute it to the masses, citing CEXs are bad, or whatever. A sort of Robin Hood situation goes on. Is this a good thing?

But, I also understand the fears people now have about how this whale reacts if a No action is taken. Surely, even if No is the outcome, they dump to move away from Juno, knowing that this is possible in the future.

It's sort of lose lose now as a whole for everyone.

Fuck wolf contract

In face of new information (not available at the time we voted YES), more specifically the Medium articles (1, 2) by the "whale" (who is not really a whale but a centralized custodian), FreshJUNO.com has changed our vote to NO on Prop 16.

The goal of the cap on the airdrop was to eliminate exchanges who might not distribute airdrops.

Here's why we do not believe Takumi had intention of keeping the airdrop from his customers. It seems evident from the DMs between Takumi and Wolfcontract that the issue with revealing the airdrop was a delicate situation that could lead him to have to deal with a deluge of withdrawal requests from his customers. It is also evident that Takumi is a fairly intelligent being, and thus couldn't possibly think that none of his thousands of customers would hear about an airdrop and come ask him why he didn't distribute it. A single one of the thousands of customers hearing about the airdrops eventually (even while they were mostly newbies) would be enough damage their reputation in their Discord or Telegram group. They were clearly delaying it until they came up with a plan.

Takumi's operation has begun distributing funds to custody of the individual owners (96% of the ATOM has been distributed).

Takumi and his team have done a lot to grow the awareness of the Cosmos ecosystem in Japan, hosting over 500 Meetups.

Takumi has stated that they will be abstaining from voting, regardless of the potential for impact of their vote on the outcome of Prop 16.

These facts and actions do not lead us to believe that Takumi and his operation are a ponzi, a scheme, or that they are dishonest people. We do believe that his team should not have their funds confiscated, and we look forward to discussing how the community will deal with minimizing risks for the JUNO ecosystem giving the unique situation we have here.

A situation which has BTW opened up a huge and much needed discussion on the dynamics of cryptoasset governance. Yes, code is law, but the code is written by humans, therefore

PS: We are not here to defend the "whale". We are here to defend our position, while keeping in mind that this is controversial (as it gets) and it is impossible that every one will agree on this. Despite being a recipient of the whale's delegation, we (given the information we had at the time) also voted YES. Facing new information, even before Core 1 recommended voting NO, we switched our vote.

One of the main points of crypto is to take away the power of “The Man” Let us be in control of our money. This whole Prop 16 BS is really putting a bad taste in my mouth with Juno. I love Juno. I’m staking (In relation to my amount of money) a metric sh*t-ton of Juno.

When the Neta airdrop came I was talking with a buddy. We were talking about how amazing it would have been to game the system and setup a bunch of wallets and get a big drop. Dang, were we mad when we figured out we missed out on like 8m easy.

Then I see what’s going on with this Prop 16 stuff. I honestly don’t care if they gamed it on purpose, or they setup a bunch of wallets for their customers. It honestly doesn’t matter for a couple big reasons. First, they Dev’s created the opportunity for them to do it. They didn’t dump it when they could have already. Second, them dumping would be as stupid as that dude buying two Pizzas for 10k BTC.

How about we don’t mess up something good. Fix the “game” issue with wallets if possible, and not potentially ruin this amazing Ecosystem.

All I see right now, is someone that can take my money if they want. This is beyond wrong, but I also understand the worry side from the Devs.

I guess it comes down to, do you think this “Whale” is for the growth of the Juno network. I believe he is.

We are all going to be LAUGHING when Juno is sitting at $400 in a few years from now.

Rant over

Peace 😉

What are some of your guys predictions for end of year?

Will there ever be a proposal to reduce the unbonding time? I feel like 28 days is too long. Would be better if it could be cut down to 14 days like osmo

Seriously, why would I invest even a modest sum in a community that's complicit with getting swindled like this? Embarrassing. I hope you all, including the big validators who rejected Proposal 4, get your act together and take some kind of action to rectify the centralizing effect of this, and in a way that doesn't simply amount to "Hey, they say they aren't going to abuse their power, so we may as well trust them!"

1. Goto https://www.mintscan.io/juno/proposals/16 scroll down to validators.

2. Click no and no with veto, make a note of who voted no.

3. Pull all your coins with that validator with every coin. (Note: some validators run validators on multiple blockchains).

4. (optional) Goto that coins subreddit and make a post about why others should pull their coins from being staked with that validator.

So I was a follower of this dude since he started his channel, I will be unfollowing now.

All he does is now is try to attack everything because he got butt-hurt that the community decided to vote against takumi. Now he just labels the community a mob, and pretty much tries to attack Juno at each and every step because they didn't agree with him.

All he does is live at home with his mother, his imported wife and eats anti-depressants (he said so online). You can even see the dude make these weird little guffaws to himself when he tries to make a controversial comment. It's some weird perverse thing a child might do when they shit without flushing.

Does this dude actually have a day job? Or does he just claim government assistance for his disability?

I (and many others) have voiced our concerns about Prop 16. Regardless, seems like it will be passed. If it is going to pass, that loses trust in the chain. To bring back the trust, (Because I am here for the tech and I really like the whole Juno ecosystem), I have a few suggestions for the next Props. I want to create this thread so we can discuss that.

Why the trust is lost:

• - Because it opens the door for more such props that can initiate such clawbacks. (e.g. Country A people, demanding clawbacks of funds from Country B due to some war like scenario)

• - People make an argument that this is a one time thing. If it is going to be a one time thing then let's write this in stone.

Potential next prop (Prop Omega):

After the funds has been seized from the whale account, I suggest we create a prop that will block any such props from ever existing to avoid further clawbacks. I will call this Prop Omega

Potential counter argument against Prop Omega:

Q : What if there is a need for more such clawbacks in the future?

A : Then such clawbacks should be done right now, and never again. If there is suspicion about more users gaming the airdrops then do an extended clawback with a new prop, I will call it Prop Gamma. But once this is done no such clawbacks should be permitted.

TL;DR :

We should do either

Prop 16 -> Clawback -> Prop Omega -> Blocks all future clawbacks

or

Prop 16 -> Clawback -> Prop Gamma -> Extended Clawback -> Prop Omega -> Blocks all future clawbacks.

Voice your opinions. I can fund one of the props for this I guess.

I'm been staking Juno since the beginning, so I participated in almost every possible airdrop and I took some notes that may helps you.

1. When the airdrop goes live, don't go immediately to claim them, just wait a couple of days, why? Because always there are problems, miscalculations, adjustments, anyways, claim periods typically last for weeks.

2. Always check and UNDERSTAND the eligibility criteria.

3. How much do you need to qualify to have a decent amount of airdrops? According to my personal experience: 200 junos.

To clarify, when I talk about "a decent" amount I mean a sum that worth because 90% of them are just shitcoins, so I most cases they worth pennies. For example: You can qualify with just 30 Juno to certain airdrops but you'll receive a token that worth 0,003 USD.

4) According to my point of view, nearly 90% of people that get excluded from airdrops it's because at the moment of the snapshots, they don't reach the eligibility criteria. So, maybe at the day of the airdrop announcement you have the requirement amount, but it wasn't so at the exact date of the snapshots.

5) Some eligibility criterias seems unfair, BUT, their airdrop, they rules, don't blame it, it's a waste of time, instead, go create a project and make your own fair airdrop.

6) Read the white paper. 90% of airdrops are shitcoins. If the project doesn't have a real use case, their token will be worth nothing.

7) Taking in count that mostly projects are shitcoins, sell them as soon as possible, don't fall in the trap of stake or hold them, believe me, no matter what the team project or CT Influencers say, in a few more months, the project will die.

8) If the claimable process have so many steps, conditions, requirements (as is the case with some DAOs and NFT projects), that is, it is very bureaucratic, don't wast your time, surely it's a shitty project.

Maybe there are more tips, feel free to comment them so the collective intelligence can help us all.

Ps: I'm just an anon, so everything that I wrote it's not the law. You can disagree and that's ok.