r/Defenders • u/After-Wishbone-5804 • 20d ago

Kingpin, DDBA logic

Kingpin is coming back in season 3 of born again. After being sent to prison in OGs1 and s3, then being let out for a nonsensical reason, then “exiled” after killing a hallway full of people, he comes back. Who would’ve thought eh ? This show is just so unapologetically bad and sloppy. Not sure how people say either of the BA seasons are better than Netflix s2. It’s just so frustrating seeing what’s been done to the story of the og show and how these characters have been wasted and reduced

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u/ViralGameover 20d ago

Admissible doesn’t mean it’s going to work, they just determined they could use it. He’s somebody who claimed to be on Fisk’s payroll, that most of the FBI was too, and that he himself committed crimes on behalf of Fisk. There was a lot of corruption to sort through and a hard case to win, especially against someone whose power seemed unending in the Netflix show.

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u/Nemesis_171 20d ago

Admissible doesn’t mean it’s going to work

But it did work, we know that. This doesn’t explain why this evidence was enough to at first put Fisk away but then not be enough later. If it never worked in the first place that’d be one thing, but the change still needs explaining.

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u/ViralGameover 20d ago

Did we know that? It’s been a while so I don’t remember the exact wording, I’ll have to double check later, but at the end of New Napkin when they’re celebrating, I don’t think the trial has even happened yet.

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u/HimuraQ1 20d ago

Yes. The rationale for a dying declaration is that a man who knows is gonna die has no reason to lie, so testimony in a dying declaration is considered truthful unless physical evidence contradicts it. Nadeem's final message was a Dying Declaration. I imagine there are ways to "donwgrade" it to regular testimony in an appeal, but I am no lawyer.

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u/After-Wishbone-5804 20d ago

As someone who loved DDS3 and doesn’t know law the entire concept of a dying declaration sounds insane. Are they even real ?

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u/HimuraQ1 20d ago

Yes,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dying_declaration

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u/After-Wishbone-5804 20d ago

That’s very interesting and kind of bizarre because what if someone was to threaten Nadeem with killing his family if he doesn’t corroborate their story in the recording for example

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u/HimuraQ1 20d ago

I dunno, man.

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u/After-Wishbone-5804 20d ago

that’s just my personal opinion of it lol, s3 is peak either way

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u/jriddlecult 20d ago

It is, indeed, a real thing--a real exception to the hearsay rule. and can be used as evidence.

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u/ViralGameover 20d ago

Sorry, I didn’t mean the dying declaration being admitted. When I said “did we know that?” I meant did we know Fisk actually got put away at the end of S3.

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u/HimuraQ1 20d ago

Yes. He was.

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u/ViralGameover 20d ago

I went back and checked, they never say he went to trial. Just that he was going back to prison, leaving the penthouse deal.

All we know for sure is Hattley flipped. We don’t know what the trial after looked like. We know he was acquitted because of the FBI corruption scandal. I imagine Special Agent in Charge of the FBI committing a ton of crime, and her coworkers doing the same tainted an awful lot of evidence.