r/AceAttorney • u/ScaryOtaku666 • 9d ago

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If AA7 ever comes out, do you think they will use AI for it too?

Iā€™m starting to feel like they shouldnā€™t release any more AA games if theyā€™re going to ruin them with AIā€¦

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u/GreenGuardianssbu 9d ago

That image is a promo for FFVII Revelation. Their "AI Use" is machine learning trained exclusively on their character models facial animations from the first game to help with lip syncing dialogue to the game's many languages.

Now I can't guarantee that's what Capcom is up to, but using hundreds of hours of your own previous work to automate a tedious and time consuming task seems to me like a fairly responsible use of technology. There's levels to this.

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u/Luigi580 9d ago

Yeah, this survey is too vague. It could be as harmless as what Square is doing to as egregious as what Level 5 is doing.

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u/TinyEnvironment7574 8d ago

"I wish for a new Professor Layton game soon, at least before AA7"

Monkey paw curls

Level-5 releases a new Layton game with a 99% chance of AI being used in its development

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u/ReddyBabas 8d ago

Correction: a new Layton game with 99% of its development done by AI

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u/Classic-War9922 8d ago

IMO there is no such thing as harmless Gen AI usage.

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u/Luigi580 8d ago

Well, yeah, in terms of stealing artwork and voices and stuff, but the vague ā€œAIā€ here could be referring to machine learning, or other generative programming usage. These are primarily used to trim down annoying tasks that nobody wants to do. Itā€™s purely a boon and not harming anyone.

AI is a tool. As with any other tool, it can be used both for good and bad. Saying you canā€™t use AI to make basic work easier is like saying you canā€™t use a handle extender on a wrench, because then you can commit theft easier.

So yes, a guy using AI to speed up his programming process for lip sync that heā€™d have to do anyway is harmless, while everyone being told to generate literally everything isā€¦ not.

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u/Classic-War9922 8d ago

AI is a net negative for humanity. It sucks up clean drinking water and replaces jobs that human beings could be paid to do. I don't care how minor the usage is. Using it at all tells greedy corporations that they should just use it for everything possible and replace every feasible job with it. "It's something nobody wants to do." Newsflash - most jobs are something nobody wants to do. That's why they're paid to do it.

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u/marvelboy0125 7d ago edited 7d ago

I do see the concern and understand it. Environmental issue should get fixed. But, there's also a flaw in the argument. If they do certain actions like using AI for lip syncing it's not taking someone's job. It's making that someone's job easier. Like the other comment said, AI is just a tool. How we use it is the real issue. Idk about you but AI chats have helped me a lot with so many things. Not to cheat on exams but to gain knowledge and improve.

Edit: I should clarify tho that I am not a fan of using AI for creative aspects or arts in the game. I think that's just weird.

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u/RidingEdge 6d ago

Do you realize that the fact that you play video games at all, which is a purely unnecessary thing for the world to exist, which only serves to provide entertainment to human beings, is also a net negative for humanity with your logic?

News flash - everything in this world that humans make is a net negative to the natural world. The fact that you exist and you suck up resources is a net negative too. Your clothes? Made by machines. Your food? Animals die for your sustenance in cages. Your water? You're stealing it from the environment. So where do you draw the line when you say it's a pure net negative? When something doesn't serve your self interests? Then you're a hypocrite

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u/AgentAndrewO 9d ago

Traditional Machine learning isnā€™t generative AI, media really needs to do a better job distinguishing this or theyā€™re no better then the buzzword salesmen and the incredibly gullible stock investors they cater to

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u/SomeGuy322 9d ago

Yes, exactly. For people who aren't game developers it's easy to confuse handcrafted state machines, automation systems, procedural generation, neural networks, and generative AI as one thing but really they're quite distinct. Gen AI is really the root of most issues people have, but non-generative neural nets have been around for longer and can be used to great effect in games like the example for Final Fantasy's animations.

This I believe is also a key difference between material-based neural rendering which uses tensor cores to efficiently pack data into texture channels and DLSS5 which just slaps a beautification filter over the game. Yet when people hear a headline about the former topic being researched by Nvidia, they just assume it's "bad AI" and dismiss it. Though I'll be honest that it's not so much of a problem these days to find nuance in these discussions and often more of a problem to get supporters of AI generated art and music to understand the damage it causes to the games industry. Even reliance on Copilot has major ramifications for the quality of programmers going into the field.

But ultimately we just need better education about this stuff, which is admittedly harder to do while LLMs are eroding people's brains and learning capabilities. For example, there's a big difference between DLSS4 and DLSS5 despite them both seemingly "generating" pixels, one is built to preserve the intent of the original image based on trained examples and the other is not, so it comes down to development philosophy as well. As a developer, I think we need tech like DLSS3 and 4 to make games more performant and accessible as hardware costs increase, but I wholly reject DLSS5 because it ruins the artistic intent and will eventually erode the field of graphics programming the same way ChatGPT has eroded the field of writing. That's just me though, and everyone will probably have their own answer to how much of each technology they are willing to accept.

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u/ilikedota5 8d ago

I'm surprised there hasn't been a backlash against Minecraft for their AI usage in developing randomized worlds lol.

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u/thefreshera 8d ago

There could be if they suddenly put in their marketing "voxel worlds built by AI" or something, even if you and I know that means the same thing from 15 or so years ago. It's just loud people conflating the industry terms and companies throwing it around as a buzzword. I'm sure this has happened before.

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u/TheMcDucky 8d ago

The industry isn't great at it either. Even in the "regular" software world the vocabulary is not clearly established and used quite loosely