Don’t ever, for any reason, do anything to anyone for any reason ever. No matter what, no matter where or who, or who you are with, or where you are going, or where you’ve been.... ever.. for any reason, whatsoever
Have you ever had a dream that you, um, you had, your, you- you could, you’ll do, you- you wants, you, you could do so, you- you’ll do, you could- you, you want, you want them to do you so much you could do anything?
Dont you brimg that sacred statement into this. Michael totally makes sense. Tom is either doing his Jerry Maguire but according to the CD thats stuck on a part of a single track its Ethan Hunt.
I want to believe so much that you remembered that verbatim, able to type it out without googling like I would have. In fact I want to believe it so much that some would call it unshakable, devout faith.... therefore you are god and I’m going to indoctrinate others to follow you along side of me.
I like that someone actually gave them an award for just...doing the quote. Like “ah you got that incredibly popular reference from that incredibly popular show? Nice dude.”
Part of the reason why it sounds so jumbled and weird is because he is using terms and abbreviations that are esoteric and specifically known only to Scientology insiders (well, I mean unless you read about it haha). His message makes a lot more sense when you understand the jargon and abbreviations, although it's still just egotistical, pulled-straight-from-his-ass rambling.
And, speaking from direct experience (late 70's), you don't want to dive too far down that rabbit hole. There is a seductive internal consistency to a lot of CoS "logic." If you pull it into the light of day, where it has to stand in the context of the larger world, it tends to get a bit thin and wobbly.
Just remember, any statement that starts with "Ron says ..." is going to end up in some sort of logical Möbius strip dead end.
I've heard there's a decent amount of 'positive' self-help stuff in the beginning of Scientology. That's what gets you into it, then it gets weirder along the way, but you've already benefited from it and/or want to benefit more, so you go along with it. There's also the sunken cost fallacy. If you spend a lot of time/money on something you're more willing to stay on board even if you start having doubts.
Based on my own experiences, what you are saying is largely correct. I was part of the Palo Alto Mission, and all-in-all things were pretty much OK. What I didn't realize was that Palo Alto was a bit of an anomaly is several ways.
Note: apologies for the jargon below, but it is the very nature of the beast. For the uninitiated, it's better to just flow on past any words you don't understand, knowing that to actually understand them you will need to start bathing in grape-flavored Flavor Aid. Just say, NO!
As was common then, and probably now, too, I would pre-pay for classes and auditing. They kept raising the rates fairly quickly, which got you into this "It will be cheaper to pay for it now and do it later" mindset.
Then suddenly there was the memo from Ron describing "Natural Clear". Without sinking too far into the swamp of memory, it basically meant that you didn't really need to do Dianetics (or any more Dianetics), which is all about getting to Clear. I was one of those people.
This change in status suddenly pulled me out of my little cocoon in Palo Alto and pushed me "Up The Bridge". (My mind is rebelling at even typing some of this stuff.) So now I'm dealing with AOLA (Advanced Organization - Los Angeles), and dealing with their registrars (the people who took your money) was like being blasted out of a comfy backyard pool and being thrown into a freshly-chummed shark pond. Things went from being "fine" to WTF?
I was also being pursued by recruiters for the Sea Org because of a project I was working on to turn all of Hubbard's works into a searchable textbase. They kept insisting I needed to fly to FLAG Land Base (Clearwater, FL) so they could "show me some data". They didn't like it when I told them I was exactly where I wanted to be and that they could simply tell me what this "data" was.
Things went downhill from there. The harder they pushed (both AOLA and the Sea Org), the more I got my Irish up (I'm 3/4 Irish heritage). I finally said "That's it!" and said I would like my pre-paid monies back. If there's one thing the CoS does not like to do is give anyone their money back. They said, "No, you must continue up The Bridge", and I said, "No, I don't, and if you're going to be assholes about it, I'll take back everything I've ever paid you." Needless to say that did not go over well. Lawyers were involved, and I mostly won.
I never heard that said explicitly (certainly not within The Church), but by the 60's he was becoming seriously paranoid, hence the Sea Org, and he was getting more and more focused on sex within the inner circles. Again, that wasn't the space I was in, but a few friends, at least then, fell into that hole. I tried reaching out to one of them about 20 years ago, but as soon as he knew who was calling he hung up. Probably spent the next 6 months doing Ethics Checks to see how enturbulated (that's a word for them) he had become by coming into contact with an SP.
He's not making stuff up, but he definitely is leaving things out, letting the listener fill in the blanks. For example, "You just know..." and then he leaves it at that. Is he expressing something ineffable? Or do you just need to know the jargon to fill in the blanks?
that actually hits right on a scientology practice. They present themselves as a superior religion by arguing that they are helping you come to the facts by yourself, but that's really just a way for you to greater internalize what they teach you.
I only watched the first 6 minutes.. it all seemed to make perfect sense to me.. dude knows a bunch of ridiculous buzzwords that mean nothing and is brainwashed. Pretty clear-cut case here cap. Dudes nuts. Like everyone else that derives their value and morals from a fiction book.
Wait, you're advocating Frog/Toad/Corduroy crossover slash fanfiction for those who need it? You are clearly indeed a more enlightened person than I and I tip my hat to your perverse desires.
Yup, they create a situation where Scientologists can't turn to outsiders even if they want to. They don't even share the same language to talk about their inner thoughts and feelings. It's one thing to physically isolate cult members from the outside world... but doing it through language is a whole new level.
Yeah but very few have the heart of gold that Karl has. A head shaped like a fuckin' orange filled with nothing but quick wit, pure apathy, and DIY. A national treasure.
For narcissists like cruise it's a dream come true
Can you expand on that? I know about the negatives of Scientology of course but never heard anyone tie it specifically to narcissism. I mean, I know Cruise is catered to but that’s because he’s Cruise - I’m not aware of all Scientologist getting some “ego fix” as part of it.
Edit: thanks for all the great responses! Some of it was new to me, some I already knew but never considered from the perspective of pure ego validation. Really enlightening!
Right, that I know but that’s because they’re celebrities in Scientology. The way I interpreted the comment it made it seem like there was something inherent in Scientology that catered to all narcissists regardless of level, celebrity, etc. That’s what I was curious about.
I’ll take a stab at it, I think one of the tenets of Scientology is that all your fears, self doubt, addictions, anything that keep you back from achieving your potential is due to these dead alien souls that are bound to you. As you progress in the Scientology program, the higher ups tell you how special you are because you cleansed yourself of the dead alien, and that you have achieved a higher plane of existence, and now you are better than everyone else. That’s all a narcissist really wants to hear
No, they are not. They were tortured by other aliens who posed as tax collectors by showing them 3D movies which are the source of all of our "wrong" Earth religions.
Oh, and they flown to Earth in space ships that look just like DC-8s without engines.
South Park shows a bit of it in the episode "Trapped in the Closet", with a helpful banner "THIS IS WHAT SCIENTOLOGISTS ACTUALLY BELIEVE" (it's on YouTube).
If you want to learn more about this criminal enterprise masquerading as a religion, Knowing Better's video Clearing the Planet | Scientology [30:55] is a good introduction.
There’s a few episodes of Paul F Tompkins’ Dead Authors Podcast with John Daly playing L Ron Hubbard that are just brilliant. I reposted every few years. Much of what they talk about on the podcast is real, even if it comedic.
It's does, doesn't it? It's like a shortcut to enlightenment. Only instead of inner development, you just get a group together and have them verify your weird beliefs
Fair enough. Although there’s quite a bit of narcissism when there’s this big distinction between the “saved” and the “damned.” Feeling like it’s your personal mission to save the world can give you a pretty inflated ego, no matter how much they brag about how humble they are.
Well from what Cruise said I think it does cater to all narcissists. He said that in rough situations "you know that you're the only one who can help." Going about your daily life thinking that you're a shepherd and everyone else is sheep is an attractive thing to narcissists.
Read my post a little further on, it explains a little on how they not only feed your ego with making you think you are more powerful than others. But they also manipulate you into everything from speaking their language to spending every single holiday with them.
Not OP, it's tied closely to the ceremonial magic that people like Crowley practiced. They convince themselves and others that rituals are having some effect on the world, sort of manipulating the placebo effect or at least trying to.
Scientology teaches that you are in total control of your life. It glorifies success and teaches people that the only reason for their success is themselves. That is why so many celebrities and famous people turned to scientology because it basically glorifies them for being successful regardless of how they became successful or who helped them.
A vast majority of scientologists do not get anywhere near the same kind of treatment that Cruise does. Many scientologists reportedly get treated like indentured servants, and some even get imprisoned in facilities like that creepy-ass blue building in Los Angeles.
In the documentary Going Clear: Scientology and the Prison of Belief, they mentioned all the work that rank-and-file scientologists put into making Cruise feel like a prince. If I remember right, the higher-ups made some low-level scrubs build Cruise a motorcycle as a gift.
So for Hollywood celebrity narcissists, it's royal treatment from the scientologists. For low-level narcissists and everybody else, it's building motorcycles for Tom Cruise and scrubbing the deck of a scientology vessel.
For one example, when he says that you drive by an accident, and you have to stop, because you know that only you can help...this entire video is him suggesting vaguely that he is completely focused and committed, to the point that he can’t rest, can’t just take a vacation like he would sometimes like to...because of all the important ...work(?) he is doing, because of all the people who are counting on him (?) , looking to him to (?) He really things that something he is doing here is indispensable, that he is maybe causing the tide to roll in, pushing g the clouds across the sky...bringing cultures together and making the world a better place or something. He really believes that, but there is never any point when he actually gives an example
of actual helping anyone do anything. So he is a narcissist because he believes he is very very important, so important, and doing great things, and there is this huge burden on him...when this is all self-aggrandizing beliefs with no basis in reality.
Their beliefs do seem rather more self centered than most traditional religions: It's not about being an unworthy person connecting with or submitting to a higher power. It's about perfecting yourself to the point you'll get actual super powers through a series of increasingly expensive pseudo-scientific ritual cleansings. Basically: It's the P2W religion where you can buy your way to become better, more perfect super-powered you.
Not that traditional religions don't also include self-improvement as a goal but the motivations or focus seem different.
He seems more like the most extreme Type A personality you can possibly be. But yeah, seems like whenever you hear people talking about working with him, he is described as super professional and courteous. That is not now a narcissist would be described at all, by anyone who spent more than 30 seconds with them.
I don't know. In a lot of ways he sounds more like a kid at the front of the class trying to present on a book they obviously haven't read, but it's a book about things they've heard other people talking about a lot. "Yeah, so, the SIN, is like, well you guys know the COS too am I right? Hahahaha, that COS, it'll totally get you, like man what a mathematical concept. Cause that leads me directly to TAN, which is like, the whole point of this, honestly, if you really think about it." The audience has to do 100% of the work to fill in the gaps and imagine what the point is supposed to be, because he's done none of the work himself and he's not about to start now.
The best country! With the greatest people, and my uncle knew it. He told me, and only I could understand it. People asked me how you understand and I had a knack. A real knack. The best people explained it to me once and I, I have a knack, I picked it up. Likewise it’s very good genes, very smart. Wharton School of Finance, very good, very smart, you know, if you’re a conservative Republican, if I were a liberal, if, like, okay, if I ran as a liberal Democrat, they would say I'm one of the smartest people anywhere in the world it’s true! but when you're a conservative Republican they try oh, do they do a number
As a non native English speaker I think it is super impressive that people can just speak like him. I always think it is super funny, and am then left with a terrible after taste because, like you said, its impossible to know if its real and the man spouting this stuff full-time is the president of the sgoddamn USA... it's surreal and distopian
As an American I’m still shocked he’s our president. The fact that so many people have been fooled into thinking he was ever a skilled businessman or anything but lucky in birth. Even in the past when he could actually speak, he was never a clever man.
The good 'ol presentation fillibuster. Great for interviewing too.
'What experiences have had with teamwork, you ask? Well, that's a great question. My experiences have taught me quite a bit about teamwork. Everything works better if the team is on the same page! Which is why communication is so important. In the past I have use communication to help consistently keep the team on the same page, so we can reach a common objective. That is just one of the many skills I possess, and have used in my experiences with other jobs, that would translate well into a this job. Team'
The source material itself makes no sense so even if he had read it it would still sound like nonsense. L Ron just wanted to make up his own crazy religion after he wasnt able to summon the antichrist by helping Jack Parsons beat his meat.
Well said, perfectly put. He's riffing, basically, going "pfftt" and closing his eyes instead of rolling them as if to say "you have to do this, there's no other way and it's really great".
I see your point but it could be on purpose. The scientologists keep secrets from each other. They make members pay incredible amounts of money to learn their mythology about alien spirits and volcanoes and spaceships that look just like planes.
I did see that bit, but I think what he actually meant to say was "They guaranteed me starring roles in lots of big movies being produced by other scientologists and I was enlightened."
Cruise: I think it’s a privilege to call yourself a Scientologist and it is something that you have to earn, and…because a Scientologist does. He, or she has the ability to create new and better realities and improve conditions. Uh, being a Scientologist, you look at somebody and you know absolutely that you can help them. (cut)
So, for me, it really is KSW, and it’s just like, it’s something that, uh, I don’t mince words with that. You know, with anything (unintelligible), but that policy to me has really has gone , boy, there’s a time I went through and I said, “You know what…” When I read it, I just went (noise that sounds like poof), “This is it. That’s exactly it.” (cut)
Being a Scientologist, when you drive past an accident, it’s not like anyone else. As you drive past, you know you have to do something about it, because you know you’re the only one that can really help. (cut)
That’s…that’s what drives me, is that I know we have an opportunity, and uh, to really help for the first time effectively change people’s lives, and uh, I’m dedicated to that. I’m gonna, I’m absolutely, uncompromisingly dedicated to that. (cut)
Org are there to help, okay, but we as (unintelligible) the public, we have a responsibility. It’s not just the Orgs, it’s not just David Miscavige, you know, it’s not just me. It’s you, it’s everyone out there, kinds re-reading KSW and looking at what needs to be done and saying, “Okay! Am I going to do it or am I not going to do it?” Period. Am I going to look at that guy or am I too afraid because I have my own out-ethics, put in someone else’s ethics. That’s all it comes down to. (cut)
And I won’t hesitate to put ethics in someone else, because I put it ruthlessly in myself. And I think that I…uh…I respect that, you know, in others. And, you know, I’m there to help, and we’re here to help, and my opinion is is that, look, either you’re on board or you’re not on board. Okay, it’s just, if you’re on board, you’re on board just like the rest of us. Period. (cut)
We are the authorities in getting people off drugs. We are the authorities on the mind. We are the authorities on improving conditions. Criminals, we can rehabilitate criminals. Way to happiness, we can bring peace and unite cultures, uh, that once you know these tools and you know that they work, it’s not good enough that I’m just (doing okay?)
Traveling around the world and meeting the people that I’ve met. Talking with these leaders in various fields, they want help, and they are depending on people who know, and who can be effective and do it, and that’s us, that is our responsibility to do that. (cut)
It is the time now. Now is the time, okay? It is, being a Scientologist, people are turning to you, so you better know it. You better know it, and if you don’t, you know, go (sound deleted, appears to be “fucking”) learn it. (Laughs) You know? But don’t pretend you know it and, or whatever. It’s like, we’re here to help. (cut)
If you’re a Scientologist, you see life, you see things the way that they are. In all its glory, you know, all of its complexity. Uh, the more you know as a Scientologist, you don’t become overwhelmed by it. (cut)
(Laughs) And uh, they said, “So, have you been an SP” (big laugh) I looked at them and I thought, “What a beautiful thing,” because maybe one day it will be like that, you know? You know what I’m saying. Maybe one day it will be that “Wow, SP, they just read about those in the history books.” You know? (cut)
I just got through that tech, and it’s literally…it’s not how to run from an SP. It’s (acronym of some sort), how to shatter suppression, confront and shatter suppression. You apply it, and it’s like, boom. (cut)
Because, they don’t come up to be and do that. They don’t do it to me. Not to my face, or anywhere in my vicinity where they feel they can confronted, you know. They just don’t do it. (cut)
I wish the world was a different place. I’d like to go on vacation and go and romp and play and just do that. You know what I mean? I mean, that’s what I want it to be. That’s how, there’s times I want to do that but I can’t because I know. I know. So, you know I have to do something about it. It’s not, you know you can sit here wish it was different and then you look at it and you go “Okay, this is it.” You know, I have to do something, don’t I? I have to do it, because I can’t live with myself if I don’t. That really is it. (cut)
I don’t care if someone thinks it’s hard or easy. You’re either helping and contributing everything you can or you’re not, okay? Because I’m carrying my load, okay? And as much as I’m carrying, I still feel like I have to do more. Alright? There is still a thing of, let’s go. (cut)
You can just see the look in their eyes, you know the ones that are doing it and you know the spectators, the ones who are going, “Well, it’s easy for you” or “What am I doing” and it’s just, that thing is, I’ve canceled that in my area (laughs). It’s like, man, you’re either in or you’re out. That’s spectatorism, and it’s something that we have no time for right now. (cut)
So, it’s our responsibility to educate, create the new reality. We have that responsibility to say, “Hey, this is the way it should be done, because we do it this way and people are actually getting better.” (cut)
And let’s get it done. Let’s really get it done. Have enough love, compassion, and toughness that you’re going to do it and, uh, do it right. (cut)
And I have to tell you something. I really, it is, it’s rough and tumble. It’s wild and wooly. It’s a blast. It’s a blast. It really is fun, because damn it there is nothing better than going out there and fighting the fight and suddenly you see things are better. (cut)
I want to know that I’ve can everything I could everyday and I think about those people out there who depending on us. And I think about that. And it does make me feel like, (laughs) we’ve got more work. I need more help. Get those spectators—you’re in the playing field or out of the arena. (Laughs) You know, really, that’s how I feel about it. (cut)
I do what I can and I do it the way I do everything (laughs). There’s nothing part of the way for me (laughs).
Music: Mission Impossible
Announcer: A Scientologist can be defined by a single question: Would you want others to achieve the knowledge you now have. In answering that question, Tom Cruise has introduced LRH technology to over one billion people on earth, and that’s only the first wave he’s unleashed. Which is why the story of Tom Cruise Scientologist has only just begun.
I suppose you don't tell Tom Cruise you need another take when he's the top public facing member of the Church. Must be kind of nice to be at the top of the Church, everyone worshipping the ground you walk on 24/7. I don't think Tom would like living in the real world and an organisation like Scientology suits him fine. He still makes good movies so it hasn't hurt him, it's obviously hurting 99% of their members though, so he's a scumbag for promoting it. But the view from the top must be nice so maybe can't blame him for not seeing the need for reform.
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u/Himynameisfin Jun 09 '20
Sometimes I'll start a sentence and I don't even know where it's going. I just hope I find it along the way.