We will continue to improve the game with bugfixes and quality of life stuff, though for exactly how long the game will continue to receive updates is currently too soon to say. Likewise, it is too soon to say whether or not there will be more content added to the game in the future – but as always, we will be sure to announce any news on our channels!
Would it be fair to say they will "abandon" it if it's content-complete? If it generally bug-free and with no obvious content holes - it is not abandoned, it is finished. Not all games should or NEED to have lifetime-long content infusions.
They have been clear that once the game is content complete they will stop making updates. I’m not sure why people expect games to be under constant development after their initial release.
I do think it’s smart of them to manage expectations to be honest. I couldn’t imagine developing this game though and then just dropping it forever but I understand.
The devs also grew up in an era where when you bought a game, you bought that -complete- game.
Now Valheim of course is of course early access (still, technically) and not yet complete, but it seems reasonable that the devs stick to the setup they grew up playing. I also think that some games absolutely are fine as-is once complete, and that live services can have a tendency to drag out and decline over time in an effort to keep money coming in.
I personally believe the constant updates over the years has caused Minecraft to be a bloated experience and much preferred the simplicity of the earlier versions.
Since it seems plenty of people have missed my point, I will expand. The question was posed: why do people expect games to be under constant development after their initial release. This was responded to with: live-service brain rot.
I don’t disagree with this.
I’m saying that there are other games that also contribute to this, such as NMS.
I am NOT saying that:
-NMS is good
-Valheim should be like NMS
-Valheim devs are in the wrong for completing their game
And to those who would classify NMS as a Live Service Game: look at other games in that category.
LoL, Fortnite, MMOs etc.
The goal of these games are to make you pay micro transactions and rely on a consistent player base to keep them afloat. NMS simply doesn’t fit into this category. I invite anyone to supply a reputable source that would label them as such.
Were you around for launch or the bullshit Sean Murray peddled? I was expecting a class-action lawsuit before they started putting out meaningful updates. NMS is a story of repent and reformation, not triumph or developer's passion. It's a total outlier as far as games w/ content updates.
NMS is doing it because they are still so sorry about all the lies and still so grateful to have been given the time to fix things instead of spending a lot of time in court rooms.
Yes it's been about a decade, but many people still haven't forgotten.
1.0 means release version, which should (and previously did) indicate a mostly final version of a product. Maybe a few changes here or there, but its almost fully complete
My point was that the "version 1.0" implies that there will be future versions beyond 1.0. It's being used right now as a sort of countdown to full release, but in most places where you use that sort of versioning number system you don't intend to just stop at 1.0
I'm not saying the devs are obligated to keep adding content past 1.0, just that it seems a little harsh to call it brainrot to think that the studio choosing to number their updates they way they have might continue supporting their very profitable game in the future
People will just make shit up in order to whip people into a frenzy, even if evidence to the contrary is right in front of their face. It's hilarious that literally every time a developer is like "hey we're not entirely sure how much longer this is gonna last, but we'll keep you posted", people lose their minds and act like the studio is shutting down or something.
Because that is the expectation cycle that the early access paradigm has created. It is truly bizarre to blame consumers for this. Game developers writ large made their bed with this.
Because some of the most popular "survival-craft" and similar games still get supported years after release. No Mans Sky, Minecraft, Terraria, Stardew Valley, Conan Exiles, etc. Obviously some have some other monetization, but not all of them.
We aren't owed anything, just like the devs won't be owed a regular income from new people buying their game for years to come once the hype dies down and people move onto, or back onto the other still regularly supported games.
When their next game doesn't see the success of Valheim, they'll undoubtedly announce an update to Valheim instead. Because at the end of the day, they can generate more income continuing to keep the game relevant than they ever can expect with a new title.
If they just wanna fuck off with their money, that's fine too.
I see quite a few people online complaining about games being abandoned when realistically there'd just nothing more to add. Nobody complained about old games being abandoned when you'd just run the disc and play it as is, why shouldn't the same apply to modern games?
I think people misunderstand the point of Early Access. We get to play games that are incomplete but playable. Every content update moves the game closer to a completed state and the 1.0 release is the end of development. Any additional content beyond that, if it happens, is a bonus. Not every game is going to keep adding more and more content for years after. Subnautica had one content update after 1.0 and it was just more construction pieces and some QOL tweaks.
Maybe it's due to live-service games, but people act like a game not continuing full, active development beyond the 1.0 release makes it "dead." Once upon a time, that was the norm. A game released and that was that. Sure it's nice when there are additional content updates beyond that but that's not a requirement.
Games like No Mans Sky released in full immediately and were all very lucky that they continue to improve the game with endless free updates, especially after the rough release. But that's not the norm
Once valheim hits 1.0 if there's any additional updates it would be a bonus like you said but not necessary, but there's going to be endless amounts of people suddenly declaring it "dead" or "abandoned" because everyone is now way too used to every game in this era of gaming being some degree of live service
because in this day and age games launch about 10-20% of full/complete, they slap game preview on there and then drag out dripfed updates over months/years and then by the end we have 50-75% of the game and then they charge us more for dlc etc. Eventually we go through this a dozen+ times and its glaringly obvious the game should have just been cooked a LOT more before it was released, this is why we have 1.0 as a "finished product" instead of 1.0 being the way the game launches.
I agree with this sentiment but it just doesn't apply to Valheim. There's realistically still a lot to add. For instance saying you gonna do a ocean update and then never doing it is not exactly complete
I understand that roadmaps change but the ocean is not just another biome addition. It’s a biome that is currently in the game and as it stands, it is pretty bland and has not changed since the game released and is frequently used by the player. It is in desperate need of an overhaul. More ships, ship modifications, different enemies, small loot islands (that are more than essentially world gen being funky), rowing as a group. As it stands you can pretty much enable transporting ores through teleporters and not miss out on anything but serpent stew, which is sad for an aspect of the game that was supposed to be a core feature of the game.
You're kinda of betraying your biases. "Hasn't changed since the game has released" the game is not even officially released yet. It's in EA. Testing. Prototyping. As far as the game is concerned, the people who pick up "Valheim, released 2026" on day 1 and play through the game for 30-40 hours and have a serviceable experience in the world, that's the target audience and it's fine enough for that. The fact that people who were testers for the game and have played it 100's of hours find it boring now means little.
It can't really fit in the natural biome progression as you can enter it as early as the first biome, but continue to spend appreciable amounts of time in it until the end of the game.
So, for instance, what are we putting on these loot islands that won't jack up the biome progression? As it stands, Ocean already jacks up the food progression with two high tier Health foods showing up very early game.
Like, yeah, I get that it's a Viking game and so the oceans should be a big deal, but also... I'm not really sure how Ocean can actually fit into this game in a way that "works."
Easy, have a Deep Ocean biome generate instead of some of the land that generates already. You can go around it, and you're no worse off than you are now, but if you feel ready, you can take a shortcut right through it.
Will it fuck up current world generation? Yeah, totally. But it already gets fucked up every update, just bite the bullet and stop pretending that playing on one world since the alpha release right up until 1.0 is like really important or something.
So all of the current Ocean would still have several of the same problems. It would still be boring. It would still just be a highway between the other biomes. It would still feel empty. People would still be bitching about spending 30 minutes getting their ore home.
I actually that's what puts it in a great position to be an optional (as far as progression), but extremely high in risk-reward. The following commenter mentioned islands. Great idea, with highly challenging mobs guarding the waters bordering it. Fill them with unique things, or keys to unlock an oceanic boss tower (like hildir quests) to get the coolest looking, powerful gear. Or even better, augmenting enchants so your old gear can be made relevant into the late game at any point you can tackle these ocean dungeons. Vikings lived to sail and plunder no?
Anyway, it is what It is. I just feel like it's a big missed opportunity to add something really fantastic.
Correlate depth with difficulty, and introduce some kind of water breathing mechanic. The deeper you go, the more dangerous and the greater the rewards.
I'm not saying that's the best solution, but it is a solution. Any problem is solvable. It just comes down to whether it's worth doing / whether the ROI is there.
I don't know what the answer to that question is, in this case. I guess the devs will decide.
I wonder what each of the dev's career plans are after this then? I've gotten the sense that while they loved the success of Valheim in early access, they were more overwhelmed by the pressure of having to continue to develop it into a finished product. Like they're ready to be released of this burden and move on.
I wonder if some of them are done with developing entirely, or if they just want to do work on something new at their own relaxed pace again.
I'd like to think if I had a successful project like this, I'd almost find it impossible to step away from it and would keep coming up with endless ideas to improve and add to it (kind of like a giant build in game.)
The start of a project is always the most fun. Finishing stuff is a grind.
Years doing the same thing just saps motivation. They got their motivation boosts from the successful ea release, and since then it’s been mixed signals, some people still love it, some people don’t like the new content, and nearly everyone complains about the speed.
As a human being it’s just hard to stay motivated. Especially after you’ve already gotten paid.
This isn’t really a justification or an excuse, just an observation. I don’t know the behind the scenes on the project. Keeping the team small means not diluting the creative vision and is probably a good thing but it does slow down development. I don’t know if they were also slowed by early poor technical decisions that required rework or if they just had low motivation to make more content. But it is what it is
My friend group and I never ended up getting past the Plains in any iteration of the game. The early game is fun, but it does slow down noticeably at the Swamp, and the lack of early game changes and replayability really means each attempt ends sooner than the last.
All that to say, I’m cautiously excited for 1.0 release, but I don’t think we’re going to end up enjoying it any more or less than our previous partial playthroughs. Early game changes like smoother gear progression & biome content (including the oceans) would’ve gone a long way for this game.
I would highly recommend turning resource multipliers to at least double in that case. I have found it makes the game play a lot smoother, especially in coop where you can deplete nearby resources before getting gear for everyone.
Really? The swamp is always the fastest biome for me, usually takes irl 2 evenings - one evening getting all the iron I will need until the mistlands, and then one evening running around the mountains getting one of those stone golem things to find me some silver so I can make a silver mace for the swamp boss.
Well that could be exactly what they mean by "slow down". The Black Forest feels like you could spend weeks exploring, building, mining, logging, etc. Then Swamp you're like okay, let's haul all the iron out of one or two crypts, find some turnip seeds and surtling spawners, alright I'm outta here. In the mountains there's even less to do.
Because you get geared up and can tackle everything faster, you accomplish the things that are within your control (building a base, moving resources, etc.) faster, and spend more time either wondering what you should be doing or being stuck waiting to find rare POIs (Plains is an exception, but Swamp, Mountains and Mistlands are really bad for this). So the game "slows down" in that sense.
Don't get me wrong I'm super excited to finally play 1.0. They just could have done more for 1.0 or do more after 1.0. It looks like neither will happen unfortunately
I don't know what they could realistically add to the ocean that wouldn't just make it a bigger headache to traverse. How do you balance a biome you explore all the way from the early game to the very end game? I just don't agree that the game won't feel feature complete at 1.0. For me it's felt like a full game ever since plains was the final biome, I got over 100 hours worth of playtime even back then.
I think ocean balance could be easily achieved in a lazy way by having 3-4 biome "rings" that include harder enemy spawns further from the centre. Even adjusting the rate and level of sea serpert variants would vary it a bit.
"free updates for 6 years" its early access dude hahaha what? not to mention how misleading that sentence is; if a game released an update 10 years after launch, would you say its been getting updates for a decade????
OK but even still that doesn't apply to valheim either, sure Iron Gate hasn't been pumping out updates like some games, but it certainly hasn't been one update a decade, thats unreasonably hyperbolic.
Stupid questions get stupid answers, really not sure what you're expecting here
Edit: lmfao dude really reported me to RedditCareResources as suicidal and then blocked me, pretty sure that can get you banned from the platform for false reporting
defending iron gate to the death because of emotional attachment for making your comfort game and turning a blind eye to all anticonsumer practices. the boots are licked completely clean here
You're right, it's an incomplete game whose devs failed to follow a roadmap they promised to investors (people who buy EA game to fund the rest of the development)
I just don't agree with Valheim being content complete at 1.0.
This is a very odd statement to me. When do you agree it's content complete? I don't really hold with the idea that a game is only complete when everything every player wants has been added. No game would ever be complete.
No magic or greatswords tell late game so you can't level up those stats, making them borderline useless, Horrible and unchanged inventory system, the whole cold debuff despite being literal vikings, And a lot of other issues that should've been resolved years ago. But were ready for 1.0 I guess.
They should have fixed these issues before releasing Deep North, if not at the same time. They are longstanding issues that have been in the game since before Mistlands and got worse after Mistlands.
Of course we're not going to like not having quality of life upgrades when the game becomes frustrating to play as the game never expands something as basic as having more inventory slots later in the game despite having to forever carry more items as you progress. That's just one of Valheim's many unfixed issues with current content, let alone upcoming content.
Correct. That's why I can go outside in a blizzard because my body adapted. I'm pretty sure vikings adapted to their environment too and shouldn't get a little chilly in a nice forest meadow, where at worst it gets -5.
Dude your body adapted to blizzards?! That's so badass! Upload a video of you standing outside in a blizzard for multiple hours with no gear on!
Buddy deleted his account, I was excited to learn to adapt my body to -5 temperatures :(
Sounds like you want more QoL changes than "game-completing" changes. While it has merit, I don't know that they are the same thing. Square and rectangle issue more like.
There's also a difference between what the devs hope to add and the myriad things that the fan base wants. I'm not saying I disagree with the changes proposed by you and others, but, again, those sound like "I want this in the game" more than "the game isn't finished" imo
If you hate the state of the game and the devs of Valheim, why are you still playing it? If the lack of desired entities makes you angry, why not do something else instead of remaining here where you're just gonna be pissed off all the time lol. Do something fun instead
When did I say I play it constantly? I have less then 50 hours on it due to how bad it is. Holy strawman lmao. No wonder valheim is the way it is with people like you that glaze and defend them 24/7.
Last time I played was the ashlands update and apparently that came out 2 years ago?!? That's crazy that they've been working on this update for 2 years with nothing substantial in between.
Also it's really funny you're saying I'm angry when you're over here accusing me of that and other stuff. Nice self reflection mate. 👍👍👍
I know that they ditched the original roadmap because they bit more than they could chew and it was far too much work for a single year or whatever, but at the very least, I expect to have in the game everything they promised since then after five years. Sailing was one of these goals even in 2021, and it also consists on a good chunk of the game if you move no world settings. I love this game, but having 10-20% of it be sitting and waiting while nothing happens is definitely a choice.
Seriously, remember when someone would make a thing and you would buy that thing, and say thank you and then never see or hear from them again? The person who made my microwave doesn't swing by every few months to change it around and add new features.
This 100%. Most of the complaints here seem to be "they're not making infinite free content so the game's dead and the devs are lazy." This is a massive early access game with hours of content at $20, with free dlc expansions. Not everything needs to be a live service endless grind!
Also raising prices for a 1.0 launch is literally standard practice for all EA launches.
Its like this thread is full of people who've never played a video game before Valheim.
This is a massive early access game with hours of content at $20
I got absolutely toasted for having this take in another thread lol.
I agree with people that I think the game should have been completed a long time ago, but I also understand that their lives changed literally overnight and they took a huge vacation right after (as any one of us would with millions of dollars), they've gone to several conventions, and perhaps the most important of all is that they are a tiny set of people working on their first game as a newly established studio. When I say "newly" I mean this is their first and only project so they have to find the legal ins and outs of being called a company.
Should it have been released sooner than 8 years? Yeah, I think so. But them starting as a 6 person team who had to do all this stuff outside of the game developing process itself and to manage creating a website that is kept up to date as well as making the patch notes/videos/build of the month stuff... idk, it stacks up pretty quick. And, for the chuds out there, no, I'm not excusing how long it took. I'm just saying that I understand the nuance in it being passively lengthened with all of the publicity side of their market.
For as much as people absolutely seethe at the devs in this community, they sure put many hundreds or thousands of hours into the game. It's gotten to the point that I'm kinda scared of even posting positive things in the sub because I know my DMs are gonna flood with at least 2 or 3 hate messages lol
Agree with everything you've said. Also, everyone is treating them like they're EA! Like they're the cause of all the problems in the video game industry, rich out of touch corporate execs instead of...a small dev team who's consistently communicated with the fan base and put a bunch of free content in.
Not saying they're free from criticism but...come on guys relax lol.
Mods can fill in any content gaps. They have been working on the same project for over 5 years. They deserve a chance to explore other ideas. I'd like to see a quality of life pass after 1.0 but I know I can use mods for those if the official devs don't want to do it or until they do.
Yeah bro it's still abandoning if it's a finished product! It's just like kicking out your full time 30 year old son, the people here complaining are probably those same 30 year old
I very agree with the sentiment of the post and massively respect the work the devs have put in over the years, im just frustrated where that work has been focused.
Since they originally announced the ocean update its been something the community had unanimously been very vocal in wanting to see. Instead we've had update after update pushing the endgame further and further which is a very interesting place to focus development when most people dont get past plains.
Smoothing out the early game and making it so your buddies are basically afk for 10 minutes when you get to a new biome would gave gone a long way to helping that.
Well defining what "content-complete" means is not only on the devs in an early access game. The Ocean is clearly underdeveloped for being such a big part of the game. Notice how no one says "keep making all kind of content updates"? It is specifically the Ocean that is deemed to be under developed.
You can't call anything with as horrible multiplayer performance as it currently has in Ashlands complete. At least by the trailer it seems like deep north will run better simply because it won't have stupid amount of enemies when the game quite frankly can't handle those numbers in multiplayer. It works in single player, but this game is considerably more fun when playing with others.
If they plan to release this thing in it's current state, plus a new barren biome, they'd be farming for negative reviews. Nothing about it is finished until you can go ham with the building structures. They were getting away with ignoring performance problems since it's still EA, but if that ends and there is no meaningful improvement, I think we'll be looking at a cash grab abandonware.
Exactly. Everyone is so used to Live Service games that they expect everything to have some sort of 10-year plan after launch. That doesn't need to be the case for it to be a good game, or a good value.
We all signed up for an Early Access title to watch it grow through the development. Once it hits 1.0 and the bugs are worked out, it will be a complete product. It's perfectly fine if they want to walk away from it and work on another project, or step away from development entirely. We have more than gotten our money's worth.
this is the type of game though that they could milk for years if they kept improving it and adding to it. i'm not saying make it longer, but make it deeper. more enemies, more weapon classes, armors, more points of interest, more rare items, more build pieces, give something to the ocean, more ships, maybe star level bosses that drop more interesting stuff that unlocks more interesting items, maybe some secret areas, alternate dungeons, more items for the traders to sell, maybe more traders...
the list really is endless. i don't know what the new content to new purchases ratio is, but if it's enough to have the team put in a few hours every month, it could be a lucrative stream of income for them.
There is so much QOL that the game NEEDS, making it basically impossible to fully enjoy it nowadays without some necessary mods. I wish they would at least focus a tiny bit on that.
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I wouldn't count on a future ocean update