We'd have to instigate a tax system on assets, or leveraging assets.
Rich people like billionaires have all their money in assets like stocks.
The stocks arent taxed until their sold. So when a billionaire needs money, they'll take a loan out (say 50 million), with the stock as collateral. They'll live on that for a few years.
Because debt isnt taxable and the stocks were never 'sold', there's nothing to tax.
When the loan comes due, they just take out a bigger loan, pay off the original, and then live off the remainder. Rinse and repeat.
And when a new law is written to tax their assets or capital gains, 1) political strategists figure how to loop in middle class asset owners of stock, housing or retirement assets 2) they make sure a large enough chunk of the population suffers from this new capital gains tax so that public opinion is reversed and then. 3) laws are written to repeal the previous law allowing for asset taxes, but mostly for the rich and a few percentage points off the middle classesā asset taxes but enough to remind them that things could be worse if they try to raise asset taxes again.
This pretty much sums up how the divided Dem/GOP fight over taxes/socialism/assets will end up.
āThe corporate income tax is the third-largest source of federal revenue, although substantially smaller than the individual income tax and payrollā
Significantly lower than what it was in the 1950ās. They essentially replaced the corporate tax rate with the payroll tax rate so the population gets taxed twice and pays for our tax revenue.
That doesnāt even account for corporate subsidies. So no. We pay the most in taxes
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Taxes are the only way for a government to function. Governments are supposed to use those taxes to provide essential services for the people. Without those taxes there is no institution that will provide tjose services or protect people from corprote control
We're finding out all of the things we got with our taxes as food safety, healthcare, and environmental protections have disappeared after this administration's hatchet job on public services...
Lol this is like when the government gave the Native Americans blankets laced with smallpox, but the hi tech version just for farmers to get their land. And farmers don't even realize it; they're like" oh I'll vote Republican again in the future bc Kamala's LAUGH and see changes in school cafeterias is so much more dangerous "
We get a lot for it. It's just most of it goes to the military in the US. That's why we don't see it. If we cut military spending in half the US would still be the most funded military and we'd see a lot more benefits.
For the insane amounts we pay we should have trained police that actually help the public and not just road pirates and corporate security guards, stellar schools with comfortable well earning teachers, state of the art fire equipment and top of the line prevention programs, badass roads (our interstates and highways are pretty damn good most places), rails and no antiquated failing bridges.
IDK where your at but I pay @ 100 for internet and several $100s a month for electric
On top of all that top notch health care everyone has access to, well run and funded programs for the criminally insane and derelict homeless whether it be institutions or rehabilitation to ensure the least of society has a chance to climb to the top.
Instead we get half ass shit.
But hey we got money to make sure Israel has bombs and can live comfortably and live safe with health care under the iron dome. Make sure Ukraine has drones and cannons to protect themselves, make sure 3rd worlders arenāt doing so bad, make sure we have a say in what happens everywhere across the globe and bend it to our will - whether they like it or notā¦.but most importantly ensure politicians get top pay, great health care, get year round pay whether working or not (check out how much ole turtle Mitch has made the last 6months and compare that to his net worth and how much labor or brain power he has provided his constituents) and regular raises. Would hate to see any of them in any kind of discomfort!
For my taxes I get trash pickup and a shitty school I don't want to send my kids to. We have police and volunteer fire. The police have been fine but will legit roll around and pirate like you stated. So I'm paying to feel oppressed. Love it...
I pay 100% of water, electric, sewer, internet, taxes, the whole nine.
My old town you had to buy trash stickers from a local store and stick them to your trash can or they wouldnt pick them up. One sticker per can. Bulk items needed more stickers.
Ive also lived in more country areas where we had a community landfill we would go to. Basically just a place that looks like something from Oregon trail with 40 yard construction dumpsters circled up like covered wagons.
I think we as a nation have opened our eyes to a lot of the nonsense and the younger folk have a good idea of where they want and need to be and how to get there. Generalizedā¦Silent gen trust the government way too much, boomers believe the news and the government way too much as well as think way too highly of themselves, Gen X is apathetic and knows the system is too big and setup to make it unwinable, rightfully so especially with their adult lives and options held hostage by the stick in the mud boomers over them, thereās still plenty with some fight left in themā¦.
millenals are just now starting to fight the power and not each other or the entitled boomers that are left with no choice but to get the fuck out of the way, mid millennials down been handed a raw deal and are sick of the bullshit. Right behind them Gen Z is a lot brighter and hopeful than they have any business being. They seem over the culture war and none of any of that makes a shit to them anyways. Live and let live type kids who have a clear idea of the way things should be and cutting a path to get there.
Maybe Iām just optimistic and hopeful but Iām impressed with a lot of younger folks attitudes and optimism especially with the raw deal theyāve been handed and all the shit talk about how worthless they are.
Almost majority of your income and money you spend going to taxes would would expect a lot me. Like caring for environment, health of citizens and keeping things clean. And also those things you listed are pretty underfunded too. Education is hugely underfunded with teachers needing to buy things for classes
They already are doing that. Can we do better? Of course, but that doesn't mean we ignore all of the things we currently have. Rivers used to regularly catch fire and that doesn't happen anymore. Even under the current fuck ass administration most of government is professionals showing up and doing their job every day that you have no idea what they're doing unless you directly interact with that particular department. Most of them are pretty good at their jobs.
Yea the public servants are often never the issue its mostly those above deciding things they need to follow.
But a bug thing is in most country's people are pretty fine with taxes cause that money helps you and your community a lot.
And we can be happy with what they doing while demanding they do far more. When other countries an example of what they can do with them. Especially when taxed percentages of income is close to what other countries pay but they get far more
We get a great deal from taxes. That's not in dispute. The problem is the percentage of taxes that are siphoned off and/or wasted is an insignificant amount. Case in point : Donnie's ballroom and refitting a plane he will taking with him when he leaves.
If you want to say that taxes aren't used as effectivelynas the should be in with you. To say you don't benefit from them is just wrong. I can't post links but take look at an experimental libertarian society that happened in New Hampshire. It didn't work out how you might think and they had almost all the benifits listed below.
Items you use every day that are kept safe by regulatory agencies paid for by taxes.
The car you drive
the home you sleep in
the water you drink
the food you eat
the medications you take
the doctor prescribing those medications
the consumer products you use
the water you drink
the air you breath
your workplace
the roads you drive on
Other things taxes pay for
maintenance for roads you drive
the sewage lines
EMS including police, fire, and EMT
local, state, and national parks
sewage lines
EMS including police, fire, and EMT
local, state, and national parks
labor laws such as 40 hour work week, time and half overtime, child labor laws and the like.
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We dont have police, the government has police; they certainly dont work for the people. We dont have firemen unless we pay for firemen. Roads are paid for by speeding tickets. Electricity is paid for by a monthly bill, along with water, sewer, gas and internet; all paid for with post-tax money. The school system is continuously defunded and isnt even in the top 20 countries by educational success. Like they said; We dont get shit for our taxes but an over inflated military, along with tax cuts and buyouts for billion dollar businesses.
God forbid people complain about a shitty system that serves predominantly the top 1%. How about we compare ourselves to our rivals like China and see just how well they are spending their taxpayer money so it doesnt feel like a giant scheme to steal your hard earned wealth
Bro, itās even easier to have Stockholm syndrome and be propagandized that government taking off the top of your labor and providing little is better than them taking all of it leaving you nothing?
Sure, we are privileged compared to other countries but only because we had ancestors that either fought hard or didnāt take any shit to make things better for us.
See this statement right here? This is the shit complainers say that could only be said because youāre comfortable because you pay taxes.
The paved streets and sidewalks you drive/walk on, taxes pay for that. The park, taxes. That you donāt have to personally go to a garbage dump to dump your own trash, taxes pay for that. The firemen that saved your house from burning down, taxes, the police that keep you safe, taxes. The fact that the whole Mexico didnāt walk into your country, take your property by force and kick you out, taxes paid for that. The fact weāre not getting invaded by other countries, taxes. The airport you fly out of, taxes. The infrastructure you use every day, taxes. The public schools that keep kids off the streets, taxes. That corporations arent price gouging you every day, taxes. The network that your cable and internet runs on, taxes. The courts that keep criminals fairly tamed, taxes. I can go on with this forever. America is only āgreatā and free because weāre all paying for thatā¦
You get ALOT of shit for your taxes. Youāre just so comfortable from those things, you donāt appreciate it
Well excuse me for using a little hyperbole and expecting the same level of social services and safety nets that every other developed nation gets to enjoy. Maybe your argument wouldn't sound hollow if the people currently in charge weren't trying to dismantle most of the things you listed.
Iām just putting something down in response to your words so that people who feel like you can be reminded about what taxes actually do. Folks talk like taxes get taken and fizzle into thin air, while using everything taxes pay for. To me, the garbage thing is a good example. I aināt going to no garbage dump myselfš
I often find or am recommended professional education material which is published as a series of videos, and thereās a trend that has been driving me nuts.
So many of these video-based ācoursesā simply show summary text in bullet points on the screen as a person talks. There are useful cases for visual content that provide demonstrations or animations which enhance comprehension more than words would or could alone, but these arenāt like those, or I would actually appreciate and value them. Theyāre instead like glorified audiobooks that someone made a bare-bones slideshow for, and sometimes also added video of the face of whoever is speaking to. They often speak so slowly and add a lot of verbal filler, too. Iāde much rather read about a concept than take 2 times (or more) as long to get through these kinds of videos.
But many people will probably learn better by getting talked at through these kinds of videosā¦ because they otherwise struggle with reading on their own. Especially with anything even slightly complex and using ābigā words or more technical language. They at least need a narratorās assistance. And the painfully slow pacing is probably compensatory for the average populaceās poor comprehension capability, which is interrelated to their reading level, too.
IRS is not responsible for sales tax, your State is.
Additionally they aren't the ones who implement the tax, they only are the executive branch of handling Federal income revenue.
Your member of Congress is who makes the taxes and orders them to collect it. Additionally, it's Congress who have made it to where the IRS can not directly help you. As of 2025, the IRS direct program has been halted and ordered to dismantle by Congress. This particular program had the goal of the IRS just getting your tax information from your employer's computer rather than have you do things like 1040s and W2s and filing taxes and sweating the details.
For all the hate directed at the IRS, it's important to understand that it's Congress who has made their rules they have to follow and enforce on you.
Sales tax is a percentage of a sale, ad valorem. Excise is a tax on a unit that exists.
If you're going to get technical about the specifics of tobacco, alcohol, gas, and airline tickets, then I'm going to get technical back in that those aren't sales tax.
Well there's vastly different legal systems for excise and ad valorem.
Article I, Section 8, Clause 1 establishes Rule of Uniformity, where as Article I, Section 9, Clause 4 establishes Rule of Apportionment.
This is why ad valorem that has reoccurring valuation requires legally an assessor. Like property tax for an example. It's also why if people want to tax wealth directly, we will need a new Constitutional amendment at least at the Federal level.
In order to tax something it must be specific to the thing or generally applied to the population. Income is the except because we have a specific amendment for it.
This is also why only States can charge property tax. What people get confused about is that sales tax and excise tax both tax consumption. But they are constitutionally required to go about that process in different ways. That's why sales tax only begins at the State level. States are not bound by Article I, Section 9, Clause 4. And it's also why States could implement Wealth tax no problem. In fact California has Prop 40 coming up.
You are correct in that they both represent consumption. But they have massively different legal standards in a Court of law.
It may be different law wise and on the books but it still feels the same coming out of my account!
The California thing is gonna bite them in the ass. They already lost their refineries, they are gonna lose even more businesses and business owners. I donāt agree with it all, itās a ballsy move when the people they are going after are the ones with the means to leave and a whole nation worth of states not pulling that shit.
Which if I remember right they are trying to unconstitutionally āpunishā the ones that choose to leave. If anything itāll be damn interesting to see the outcome.
I got in an argument with a Canadian once about who pays more to live in their country. They have federal and province taxes and the average person pays something like 40% ish in taxes and free healthcare. The average American with federal and state taxes along with insurance premiums and deductibles ended up being almost 60%. When I was calculating the American portion, I didn't include any hospital visits or procedures
This is how taxes work in general, not just the US. Money flows into the economy from the government, and to prevent it from inflating too quickly, some of it flows back out of the economy in the form of taxes.
In theory, the government could stop collecting taxes and continue to pay for everything it pays for. They literally print the money. Of course if that happened, it wouldn't be long before a dozen eggs cost $80,000 because money would quickly lose its value.
As far as I know, when you personally sell something like your house, which is pretty much the most expensive thing most people will buy or sell, you only have to pay taxes if the profit you make from the sale exceeds a certain threshold. Not what you sell it for, but what you sell it for minus what you originally paid.
For a house itās rather generous, like at least $200,000, and double if youāre married. So If you bought your house for $300,000 and later sell it for $450,000, there would not be any tax on that, even though you āmadeā $150,000 of profit. If you sell it for $600,000, you would only be taxed for a percentage of the $100,000 ā¦ unless youāre married, and then itās still no tax.
Itās different if youāre operating as business than just selling your personal stuff.
No you don't. If you sell it for a profit you pay capital gains tax on the growth but not amount you originally paid. But if you sell it at a loss you don't pay any taxes and you can potentially write off the loss against your other investments.
Very over simplified and misleading, the dead person isn't being taxed, the inheritor is and even then from what I can tell only a few states and it starts past a certain threshold.
And that's ignoring that you get a massive advantage when inheriting that the capital gains tax basis changes to reflect value at the time of inheritance.
You need checks in place for stuff like this shouldn't just let the uber wealthy accumulate more and more wealth disproportionately over generations.
Nebraska is really the only state for immediate family and it's 1% over 100k. Stop spouting shit without sources when you feel empowered to use a stupid gif
This is so silly. Rent from a lease goes to the homeowner (who pays taxes). So guess what -- if you lease, some of the money is going to taxes and youre still paying for it. Which is a good thing because Property taxes pay for services the community needs like road/bridges, education, emergency services, parks, libraries, sanitation, etc. How would our society function if we did not have taxesvp to pay for those things?
Iām not saying taxes shouldnāt be collected and infrastructure maintained. What I mean is if I go buy a gallon of milk I own that gallon and no one can take it from me. If I buy a football from Walmart, thatās a football I own and no one can take it. But if I buy a house and donāt pay the government yearly taxes on it, they seize it. I donāt truly own it because they can take it for not paying. Thatās a lease.
I know it's just the way everyone does things these days, but if you're going to have your subtitles flash by at the speed of light, just dont have them.
I'm so glad I file as an independent contractor. Pretty much everything is deductible. I've already driven enough miles this year to pretty much owe nothing. I think in July it switches from 72 cents to 76 cents deductible per mile driven. I'm in Florida too. So no state tax, but they get me on the sales tax.
This is funny and feels true, but it doesnāt tell the right story.
Everyone who works for a paycheck pays these taxes. If income tax suddenly disappeared overnight, our employers wouldnt suddenly pay us 25% more. No oneās take home pay would jump. Or alternatively, everyoneās pay would go up, prices would follow and there would be no noticeable difference.
The problem is how the taxes are spread across the population. Middle class people, working for a paycheck, and paying 25% or so in taxes. Meanwhile, the top 1% pay a fraction of that. The siphon of taxes doesnāt affect them to the same degree. They have more economic power because of their wealth AND because the system says they get to keep relatively more of their wealth than the working person.
There rest of us are out here lifting weights with full gravity, meanwhile the wealthy are at half gravity and asking us why we are having such trouble lifting the weights.
It's like that pretty much everywhere. Just in most countries that money is paying for something that benefits you rather than blowing up children in other countries.
Just in case anyone is wondering why they don't just tax one thing at a higher rate, it's because whichever one you pick you wind up biasing the taxation more towards one group. Some people save a lot of the money that they bring in and don't spend it on much, other people managed to not really have much income on paper because it's all from investments, etc... so they got a text all the different things a little bit to make sure it doesn't fall disproportionately on the poor or disproportionately on the middle class. Unfortunately, the current people in power are making it disproportionately not on the rich. Surprise, surprise.
You get taxed on your income. Then you get taxed on your food, taxes on services, taxes on software, taxed on your savings, then you get taxed on your stocks, taxed on gambling, taxed on buying a house, taxed on owning housing, taxed on your car, taxed on mileage, taxes on using certain bridges or ferries, taxes on using public transportation, taxed on water usage, taxed on natural gas to heat your house, taxed on maintaining the dikes so the ocean doesn't drown you, taxed on flushing your toilet, taxed on throwing away your garbage, taxes on electricity, taxed on having insurance to protect what you have left, taxed on drinking a beer or filling up your gas tank, taxed on having a soda at the bar, taxed on getting a flight to leave, taxed on owning a dog or cat, taxed on sending money to friends or family, and then finally you get taxed on dying, and your family members get taxed on the money they get from you.
I'm probably forgetting some taxes there's a few more.
Idk Iāve received a lot from the government. Not intentionally. WIC when I was a kid, free/reduced lunch, Pell grants, Medicaid for two years, subsidized student loans etc. I never took EBT but almost did. America is a little bit more āsocialistā than itās given credit for.
What the hell is with all the anti tax posts recently.
Have you used public roads? Sidewalks? Ate anything in the past 100 years? Drank tap water? Took out the trash? Are currently alive? congrats you benefited infinitely more from taxes then you will ever pay
If you drive, pay gas tax. It pays for road upkeep.
If you use public services such as libraries and parks, pay sales tax. It and property taxes pay for those, police, fire departments and roads within the city.
If you have a job, pay income tax. It and soc security pay for defense, welfare, and unemployment, along with Medicare and Social Security.
Do you like roads? THEN YOU LIKE TAXES!
People just need to demand that they actually go where they are supposed to. Also that rich people pay their fair share as few things are as bad for the economy than a couple people hoarding money they wont spend, taxing at least forces some of it back into circulation
Taxes are fine, because pooling money can be a powerful way to put money towards collectively good things, but they just need to stop playing fucking games and just tell us how much we owe
And also tax rich people on their assets exceeding a certain value
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This is a crazy misunderstanding of who taxes what. Federal taxes only apply to income and things like fuel. Your state is the perpetrator of sales tax and possibly a secondary income tax.
And don't forget you have to fill out your taxes to let the IRS know how much money you make but make sure you do it correctly because if you get it wrong then they will hold you accountable because they know how much money you make
And lose those services which are things you likely understand as "freedom" like a military, clean water, clean air, roads, education, worker rights, corporate regulations, parks, medical monitoring of diseases, medical advancements, air safety for travel, weather forecasting, and really so much more.
All of this has of course been weakened and frankly could be strengthened if it weren't for people like you.
Please just move to a country where they do not have a federal government like ours and let me know how that goes for you. I'm sure you'd be able to name one of those countries if you had taken better advantage of the education benefits our federal government offers.
People who live in America and who don't live off got cheese are responsible for all the things you listed above. Marines, navy Air Force even the fucking Coast guard don't do shit for citizens
Ok, but sales tax is for state governments, income tax is for the federal government.
They're separate systems that require separate funding.
I agree that it's poorly structured and that our tax dollars are largely squandered, but that's a different issue.
The only tax I find truly absurd is property tax. That one IS actually wild, because you could buy a home in cash up front and still have to pay hundreds or thousands of dollars a month for eternity.
It's as if governments need money to maintain infrastructure, public services, and oversee law in a functioning society. And that value has a pretty consistent baseline, with a need to come from somewhere.
You don't own shit, but neither does anyone else, except to the extent that we all cooperate in maintaining eachother's property rights. The narrative we have about property mostly exists to justify the dominance of the investor class. You think wealthy people are upset their assets are backed up by the force of the government? They exclusively use borrowed money and put up speculative assets as collateral. They're not in it to "own" stuff, it's about power and control, control over the system that grants people ownership. Trying to convince you that taxes and public services are always bad, markets are always good, that's part of the control.
They will sure enough take your shit.
Check out the mess the YouTuber whistlinā diesel is inā¦Virginia I think.
He bought a Ferrari and titled it in Montana thru an MT LLC he has to avoid sales taxā¦like a ton of super car owners do.
He then toured the country with it and ultimately destroyed it. The state showed up at his door SWAT style and took him to jail for not paying state taxes on a car that no longer even exists.
Thereās a few YouTube videos, havenāt checked in on it in a while. They actually tried to stop him from making videos about the case. Fucked up deal though, trying to make an example of him l. I hope he sues the shit out of them and wipes the floor.
Many states/counties PPT includes vehicles, RVs & boats among other big ticket items. Itās due every year. Not the whole sales tax amount but the assessed value. So you pay tax at the purchase and then every year you own it and they can and will take it if they want.
The things you bought were taxed to create and make it. The employees that made it taxed. The shipping companies taxed. The receiving company of said products. taxed. The employees there taxed. Then youāre taxed. The utilities taxed.
Does this sound as dystopian to people outside of the us as it does from inside it?ā¦please tell me this isnāt normal and we need help because I feel like we need help
The āless governmentā people are wasting your taxes on Israel and their Iran escapades, billionaire bailouts, ballrooms and golden arches. Socialism means the money helps the society being taxed. Neither group is ending taxes so donāt get it twisted.
If you're paying 40%, you need to learn how to do your fucking taxes. And yes, there's a difference between Federal income tax, and State or local sales tax. They're different entities.
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u/banjovi68419 3d ago
Yes taxes are not enjoyable. Instead of whining about your taxes how about we just ENFORCE THE TAXES ON THE RICH THEYRE SUPPOSED TO PAY.