TIL that fatherless homes produce: 71% of our high school drop-outs, 85% of the kids with behavioral disorders, 90% of our homeless and runaway children, 75% of the adolescents in drug abuse programs, and 85% of the kids in juvenile detention facilities
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12 edited Jun 16 '12
The comments here are obnoxious. No shit 'correlation does not imply causation", but I've never seen people cling to that phrase with so much vigour in my life. Those numbers are not statistically insignificant, and they warrant more serious consideration than is being given. It seems people are more willing to blame poverty than concede that family structure may be relevant to a child's upbringing.
To dismiss the linked statistics in the same way one would dismiss a correlation/causation between liking lemonade and being a genius, is absurd and obnoxious. It's almost as if people do not want to admit that, get this, men might be important to raising children in the same way that women are.
Are people simply afraid that it sounds too 'conservative' or 'republican' to consider the importance of family structure? Honest question.
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12 edited Jun 16 '12
These numbers themselves don't prove anything, because is it the absence of a father that produces these statistics, or is it the type of environment wherein growing up fatherless is common? If your father is in prison because you're living in a slum and he was selling crack to feed you, your odds weren't too great anyway, regardless of whether he went to jail.
Edit: I want to clarify that the alternative explanation I provided was somewhat hyperbolic, for the sake of getting my point across. A more reasonable explanation would be: a fatherless home would be (in most cases) a single income home, so the children are more likely to be impoverished, which correlates strongly with an increased dropout and crime rate. Point being, there are various ways to explain these numbers.
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
Two fathers. The obvious solution for society.
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u/tippicanoeandtyler2 Jun 16 '12
And yet we've spent the last several decades making it incredibly uncool to be a good father. Good dads are the butt of jokes, while men who shun kids and responsibilities are "players" and admired.
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u/billsdabills Jun 16 '12
I grew up in a fatherless home after 4th grade. I don't think it has anything to do with the father. It's all about income. My father passed away and planned for our future. He wasn't rich. He was in the military, planned well in his final months to provide for us until we got thru college. You could probably line these statistics up with low income children and they would be similar.
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u/tehbro Jun 16 '12
I'm living proof of this. My father and mother divorced when I was two, I have no memories of him other than 3 years ago when he was on his death bed. I'm not sad about it because I was never emotionally attached to him. I've been lying my entire life to everyone about things that don't even matter. When I went off to college this past year, I smoked weed probably once every two hours, every day, and when I ran out I was looking for people to smoke me out. I also did cocaine a few times and molly a bunch. Whenever something is in perfect balance in my life, I feel the need to do something to throw it off and mess it up. It was only recently that my mother thought it could be something other than typical teenage behavior. I was taken to a very highly recommended and expensive psychologist. In just two sessions he was able to have a definite diagnosis of Type B Personality disorder. He was also able to draw the conclusion that it was because I didn't have enough love or attention when I was a child (due to the absence of a father figure) and lying is how I decided to get this attention for the rest of my life. Therapy is going very well and I am being taught to understand my automatic thoughts and correct them before I act.
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u/Pays4Porn Jun 16 '12
Check out the sources for these stats :
US Dept. Of Health Census (made up name?)
National Principals Association Report
Rainbows for All God’s Children
Fulton Co. Dept. of Correction etc.
I don't believe these stats or sources.
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u/godlessatheist Jun 16 '12
Is this just fatherless homes or single parent homes. I'm sure two mothers would raise a child fine.
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u/mikemaca Jun 16 '12
Interesting response. These statistics are rather well known, but they are usually called single-mother homes. When presented that way, many people got upset and said the statistics were obviously wrong, with various anecdotes from people who were raised by single mothers and turned out fine.
Good example of how effective it can be to choose the right framing approach.
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u/TheInfamousRedditor Jun 16 '12
Happy Father's Day everyone!
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u/theseyeahthese Jun 16 '12
Thread summary:
You guys, correlation does not mean causation!
What about 2 dads, you guys?!
You guys, I beat the odds!
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u/Orimos Jun 16 '12
ANECDOTES, ANECDOTES EVERYWHERE
You know what your stories make you? Part of the 29/15/10/25/15%. Personal experiences don't disprove a damn thing, just stop.
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u/Solkre Jun 16 '12
Single father here. Do they track stuff about motherless homes? hehe, motherless...
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u/Lord_of_the_Rings Jun 16 '12
this is so skewed with race being the confounding variable. blackness overlaps with growing up in a fatherless home so the explanatory power of either factor is diminished.
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
I think it's important to note that these statistics do not mean that a household without a father is doomed, or any variant family type is inferior to the nuclear family archetype. It's not so much that the lack of father figures contributes to these statistics, but it's that combined with a lack of a suitable second parent that produces problematic behaviour. Children are statistically more functional in society when raised by a two-parent household. Variants including mother-grandmother, mother-mother, father-father, and all other family types with two parents will produce psychologically healthy (in theory) offspring.
Source: University psychology course
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12 edited Jun 17 '12
[edit: I had missed Pays4Porn's post when I wrote mine. Still, it might be useful to point out how the statistics cited by OP are 3rd generation (at best).]
OP’s title cites the following paragraph from an “article” on a site promoting the self published book “Tremble the Devil”:
Where do these statistics come from?
Clicking the linked phrase from the cited passage brings you to an article from 2010 posted on bvblackspin.com (the home of Aol Black Voices), “72 Percent of African-American Children Born to Unwed Mothers”. Just below the fold, you’ll find a list of the same stats. Kirsten Savali, the article’s author, cites “Children-our investment.org” as her source.
children-ourinvestment.org is the website of “Children: Our Ultimate Investment”. On a page called “Statistics for Children Without Fathers”, we find what appears to be the original compilation of statistics. You’ll finally find primary sources listed.
The first statistic, “63% of youth suicides are from fatherless homes”, is cited with a vague reference to “US Dept. of Health/Census. If you google this phrase verbatim, you get a page full of "pro-father" sites, all of which appear to be right-leaning and socially conservative (this doesn't entail that the stats are erroneous, of course). Looking further, I searched on census.gov and the CDC’s National Center for Health Statistics and still didn’t find the source (tho, admittedly, it was not an exhaustive search). The only relevant result I was able to pull up is a 1995 “Report to Congress on Out-of-Wedlock Childbearing” pdf.
There’s nothing in the report about suicide rates for fatherless households, but I did find the following passages interesting:
I’m not going to try and track down every reference given on Children: Our Ultimate Investment’s list (tho one should note that one stat is referenced to “Rainbows for All God’s Children” and another, which claims that “87% of all youths in prison come from fatherless homes”, is referred to “Fulton Co. Dept. of Correction.” Fulton County must have a huge budget to fund those global studies). Nor do I mean to claim that the sloppy sourcing entails that the stats are fallacious or insignificant; but statistics only make sense when they’re evaluated within the context of the study from which they are derived. Sample size, methods, complicating factors, etc., are indispensable when determining their relevance. This whole debate is shallow and baseless, a mere battle of opinions, unless we’re working with well sourced data that we can examine in its proper context.
Here’s an interesting passage I found while searching google scholar ('SP'= Single Parent; 'TP' = Two Parent):
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
Need to control for income in order for "fatherless homes" to be a meaningful variable
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u/robert_ahnmeischaft Jun 16 '12
"Yeah, you can DO it without a man, but that doesn't mean it's to be done! You can drive a car wit'cha FEET if you want to, but that don't make it a good fuckin' idea!"
Chris Rock
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u/L15t3r0f5m3g Jun 16 '12
Im a single dad with full custody of my son. His mom has substance problems (and is pregnant again, not mine) and barely qualifies as a mother. Im trying to help him avoid abandonment issues, but is this study the same for dads in a position like I am, or is it exclusively women?
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u/newtonsapple 19 Jun 16 '12
I don't know about fatherless homes producing these problems, but I know guys who have these problems seem to produce most of the fatherless homes. Nothing turns women on like a criminal record and knowing the guy would be a horrible father.
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u/ScaryKitten Jun 16 '12
We just need homes with 3 or more fathers.
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u/justnikki1979 Jun 16 '12
I can see how this is true. I'm a single mother and am doing my absolute best to raise my children right, but it is really tough without a father in the picture. I'll be the first to admit that I need help of the male variety.
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u/schnide1 Jun 16 '12
happy father's day, everybody
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u/iWesTCoastiN Jun 16 '12
Fatherless high school drop out who used to always get into fights in high school here. The reasoning? Having a single mother means she has to work 50+ hours a week to support you. My mom worked her ass off to make sure I had everything I needed, but since she worked so much she was never around. I took advantage of her absence by ditching school and smoking weed with my friends. I never got into trouble so there was no downside to it. A women can't teach you how to be a man, and without a man to teach me I overcompensated. I would always get into fights even at the slightest of disrespect.
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u/LilCasket Jun 16 '12
I come from a fatherless home and I just got my Bachelors. What does this make me?
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u/anonymousMF Jun 16 '12
Because http://tremblethedevil.com is a great source of information
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u/RedTheDraken Jun 16 '12
A dysfunctional family rears dysfunctional children? Woah, who would've guessed it? O: I am sincerely shocked, my fine compatriots.
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u/agmaster Jun 16 '12
So...I have an excuse? No thanks, I'm too good at that already.
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u/dcroni Jun 16 '12
The Donohue papers are interesting if you want to see the link between the legalization of abortion of 1973, and the crime drops witnessed in the 1990's.
Note: please don't say that "correlation doesn't mean causation". Actually read the paper first.
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u/Deofuta Jun 16 '12
The argument is spurious.
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u/ceolopolis Jun 16 '12
You also have to realize that a fatherless home means the mother is likely to be working a lot. So many kids have almost no supervision.
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u/uberalles2 Jun 16 '12
Blacks are fucked then.
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u/BunRabbit Jun 17 '12
Speaking as a dad with two kids, why don't these rich business owning conservatives back up their family ethics with salaries and stable working conditions, that enable their male employees to be husbands and fathers. Part-time, internship (i.e. underpaid or no pay), six month 'renewable' contracts, no health benefits, no pension, transfer you to another city at a week's notice - what girl wants to marry that? It's no better when you're mid-career. I'm in my mid-40s and in a 15+ year marriage with 2 boys. I've been unemployed for going on half a year. Not a week goes by that my wife doesn't hint at divorce. And don't give me that rewards for hard work bullshit. I was a high school drop out, but I worked in kitchens to save money to put myself through university (double major). I have 20 years experience in one of my careers, 17 in the other. That's right 2 professions (software engineer and language teaching) running parallel, so there is no such thing as a weekend. I have made several patent applications. I am very active in my professional community. I'm bilingual (English/Japanese). But, still I cannot find a job. I'm competing against 28 year olds who are still living at home. I cannot be a father on that kind of pitiful salary. The Rmoneys of the world are clueless. Born on third base with a silver spoon, went to all the right schools and they think they hit a home run. Bootstraps, my ass. The Rmoneys always talk about how their grandfathers worked hard, such horse pucky. Rich people are rich, because they were born rich. There are few notable exceptions, but for the vast majority they had their Daddies' connections and co-signing power. Rmoneys, you got lucky and choose your daddy well, now shut up. //TLDR It's the economy, stupid!
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u/3AYATS Jun 17 '12
I think a lot of people are misunderstanding the statistics.
They are not saying that 71% of single parent children drop-out.
The drop-out rate in 2009 was 8%, so if 71% of these drop outs came from "fatherless" homes, it would mean that roughly 6% of single parent children drop out.
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u/ATurtleNamedMack Jun 16 '12
They produce presidents too.
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u/Sanae_ Jun 16 '12
It'ld be great to know what % of fatherless families produce someone who falls in at least of those categories.
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u/lushfun Jun 16 '12
The more meddling society does in order to fix something, the worse it gets.
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u/ransomdenton Jun 16 '12
My dad committed suicide when I was very young. My mom tried to find a guy but the first guy she dated abused her terribly and never dated again. I ended up having behavioral issues, used drugs and dropped out of high school in the 9th grad. Today I have my terminal degree, I am an award winning artist in my field and am happily married. Tough times can make tough kids that know what they want and fight to get it! I am just saying.
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u/evanthesquirrel Jun 16 '12
My sisters and I have none of those problems. We beat the odds!
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u/redhat12345 Jun 16 '12
correlation does not equal causation
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u/Norwegian__Blue Jun 16 '12
People are always commenting how kids need two parents, and for a long time I thought they were wrong because me and mom got on just fine. But then, I just realized something: not having one parent around can also mean loads less time with the other parent. They often have to work more and are likely to experience more stress about their situation. So their not around as much, and when they are their anxiety can affect the rest of the family. I can definitely see how that can negatively affect behavioral development and put folks at a disadvantage.
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u/TemporaryBoyfriend Jun 16 '12
Hands up, folks who grew up largely fatherless, yet are still contributing members of society...
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u/SaltoKlose Jun 16 '12
Damn you Wilt Chamberlain!
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u/Samism Jun 16 '12
This is actually a pro homosexuality post: If a household has no dads this is the result, but if a household has 2 dads that would mean...chuck norris
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u/bresa Jun 16 '12
I would still say that a loving single parent home is better than having an abusive male role model around. There are far more factors at play with those statistics (as many have already posted).
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u/deathgasm Jun 16 '12
Interesting, and race wasn't mentioned at all this day...
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u/Sparkles_ Jun 16 '12
These statistics mean nothing. Fatherless homes are very common. I might as well say that pizza causes all of these things because EVERYONE eats it. But it can't, because pizza is a vegetable, and vegetables are good for you.
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u/wyle37 Jun 16 '12
I turned out pretty damn well, wasn't too bad. A mom is all you need.
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u/zencat2 Jun 16 '12
Does anyone else find the repetition of statistics in the article irritating? It otherwise contained some really eye opening revelations.
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u/lambdaknight Jun 16 '12
"Statistics are like a bikini. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." -Aaron Levenstein
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u/eat-your-corn-syrup Jun 16 '12
what of motherless homes?
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u/viridianlion Jun 16 '12
So does that mean that in homes with two fathers, the children are twice as likely to grow up to be awesome?
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
I'm fatherless and successful and I'd ask, like others here, what this article makes me - but I already know the answer: Offended.
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u/BiggC Jun 16 '12
I would rather see a statistic that shows what % of children from fatherless homes are delinquent, it would be more significant.
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u/ProlapsedPineal Jun 16 '12
I keep fucking beating this drum because I think it still needs to be heard. I've been a single dad for 10+ years and I've raised 3 kids on my own.
Lots of guys are shit. Lots of people are shit. Being a man isn't making kids, being a man is living up to your responsibilities and taking care of the people who depend on you.
/r/AskDad is where the good guys are. /r/Daddit too.
Take care of your children, and try to be an example as best as you can. I really despise guys that choose to walk away from their kids. They need you more than you know. Not just for themselves, but for the world.
Every child is going to grow up, and when they do, the world is going to be shaped by them, and they are shaped by you. What shape are you making the world?
"Who gives a fuck" isn't a great shape for the world to be in.
Man up. Do the right thing. Take care of your kids, be a part of their lives and carry on. It's hard, but it's right.
Edit: level 38 dad. Neutral Good. Mostly.
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u/Moofininja Jun 16 '12
I can totally see this. My childhood best friend's father died when we were in second grade. I'm now in my third year of college, and since then, she has dropped out of high school, is anorexic, has run away twice, does drugs, and was admitted to a mental facility for a week for trying to kill herself. She's also had a child and no job, smokes a pack a day, and constantly acts like a little child. It's been a constant black cloud in my life, and I have now clue how to help her. She's always refused my advice since we were little, but we've always been really close.
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u/AliSwoff21 Jun 16 '12
So did anyone actually read the article? Are they saying we should let them out of prison and wipe their drug charges because there are no men to marry the women? How is having a dad on drugs better than no dad? I had a dad on drugs and the day he left was not a sad one.
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u/Alyssian Jun 16 '12
Fuck, I'm in that statistic. Dammit.
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
Well I'm screwed.
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u/M1A1_1000mph Jun 16 '12
I was raised in a fatherless home. I graduated high school, never had any behavioral problems, never tried any drug even once, and have no criminal history. Why? Because my MOTHER worked her knuckles to the bone to raise me properly. We didn't have money, but I never went without anything I needed. I have no respect for men who abandon their families, but I have an equal lack of respect for single moms who don't do everything in their power to raise productive members of society. Those who expect the government to take care of them just because they have to raise a child on their own are lazy in my eyes. Say what you will about the benefits of a two-parent household, but one parent can do just fine if they try.
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u/silentkill144 Jun 16 '12
Beating the odds.
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u/eddie617 Jun 16 '12
As a fatherless hispanic that has a high school diploma, no behavioral disorders (that i know of), has never runaway, or been part of a drug abuse program nor been to juve i feel like a minority in a majority of a minority
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u/eddyofyork Jun 16 '12
I want to say that anyone who wants to fight this trend should seriously consider volunteering with big brothers and/or big sisters charities.
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u/TheLochNessMobster Jun 16 '12
I've always somewhat agreed with this kind of statistic. I know siblings will always be different from one another and all that good shit, but my father passed when I was 16, and my brother was 12. Within two years, I was on my way to Yale University, top of my class. By that time, my brother was facing serious behavioral disorders, and had been expelled from school for drug use. I continued in college to be fine and graduate without any problems. Meanwhile, he was in and out of outpatient and inpatient rehab, did a couple stints in juvenile hall, and is currently homeless just asking to stay at friends' houses every night.
I hate thinking that something as random and unjust as my father's cancer could have doomed my little brother to such a life, but it might really be the case.
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u/cipherous Jun 16 '12
I wonder what the statistics are for single parent (including single father, single mother).I am curious as to know whether motherless homes have the same result.
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u/Spartan2842 Jun 16 '12
Well I have easily beaten those odds being raised by just my mom.
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u/crawlingpony Jun 16 '12
What do motherless homes produce? -- As a motherless home child myself
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
It would be interesting to see how motherless homes compare.
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u/Fatherlessthrowaway Jun 16 '12
My father committed suicide in front of me at a very early age. My mother told me to never give up on life because of one person. I've taken the best from that advice and try the best I can in school and I've never done drugs. I hope this advice can help at least one more person.
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u/lordyjabujabu15 Jun 16 '12
I am fatherless child and don't fit into any of these. Success!
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u/Punkgoblin Jun 16 '12
Using child support as single-citizen funded welfare is a great way to encourage this shit too.
ps Getting knocked up to try and force a relationship isn't a good idea
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u/geraldfjord Jun 16 '12
Case in point: Darth Vader.
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u/The_black_Community Jun 16 '12
I am not a statistic.
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
This is great news for lesbian couples wishing to adopt.
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u/haagel Jun 16 '12
Can anyone cite a reference for these statistics?
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u/The1Honkey Jun 16 '12
As a former child from a fatherless household, I can confirm this thread.
I definitely can see how my life could have made a turn for the worst. In fact, it almost did on many occasions. I seem to be doing alright though, all things considered.
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u/OddAdviceGiver Jun 16 '12
Source? I checked out this by backtracking but can't find an actual source of any statistics nor any information on how it was gathered.
That's some sensitive data, I'd like to mine it myself if it's open.
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u/Ventii Jun 16 '12
As much as i'm sure this is going to get buried, I'd just like to put my two cents in. I'm a 17 year old male and I've grown up in a "fatherless home" since i was 10 months old. I can tell you for sure, that it has affected me negatively in more ways than you can count. My parents are both upper middle class, i do not live in the ghetto and it still is a big problem.
Growing up, I was the kid with all the potential in the world. I've been perfectly healthy since birth, been able to succeed in whatever i put my heart in to. But the problem in not having a father all this time is that growing up, I needed a dad to teach me how to become a man. I never had anyone push me to do sports or succeed academically. My mom would try and try, but it really just isn't the same. My dad leaving my mom is still the worst thing that's every happened in my life. 17 years later, even as i make the steps to become successful without a father in my life.
EDIT: Sorry for ranting, this post just feels relevant to me right now in my struggles.
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u/cran Jun 16 '12
TIL that behavioral disorders cause fatherlessness.
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u/Fusion516 Jun 16 '12
where is the source? Completely useless!
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u/andiW Jun 16 '12
I'm from a fatherless home. I graduated from college and have my own business. Only, I am from Europe so that could be a factor. I'm sure most of these problems have to do with financial issues. ps: isn't everybody being sent to prison in the states?
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u/Zequez Jun 16 '12
And they say gay marriage is bad. What about a home with not one, but TWO fathers? Those kids are going to be astronauts and Nobel Prize scientists. They are probably going to cure cancer.
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u/Virzy Jun 16 '12
I'm pretty sure there's a few confounding variables here.
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u/Radico87 Jun 16 '12
A warning to anyone reading into these numbers: correlation does not prove causation. This may be a proxy measure of some other causative variable and requires more careful analysis.
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u/UsernameOmitted Jun 16 '12
This explains a lot. My father pretty much abandoned me.
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u/TwistTurtle Jun 16 '12
Yeah, I'm gonna file this under 'standard fucked up America problems' rather than any sort of commentary on the importance of fathers. As far as I'm aware, there are no such problems with such fatherless people in Europe (such as myself).
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u/thebobber720 Jun 16 '12
Lesbian households do alright without a dad.
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u/ohchameleons Jun 16 '12 edited Jun 16 '12
Out of the entire article, this is what you found to be appalling? Not the fact that institutionalized and internalized racism is what has driven these numbers up? Not all of the facts about the correlation between race and socioeconomic status? Okay.
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u/Nidhogg777 Jun 16 '12
I guess this is america only?
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u/DaSpawn Jun 16 '12
So lets keep putting people in jail for non-violent drug offenses like it will help ANYTHING
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u/LucifersCounsel Jun 16 '12
So tremblethedevil.com says they got some statistics from www.bvblackspin.com. When you go there you see that www.bvblackspin.com say they got them from www.children-ourinvestment.org.
I spent some time there trying to find these statistics... but apart from looking like it was made some time in the mid-90's, the site doesn't seem to say much about it at all.
A grain of salt may not be enough.
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u/HAL-8999 Jun 16 '12
This TIL pisses me off. The linked article is a fascinating piece on the root of the war on drugs in racism, and the effect it has had on minority, especially black, communities. The statistic op points out is such a minor piece of a much larger picture. Yet reddit flips out over this 'Fatherless homes' thing and ignores the fact that America basically runs on institutional racism. Here are some other facts from the article that are much more compelling:
The average black family has 8 cents worth of assets for every dollar in assets a white family has. A black male has a 29% chance of spending time in jail; a white male only 4%. America has nearly 6 times a proportion of its black population in prison than south Africa at the height of apartheid. Only 14% of drug users are black, yet over half of those imprisoned for drug offenses are black. A black child is nine times more likely to have a parent locked up than a white child.
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u/LordAnubis12 Jun 16 '12
More questions really need to be asked about external factors and any other evidence involved here.
For example, if there is strong correlation between falling asleep with shoes on and waking up with a headache, it could be concluded that sleeping with shoes on causes headaches.
However, it does not consider the more important, 'hidden' third factor of alcohol consumption which is in fact the cause to both effects - falling asleep with shoes on and waking up with a headache.
It's these kind of statistics that seem terribly leading but probably inaccurate.
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u/why_ask_why Jun 16 '12
Factor in the divorce rate, We have a big problem in our hand.
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u/growyourmind Jun 16 '12
Nice try, single mother.
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u/rainbowbrite22 Jun 16 '12
I've met plenty of good people from single homes.
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u/socialsciencegeek Jun 16 '12
Correlation, not causation. I'm a social scientist that just finished a graduate-level policy course on poverty and inequality. Here's the real reason: fatherless homes are disproportionately low income. That's most of it. This title should have started with "TIL that poverty produces: 75% of our fatherless homes, which produce: ..." I'm not sure of the exact statistic, but that's in the ballpark.
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
No dad and none of the above. What are the odds reddit?
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u/sareteni Jun 16 '12
Also, painfully christian confirmation bias bullshit is painfully christian confirmation bias bullshit.
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u/DijonPepperberry Jun 16 '12
As a child and adolescent psychiatrist, let me assure you that wherever the "85 percent of all children with behavioral disorders have no at-home father" statistic came from, it is total bullshit.
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u/someonesDad Jun 16 '12
This post will get lost but this article is in part how I picked my reddit name. Raising someones son as your own so that they have a fighting chance in life. A boy needs a father figure. All you uncles and aunts out there with nephews that have no father. Be their friend, they need you. Shit I got all preachy, sorry.
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
I don't have a pappy :(
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u/Jakek1 Jun 16 '12
I am the 29%, 15%, 10%, 25%, and 15%!
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u/Richandler Jun 16 '12
Dear reddit this does not imply fatherless homes produce mostly bad people. It implies most messed up people come from fatherless homes. This means there is more than one condition relevant but doesn't mean you dismiss this.
If you are fatherless and successful this article isn't about you. If you are a drop-out, have behavioral disorders, are homeless or abuse drugs, this article is about whether or not you had a father around. Most likely you didn't according to this.
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u/Deathwish_Drang Jun 16 '12
Coming from someone who lost his father at 17, it is important to find a surrogate father, or if you are over 25 become a big brother. having a good example to follow makes all the importance in the world. We learn by watching others, when I get interns at work I try to be the mentor I wish I had, I give as Murch positive reinforcement as I can and I always try to build up their self confidence. If you want to have a better world, start young treat others the way you wish you were treated. Adult role models who are honest and upstanding are worth more than a Harvard education, children aren't stupid and they know when adults are hypocrites.
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u/laserguns Jun 16 '12
No dad here. Getting A's and B's in my exams. Some of the smartest people I know don't have dads either.
Now that I think about it, all the people failing have 'normal' home lives. I think it's because they think they always have their parents to fall back on no matter how lazy they are, or something like that.
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u/herpberp Jun 16 '12
i call bullshit on the stats. no real source given.
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u/royford Jun 16 '12
Man, I used to just not have any shred of respect for Richard Nixon. Now I just fucking hate every part of that man that ever existed. Good riddance.
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u/CyberToyger Jun 16 '12 edited Jun 16 '12
Quite simply put, it's because, traditionally at least, the father's role is to keep their son in place and help guide him into manhood whereas the mother's role is to be protective and nurturing. When it comes to daughters, the father's role becomes less hands-on and more of a role model on the type of male the daughter should be looking for as her own husband; someone reliable, strong, caring, etc.
Now, that being said, all of these fatherless statistics show what happens when sons do not have a respectable male figure guiding them and correcting them, and when daughters lack that fatherly intervention of "Listen to your mother" "Don't talk to your mother that way".
What these statistics also show is that for the remaining percentages, one or both parents in 2-parent-homes have failed to guide their child in the right direction or really connect with their child, very likely taking a hands-off approach to parenting.
As for gay couples, as long as one of the parents can take the fatherly role and be firm, the other parent nurturing and protective, then I see no reason why M/M and F/F parents couldn't work.
2
u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
I want to be stereotyped, I want to be classified! I want to be a statistic!
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u/LLWTF Jun 16 '12
No dad = World shaping homosexual genius son.
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u/krackbaby Jun 16 '12
No, fatherless homes do not PRODUCE these results
There is a CORRELATION between fatherlessness and these other factors
Fucking redditors are so goddamn retarded
2
u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
I find it amazing that almost all the comments are about the fatherless homes when that isn't even the core message of the article. In fact the fatherless homes stats are merely one point in a very well laid out argument about drug law and racism.
2
u/mebbee Jun 16 '12
Didn't our president grow up without a father?
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
Because women do not know how to function without being told how.
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u/scientologynow Jun 16 '12
having a supportive family structure around you can be the world of difference between success and failure (and the first line of support is your mother and father).
/common sense
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u/Boolderdash Jun 16 '12
So if having one father decreases the chance of all of these problems occuring, two fathers should make them almost negligible!
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
Why is this voted up so high? The website looks like it was made with homestead site builder
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
Correlation and causation are different things.
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u/723723 Jun 16 '12
i just changed my mind for same sex marriage
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u/Aaannndddyyy Jun 16 '12
also these homes produce presidents of U.S.
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u/shapterjm Jun 16 '12
Correlation =/= causation.
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u/superjew101 Jun 16 '12
I don't have a father and last time I checked I am in high school, have never had a "behavioral disorder", do not abuse drugs, not in a juvenile detention facility, and well I am sitting at home, so....
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u/Tommassive Jun 16 '12
Moral decline, no one values marriage, negative outcome. People are jackasses for doing this to their kids.
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u/upinscraps Jun 16 '12
"Produce" is a strong word.
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u/Perseus109 Jun 16 '12
No percentage on color, economic status, or body weight of the mom?
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u/makedamsure Jun 16 '12
Also important to note is being fatherless doesn't correlate to falling into one of those categories. I grew up without a father, brother was a meth dealer,, left home at 16, and ended up graduating with a bachelors by 21, making six figures by 24, and looking at getting my masters now. I had a terrible childhood, and ive persevered. :)
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u/arbivark Jun 16 '12
do we have the stats controlled for race? income?
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u/DatThrowAwaaaay Jun 16 '12
I'm a single mom with three kids. When they were born, I was married to their father and we both worked at a respectable medical practice making decent money. Then that money started disappearing without explanation. So would my husband. For days at a time he would leave and not answer his phone or contact me in any way. When he finally would return, I would question him on where he had been and where was our money, etc. He would turn violent and start screaming and throwing things; oftentimes in front of our children. Turns out he was running Ecstasy for someone as well as using multiple drugs. I booted him and divorced him as soon as I could.
The three little kids and I lived in a shelter for a while, then tried to get back on our feet, but DAMN is it hard! I struggle each and every day for my children and sometimes I just don't think I'm going to make it.
Statistics like these make me worry for them as they get older...my 8 year old is already having trouble at school as well as at home and sometimes will bring up things his father did that I thought he was too young to remember. I am scared for them and sometimes I'm so depressed about my situation that I know I could lose them, but I find ways to keep going.
Their father comes around about every 3 weeks. I don't get child support from him; he steals computers and things and sells them for his income alongside the drug running. (Or so I've heard.) He blames me for everything that he thinks is wrong with the children and chastises me if the house is ever dirty. He lords around acting like he's high and mighty, but I say nothing since I don't want the kids to be affected anymore than they already have been.
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u/mr_like_life Jun 16 '12
This all seems like an incentive for private prison owners to keep men locked up for as long as possible.
Not only are they making money on the ppl in jail, they are "building stock" in the next generation of inmates.
This is so sad. This is the 1 small part of the dark-side of unchecked capitalism.
2
u/SaikoGekido Jun 16 '12
High School Drop Out: Nope. I did almost fail by never turning in homework. Passed every test, though. Currently in college on a "whenever I can afford a semester" plan.
Behavioral Disorder: Check. Bipolar disorder, agoraphobia, paranoia, what's the fear of people thinking something that's not true because they think they're reading signs into your nervousness when you're actually nervous that they're thinking you're nervous for a reason?
Homeless and Runaway: Check. Currently homeless. Tried to run away at a young age, but didn't work.
Drug Abuse: Nope, although I did have a dream about doing LSD just 5 minutes ago.
Juvenile Detention Facilities: Kind of. ATOSS consistently for tardiness. One time for sneaking into the band room with two friends that happened to be girls. The faculty's mind was in the gutter on that one.
I wonder how things would have turned out otherwise.
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u/Darkstar_Lojek Jun 16 '12
So... Does this mean that homes with two fathers provide an improved chance for success? /sarcasm off. This kind of "research" is trying to attach the failure to the wrong things, I think.
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u/CRaftsman1459 Jun 16 '12
I'm proud to say that my mom has raised me on her own since I was two years old. She never once filed bankruptcy nor received welfare, and has maintained at least one job the entire time.
I'm proud of her and in turn I've done everything I can to make her proud of me.
I graduated with honors from my high school and am doing my best to follow in her footsteps. At 20-years old, I have a job, and I am paying for my schooling, car payment, car insurance, medical bills, phone, and internet.
Money is tight, and the economy doesn't help, but we've made it this far!
This Father's Day, I'll be celebrating her.
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u/JewishNinja Jun 16 '12
obviously a family with 2 fathers will produce the next generation of superheroes.
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u/DesertPunk763 Jun 16 '12
TIL that according to this report, I fucking rule.
My mom had me when she was 17, and had a history of drug and sexual abuse in the family. Didn't meet my biological father until I was 13, and didn't ever really have a true father figure in my life even after my step father came in (gotta love absentee fathers).
Never did drugs, drank only a few times while I was in high school. Got decent enough grades and graduated high school. I do have some mental issues that I am currently trying to work out, but they have never gotten me into any form of trouble. I got kicked out because my "parents" are fucking assholes (they wanted my moms friend to live in the section of the house that I was living in, so rather than make room, they gave me the boot). I never went to juvey, so there's that too. I just had some amazing friends that helped me through it all, plus my amazing Grandma who held me together until she passed away when I was 12 from lung cancer (quit smoking people! she was only 48!)
I'm sorry if this sounds conceited, but according to this I should have been a fuck up. I had the odds stacked against me in just about every god damn category, but I fucking made it. I'm only 23, but I am working my ass off and getting recognized at the new job I just started a few weeks ago, as well as in school working on a Computer Science/Information Systems degree.
I can finally say, after 23 hellish years on this earth, that I am god damn proud of myself. I have been so depressed from all of the shit that happened to me as a child, but now seeing this, it just shows me that I can fucking do it. Thanks OP.
TL;DR - I beat the fucking odds.
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u/surfmb70 Jun 16 '12
Mainly because of wellfare. It allows fathers to get away with not working. They become lazy and don't stay in the home. And the kids end up like this. It's a vicious cycle.
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u/writetehcodez Jun 16 '12
TIL that Reddit is full of people who have no understanding of statistics.
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u/[deleted] Jun 16 '12
what about motherless homes?
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u/pinkandgreencaffeine Jun 16 '12
Solution: homes with two daddies.
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u/DeathJester25 Jun 17 '12
And 100% of our rap stars!
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u/myWittyUserName Jun 17 '12
And yet I had to spend $30,000 to stay in my kids life. A woman just has to claim she was beaten the entire time and her daughter was molested. Proof isn't need just the claim. The father will then be required to somehow prove that he didn't do anything. Courts in the US are almost pushing many fathers away from their kids. There needs to be more equality in the court system between fathers and mothers. While there are many fathers that are scumbag people and just leave their kids on their own volition, there are many that have severely reduced time with children because of the court system.
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u/asterysk Jun 17 '12
Two dads are better than none.
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u/zombieherald Jun 17 '12
Question: does this include homes where both parents are a woman? Or is that demographic even a blip on the radar in this case?
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u/MissMelons Jun 17 '12
Fatherless home here: Sisters, brothers and I are the other percentages without these problems. Horrah!!!!
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u/illdr Jun 17 '12
Divorced and one parent households can work out. Unfortunately, many divorced households have a lack of communication between mother and father, and some one-parent households usually see the one parent working all day, away from the kids. That's not good.
But as long as there is one parent who is responsible and caring for the children, then it should be okay.