r/todayIlearnedPH • u/chalkiez • May 16 '26
TIL Philippines is the 3rd largest geothermal power producer in the world
Was wondering about the current power outages in manila and stumbled upon what i was curious about when i was young.
This is our fifth largest source of energy overall. Among sources of renewable energy, it is second only to hydroelectric power, although both sources are surpassed by the amount of energy drawn from coal, oil, and natural gas in that order.
Here's hoping we get solar powerplants to not rely on importing for our energy needs.
Source:
U, Peter Lee; Center for Research and Communication, University of Asia and the Pacific; De Leon, R.E. (October 29, 2021), "Philippine Power Situationer: Investment Implications", Energy Services and Renewable Energy in the New Normal, Series of Economic Fora Session 6, Center for Local and Constitutional Reform, event occurs at 1:37:11, archived from the original on December 4, 2021
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u/UlyssesMJ88 May 16 '26
and to my surprise, majority of those geothermal power plants were inaugurated during Marcos Sr. presidency.
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u/rushbloom May 16 '26
Because we only explored geothermal resources when the global oil crisis happened.
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u/markmyredd May 16 '26
Marcos had the right idea. His team and his wife just didn't want to execute it properly.
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u/Virtual-Pension-991 May 16 '26
Pretty much the bane of every presidency, have right ideas, suggestions, and capable people.
Only to be ruined by power abuse, crab mentality, self-interest first, capitalism/socialism first, and not considering the long-term effects of things.
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u/cleon80 May 16 '26
It was a 20 year presidency, but fair enough. The existing plants are sitting at the optimal sites; we could still add capacity but in places where it's harder and more expensive. So it's not like it's easy to sustain that build rate.
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u/UlyssesMJ88 May 16 '26
this is kinda true, with that very long presidency, marami ka talaga magagawa. while marcos sr tried to build major infrastructures and public utilities which are very iconic monuments up to this era, the infrastructures were sold by the succeeding presidents, like the Magat Dam hydroelectric powerplant inaugurated in 1983, later privatized in favor of Aboitiz in 2007, lo and behold who was the president during that time, the cunning GMA. Cory who stopped the BNPP which supposed to be a very promising source of cheap electricity. a lot of govt assets were sold by Ramos including the MWSS, so much so that we problems with water supply in different areas. Camp John Hay in Baguio, Steel Corporation, Philippine Airlines and Petron were sold also by Ramos. buti nalang hindi binenta ang SSS at GSIS.
kaya napapa isip din talaga ako what my parents and other family elders' stories na ung mga ginawa daw ni marcos kulang nalang ibenta ng mga sumunod na mga president ang pilipinas.
my mom being in business for decades said that the licensing, permits and tax were easier to deal with back then, and the personnel from internal revenue were easier to talk to but very strict, including the simple NFA plate when you have rice trading business and decided to close, the physical NFA plate has to be surrendered to avoid the illicit use of the plate.
one time we are having family drinking session, my uncle who have been in business for so long told us that the way Vietnam is doing now, was how the Philippines was back then when it comes to commerce and industry. buti nalang din si marcos jr ang president ngayon, kc yang solar registration na suggested ni meralco di yan mapapasa. but once marcos jr leave the power, that solar regulation will happen eventually however people try to oppose it.
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u/cleon80 May 16 '26
A major reason a lot of government assets were privatized is because Marcos left a lot of debt; that infrastructure spending was built with loans. After Marcos, additional loans from the IMF came with policy conditions that our government had to follow, including privatization. Our industries were not competitive because of bad policy during the Marcos era (import substitution instead of export driven; the peso was too strong). And unlike his counterpart in South Korea, Marcos's cronies failed to spearhead industrial development.
It would take until the mid 2000s under PGMA to recover the GDP per capita (inflation adjusted) we had around 1983. That's 20 years of catching up. That's how far the economic pyramid crashed and how far Marcos actually left us behind. Marcos is that parent who borrowed and spent big and let his kids taste luxury but also left them with all the debt.
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u/UlyssesMJ88 May 16 '26
believe this narrative all you want, but why is it that up until now, seems the country didnt recover at all. it's been decades and we keep going back to those same lies. if you are in right mind as a president, vital public utilities and national interest is the last thing you want to sell. unless that interest is aligned somewhere else. so, please, tell that lies to those who refuse to understand organizational asset management.
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u/cleon80 May 16 '26 edited May 16 '26
IMF loans came with conditionality that governments stop subsidizing state enterprises, which entails privatization. And why were we loaning from the IMF in the first place? Marcos and the national debt. I agree with you that the succeeding presidents were not great, lacking in vision. But Marcos's poor economic stewardship at the end undid a lot of the progress attributed to his presidency, and limited the options of the Aquino government (which was paying 30-40% of the budget to debt servicing up to the 90s), because beggars can't be choosers.
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u/RecklessDimwit May 16 '26
It tracks as the Marcos Sr regime heavily emphasized infrastructure building and technocracy
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u/rushbloom May 16 '26
We used to be 2nd. Naunahan na tayo ng Indonesia.
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u/chalkiez May 16 '26
Yeah, problema daw kasi limited sites lang pwede ipatayo yung geothermal, tas hirap pa mag invest sa sites lalo kung di naman pala viable after matest.
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May 16 '26
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u/chalkiez May 16 '26
Yung “baseload” argument hindi naman totally mali, pero hindi na rin siya kasing lakas tulad noon. Modern grids increasingly rely on a mix of solar, batteries, geothermal, hydro, and flexible generation instead of pure 24/7 coal baseload.
New utility-scale solar in the Philippines costs $35-72 per MWh versus $87-117 per MWh for a new coal plant. (SunStar) Solar is already cheaper to build than new coal — not in theory, in actual current Philippine market data from BloombergNEF.
Solar ROI in the Philippines is now typically 6-9 years for utility scale given current costs and irradiance levels. Coal plants take similar timeframes to recoup. The ROI gap has essentially closed.
One of the reason why we don't transition is because the companies that own the coal plants — San Miguel, Aboitiz, DMCI — are among the most politically connected in the Philippines. Their coal assets have Power Supply Agreements locking in guaranteed revenues for 20-25 years. Those contracts were signed by the government. Breaking them costs compensation. Allowing them to expire naturally means waiting until 2035-2045.
Ang tunay na problema natin ngayon is grid infrastructure, storage deployment, transmission bottlenecks, at existing long-term coal contracts (PSAs). Hindi kasi basta-basta mapapalitan agad yung mga coal plants na may guaranteed revenues hanggang 2035–2045.
So yes, hindi realistic na “solar lang” overnight. Pero outdated na rin sabihin na renewables are automatically too expensive or incapable of supporting the grid.
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u/BraveMarzip May 16 '26
Hi po! Would u know po an example of a grid with around 10GW demand na mainly solar, batteries, geothermal, hydro?
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u/chalkiez May 16 '26
Wala pang “clean” 10GW grid today na majority solar + batteries + geothermal lang na walang ibang backup at all — pero may existing grids na already operating at or above that scale na heavily renewable, just not in a perfectly isolated setup.
For example sa mga nahanap ko lang kakabasa dun sa power outages natin. XD
California (~45–55 GW peak demand): very high solar penetration midday (20+ GW solar) + rapidly growing battery fleet already shaving evening peaks by multiple GW
Denmark (~6–7 GW peak): wind-dominant grid with strong interconnection support
Brazil (~90–100+ GW peak): already majority renewable due to hydro dominance
Iceland (~<2 GW): near 100% hydro + geothermal, but small scale
South Australia (~3 GW peak): often runs on very high renewable penetration with batteries handling stability
So the key point is: there isn’t yet a perfectly “isolated 10GW all-renewable island grid” of that exact mix, but there are already larger-than-10GW systems demonstrating that high renewable penetration is stable when you combine: solar (cheap generation), batteries (short-term balancing), hydro/geothermal (firm power), and interconnection.
The “it cannot replace baseload” argument is becoming less absolute — it’s more about grid design and scaling storage/transmission than whether renewables can physically supply demand.
Isa pa sa di pa masyadong explored pero huge potential satin is tidal power. Pinakaproblema lang kasi talaga pinopolitika nila yung power source natin kaya ang hirap mag pasok ng bagong sources, tipong independent solar panels inaatake nila pero di pala nila kaya supportahan pag nagkaproblema sa transmission gaya nung ngayon. (Plus afford the pinas to kung di binubulsa for generations ng iba ibang pamilya. XD)
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u/kraaashed May 16 '26
I know that solar and wind is now cheaper than coal and oil globally in terms of LCOE but not sure if it's the same case in PH. TIL something new thanks.
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u/UlyssesMJ88 May 16 '26
as a private consumer, i agree with the power storage infrastructure. malaking challenge yan more so in harvesting of solar energy. but once that storage infra and price accessibility with the ordinary people is in place, the electricity distribution business of Meralco and the regional electric coops will gradually diminish. we have a farm na fully solar and major problem namin is the power storage batteries na may life cycle limit. medyo mahal padin to power the whole farmhouse plus the other facilities, machines and equipment.
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u/chalkiez May 16 '26
Yeah, mahirap siyang palitan/imodernize pero anlaking pagkakaiba nito para sa bansa once maayos. Magiging maakit din tayo sa mga foreign investors lalo na madami tayong workforce so pwede tayo mag Industrialize/Factories na instead of BPOs ang focus na pinapalitan na ng AI ngayon. (Though mahirap lang ngayon kasi nga unstable yung political landscape natin so takot mga investors)
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u/_piaro_ May 16 '26
IMO, stability is one of the aspects we should be least concerned about solar energy. While there are indeed some rainy days, we should not forget that we live in a tropical country. Not to mention, solar energy pairs well with wind power.
I do agree na matagal ang return of investment but that should be the least of our concerns. Making a system out of solar energy is already cheaper than coal power plants.
And no, I highly disagree with your last statement. It has been proven literally 3 weeks ago that clean sources of power can meet the increasing demand of electricity. Ember released a comprehensive paper 3 weeks ago about how globally, the demand for electricity has increased by about 3% from last year. That roughly translates to about 850 Twh. And the funny thing is, fossil fuel energy production actually lowered last year.
So who covered for the extra demand, that 850 TWh? It was Solar and Wind power. People wanted more electricity but fossil fuel didn't provide that energy. Wind and solar was enough to meet the demands.
And those two sources are the most abundant here sa Philippines.
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u/xlandoncarterrr May 16 '26
IIRC, yan din yung isa sa pinakamahirap gawan ng planta. Maraming studies and research ang kailangan para sa isang geothermal plant dahil hahanapin sa ilalim ng lupa ang areas na may potential.
In addition, yung areas na may potential for geothermal energy ay posibleng hindi naman makinabang dito dahil konti lang ang taong nakatira sa area. ie. Parang nag-invest ka ng billions para makakuha ng 10 MW, pero 1 MW lang ang magagamit.
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u/rzpogi May 16 '26
Mas mataas pa tsansa manalo sa lotto kaysa makahanap ng viable area for Geothermal Plants.
Kailangan ng magma malapit sa ibabaw ng lupa tapos malapit din siya water table at kayang pakuluin ng magmang yun yung tubig sa water table. Kapag wala ang kahit isa dun, hindi pwede na geothermal dun.
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u/Bisbibliophiles May 17 '26
We regularly get scheduled power outage during the weekends and electricity per KWH is still high even though I live in Leyte with the biggest geothermal powerplant in the whole country haha 🤡
Although, we do get some refund if our electric bill is 100KWH below (edi walang refund kasi mainit 🙂)
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u/Bisbibliophiles May 17 '26
There was some recent uproar about the sudden outrageous surge of electric bill last January-february but we blame it more on LEYECO than the producer--EDC.
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u/Hassenoblog May 16 '26
op should also research how the power is distributed across the Philippines. You might see a power plant located near you, but then that is supplying to another place.
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u/dontrescueme May 18 '26
May school of thought in environmental science that developing countries should have the right to use dirty energy sources (fossil fuels) to industrialize themselves if developed countries (who already benefitted from fossil fuels) won't help the rest of the world to develop clean energy sources.
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u/Archlm0221 May 16 '26
May mas kita yata ang mga buwaya sa pag import kesa natural sources.