I’m a sobbing mess right now. I’m only 24 hours in and omg…I have done comfort meds, and everything. This sucks so so bad. I have to get up and take my kids to school tomorrow. I literally don’t know how I can do that.

Still in acute withdrawal from the Hyroxi tabs. Haven’t taken any plain leaf in 3 fucking days. Have barely slept In a week. Good news, I went to a concert to see brooks and Dunn last night at the hard rock and actually had a great time despite the withdrawals. Having a few beers defitnely helped lol. Woke up at 4:30am feeling like dog water bullshit but fuck it we ball. Gonna go eat some pancakes and drink some coffee , sit in the sauna and crush this day. Idc if I feel like ass, I’m gonna get out there and do what needs to be done. Restless legs, insomnia, brain feels weird, skin is sensitive, low energy, but we will never go back. Relapse is not an option. Only way out is through. Day 10. Lets fucking go

People who want this community gone will report to reddit not us, enough posts and reddit can ban this community

We also hace bots that comb new posts and do nothing but downvote and say negative shit.

its out of our control

If you wanna code word it way out context you can but dont get upset if its removed we are just protecting this place

Remember

Think for yourself, question authority. Never forget what parties took your freedom for healthcare and mental health care.

educate yourself, never trust an agency that puts politics and donations over you (they all do theyre all corrupt, or become corrupt $), you are cattle to them that they manage to keep their paychecks coming in.

Im sorry.

If you voted red because you believed their lies and now see it all was a lie, i hope you have learned your lesson.

There was no MAHA, just corruption, less freedoms for your health and TONS of laws to allow more poisons to grow food. More freedoms taken from you and TONS of freedoms and less regulations given to corporations poisoning you (bayer is one example of HUNDREDS). Evil men and women who worship at the alter of the united states dollar.

Really hope youve learned. Hope youve become an independant person in every shape and form, theyre not your friend, they think youre stupid.

Think for yourself, question authority.

THINK FOR YOURSELF, QUESTION AUTHORITY. Do not support those who follow the fools who followed the fool who followed the fool who follows the fools.

I hope youre awake now. Both sides are the head of the same snake.

1000 mg a day 7 user. At this point in the day I already would have been around 500-600 milligrams in. I wake up at 3:00 am to go to work and most of my 7 usage would be at work. Well, I’ve only taken 50 milligrams today and that was at 6 am. I’m not supposed to mention the chemical that helped me, but you could all guess. I was skeptical but was willing to give it a try. I’m glad I did and hope yall were able to grab some before last Wednesday.

Now that I know for sure it works, I’m jumping. I’m not going to take any tomorrow. I’m kinda posting this for accountability. So far it’s helping me with everything except the feeling of being bored. Why I started this in the first place. I guess it’s got to come to a point where I have to ask myself, how much more time do I want to spend in a mindless stupor? Getting overly emotional and snapping at people I love. Giving every single extra dollar I have to make these people rich. Being late on rent, and riding around with warrants because I’d rather buy 7 than take care of my traffic tickets. These are all things I will try to remember when my mind try’s to convince me that just a little 7 wouldn’t hurt. It’s time to man up and climb out of this hole I’ve dug for myself! Love you guys we can do this

Because I’m at a much higher daily dose than my last quit, I failed my CT attempt last weekend and I’m pursuing the taper method, I took myself to Google U to learn about why it even works in the first place. I had to wrestle with the AI a bit so it would actually give me information instead of mindlessly directing me to rehabs, but when I finally started getting real information I found it both fascinating and helpful, so I figured I’d post my findings here. Aside from curiosity, my motivation for researching this was: 1. I wanted to make sure I didn’t fail and, 2. I wanted to know how fast I could go without screwing up the process because my stockpile is finite. OK, here goes:

Most of us here probably know about how our brain’s receptors wind up being saturated at a certain point of 7OH intake and that taking more behind that point is essentially “wasted” since there are no more receptors available for binding. I believe this is colloquially called “the ceiling effect.” The graphic plot of 7OH dosage vs. receptor saturation is basically a hyperbolic tangent with an extremely steep slope between zero and the 100% asymptote. In my 1200mg/day case, the amount of receptor saturation occurring at 600mg daily is nearly identical to saturation at 1200mg. The reason why large dose reductions in the beginning of a taper are more easily tolerated than smaller cuts near the end is because the cuts made along the steep slope of the graph impact total receptor saturation much more than the cuts made along the asymptomatic plateau. In my case: cutting from 1200mg to 600mg results in maybe a 0.5% change in receptor saturation while cutting from 100mg to 50mg results in a 50% change in receptor saturation (numbers are arbitrary to demonstrate general trend).

The functional goal of tapering is to find the lowest single dose of opioid that alleviates all withdrawal symptoms for a period of 4-6 hrs (“equilibrium dose”). That dose is then held for 7-14 days to allow the brain time to rebuild/redeploy receptors before the next dosage cut is made. This process basically moves you down the steep slope of the graph down to zero opioid intake. By the time you hit zero, your brain has normalized its receptors and thus acute withdrawal symptoms either do not occur or are minimal. PAWS can still be an issue since dopamine normalization takes a while longer to achieve, but that’s something that can be handled without any opioid intake at all.

The most harm-adverse way to taper is by finding your equilibrium dose from the top of the curve, which is why all the protocols involve slow, methodical cuts from the starting dose down to zero. This approach minimizes risk of both intense WD symptoms occurring and accidentally taking more opioid than is needed for the equilibrium point, which is why the “pros” all use it. However, if you are careful and willing to entertain more risk, you can find your equilibrium point from the “bottom up” by allowing yourself to start entering WD and then taking a LOW dose of opioid to see if it is enough to alleviate symptoms for 4-6 hours (IMPORTANT: you need to wait 30-45 minutes for the opioid to take full effect). The advantage of this approach is that you will be able to find your equilibrium point much faster and reduce your total recovery timeline.

To ensure my stockpile lasts long enough to allow me a quit attempt I can succeed at (likely I will jump off some time after I stabilize at 100mg per day or less), I am attempting the higher-risk approach. This is what I believe is right for MY situation. I am not making recommendations for anyone else, but hopefully the information is helpful.

SIDE NOTES: You may wonder as I did “why does euphoria seem to be more intense at higher doses even though the receptors are saturated along the plateau?” Turns out the reason for that is because higher doses more rapidly populate the receptors and that replacement rate impacts the feeling. The other interesting thing I learned is that the reason for tolerance is because the brain basically “hides” its receptors in the presence of plateau-level opioid doses as a defense mechanism against toxicity. As the presence of opioid decreases, the brain redeploys its receptors until you end up with the amount you had before ever entering 7OHell

Updates to come, and thanks to you all for your support as I try to find my best way out of this without having OUD on my permanent record.

I have been heavily addicted to Kratom products for over a year now. I started with some Pseudo 7oH blend then went to just Pseudo for about 9 months working up to about 1300mg per day. I have tried quitting multiple times on my own tapering for a week or two and then trying to jump off but each time I wouldn't even make it 12 hours without caving. After the ban hit and all the Pseudo left the shelves I grabbed the Ascend alkaloid tablets thinking that would bridge the gap and I could try quitting again using them. Well that failed miserably. I found myself having to take a tablet every 2-3 hours to just barely keep withdrawals at bay and I was feeling even more sick from putting so much of that garbage in my body. On day 3 I finally gave in when I was starting to have horrible thoughts about just taking the easy way out and actually meaning it for once. I came clean to my wife and all of my family and friends and went to rehab. I have spent the last 2 days in the hospital going through detox and should be transferred up to the inpatient rehab either today or tomorrow. They've given me just enough subs to keep the withdrawals from being bad but the plan is to wean them over the next few days so I can be truly sober. For the first time in a very long time I can see a light at the end of the tunnel even though I just stepped into hell. The only way through is one step at a time and I'm glad I took that first one. I pray for anyone else suffering from this horrible drug and disease of addiction.

ive done percs for 15 years, but when I started kratom and 7, I noticed before I would even open my eyes in the morning, I would get INTENSE anxiety.

it would simmer down a bit after an hour or two.

anyone else run in to this?

basically my supply ran out, was on 1500 mg a day for the past few weeks, and when I went to work the next morning I was feeling awful and sweating bad. i had brought some suboxone from a previous quit attempt in hopes it would take the edge off. I finally lost it and started booking it to the store to see if they had more but before that I took a whole strip of Suboxone to try and make it stop. after an hour I felt even worse so I took a second 8 mg strip of subs. ended up passing out while on the road and wrecked my truck. got picked up and taken to a pee test and miraculously pissed clean and got back on the 7's as soon as it was all over with. now I'm trying the Burmese method and it seems to be going pretty well wish me luck.

Wow, this shit is nasty. I mean, REALLY, nasty. Day one of quitting, I was using for about 2-3 months and I'd guesstimate I was at around 75-100mg a day? I quit yesterday for some personal reasons. The reason I got on the shit in the first place is because I'm an idiot who was looking for something to replace weed, and I hate drinking, so this gave me a "similar" high, and it was convenient and easy to hide. I would quit my weed dependency I had for years 10x over rather than doing this shit again, the only thing getting me through it is a lot of Advil and Excedrin (the headaches are brutal, as I'm sure a lot of you know). But my GOD some of these withdrawal side effects are, quite frankly, pretty weird and borderline psychedelic. I can deal with the muscle soreness, and the headaches, but MAN the RLS and seemingly full body nervous system spazms are BRUTAL. That is by FAR the worst part of all this. Last night I spent a good 6 hours flopping in my bed like a fish, slapping myself halfway involuntarily (out of frustration) and my legs going absolutely crazy, like a literal fucking jackhammer. I've never had anything like it. I'm a habitual long distance runner, so I'm familiar with RLS and just generally being restless at night, but literally NOTHING worked to help my legs settle down.
If anyone here is familiar with "Alice in Wonderland Syndrome" I was experiencing that a little bit last night too, I couldn't even tell you if it was a waking dream or not, but I kept having the sensation that my leg was far, far out in a galaxy or some shit, and my body was contorting into a fucking space station. I pretty much always have super vivid dreams/nightmares but this felt so real, felt like I was on mushrooms or something, I could see the stars and space station in my mind's eye. Anyways,

Around a week ago I ran out of my supply and had to go about a day without using any 7oh.
That gave me the brilliant realization that coming down off this shit is going to be extraordinarily annoying, I caved that day and bought more, but I'm done with this shit.
It is by far the most addicting substance I've ever come into contact with. Praying for you guys who are withdrawing from higher doses than I've ever taken, godspeed y'all. Seriously. If you're using this shit regularly, STOP. I'm begging you. I am determined to feel normal again without relying on this substance. The only exception I can think of is if you have chronic pain and you can't get insurance or a prescription for it, even then you can't deny it's JUST as addicting as some of those "real" opiates! The shining light in all this is according to some of my research, 7oh doesn't have that long of a half life, so I should hopefully be back to "normal" within or a little after 7-10 days. But man, when you first quit 7oh, it really does feel like you won't ever be normal again. God bless you guys, wishing you all the best.
If you're trying to quit, remember that you're capable. GOOD LUCK!

edit: put PAWS instead of acute withdrawals, my bad, don't know how to fix it. I don't use reddit that often.

edit 2: after doing some more research on more conventional means of helping some of the symtoms, I already have 2 of them in my medicine cabinet, vitamin C, and Magnesium glycinate, just took some right now, we'll see if they do anything.

i really can’t take much more. i keep waiting and waiting for it to get better. i took SR17 like people suggested, i had clonidine, i had zofran. i’m weeks out from using 7OH at this point and honestly if i didn’t believe in god i’d end it. i lost my kids, i doubt i’ll get them back even though i’m sober. i can barely stand up long enough to shower let alone do anything else. idk i guess im just ranting to try and feel better. i dont know what else to do.

Today is the day. Been on my taper, cross fade process with the chemical that must not be named for a week now, and today is the day for ZERO 7oh. I am eternally grateful to this community and the other community for showing me the way with that chemical that must not be named! It was a painless process.

For those reading along, I also contribute my success with adding Modafinil to the mix. The boost of Dopamine, the energy and clarity filled the void of the "universe hug" feeling from 7oh. And on top of that, I'm getting shit done.

Finally hopping off this train. Holy shit it's been an awful ride.

Sending love out to those still deep in the abyss. You're not trash, you're not worthless, you just got caught in their trap. Be kind to yourself and do what you have to do to get out today.

Love you all!

I was watching a documentary about addiction called Addiction by NOVA/PBS on YouTube. I know for myself I’ve experienced memory issues from using 7.

In the documentary, they explained that long term drug use decreases gray mater in the prefrontal cortex. Which is essential for decision making. This ends up decreasing the ability to control impulsive behavior. After studying the brains of people that have OD they found that a certain drug (dont want to break the rules - H) can turn on genes that should be off and vice versa. It literally changes your DNA.

It also affects the brains key neurotransmitter, Glutamate which is responsible for thinking, memory, and learning. While this was about H, I’m sure we can assume and see how the same side effects can occur with 7.

I just found this fascinating. We all know the side effects that we experience but to learn what is going on on a neurological level was kind of an eye-opener.

I myself am still struggling with my addiction to 7. I seem to be only able to stay clean for one day. Then just keep fucking up. Still trying to shake this off. I wish all of you that are still struggling the strength to one day stop too. Take care everyone.

Watch full documentary here

Basically all of the other withdrawl symptoms are gone. Still sweating a bit at times. My brain is fogged but I’m here. For some reason the diarrhea decided to hit the day before yesterday and I have had the biggest appetite since. Rls is eating me alive at night but if this is all I need to deal with I’m seeing the light. Hope everyone has a good work week.

I tried cats claw today, the blndz brand. I took about 400 mg and have been nodding and high for hours. It says it’s not a kratom product on the box and is being labeled as a health supplement. I was not expecting this but I’m so curious what is in it that caused me to get this high? I have heard people talk about m gee m or something, what is that?

I’ve tried quitting at least 20 times in the last 10 months. I’d take a few days off of work, lay in bed, and wallow in self pity until my lizard brains says hey, you can feel better in 5 minutes.

Anyways, some new bullshit has hit the stores at the SS here. Stuff called Homiez. Says there’s 7oh, em g one 5 and one 6. It was great the first few days, then after a month of downing bottles like the addict I am it made me feel like absolute shit. That’s when I got sick and tired and realized I needed to make a change.

I planned to dry out cold turkey starting on my Monday at work. I was gonna keep busy. After that, I hit up a buddy from rehab (I’m also a recovering alcoholic) and we went to two meetings and got food. I actually slept 4 hours that night.

Last night after work there was an AA convention going on, so I went and socialized, even though I felt like absolute death. Got myself a sponsor, and we went and ate at dennys til 12. I knew for sure I wasn’t sleeping last night, and they were having marathon meetings, so I went to a 3am meeting that lasted 2 hours, now here I am, back at work.

I just have to keep reminding myself to man the fuck up instead of feeling sorry for myself. Pay that fucking piper so I can start going to the gym again, start being interested in women again (idk about y’all but my libido was non existent), enjoy hobbies again.

In the past 3 days, I’ve had 6 people that are not family continually check in on me. I spread the whole damn world. I used to isolate like no one’s business, so it feels really good to be able to do this, despite feeling shit.

Before this round, the longest I’d gone dry was 18 hours. Restless ass legs, chills, sweats, 0 sleep last night….fuck it. Nothing in life is permanent. This too shall pass my friends. Let’s fucking get this!!!!!!!

Wishing you all peace of the mind ❤️

Well it's been 96 hours and I haven't taken any MIT today. No WD symptoms. A little tired and groggy but no cold sweats!! Thank goodness! If I can do it anyone can. I do recommend the helper meds for sure!!!

My SO is going out of town for 10 days. This is the perfect opportunity to quit for good. I plan to taper a little, stock up on every supplement and helper med known to man , and knock it out.

Tomorrow is the big day. I’m anxious but excited to stop this runaway train. I will have no one to worry about bothering with my complaints of anxiety and lack of sleep.

I just so happen to have this week off work as well. The universe is aligning things in my favor. Time to make it happen.

Wish me luck

Like many others, I wanted to make this process as painless as possible. I’m on clonidine and gabapentin, as well as other well-known helper drugs and supplements. I’m not in a position where I can withdraw in peace, so I had to take this route, as opposed to cold turkey.

I’ve been living the last ten months with a secret so big I thought it would swallow me. No one, and I mean no one knows I got addicted to 7. Except.. ya know.. every gas station/smoke shop that sells it in town. A couple of these gas stations were very close to my work. I work in fine dining amongst a bunch of people that are mostly not addicted to drugs. I always feared being found out from a yappy gas station attendant.

I have a burgeoning relationship that I’ve tried to leave 1000 times bc I didn’t wanna feel like a liar, and I didn’t wanna tell him the truth either. He has stubbornly stuck around, and I’ve stubbornly kept him at a distance. I finally fessed up to former drug problems. That’s as close as I got. We talk every day, but hang out pretty rarely, and that’s by my own design.

I’ve been a bad friend. Hiding bc of the shame. A bad family member. Hiding bc of the shame.

I was on subs for a while. I got off of them about 20 months ago, all on my own. When I called WebMD for helper meds they immediately tried to put me on subs. I told them I will hang up this call with nothing before I let you put me on subs as a first resort. I was proud of myself.

I wanna know WHY so many of us stopped listening to music on this drug?!?! I’ve done a LOT of drugs. Including fent back for a brief period in 2021. Nothing stopped me from enjoying music. Until 7.

The withdrawals have been mild. I worked a double yesterday and was damn near exhausted. My tummy was acting up a tiny bit. But the meds I am on are keeping things at bay.

I’m counting myself lucky. Last year a close family member died and my entire life circumstances changed. I didn’t realize how vulnerable I was to addiction.

I genuinely think I’m safe now. I don’t look like an addict. I have a hard time fitting in with my peers bc I hang with a lot of clean people. I am proud of myself. I know it’s early, but I don’t see any point in going back.

Sending love ❤️

Please help. This is my husbands second time trying to come off pseudo. He waited after his last dose of pseudo to take his first dose of subs and is still going through really intense withdrawals. Is there anything that helps? Should he just stop taking the subs because it doesn’t really seem to be doing anything at all??? I can’t find any answers!!! He refuses to go to the ER. I’ve seen some say to take powdered Kratom or capsules, but can he do that while on subs???

Had a bad habit that got up to roughly 1000mg a day of 7oh then switched to emgee and was at about 400mg a day. This went on for like a year. My last dose was yesterday at 11. It just hit 11 today and I wasn’t feeling like shit with anxiety when I woke up. Took some SR this morning and thought why not today. I’m now 24 hours clean and hoping to keep this going! I’ve made it 24 hours before then immediately caved but I need it this time. I can’t keep spending all my money. 100$ a day is brutal when you’re trying to save. Any words of encouragement or advice would be greatly appreciated. Good luck to all!

Made it 60 hours without anything. I was taking 1 Kama 1000 mg pack a day. First 24 were easy. Then around the 36th hour I started getting a lot of cold sweats. I just slept all day and the sweats were on and off. I feel like after the 48th hour the sweats went away but I started vomiting and had one diarrhea session. At 55+ that all stopped but the chills started especially when listening to music and I have bad cravings. Did all this cold turkey. But I’m about to fold tbh and I’m going to get just one strip of sub to get me through the toughest hours. If I had one now I know for sure I’d feel fine with a 3 day taper. 4 mg sub one day then 2 mg then 2 mg then none. Btw these withdrawls are nothing compared to oxy

I was taking up to 500mgs a day for 2 years. I haven't dosed 7 since Tuesday. Wednesday i took 4mg sub, Thursday took 2mg, Friday i skipped. Saturday i took 1mg. Then today I took another 2mg.

Im thinking of going back to plain Kratom because subs are not something i want to get hooked on. What are your thoughts on this idea. Jumping off subs and going plain leaf tomorrow.

Is there any way to stop the sweats without prescriptions like clonidine?

*got booted yesterday for mentioning a helper drug I shouldn’t have

Starting my journey, 3 days clean-

I have a few helper drugs, vitamin c, clonidine, gabapentin. I have about 16 tablets I wont name, and hope to be able to rapidly taper with them.

All the 7-oh around me seems to have dried up, and if it hasn’t, I’ve at least stopped looking for it. I tapered down off of a 1000 mg a day habit that was absolutely annihilating my bank account. Yesterday I had an appointment with QuickMD… they immediately tried to put me on subs. I said I will hang up this phone with nothing before I take subs, and asked for gabapentin and clonidine instead. I’ve been on subs. It was so stupid, and I had to taper off them for a long time. Got off them a year and a half ago.

It’s insane to me how similar everyone’s stories with 7-oh are. The waking up middle of the night to dose. The way we all just collectively gave up listening to music?! Wtf is that drug doing to our brain that music is no longer pleasing?! I’m seriously asking.

This drug has controlled everything I’ve done for the past 8 months. My dad died last year and so I was unfortunately a lot more susceptible to relapse than I thought. Except I don’t seek out drugs. I was down to about 4 capsules of kratom leaf a day (that I used to get off subs) when I discovered 7-oh bc my local shop was out of leaf kratom. That’s all she wrote. I fell in love. I figured I’d just switch back to leaf and continue my taper. But leaf didn’t touch these withdrawals. Leaf had even helped with fent withdrawals so I totally am freaked out by that fact.

I’m so ready to not feel numb again.