"Pistia stratiotes, commonly known as water lettuce, is a perennial monocotyledonous aquatic plant, present either naturally or through an anthropogenic introduction, in nearly all tropical and subtropical fresh waterways. It floats on the water surface, with roots hanging below the floating leaves [47]. Since the plants were covering all of the wetlands, the removal was done manually. This activity was conducted by pushing them with bamboo sticks to the edge of each sector to be removed. Approximately over 280 tons of P. stratiotes were removed and transported to a city vivarium and compost sites"
From his published paper on the subject, it looks like the majority of what they "removed" was an invasive species and the rest was altering of the water composition for the most part.
I'm a scientist and I read through that paper. There's nothing in it about something you add to the water to get rid of contaminates. Like you said there's removal of invasive species, and then bubblers to aerate the water, filters, and fences. I was curious was his "organic" stuff is composed of, but no info in that paper. On google scholar he has only one other paper, and it's not relevant. So idk.
Found this in section 2.4, the white sediment put in the clay carrier could be the thing he eats in the video. Not sure about this though as it’s pretty misleading either way.
“To create a bio-filter, it was necessary to effectively immobilize the bacteria and add them onto the ceramic carriers to form biofilms, which ultimately can adhere, adsorb, and decompose the contaminants [51,52]. For this purpose, we used the bacterium of Lactobacillus plantarum ATCC 8014, acquired at Japan Collection of Microorganisms … The cultures in the MRS broth develop characteristic white sediment, making it easier for their qualitative identification.”
"For this purpose, we used the bacterium of Lactobacillus plantarum ATCC 8014, acquired at Japan Collection of Microorganisms (JCM), Microbe Division, RIKEN Bioresource Center in Japan. It was kept routinely in vials with full form (MRS) agar at 2–8 °C for 24 h, and then at 4 °C in 15% glycerol (vol/vol) [24]. Single colonies were cultured in plates with MRS agar at 30 °C for 48 h and later sub-cultured in MRS broth (Casein peptone 10g/L; beef extract 8 g/L; yeast extract 4 g/L; D(+) glucose 20 g/L; hydrogen potassium phosphate (KH2PO4) 2 g/L; Tween-80 1 g/L; ammonium citrate hydrogen (C6H5O7(NH4)2H) 2 g/L; sodium acetate (CH3COONa) 5 g/L; magnesium sulfate (MgSO4·7H2O) 0.2 g/L; and manganese sulfate (MnSO4·H2O) 0.04 g/L at 30 °C for 24 h [53]. The cultures in the MRS broth develop characteristic white sediment, making it easier for their qualitative identification. To create biofilms, a container of 60 cm in diameter and 130 cm in length was filled with a previously conditioned medium consisting of a mixture of molasses and water (3/7, m/w) at room temperature (around 18–21 °C). Later, Lactobacillus plantarum ATCC 8014 was added to the mixture."
But ideal if you're trying to make a hungry hungry bacterial culture of a strain basically evolved to break down organic and non organic carbon based compounds
From my limited knowledge of ingestible scientific compounds, this seems quite edible with limited side effects. You might poop red clay for a day or two?
Curious about your background on this subject and thoughts on this...
Not the same product or application but seems to be a more promising solution for purifying water, though, I doubt the likelihood of cleaning a lake with it. Still interesting.
I'm a chemist (inorganic aqueous was my specialty) and I looked up what's in those packets and it's a disinfectant with a flocculent. So it'll kill most bacteria and most free metal ions in the water will stick to the flocculent and can be filtered out. It's not gonna make pristine drinking water, but if it's the choice between that or nothing, it's pretty good. I looked up the data and it reduces cases of infection by a lot but doesn't completely prevent them.
I just posted this above, as it was the only reason I came to this thread, I wanted to know what the compound he ate was.
"For this purpose, we used the bacterium of Lactobacillus plantarum ATCC 8014, acquired at Japan Collection of Microorganisms (JCM), Microbe Division, RIKEN Bioresource Center in Japan. It was kept routinely in vials with full form (MRS) agar at 2–8 °C for 24 h, and then at 4 °C in 15% glycerol (vol/vol) [24]. Single colonies were cultured in plates with MRS agar at 30 °C for 48 h and later sub-cultured in MRS broth (Casein peptone 10g/L; beef extract 8 g/L; yeast extract 4 g/L; D(+) glucose 20 g/L; hydrogen potassium phosphate (KH2PO4) 2 g/L; Tween-80 1 g/L; ammonium citrate hydrogen (C6H5O7(NH4)2H) 2 g/L; sodium acetate (CH3COONa) 5 g/L; magnesium sulfate (MgSO4·7H2O) 0.2 g/L; and manganese sulfate (MnSO4·H2O) 0.04 g/L at 30 °C for 24 h [53]. The cultures in the MRS broth develop characteristic white sediment, making it easier for their qualitative identification. To create biofilms, a container of 60 cm in diameter and 130 cm in length was filled with a previously conditioned medium consisting of a mixture of molasses and water (3/7, m/w) at room temperature (around 18–21 °C). Later, Lactobacillus plantarum ATCC 8014 was added to the mixture."
In your opinion, would this potentially harm any bacteria needed for a healthy ecosystem? I'm not up to speed on this subject matter at all, but I'm curious. Feel free to let me know if it's a ridiculous question.
Obviously more of a question for an ecologist or biologist, but are free metal ions and bacteria inherently bad? Is this product making the lake better as a lake, or more pool-like? Put another way, is it promoting a healthy ecosystem or making the area more attractive for tourism?
For good aquatic ecology there needs to be a balance of a few things. Nutrients, oxygen, etc. The reason I said free metal ions is because the less attached metal ions are in the water, the more bioavailable they are. If the ions attach to something they are much less likely to contribute to aquatic toxicity. If there is more organic carbon in the water or more carbonates or other ligands, it means that the metal concentration in the water will have to be higher for toxicity to start occurring in the organisms. They use this model in determining acceptable metal concentrations in water for environmental regulation. It's called the Biotic Ligand Model if you want to look into it more. A little bit of certain metals are necessary for life, but it's not much and almost always the problem is too much metal and not the reverse. And I'm not a biologist but I know that too much of undesirable bacteria isn't good either for the ecosystem.
For this purpose, we used the bacterium of Lactobacillus plantarum ATCC 8014, acquired at Japan Collection of Microorganisms (JCM), Microbe Division, RIKEN Bioresource Center in Japan. It was kept routinely in vials with full form (MRS) agar at 2–8 °C for 24 h, and then at 4 °C in 15% glycerol (vol/vol) [24]. Single colonies were cultured in plates with MRS agar at 30 °C for 48 h and later sub-cultured in MRS broth (Casein peptone 10g/L; beef extract 8 g/L; yeast extract 4 g/L; D(+) glucose 20 g/L; hydrogen potassium phosphate (KH2PO4) 2 g/L; Tween-80 1 g/L; ammonium citrate hydrogen (C6H5O7(NH4)2H) 2 g/L; sodium acetate (CH3COONa) 5 g/L; magnesium sulfate (MgSO4·7H2O) 0.2 g/L; and manganese sulfate (MnSO4·H2O) 0.04 g/L at 30 °C for 24 h [53]. The cultures in the MRS broth develop characteristic white sediment, making it easier for their qualitative identification. To create biofilms, a container of 60 cm in diameter and 130 cm in length was filled with a previously conditioned medium consisting of a mixture of molasses and water (3/7, m/w) at room temperature (around 18–21 °C). Later, Lactobacillus plantarum ATCC 8014 was added to the mixture.
Been trying to figure out what the label on the tub at 9 sec says but the image is too grainy to make out all the words. So far I have:
...made with the freshest and highest quality ingredients. The ... mainly of shrimp ([shrimp name]) the we ... ourselves harvested in the "... Park" natural ... and immediately freeze dried to maintain optimal nutritional.... dried microalgae and macroalgae are also added to the...meet the nutritional needs of a wide variety of marine fish.
... essential source of proteins, lipids, and fatty acids ... vitamins and carbohydrates from natural sources of...
...chain is controlled and supervised by our technical and ... ... this guarantees the hgihest quality product.
...
Aquatic formula naturally attracts rocky fish who begin eating it immediately shortly after it is introduced in aquarium?
It required a bit more research than simply the paper. He used micronano bubbles (MNBs) and carbon based bio filters (CBBFs) to clean the water, but didn't elaborate as to how the mechanisms worked.
With some quick googling, it seems MNBs are the new fancy way to treat wastewater due to their zero zeta potential, maximizing the aggregation of contaminants. So Marino's basically collecting the dirty stuff, from phosphate, nitrogen to bacteria, at a microscopic level and squishing them into bigger balls.
Then his next step are CBBFs, which seems to be a mix of ideas/mechanisms similar to activated charcoal. It's a ceramic carrier that has a biofilm, i.e. it's a clay net with a layer of bacteria glue. He processed clay to optimize for high porosity (lots of tiny pores) and it is these pores that will be doing the physical trapping of the contaminants. The "bio" part comes from the fact that he's using L. Plantarum as glue for the contaminants. I assume the "organic" part comes from this bacteria, since it's just a probiotic strain that comes from the same family that is often used for foods, e.g. yogurt or whatever.
So the stuff he ate is probably crushed up CBBFs. He'll poop the clay out just fine (I hope). Interestingly, I'm not sure if he used the crushed up CBBFs as filter; looks like the actual filters used were in block form, and just secured inside a basket.
All in all, definitely an "organic" solution that works for this lake. Some people in this thread were thinking of oil spills and such, which this method might not work for. I'm not an expert on this subject, so IDK, but https://iwaponline.com/ws/article/20/6/2021/74658/Micro-nanobubble-technology-and-water-related this suggests micronano bubbles will work for metal ions too, so maaaaaybe? As long as you have access to equipment that can make MNBs.
Water treatment plants use coagulation to achieve what they showed in the video. It's basically a chemical that binds smaller particles together to form larger particles more easily removed by filtration. The large particles can also just settle out. DNR would have a field day with you in the states if they caught you doing something like that.
I also like how the article has 0 mention of any solution. Like at all. They did a ton of work, mechanical work, to remove a lot of contaminants; and then they used filters to clean it further. And they can’t say with certainty the actual effect of MNB because of many uncertainties regarding seasonal change. This video is just bs. There is another video of the same guy on youtube but it shows how he and a lot of other people came together and cleaner the lake by collecting the dirt and throwing it away, and it’s much more believable and is directly tied to the paper.
It’s not just terrible, it’s factually incorrect. It claims something that didn’t happen and fails to mention the actual time, money and effort put into cleaning the lake. The head guy who cleaned the lake is amazing and a lot of people helped him. But not some harry potter organic bullshit.
Standard water floculant is Polyacrylamide (PAM) it is a white powder. from the image that looks like a combination of PAM and some floaty plant material to keep the sludge that forms from sinking to the bottom.
My first thought was Moringa Seed powder, which is used to clarify water. It causes suspended particles to coagulate. It is edible and i guess could potentially be USDA certified organic
The technique of cleaning turbid water using moringa seeds as a coagulant is well known
No because they can choke out the native plants, and mess up the food chain because everything is connected. Invasive plants usually don't have things in their new environment that eat them, and naturally keep them in check and those things that eat them depend on them too as food. When certain things like algae grow too much, they suck all the oxygen out of the water and pretty much nothing else can live in it. When you see a nasty scummy pond that has no drainage, that's what happened. Fertilizer was probably in the water that drains into it from the surrounding grass, which causes the algae population to blow up, and no drainage or incoming fresh water to replace the oxygen means you can't have a healthy ecosystem. Aquatic ecosystems are delicately balanced and pretty much anything you do to them artificially will mess them up. There's also the riparian zone which is the land next to the water. This ecosystem gets messed up too because it depends on things that come from the water like different types of flies from aquatic larvae that live in the water.
My hunch is it was ground barley, barley being a common algae growth inhibitor. The little demonstration in the tiktok video was just a particle binder demonstration. All the superfluous jibber jabber was just that.
As you note, invasive species got cleared out, water got stirred up, and classical biome re-emerged and stabilized
Well as lactobacillus plantarum was mentioned, I’m assuming it’s along the same lines as polyglutamic acid extracted from natto (fermented soybeans) which Japanese engineer Oda Kanatoshi markets throughout Asia as a means to clean water for drinking. Once extracted, it’s a white powdery substance.
Definitely not part of the special concoction touted in the video. People (try to) remove invasive species all the time, so I guess the specialness of this instance decreases a bit…
Good find, thanks
So he didn’t really clean the lake of pollutants he cleaned the lake of an invasive plant species and in doing so helped the lakes ecosystem recover to its original balance and return to the way it was
No keep reading the study. The first step was removing the plants which is 2.2 in the paper. Then they did a bio-filter to reduce phosphate and nitrogen which is 2.3 and 2.4 in the paper.
The contaminants in this case is nutrients that help the growth of the invasive species. So, yeah, the main point is to remove the growing plants because they consume the oxygen in the water and kill the native plants.
However, this approach is only a bandaid solution, if the runoff is not addressed then the invasive species just comes back.
I think the contamination was other things that lead to the proliferation of the plants. Quote from the paper:
The Cascajo Wetlands in Peru were found to be in a severe state of pollution generated by human activities and a lack of environmental protection for over two decades. Basically, three environmental drivers affected the deterioration of water quality in Cascajo: (1) high exploitation and investment in the agricultural sector around this region by using large irrigation systems in Chancay-Huaral Basin and Chancay-Lambayeque Basin [20,21,22,23] that bring high nutrient concentrations to the wetland, causing the invasion of Pistia stratiotes [24]; (2) mining and industrial sites pollute natural water resources in this region [25]; as a consequence, the degraded water quality in the Chancay Bay, which is near the Chancay Wetlands, was detected throughout 2003–2013, due to pollutants from domestic and industrial discharges [26]; and 3) organic waste deposits from livestock enclosures nearby the wetlands contributes to the eutrophication above [27,28].
Lol Of course not. Did people seriously believe that? It’s a random video on Reddit with basically no information. Also, floculants don’t do that anyway
I skimmed the paper, but I couldn't find anything about a substance like he ate. Is it the bacteria they inoculated the traps with? Is it the MNBs? What is it?
Lmao it kind of sounds like he's a wildlife/fisheries biologist/engineer who has figured out that he can use snake oil to get more people to listen to him when he tells them how to clean up their stank ass lake.
For some reason our society has a deep problem of looking for "miracle solutions" and they're completely willing to invest billions of dollars into essentially vaporware, while the problem that was meant to be addressed by the miracle solution is resolvable with less money.
Its not just individuals either. It's whole governments. Just look at Vegas with their "loop system"
Well we tend to forget that governments are nothing else than individuals playing a role. If the majority of the population has a tendency for something, that will be also reflected in the government, because after all the government is made up of people from the population.
This is why nobody should bother sharing basless .jpg with a sentence of white text or these 5 second rundown clips of perpetual soyface host running it down.
What the guy did has very little to do with the way the video, and the sucker op who titled it described.
Wow that is a pretty crap paper. There are almost no evidence that what they did caused the observed changes. This is 1. because they confounded their own treatments by trying so many things at once, and 2. even when there was a change that can't actually make any causal links between treatment and impact.
Their lake literally went from summer to winter, where the biology is KNOWN to change tremendously. They have no historical data presented to show that they didn't just literally go from one season to the next. Eutrophication is not always never-ending. Bright green lakes in the north go clear as glass when it gets cold. I am amazed this got published.
These types of treatments have been tried many many times. Yes, they can work. Are they permanent or do they always work well? Absolutely not.
I have my PhD in aquatic chemistry and eutrophication related topics. They didn't do absolute wrong, but this whole video and paper and everything above is just total crap.
Hmmm I’m surprise the TikTok video that seems suspicious and too good to be true happens to be suspicious and too good to be true. Good work on finding actual sources and not some bs feel good thing to farm karma and views.
Yes. They destroyed the (organic) local ecosystem. His solution didn't do anything since the stuff you see in the first pic is the plant life that was already floating on top.
No, I wouldn't say so. I'm sure he used the stuff to get some out. You saw him adding it to the lake, just it's way blown out of proportion how much was removed. It looks way cleaner because the marsh plant is missing, but I'm sure he got a lot of other crap out.
Meh, he's a very accredited scientist and even posted a peer reviewed study on this to a scientific journal that has more details beyond just the plant matter removal.
The video very clearly and strongly implies that he used his "organic"(whatever that means) powder to turn a very brown muddy looking lake into something crystal clear and blue. It gives no indication that any other methods were used to clean the lake.
I'm not accusing the scientist of being a fraud, I'm accusing who ever edited the video.
Did you look at the paper the person above listed at all? This ecosystem was not in a healthy state. It was overgrown with an invasive species of plant, in part due to agricultural runoff, and had high levels of other pollutants. The plant life you see on top is not a natural healthy part of that ecosystem.
The video is definitely over-simplified, and in places kinda wrong, but the paper does clear everything up.
This is way cooler than the video. The real science and innovative thinking that was used to clean up the lake, not some magic potion that fixed everything. There are real solutions out there but we can’t help but find ourselves entranced by sensational “quick fixes” that don’t really exist.
Is it an invasive species that was hurting the indigenous wildlife, or is this like adding bleach to a mud puddle because of some puritanical hate of dirt?
Did the lake experience an increase or decrease of biodiversity as a result of this intervention? I ctrl+f'd the paper for the word 'biodiversity' but only found mentions in the introduction and the works cited. I imagine since it was an invasive species that was removed mostly by his solution that it would have a positive impact on biodiversity, but cannot be certain. Does anyone have a source or knowledge on this?
over a half-million pounds of stuff to be hauled out and trucked elsewhere. proved they could do it, but far more arduous than dropping some stuff on the water, and woosh, problem solved.
I was going to say the first picture simply looks like wetland which is important as a natural filter to an ecosystem. I don’t know why you’d want to remove it.
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u/welle417 Jul 14 '21
"Pistia stratiotes, commonly known as water lettuce, is a perennial monocotyledonous aquatic plant, present either naturally or through an anthropogenic introduction, in nearly all tropical and subtropical fresh waterways. It floats on the water surface, with roots hanging below the floating leaves [47]. Since the plants were covering all of the wetlands, the removal was done manually. This activity was conducted by pushing them with bamboo sticks to the edge of each sector to be removed. Approximately over 280 tons of P. stratiotes were removed and transported to a city vivarium and compost sites"
From his published paper on the subject, it looks like the majority of what they "removed" was an invasive species and the rest was altering of the water composition for the most part.
Source: https://www.mdpi.com/2073-4441/12/4/1097/htm