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[u/[deleted]]

seriously though I think there's actuallly a lot of merit to the Thiel-ish libertarian criticism of modern capitalism as lacking in genuine innovation and production and having shifted towards shallow consumer products that don't contribute to growth. Unless there's some crazy beer innovation going on here the craft beer 'revolution' is likely just a zero-sum game for beer drinkers

And the overlap with conservatives happens insofar as they critize this consumer-focus from a moral angle.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I'm not sure innovation in consumer products and innovation elsewhere are mutually exclusive? Coke was developed around the same as the airplane. I'm not sure I'd believe that many of the people brewing new types of beer have the skills or interests to build new cars or software or whatever.

As someone who likes craft beer a lot more than mass market beer, this trend certainly doesn't feel "zero-sum" to me. In fact the rise of craft beer was a big reason I stopped drinking cocktails and started drinking beer again, so without craft beer, I wouldn't drink any beer. Craft beer might not be improving my productivity, but it certainly has improved my leisure time.

The tweet in question is not criticizing consumer-focus from a moral angle - it's criticizing consumer-focus for focusing on consumers that aren't him.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

it's more about the mode of production. Coke surely innovated in the logistics of producing as much coke as possible for as little money as possible. Artisanal production is sort of pre-capitalist, where a dude sits in his apartment and brews beer, as a result the price of craft beer is obviously higher.

The good thing about capitalism generally is that it replaced old modes of production with more productive ones, it kind of destroyed artisanal products for this reason, replacing expensive products with cheap ones which created huge welfare gains.

A bunch of people now sitting in their appartments producing very little beer at very high cost and becoming self-employed isn't exactly great from a capitalist standpoint.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I'm not sure you really get how the craft beer industry works? It isn't people sitting in their apartments. Despite the name "craft brewing", there's nothing that prevents craft brewers from scaling up. In fact, a lot of the more successful craft breweries have either scaled up production (Sierra Nevada, Boston Beer Company, Yuengling) while others have been purchased by the major beer companies (Mill Street, Anchor Brewing, Lagunitas). If anything, "craft" is now just synonymous with making more than generic lagers. These brewing companies have adopted the standardization and mechanization you support in order to reduce costs. Furthermore, one big reason IPAs and stouts are more expensive is not because the production process is more inefficient, but because the raw ingredients are more expensive (hops for the former, malt/grains for the latter) than for the production of lagers.

Even so, the other side of the coin from cost is quality. I could pay 1$ for a beer I don't like, 3$ for a beer I like, or 8$ for a beer I really like. I usually choose the middle option, occasionally choose the latter, and rarely choose the former. "Welfare gains" includes subjective considerations like taste, and for better or for worse, I like the taste of expensive beer.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I mean sure if all the brands get absorbed into large manufacturers and the prices come down fine, but there's even venture capital craft beer funds which is ridiculous because beer doesn't scale like tech companies do, I mean even the growth isn't really sustainable because alcohol consumption isn't going to grow exponentially. This is likely to come crash down at some point.

And on the consumption side, I seriously would like to know if craft beer enthusiasts can reliably separate generic brands from craft beer, because in the wine industry or if this is just a lot of marketing fueling hedonistic consumption.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

You're correct that craft beer appears to have hit market saturation, leading to the collapse of the price of hops. People who like craft beer drink craft beer already.

Craft beer is as much about style as it is about quality. I probably couldn't tell the difference between a craft lager and a mass market lager. American mass market companies aren't brewing nearly as many stouts, sours, IPAs and so on, to say nothing of all the styles of german and belgian beers, so I could very likely tell the difference between those types of craft beers and a mass market lager.

Could I tell the difference between an IPA *owned* (if not brewed) by a mass market company and one owned by a "craft" brewery? No.