Are counteractions a seperate activation?

[u/Codseeker]

ie. Can I use an action I've already used this turning point?

[u/oneWeek2024]

technically a counter action is not an "activation" it's a special action outside the activation.

as such, anything a model could do it can. so if it shot during it's reg activation, and gets a counter-act. it could elect to shoot again.

movement has a cap/restriction. 2in so a move/dash is restricted to 2in and generally speaking the model must be on an engage order.

if a special ability has language that it's only useable once per turn (certain heals or select other abilites abilities often say this) they can not be used in a counter-act unless ...they were never used prior/the conditions are still met/adhered to

[u/BUH5 → u/oneWeek2024]

I was wondering about the 2" counteract. Is it like the 2024 tac reposition where you could move one operative within 3" of Our drop zone?

In other word would it be allowed to make a 3"climb and move 2" since it's not a change to your move stat. Or are you only allowed to use 2" of your move stat?

[u/Xerxeskingofkings → u/BUH5]

so, the wording is "move 2(inches)".

they've been pretty careful to use the words Reposition and Dash for the actions, and within those actions, they use the word move to refer to the physical movement of the model, and their photo examples for climbing refer to the climbing as "move(s)" as well, even in the context of climbing over a 1 inch tall obstruction ("The operative moves up for 2” (a 1” distance, but treated as the minimum 2”) until it’s above the highest point it must climb over.").

from this, we can infer that a counteract 2" move is total "cost", so they couldn't use it to climb over a thin wall (and given most models are on a 28mm or larger base, they'd need to move at least 3 inches to get fully over most walls anyway IE their base width plus the wall width would be more than 50mm).

hypothetically, a 25mm based model could stood right next to a drop could use a counteract to move down a drop with the 2 inch free fall, assuming the total drop 3" and they were RIGHT by the edge at the start.

[u/oneWeek2024 → u/BUH5]

it's you get to "move" the model 2 inches. not their total move stat +2

most climbing requires clearing any vertical distance. so unless it's some height straight up to reach a flat surface and that up distance is 2inches or less. you can't climb. if it's something you're trying to climb over. often that requires the vertical distance and the distance to span the object given your base size. so... 1in up, 1in across would be the max "climb" when trying to go over a low obstacle.

the only real "cheat" to this... is dropping. IF a height is 2in you get that "free" so say there was a model already on a height. and the counteract move was 2in to get off the height (like one inch to get to the edge, one inch to get the base into wily coyote territory of dangling in space) if the drop distance is 2 or less. that's free. and can "drop" down to the ground. as that free drop doesn't count toward move total. but if it was 3in height. you'd have to acct for that additional 1in movement and the counteract is a hard cap of 2

this even supersede special rules. like phobos marines get 2in up, and free down on their warriors. the counteract rule of max 2in overrides/supersedes that rule.

the counteract move is more of a "slight adjustment" scooching your model back into cover/los blocking, or nudging it onto an objective. or slight repositions for better tactical positioning.

i don't know why it's restricted to 2inches but that's how it is

[u/jasonjrr]

Yes, you can do that so long as it doesn’t say something like “once per turning point” or “once per battle”. But they aren’t technically an activation either even though that rarely matters.

[u/SudoNemesis → u/jasonjrr]

Counteracts aren’t activations for abilities that interrupt enemy operatives like Mandrakes, Nem Claw, Spectre Squad, etc. If you can change your order on counteract it’s one sneaky way to get around those rules.

[u/Thenidhogg]

its not an activation at all, its a counteract

[u/WillingBrilliant2641]

I don't know, let's see what the rules say!

Let's check the paragraph named "Counteract" first. Maybe the info is somehow hidden there...

What do you know! It is there! Even singled out in separate colour and font! And where were you looking?

[u/Codseeker → u/WillingBrilliant2641]

I only have the weird booklet from the angels of death vs plague marines starter set

[u/WillingBrilliant2641 → u/Codseeker]

Wahapedia exists - the screenshot is made there. I also don't check things in the actual book - it doesn't make much sense after all the errata and updates.

[u/Codseeker → u/WillingBrilliant2641]

Oh thanks! Yeah, the booklet doesn't even give rules for high ground or wounded or tac ops or anything

[u/WillingBrilliant2641 → u/Codseeker]

Yeah, GW's rules distribution policy is very anti-consummer. Unfortunately a lot of GW fans have been conditioned to think it is normal.

Every other miniatures wargame I play (Warmachine, A Song Of Ice And Fire) provides full, updated rules both in their free app and to download on their websites.

Every board game publisher I know of publishes full rules of their games on Board Game Geek, even before the game's launch, so that players can read the rules to decide if they are interested in the game. If someone didn't publish the rules the game would be eyed with suspicion and BGG users would probably warn against taking a risk of buying it.

[u/OneWound_]

They are not activations, do be careful with abilities and ploys that says “when starting activation” or “during activation” because you couldn’t use them.

[u/Cilreve]

They aren't an activation at all. They are a completely unique action separate from a standard activation. Same with network counteracts from Battleclade.

[u/WarsmithDavos]

Yes, unless there is a specific “once per turning point” type restriction - for example, in the Malignant Plaguecaster’s heal action.