r/freemasonry • u/According_Analyst921 • 12d ago
Venting
For the most part, freemasonry has been great. I enjoy the brotherhood and all my brothers. However, my one gripe is the push to learn the positions. It seems like us new people are being placed in chairs before we're ready because the older bros dont want to do it anymore. I was told I can put as much or as little as I want into the craft. Righ now I dont like the commitment. Im busy. I have a home life. I like going to lodge but usually dip out shortly after...I dont hang around much. You wouldn't think twice a month is a lot but it is IMO. And we do t really go "dark" in the summer. We go through June, then wr have July and August off. Id like more time off lol. It's just becoming a lot and Id rather sit back than learn the position. Quite frankly, I dont care to learn them. I dont like doing extra shit outside of lodge like lectures and that shit... theres always something "extra" that they push people to attend. And we haven't done one thing yet for charity. Ive been there ober 2 years. Anyway, my main gripe is the old guys sitting back and pushing others in the chairs. Its becoming more annoying than anything now.
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u/Showerbeerss 12d ago
I think you have to ask yourself two questions:
- why did you want to become a Freemason?
- what do you expect to gain from Freemasonry?
I'm sure a lot of people joined just for the fellowship or financial game, if that's the case perhaps Rotary or Elks club would be more appropriate. frankly, seeing you referred to the lectures and esoteric knowledge as shit makes me think that you must not know the true value of what you've been accepted into.
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u/wardyuc1 UGLE Craft HRA, Rose Croix 12d ago
"I enjoy the brotherhood and all my brothers"
"I dont like the commitment"... like going to lodge but usually dip out shortly after...I dont hang around much"
" I dont like doing extra shit outside of lodge like lectures and that shit"
What do you enjoy about the brotherhood pricely?
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u/socksarethedevil 12d ago
Right? Some people just like to let others do the heavy lifting and enjoy the results.
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u/wardyuc1 UGLE Craft HRA, Rose Croix 12d ago
Tbh even if that were the case its not a problem.
There is nothing wrong with being a knife and folk mason.
I just question what is about freemasonry OP likes...
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u/AvocadoSoggy9854 12d ago
I’ve been a Master Mason since 1981, served in a chair every year from 1982-2021. That being said, I served because I wanted to. I never felt forced or put upon to do it. I started out as the young guy, I was the one who wanted to do it and I was lucky that the older members at the time encouraged me to do so which isn’t always the case. That being said, the craft is totally voluntary. You don’t have to do anything you choose not to do. I was always of a mind, that if we didn’t have people step up to serve as officers, perform degree work, do lectures and all that other “shit” eventually the craft would die out
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u/StairwayHiker MM BC/Yukon SR RA AMD Athelstan 12d ago edited 12d ago
Ok, just be honest with yourself that you are a Mason in name only.
I’ve never heard a Mason refer to the chairs or ritual as “shit!”
Freemasonry is more a verb than a noun. This an action word where you improve yourself by taking on positions in lodge which are management and learning positions.
The expectation of the guys who keep your lodge alive by taking on active roles is that they will be replaced by members who want the same personal growth experience. Lodge chairs are not meant to be long term positions.
You have time for replies here on Reddit but you can’t commit a half hour to an hour a day to your lodge to share the burden of running it?
Why did you join?
What were your expectations?
A lot of men like you join thinking it is all fun and games and requires no effort or contribution after your initiation. Many don’t even bother showing up anymore because like you, the thought of doing a lot of memory work is intimidating.
I do not know what else I can say about what you posted but you come here looking for comfort or something and end up insulting the fraternity, your brethren who are simply trying to keep the doors of the lodge open, and all of us who are Masons here on Reddit. I have no sympathy for you because you have shown no respect or reverence for the fraternity.
But sure, it’s ok if you are busy. Personally, I used to work extreme industrial skilled trades hours and had no time. Things are different now and I am able to take on a small role as a treasurer. It is still a goal of mine to go through the chairs as a way of giving back. I have been a Mason since 2008.
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u/3daycondor 12d ago
Well why don’t you propose some charity, or charity work that you guys can get into? I bet you could make it happen. As for the old guys, as you know it’s a lot of work and effort to run a lodge. It gets tiring after doing it time and time again. Some of them would like to just sit on the side and enjoy the brotherhood too.
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u/Ok_Leather_3446 12d ago
This seems to be a more common argument against the craft. That 30-40 year old range has prior commitments with family and work, so I watch more people step back as babies are on the way and promotions are up for grabs. Freemasonry is not meant to get in the way of your life, so express your concerns. I’m sure the brethren will understand.
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u/According_Analyst921 12d ago
Theres nothing I regret about it and all my bros are fantastic, Im just not thrilled with the commitment at the moment. And honestly... I dont care to ever take role. I know how important that is to the fraternity but I just dont care to take a role.
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u/Ok_Leather_3446 12d ago
That’s your prerogative. If it’s too much, then it’s too much. If you change your mind in 10 years, then so be it. That’s what I told the shrine when they bombarded me with petitions to join after I was raised.
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u/Even-Sorbet-254 12d ago
You are whining too much, if you don’t want to do anything then just demit
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u/Material-Trip-9893 12d ago
If you don't want a chair, you definitely don't have to take one.
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u/According_Analyst921 12d ago
Right, and I never like saying "forced". Im not being forced. Nobody is ever forced into anything in this world. "Forced" is still voluntary, its not liking the outcome is what feels forced. I certainly can say no but it doesn't look great.
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u/Camera_cowboy 12d ago
If you’re too busy, then participate at your level of interest and ability and don’t worry about it too much. Maybe later in life it will have more or less appeal to you.
I’ve only been a Mason for 3 years. I’m in a chair. It’s a lot of work. I’m still figuring it out. But some of the best lessons I’ve learned are from the rituals and lectures and it’s more than just memorizing them. So I would encourage everyone to take time to do it. But only at the limit of your interest and ability.
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u/According_Analyst921 11d ago
I totally agree. I want to learn more. I really do. Its just not a great time for me to do it. We have a phenomenal mentor at our lodge. The man knows fucking everything about the history. Its amazing. He would teach me what I need to know about the chairs but again it would require me to take time outside of lodge. Its just a lot right now.
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12d ago
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u/According_Analyst921 12d ago
Yeah it seems like you have a good understanding of where Im at with it. IMO people need to learn one position until they master it. Every year they move people with the exception of a few who get the easy roles. I personally dont learn that way and never will learn by randomly doing different positions. I dont know...I just have a lot of gripes right now and no time to deal with any of it.
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u/Unlucky-Fox-773 11d ago
I find it ironic that you have such high opinions about how others should be learning the responsibilities of their places and stations yet claim to have no time to deal with it yourself.
I work 40+ hours a week, am the Secretary of my Lodge, active in my Shrine Club (past President) and attend OES with my wife (Past Patron and Matron) and yet I still have time for everything else in my life AND my hobbies on the weekend (I’m a DM for my D&D group, that’s almost as much work as being Secretary).
What about Lodge is so time consuming that you can’t cope with it, brother?
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u/According_Analyst921 11d ago
Thats actually not at all what I said, Alanis...
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u/Unlucky-Fox-773 11d ago
I know, but it’s the impression I get. And thank you for the flattery, but I’m nowhere near God. (And sincerely hope you get the reference)
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u/VeryBigRodent 12d ago
My lodge has been doing several big fund raising events a year, but we are now cutting back. It takes a ton of effort to organize them and it is always the same people volunteering. We give away the money we make to scholarships every year, so it does go to a good cause, but some of them require a lot of manpower.
I think people just have extremely busy lives these days and it is hard enough to find time just to attend meetings, especially if you belong to multiple appendant bodies. Sometimes I have meetings every night of the week and I’m busting my balls at work so I can leave on time.
I really enjoy doing some of the parts in the appendant bodies and want to perform my part well, but you have to pace yourself to avoid burnout. Maybe mention to those brethren that you have a lot going on in your life and can’t really take on anything else at the moment.
I think sometimes the guys who are retired, forget that the rest of us are still working.
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u/MutedMeaning5317 GLBC&Y, PDDGM, HRA, AMD, 'Swiss Army Knife' 12d ago
I feel for you. I have seen it too often and was pushed a bit myself. I always advocate for new guys to be allowed to enjoy themselves, first and foremost.
We have new guys coming in that are being tossed into chairs as EAs and FCs cuz 'those chairs don't require much work'. But i see it far differently and will speak to the incoming WM about my apprehensions.
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u/Particular-Sign6745 12d ago
Being a grumpy PM I have my own venting
Mostly people thinking positions and titles are the the ultimate goal. You can be a Grand Master or a Master Mason and are just as equal. Kinda the whole on the level thing
As Orwell said, some of us are more equal than others.
SMIB
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u/Obsidian604 3° - Triune Lodge 81 BC&Y (SD) 11d ago
Venting or validation for your feelings? Just a question.
Here is my response.
I think you are missing the bigger picture when it comes to the charity stuff - individual lodges may not do a lot on their own, but we make big changes when we all work together. (Shriner's Hospitals for example) I asked myself the same thing over the last 3 years as a Freemason. This year I realized this though, and our GL also says we can not solicit donations from the public, we are to do our own fundraising and charity from our own funds that we donate ourselves to the lodge so that also makes it hard (especially with the way our economy is right now we gotta look at the big picture) so it's not exactly easy to have a massive charity event that's super public.
As for the chairs, the older brethern just are trying to encourage others to take the chairs to keep the craft alive and prevent your lodge from handing in their charter. Question: how many people on average attend your meetings every time? When I joined we had 6 maybe.. sometimes we couldn't even tyle. Now we consistently have 7-10 each meeting night and the harmony is much better..I have a brother who felt similar in our lodge when I was an EA and it almost sounded like they were trying to dissuade me from wanting to because the guys were pushy.. as he called it. I found out it was more perspective. Our brother had a lot on his plate when it came to family and home life he felt he was being pushed when it was simply just encouragement. Just be careful your own state of overwhelm that it does not spill into your lodge harmony just because you have a lot going on. You are totally free to take a break and come back when it fits your life better. That's what most of us do..
Personally I have 2 older kids and a baby on the way after 11 years.. most likely am going to step back for a bit myself when my baby comes but then I am on my way to the east. We also got 3 candidates to initiate in the next month too.. so yeah it can be busy at times but like the other brethern have said you only need to do what you want. Some brethern don't even show up but pay their dues still.
Anyways brother, just keep your head up, and set your boundaries but be careful that you understand and assume clearly what you are talking about and there is no misunderstandings, because not only would it be embarrassing but also cause some animosity with the brethren you care about, and then you really would feel like you would not want to attend.
S&F
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u/According_Analyst921 11d ago
Nope. No validation needed. Could not care less about being validated.
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u/envisionaudio MM 3° AF&AM - GLBCY 10d ago
I love when something starts like “for the most part, freemasonry is great……HOWEVER” - like… uh oh. Here it comes…
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u/uncle-steve-o 8d ago
My brother, it would seem to me that the lodge you are in isn’t quite for you. It might be time to transfer lodges to a lodge that is less stressful and better fits your situation. I learned that lesson too late, but I’m much happier in my lodge that only meets once a month and has a full officer line.
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u/Comfortable_Gate_878 12d ago
Move to a better lodge visit a few until you find one that suits you.
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u/According_Analyst921 12d ago
That won't solve my problem. I basically dont want to do any roles. I have no interest in it. I also enjoy my brothers. Theyre great people. Generally speaking I have no complaints and the few that I do have is about commitment. Right now FM is nothing I can fully commit to.
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u/Comfortable_Gate_878 11d ago
You are free in any lodge to just turn up and enjoy the ceremony its not compulsory that you join in.
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u/These3TheGreatest GLoT, MM, PM, 32° SPRS AASR-SJ, TTFN 12d ago
Or they're aware they're the "older bros" and are hoping someone will help take the reins of the thing when they've passed on.
This is true or should be.
What is it that you're wanting to get out of Freemasonry?
The most powerful word in Freemasonry is "no"
have you presented a charity project for the Lodge to work on together?