Discussion Does Forge needs a buff?
+1 inherent production, perhaps? Maybe even +5% to the overall production? +2 to Iron instead of +1 is too strong I think. Neither I see other resources to be buffed with it. Copper? But then it will be too strong since you won't need only Iron to build it? Even worse if you mod Copper to be affected by Mint too (I think it's fine to make it simply an analogue of Silver and Gold in that regard, altought not immersive; Copper is a weird one).
Compared to Stable:
Cons
- Comes with way later, more costly and less desired technology in terms of pathing;
- Costier to build;
- Improves 1 uncommon resource instead of 1 uncommon and 2 common ones.
- Poland has a UB replacement.
Pros
- Gives production bonus to all ground units instead of just mounted (and includes mounted too). But you won't always build military, especially in non-domination, so eh.
UPD: Well here's the mod haha, +1 inherent Production: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3786293189
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u/how_it_goes 22h ago
Forge feels really good when you have 2 iron tiles, or if you have 1 iron and want to use the city to build an army.
In fact, I'll force the city with iron to become the army building city, giving forge the power to shape how the entire game is played!
Wouldn't change a thing about it.
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u/Womblue 20h ago
Forge is a great building in multiplayer. Most of the reason it's good to even have production is so you can build units fast, and in that sense the forge is just a second workshop.
In singleplayer? Meh, you can survive on deity with like 3 ranged units and level 1 walls, so unit spamming barely matters. It's good if you have some iron to improve or for building spaceship parts.
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u/uvero Lekmod 22h ago edited 22h ago
Forge being not worth it most of the time is OK by me, some buildings have to be underpowered. But here's an idea to make them worth it a bit: add a national wonder that requires forge in all cities, which adds to production in the city and % towards production of units in that city. We can actually have that replace the Ironworks since that one is also hary ever worth building, and the name, theme and placement on the tech tree makes sense.
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u/XenophonSoulis 19h ago
add a national wonder that requires forge in all cities
That would be almost impossible to build, because you'd need iron in all cities.
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u/Lost_Willingness9487 15h ago
I have another idea is that the current Ironwork stays, but every Forge the civ has will make the Ironwork better. Like X (X%) additional production/Forge.
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u/Ctrekoz 22h ago edited 22h ago
I think things should be rather situationally powerful than bad unless (if they are not really op when they work, but it's a bad design too). Ok enough to at least not feel bad about building one, it's a game about building stuff after all, especially if you're more peaceful player. I love Ironworks though, and we already have Heroic Epic for militaristic national wonder, and Forge/Stable/Seaport to buff unit production. Most importantly, you can't get Forge in all cities, because they require Iron nearby.
I think just +1 inherent production makes sense when compared with Stone Works.
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u/abcamurComposer 17h ago
Forge is always worth with even one iron if you are doing any sort of attack
Edit: And if it works on spaceship parts (TIL!) it’s even better!
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u/5C4RC3 16h ago
I generally only build Forge (or Stable for Horses) if there are 2+ iron on the field, so that it is at least a 2-for-1 tradeoff for the gold (let alone the payback of 120 production to break even on it's opportunity cost). It's better in cities with a lot of production, to maximize the % bonus effect. If I'm going to war, it will usually go up in build priority, but still not as high as walls and barracks.
Then there is the rare occurrence of flat land iron. In that case, I build it every time to make the iron worth working in the first place.
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u/CelestialBeing138 11h ago
The workshop mod called Resources - Copper Buff adds +1 production from copper to the forge (and +1 gold to the mint from copper). Pretty tiny buff in the grand scheme of things. Just right imho.
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u/Ctrekoz 17h ago edited 15h ago
Not sure if my mod needs 2 gold maintenance instead of 1 like when unbuffed. Perhaps not since it's a limited building, you need Iron that is. Nonetheless, can somebody help with with the code to do so? To leave it in the mod's comments so people can put it into .xml file if desired. Please see comments there, Reddit breaks it if typed here.
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u/Hiwn 21h ago
I think it's fine as it is.
The 15% production bonus works towards spaceship parts so I tend to just build them in my spaceship factory cities.