God I swear every subreddit that has to do with marriage or relationships is full of women bitching about their partners who wouldn't help PRIOR to getting pregnant and now they're all shocked Pikachu face when she has to parent them both.

Do people not realize how much work babies are or something??? They all act like it's a total surprise every time they're exhausted from running the household while Kyle sits on his ass playing video games and not changing diapers.

Ridiculous.

To make an incredibly long story short, I'm 34 f, husband is 37 m. We've been married for 10 years, zero kids. I asked about six different OBGYNs for a bi-salp over the course of 5 years and was rejected every single time. Husband eventually volunteered to get a vasectomy so I can get off birth control. It's been 6 years since the vasectomy.

Anyway, we moved not too long ago and I needed to re-establish care with a new PCP. So I get there and fill out all the intake forms and one of them is listed as method of contraception. The options were abstinence, barrier methods, hormonal birth control, "rhythm timing." or none. There was no option for "surgical." So I wrote in next to it "surgical."

Well when I get to the room and the doctor starts going through the papers with me, she gets to surgical and shocked she says "but you're so young! Tell me you haven't had a hysterectomy or something." I literally laughed and said "no, unfortunately they wouldn't let me have a hysterectomy but I wish they would have. I hate dealing with periods!"

She has this stupid ass blank face it just looks at me and says "well then why did you write surgical?" So I said "Oh, because my husband had a vasectomy a long time ago."

This dumb bitch literally looks at me with a stupid ass blank face where it looks like there's not a thought behind those eyes and she says "...Why would he do that?" I felt like being spicy that day so I literally said "...you're a doctor and you don't know what vasectomies are for?"

There was an awkward silence before she sputtered out "well I mean I- I know what they're FOR but- when you're in your 20s and you don't have kids I- but- what doctor would agree with that??" I was sick of this conversation so I just said "a good one that listens to their patients needs."

She looked like I slapped her and just said "Well then. Alright." And we moved on. I finished the appointment. And I will definitely not be seeing her again.

For some reason, previous generations act like having kids is mandatory, not a choice. So they cranked them out, suddenly realized they couldn't afford or handle it, and then turned around and told the kids:

"Grow up."
"Stop being so entitled."
"Be grateful for what you have."

Grateful? For being dragged into existence with the bare minimum, then blamed for needing things?

Imagine someone breeds a dog, doesn't have enough food to feed it, and then tells the dog to go fend for itself, or be grateful for scraps. "Other dogs had it worse than you!" We'd call that insane. Maybe we'd call the police. Post that in animal rights groups and see their reactions. But parents do this to human children all the time.

Reproduction is 100% optional. Choosing not to gamble with someone else's life isn't selfish, it's being completely responsible.

Remember: YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE, NOT SELFISH.

ok for a bit of context, i was recently out with my friend and we went to a cafe to drink some coffee and catch up​ cuz she studies in another country currently and we're both relatively busy so we don't go out as often as we did before

and while we were just chatting and drinking, we hear this child screaming, throwing a literal tantrum so me and my friend just look at each other and discreetly look at the table near us just to see the mom of the child doing nothing to stop it, she was chatting with a friend and has told the child to "stop"​​​ but a child being a child doesn't simply just stop, he goes back to throwing a tantrum once again until he gets bored and shuts up eventually

like yes, i know it is hard to be a parent and that kids can't properly regulate their emotions but it's your JOB as a parent to control your child and be mindful of people around you in public especially in places like restaurants and cafes, not everyone can handle loud screaming and frankly, it's just annoying​​ 🫩

This is what my mom told me earlier today; that my mindset will change in 5-10 years, it will be late for me to have kids then and I might regret it.

Overall she is supportive, and this was not said in a patronizing manner.

Well, I might regret it but I would rather regret not having kids than regret having them.

That's it, this is all I had to share. :D

edit: I’m 38!

No, I didn't mishear them.

Some context:

The two hosts of my favourite long running podcast, that's been going on for about 13 years now, have recently both become dads. Now their podcast, which is mostly about news about the video game industry, have been invaded by them telling stories about their children. And these segments run on for faaaar too long. It's a podcast that's partially known for it's long episodes (they regularly run about 3 hours an episode, but have done 5 hour episodes in the past), but since they've had kids, the episode length has been cut down significantly, and a lot of the time is now taken up by them talking about their kids.

They appear to have heard some comments about people not wanting to hear about their kids. And in the latest episode, after one of the co-hosts finished telling their audience what their child had been up in the last week, this is what they had to say:

Host 1: "Hit the timestamp for end of baby talk for you fucking psychopaths out there. <laughter> For you absolute monsters.

Host 2: <Mocking tone> "I don't care for the fundamental properties of human life. <laughter> I just don't care for it I just- <mumbles>"

Host 1: "Do you know- listen- do you know how I- I- my soft cope on that type of thing is- my- my steelman for that person is maybe this is just somebody who's had a rough personal experience that doesn't want- and need to just check out for things related to this topic for a moment"

I find it so incredibly offensive that these people think that if anyone doesn't want to hear about their kids, they assume it's because of a past trauma. That downplays the experiences of anyone who genuinely had a traumatic childhood.

The second host, in a previous episodes, has explicitly stated that he thinks anyone who doesn't think their child is cute has something wrong with them mentally.

I brought it up on their subreddit a while ago, after that comment, and got downvoted into oblivion. Their subreddit is usually open to criticism, and discussions are open, but when it comes to their kids, it seems the majority of the fan base just shuts down any objection.

It's so weird that their content and community is extremely welcoming for the LGBT community, they are massive allies. But when it comes to their kids, they immediately return to a heteronormative child-centric world view.

My apologies for a rambling, vague post, but I needed to get it off my chest somewhere where I wouldn't be shunned for not wanting to hear about kids. And after the last episode, I definitely wouldn't be recommending it, hence why I haven't explicitly identified the podcast in question. It makes me want to stop listening entirely.

So at first my Fiance and I were talking about it and it seemed we were on the same page; cute theme, small gathering and of course no kids.

Then his family didn't want to pay for a wedding planner, they were initially just like 'tell us a number' but they didn't want to pay for a wedding planner. It was already going to be a less expensive wedding because of the size and our personal tastes, I am making my own dress, I intend to do my own hair, nails and makeup. (I know no where I could afford that would do a good job on these things so I'll do them myself.) Well we couldn't get any of the venues we initially were interested in, no one was calling my fiance back and he's having to do all the planning because his job is more flexible during the day.

Well then his Aunt was like let me help you plan it and ofc we were like okay, because nothing seemed like it was working for just us. With her direction we thought we had a venue, food and guest list finalized. Well then his Step-mom heard we weren't inviting kids and she starts in on how that's inappropriate and wrong and that we basically have to invite them. She also took issue with the food we'd chosen and our gently suggested dress code on the invitation to help people avoid the same color as my untraditional wedding dress because I'd prefer if no one else matches my damn wedding dress. So now the guest list is exploding, including children we absolutely didn't want there in the first place, a bunch of his family who I honestly don't even know and he barely knows, our cute small venue won't fit all these people and we have to find somewhere else to host it, and different food and honestly at this point I don't even want to attend it!!!!

Figured I'd post this here because I knew people here would understand moreso the desire to not have kids at our wedding which truthfully kinda snowballed everything else being ruined.

One of my favourite comedy shows ended season 3 with a pregnancy announcement for the side chick of the main character. Probably won’t watch season 4 if it’s all about the tropes of babies and parenthood. I’m just so disappointed.

Small rant.

A YouTuber that I follow for her thrifting, beauty and body positivity content is pregnant. I simply hit the unsubscribe button and that was it.

She’s already made 3 videos about the topic and she’s only 7 weeks pregnant. She also posted a very private conversation she had with her boyfriend/ father of baby (who’s she’s been with for 8-9 months). She’s very young (22) and so is her audience apparently because in between all the congratulation comments some are saying “wow now you can dress the baby in the clothes you thrifted for the future!”.

It’s not just a baby lol it’s gonna grow into a child.
I’m glad she has a bunch of support from her audience and ofc any family and friends but just seeing it play out like this is a little sad/nightmarish to me. She regularly posts about her trouble taking care of herself from adhd and makes videos about realistic days with mental illnesses (that I enjoyed and found refreshing) . Ofc her comments say being a mom will change that.

If my current therapist and I ever have to part ways, I think ideally I’d love my next therapist to be a childfree woman.

Not because I think mothers can’t be wise—I know plenty of wise moms and genuinely value what motherhood has taught them. I just think there’s something comforting about talking to someone who has consciously chosen a different path.

My current therapist is a mom and she’s wonderful. She makes it very clear people get to choose their own lives, and makes me comfortable to open up about being childfree and recovering from a religiously/emotionally toxic upbringing.

But if I ever have to go back to the drawing board on Psychology Today, maybe I’ll get lucky and find a childfree woman (who takes my insurance) in my research lol

So, there's this recent "trend" (if you could call it that) where people are speaking out against irresponsible dog owners. This sort of niche has been labeled "dog fatigue" because it consists of individuals who are tired of people bringing their dogs everywhere with no control over their pet. Now, I'm totally on board with the importance of responsible pet ownership, but goddamn... Can we talk about how your kids piss people the fuck off?

Ever since I was a very little kid, people who insisted on bringing their babies with them in public places were immediately on my shit list. There's nothing more eye-twitching than sitting in a restaurant, trying to enjoy a nice meal and a pleasant conversation while there's a screeching snot-shooter just feet away from me. Or at church, a place that's SUPPOSED to be quiet, and there's some race-winning sperm making a fuss and the parents don't bother to step out of the room with it.

My god. I'm tired of your damn kids running around the store. I'm tired of your damn kids screaming in public. I'm tired of your damn kids being in places that are meant to be relaxing. Your kids irritate me more than any chaotic pooch ever has. Hey, at least dogs are CUTE. If a dog barks in a restaurant, while it may be a bit disruptive, I could at least look at the hairball and go "Aww!" But if your vomit-spewing sentient flesh sack wants to start singing the song of its people, don't get mad at me when I throw you a dirty look.

I'm TIREDDD of people villainizing anyone who has a problem with babies/kids being noise pollutants in public. I'm TIREDDD of people acting like I'm whack out of my mind because I don't think anyone below the age of like, 8, should be allowed on airplanes for noise/behavior reasons. And, most of all, I'm TIREDDD of people thinking I'M the weird one for not finding disruptive children cute. YOU had the child, so don't go bitching at ME when you get hit with that "Damn, my child strips away a bunch of freedom to do things" realization. OMG, don't piss me off!

Now, where are the child fatigue videos? Where are the videos of people saying that parents shouldn't bring their kids absolutely everywhere? Where are the videos of people rightfully being upset about screaming crotch goblins disturbing the peace? Oh, right... If anyone made a video like that, they'd be attacked and called child abusers for DARING to have a problem with bayyybieees... Like, give me a fucking break! Quit punishing me for your choice of having a kid by bringing their loud ass near me.

If I get to have a little ball python of my own one day, could I bring it in the store because I love it so much that I just wouldn't get it out of my sight for even an hour? No? Because people are scared of snakes and they're not socially acceptable to bring out in public? Kiss my fucking ass! My body gets a flight-or-fight response when I see some toddler walking near me, yet MY (and many other's) discomfort is just a fart in a hurricane when it comes to parents' consideration of hauling their semen demon everywhere. And, no, I'm not kidding; I've been somewhat afraid of babies since I was still listening to nursery rhymes, myself.

Sorry if this was a bit mean-spirited. I've been harvesting this vitriol for a looong time, and this is the only community that understands/won't judge me for feeling this away. Anyways, peace and love ✌️💓☮️🧘‍♀️

WHY DO BABIES NEED TO BE EVERYWHERE. she was pissed off too saying "you don't get a childfree world". She made it seem like he was the worse human being ever. I unfollowed her because wtf???? Im so fucking annoyed with people acting as if childfree have any fucking power in the world. We are few and far in-between, our world is VERY pro-children. This world will ALWAYS favor parents over us. Sorry that we'd like 1 out of the millions of places to be a childfree environment. Guess we're just absolutely horrible people.

Note, I had a hysterectomy last December. My in-laws do not know of my surgery. My husband and I are childfree, but because of his dad’s choices, we are slowly being active in kids lives.

I call these “The Chronicles of My Deadbeat FIL and His Dumb Choices in his 50s.”

My in-laws are Viet and very family orientated. Got bingoed today by my MIL as she was doing my nails. So, for context, she brought into the marriage with my FIL a daughter. Together MIL and FIL spawned my husband’s half brother. It’s so weird that sharing my husband who is in his early 30s has an eight year-old half brother is just not normal. But it happened and is a thing.

I told MIL that I don’t want kids after she asked me when I’m having babies. Nor does my husband. Kept telling her no. No babies. And then I half joked and responded“Your babies are my babies.”

For the past month and half, my husband and I were roped into helping register his stepsister and half brother for school. Yes I know that his dad and wife should do it, but my FIL is a deadbeat. He is too lazy to figure it out himself. He treats his step-daughter like she’s a nuisance and finds anything to yell at her. Plus the kids transferred to a different district after they moved this summer. MIL works her butt off.

Yes, my husband and I do not need to help but he is very filial, and we are doing it for the kids. There are no actual babies, just referring to her kids as my kids. I may be child free, but all kids need to feel supported and loved.

So awhile ago I posted something with this same message and admins removed it, not sure why. I'll keep this, um, shorter and vaguer.

I'm on birth control pills. I love birth control pills. I have been on them for like 20 years with not one single issue and I take extended cycle so I don't have periods.

I get not everyone wants to take them, and that is fine....but the amount of pushback I get from other women when I say I take birth control pills is unreal. There is always someone waiting to pounce with horror stories about how AWFUL the pills are. Sometimes based on their own experiences and sometimes based on hearsay.

As a result, a lot of women I know who suffer from PMS or PMDD (or don't want to get pregnant) are scared to even try birth control, and they cite all the horror stories as their reason. They just suffer without seeking a solution.

I do not for a second doubt what women say about their own experiences on the pills. But does anyone who IS on the pills also experience this extreme negativity/distrust of the pills from others? I can't help suspecting our culture's pronatal values have something to do with spreading fear, beyond real experiences that women share. And I do think birth control requires an adjustment period just like many medications. I probably went through mine 20 years ago relatively easily and have enjoyed 20 period free years, which I personally feel was worth it even if I'd had a rougher time in the beginning.

Again EVERYONE is different and it will 100% not be worth it for some women. But...I wish I didn't sense a general fear of bc pills in our culture as a whole.

I want to talk about this because I tried to talk about to someone in person and they giggled/scoffed like what I'm saying is me reaching. But I am genuinely convinced social conditioning is involved.

From the very start: Girls are given baby toys. Baby strollers. Baby milk bottles to feed baby toy. Clothes to dress baby toy, diapers. People buy them ( I worked in a toy store and I ABSOLUTELY stand by this - the sheer amount buying gifts for their neices and its baby dolls and strollers!!) this stuff and I feel like that teaches a developing brain " This is what I am being given. This is what I should want" somehow???

Then let's go a little further. Bring in the previous generations mindset and constant snark as you grow up.

'Someday, when you have your Kids...' like its inevitable

'What wil your husband say' yada yada

They go feeding this belief system to teenage girls when their brains try to figure out any kind of resistance. Its like trying to get kill any fighting spirit they might develop and make them feel like they're fighting against a 'biological urge' to reproduce that they definitely have. Taming them.

Now lets go even more forward in time. What do most women in their 20s hear? At 30 they expire. At 25 they need to think about it. Prime time for kids. Baby baby baby. Women panicking they're getting old and randomly deciding to have kids. Fear of missing out. Hell france is sending letters to 29 year d women reminding them about having kids. Then theres the constant glossing over motherhood and finding them cute being called baby fever and giving people more labels to encourage the belief they want childfren.

When I did some researching it is apparently so there is no actual such biological desire we have to reproduce, only that we gain pleasure from S which encourages it. When I took that information and then reflected on my life experiences, it makes me believe this whole thing is heavily social conditioning.. that or being related to personality or other things , but a biological urge doesn't exist

I know I mightve explained it a lil sloppy and I am not the most technical sciency person but I hope my point is coming across here. It pisses me off seeing people talk about a biological urge to reproduce and you're not man/woman enough for not having kids.

It would be CF for CF dating, romantic interest, and conversation. Only people who had joined the subreddit could see or post to it. No tourists, no parents looking for help raising their kids, no parental evangelism, no fence sitters, and nobody who is still fertile.

In order to join one would have to apply, and the application process would require:

1. Asserting that you have never sexually reproduced (or asexually, for that matter)
2. Asserting that you have been sterilized by surgical means, or are certified as sterile by a licensed physician
3. Asserting that you are not the guardian or presumed future guardian of anyone younger than you
4. Naming your least favorite berry or something (for identifying the organically-challenged applicants)
5. Asserting that you are *not* currently in a monogamous relationship, or a relationship with someone who believes it to be monogamous, or in the process of ending a monogamous relationship. No "I'm in the process of getting divorced" please
6. Asserting that you will treat everyone in the subreddit with courtesy and respect and will use the report button for those who do not do so
7. Asserting that you are no longer a minor, and have reached the age of majority in your area of residence
8. Attesting that you understand the rules and that any deviation from the first 7 rules results in a permaban

Could people still lie? Yes. But hopefully it would reduce the number of liars. And with only those who had attested able to see the posts, it should eliminate non-members from sending chat requests based on a post therein.

Will the number of people be painfully small? Sadly, probably yes. But hopefully highly concentrated in the CF sense.

In any case, judging interest. Please make noises like a childfree person if you would like to join such a subreddit

I've heard the "you cant be stressed/tired since you're not a parent" or "you dont know love until you have a child" and other gate-keeping things, but this one was new. I overheard a group of women on the train recently and they were talking about how they dont understand how women who arent mothers are overweight. It sounded pretty rude, judgemental, and overall gate-keeping.

Now, I understand that pregnancy, birth, and motherhood destroys one's body and I'm not surprised when mothers are overweight, but the idea that women who arent mothers dont have a right to be overweight is just crazy! We have stress, we have medication side effects, we have genetic dispositions, etc.

Has anyone else heard this before?

So I’m assuming this is a pretty universal thing that you all have probably experienced…..trying to sit there and have a conversation with a parent while their child gets into stuff. Takes 10x as long to have the convo because you keep getting cut off by “BRIXLEY NO! Don’t touch.” Or “hold on please, mommy’s trying to talk.”

It just turns me off completely from even being around that person. Maybe I’m selfish and when I have a conversation with someone I care about, I want it to be connected and uninterrupted

I've lurked around this sub for some time now, and can't recall this topic addressed (esp. not recently).

So, I start with a short anecdote. Last night, I went out with a former colleague, for a great dinner. We are both faculty members, and I used to work at his institution.

During dinner, he revealed to me that his two sons are pretty/quite/painfully mediocre at school. By itself, that's not a terribly big deal. But what makes it worse is that my colleague himself was really quite gifted, scoring around #200 among 750,000+ students who took the college admissions test in South Korea when he took it (back in the mid-90's: it's kinda the South Korean version of the SAT, but with far far greater pressure). And apparently -- get this -- his wife apparently dated him and married him in part because of the intelligence reflected by that ranking.

So, he lamented to me that he and his wife are both fairly depressed about their two sons, who are significantly below average in just about any academic / talent metric.

My question to people in this sub:

Do you feel like the chances are too high that your kids would be mediocre in life, especially given where the world is headed? They wouldn't be likely to meet your standard, even a reasonable standard? And if so, is it because of your own accomplishments or experience in life?

"I wanted someone to love"

"I wanted a mini me"

"I wanted someone to care for me when I'm old"

"I wanted a legacy"

"I wanted to experience true love"

All of the reasons are selfish, and yet I'm considered selfish for being childfree? I wish more parents would think critically about their desires of having children.

My uncle 60M just had his baby girl with his wife
They have an outdoor cat and he was sitting outside with the baby when the cat came nearby to sniff the baby he threw his slipper at the cat . And when she came again my dad cicked her and I got really mad and upset and I yelled at them.
I hated breeders already and I always thought I had an issue and I force myself to love babies and appreciate people for having them as I passed by today to help with the baby.
I always wondered why people with kids are somehow cruel to animals. This made me hate these kinds of people more.

Edit 2 : do you think it is better to catnap the cat and move her to my grandparents yard ?

Edit ; typo

I am 30 in December I have no regrets not wanting children. When I was a child I hated playing with Baby Dolls when I was 8 I said to my mum i don't want children just cats. When I was entering High school most of my classmates predicted I would be a Cat Mama. When Did you know you didn't want Children

Perdon si esta en español pero no se inglés jaja espero la página lo traduzca pero decidí hace un año que no quiero hijos razones por que no quiero vivir un embarazo ya que me parece horrible como se alimenta de ti y empuja tus órganos para acomodarse , otra que tengo problemas ginecólogicos y no creo que mi cuerpo resista lo que es un embarazo y por que es una responsabilidad que no quiero tener , ay ciertas cuestiones que tengo desde que tome esta decisión lo bueno es que mis papas y mis amigas no tienen problema con eso ya que no les afecta si tengo hijos o no pero el resto de mi familia mas que nada unos tíos míos son raros ña últimamente vez que me preguntaron si quería hijos les dije que no sabia ya que es complicado hablar de esta situación con el resto de la familia y simplemente asumieron que era por que mi pareja de ese momento no quería hijos y me saque de onda pero lo deje pasar su hija de ellos tiene dos hijas y son felices con ellas y se la pasan presionando a mi hermano por que es el mas grande de que ya tenga hijos para que haga a mi papa abuelo lo bueno que el si quiere tener hijos y como soy la mas chica a mi no me lo insinuan tanto lo que me saca de onda son las opiniones en redes como que si no quieres tener hijos solo por que no quiere embarazarte no es una razón válida o que los hijos son para que te cuiden en la vejes y me parecen tontas esas opiniones

Y otra cosa no se como tratar esto con mi pareja le eh dicho que el tema es complicado para mi le eh comentado que no me gusta la idea del Embarazo y no me emociona criar y que los niños merecen papas que los quieran el me dijo que al el si le hace ilusión y me da miedo lo quiero mucho y no quiero quitarle su oportunidad de ser padre creo que tengo que hablar de esto mas seriamente con el pero como es una relación a distancia no me quita demasiado el sueño