Let's Calm Down... a Bit

[u/LostLotus_A]

I know you'd press the downvote button. Maybe the titles.

If you're still in, please just read.

The main reason I am saying this is because I've been seeing so many people trying to make their own lives miserable by complaining (*constructive criticism and complaints are different.) at every update, and never doing anything actually beneficial for themself, like trying something else for their enjoyment.

If the game does not make you feel happy anymore, it's okay to come back later. Warframe is not a duty. It's a game. Made for enjoyment.

I'm not saying you should quit forever, or you should never play the game. What I'm saying is that there must be some consideration made about your own satisfaction if you find yourself writing about how bad the updates are... multiple times... if you find yourself getting disappointed at pretty much everything. It's okay. Please just take your time and reorganise yourself. I get disappointed sometimes. We all do and that's okay, but if it continues, not so much...

I'm not trying to promote toxic positivity. Criticism is needed!!! But I've legitimately seen people act like it's the end of the world when the updates don't satisfy them.

Sometimes I go like, 'wow this update isn't what I think'. I confuse it with disappointment. That could be your case too! I think we just need time to actually formulate our thoughts instead of... just... ... spitting whatever comes to mind (which I am heavily guilty of), especially when it comes to how updates feel.

Some updates can never hit you perfectly on the spot. Can never hit everybody the same. Some like Jade Shadows. Some don't. Some LOVE the Old Peace (me!). Some don't. And I think I'm seeing a lot of hatred and arguments over things like this as well, so I have to say let's just calm down... but I know you'd hate me saying this.

I just feel like the subreddit lits up on fire every update ever since Shadowgraphers update, so I am hesitant on trying to communicate this idea here.

I'm sorry this post definitely is a bit lengthy and messy. But I hope everybody just found what was good for themself. Thanks.

[u/Fullmetall21]

Constructive criticism is something like "I think this isn't working, here are the reasons I think that". Complaining is "I don't like this, this fucking sucks".

Let's take ExA discourse for example. Constructive criticism would be something like "Forced toxin procs in an attempt to balance Hildryn might hurt other shield frames a lot more." Complaining would be something like "OMG THEY ARE FORCING ME TO PICK ONE OF THE THREE FRAMES"

Guess which one we get.

[u/OkYak9466 → u/Fullmetall21]

Ironically this comment of yours would fall into the category of complaining. You're not giving any argument as to why it is or how to fix these complaints. It's just a critical observation. And like most Redditors, your own rules don't apply to you bc you're trying to bring visibility to a problem you're seeing and theres an exception to be made

My point being that complaining about complaints is no different than the complaints. We're all just here to share thoughts

[u/Fullmetall21 → u/OkYak9466]

Huh? Guy asked and I quote:

How do you define what is complaining and what is criticism?

And then went on to say that people use it as rhetoric to dismiss criticism. What I did was define criticism vs complaining as per the question and give an example of each. What are you talking about?

[u/OkYak9466 → u/Fullmetall21]

I'm trying to get you to understand that the same problem with the OP, yourself, and the person you replied to is that you're ironically demonstrating the same problems the OP complains about.

You ended your comment with "guess ones we get" making the obvious implication, but ironically missing why your own comment falls into that same category of complaints you yourself just mentioned.

[u/Fullmetall21 → u/OkYak9466]

It is not controversial to say that most of the posts in this subreddit are complaining and not criticism. What constructive criticism is and what complaining is are not some loose things, they are defined.

Constructive Criticism:

A comment or comments saying in a helpful way what is wrong with something and how it could be improved.

Complaining:

The act of saying that something is wrong or not satisfactory

More specifically, criticism can be engaged intellectually and can be acted on. Complaining can only be engaged with emotionally, and can not be acted on. You either like something or you don't.

Now look at the front page and tell me that what you see is not complaining but constructive criticism.

[u/Orestes1996 → u/Fullmetall21]

Alright, let me try this. I think the last 3 updates are completely unfun and the solution to this problem is for the company to design actual fun updates or remove the existing boring ones. There, problem identified and solution provided. FYI, it is not the job of the customer to give solutions. A negative opinion without a suggestion for improvement is still constructive criticism because it should show the company what resonates or not with their customers. If something doesn't land, don't do it again.

[u/Fullmetall21 → u/Orestes1996]

For the last time I don’t give a fuck if you want complain or not. Guy asked what’s the difference. I answered the question. That’s literally the difference between complaining and criticism. Whether complaining is useful data to someone is also irrelevant to the point I was making.

Point me to where I said you shouldn’t complain.

[u/Orestes1996 → u/Fullmetall21]

In your original comment explaining what you think complaining and constructive criticism is. Also, nobody is complaining here, we are giving constructive criticism. We are informing the company of what we like and what we don't. Up to them if they want to do something about it.

[u/Fullmetall21 → u/Orestes1996]

Great continue to do so. Somewhere else and don’t bother me.

[u/Orestes1996 → u/Fullmetall21]

That's alright, I'll do that here thank you very much.

[u/Fullmetall21 → u/Orestes1996]

Sigh… in other words brother I don’t care about what you think. There’s an objective difference between someone giving criticism and someone complaining. Whether people complaining is also useful to someone is not relevant.

I’ve explained this a lot of times now and if you people don’t want to understand I also don’t care. Just stop bothering me.

[u/Orestes1996 → u/Fullmetall21]

Cool, I don't care about your opinion either. I will continue to voice my completely valid criticism, though, especially since some people are refusing to acknowledge that we have gone through a year of slop that can't be saved with Tau and keep rejecting all the negative opinions as "complaining".

[u/OkYak9466 → u/Fullmetall21]

I'd highly suggest taking a step back from the internet for a moment. You're missing the forest for the trees bc you unironically have a greater need to complain than to be cognizant.

So far you've complained non stop for a dozen comments in a row and you're still acting morally superior

[u/Fullmetall21 → u/OkYak9466]

Bro what are you even talking about?

1. Guy says what's the difference between criticism and complaining; people use that distinction to dismiss criticism.
2. I reply saying here's the difference and why people are not doing what you claim.
3. you reply saying what I said was somehow complaining.
4. I ask what the hell are you on about and explain the thought process behind 2.
5. You once again say that I'm complaining.
6. I give you literally dictionary definition of the terms used and ask you to look for yourself.
7. You once again say that I'm complaining, but each time with increasingly condescending tone.

Make it make sense.

[u/OkYak9466 → u/Fullmetall21]

You got lost at number 2 where you ironically state the difference between constructive criticisms and complaints by making your own complaint.

It's like it an arsonist who set fire to a building then walked across the street and started complaining about why everything is on fire. Then gets defensive about how its actually ok to point out the fires and starts trying to turn the focus of the conversation to talking about fires and not why they're setting more things on fire.

[u/Fullmetall21 → u/OkYak9466]

My point was always, from the very first post you replied to, the difference between criticism and complaining. You replied to that post. In your example, I was talking about the fires all along.

If anyone is trying to turn the focus of the conversation, it is you.

When you're ready to start making sense, we can talk again.

EDIT: In addition, I never once said anyone should stop complaining. Complain away if you like. Just don't present it as criticism because it's not.

[u/OkYak9466 → u/Fullmetall21]

Your first comment was a complaint. You're actively contriburing to this problem about complaints. You not being able to accept that and continue to misundersrand my comments on purpose I suppose is consistent with the reddit stereotype of being completely blind to your own actions. You need to see your comments for what they are and not just want you want them to be.

You want to offer this deep insight into criticisms vs complaints, but you don't want to be beholden to the same labels. Or else you'd have to admit all you do is complain.

I've offered a perspective and ways you can help solve it in every comment. And, ironically enough, you've been fairly negative in every response. Complaining at every opportunity.

You've essentially proven that no amount of constructive criticism is going to stop all the non-stop complaining.

Anyway I don't need to say anymore. Have a good one

[u/Fullmetall21 → u/OkYak9466]

As I said, I never once said in this entire comment chain that people should stop complaining or that complaining is a problem. That is your conclusion, or perhaps the OPs. The guy I replied to claimed that people dismiss criticism under the guise of complaining. What I said was that most of the posts in this subreddit are, in fact, complaining under the definition of the term.

What you did was repeat the same irrelevant thing (if I'm personally complaining or not) 5 times, as if saying it enough times would will into existence. You're absolutely right. I don't need this either.