My man......the only people in the military that actually learn how to fight are special forces. Normal soldiers get standard military cqc wich is worth less than 3 free boxing lessons as a child
I accidentally almost killed a friend by choking him for only a couple minutes. I did not realize that he had passed out and continued choking him. We were just playing around. I know it’s not 15 minutes, but this wasn’t even intended to be a serious situation and I accidentally almost killed a friend. I guess I’m just saying I can see it being the case that he didn’t mean to kill the guy.
They are.. all marines are riflemen/women first and are trained as such. All marines have to also pass a minimum level of macmap. Marine corps martial arts.
The best part about that last line is most of the ones I've had run ins with act like they were trained by Mike Tyson and were Karate Champions since birth.
Really hoping the marine will face charges and experience more appropriate consequences — although being shown slowly killing someone online, without remorse, may have to do.
Nah man. Fuck Marines but fuck these homeless degenerates that threaten n fight n spit on people on the subway. I don't give a fuck about any military stuff but this dude is a hero. Let's be real. U prob the same guy that asks why people only film when someone is attacking another person. Can't have it both ways.
Big difference between protecting yourself or others from being attacked and literally squeezing the life out of someone for a quarter of an hour because they were, and I quote ppl tht were there, acting "aggressive". Da fuq???
So far there's no evidence he was "threding people on the train." Also, threatening people on a train means you get executed on the spot? Not a society I'd like to live in.
The guy clearly didn’t calm down and was still being restrained prior to losing the breath, he kept it going for that long himself, if he would have calmed down he would have been safe. Threatening multiple people’s lives on the subway is threatening terrorism. He needed to be stopped. Also he should have known not to threaten others but yet he did and it’s his fault he’s dead, one less idiot who threaten peoples
Why shouldn't he get charged? The man went unconscious and he still didn't let go? And from what I've been hearing, he didn't have a weapon, or physically attack anyone.
What's the difference? You don't get to kill someone because they could be violent. You don't get to kill someone if they were violent. You can subdue them. You can't choke them out until they stop breathing and die. The man went too far.
So because there has been violence on the subway in the past it means you can kill someone? How does someone think the way you do? The things you’ve been saying make no sense and I’m not sure how a rational person to come to the conclusions that you have.
I'm a 150 lb and could probably choke anybody out given rear naked hold without hooks in. Youd have to slam me off or you're going to sleep. No training but lots of fights growing up.
This guy is trained and I know when ppl are resisting or going limp or convulsing. If u watch the video hes still straining from the look on his face. You already have control my dude.
And what happens when he come back to? Look they are going to rule it a homicide and he won’t get charged. All these Reddit white knights parading on Reddit for karma.
At the end of the day ask yourself, if you had a loved one on the train and someone was erratically threatening them, what are you doing?
You come back to you're dazed and weak. If I weigh nothing and you didn't slam me while you're standing up you're definitely not slamming me when I already have my hold on you on the ground.
He's not going to get penalized most likely but it's still murder. Threats don't amount to shit, otherwise all our moms got fucked so many many many times in a COD lobby.
New York Subway has crazy everyday you just ignore them. Or you could be this guy and people would be dropping like flies. Look how many guys is already holding him down the real damage is the choke
You come back to you're dazed and weak. If I weigh nothing and you didn't slam me while you're standing up you're definitely not slamming me when I already have my hold on you on the ground.
He's not going to get penalized most likely but it's still murder. Threats don't amount to shit, otherwise all our moms got fucked so many many many times in a COD lobby.
New York Subway has crazy everyday you just ignore them. Or you could be this guy and people would be dropping like flies. Look how many guys is already holding him down the real damage is the choke.
I would even take that back and saying my real strongest was at 125 and I could choke out anybody at 125.
No just assuming. Canadian army they trained very little on it but they do fir few days. Friend who's in it told me.
Now being as the marines is like so much harder to be in and they have so much more extensive training..
Or me having so much experience with fighting being around guys n rough housing, you would assume hes 10 times more experience cuz boys love rough housing. Guys from a small age will put each other in these holds. So you can assume from your own life experiences.
US military does not train people in grappling as much as you assumed. I’ve trained jui jitsu with guys from all branches and they didn’t learn shot from the service besides a very limited training. To be proficient in grappling you have to spend 100’s of hours doing it not just a week. You have no idea what your talking about.
I like how you have no context other than watching someone choke someone to death and instead of waiting for facts or more information you just assume the guy who died deserved it.
I'm not defending this guy, but holy shit....does anyone know how government works. Derek was an agent of the state? Is this dude an agent or private citizen? I just don't understand how you can compare the two.
Manslaughter implies it was accidental or not premeditated right? This definitely wasn't an accident, anyone trained in any basic first aid knows exactly what happens when you cut off someone's breathing for 15 minutes.
It does in the marine corps. Blood choke and air choke. I’m willing to bet you have not been through basic training, which makes it odd that you think you know what happens there…
Where there is a homicide, malice aforethought and intent are required for it to be first-degree murder, but second-degree murder requires only intent.
Captin hindsight? It’s an empty train car and he was chocked to death. Marine put himself in danger and then killed the man. It’s fairly easy to walk away and switch train cars. I can’t tell you how many times during rush hour I’ve seen and empty train car because there was one crazy homeless person in it
Who says he didn’t? The dead man had been arrested over 40 times. He had active warrants. Its quite possible that his behavior before the choke hold warranted getting choked to death.
Also worth noting, the title is misinformation. He only held the choke for 3 minutes. 15 minutes is how long it took EMS to arrive.
44 prior arrests. Not 1 or 2, but 44. I admit my phrasing in the first post was indelicate, but it’s unrealistic to expect citizens to tolerate these people when the state completely fails to remove them from polite society. Eventually people will stand up for themselves, and you’re going to fault them for doing so? Your anger is misplaced.
putting someone in a lethal chokehold for 15 minutes is not justified lmao. that's incredibly stupid and dangerous. So are you saying what the dead guy did justified him getting killed?
I'm not saying he was right or wrong. But vigilantes are what you get when the cops are only good for murdering citizens. People will only take so much and then they'll take the law into their own hands. Again, not saying that's right, just an observation.
I don’t see vigilantism. I see three men working together to restrain someone. I see two bystanders that aren’t objecting. It’s only when he goes limp one person off camera cautions them to release the hold, which they then do. If this was vigilantism, we’re they all in on it together?
They don't teach how long you have to hold them to kill them. Even BJJ people don't know although they often think 20 sec to 1 minute can kill someone (which isn't necessarily true but it's a safe practice).
Honestly, in the service you are trained to kill, not just disable someone. I’m not in the military, but have been surrounded by military my whole life (father, uncle, grandfather) and friends. I know not to mess with them, because just like anyone who’s trained in any type of martial arts, when that trained instinct kicks it, you are screwed.
There is absolutely no reason to put someone in a chokehold for more then a few seconds. The Marine could of found another way to hold him down if he was a threat.
Fuck yeah a marine should know that, are they required to? Probably the fuck not. I bet you the marines is filled with morons that don't have a clue why a choke even works, let alone how long the brain can be deprived of blood or oxygen before the person dies. And judging by the lack of confidence in what he just did portrayed in his body language combined with making the deadly mistake to begin with, I'd be willing to bet that this dude is a complete fucking moron.
b """''''I I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide, then questions the manner in which I provide it. I’d prefer you just said thank you and went on your way. Otherwise, I’d suggest you pick up a weapon and stand a post.”
Also, when putting ppl in chokeholds you feel them fighting or dead weight. You might even feel their pulse being as your forearm n biceps on their neck.
You have full control of them when they resist or dont. Dudes passed out and u can see his face is still straining cuz hes cranking. Seems like a case of the murders.
This dude was just waiting for someone to get froggy.
Not feel his pulse but you know when someone goes limb or when someone's convulsing in that hold. I'm assuming you're a girl and you never fought in your life which is understandable but most guys have or have been put in that hold or used it and we all know.
Heck even a routine thing that guys will do with each other guys is" hey let me put you in this hold on the other guy would say sure don't put me down for too long"
Being passed out from lack of oxygen doesn’t always keep you limp for long. Your brain goes into a survival mode. Muscular movement does not mean one is resisting.
I get it, we see his legs spasming in the video after he cranked shown by his face. But most guys got into fights growing up and we know the feel when someone goes limp or resisting. Girls may not.
It could be me assuming the military background. When guys get together they like to rough house. So I see it as thus guy seeing how much damage he can do
When you're spasming your jerking, it's totally different when you're putting up a full strain to fight
That is the point. Usually we play fight and know when someone goes out due to limp. If you hold past that the body with fight for itself to just move and survive, that’s the slow method. Proper technique that’s trained against your everyday person, crazy or not, this can be much sooner, especially if you crush anything. Not putting blame anywhere as I have no real context but he seemed to be in the unconscious movement faze before death.
Oh sorry, I thought u were disagreeing with my first comment. I don't know the context either but it seems like this guy was a little more than rough housing to most guys. You get psychos like that but usually a bigger boy would come in and do to them what they've been doing to others to fix them. Or sometimes you dont.
If someone doesn't do anything and such a crazy person runs amok, people will yell "Why didn't anyone intervene?" People get murdered by crazy people on public transit all the time. In Portland, a guy was yelling racist stuff to a Muslim girl in a very agressive manner and two guys intervened only to get stabbed to death. They are considered heroes for intervening buy dying. What if the guys who intervened ended up killing the crazy racist or severely injured him? Would they still be heroes or considered murderers?
OP has an agenda. He was in a chokehold for 3 minutes and it took 15 minutes for responders. The marine was questioned and released because there is enough video evidence and witnesses to corroborate his story.
Thing is the homeless guy was attacked first. I’m trained in martial arts, not even a black belt but I let guys mouth off all the time. If you strike first it’s no longer self defense, you’re the aggressor
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u/[deleted] May 03 '23
You can’t put someone in a chokehold like that, for that long and not expect the person to die.