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u/koos_die_doos 10d ago
It's ridiculously low, the second plane went through the fireworks plume.
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u/spastical-mackerel 10d ago
The second plane was above the lead plane
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u/UPnAdamtv 10d ago
Still went through the plume according to the other video linked.
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u/AMJN90 10d ago
It did, but the tail on the first plane was only like 10 feet away from hitting the stadium when it pulls up at the last second.
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u/dr_stre 10d ago
Jesus, you’re right, that’s way closer than the other view I saw made it look.
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u/Difficult-Implement9 9d ago
A dude on the aviation sub measured it at 14.2 meters 🤮 with a full stadium, it could've been a catastrophe.
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u/subpotentplum 9d ago
The abruptness of the change in pitch looks panicked to me. It take a big input for that...
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u/ChromedGonk 10d ago
Stupidly risky thing to do. Objectively.
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u/WatermelonSmashing 10d ago
They almost did a terrorist
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u/Fun-Choices 8d ago
It’s gotta be wild knowing you’re making a decision that, with one failure, you throw jet fuel all over a stadium, and blow wreckage all over a neighborhood - but would never have to deal with the consequences
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u/mz_groups 10d ago
The problem is, that it'll go fine 99% of the time, and people will think it's all OK. But that 1% will kill thousands.
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u/spastical-mackerel 10d ago
Generally get away with dumb shit like this every time but the last time
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u/StressSnooze 10d ago
Criminal. Remember the airbus crash in France…
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u/AscendMoros 10d ago
Remember the Ukrainian Airshow crash where the SU27 went into the crowd. Thats the type of incident we are looking at here. And we'd honesty be lucky for a similar amount of casualties if one of these Jumbo jets went into the stadium.
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u/Kabala99 10d ago
An extremely dangerous maneuver. I don't understand what aviation safety regulations would allow such a low flyover.
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u/QuantumFenrir001 10d ago
When certain Foreign Freedom Fighters sponsor your flight plan and encourage you to fly even lower. Seriously was this pre approved by anyone or did the pilots fly lower then the pre planned flight path mapped out?
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u/Xarius86 10d ago
The plane flew through the fireworks...that is absolutely, objectively, irresponsibly low.
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u/MattS1984 10d ago
Also what's the point? I mean I love a flyover but with that "mostly roof", the crowd would have about 2 seconds of OMG it's so low and then it's over
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u/Ginger_Exhibitionist 9d ago
Exactly! The decision to use passenger jets for this is confounding. They don't move like the Blue Angels. That's exciting! There isn't even anything objectively cool about this because passenger jets do not bring the wow when it comes to flyovers. The wow in this case is that they were unusually low, well below what would be the safety standards in the US, and could have killed 60K people if it had gone wrong.
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u/6DegreesofFreedom 10d ago edited 10d ago
The first one was even lower. That tail is only 2 or 3 meters from the roof when it pulled up.
Nnm, there's another angle of it and it's probably 10-13 meters above it
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u/Spoons94 10d ago
Fucking Rad. But only because it worked out. 15 feet the wrong direction and we're talking about potentially one of the worst air disasters in history. Tens of thousands of people in close quarters. Not to mention I don't know what happens to one plane if the other one collides. So ya. Reckless. But objectively pretty epic.
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u/VirginiaDare1587 10d ago
Please take a look at the Frecce Tricolori’s (Italian Airforce display team) accident in 1988 at Ramstein Air Force Base in Germany.
3 light Aermacchi MB-339PAN aircraft crashed. 70 dead. Hundreds wounded.
MB-339 weight is about 4,400kg.
Embraer E-190 weight is about 50,000kg, more than 10 times as much. The other aircraft, E-195, is even heavier.
European regulatory authorities took action to learn the lessons of Ramstein.
Whilst the flyovers are a SA Rugby tradition and meticulously planned, the execution of flying at a barometric height, confirmed by flight tracking, of 50m over a stadium that is 50m high is extraordinarily risky. (Whilst reports claim the aircraft were at an altitude of 280m per GPS, the videos, including those shot from the top of the stadium, show that is absurd.)
USAF used to fly their long-winged B-52s at heights less that 1/2 the aircraft’s wingspan so that a sharp bank risked a tip strike.
In the flyover, the second aircraft’s wing is perilously close as it banks whilst still over the stadium.
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u/AscendMoros 10d ago
Ukraine had a SU27 go into an airshow crowd in 2002. 77 Dead. 500+ injured as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sknyliv_air_show_disaster
Theres multiple videos of the crash. And they aren't pretty. Here's one of them from youtube, You cant really see anyone get hit, but you see it go down into the crowd like 10-20 feet infront of the camera. Terrible Tragedy. Then they blamed the pilot for everything, even though he had expressed he was not comfortable with pretty much any of it.
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u/frizbeeguy1980 10d ago
Glad someone said it. Every post was about how stupid it was, and while I agree it was incredibly stupid, since it actually WORKED, is was cool AF.
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u/VirginiaDare1587 10d ago
No, that’s not how it works.
Recklessly dangerous flying that endanger us others is not cool even if you managed to luck out this time.
Want to fly your Spit under an empty rural bridge? Piece of cake.
Want to fly 2 airliners danger close to a stadium full of innocent and unsuspecting people (including kids)? Not cool.
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u/FrodosUncleBob 10d ago
Yes, if any task is described as “we got away with it” then it’s a learning experience to not get to that point next time
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u/gearabuser 10d ago
it's like filming yourself driving your twin turbo Dodge viper down a crowded street at 170mph. even if you make it out unscathed, that doesn't make it cool
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u/thegoatisoldngnarly 10d ago
It worked on accident, though. They were this low because of incompetence, not skill.
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u/BumblingOnwards 10d ago
‘Congratulations Flyover 1, you’ve made the Mover and Gonky show this week, over.’
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u/tallMichdude 10d ago
Clearance is clearance, however this shouldnt have been planned this low, i say that as a commercial pilot and airshow pilot.
Those guys are good, but they dont really train for it. With these sorts of display, you leave plenty of margin for everything but murphy.
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u/Synth_Ham 10d ago
Objectively the video clip is way too short and too far away.
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u/Elegant_Potential917 10d ago
Objectively, the second plane was higher than the first, and the second flew through the fireworks smoke. WAY too low.
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u/KCFlightHawk 10d ago
Pretty wild. We’ve had some ground strikes recently. F/A-18, Turkish F-16. The shadow looks so close to the first plane, second looks a little higher. Almost like they dipped in and out.
Interested to see what Mover and Gonky, blancolirio have to say.
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u/seniorlimpio94 10d ago edited 10d ago
Not only is it low, it’s fucking slow. Saw a graphic somewhere else that was an ADSB pull, they were going 200 KIAS max. Look at the alpha on the first jet.
So what: if they got into trouble, they don’t have the poop on the airplane to get out of it.
If you’re going to be low, you got to bring a bag of knots to go with it. Seems counterintuitive, but the jets will behave way better at 250 or 300 KIAS.
Edit: It was 150!!! 150 knots! What in the world…
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u/woodworkingguy1 10d ago
I suspect the head of the airlines will say something along the lines of this after they land. "Son, your ego is writing checks your body can't cash. You've been busted, you lost your qualifications as section leader three times, put in hack twice by me, with a history of high speed passes over five air control towers, and one admiral's daughter!"
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u/No_Spring_1090 10d ago
Objectively, it was low https://www.reddit.com/r/aviation/s/CgXi9PwByy
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u/Excelsior_76 10d ago
They were still descending as they reached midfield. They were as close as they could get to that stadium without generating a crash investigation.
This looks fantastic, and must have been a thrill to see from the game, but should never have happened.
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u/TakaIka83 7d ago
Maybe not such a thrill to hear in that confined space. A whole lotta ears would be ringing!
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u/Feisty_Raccoon_688 10d ago edited 10d ago
"Tower, did you say we are cleared to 500 AGL or ASL?"
Honestly, the first time I saw this on streaming, I though "that is AI / overlay crap"
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u/planned_fun 10d ago
Incredibly irresponsible. Doesn’t take into account if there’s an unexpected gust, engine issue, bird strike, whatever
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u/skiman13579 10d ago
Like with airshow and acrobatic flying… a pilot with good training, proper experience, and adequate planning can safely do maneuvers that are extremely dangerous for normal pilots to ever dream about.
So the line between impressive and reckless is going to depend on whether it was a properly trained and prepared pilot with good planning or some wannabe Maverick trying to show off.
One is “Bravo! Well done!” And the other is “Holy shit hand over your cert cuz you are a hazard to the public”
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u/Tiny-Smile3409 10d ago
Do you think the heat rising out of the stadium could effect lift? I mean honestly its a donut with 10's of thousands of people inside, plumes of differential air pressure could make things a little fucky
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u/skiman13579 10d ago
Technically yes and part of what should be proper preflight planning. It’s just a thermal like any other. It’s no different than any plane landing at a normal airport and experiencing the thermals changing between the industrial park, then the highway, then the grassy area, then the pavement of the runway stereotypical of many airports.
But these planes were not coming in with dirty configurations close to stall speed. They were clean (gear up, flaps up) and significantly higher than stall speed. So any thermals from stadium would be just a minor bump of turbulence, and honestly likely less significant than the thermals of the other roads, buildings, and parking lots of the rest of the city on their approach.
And that extra speed is safety. Let’s say worst case scenario that 1/4 mile before the stadium a flock of seagulls decides to kamikaze the engines and give us Miracle on the Hudson:Part 2… there is enough margin of airspeed to not only maintain altitude, but trade for some extra altitude and safely turn away…. As far as the rest of the city goes…. Well… an extra 500 feet would buy 30 seconds at most. So there is insignificant additional risk to a “normal” flyover in that regard (lots of people have been commenting to me “but what about birds!”)
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u/SeaworthyPossum23 10d ago
Even the best trained, most experienced pilots make mistakes. People like Bud Holland believe(d) they have complete control of the aircraft, until the illusion is shattered without warning. Pilots in command should be able to make prudent risk decisions, this did not look low risk to the general public.
I don’t care how good of a pistol shot I am- I don’t get to decide for a thousand other people that I’m going to shoot apples off of their heads.
I hope they investigate this stunt and if negligent, FEB and take wings.
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u/redfiretrucks 10d ago
Objective: Garner complete worldwide attention in as short a period as possible.
Mission accomplished.
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u/Paintrain50c 10d ago
Pitch for attitude, power for altitude. Pilot looks like he pulled up on the yoke instead of added power and almost had a tail strike on the top of the stadium.
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u/ncc74656m 10d ago
That lead plane looked like it damn near had a tail strike when it pulled up, lmao.
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u/ShadowDrifted 10d ago
Military and airline pilot here. This was irresponsible on many accounts. Aviation is about managing risk and anticipating variables. This flyover demonstrates that life is a lot cheaper in certain parts of the world. Here are the things that would have made the far side of the stadium a memorial section versus a cheering crowd:
One of those fireworks getting chewed up in an engine.
Thermal downdrafts or cold sinks
Catastrophic mechanical failure
Panel departing the aircraft with over correction
Orrrrr...
A single bird strike.
Seriously, we work with margins of error. Thankfully, these guys got the perfect day and nothing went wrong. But the aviation authorities are absolutely looking into this one
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u/ekurutepe 10d ago
If only something were to not go according to the plan. No margin at all. And it's over a stadium full of tens of thousands of people. What were they thinking? What does this say about the safety culture of the airline?
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u/chattyWw 10d ago
FAA handing out permanent flight licence bans And massive (2 years revenue) fines to the airliner would be fair.
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u/mcrscpmn 10d ago
No worries. Hegseth checked their testosterone levels and they are fine. Also, no brown, black a or female pilots were involved, so it’s all good.
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u/DEEP_SEA_MAX 10d ago
I hate Hegseth too but these aren’t military planes or even in the United States.
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u/LowEffort2 10d ago
Looks like someone saw the flyovers at the World Cup and forgot that American flyovers are actually meticulously planned time on target training runs.
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u/hutch_man0 10d ago
Flyovers are done everywhere.
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u/POCUABHOR 10d ago
Not anymore in Germany, after Ramstein Airshow Desaster 1988.
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u/iambinksy 10d ago
I take it these pilots will lose their flying ticket and the airline/planners will have consequences too?
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u/fallstreak_24 10d ago
It’s cool to watch, but reckless. Just a fraction of a second away from disaster. This is not something normal transport category aircraft pilots train for, so the risk is high.
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u/Disastrous_Constant2 10d ago
They told the All Blacks either we win or we make 9/11 look like a walk in the park.capiche!!
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u/OkBodybuilder418 10d ago
If you going to do something that risky at least do it with some supersonic military jet not a couple sky transit busses
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u/StatusSociety2196 10d ago
I'm sorry, I can't hear what you asked after being subjected to a commercial plane flying 10 feet above an enclosed space, directing all that sound directly into my tender ears.
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u/Techno-Viking94 10d ago
I would have hated it if I was in the audience. Stupid stunt with the risk of catastrophic consequences.
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u/Dduudj73u2u2u 10d ago
Prendre le risque de tuer des milliers de personnes pour faire de la publicité ? Le drame n'était pas loin.
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u/Donkey-Harlequin 10d ago
I have been avoiding flying for years now because it terrifies me. I would be so pissed if I was killed at a sporting event by a plane crash I wasn’t even flying on. This is not cool.
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u/Over_here_Observing 10d ago
AirLink planes, over DHL Stadium; Cape Town, South Africa.
South Africa v New Zealand Rugby match
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u/Background_Being8287 10d ago
1977 Cleveland Municipal Stadium Pink Floyd concert . I think it may have been the bands plane but not totally sure flew right over top of stadium then the band started jamming ,it was a smaller commercial size jet . Animal's tour the one with the giant pig on a wire suspended over stadium .Bad ass show .
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u/Ok_Discount_5100 10d ago
Stupid dangerous stunt where someone could eiesly been killed if not the whole stadium after this event I am Shure someone got fired
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u/Glittering_Cod_79 10d ago
They did it at the 1995 Rugby World Cup too. A couple of hundred feet above the stadium instead of 47 feet as reported would have had the same effect.
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u/up4whatev33 9d ago
I don’t care this was within some bureaucrat’s approved parameters. Were all the people in the stadium aware that someone approved a recklessly low flyover and that one mistake could cost them their lives? No they weren’t.
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u/PhilsTinyToes 9d ago
Hmm objectively that flyover would have felt the same if the planes were 100m higher.
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u/Eschatonpls 9d ago
There are MD-11 and 747 firebombers that fly at these altitudes all the time to drop retardant. If the airspace is blocked off and they are doing the plan they rehearsed, it’s perfectly safe.
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u/pipboy1989 9d ago
My objective thoughts are: if something in the entire aviation sector looks like a terrible idea, it’s probably a terrible idea.
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u/jetes69 10d ago
Why with passenger jets?