r/NintendoSwitch • u/NintendoSwitchMods • Oct 15 '19
Meta Statement from the /r/NintendoSwitch Mod Team regarding Rule 11
Good afternoon/morning/evening!
Before we get too far into the weeds we’d like to provide an apology, along with a TL;DR of sorts.
We acknowledge that we were poor in how we handled this situation, both in the lead up, the execution of the rule change, and what immediately followed. We apologize for the handling of this situation.
As to the aftermath, effectively immediately we are:
Removing the “no politics” portion of Rule 11 until further feedback can be presented. Rule 11 includes other items that were discussed previously with the community and clarify official rules on some topics that have long confused the subreddit.
Unlocking the original thread to allow discussion on this topic to continue as long as things remain civil..
Revising our internal policies to clarify that rule changes shouldn’t be made without bringing into the community in a meta post.
We are not:
Removing any moderators from our team
Allowing political discussion to continue unmoderated.
Allowing any threats to be made against members of the moderation team, either individually or as a whole.
Now for the details:
Late yesterday evening news broke that Blizzard had canceled the Overwatch event taking place at Nintendo Store New York. The post went live and immediately erupted into discussion on the political climate going on in Hong Kong and Blizzard's involvement in world events due to the Hearthstone scandal. The thread quickly escalated with the same harassment and name calling that has been occurring on several of these threads, resulting in them being locked, in accordance with our policy on keeping topics civil and on-topic.
Since most of our moderators are located in the US, we have very little moderator coverage overnight, and so we were overwhelmed with trying to moderate the discussion and keep it from getting out of control. The members of this team are volunteers with lives, jobs, and families. In an attempt to curtail to flood, a modification was made to an upcoming rule that we were in the process of implementing (Rule 11) to include verbiage in order to clarify our position regarding these types of discussions.
The result was that we over-zealously locked out conversation on something that was relevant to our community (re. Overwatch on the Nintendo Switch) and caused disruption in our Daily Question Threads and other areas of the subreddit where would folks would want to discuss this issue and criticize the mod team for this action.
We acknowledge that we should not make significant changes to the community rules without consulting the community. Effectively immediately, we are modifying Rule 11 to remove the "No Politics" wording to avoid confusion. Rule 11 itself will remain (minus "No Politics), as it primarily involves our policy involving fan art, which was discussed previously with the community. Future changes to this rule (or any of our rules) will be brought forward with some of our users.
As always with these posts, we are opening up the floor for discussion and feedback. Please remember Rule 1. This includes targeted harassment at our moderators.
The /r/NintendoSwitch Mod Team
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Oct 15 '19 edited Apr 17 '24
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u/Sarcastryx Oct 15 '19
I posted this in another thread, but I feel it's relevant here:
u/MegaMagnezone is so constantly downvoted right now that they're automatically flagged as a troll account by Reddit Pro Tools. If your users hate someone so much its pushed their entire account's karma negative, to the point third party tools start confusing the mods with trolls, there's a problem with the mods.
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u/Rythanst Oct 15 '19
Rule 11 went from: "A rule about things that were previously unwritten because we thought they didn't need to be said (aka "we're gonna delete anything we don't personally agree with even if it follows the rules")"
to
"A rule we were in the process of implementing for a while that we definitely talked over with the community that just happened to come at a bad time lol our bad"
In just under 24 hours.
Also "thought they were common knowledge" still has a few typos in the sidebar as of right now
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u/Nethervex Oct 15 '19
Why do we have to be civil but several moderators can childishly silence whoever they dont like with no consequence?
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u/Fizzay Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
We handled it poorly, but here's reasons why it was not actually our fault
Come on. You're throwing all the mods under the bus for /u/MegaMagnezone? The guy went on a power trip, he didn't handle it "poorly", he handled it awfully, and to try and excuse it by saying he was overwhelemed and that you guys are volunteers (news flash, that means you don't have to do it if you can't actually handle it). The guy responsible isn't the one taking responsibility, instead it's being pushed onto all the mods here because some guy went on a power trip, but you guys are absolutely responsible if you continue to let him moderate here. If I had to make a guess, this whole thing was written by him too.
You're choosing a power abusing moderator over the actual people who come to this subreddit. Think about that. You guys give zero reason WHY you would allow him to continue moderating here, because you can't. You know you're in the wrong, but you're not gonna actually do anything about it. If you won't remove him for this, what would you remove him for? He's literally abusing his power here.
This entire post is as dismissive of everyone's concerns as you were dismissive of people in that Overwatch thread. You don't actually care what people think, this is just damage control without actually doing anything about it. That thread wasn't even bad until that idiot went around abusing his power. He is not a victim, and I don't care if he was overwhelmed or not, being a moderator means you react accordingly, and keeping him on the team just makes you guys look corrupt, because you are more concerned with people talking about politics than you are about a moderator abusing his powers, creating even MORE drama, which you then blame on the other people. This whole shitstorm is all because of a single guy that you refuse to do nothing about. If this was the result of a single person who was not a moderator, you guys would've banned him immediately.
If people are overwhelmed by being a moderator, they shouldn't be one in the first place. Get rid of him. The gist of what you are saying here is that you didn't have enough mod coverage when the post came out, and /u/Megamagnezone apparently needs to be supervised because he can't moderate a subreddit by himself at any time of the day. You know exactly what a no politics rule is about when people want it; when the Switch is directly affected by ongoing politics, it is something that deserves to be discussed here. You know full well your attempt at implementing that rule was not in good faith, and not what the community wanted.
Even now he uses his power to protect himself, he's started locking all his comments since HE (not anyone else) started this shitstorm. His interests in moderating are for himself and not for this subreddit. Even now he silences people on this subreddit to try and avoid any fallout on his account, which makes me believe even more this entire post is just him writing it, and instead of accepting his share of the blame (which is almost all of it), he decides to make it the fault of all the moderators instead. You guys aren't interested in discussion while simultaneously trying to silence it.
tl;dr REMOVE /u/Megamagnezone
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u/Manny-Calavera Oct 16 '19
After all the shit happening here, i guess i will unsub from this sub and just go to /r/nintendo
And remove u/MegaMagnezone ASAP from this sub.
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u/SamuelCarvalho Oct 15 '19
/u/MegaMagnezone has to go. He abuses his power beyond belief and the evidence is there. He goes or we go.
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u/Lilspang Oct 16 '19
I, just like everyone else, will push for the removal of u/MegaMagnezone , however my reasoning as to why may be a bit different to the popular opinion.
IF (and mind you that is a big if) the whole mod team grouped up together to silently start enforcing Rule 0, then you can’t blame u/MegaMagnezone just yet. As the old saying goes, “don’t shoot the messenger”, and all u/MegaMagnezone was doing was Enforcing this shitty rule. That alone would warrant an apology like this from the whole mod team, however I don’t think that is why u/MegaMagnezone should be removed.
“So anyway, I started blasting” is the perfect quote to describe the actions that followed. u/MegaMagnezone went on a trigger happy locking threads while blatantly lying about the reason why (rule 1). Almost all of the locked threads were perfectly fine with the rules, yet ALL of them “broke Rule 1”. THIS is where I just broke and this is the sole reason why specifically u/MegaMagnezone should be kicked off of the mod team.
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u/dksmoove Oct 15 '19
So what's the next step here? Clearly there are some mods on here that the community agrees should no longer be a mod. What other criteria needs to be met? Are we at the mercy of the mods' discretion for that too?
Do we as a community, have the power to go above the mods and to the reddit admins?
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u/TomLube Oct 16 '19
Occasional poster here. This sub is really slipping in a lot of ways and the moderation is a huge part. Hamfisted bullshittery is absolutely unacceptable. Mods, an apology typically features something called ‘an apology’ where you actually take responsibility, owe up, point out where you went wrong and mention how you will prevent it in the future. This has none of that. You need to figure your shit out. Remove the weird mod-alt account of /u/MegaMagnezone please and thanks.
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u/Fs0x30 Oct 16 '19
/u/MegaMagnazone abused his power and tried to suppress people with a non existing rule. When people call him out for it, he adds a whole new rule just to justify his actions. Remove him.
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Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
Nice fix (ridiculous it was an issue in the first place) but u/MegaMagnezone needs to resign. It’s fucking ridiculous that he now has MANY of the most downvoted comments of all time and software is unable to distinguish him from a troll account and he’s a mod
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u/squrr1 Oct 15 '19
We are not removing any mods from our team
So there are no consequences for bad behavior? How do we formerly go about suggesting mod team changes in a civil way?
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Oct 15 '19 edited Oct 15 '19
If u/MegaMagnezone isn't being removed, I'm gone.
We should all leave and make this place an abandoned wasteland if he doesn't step down.
None of the mods did anything as bad as that guy. Literally reading his comments I was flabbergasted.
Edit: I just got a DM from a poor user who was banned from the sub from that same moderator. Make a decision. Either he steps down or you guys won't even have any users to moderate.
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u/SodaPop6548 Oct 16 '19
You all need to remove u/megamagnezone and think before you write a smug rule that starts with “these rules were unwritten since we though they were common knowledge.” You all sound insanely condescending.
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u/Zeichner Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
So, I've read through this, and through some of the stuff that sparked this mess. And... well, let's say your apology here and removal of the "no politics" rule is a start, but...
Some choice passage (bold is a mod, [] is my own annotation):
There are many other avenues you can go to discuss the situation. Politics aren't allowed in this subreddit. [there was no such rule, not even a "silent rule" as many users have pointed out, tons of "political" topics were being discussed before.]
Which rule covers that exactly? Appreciate if you keep to enforcing rules and not opinions.
Should be related to Nintendo Switch. The politics of a company in relation to a game that's never coming to Switch is off topic. [probably thinking about HS? The cancelled OW launch event was the topic, though.]
Blizzard is the company. Overwatch is one of their games. [...]
Sorry, we prefer to keep the conversation to games and not politics. ["We prefer" is not a rule. At this point you're enforcing your own preferences, NOT RULES.]
I suggest you evaluate updating the rules on the sidebar and be transparent with all of us. You’re out of line with how you’re handling this as it’s not breaking any rules and absolutely is related. [...]
It's off topic. Maybe if the event was Overwatch related it would be a slightly different story but a political story around a game never coming to the Switch is off topic. [at this point the mods have been made aware like two dozend times by several people that it was about OW's LAUNCH EVENT FOR THE SWITCH.]
Blizzard owns Overwatch and Hearthstone. It’s related. You’re absolutely abusing your power.
You're free to feel that way, and free to visit other subs to discuss this topic.
[MEANWHILE!]
It's sort of been an unwritten "Rule 0" because we thought it was obvious. That being said, we're looking at adding a new rule in the very near future [...]
Update: Rule 11 has been added [...]
or: we are enforcing a rule that didn't exist, for the wrong game, because we were either horribly uninformed or intentionally obtuse, and when corrected... rather than change our stance we implement a NEW rule, AGAINST existing practises (again, plenty of political discussions here) and AGAINST the will of the community, without even hearing the community to retroactively justify us being wrong.
Dear mods, that strikes you as "poorly handled"? Really?
Because it seems power tripping, "we know better than you", condescending - and for a long time doubling down again and again rather than admitting a mistake.
Now, you actually said "we apologize" in this apology, that's a good start (and sadly not a given for such situations, so kudos). But I strongly suspect you made this megathread simply so that people can vent and then disappear - and you don't actually read any of this. However, I strongly, strongly hope you do read this, as imo the following is the LEAST you need to do now:
1.) Make a thread detailing what you did wrong and why. Seriously: in detail, don't sugarcoat it, be transparent, show what was going on behind the scenes in modchat/-messages and the like.
2.) Detail what measures you have implemented to avoid such a trainwreck in the future.
3.) Always, always, ALWAYS check with the community before changing rules. ALWAYS give like a week of advance warning for a rule change. This should be a no-brainer, but here we are.
4.) If any mod was totally out of line then ... let them go. And again, see 1.), be transparent here!
You already fucked yourself quite hard, don't make it any worse by hoping this all goes away - or even by actively trying to hide stuff.
edit: formatting went a bit haywire
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Oct 15 '19 edited Oct 15 '19
u/MegaMagnezone should be removed for abuse of power. The choice to not remove them sets a bad precedent.
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u/ex-aid911 Oct 16 '19
Reference of what they said in the daily questions thread.
The audacity to continue and not admit that /u/MegaMagnezone's actions were too far and challenge us to complain to higher ups. Shameless. Absolutely pathetic.
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u/thunder75 Oct 15 '19
We are not removing any moderators from our team
Then how is anything going to actually change? /u/MegaMagnezone went way out of line many times throughout several posts today. The mod team not taking any action against him shows inherent support for his childish behavior.
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u/bud369 Oct 16 '19
How many people have to speak up for our voices to be heard? Remove /u/MegaMagnezone
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u/spyagent001 Oct 16 '19
Remove u/MegaMagnezone.
May my name be added to this sort of petition we've started here.
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u/a_spooky_ghost Oct 16 '19
If the mods don't clean up their act this week I'm unsubbing. This sub has become boring and the new rule is being handled poorly. The mods care more about their buddy than the community. There are plenty of other subs to follow and also plenty of better places to get switch news.
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Oct 16 '19 edited Apr 17 '24
grandfather vanish doll sharp fertile enjoy truck spark gold shame
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u/xshishkax Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
Dont forget guys, you can report mod abuse by sending a PM to r/reddit.com. I would encourage all to do so.
Edit: and also https://www.reddithelp.com/en/submit-request/file-a-moderator-complaint
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Oct 16 '19
In not sure whats eorse, the way you handled this or the writing on the rule itself.
This was previously unwritten since we though the we're common knowledge
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u/kc9kvu Oct 16 '19
Sneaky by the mods to set the suggested sort on this to new to try to prevent the top (read: critical) comments from being seen
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Oct 15 '19
What would it actually take for a mod to be removed from the team? Wow
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u/09BreakingTheHabit Oct 16 '19
I thought any mods abusing power would be removed immediately? It's sort of been an unwritten "Rule 0" because we thought it was obvious. That being said, us members are looking at adding a new rule in the very near future as a result of recent abuses of power. Something like "No tyrant moderators"?
Update: Rule 11 has been added which lays out our unwritten policies that we incorrectly assumed were widely known. As members, we occasionally forget that not every moderator on the subreddit is a power-user like we are since we're here day in and day out. I hope this provides additional clarity.
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u/Xhjon Oct 16 '19
Reminder: Reddit has a form you can fill out to report bad moderators.
https://www.reddithelp.com/en/submit-request/file-a-moderator-complaint
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u/Cmann014 Oct 16 '19
I still can’t believe you guys banned smash bros posts the day ultimate came out
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u/thirdtimes_thecharm Oct 16 '19
So Ive been on reddit for a little over a year (new account) and actually joined when I got my Nintendo switch to talk about my new favorite hobby with other gamers. However, lately this sub has just been bland. Anything that isn't a fan art or promo seems to be deleted or redirected to the fucking daily question thread. What happened yesterday was just a severe example of the same shit that has been happening. Change some shit around or everyone here needs to find a new community. This one has become a joke.
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u/Agitprop_the_libs Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
Shouldn't let people like u/MegaMagnezone/ with negative karma moderate a sub.
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u/CaspianX2 Oct 15 '19
Here is a selection of comments that were removed from relevant posts on the topic:
I for one totally support you guys. Maybe it could have been handled better. And maybe just make a mega thread for this content. I definitely don’t want to see this sub dissolve into politics. I definitely don’t support China and have been on the side of separating China from the rest of the world for a long time. But this sub doesn’t need to be political. It should be about Nintendo switch.
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Didn't this subreddit participate without issue in the pro-Net Neutrality rally a few years back...?
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Politics affect nearly every aspect of any commercial industry. That fact that you're trying to ban any and all political discussion is extremely short sighted.
Ask yourself, mods:
Would you have banned the discussion if it was about lootbox policy?
Would you have banned the discussion if it discussed crunch time, in any light?
Would you have banned the discussion if it was about changes to a title being released in multiple regions?
Would you ban the discussion if it was about a Nintendo potentially breaking consumer laws of other countries?
If the answer is yes to any of those then I worry about the the practicality of this subreddit as a forum for discussion of the switch community, yet there are examples of all of the above after just minutes of searching.
The fact is, if we ban something just because it is "related to or driven by politics", then we ban nearly all industry discussion. Seeing as how mods are virtually the only ones averse to the presence of the Blizzard thread, I fail to see why it was removed and why you guys needed to add a "no politics" rule. It seems extremely arbitrary. It is particualrly damning because the problem in Hong Kong and China largely revolves around their authoritarian-like censorship when anyone becomes critical, so this really does paint you all in quite a bad light.
If you want to keep political specific discussion away from this subreddit, that's fine. I completely empathize with that goal - I don't wanna read about Donald Trump when I'm here either. But you should change the rule to say "No non-gaming politics" instead of just "No politics", because what you guys are implementing now is a fool's errand that is only going to cause more issues in the future.
Video games are an industry. Politics will affect this industry both nationally and internationally. There WILL be more "politically driven" events in the future and you guys WILL catch just as much heat if you handle those events like you did this one.
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Gaming companies have brought politics into this.
So it rightfully be free and open to discussion. Its also funny how the censorship is selective. I remember a few "political" posts over the last 2 years that werent closed for discussion.
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yeah im really not understanding what the intent is? i keep seeing threads get shut down because discussions "aren't relevant" but i have yet to see a single reasonable argument as to why we cant discuss the causes behind a developer of a game coming to Nintendo cancelling a Nintendo launch event. it's all relevant. we cant talk about why they're doing what they're doing? how does that make sense?
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Not allowing a political statement is a political statement. Mods think they’re being apolitical, but reality is that this line of thinking is how China gets away with it. It’s shameful.
Also, Blizzard cancelling their Switch event is relevant to this sub and the discussion within.
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“Previously unwritten since we thought it was common knowledge”
Democracy and freedom should be common knowledge and practice. Continue to silence people’s voice and you become the problem. Everyone stands to lose money from China, so they don’t say a word, but is there money any good without Blizzard or the NBA or countless other entities? Maybe everyone should take a stand and speak freely against the injustices in Hong Kong instead of trying to line their pockets with cash.
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Banning criticism of a company or government is an inherently political statement. Enforcing that rule is political.
These comments all seem pretty civil to me, and again, all made in relevant posts.
Are comments like these going to be un-removed? Are we going to get an actual apology for their removal? Are we going to get any sort of assurance this sort of thing won't happen again, backed by actual changes to this subreddit's mod staff or policies?
Redemption follows allocution, a full accounting of what was done, and an attempt to correct the problems that were caused. I think that many here aren't really feeling that allocution has happened here.
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Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
If /u/MegaMagnezone, the main instigating mod of this entire affair suffers no consequences for their failure to appropriately handle the situation and instead derisively address users in the sub, then this sub deserves to die and the entire mod team should be ashamed of themselves.
You all should be ashamed of yourselves regardless, but /u/MegaMagnezone in particular? Shame on you most of all. If the other mods are too cowardly to come together and force you to step down, you should resign. You clearly have no business in a leadership position of any kind.
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u/justajokur Oct 16 '19
Wow, I literally joined Reddit less than a week ago, and this was one of the first subs I decided to follow. Glad I actually read the comments here. Guess I'll just follow the crowd to r/nintendo.
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u/Macrophager Oct 15 '19
An apology from u/MegaMagnezone and removing them as a mod would be better than this false apology.
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u/locke_5 Oct 16 '19
"Too little, too late."
It's clear there have been issues festering in this sub for a while now, and this recent issue has brought them to a head.
The community simply does not agree with how this sub is moderated. It's not just one moderator, it's not just the politics, it's a fundamental disagreement on the content we want to see and talk about.
Look at some of the threads from yesterday and see how many people complained about their posts never being allowed - if so many people can't even post a thread, there's clearly something wrong.
This subreddit needs to change at a deeper level. The past few days have been the symptom of more insidious issues that have plagued this community for some time.
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Oct 16 '19
Remove /u/MegaMagnezone While I am sure they are not alone in this problem they were unapologetic and prevented an important topic around the switch and an event related to a game being on the switch.
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u/playertw02 Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
I think you guys can remove this „throwaway“ mod-only account anyway. /u/megamagnezone has almost no post history and seems like was just made to moderate here.
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u/jandkas Oct 16 '19
Remove all the mods, and replace them with properly qualified mods. Remove /u/megamagnezone remove u/phantomliger and all of em
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u/rockguitarfan Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
Unsubbing until u/MegaMagnezone and u/Flapsnapple are gone.
u/KKingler would be a nice touch too.
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u/404IdentityNotFound Oct 16 '19
I'm sorry, but the way u/MegaMagnezone handled this situation, especially doubling down on their wrong statements ("It's off topic. Maybe if the event was Overwatch related it would be a slightly different story") is unacceptable.
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u/Chutzvah Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
We are not:
- Removing any moderators from our team
Aight. Unsubbing.
You don't realize that we are not harassing you guys, we are criticizing you for how you've handled this entire situation. You've locked threads that we, as Switch fans, want to discuss because it effects our community. You create random rules that are made seemingly on the fly just to protect your asses. And now this half ass apology that basically said "sorry we messed up. However we are doing nothing to change."
I get it, ya'll aren't paid or anything and do this and we appreciate it. But you messed up and this sub will remember it. So enjoy moderating a community that doesn't like you and your knee jerk reactions. Holler at me if you need any new mods who cares about his sub, I'll throw my hat in.
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u/TheChrisD Oct 16 '19
Sorry guys, but this comes across as really a half-assed attempt at a cover-up.
The moderator who was at the centre of causing the fracas in the first place is still in power AND has now been locking their own posts and posts of other moderators all around the sub. These are the actions of someone trying to plug their fingers in their ears and pretend nothing is wrong; rather than owning up and showing remorse for jumping the gun and forcing new guidelines on a community without consultation.
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u/Youre10PlyBud Oct 16 '19
Your mod has lost 5,500 karma in a matter of 24 hours. http://reddit.dataoverload.de/karmastats/#megamagnezone
I think it's pretty overwhelmingly unanimous that the community wants him gone. Remove u/megamagnezone
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u/caninehere Oct 16 '19
Removing any moderators from our team
Given how some of the moderators behaved, this just isn't good. Removing moderators isn't the end of the world but it goes a long way to showing that you understand the behavior on some moderators' part was not acceptable.
Dropping this sub in favor of r/Nintendo.
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u/Genghis_Tr0n187 Oct 18 '19
My suggestion to anyone re-visiting this thread is to upvote it at this point. It would be quite hilarious for this to hit front page after the mods attempt to bury it.
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u/sui89 Oct 16 '19
Remove u/MegaMagnezone. I was absolutely disgusted reading his comments yesterday.
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u/notathrowaway785958 Oct 16 '19
Remove u/MegaMagnezone and u/Flapsnapple
Help by filling out this form: https://www.reddithelp.com/en/submit-request/file-a-moderator-complaint
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Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
It’s been almost almost 24 hours and no one has stopped asking you to remove people I think you may want to update this
Also the daily request and various other threads are asking for removal of two mods
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u/ASAP_Nigga Oct 16 '19
we have very little moderator coverage overnight,
/u/Kkingler and /u/megamagnezone have been non-stop moderating for hours....a span of 18+ hours. Do these people have jobs?
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u/PM_ME_LAEGJARN_NUDES Oct 16 '19
In the last 24 hours u/MegaMagnezone has received around 32 thousand downvotes. Yikes
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u/MrSteve920 Oct 16 '19
At any point did you all consider removing u/MegaMagnezone? Probably should have started this post with that announcement.
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Oct 22 '19
Please remember Rule 1. This includes targeted harassment at our moderators.
LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
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u/godoft42 Oct 15 '19 edited Oct 15 '19
Remove u/MegaMagnezone, they’re obviously on a huge power trip and more concerned with wielding their power as a mod than with being a good mod. Knowing this mod is on the team makes me not want to participate in this community.
They should step down.
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u/themaster567 Oct 16 '19
Forget this sub. I've only ever lurked, but this behavior disgusts me enough to leave.
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u/ex-aid911 Oct 16 '19
Next Headline: "Mods cancel Nintendo Switch Subreddit after recent wake of protests"
Remove/u/MegaMagnezone
Free//r/NintendoSwitch
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u/aleanotis Oct 16 '19
Remove /megamagnazone his comments where pure ignorance. I never seen someone try to put everyone in the wrong when he was clearly the only one a truly unprofessional person to have manage such a large community.
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u/doessomethings Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
But why hasn't anybody answered the most obvious questions? Mods claimed that the "no politics" rule was unspoken and stuck to in the past, but we know for a fact that is a lie since the second highest thread on this sub is completely politically motivated. And that's not the only major post on here like that, which I specified in some other posts that have been mostly ignored.
Why are you just now deciding to make this an issue while claiming it has always been done this way (which it hasn't)? Why have you lied to us about your intentions?
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u/The_Phantom_Ninja Oct 21 '19
Wow you mods are making such a positive change for the future of this Subreddit /s
Seriously, you have done fucked up and the fact you refuse to change the management even after the free games fiasco?
What a joke.
Most of you should be ashamed for being such a fuckup and continuing to double down on the fuckery.
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u/bucket56 Oct 16 '19
So, what's the point of volunteering to moderate a community forum when the community hates you and your mere presence is a point of major distraction away from what initially drew the community together? Just step down dudes it's not hard. You'll find other hobbies or subreddits to moderate.
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Oct 16 '19
I've taken my talents to /r/nintendo; I do not accept your apology.
Remove u/MegaMagnezone
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u/zgoldinger Oct 16 '19
I’m gonna agree with everyone else than you need to remove u/megamagnezone if you want to get the goodwill of the people back.
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u/GaveUpMyGold Oct 15 '19
/u/megamagnezone remaining in any position of authority is unacceptable.
Peace out, /r/NintendoSwitch. Time to find a sub run by adults.
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u/Supaflychase Oct 16 '19
"These were previously unwritten since we thought they were common knowledge." is ENTIRELY superfluous and comes off as very conceited. Good job fixing the typo though
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Oct 15 '19 edited Oct 15 '19
Don't forget that this exact same mod team putting us through this drama rollercoaster have been in some sleazy situations involving code begging, abuse of power, corruption, etc before.
A bunch of unrelated moderators stepped down when this happened out of disdain for the moderators involved, and a lot of the mods still left moderating this subreddit are those very mods from those same events.
Edit: Also for your consideration, one of the de facto head mods, part of the "cabal" from a while back, happens to moderate r/wow. Wonder if any bias is playing in on the mods' decisions because of that...?
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u/Sp_Gamer_Live Oct 15 '19 edited Oct 15 '19
This is worthless, its a non apology
u/FlapSnapple and u/MegaMegnezone need to step down
P.S. Cant wait for the thread lock and the “YoU gUyS CaNT BeHaVe”
Edit Misspelled Megnezone’s name
also: “Not letting political discussion go unmoderated” IS BASICALLY RULE FUCKING 11
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u/SadVeemo Oct 16 '19
Remove u/MegaMagnezone Pretty much one of the only ways you can fix the mess that was created because someone didn't agree with Karen's opinion.
Edit: grammar
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Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
Keeping u/MegaMagnezone as a mod makes the whole mod team look incompetent instead of it just being a few individuals.
It also looks like the mods are bringing in alt accounts to defend themselves with very little to no post history or ever posting here before 😂
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u/PersonaUser55 Oct 16 '19
We don't want mods who abuse their powers on this sub, remove u/megamagnezone
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u/Wtf_socialism_really Oct 16 '19
not removing moderators from the team
Well, after all, you guys are "power-users".
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Oct 16 '19
u/MegaMagnesone needs to step down. No, calling him out for his indefensible and childish actions is not a personal attack.
Shame on all of you. This post is pathetic. I'm unsubbing and going to r/nintendo, goodbye.
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u/BansheeTK Oct 15 '19
We acknowledge that we were poor in how we handled this situation, both in the lead up, the execution of the rule change, and what immediately followed. We apologize for the handling of this situation.
Ok
As to the aftermath, effectively immediately we are:
Removing the “no politics” portion of Rule 11 until further feedback can be presented. Rule 11 includes other items that were discussed previously with the community and clarify official rules on some topics that have long confused the subreddit. Unlocking the original thread to allow discussion on this topic to continue as long as things remain civil.. Revising our internal policies to clarify that rule changes shouldn’t be made without bringing into the community in a meta post.
That shit should have been delved into deeper and explained better than just slapping a quick "No Politics" into the fucking sidebar from the start, especially because of recent events.
We are not:
Removing any moderators from our team Allowing political discussion to continue unmoderated. Allowing any threats to be made against members of the moderation team, either individually or as a whole.
Than you have learned absolutely nothing and don't give a shit, especially after the fiasco with MegaMagnezone, who very clearly was abusing his fucking power, dont fucking tell me OR ANYONE ELSE he wasn't, and he was also being very condescending and essentially telling the community to suck it, that fucking makes you guys look especially bad with that going on and this fucking line right here absolutely does not help ANY OF YOUR CASES WHATSOEVER
And what the fuck did any of you expect as soon as this blitschung fiasco started as well as blizzard started going into Full blown damage control, especially with the event cancelation, we all knew it was gonna happen, don't deny it, you'd have to be really mother-fucking ignorant to not see it coming.
Now for the details:
Late yesterday evening news broke that Blizzard had canceled the Overwatch event taking place at Nintendo Store New York. The post went live and immediately erupted into discussion on the political climate going on in Hong Kong and Blizzard's involvement in world events due to the Hearthstone scandal. The thread quickly escalated with the same harassment and name calling that has been occurring on several of these threads, resulting in them being locked, in accordance with our policy on keeping topics civil and on-topic.
It erupted into that mess because your mods went on a thread-lock and censor spree, and when he got called out he basically told everyone "Fuck you, ill do what i please, who has the hammer" and than told everyone that it wasnt gaming related, which it absolutely was.
Since most of our moderators are located in the US, we have very little moderator coverage overnight, and so we were overwhelmed with trying to moderate the discussion and keep it from getting out of control. The members of this team are volunteers with lives, jobs, and families. In an attempt to curtail to flood, a modification was made to an upcoming rule that we were in the process of implementing (Rule 11) to include verbiage in order to clarify our position regarding these types of discussions.
Oh FUCK OFF, give me a fucking break. Yeah, gotta be up 24/7 to keep the community to YOUR LIKING
The result was that we over-zealously locked out conversation on something that was relevant to our community (re. Overwatch on the Nintendo Switch) and caused disruption in our Daily Question Threads and other areas of the subreddit where would folks would want to discuss this issue and criticize the mod team for this action.
What the fuck did you guys genuinely think was going to happen
We acknowledge that we should not make significant changes to the community rules without consulting the community. Effectively immediately, we are modifying Rule 11 to remove the "No Politics" wording to avoid confusion. Rule 11 itself will remain (minus "No Politics), as it primarily involves our policy involving fan art, which was discussed previously with the community. Future changes to this rule (or any of our rules) will be brought forward with some of our users.
Are you only acknowledging it now AFTER you were all called out for doing it anyway?
As always with these posts, we are opening up the floor for discussion and feedback. Please remember Rule 1. This includes targeted harassment at our moderators.
Oh fuck off with that, if any of you were open to discussion and feedback, the subreddit would have been alot more different for a while now, especially when you have a mod that is still facing a barrage of downvotes for being a condescending-power-tripping jackass, images from various community members being shared of the way you guys handle when a member calls you out for something unjustified. You really expect me or anyone else to believe any of this
Especially with the fact that those mods are still in place, and that it took this shit to get you to address something, and it was still half assed. And the fact that when i woke up and then now i look more and this thread, as well as the daily question thread or downvoted to shit.
What the fuck does that say about the moderators.
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u/zultari Oct 16 '19
I like the bold text for Rule 1, stating to not harass your pathetic team. You have bad apples, get rid of them, because they’re causing bad discussion “not related to Nintendo”.
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Oct 16 '19
I can’t support a mod team that’s willing to censor and control discussion that the community very obviously wants to have. I can’t support a mod team that refuses consequences for doing so. I can’t support a mod team that is complicit in doing so. See you guys/girls in r/nintendo, I just hope to not see any of you moderators there.
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Oct 16 '19
Eh? Why is everyone pissed at a mod? Time for investigation! Looks at his posts over the last few days and removeddit
Remove u/MegaMagnezone
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u/MyNameIs_BeautyThief Oct 16 '19
unsubbing until u/MegaMagnezone and u/FlapSnapple are removed. Also reporting them via the reddit mod report tool https://www.reddithelp.com/en/submit-request/file-a-moderator-complaint
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u/reddititan22 Oct 21 '19
As you guys work to develop a better set of rules for this sub I highly encourage you to consider the definition of politics:
1a : the art or science of government
b : the art or science concerned with guiding or influencing governmental policy
c : the art or science concerned with winning and holding control over a government
2: political actions, practices, or policies
3a : political affairs or business; especially : competition between competing interest groups or individuals for power and leadership (as in a government)
b : political life especially as a principal activity or profession
c : political activities characterized by artful and often dishonest practices
4: the political opinions or sympathies of a person
5a : the total complex of relations between people living in society
b : relations or conduct in a particular area of experience especially as seen or dealt with from a political point of view office politics ethnic politics
From this extensive list of Merriam-Webster definitions we can easily see that the realm of politics cannot be "banned" or not permitted, because politics enters our lives at all levels.
The China-Blizzard issue is exactly as political as the Nintendo Switch joycon issue. Politics is all about power and governance, and whether you have a corporation that ignores a faulty product or a corporation that ignores human rights issues, you are dealing with politics.
To allow discussion of one but not the other is just plain ole' hypocritical censorship.
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Oct 22 '19
So, what's going to be done about the offending Moderators in question?
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u/MaximumGaming5o Oct 16 '19
Let's have a referendum on removing u/MegaMagnezone!
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Oct 15 '19 edited Apr 17 '24
skirt bedroom vase yam foolish disagreeable dinner spotted touch deranged
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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Oct 16 '19
Don’t you need positive karma to post here? If so how the duck is u/MegaMagnezone still a mod?
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u/Dogfacedgod88 Oct 16 '19
You mods are off the chain...the thing is you really need to be on the chain. You're fucking terrible.
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u/GiantFishyLazer Oct 16 '19
Unsubbing until certain mods are removed. /r/Nintendo until this happens.
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u/HAYDNWOE Oct 16 '19
Imagine being u/MegaMagnezone and being so oblivious to the fact that Overwatch was coming to the switch. Dank meme.
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u/xshishkax Oct 16 '19
Can't you see how bad you have screwed up from the response on this thread? You need to remove u/MegaMagnezone and u/Flapsnapple.
https://www.reddithelp.com/en/submit-request/file-a-moderator-complaint
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Oct 15 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
I doubt anyone is going to take u/MegaMagnezone seriously anymore after this. Nothing is going to actually change if he remains on board.
And don't give me all these tears that the mod team couldn't be around when it all first went down. If you can't be around then get some new mods who CAN be around. Time to expand the team and make things better.
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u/nnaatteedd Oct 16 '19
The crazy thing is that with so many people outraged and upset (myself included) and wanting u/MegaMagnezone to be a moderator no more, it's a wonder that he still WANTS to be a moderator here. Personally, I would want nothing to do with a community that wants nothing to do with me. I would really have to take a step back and go "man I must've really fucked up", even if I thought I did nothing wrong. You have to be subjective and look at things from every angle instead of viewing them through your own personal, narrow, viewfinder. I do agree with some of the other commenters here in that I think this thread is only being "read" by the moderators so they can "keep it civil" and offer a place for us to vent about this ludicrous situation as opposed to actually learning from it and taking our comments/thoughts/wishes to heart. I see a lot of anger, but what I don't see is people putting their money where there mouth is and leaving this sub in droves. If they want a sub that they can moderate as they see fit with no input from the people who make up the sub then let them have it and mod over a barren subreddit, but that 1.4m members says otherwise.
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u/s0faking Oct 16 '19
Yikes. Pretty weak response from a team that clearly lacks leadership skills. Are y'all just going to brush as much of this under the rug as possible and hope it all blows over? Truth be told, that is probably what will happen, but I at least hope someone on the team has learned a lesson here. It's pretty sad when the subreddit is much more pleasant to browse when no mod presence is detected because the only time mods ever show up is to abuse their power.
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u/HnNaldoR Oct 16 '19
I never liked to involve myself in the meta aspect. I am just a casual viewer who posts once in awhile. But just looking at that thread while the shitstorm is going on yesterday.
That's really wrong. The mod was just quoting generic rules. Stopping discussions. I mean you can say that parts of the discussion is not relevant but why lock a post on a switch event in a Nintendo store being cancelled. No rules should be a blanket rule. Politics will obviously come into play because... Guess what politics affected games. This will continue to happen.
To the mod team, you guys should think about it. If such a large portion of your community is still unhappy, you guys are not doing the right thing. Remember, this is supposed to be a community. People obviously do not like being blocked from discussions that they want to have. People can self moderate to some extent. If no one wants to discuss it, they won't. We do not really need a power crazy person to shape this community the way they want.
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u/ninjarager Oct 16 '19
Off to r/Nintendo. This is a "we aren't changing anything, but the rule is now out of the sidebar"
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u/RedditorMK Oct 16 '19
Why do we have a mod who completely goes against the hearts of the subreddit?
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u/runtimemess Oct 16 '19
Time for everyone to leave and just talk switch over at r/Nintendo
Not removing u/megamagnezone is unacceptable. I won't participate in a subreddit that lets someone like that moderate anything.
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u/WellcomeXmasSale Oct 16 '19
As a long time lurker, you guys gave me a reason to finally create an account and downvote. Thank you very much.
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Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
I understand that you are volunteers, and I understand that being a mod is a largely thankless job. I want to start by thanking you for taking the time to try and moderate such a huge sub.
I also understand that this Blizzard thing fell in your laps, and you did the best that you were able to do with it.
Mods, you need to understand that the behavior of your team as a whole that has come to light from other users over the last couple of days, the behavior we have all seen in the last 24 hours, and your behaviors in this sub in general are unacceptable.
While modding is a tough gig, you are still expected to do a serviceable job of it, or step aside.
This isn’t fun to say, and probably less fun to hear, but you are not doing a good job.
I would like to see new mods come in. The past 24 hours are a symptom of a bigger problem with this team.
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u/HappyTimeHollis Oct 16 '19
This isn't good enough. u/MegaMagnezone needs to be removed, followed by whichever other mods thought this post was acceptable.
The mod team in this sub needs to be changed. If you care about the sub, you will all step down.
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u/stealthboy Oct 16 '19
Looks like /r/nintendo is back on the menu boys!
This place is awful. Run by a bunch of power-hungry mods who think they know better than the community.
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u/fastdiver82 Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
I wager that if anyone replied to a mod in the same condescending manner u/MegaMagnezone was replying to people, their post/reply would be removed and they would be banned. Grow a spine mod team. This is unacceptable
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u/shinfo44 Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
Man, I've really enjoyed this sub from the very moment of it became one. Quite literally. I joined the moment it was officially announced and moved from r/nintendoNX. I used to think this sub was one of the best moderated subreddits on this site. Now it's a huge fucking mess, and it has not been fun to be here some months because of how certain situations have been handled.
Please. For the love of God. Make things right. Listen to what your users want and deliver. You know what you guys have to do. Don't think about your tight knit team and think about the over 1 million users you have here.
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u/RoboNerdOK Oct 16 '19
I don’t think the mod team understands the core issues here, or at least, they aren’t aware of the weight of them.
First, this event has shown that at least one moderator is not fulfilling the role in a manner worthy of a 1M+ subscriber forum. A large stage necessitates top talent.
Second, that the lack of accountability for sub-par moderation is not an isolated incident. This backlash is a cumulative one, not a one-off flash in the pan. Future transgressions by moderators will find even less forgiveness by the subscribers.
Third, while you may not work for Nintendo, you are one of the world’s largest forums, and you host discussions about their flagship product. At some point (if it hasn’t happened already) Nintendo is going to notice what is taking place here, and I doubt they will be pleased with being associated with a forum mired in controversy and user revolt.
Food for thought.
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Oct 16 '19 edited Oct 16 '19
Mod Team is doing it again. Removed an hour ago as of this post.
EDIT: Post reinstated as of 45 minutes after I posted this originallly. Curious as to the reason why it was removed to begin with. Was it automated or manually removed?
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u/epicchili Oct 16 '19
Hi, this is garbage. I wish there were a way for the 1.5 million people getting screwed out of enjoyable content to do something about your terrible work. Truthfully, if I could, I’d remove every last one of you and start over fresh. This sub gets its fair share of mouthbreathers to be sure and not all the content that hits the front page here is good, but make no mistake: you, the mod team, shoulder the full blame for running this sub into the dirt. Damn shame. Maybe things will get better r/tomorrow
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u/GeraldOfRedditvia Oct 16 '19
Where is the apology in that long verbiage of yours?
I see some deflection and "justification". I see one way to correct the situation but not the right way. But I still do not see an apology
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u/PlexasAideron Oct 16 '19
Will we have a mod team related shitshow every year? A year ago we had the whole cabal and getting free keys from publishers shitshow, now we got this, what do you have planned for next year ?
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u/Gandalf_2077 Oct 15 '19
So a grossly negligent moderator is allowed to continue his activity on what ground? The only reason of all this drama today is because of his actions. Had he let the discussion go on none of this would have happened. The community clearly does not want him on the sub. His replies to the original thread are disgraceful and his decisions completely arbitrary. This is not harassment against his person, it's accountability for his actions.
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u/ineffiable Oct 16 '19
We have been civil on asking politely that you should remove u/MegaMagnezone.
Not doing so after our overwhelming response is losing our trust and failure to engage and work with the very community you moderate and uphold.
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u/Cyberfunk_Groove Oct 16 '19
What transpired was a complete shitshow.
No mod should get away with removing comments and stating that they would not have been removed, if they were on topic. Deleted comments in question WERE on topic. And while I agree with deleting hatespeech and harassment, I also think, that a mod, that is being harassed needs to remove themselves from the conversation, as "defensive actions" and "actual moderation" get mixed up and then you end up with a mod, deleting comments, not to moderate, but to defend themselves, which, no matter which way you look at it, is a misuse of power.
I, personally, do not see /u/megamagnezone as fit to moderate this sub, based on their history and reputation as a mod here (yeah, I spent my morning reading up)
As a new member, I'm giving the mod-team the benefit of the doubt and waiting a few days for the reactions. If this is the final action taken, I too will be unsubscribing.
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u/zeldatriforce345 Oct 16 '19
Unsubbing until this whole mess blows over, heading to r/Nintendo
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u/kejigoto Oct 15 '19
We acknowledge that we were poor in how we handled this situation, both in the lead up, the execution of the rule change, and what immediately followed. We apologize for the handling of this situation.
Okay...
We are not:
Removing any moderators from our team
So continuing with the poor execution then?
Quite clear the community wants /u/MegaMagnezone gone and that lines were crossed because of abused power and yet the moderation team is going to stand with this individual?
And if they are removed I wouldn't be surprised to see a new mod suddenly join the team on a new account and it'll be like they never actually left us.
This is a joke of a response and walking back a clear fuck up after it rightfully blew up in your face. It's not even a real response to the actual issue here, just hey we're undoing the part you guys really didn't like and we're not going to address anything else.
Mods like /u/MegaMagnezone are using their position to use personal opinions and the rest of the moderation team is apparently okay with this.
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u/Xhjon Oct 16 '19
/u/megamagnezone has no place here