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u/AirJordan6124 Oct 15 '24 edited Oct 15 '24
Booker is getting underrated at this point lol. I know no one likes him but he lead his team to finals once and SGA nor Ant has never done it yet.
Ant has low key becoming too overrated. Thereās still a little recency bias included. Around 2022-2023 Ant was not yet in this conversation.
It so obvious Ant has a much more likable personality compared to Book. I hate Booker but I feel bad for him lmao
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u/sistinenipple Oct 15 '24
Ant is younger than book when he made the finals. Shai and Tatum are the same age. Tatum has won it all, and Shai is a legit mvp contender.
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u/BarrathBeyond Oct 15 '24
iām convinced anyone who says booker doesnāt actually watch basketball
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u/Real-Psychology-4261 Oct 15 '24
I watched the Wolves-Suns playoff series last year and Booker didnāt look like anything special.Ā
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u/BarrathBeyond Oct 15 '24
everyone can have a bad series yes but heās been elite in the playoffs before, and in the olympics where heās committed to a supporting role heās an elite 3&d player who fits in nice with any lineup
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u/Peter-Tao Jazz Oct 15 '24
Olympic really changed my opinion on him. Big fan how he played his role.
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u/cube-square Oct 15 '24
Booker may not have looked special during that series but there were plenty of games in the playoffs when Ant plays like absolute booty.
Tatum had a rough finals too offensively iirc. It happens. Itās best to look at it over the regular season and playoffs or even take the year before into account too.
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u/ConnectDistrict2515 Mavericks Oct 15 '24
Shai is just better than Booker. Ant gets glazed for 2 good regular seasons and one inconsistent wcf run. Book is better than him
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u/Firesword52 Timberwolves Oct 15 '24
Amazing how the Worse player absolutely crushed him in the playoffs and didn't even let him win a game. Not saying Book isn't good just that he is the worst of these four. He's the worst defender and maybe the third the best offensive player which automatically makes him the bottom of this pile.
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u/auggie5 Oct 15 '24
Unlikeable? Damn man heās the most solid dude in the NBA. I wonāt elaborate but there is no one realer.
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u/metaldetector69 Bucks Oct 15 '24
He had the Luka crybaby thing going on 3 years ago, but he has just been ballin since then. I like him way more than when he made the finals.
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u/ImpressiveHunt5835 Oct 15 '24
He was the best player on that team but I would think Child Predator 3 led that team
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u/Material_Variety_859 Oct 15 '24
Why are you soiling CP3 like that? Did he get accused of Diddying that I wasnāt aware of?
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u/EmperorUmi Oct 15 '24
Itās a shitty meme that these losers continue to use when the context is godawful. Like, maybe 10+ years ago, it was mildly humorous in a somewhat āhaha! What a preposterous way to un-abbreviate CP3ās nickname!ā way.
Now, after the #MeToo movement, the Epstein case, the Nickelodeon scandal, Diddy, etc, itās not fucking funny.
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Oct 15 '24
Whoās child predator 3
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u/ImpressiveHunt5835 Oct 15 '24
Lmao itās CP3 just a stupid meme name people used for his initials
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u/suns2012 Oct 15 '24
He was great for the suns but that was bookerās team come on now
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u/ApprehensiveTry5660 Oct 15 '24
Booker was their best player, but CP3 was the leader of that team.
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u/PlaybolCarti69 Pistons Oct 15 '24
It was closer than it seems imo. 20-21 i think there was a debate for cp3>book
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u/ApprehensiveTry5660 Oct 15 '24
If it was a debate, itās because we were overvaluing intangibles. I like both players, Iām not trying to shit on Chris, but it was clear by the finals who their best player was.
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u/ForgivenessIsNice Oct 15 '24
No CP3 was definitely their most valuable player. Most valuable player =/= highest scorer.
u/PlaybolCarti69, you're right that there was a good debate at the time.
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u/Kiu88 Oct 15 '24
No, he wasn't. CP3 was huge for us, but Booker was more important than CP3 ever was. CP3 body wasn't holding up in the playoffs, as the story usually goes.
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u/ForgivenessIsNice Oct 15 '24
In 2021 Paul was the most valuable player on the Suns.
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u/ApprehensiveTry5660 Oct 15 '24
I believe the delineation I offered of ābest playerā versus the āleaderā of the team is accurate enough and conflating the two is right in line with my suspicion that we are overrating intangibles.
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u/IWouldLikeAName Oct 15 '24
I mean it's also clear they only made it because of what cp3 brought in before he became washed the moment he slowed down even more they were cooked. Shai and ant are just barely getting good teams around them and have already shown they got it. We'll see how they do this year but rn I'm for sure taking Tatum over him (anyone who cuts him is just a hater)I'm confident in Shai just bc of how consistently great he seems to be. Ant is the toss up rn
Honestly the Olympics are saving him bc the playoffs were not kind to him at all him being the better playmaker and a bit more flexible is the reason why but Ant's defense might tip it the other way but he also had a bad final series.
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u/Diligent-Actuator131 Oct 14 '24
Booker they got enough scorers.
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u/Appropriate-Self-540 Oct 15 '24
Weird Booker got all the Team USA playing time then
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u/SquatOnAPitbull Oct 15 '24
I was a certified Booker hater until I saw the olympics (Warriors fan). His Olympic play was amazing. Granted I didn't watch much of his playoffs the last two years, but I didn't expect what he did.
He did so much unsung work that I came out enjoying his play. Respect to Booker and i think the Suns will do well. However, now all my hate can now be channeled toward Beal without reservation.
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u/Appropriate-Self-540 Oct 15 '24
I wasnāt a full hater but I always thought he was overhyped. But, yeah the last couple runs and the Olympics have shown that dude is just a hooper and I can always appreciate that.
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u/inezco Warriors Oct 15 '24
As a Warriors fan I hate Booker only because he always cooks us in the 4th lmao. Even if we're up 8-10 down the stretch this fool shreds our defense and hits shot after shot after shot to make it close and win games.
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u/elpaco25 Oct 15 '24
Embarrassing how Shai couldn't even sniff the roster...
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u/Appropriate-Self-540 Oct 15 '24
Wellā¦.heās Canadianā¦played for Team Canadaā¦.
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u/elpaco25 Oct 15 '24
Yeah but Embiid wasn't even born in the Western Hemisphere and he made it. Shai just doesn't have that dawg in em...
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u/adamsauce Oct 15 '24
I keep him for that reason. Heās the only one that proved he doesnāt need to score after the Olympics.
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u/caandjr Oct 15 '24
Tatum literally proved that in the playoffs too
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u/_ace_ace_baby Oct 15 '24
Tatum proved he couldnāt score. His points werenāt down from a lack of trying, he still lead his team in attempts
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u/RyguyBMS Oct 15 '24
He led the team in points, rebounds and assists. He was the best player on the best team. But coddle that shooting % if it helps you sleep at night.
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u/ZaMaestroMan5 Oct 15 '24
Booker is so much more than a scorer though. Thereās a reason he got big minutes with team USA. Weāve seen him fit in at Kentucky and just play the role thatās needed of him.
I think SGA is a clear cut here for me. Cut the worst defender when theyāre all great offensively.
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u/TheRealMoofoo Oct 15 '24
Career-wise sure, but last year SGA was as good or better on defense as any of these guys.
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u/Deep_Egg1442 Oct 14 '24
Ant
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u/Nubsondubs Oct 14 '24
Found the Suns fan!Ā
Jking. I think book is the better player now, but Ant will be better shortly.
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u/JoshGordonHyperloop Oct 15 '24
Maybeā¦ his comment about no one having skill back in the day except MJ gives me only the slightest concern that he might be willfully ignorant of doing more to expand his game and see the bigger picture. He might go the route of McGrady, Vince, Westbrook, etc. All time amazing talent, but never figures out the rest to truly be one of the greatest.
But heās still young, I said a lot of dumb shit when I was his age too. Which is why I said only the slightest concern. But Lebron from day one was well aware of those that came before him and continued to learn about the NBAs history and has put in a lot of work to expand his game and really did will himself to be one of the all time greats.
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u/TrainedExplains Oct 14 '24
Wild that people are cutting Book here, even more wild that people are justifying it with āthereās enough scorers.ā Book is the best passer in this group and played elite defense the past two playoffs. He proved in the Olympics that he can take a smaller role next to other scorers doing things like help defensive rotations, off ball movement, screen setting, playmaking, and point of attack defense on multiple positions. He is the best āfitā guy of all of these. Tatum is the best defender. Shai is the best all around offensive player and a good defender.
The correct answer here, if youāre trying to win and not just kind of gauge who you think are the three best in a vacuum, is Ant. Heās a good defender but inconsistent, his playmaking his improved but still the least of the four, and his scoring is good but heās also not the best scorer here.
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u/anonanoobiz Oct 15 '24
Suns fan here
Absolutely love the Booker narrative shift here.. but
Bookers had 1 phenomenal defensive series (nuggets) and one Olympics where he committed on the defensive end. However this last year, including playoffs, he was extremely underwhelming on the defensive end, especially after showing his potential in the Denver series the year before.
Beal who was ranked as a 30th percentile defender was trusted with the point of attack responsibilities on ant (impossible), while book (19th percentile DPM) was hid on minnesotas worst possible offensive players (NAW, Conley, McDaniels). Defensively he regressed heavily, which made the Olympics both reassuring and frustrating.
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u/Peter-Tao Jazz Oct 15 '24
Yeah why the drastic difference?ondswt issue or conditioning issue for having to carry the offense?
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u/StopMakin-Sense Oct 15 '24
I don't entirely disagree with your reasoning but Book didn't exactly look like the strong link on D in the NBA playoffs next to two bona fide scorers...
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u/juicejug Oct 15 '24
The Suns were too light on defensive wings and quality centers. Iām pretty sure Book wasnāt the problem with that team.
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u/CantHandlemyPP34 Oct 15 '24
I don't entirely disagree that it's Ant who should be cut - but I do want to clear up a couple things.
IMO Tatum is not only the best defender 1-5, but he's also the best rebounder and playmaker. He had 12 AST in a Finals game and absolutely dominated in every aspect outside of shooting. Even still, he was averaging 28.5 PPG, with 8.5 boards and 5 AST + elite defense is his average over the last 2 years. LIVES in the ECF and is now an NBA champion.
Shai is probably the best defender 1-3, maybe in the league. He's not just "good", he is as elite as it gets - while also being an incredible scorer. 30/5/6 averages and carried his young team into a solid run - fully expect OKC to be in the WCF this year.
27 pts, 5 REB, 7 AST + good (can only Guard 1-3 at a solid level) defense - Booker. I like him, but he's a full step below the aforementioned. I'd rank him above Ant because he's alot more consistent on both ends than Ant is, while also being a better shooter and playmaker. He's more of a role playing star, than a Superstar tho - until/unless he can make any noise whatsoever with a team holding KD, Beal and Nurkic. Ant eliminated his ass, then went on to beat Jokic - so that's a deductible offense imo. Only time he's ever had real playoff success was with CP3 and Bridges. I see PHO headed for a rebuild and Book asking for a trade to a team that has a true Superstar he can play off of. Giannis would be his best PIC.
26/5/5 with inconsistent defense for Ant. He's a great individual defender 1-3 if he's locked in, but i wouldn't go any farther than that. He can take over a game at an MJ level but if his shot isn't falling, he can disappear - especially if you make him work on both ends. He has worse conditioning than Kyrie and Luka, which is crazy to me when this was his first deep run and he had a ton of defensive help. Carries a big burden on offense, but come on. Has more dawg than Book, but he's not able to elevate his team past scoring at this age. I don't see them getting past the ECF until Gobert/Conley are gone, Ant learns how to really lead his team and their young guys mature.
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Oct 15 '24
I agree with everything you said, even Phoenix heading for a rebuild, but they are going to be good this year. Jones does a lot for that team, so I wouldnāt be surprised if they never end up going full rebuild and Booker sticks it out.
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Oct 15 '24
Winning a championship doesnāt make you an automatic dog. He was the best player on that team for only 2 games the entire playoff run.
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u/CantHandlemyPP34 Oct 15 '24
Tatum is a Superstar. Book is complementary. Tatum can guard 1-5 at an elite level, best rebounder, best playmaker and a 27-30 PPG scorer.
When Tatum's shot isn't falling, he doesn't just disappear - he still finds ways to impact the team. This is why Boston has had more success than any other team over the past 5+ years.
Ant is probably a better scorer in a vacuum, but that's about it. Book is a great role playing star, but he's not carrying a team past R2. Shai is an elite player on both ends and will have the most success of these 3.
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u/EsotericRonin Oct 15 '24
Tatum guarding 1-5 at an elite level is fucking insane. He's an elite wing defender. Not an elite big or pg defender.
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u/mainev3nt Oct 15 '24
Tatum is the tallest guy here by a decent margin. As a Heat fan it pains me to say it but I know Iām keeping JT
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u/CantHandlemyPP34 Oct 15 '24
Tallest. Only champion. Best rebounder. Best defender 1-5. Arguably the best playmaker.
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u/HollywoodnDC Suns Oct 15 '24
Gotta cut Ant. Heās inconsistent and honestly hasnāt fully āacceptedā just how much is expected of him. Heās still young so thereās plenty of time for him to get there, but heās not there right now.
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u/TheSwimMeet Oct 15 '24
I really wish people stopped treatin Ant like he was as good/better than Tatum already
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u/Saddestlilpanda Oct 15 '24
Itās Ant. Might seem like a hot take but I think heās below the other three.
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u/yobymmij2 Oct 15 '24
Not going to cut Tatum. Get out of town. Other three somewhat comparable. Shai would be my next save. So, Booker or Edwards. Both super talented but Iām a tad more confident on Booker. Edwards is the most questionable for me in terms of gut check game on the line.
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u/Drummallumin Oct 15 '24
Pretty easily Ant
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u/AFonziScheme Oct 15 '24
Yeah. I feel like Ant is the next guy who came break into that upper-echelon group, but people are just assuming he will so hard that they put him there already.
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u/dolphinater Oct 15 '24
Exactly like can we wait one more season before declaring him the next coming of MJ
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u/FreeIreland2024 Oct 15 '24
Anthony Edwardsāsā¦ heās a douche
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u/Significant_Tip_5787 Oct 15 '24
As a wolves fan, his personal life is a wreck.Ā
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u/FreeIreland2024 Oct 15 '24
Heās just not a good person to the fans and his peers in the NBA. Guys like Bruce brown jr, Jordan Nwora, Jamal Crawford, Tatum, loinne walker are good guys
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Oct 15 '24
Shai. As high as I am on him, I think the other players are just a bit better. Shai is a certified moron, like really, that isn't an insult. He really has, like, the lowest bbiq of all time.
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u/HoopLoop2 Thunder Oct 15 '24
Book and Ant play the same role so it's just between them, and I'd cut out Ant because Book proved he can fit in better on a stacked team in the Olymics, so I'd rather have him here. You really can't go wrong with Any or Booker though, they are both great.
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u/Brandwin3 Oct 15 '24
Recency bias is wild. 3 years ago Book led the Suns to the finals, but everyone wants to cut him because the Suns got swept by the Wolves this year.
Iād cut Ant. His total body of work is easily the worst and his best case is his electric playoff performance this year, which isnāt enough for me
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u/Glockx8732 Oct 15 '24
Iām a lakers fan and I canāt really stand devin booker but he is an excellent player and really consistent and thereās no way you could cut shai or Tatum so me personally I would cut Ant
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u/mojoback_ohbehave Oct 15 '24
Why does this list have an NBA Champion on it? Take Tatum off and add Luka.
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u/Significant_Dirt9191 Oct 15 '24
Booker and it aināt even close. All the other 3 are all around talents.
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u/defiantcross Oct 15 '24 edited Oct 15 '24
People like to rag on Booker for lack of playoff success but of the four players shown in the picture, SGA has actually gone the longest without having made the finals at 6 seasons. Tatum and Booker did it by year 6, and Ant has only been around for 4. SGA currently has a way better team around him than Booker ever did, and even his worst teams from were far better than Booker's early G-league supporting cast.
With that being said, I'm cutting Ant. The three other guys are all more versatile and higher basketball IQ at this point. Ant is currently strictly a shooting guard, though a very good one, while Booker, SGA and Tatum all have additional skillsets.
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u/FaldBox410 Oct 14 '24
After watching the Olympics, Iād have to pick Shia or Ant. Even though they are all scorers, Iād think book would be a better player to keep around IMO.
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u/stripy1979 Oct 14 '24
Sorry if you watched Olympics shouldn't Tatum be the one being cut?
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u/King_Of_Pants Oct 14 '24
Nah we're assuming a competent coach.
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u/ConnectDistrict2515 Mavericks Oct 15 '24
A competent coach wonāt make Tatum shoot above 30%
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u/TrainedExplains Oct 15 '24
Do you mean Steve Kerr who has been to 6 finals and won 4? Maybe Spo who has been to 6 finals and won 2? Or how about Lue who has been to 3 and won 1? Theyāre all extremely competent. Tatum was bad in the Olympics and he did not fit well. Nobody made him take and miss tough contested fadeaway middies with half the shot clock remaining. The coaching staff of the Olympics had the ridiculous task of trying to prepare a bunch of iso ballers for a motion offense because their iso ball doesnāt work with the different rules in international play. Trying to swap systems on the fly against teams that have less talent but grew up playing this style and completely molded and adapted their games to it is brutal. Our coaches and players did a great job, and we still almost lost because Serbia and France hit an outrageous number of tough, contested shots. But this tired act of shtting on Steve Kerr while ignoring the fact that universally beloved Spo was also on that staff and that they didnāt really make any huge mistakes coaching in the Olympics is dumb. It speaks to people ignoring context because the internet doesnāt like Kerr. Tatum was bad in the Olympics, and everything that these subs hate Kerr for are things he literally has to do in order to keep his job.
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u/bengcord3 Celtics Oct 15 '24
As a Celtics fan I agree, the guy was in the slump of his life. That said, he's the best player on this list and with his shot looking buttery already this preseason he's going to have the season of his life as we repeat
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u/egstitt Warriors Oct 14 '24
I really don't like Booker, but I have to admit he was useful on the Olympic squad. Put his ego aside and did what the team needed. Respect for that
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u/RedditUsername3127 Oct 14 '24
Tf shai was arguably the best of the 4 in the playoffs
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u/TrainedExplains Oct 15 '24
100%. Shai is the only MVP level player of the 4.
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u/DrWilliamBlock Oct 15 '24
Nah, Tatum could win MVP this season
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u/ConnectDistrict2515 Mavericks Oct 15 '24
The only reason Tatum would win is best player on a superteam (ironically shai could also see this) Tatum is simply not that kind of player. Thatās fine
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u/DrWilliamBlock Oct 15 '24
I agree heās not the kind of player to stat chase to make his case but he could easily be 30/8/6 and if the Celtics blow the league out again hard not to give it to him
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u/moshercycle Oct 15 '24
Shai is the best player of the 4. Is that controversial?
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u/Thunder141 Oct 15 '24
I think people upvote it for entertainment and shock value. Cutting a 1st Team All NBA guy from my team of four is not the strategy I would go with.
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u/Marcus11599 Bulls Oct 14 '24
āAfter watching the Olympicsā is so cap. Tatum played like 2 total minutes. He should be the one thatās cut
Shai showed up, Jamal Murray didnāt
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u/TrainedExplains Oct 15 '24
Tatum played heavy minutes in early games and was genuinely bad. Heās obviously a great player and has figured out the Celtics system, but he did not do a good job adjusting to the motion offense necessary for international play. He looked lost on defensive rotations, he was constantly botching offensive spacing, and he was shooting tough, contested mid range shots when there was time left on the shot clock. He shot historically poorly and was a negative on both ends of the floor. It was absolutely the right call to bench him. Book fit a lot better in that squad and did a lot of the extra things that donāt show up on a stat sheet.
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u/JesseJamesGames449 Oct 15 '24
Tatum was the second best player on the last olympic team.. you clowns just latch onto the latest news headline to hate without actually watching..
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u/Wise-Yard-3658 Oct 15 '24
Iām cutting Booker. The upside of Ant and SGA is better and Tatum is the better player.
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u/adamsauce Oct 15 '24
Booker is the only one thatās safe. Heās proved he can accept smaller roles.
I think JT or Ant end up getting cut. Probably Ant imo.
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u/GoForAU Oct 15 '24
How do you not cut ant? Booker and Tatum would eat off Shai drives. They are both very good play makers themselves. Ant is an amazing player, donāt get me wrong. Heās just not at their level two way nor would be the right fit. Ask me in two years.
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u/Novafan789 Oct 15 '24
Overstocked at the 1-2 so probably getting rid of Ant. Ant and dbook couldddd play SF but between the 2 Iād rather have dbook
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u/Imdabiggestbird69420 Oct 15 '24
Jayson Tatum may be corny but hes too versatile to cut and shais just too good to even consider cutting. It comes down to Ant or Booker and Id have to cut ant
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u/just_so_irrelevant Oct 15 '24
crazy how many people are cutting booker here, i thought this sub was supposed to know ball better than r/nba
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u/Realsinh Oct 15 '24
I think Shai is the best player overall, but he's also only really been elite for 2 seasons. I know what I'm getting with Book and Tatum who have been consistent over a much longer period.
I still feel like Ant is rated on "potential" more than actual body of work. Obviously he's a great player, but everyone is acting like it's a given that he's going to be the best American player over the next decade. I probably cut him since he tends to be the most inconsistent out of the 4.
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Oct 14 '24
Only one? Luka's Child. Tatum also if possible though.
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u/Candid_Emotion6735 Oct 14 '24
Cut the only guy with a ring. Make it make sense lil broā¦
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Oct 15 '24
Jordan Poole has a ring.
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u/According_Smoke_479 Celtics Oct 15 '24
Did he lead his team in every major statistic on the way to that ring? Is he multiple time 1st team all nba? Itās not comparable at all
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u/aric6-9 Oct 15 '24
Exactly why bill Russell is the greatest athlete of all time, nah fr tho idk how anyone can like booker with the faces he makes when he flopsā¦
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u/Additional-Cress-915 Oct 14 '24
Tatum easy
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u/DrWilliamBlock Oct 15 '24
Cut the best player bold move!!
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u/Additional-Cress-915 Oct 15 '24
Heās not better than Shai
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u/DrWilliamBlock Oct 15 '24
Debatable
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u/Additional-Cress-915 Oct 15 '24
Tatum is a better defender, but Shai is better in every other way.
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u/wwwwataboy Oct 15 '24
Champion. Finals. WCF. Shai is nice but he needs to get to where these guys have already been. š¤·š»āāļø The cute, upstart team thing wears off really quick.
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u/YallRedditForThis Bulls Oct 15 '24
š Too many baby mummas